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Fly-K
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Posts: 2994
Joined: Thu May 04, 2000 4:26 pm

"vip" List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 7:37 pm

A while ago, the topic of the so-called VIP list was discussed.
(The list of photographers that are known for good quality and whose photos therefore get processed much faster).
I wonder how many photogs Johan has on this list. I can somehow tell by which photogs have photos added frequently, and some have told me this in private.
Some of them are the ones with thousands of photos in the database, others are just sending in good quality once in a while.
Checking the stats, I notice that by number of photos, I'm on rank 14, by number of views, rank 10. Yet I'm not on the list, and I also know why, I try to "experiment" with different angles, light conditions and so on and not all meet the quality requirements and therefore I have a higher rate of rejection. If I would only shoot full sun, full frame and from the side, I'd probably also get a better acceptance rate. Thus I'm asking myself if I should limit myself to those photos which have a better chance of acceptance, or still take those "risks". Of course I'm always very impatient, and when it takes more than a week, it drives me mad.
The irony is, a friend and colleague of mine who only recently started to take photos got added to the list instantly, even though I scanned his slides, and our shots were almost identical as we standing next to each other. (just in case somebody is wondering if he steal the photos from each other). Lucky him! He does good photos and deserves it, don't get me wrong.
Any advice/comment is appreciated.

Konstantin
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
 
PUnmuth@VIE
Posts: 3119
Joined: Thu Aug 24, 2000 9:31 pm

RE: "vip" List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 7:49 pm

Hi!
I personally would vote for keeping the "risks". Just because I like it when differnt views or light conditions are showing up. I peronally dont like the so called "standard" pictures showing a plane profile. Thats my personal opinion and many other will disagree but thats the spice in life. If everyone would prefer the same it would be boring.
Peter
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cfalk
Posts: 10221
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2000 6:38 pm

RE:

Tue Apr 03, 2001 8:22 pm

I'm on the list, I think, as I haven't had a rejection for the last 6 months. I only figured it out a month or two ago, and It's caused me to try to be much more selective in what I upload, 'cause I know that Johan won't filter out any crap I might send up. I've only uploaded 100 or so pics since the beginning of the year, vs. 100 per month on average during 2000 since I started uploading in May. I try to concentrate on either unusual things, like the flying banana below, or stuff I take when travelling. Geneva has gotten boring  Yawn

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Charles Falk



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Charles Falk



Charles
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
Granite
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RE: "vip" List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 8:31 pm

Hi all

Please remember, it's not a VIP list but a list of regular photographers who have had little rejections in the past.

This 'list' makes it easier for Johan to upload shots when he is away on business/holiday on his pocket PC.

Regards
Gary Watt
Aberdeen, Scotland
 
cfalk
Posts: 10221
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2000 6:38 pm

RE: "vip" List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 8:31 pm

To return to the topic, I just glanced over your pics, Konstantin, and I think you take pretty awesome pictures. I especially like this one:

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Konstantin von Wedelstaedt


The contrast between the desert theme and snow is great.

Looking at all my pics, I note that the classic profile shots are the least viewed pics. The most viewed are the ones with interesting lighting, or setting, or action - i.e. the ones with a bit of risk. So keep taking risks!

Cheers,

Charles
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
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Fly-K
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RE: "vip" List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 8:51 pm

Gary I just called it "VIP" because I couldn't think of anything better.
So what rejection rate is required, in the early days mine was very low, around 5%, it has sinced increased to maybe 15%.

Charles and Peter, I agree with both of you, adding variety, if you can and are lucky enough to get around a bit, is really best!

Konstantin
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
 
cfalk
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Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2000 6:38 pm

RE:

Tue Apr 03, 2001 9:04 pm

Konstantin,

My rejection rate when I started out was sky-high - 90% to 95% or so when scanning prints. My reject rate fell to maybe 50% or so when I bought a dedicated slide scanner, and then down to almost nothing after I started using Provia 100F (which is what I use almost exclusively now).

The difficult thing about putting in variety is that when you don't know the airport, the really interesting places to spot from are unknown. The Delta 727 shot I did above is a case in point - I would have found a more interesting vantage point, but did not have the time, and wanted to at least document that I had been there  Big grin.

Charles
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
AndyEastMids
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RE:

Tue Apr 03, 2001 9:11 pm

I've only been looking at this site for a few weeks, and uploading stuff for less time still. At a paltry 150 pics in the database, I am hardly qualified to comment, but sorry, I will...

If photographers stop uploading creative shots, just so that they can get their "standard" shots uploaded more quickly (due to the risk of some of the "creatives" being rejected), then that is a huge loss for airliners.net. Just take a look at the best shots from the front page - how many of them are standard side on ramp shots? Not many. By not taking "risks", do we risk loosing those best shots in future? I hope not.

