serge
Posts: 1903
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Eliminating Grain On Scans

Wed Jan 01, 2003 9:36 am

Is there a good way to remove grain from photos (especially the sky) in Photoshop? Heres a good example:





[click for larger version which opens in new window]



I have quite a few Great Lakes photos I would like to share but this is one of the problems  Sad. I submitted a version of this photo and it was rejected for badscan.. Also submitted another angle of it and it was rejected and rejected again after I did a little improvement...

Any help would be appreciated,
thanks,
Serge
 
skyliner
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Wed Jan 01, 2003 10:25 am

Try FIlter/Texture/Grain, and set "Intensity" to zero. This does a fairly good job in Photoshop Elements.
George
 
JT8D
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Wed Jan 01, 2003 11:33 am

A simple method I used in PS on occasion before I got the S2 which works fairly well at reducing grain in the sky is:

with the BLUE channel selected, click FILTER/BLUR/SMART BLUR, move the RADIUS value to 10 and the THRESHOLD to 30 then OK. Click back on RGB and there you'll have it. This method will never create a perfect "non-grainy" image, that goes beyond PS's ability, but it can help reduce apparent grain significantly.

Much of the noise exists in the blue channel, so it works particularly well for skys where grain is most noticeable. It doesn't deteriorate the overall image quality too much either.

It might work for you.

GH
Graham Hitchen, KMIA
 
serge
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Thu Jan 02, 2003 10:25 am

I gave the blue channel thing a try, but it didn't seem to do much of difference overall, but I'm sure it can prove very handy in the future.

As another photog suggested via email, I just did the whole selective smartblur to the background of the RGB version (I kinda wanted to avoid that process though):

http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/big/ready/N96ZK_ISN_v2.jpg

thanks for the help,
Serge
 
ckw
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:15 pm

I don't think grain is the biggest problem with this pic - it is far too contrasty with almost all the shadow detail lost. I think the first thing to do is make a new scan and try and get a little less contrast and bring out more of the shadow. Of course, this assumes there is more detail in the original.

Once scanned, I think increasing the gamma a little (using levels or curves) and thereby lightening the sky and underwing a bit, you'll find the grain less obtrusive.

Personally I don't like most grain removal techniques - they tend to result in an "unnatural" look to my eye, but you can avoid making it look worse than it need be - sharpening generally tends to bring out the grain, so one thing worth trying is to mask off the sky before applying USM - use a pixel or so of feathering on the mask to avoid odd edge effects (esp round the props).

Cheers,

Colin
Colin K. Work, Pixstel
 
serge
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Fri Jan 03, 2003 2:20 pm

Thanks for the opinion/advice Colin. I'll give the rescan a try tomorrow, I don't have anything to judge the pic with except the scanned negative since the prints were some crappy one hour matte finish....

I do try to do selective USM most of the time, but sometimes it leaves this compressed look on the sky/background.

I typed another reply to this thread before today, but my f***ing computer crashed when it was still in the preview mode  Pissed.

...Serge  Smile
 
serge
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Fri Jan 03, 2003 4:13 pm

New batch of rejections:


http://airliners.net/procphotos/rejphoto.main?filename=N297UX_ISN_Dec20_02.jpg


http://airliners.net/procphotos/rejphoto.main?filename=N499US_Sept_02_BIL.jpg

Any advice? I really don't know how I can keep up with this site!  Nuts

...Serge Big grin
 
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clickhappy
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Fri Jan 03, 2003 5:04 pm

Serge, you sure are determined to get those Great Lake shots accepted!

What were the rejections given? The Great Lakes shot is pretty cool, really looks cold in that shot.

Are you using Auto Contrast and Auto Levels? Dont.

Use Levels (Ctrl - L) and have a go that way. I think the Auto settings, while helpful at times, tend to make images way to contrasty and cartoonish.

 
sunilgupta
Posts: 768
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Sat Jan 04, 2003 1:18 am

I agree that you need to improve the quality of the initial scan. However, even after doing that you may still have grain issues. In that case, I recommend a neat feature of Paintshop Pro called “edge preserving smooth”. The name of the feature says it all. Apply the filter before resizing the picture for best results. You can mask the sky if you want, however I generally do not.

Sunil
 
serge
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Sat Jan 04, 2003 7:08 am

Royal:

Yep! I really had hopes of getting every Great Lakes EMB-120 reg in the database (theres only 6 soon 7 of them anyway). I've only gotten 293UX and 297UX in... This is the largest commerical flight we get here so its always my "target" for photography... All we get are GLA EMB-120s and B1900Ds (I'd say one every few weeks if a Brasilia is down) and Big Sky Metros.

I never use auto-level or contrast anymore, but I do usually play with the curves and contrast myself. I'll try turning it down a bit.

Sunil:

I'll download the PSP trial version and check it out!  Smile

I'll do a rescan of the GLA photos and post the results up here if they're improved...

thanks,
Serge
 
serge
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Sat Jan 04, 2003 7:35 am

Forgot to mention all were rejected for badscan...

...Serge
 
serge
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Sat Jan 11, 2003 7:07 am

Thank you screeners  Smile/happy/getting dizzy:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Serge Walczak
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Serge Walczak



View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Serge Walczak
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Serge Walczak



I'm glad to have gotten some more GLA material onto here. Tonight I'll give the first image in question (of 96ZK) a rescan and try and bring out some shadow detail.

...Serge (yay, its the weekend Big grin)
 
serge
Posts: 1903
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Sat Jan 11, 2003 1:22 pm

I set the white point to another point in the sky on the Big Sky photo and came up with this:

http://airliners.net/reupload/upload/big/N459AM_ISN_Dec20_02_v2.jpg

What do you think is better? (heres the first one: http://www.airliners.net/open.file/309421/L)

I always have a tough time tweaking photos to perfection  Sad

thanks for any opinions,
Serge
 
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lindy field
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Sat Jan 11, 2003 1:48 pm

Serge,

I just had a look at both images. My initial impression was to like the first one (the greyer one) a little more because it's a little more evocative of the darkness of winter, and a little more natural in appearance. I think I still feel that way, even though I had some doubts. I asked my wife to have a look, but she says she can't even tell the difference. Women.... what can you do? Maybe it's my laptop monitor. Sorry I can't be of more help, but congrats on your successful uploads.

Edward
 
serge
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RE: Eliminating Grain On Scans

Tue Jan 14, 2003 1:42 pm

Thanks for the help Ed! I agreed with you and changed it back to the original (nothing has changed on the photo).

I saw the Sea-Dart and blackbird as well as your other photos on jp.net. Neat photo of the El Al tails. BTW, I have a photo taken from this EXACT spot (I think?) of a UA B777 as well:

http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=18976

Did you take it through a cafe window? If not there musta been pretty close through the terminal glass?

regards,
Serge

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