Aer Lingus
Topic Author
Posts: 1217
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Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 3:06 am

Well you may remember my topic a while ago about my intention to explore the marvels or woes of Kodachrome, well now I have the results and can I say im fairly impressed.
Initial impressions from my one and only roll is that the film is very sharp and grain is quite good. Scanning it is a little tricky, sometimes producing a cyan tone to the image. Not much hassle though so it doesn't really bother me. Scanned colours are a little dull, however the original slide is much more punchy and to be honest thats all that really matters. Anyway a little saturation adjustment in photoshop produces a more accuarate representaion of the real thing (according to my eyes).
Having shot Sensia 100 since November last I can safely say that K64 will be my film of choice for bright and sunny days. My observations are that K64 is much better in those conditions being sharper and more impressive in teh grain department. Having said that I wont be packing in Sensia for good. K64 isn't exactly the best film in not so great conditions, which has been said many times, so Sensia will remain my No.1 for the dull days when I fancy going out to shoot.
Finally on teh developing front all turned out well. I sent my film off to Stuttgart in Germany, refusing to send it to London for fear of the dreaded Ireland - England post reliability! Nevertheless I received my yellow box exactly two weeks to the day, including time over the Easter holidays, so im fairly impressed.
Anyway Im including a few examples that you may be interested in and no Dan contrary to you belief this is not a plugging session!

Sorry that the shots aren't exactly the most interesting angles but since I had only one roll of the stuff I wanted to shoot angles im more confident shooting.


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Martin O'Connell



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Martin O'Connell



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Martin O'Connell



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Martin O'Connell



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Martin O'Connell



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Martin O'Connell



and some Sensia 100 examples taken in dull weather


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Martin O'Connell



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Martin O'Connell



I hope I've enlightened some of you who have doubts about K64, its a nice film so give it a chance.

Cheers,
Martin
 
lewis
Posts: 3565
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 3:19 am

I also think that K64 is a good film but the colours seem a bit 'dead', maybe because it is an old film and the emulsion hasn't changed from the time that K64 was released.
 
Jan Mogren
Posts: 2014
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2000 2:47 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 3:46 am

The emulsion has changed.(or was it just the processing?) But not for the better..
Anyway it looks nothing like the old Kodachrome II.  Sad
/JM
AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
 
Alaskaairlines
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 6:25 am

Nice pictures! K64 explains it all!

-Dmitry
 
CO777
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 7:41 am

Anybody tried the Fuji Provia 100F? I have tried and its very easy to scan.I do like K64 but it can be very difficult to scan.
Jason Whitebird
 
scottysair
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 7:50 am

Help!! Hey Guys!!

I need your help about with me a cabin shot inside of the airplanes as for K64 or something is different film use as for sensia 100 or somelse like that to do buy at eckerds or wolfcamera. See if you guys that need to know about anything best shot with airplanes and cabin shot or cockpit shot. Well, can you do something as for me. Thanks, guys!
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 7:53 am

to me Martins scans on k64 look excellent- nice saturation- great. k64 scans just fine- did over 5000 scans on my s20 now on my 4000ed- always beautiful scans.


Joe
 
jderden777
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 9:42 am

i'm usually a green shooter, but recently i decided to try it out and i got my hands on a few rolls of k64...i'm anxious to get my slides back, as i think lots of them will turn out good (i got some PERFECT shots of an AA/TWA 757 hybrid, if my memory serves me right it was N701TW)...but today i got some k64 shots of "Fat Albert" the Blue Angels support C-130...and some provia 100f of the blue angels F-18s...

tomorrow i'll have some action shots from their practice for the airshow on saturday!

anyway, i am looking forward to getting my slides back (tuesday)...and i hope to have some K64 slides to scan (aside from Mr. Liao's which i always enjoy scanning Smile/happy/getting dizzy)

jonathan d.
"my soul is in the sky" - shakespeare
 
TomH
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 10:00 am

Martin,
Those are some sweet pictures! K64 speaks for itself when a competent photographer is pushing the button, like yourself. In other words, I think many of the problems others have had with it relates to experience level.

Regarding some of the other Kodachrome advantages that have been discussed and argued over in the past, let me reopen a couple of old wounds with the following:
Should you find that a couple of years have passed and you are still using K64, you will by then have realized you made a good choice. You will not have to worry about image deterioration, and collectors will always be willing to send you bundles of money in return for your slides. Well, small bundles anyway.

If you shoot much military, you will find K25/K64 are the accepted and expected currency of the experienced military shooter when it comes to slides. Newbies will probably try to argue this, but who you gonna listen to?

Jan,
You are correct, K64 is nothing like the old KII. It was not intended to be like it, as K64 was the replacement for a bad ISO 64 product called Kodachrome-X. K25 is the replacement for KII. Somehow I think that KII was better overall-and I'm not alone.
 
Guest

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Fri Apr 12, 2002 11:07 am

K64 is a great film! For anything overcast or semi sunny, I use Provia 100F, heck I sometimes even use it on sunny days but it will never replace Kodachrome.
 
Ljungdahl
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Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2002 2:10 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sat Apr 13, 2002 6:58 pm

Hi!
I believe that the choise of what film to use, has much to do with your personal taste. I used the K64 between 1979-97, then I switched to the Sensia 100, and I will not switch back, 'cause I think it have more intense colours (=which I think is better).
The K64 is very difficult for red colours in dull weather conditions, but the red colours is OK when it's bright sunshine. The real problem with the K64 is, shooting a photo of for instance an Alitalia, or even worser, Air Canada aircraft, in ANY weather you can't easily see that the dark green areas IS dark green and not black!
One more problem with the K64, at least here in Europe, is a very long developing time (weeks!!).

Just my 2 cents

Johan  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
N178UA
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sat Apr 13, 2002 11:16 pm

I don't want to spark any debate on Kodak vs Fuji again, but have any of you look hard in your viewer(loupe?) ,compare about a K64 slide and a Provia or Velvia slide (Not Sensia), see just how GRAINY the kodachrome is and Fuji despite all disagreement by many of you, you cannot overturn the fact the K64 is so GRAINY, dot dot and many dot in the blue sky background. I am not complainting about the color here.

Martin, all great shots, try shoot K64 in wet days like you did with Sensia, and see the results again. For Fuji, you have to be very careful to choose a right lab to process, if all care have been taken, I am sure Fuji looks just as good as K64 if not better! Those Aer Lingus and JaugarB732, I know what exactly will turn out on Velvia, which is my beloved favourite, a super high saturation and contrast, make the slide looks mouthwatering.

The other explanation of people shoot many K64 is the Economy of Scale. K64 price include processing, in most countries have Kodak lab set up, price is way lower than Fuji Velvia or Provia. (Without Processing on film). Some slide service turned around a great deal of slides, opt for K64, have to do with their own Economies of scale, heard in Swiss cost CHF13 for K64 include D/M, but FujiProfessional (not Sensia) will cost at least CHF25 or so, it is more economical after all, but I am going for the super nice color feeling and smooth Grain, willing to pay a little more anytime!

Sam Chui
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sat Apr 13, 2002 11:45 pm

Sam,
with your above message, even though you dont want to spark a debate, youve done so. I love when people put down kodachrome- its grainy its old its rotten its ancient the colors are bad they are too red they are too dark, its bad in poor weather. I still cannot understand how in my 12 years of shooting kodachrome, ive never once had a problem yet with the film- and you know i shoot in every single type of condition. People have been putting kr down for ages, but meanwhile the kodachrome guys just sit on the side and listen- and continue to shoot kr heavy- last weekend i shot 23 rolls- all came out absolutely perfect. This weekend, if it wasnt cloudy in new york i'd go shoot another bunch- and get back perfect results.

Joe
 
Alaskaairlines
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 1:20 am

There sure is a lot of faithful Kodachromers here. Joe and were all those 23 rolls on the ramp?

Your one lucky guy, wish I could get ramp access like that!

-Dmitry
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 1:24 am

D theres a reason why most of the long time slide collectors have used and continue to use kodachrome and pay big money for slides.
as far as the ramp- remember that i do work for clients who send me to shoot airport scenes and airplanes so it allows me to spend alot of time shooting 50mm shots.

Joe
 
Ljungdahl
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 3:06 am

Well, as I wrote earlier, not ALL people who use KR64 continues with it, I'm one of the exceptions!
I used KR64 for my aviation photography until 1997, which was for 18 years, when I switched to Sensia 100.
It's pretty much about your personal taste, as well as aesthetics ALSO is about taste, you can discuss such things over and over again, forever, and people still have their own taste.
Not much to do about it, but it's damn fun to have the discussion...

Johan  Laugh out loud
 
N178UA
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 9:48 am

Joe

With all the criticism you wrote there, obviously your words reflect lots of people didn't get along with KR64, include me and others here, but sure every brand of film have some faithful followers like you here. I know enough guys complaint to me often and swaped to other film (Green prehaps), otherwise tell me HOW did Green film as a late comer to marker develop such a market share, luring new users and even K25 stopped? (not sure this is related?).

I am not using this messages to show how Kodachrome so bad compare to Green, but i am expressing my feeling and facts towards K64, as it is grainy, you just can't deny it. That's all, I didn't mean Fuji is a completely perfect film.

Sam
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 10:32 am

Sam,
i've used fuji provia100f for non ramp shots and i like the film- but for ramp shots, i will use kodachrome until they dont make it anymore.

Joe
 
Alaskaairlines
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 10:36 am

Joe what film was used on this shot:


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Joe Pries

?

Is this Kodachrome or Fuji?

-Dmitry
 
F27
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 10:44 am

I have used KR 64 film since the early 80's and never had a problem with it. My biggest problem is Kodak keep loosing my films on me. My latest one i got back slides from a Plastic surgeon certainly not Aviation Slides and most were regos which i had chased for months. But KR 64 film is industry standards and i will keep using Kodachrome until it is made no more
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 10:53 am

D,
that is kodachrome 64 and Sam, i can proudly say that there is very very little grain- i think the grain issue is overdone with kodachrome, especially when high quality lenses are used- there is very little in the way of grain

F27- i know that kodak is frustrating once you leave the new york area and i know its brutal waiting for 2+ weeks to get your slides back- but we always put a premium on the finer things in life....

Joe
 
F27
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 11:35 am

Joe i live in Australia and our films go to sydney most of the time it is only a 4 day wait for our films to come back but what has been happening to me lately i am getting very sceptical at times as to weather or not i am going to get my films back. I have no probs with the film at all i love it but they ned to get their act together to return the correct film. I am about to go and shoot a 727 that i last saw 19 years ago when it left Australia.
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 11:53 am

4 days in australia? thats excellent- aside from the getting back the right film problem- 4 days is probably better than anywhere in the world other than new york- you guys in australia are lucky

Joe
 
Alaskaairlines
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 12:07 pm

Well I have had a record of 3 days, but that was at a Ritz Camera place. Usually it takes about 4-5 days, but now I am going to the mailers that go to NJ (New Jersey), I have no idea how long that will take for them to ship the slide back to AK. The local place gets my slide back usually really dusty and sometimes little werid marks on a few slides. How should I expect to get my slides back from NJ Kodal Processing lab?

I kinda thought that shot was on good ol' Kodachrome, excellent Joe!

-Dmitry
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 12:09 pm

D,
i think fairlawn youre looking at 2 weeks turnaround- sucks but what can you do aside from moving to nyc.

Joe
 
Alaskaairlines
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 12:26 pm

Well Joe I think NYC is just not a place for me! I love Alaska, wait untill you see it! I know NYC has a lot of advantages, but Alaska has a lot also, not only photography, I know you got a lot more variety of planes, but there are lots of planes at ANC with a great background many wish to capture with those arrival and departure shots!

In the summer you can shoot almost 24/7, thats if anybody cares to shoot that long!

-Dmitry
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 12:35 pm

D,
number one- i would love nothing more than to shoot 24/7- i've sat at a poker table for 16 hrs straight (Ballys atlantic city 1997) so i can certainly shoot for many hrs too. Also- ANC is great for the backdrops but traffic wise for me, everything that goes in there i've already shot elsewhere- the alaska 732's i shot in seattle, all the asian and us freighters ive shot in jfk/mia/lax/sfo- so you see why europe and the far east are much bigger priorities for me than ANC, though one day i definetely want to come shoot there

Joe
 
N178UA
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 12:53 pm

Hello F27

If you live in SYDNEY, you can go to Moorebank direct and drop off there, pay AUD10 for 5 rolls prioirty , you can sure get them back in 24-48 hrs, I dropped 17 rolls of ramp shot shooted for an agent, not for myself(as everyone know I shoot green) Kodak return promptly in 24 hours or less, call me then I go there to pick up!!! In terms of Service, Kodak Australia is really deserve thumbs up!

Are you 75-86 years old, and live in Antartica? that no wonder Kodak lost your film sometimes! I wonder if you stick this hobby long enough, you may have some nice 1950s slide?? Who want to buy?
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
Alaskaairlines
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 1:19 pm

Yep Joe! If you want just about 24/7 ANC is the place. I could almost feel sorry for your walet if you sat 16hrs strait at a blackjack table, or it could be visa versa. What was the out come?

I'll have to check if you have any of the Alaska B732's uploaded here. Well Seattle is just about the farthest they go South, unless its something special. But, you still don't see them that often down in SEA. You can see one take off and arrive almost non-stop at ANC, but there is a lot more interesting aircraft to shoot, like the heavies. The light jets are usually way to high to capture with the backdrops.

-Dmitry

P.S. where do you want to go in the Far East? Like Vladivostok? Now thats cold!
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 1:38 pm

D,
it was poker and i won about 100 bucks in the end. ill have to fish out the ak 732 and scan it. far east i mean japan and china

Joe
 
Alaskaairlines
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 1:43 pm

So when you going to head out to Hong Kong, Beijing, Tokyo, etc.........?

-Dmitry
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 1:48 pm

no firm dates yet but will be sometime in the middle of winter- most of the people ive spoken to and the shots ive seen on ainet from there point to between nov and march D

Joe
 
rindt
Posts: 876
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 3:18 pm

Sammy,

Honestly, you make me laugh... no offence. First you tell us how good Fuji is, etc, etc... and then you say you're shooting Kodachrome 64 for an "agent"... now, I can't say I've heard of an agent that specifically wants Kodachrome, but if they did, then obviously they must like the film for a reason  Smile/happy/getting dizzy  Smile/happy/getting dizzy  Smile/happy/getting dizzy I've heard you've got into some arguments with Joe, and Schaefer... when will you realize that if you want to trade slides, it's gotta be KR. As far as Fuji vs. KR for trading goes, you're SORELY out-numbered, accept it. And quite frankly, I think Velvia is CRAP. No offence.

But thanks for the pointers about dropping the film in SYD, I'll give it a go while I'm down there.

Joe - far east is practically only good in November-January (for the best light)... as most spots are around N35-40 degrees, like LAX... and we all know how LAX is in the winter  Smile/happy/getting dizzy mmmm! That's why I plan on hitting PEK in November.

Cheers,
-Rob



What other people think of you is none of your business!
 
rindt
Posts: 876
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 3:39 pm

Oh yeah... while we're talking about "grain" with KR64...



Here are some recent slides taken with KR64 (like what else would I use?  Big grin ) :

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Rob Rindt


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Rob Rindt


Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Rob Rindt


Can you HONESTLY(!) notice an abundance of grain on ANY of these shots? There are hints on the winglet shot, but considering the light conditions, I'd say it's pretty damn good (3.5 second exposure, leaning on a bench-stool, talk about roughing it!). I'll have to try a roll of Provia myself (if my camera would allow me to... it has Fuji-phobia), but I find that the Kodachrome nay-sayers are those are more inexperienced with the film. Granted I am using top-of-the-line F2.8 glass, but the scans are all coming from 1800DPI scans with the S20, saved with GIMP... in rather simple process. So, I personally think if you're having trouble getting good scans, and you see more grain, YOU'RE doing something wrong, there isn't something wrong with the film. The film itself is fine, and might be more challenging, but once you've tamed the beast, it's all good from there  SmileSo, you might want to brush up on your photographic capabilities before you diss the beloved Kodachrome. And I'm saying this directly at you Sammy, because I know for a fact you use top-knotch equipement, so I KNOW for a fact, you're capable of producing the same quality scans/shots as all the other Kodachrome users. I'll be blunt, because, I don't think I could get the point across any other way.

Hopefully others will agree with these comments !

Cheers,
-Rob


What other people think of you is none of your business!
 
N178UA
Posts: 1686
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 9:56 pm

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 5:34 pm

Rob,

You COMPLETELY MISSED MY 1ST intention, and afterward...

1. You missed my point, my point is I shooted for the agent, who asked for specifially on K64. My opinion on K64 or my preferrence on Green have nothing to do with that.I just finish my job and send them to the agent. Just like Joe said he did Provia100F for clients, but not ramp.

2. I never got trading slides problem with Joe or Frank (never exchange actually). I just bought (a few slides from Joe in Miami and Frank in SYD) if they cannot accept Fuji. Furthermore, if people only accept Kodak in trading, I just say sorry, I can't help because I got Green mostly, WASN'T IT THAT THE REASON I TOLD YOU WHEN YOU ASK WHETHER I AM INTERESTED TO TRADE WITH YOU?

3. Since you said Velvia is crap, I invite you comeover have a big fight and debate in my house, under my loupe and lightbox look through the exact difference on 2 Orient Thai B747 slide, 50 mm perfect Ramp condition, both Green and KR taken on F5 on different roll within 5 minutes (sun condition similar to identical), f2.8 lens, then tell me what difference you see, I know it is pointless to say it over to all the loyal user of KR here, but if we can put some evidence to show, it is far more effective to prove what I want to show. So when you come to SYD, I would love to show you those.


4. If KR64 is the only currency for trading or selling slides, why I have over 30 person range from Europe to Brazil trade with me? They know in the other end, they will receive 90% Green from me, and still trade? And Why I can turnaround a good load of amount of slides selling on Airlinehobby? (Cost me a lot to just pay the commission). So, how can you say I am SOLELY Outnumered shoot Green and trade green? No one else here shoot Green??? If no one did Green, why all KR shooter said I will continue shoot KR until it die? Why assume will (and when please?) KR die if Green is so Crap.



Finally, hope I can see you in SYD, and discuss furthur if you want. Bring those slide non grainy one you want to show me, THE ONLY WAY TO JUDGE IS IF YOU HAVE 2 SAME OBJECT TAKEN SAME TIME ON DIFFERENT FILM, otherwise the debate never end!


Sam
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
N178UA
Posts: 1686
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 9:56 pm

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 5:57 pm

Another Topic from Joe said about Far East

I think there are another few airport in Asia really deserve some attention.

these are the airport have enough traffic, not like 10 flights a day, it will keep you busy, and you can look for Ramp quality even youre outside.

1. Nagoya (Will you lucky enough to see the Special Korean A300 CheJu Speical color there?)

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Kok Chwee SIM


2. Osaka Itami Excellent for Action touch down or Rotate

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Takuji Sohmura


3. Manila Cebu Pacific is calling!

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Torsten Maiwald


4. Denpasar Bali Ramp is available at low cost. Weather I believe is better than Jakarta and interesting Indonesian stuff!

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Propfreak


5. Finally Taipei Sung Shan, you are located very close to runway! Weather have been problem.

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Arthur Yu




These airport are worth to consider as a side trip, like NGO together with Tokyo...

Sam Chui
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
Glenn
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 6:00 pm

No Argument

Go Digital
 Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
rindt
Posts: 876
Joined: Thu May 25, 2000 3:08 pm

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 6:03 pm

1st point : Yes, I'm aware the agent asked for Kodachrome 64... obviously, because it's an excellent film - that's WHY they chose it.

2nd point : Yes, and that's one of the reason's I am NOT trading with you at the moment, unless of course I come across some KR64s from you, I'd be more than happy to trade for those, but I'm not touching the green stuff, period.

3rd point : I'm game... but I'll tell you off the bat, I don't like the fake blue colors and way over exagerated tones with Velvia, and whether you show me the slide, or I see Velvia from someone else, the colors will always appear "fake", at least in my eyes. But, that's my opinion, and that's why I don't shoot the stuff.

4th point : Well, for starters, most of the people in South America unfortunately are forced to shoot Provia/Velvia as KR is not available (at least not cheaply). So, the Kodachrome guys rely on Europeans and others who go down there to shoot on trips. And also, a lot of the guys who buy stuff from you already have too much money to spend, so for them its irrelevant as to what type of the film the slide was shot on. But, if you take a look at the true diehard slide-shooters, the vast majority shoot only Kodachrome. No matter what you say, you won't be able to convert them.

What I'm trying to say is this, if you only worked with KR64 more, you would achieve the excellent results the rest of us seem to be able to get, and you wouldn't be complaining.

I've never mentioned that ALL Fuji products are crap, just Velvia. I hate that film. I'm sure Provia has it's positive notes (sure, it might have a little less grain, but that's really only a trivial amount anyway, and that's expected from a new film in any case). The fact that KR64 archival abilities are so great gives me a warm feeling inside knowing my shots will last a LONG, LONG time. And I really would hate to see you in 20 years, and look at some older Fuji shots that have gone brown/yellow/murky, and then say "I told you so". Oh well, your risk.

In the end, shoot whatever the hell you want to shoot Sammy, just don't get offended everytime if people don't like your stuff because it's Fuji.

The debate that never ends, the debate we never want to end...  Smile

Cheers,
-Rob


What other people think of you is none of your business!
 
N178UA
Posts: 1686
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 9:56 pm

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 6:35 pm

Rob,

Thanks, I simply like to respond all uncertainty and some funny issue you arise from my last reply.

The fact that KR64 archival abilities are so great gives me a warm feeling inside knowing my shots will last a LONG, LONG time. And I really would hate to see you in 20 years, and look at some older Fuji shots that have gone brown/yellow/murky, and then say "I told you so". Oh well, your risk.


I have a lot of Kodak faded color slide here, do you want those, I wonder why? You will probably will come up with the reason people didn't keep it well or didnt expose correctly, but I don't just have one, have loads of KR slides from 70s-even 98, 99 recent ones on KR......Sure I have some nice stuff that kept well over years, but gone through most KR slides in many tin box at Miami Convention, Rare and excellent shooted planes, but I have to sigh is the color! I do have some new Kodak slide from others, in about 5 years, I will sure look at them again! (Do not come up with a reply, saying yeah, why you bother look at KR if you like Green, as I am collector, I am collecting all slides, but for myself shooting, I opted for Green, I do accept Kodak for my collection, but Fuji is priority.)

The 2nd thing is, I am merely speaking on K64 is grainy and I think in fact it is, I didn't comment on its color depth, and simply wouldn't criticize any film saying that it is CRAP, that is not appropriate, I didn't say K64 is CRAP in any post before as you did on Velvia.

Also for you to say people have too much money to buy stuff from me, that is highly welcome! I would love to earn more money from that reason, why not?? I don't really think anybody is too rich to give away their money here?

I don't just have people from South America trade with me, thats only a few, most of them from Europe or US, why those people want my Green stuff even they can access KR cheaply and process soundly?? I am simply meaning that I shoot Green, and got people want my slides, contrary to you said I will be isolated, It cannot simply judge by you. Beside, you don't know me well, right, frankly, you come up with all assumation, that Rich people buy slides from me, South America people got no choice, trade green with me, and what's next??


if you only worked with KR64 more, you would achieve the excellent results the rest of us seem to be able to get, and you wouldn't be complaining.

Last point, I made my choice on Green, not just from a single experiment or a few trys in cloudy days, I have try enough rolls of K64 before came to Velvia. That is the best film for me, yes as you said, I stick to what I want, and you cannot tell me if I shoot K64 , I will be a better shooter.

P.S. I am more than happy to meet you in Sydney, you really speaks a lot, got my interest on you!


Sam
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
Ljungdahl
Posts: 887
Joined: Fri Apr 12, 2002 2:10 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 8:24 pm

I must say that I agree with Sam here, my own experience with KR64 is 18 years, thousends of slides shot in ALL weather conditions, and I had a long time concerning if to continue with KR64 or change to Sensia100, and my choise fell on Sensia.
It was neither an easy or fast desicion, but I made up my mind, just because I like the colours better of the Sensia, but that don't means that I say KR64 is a bad film, it's just a matter off taste!

KR64:

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Johan Ljungdahl


Sensia100:

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Johan Ljungdahl



Just my 2 cents

Johan  Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
lewis
Posts: 3565
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 10:30 pm

I have to say that I am a Fuji fan too, mostly Sensia and Provia 100F. And I have to agree that the dark green on your AC shots Rob is more like black. Sorry...
 
N178UA
Posts: 1686
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 9:56 pm

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 10:43 pm

Rob, I will off to work soon, so cannot reply to you till next morning in Australia time. I work in the Money Market.(overnight shift)

Taking advantage of the issue, I also like to put a few Fuji shots here!
Fuji

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Sam Chui



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Sam Chui



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Sam Chui



Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Sam Chui



and K64 here, is ok, but could do better on Fuji I believe (very few I used K64 as for a agent shoot)

Click for large version
Click here for full size photo!

Photo © Sam Chui





Sam
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Sun Apr 14, 2002 10:47 pm

theres way too much to respond to with Sam and Rob all i can say is that its true that people on ahobby do buy from Sam and its true that people did trade with him in miami. Sam shoots in australia (his homebase) where there arent alot of slide shooters so people prefer something over nothing and if he has a good sunny shot of an airplane down there, people will take green- some people- i for one refused to even look at his slides- even though he shoots good ones with good equipment. So while there are guys like me and rob and mike and others who wouldnt take fuji for anything, there are those who will take it because they feel that they won't ever get a kodachrome of the subject and they are thinking of their collection. Either way, kr camp is not gonna change their mind and Sam is happy shooting green so he's not changing his mind- so the debate continues.......

and nothing against the new guys who just started shooting slides recently and are shooting green- you guys dont go to the conventions or sell your slides there or on the internet so i dont blame you for going green right off the bat- if you ever shot kodachrome and were able to get back the money you spent for a roll by selling 3-4 slides from that roll (and get to keep the other 32 for yourself), you'd be worshipping kodachrome too and protecting it against any green monsters  Big grin


Joe
 
rindt
Posts: 876
Joined: Thu May 25, 2000 3:08 pm

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Mon Apr 15, 2002 6:19 am

Sam,

That's like comparing apples and oranges... any film will look like crap if improperly exposed or stored. But I find it hard to believe that Kodachrome slides from 2 and 3 years ago are already faded... My first slides from 1997 look the same now, as when I saw them 5 years ago, and the oldest slide I have (so far) in my collection from 1968 looks great even today.

I'm not saying your stuff in general is crap... you have some gorgeous shots from all over the world, but I will NOT trade for them because they are Fujichromes, and the majority of the other serious (and I mean serious!) traders will not trade for Fuji either, you're just going to have to accept that. I don't want it, and I never will (unless, Kodachrome 64 goes out of production entirely...  Crying ), full-stop.

Joe,

That's why I'm going to BNE/SYD myself in their prime winter season to stock myself up on the Kodachrome slides  Smile/happy/getting dizzy  Smile/happy/getting dizzy  Smile/happy/getting dizzy I wouldn't have it any other way.

Cheers,
-Rob
What other people think of you is none of your business!
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Mon Apr 15, 2002 6:25 am

good for you Rob i hope you crush everything in sight down there- i probably wont be getting down to australia for many years (i dont see the need personally- all the heavies i got in the US or Europe- the qf and nz heavies) and the narrowbodies i get from the europeans that go there and bring it to the FRA convention. For me the far east and europe are where the action is outside the US

Joe
 
N178UA
Posts: 1686
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 9:56 pm

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Mon Apr 15, 2002 8:35 am

Rob,

Just came back from work.

thanks again for your responses, I am wondering why you think only (non-serious people) trade Green with me? And only the top shooter, serious guy (such as YOU, or Joe) don't trade with me, this is completely made on your own judgement and at NO point, I see this is correct. You simply just don't know who I trade with, and you cannot underestimate those people are not being serious, just because they got some Green slide in their collection instead of KR64. From my opinion, (if saying anything can counts here) all my friends trade with me, provide me far superior stuff than I can asked for from any of you here. Well, this is just my view.

Please don't write stuff about trading with me, then you will not accept Fuji, the Question is back to day one, I NEVER asked you to trade, you emailed me, but I said I only have 90% Green, I am afriad not to trade with you. I never asked you to trade from day one nor did I ever email you right. You sounds like I am desperate to ask your NICE slide, Rob!


Joe to your response on KR64, selling 2 or 3, and got 32-33 for free is so ture, but this also apply to my Green shoot, I sell 1-2 , also cover the cost for the rest, so thats like you said, I stick to what film I can cover my cost, for me is Green! Not yellow Monster

For selling on Airlinehobby, just happy to what I have here, selling stuff not much people have, this does let me commencing high price, isn't it a absolute advantage??? I also found my KR64 slide on a Virgin Blue B737 sold at only $3, but a Fuji Flying shot bidding now at $16.16, people too rich there huh??

Sam
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
EGGD
Posts: 11880
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RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Mon Apr 15, 2002 9:04 am

Well, I still have issues with the colour of Kodachrome, I prefer more natural and vibrant tones. Digital photographs display them best, and just adds to a picture (A digital image of a simple aircraft can look so much better than KR64 simply because of the colours).

Of course, I don't like over-saturation but KR64 just looks ugly. The grain is excellent, some results that I have seen that have been corrected look top notch also, I just dislike the tone.

Dmitry - That shot of Joe's is obviously KR64, you can see it from a mile off. The colour of the red is very dark. I know you like kodachrome but some of your shots are well taken, but seem underexposed (they lack almost any colour at all). Which does detract from the picture somewhat.

Regards

Dan
'why.......................'
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Mon Apr 15, 2002 9:19 am

"KR64 just looks ugly"

i love some of the stuff i see on here, its great

Joe
 
N178UA
Posts: 1686
Joined: Sun Jan 07, 2001 9:56 pm

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Mon Apr 15, 2002 9:40 am

For the grainy issue, You cannot look at one's scan and comments about, as he may sharpen it hard or something. You don't know the real slide looks like.

The only way to compare (Grainy, color composition, and other things) is that you have 2 slides(Fuji and Kodak prehaps) shoot at same condition(2 cameras or change rolls within same condition) and then look back on them. I have some funny results, I have invited a few guys, and they all admiited the K64 is more grain. Color is just a matter of personal preferances. I love Green color, someone will like KR64 no doubt, and then all the trading issue is supplementary, I am more than happy to trade with people who accept my Green, which I am already getting lots of appreciation. That's all I have to say. No more other debates.

Sam
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
joe pries
Posts: 1922
Joined: Sat May 13, 2000 1:04 am

RE: Kodachrome 64 Users

Mon Apr 15, 2002 9:54 am

yeah to continue this is pointless indeed- there can be no winners here, just back and forth forever. Everyone shoots what they like

Joe

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