I guess it comes down to what you think airliners.net is for. If it is a showcase for individual photographers to present as many of their photographs as is possible as quikly as possible, then fine, everyone should revert to sunny, side on, ramp shots with no junk in the way. If on the other hand airliners.net is the premiere place to go to see the whole range of aircraft pictures, some standard and some creative, irrespective of the photographer who took them, then we should stop worrying about rejection rates and keep uploading great photographs - its likely that the good ones will get there, whether it takes a day, a week or longer.


As I said, I have only recently started offering pictures to airliners.net, and of course I am sensitive to my own rejection rate - we're talking egos here to some extent. Of course it would also be nice to see stuff uploaded within 24 hours of offering it every time, but to me quick acceptance is not the be-all and end-all. I will continue to upload pictures that I personnally like, and pictures of aircraft that I think are interesting or have not been featured before. If the consequences of doing this are that my photos take a week to appear, or I get a some rejects along the way, so be it... I only offer stuff I think is worthy of being accepted, and if what I offer gets rejected, that 's airliners.net's loss and not mine.

If we want measure our own work, surely a more reliable way of doing so is to look at the hit rate on our accepted pictures, and not to worry so much about our rejection rate or the time it takes to get our pictures accepted.

Andy
 
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RE: AndyEastMids

Tue Apr 03, 2001 9:43 pm

Very well said Andy.

And can I just say what a welcome sight all those interesting shots of yours are...keep 'em coming.

Cheers,
Dean

PS - you never know, if Kodak do take 3+ weeks to turn around your K64 processing...a week or 10 days to get shots uploaded will seem pretty damn quick  Wink/being sarcastic
 
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Fly-K
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Posts: 2994
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RE: "vip" List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 9:48 pm

That's why I use Fuji...
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
 
PUnmuth@VIE
Posts: 3119
Joined: Thu Aug 24, 2000 9:31 pm

RE: "vip" List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 10:12 pm

And thats why I use digital
-
 
ake0404ar
Posts: 2379
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 10:55 am

RE: VIP List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 11:09 pm

K and all others,

I think I am also a part of the "VIP list".
Even though my shots are unusual / arty and I am trying new things every day I still have a 99% acceptance rate.

If I were you guys, I would keep shooting the different stuff, more fun even though you have to deal with the rejections once in a while.

Just my 0.02 cents

Vasco

 
Sukhoi
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RE: VIP List

Tue Apr 03, 2001 11:30 pm

Well said Andy, personally I would much rather go for an unusual or action type shot rather than the ramp shot. But then again if I had ramp access that could all change Big grin

Its nice to see what the more creative shooter can produce, Vasco's latest uploads of the queue to depart Boston I love.

As to the "List" isnt it up to all of us to try and get on the "list"? its up to us all to improve the quality of our shots so we too can be the chosen ones Wink/being sarcastic

Regards

Paul
 
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Posts: 2702
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RE:

Wed Apr 04, 2001 12:02 am

People expect new photos to be added to this site every day. That's hard to live up to at times, especially when I'm traveling or have a lot of other stuff going on. On these occasions, I can quickly add the daily dosage of new photos to the database by only processing photos from photographers that have been uploading for a long time and whose photo quality is on a constant high level. By doing this I save time as I won't have to check the large version of every single photo, only a few. This does not mean in any way that a photographer on this list can get away with anything. The requirements are just as high as for everyone else, the only difference is that I do not check the scanning quality of each large photo version because I know from past experience that the scan quality is good enough.

I honestly don't care what photographers on this list or off it thinks about it. It was not created as an "VIP service" for certain photographers. It was created as a much needed function for me. I need to be able to process photos quickly at times and this was the best way to do it.

This list has nothing to do with "standard" or "artistic" photos. It's all about scan quality.

End of discussion.

Johan
Working on the site from morning 'till night that's livin' alright (1997-2007)
 
AndyEastMids
Posts: 1061
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 10:24 pm

RE: "vip" List

Wed Apr 04, 2001 12:13 am

Sukhoi,

I totally agree - we should each be striving to improve our own quality, and the rest including getting onto the list should follow. In terms of increasing our individual acceptance rates and thus getting onto the "VIP list", in my very humble opinion this comes not from uploading photograph after photograph, but from indentifying from within our own photographs those that SHOULD, and possibly more importantly, those that SHOULD NOT be uploaded. We can all help ourselves reduce our rejection rate, and help ourselves get on that VIP list, by recognising in ourselves when we have produced stuff that is not worthy, without Johan having to tell us.

However, it would be a shame if fear of rejection or desire to see our photographs accepted quickly compromised the diversity and "quality" of the photographs on this site - whatever quality is, which will always be judged in the eye of the individual beholder.

Andy

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