kirkc
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:50 am

OpenSource Aircraft

Fri Nov 06, 2009 3:56 pm

Hello all,

What do you think about an open source aircraft development project like the one at jumbolino.org?
For me very interesting, though maybe an opportunity like it was for software many years ago?

kirkc
 
kirkc
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:50 am

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Sun Dec 27, 2009 8:59 am

Hello everybody,

Phase 1 of the project is close to end, this means the basic aircraft requirements will be defined on December 31st!

kirkc
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:34 pm

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Mon Dec 28, 2009 2:09 pm

What a crap, they don't know if they want to build a helicopter or a submarine, have not analysed the market, and want to build an aircraft anfd get it certified?
 
kirkc
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:50 am

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:48 pm

Hello Burkhard,

isn't that a chance to participate right from the beginning in defining what to do? Instead of complaining about decisions done by others without having influence, they have a poll where everybody can participate and join the decision making progress, instead of just watching some persons. And the decision of the majority will be like a kind of market research, representing the "need" of the voters, doesn't this reflect democracy?

kirkc
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:34 pm

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Tue Dec 29, 2009 1:34 pm

I have seen many unrealistic waste of resources, this is one of the most ridicoulous. Why then decide they want to make an aircraft a priori? Why not plant some trees?

If it were a project for a flight simulator, such an appoach might make sense, and bring something on FS2000 level around 2030 - but here we speak about a real aircraft I assume, so something that needs many millions of $ just for the certification process...
 
9VSIO
Posts: 653
Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 5:00 pm

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Wed Dec 30, 2009 4:53 am

Wait, is this for flight sim or for real?
Me: (Lining up on final) I shall now select an aiming point. || Instructor: Well, I hope it's the runway...
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:34 pm

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Wed Dec 30, 2009 8:29 am

For real I understand ! For Flight Sim it would be fun, for real it is a bad joke.
 
kirkc
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:50 am

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:06 am

The project pages say for real. And why not? I mean, did not everybody say it is nonsense when Linux started? And now it is used in really critical areas. I say : think different! for me it is interesting and a challenge. And there are many good engineers, technicians, enthusiasts and students out there, who really can make a good thing in this project.
 
User avatar
cpd
Posts: 4548
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:46 am

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Wed Dec 30, 2009 11:58 am

Er, I'm in agreement with Burkhard, he has a point.

For Flight Sim, yes, great. But an opensource real plane, surely not.

I mean look at the effort that goes into real planes, just to name a few:

Cessna Skycatcher
Cirrus SR-22
Honda HA-420
Cessna Citation Mustang

Just to name a few from the GA or VLJ category. Not even thinking of the big names like Gulfstream or Dassault Aviation. This is the same Dassault that offers Catia and the legendary fighter plane Mirage, along with some of the most advanced biz-jets you can get. - They also had a 2008 revenue of €3.75 Billion.

Hardly small fry. I'm open minded, but I see the idea of an open-source real plane ending in disaster.
 
Burkhard
Posts: 1916
Joined: Fri Nov 17, 2006 9:34 pm

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Wed Dec 30, 2009 1:39 pm

The LINUX example is a very good one. Berkeley System V was a UNIX version written by programmers and students at the Berkely between 1976 and 1979. So basically built using taxpayers money, it was free available for other universities, fine. Some parts of it were based on still older AT&T code, and partially replaced over the years.

In the mid of the 80th it became clear that the approach used for this system, a single threaded kernel, was inefficient in all multi-user or multi-process application, more modern UNIX implementations took over, using POSIX standards etc... and most important efficient Kernel concepts. AT&T gave up all property rights of this ( not voluntarily, there were many lawyers involved), and it lay around in the software bin for a decade.

The big discovery by Linus Torwald was that
a) the requirements of a home computer are low, you typically only run one application
b) PC hardware has got so powerful that you can give up on efficiency - with a big enough engine everything flies
c) Microsofts Windows 95 etc weren't efficent either.
d) Nobody claimed any rights on the code he discovered under dust built in more than a decade.

So a bit of software was bundeled and a bit written and ready was LINUX - and since then got nothing but many new colorful desktops .

So, let us a build an airplane a la Linux.

It will look like a DC9, have the efficiency of the DC9, and will be built in China. There whill be a 90 seater called Gnome, a 102 seater called Geyser and a 114 seater called Giant. I hope it will be as reliable as a DC9, and not come with instructions how to crash it as normal passenger as Linux comes...
 
kirkc
Posts: 6
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 11:50 am

RE: OpenSource Aircraft

Wed Dec 30, 2009 3:40 pm

You don't have to forget that there is some experience in opensource since the beginning of LINUX. And I think, opensource can afford several persons checking things than only a few ones like in companies, which have to take care on the money. I mean, 4 eyes see more than 2 and so on.
And concerning the LINUX example, I would not only say that the effort of the last few years was only some colour and nice desktop. But this is another topic.

I believe in persons around the world being able to fulfill a small aircraft as opensource. And even if the project manages not the certification but the design, this would be a big effort (though the certification requires a lot of money). Maybe like LINUX a company then will take over the certification? who knows. But without trying and starting we will never know.

And concerning on CATIA, it has some nice colours, but if this opensource aircraft ends up like CATIA, you're right, it will be a disaster...

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests