ake0404ar
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Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 10:17 pm

Good day fellow photographers,

I have been thinking a while now to start a topic like this.......just some provoking stuff for the new year.

I have been not as active in the forum as I used to be quite a few years ago, time is limited these days.

One thing I have noticed though, that ever since DSLR are practically available for every budget, the database gets flooded with images.

Seems like some of us, uploading every single shot they have taken.......soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo boring!

Fire away...................................................

Vasco G.












 
EGGD
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 10:28 pm

Pretty much agreed here..

Have uploaded some different ones from me... Doubt many will get accepted though..

Cheers

Dan
 
Granite
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 10:30 pm

Vasco

I agree with your comments, especially this one:

>Seems like some of us, uploading every single shot they have taken<

Being a screener and viewing 100 shots uploaded by a single photographer on one upload session can be rather tedious........let's have a limit of 10 per day.......ooops.....what have I started now  Smile

Cheers

Gary


[Edited 2004-01-04 14:35:07]
 
TZ
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 10:34 pm

"let's have a limit of 10 per day"

I like that idea, although I'm sure somebody will soon suggest all the reasons why this is unfair (eg the 100 photos could still be uploaded over a ten-day period; some people only have irregular internet access so have to send batches; etc, etc.)

Sounds like a nice plan though!

Tamsin
TZ Aviation - Aeropuerto de los Banditos Team Images
 
gerardo
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 10:48 pm

A year or so back there was always the consensus, not to upload huge batches of pics. I remember harsh words regarding that. Nowadays the search page even lists the top uploaders in terms of uploaded pictures, encouraging photographers to upload every single picture to get on top of that list.

I for one would welcome a 10 or 20 pictures per upload batch limit, just as seen at Planepictures.net.

Cheers
Gerardo
dominguez(dash)online(dot)ch ... Pushing the limits of my equipment
 
TZ
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:07 pm

Like Gerado says, the "top uploaders" and the "most popular" lists greatly encourage two practices: mass-uploading and batch-uploading. As long as one's pictures are of acceptable quality, if you have enough of them, you get on that list and then your "number of views" skyrockets.

Here's an idea:
Perhaps the two lists could be replaced with a single list. Simply list the highest AVERAGE views per photographer over the past 24 hours, 7 days, etc. That way it encourages photographers to make every one of their photos a good one to keep the average up. Somebody could be up there with one outstanding picture, or 100 outstanding pictures. You wouldn't make it onto this list if you had 100 unpopular pictures.

It's not perfect, but doesn't it remove the dependency on bulk-uploading to make the grade? It's also a bit different from the most-popular of the day because that just represents an individual photo, not the work of a photographer.

Just a little idea!  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

Tamsin
TZ Aviation - Aeropuerto de los Banditos Team Images
 
fireguy274
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:18 pm

Hi I think I am one of those people you guys are talking about. I am fairly new and I was trying to find out what the site was looking for. I was getting a ton of rejections and felt I had a better chance of getting some accepted if I uploaded more. I have uploaded 40 shots at a time. I was not uploading every plane but the photos that I thought came out crisp and clear. I wouldn't upload more than one photo of a particular plane or one that I already had in the data base. I will in the future be much more selective on what I upload. I have a better Idea now on what is acceptable and what is not....The screeners do have a hard enough job without me making it harder...Stay Safe Artie

[Edited 2004-01-04 15:20:27]
 
wietse
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:29 pm

Wow my first post in the new year and already a hot topic..

On the 10 upload limit at once, I agree completely...

Wietse
Wietse de Graaf
 
ryangooner
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:31 pm

Nice topic!

I couldnt agree more, quality over quantity is the way to go.

I cant imagine having to screen 50+ images from one photographer who in that batch one after the other uploads the same plane , the same airline , the same angle but....... different registration - i would need counselling !

Maybe the whole Baddouble issue needs updating!

Ryan Hemmings
ooh to ooh to be ooh to be a gooner!
 
timdegroot
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:36 pm

Upload limit would be unfair IMO. I usually only have time to do some slidescanning during the weekends and sometime I'd like to do 20 slides in one go. Hence I only upload in batches, though usually every shot is very different from the others.

I agree about limiting the uploads from the same day/spot.

About encouraging to upload large batches, yes the new layout on the search page might have some effect, but some people just seem to want to upload every shot they take, for whatever motive they have for that.

Change the meaning of baddouble? Might be a good idea.

Tim

Alderman Exit
 
fireguy274
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:58 pm

Heres some food for thought. What if your airport doesnt allow any real access for photos and all you have is the same old boring angle, should you stop uploading photos to airliners.net all together?......Artie
 
wietse
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Sun Jan 04, 2004 11:59 pm

I am still convinced that you can vary your uploaded pics.

Wietse
Wietse de Graaf
 
ryangooner
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 12:07 am

Fireguy

there are always different angles to be had, im yet to find an airport that only limits you to one angle - but if there was, then upload the same angle but keep the same plane, airline etc.. a bit more varied in the way you queue them.

I try my hardest (sometimes need to try harder!) to make the 15 pics on my pages as varied as possible - it just makes them a little more pleasing to the eye!

Ryan Hemmings
ooh to ooh to be ooh to be a gooner!
 
fireguy274
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 12:13 am

I appreciate what your saying. Some airports seem to be a lot easier to take different types of photos. I will certainly try to be more varied in my future uploads. Thanks for the advice.....Artie
 
Skymonster
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:02 am

I really don't understand what the folks who upload [say] 20 almost identical pictures of BA A319s on short final to LHR runway 27L are trying to achieve. But if it keeps those people happy, there's nothing in the rules to stop them doing it right now (as long as they don't do it day in, day out, because if they do we'll pretty quickly snag them badcommon).

We can talk all we like about self-screening, being selective, etc, but there'll always be the serial uploader. Sorry to say this, but a lot of what those people upload seems pretty much irrelevent to me - same-old, same-old, no imagination. To me, quality is the most important factor - does a picture contribute something new or different to the database. Those people who manage to achieve that are evident from the stats - visitors to the site are attracted to interesting and/or "different" pictures, high average hit rates indicate that a photographer is contributing interesting and different stuff, and serial uploaders don't get high hit rates.

Andy
There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots
 
EGGD
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:10 am

Could you elaborate, Andy? You said that alot of what people upload is irrelevent, but quality is the most important factor... So if these serial uploaders are consistent, and the quality of the photos is good enough, whats the problem?

I try to get different things, or something new, but with that the quality decreases, and the rejections increase.. It forces me sometimes to not try something different and just get the boring side on shots of ordinary aircraft at my local airport, which I don't really want.
 
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JeffM
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:21 am

"Seems like some of us, uploading every single shot they have taken.......soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo boring!

Fire away...................................................

Vasco G. "



Outstanding. How true is that! Put a limit of some type on. Please.

v/r
Jeff
 
Jan Mogren
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:24 am

OK, this may sound like complaints but..
The safest shot to upload if you don't want to get a rejection is no doubt a standard sideshot. The only creativity this invites is the reason for rejection itself..
You could safely shoot and upload 250 sideshots of untitled Cessnas if you just get them sharp and well lit, which isn't too difficult IMHO.
/JM
AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
 
Granite
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:25 am

Hi all

And here is me suggesting a limit of 10.........I must have over 10 in the queue waiting to be screened for about a week  Big grin

Hey screeners......get moving!!

Cheers

Gary
 
Jan Mogren
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:37 am

Tamsin,
>Simply list the highest AVERAGE views per photographer<

I like !  Big thumbs up

/JM
AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
 
cicadajet
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:40 am

I agree with Andy in the main - but would just point out the hit averages come with some variables.

Crashes, cockpits, concordes, and out-the-window wing shots do not always add quality to the database..(sometimes they do, sometimes they don't) but they're guaranteed big hits anyway.

-Tom
 
Skymonster
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:47 am

EGGD said: Could you elaborate, Andy? You said that alot of what people upload is irrelevent, but quality is the most important factor... So if these serial uploaders are consistent, and the quality of the photos is good enough, whats the problem?

There's no problem... Read what I said again - I didn't say that "alot of what people upload is irrelevent"... I was talking about people who upload countless pics from the same day, and I said that a lot of those sorts of pictures are irrelevent to me. That doesn't mean that under current rules they don't have a right to be in the database, it doesn't mean that I screen them any less fairly - I can seperate my own opinions from the rules I'm required to apply as a screener. It just means I'm not interested in them and wouldn't ever look at them except that sometimes I have to screen them. I also accept that some of my pictures may be irrelevent to others, but we weren't talking about my pictures - we were talking about serial uploaders.

Andy
There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots
 
Eduard
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:55 am

I have the impression, that some of you forget, that A.N. is also a large database for aviation enthusiasts and –professionals. Each individual aircraft is welcome and if it is only one of a large fleet of the same type.
A very good side shot I like as much as an artistic picture. Both kind of photos have their place here.

Limiting the upload-possibilities would have a negative impact for those who are scanning and uploading older photos (like Frank Duarte, Johan Ljungdahl, me ...). Take that please in account…

Regards, Eduard
new user is EchoMike
 
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JeffM
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 1:56 am

It would not limit them in the least. They might just be more selective.
 
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Bruce
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:00 am

I agree with Vasco in principle.

Maybe not 10 per day, maybe 20? Also to agree with the others, on the search page the "top uploaders" list should be removed because it encourages serial uploaders. I wouldn't mind seeing one list for "most viewed"

As far as uploading the same shot angle, well, from my experience: I shoot the plane coming at me, passing by me, going away from me. But i only have a 300mm lens on the D30, and from my vantage point in many cases the best picture will be the largest one which is the one in which the plane is closest to me i.e., the side shot. I do try to find a different angle that is good but i can't help it. It really depends on your shooting location & particular airport & your equipment as to how many different angles you can shoot successfully.

Vasco is right though, the age of the D-SLR has opened the floodgates for acceptable images so perhaps a limit is not so bad.

bruce
Bruce Leibowitz - Jackson, MS (KJAN) - Canon 50D/100-400L IS lens
 
TZ
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:19 am

I know it would be hard to get the concrete proof, but do the screeners have any feeling as to the effect of the introduction of lists for "Top Uploaders" and "Most Popular"?

My instinctive (although uninformed) opinion is that these lists are fuelling the passion for mass-uploading. Perhaps a change like the one I suggested above could help? Maybe it could achieve something without the need to implement a strict upload limit. Or perhaps not?

If the "Top Average Views" list replaced the two lists we've got now, perhaps we could think about another idea for a new list? Maybe ten randomly selected photographer names (from the recent upload period).

Tamsin
TZ Aviation - Aeropuerto de los Banditos Team Images
 
Granite
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:25 am

Bruce

Invest in a Sigma 170-500.........I promise you that you will not look back and your local airport will start to look a whole lot different:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Gary Watt



View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Gary Watt


Cheers

Gary
 
ake0404ar
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:43 am

Gerado wrote:

"Nowadays the search page even lists the top uploaders in terms of uploaded pictures, encouraging photographers to upload every single picture to get on top of that list"

Seems like a lot of people who are on top of that list get a kick out of it.
....heck ya.....I am famous!
---------------------------------

Fireguy724 wrote:
"was getting a ton of rejections and felt I had a better chance of getting some accepted if I uploaded more"

Does that really make sense?????????

------------------------------------

Tamsin wrote:

"Perhaps the two lists could be replaced with a single list. Simply list the highest AVERAGE views per photographer over the past 24 hours, 7 days, etc. That way it encourages photographers to make every one of their photos a good one to keep the average up"

That is exactly what I am talking about.......


Speaking for myself I rather have 2 killer shots with 15000 hits in the databases whereas other have 300 shots with 15000 hits.

Any questions??????

I still like the upload limit.

Even for those slide dudes, does it matter if you don't upload them all at once.
You can scan 20 per weekend and then upload 5 or 10 of them right that weekend and then during the week you upload 2 more.

Vasco G.




 
Skymonster
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 2:51 am

do the screeners have any feeling as to the effect of the introduction of lists for "Top Uploaders" and "Most Popular"?

Nothing specific Tamsin. The number of uploads has gone through the roof this year - Kingwide recently produced some very interesting stats for us and there's been a massive increase in uploads since mid-2003 which hasn't abated this northern winter - we are now handling probably double the number of uploads that we did this time last year. But its difficult to attribute any trend towards mass uploading to the changes to the search page, unless Jason's stats are regarded as directly pointing to such. We screeners were of the opinion that the increase in availability of "reasonably priced" digitals (e.g. 10D, Digital Rebel) was more of an influence on the huge increase in uploads to a.net since the summer.

A few things that seem obvious to me though:

* A number photographers have started using new names (some several different names), possibly to get themselves on the "welcome to the following new photographers" list on the search page

* As far as "most popular" is concerned, the "most popular in the last 24/48 hours" link on the front page has a large influence on hits (suspect far more than the list on the search page), and since the "most popular of yesterday" photo has been displayed on the home page, that's had a huge impact on hits on each photo featured

* Access to digital cameras has had a direct influence on serial uploading. Film costs money, and takes time to process, scan and upload. Digital is often far easier to process, and it costs nothing to shoot 20 BA A319s. Cost concious film users have in some cases become trigger happy digital users. As more people switch to digital, it is more likely that they'll take more and more pictures of common subjects (and then upload them to a.net), because the incremental workload and financial costs of doing so is practically zero

* I think digital has encouraged photographers to go out and photograph more. With film, many people would look out of the window and think "bad day" and not bother because they knew the results would be marginal - possibly not worth the cost of the film used. With digital, it doesn't cost, so more people are inclined to go out more, and even if some digital images are a write-off some won't be - therefore we get more uploads

Andy
There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots
 
Jan Mogren
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:05 am

It seems every week there is a thread like "Congrats to NNN with 1000 pix in the db" so you can't blame a guy for thinking "He who has the most pix uploaded when he dies wins"  Nuts
/JM
AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
 
fireguy274
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:10 am

Fireguy724 wrote:
"was getting a ton of rejections and felt I had a better chance of getting some accepted if I uploaded more"

Does that really make sense?????????

Vasco I think this made sense to me at the time being a new to the sight and trying to get a feel for what is accepted and what is not. I will take all this advice into mind and try to get better photos. I feel a little insulted actually. I mean no one told me what kind of photos to take. I am learning as I go and asking some questions along the way. I found some of the screeners very helpful with advice. I don't think criticism is bad when it is constructive and I will take it all day. When people start insulting each others photographs that's a different story. I am sorry if I have uploaded some boring photographs and I appreciate it being pointed out. I will certainly try to be more creative in the future....I think your shots are outstanding Vasco and I only pray that some day I will get access to some of the places you took your photos from. Stay safe.....Artie
 
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Bruce
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:23 am

Gary,

I have compared shots with another fellow photographer, Paul Robbins, whom I have shot with on occasion and he used to have that lens before going to the 100-400L "IS". He let me borrow it for a few shots once, and I see that lens did allow me to get shots I would not have been able to get otherwise.
I would like to get a 100-400L but due to various reasons though I have to be happy with what I have for now.

bruce
Bruce Leibowitz - Jackson, MS (KJAN) - Canon 50D/100-400L IS lens
 
ake0404ar
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:29 am

Artie,

no offense and not any of my comments were going direclty into your direction. It was just a general statement.

Boring or not.....very subjective. What I find awesome, others may find boring and vice versa.

Still when I started a couple of years ago. I started to upload a batch of 10 photos...all rejected. That sucked.....

Then I uploaded one or two, still rejected.

What I have learned....upload 2 or 3 have them processed and then you can act again.

This method can save you a lot of time.

Just a thought.

Vasco

 
fireguy274
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:35 am

No problem here Vasco. I understand what you are saying and I agree about the boring photos. Some of mine are definately boring. I am going to be more selective in my uploads. My ratio is improving. I look at your photos and Marks and I would love to get some original Photos uploaded. It is just hard from Winthrop. I hope too see more of your photos and Marks on here in the future....Stay safe ....Artie
 
vafi88
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:40 am

I don't see why some top photogs upload EVERYTHING (even hundreds of shots) to see them Accepted, I mean comon! Even generic stuff (American md80s up the ass and United '37s up the ass) gets accepted! I upload maybe 6-10 shots AT MOST!!!

Some people upload here just for the hell of uploading EVERYTHING!!! This is not your photo album! take that stuff to MyAviation.net, we don't want to see 100 pictures of one single American Md 80!
I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
 
2912n
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 4:04 am

Vafi---some people upload those because they want to record each serial number/reg number at a particular airport. Just as you like to record the types of airplanes you have flown on in your profile.

This all ties back into a couple of previous threads...what does Anet want to be? Is it a showcase for aviation photography that encourages photographers to capture the beauty of flight? (As an example see Garfinkel's moon shots, Luis Rosa's sunset stuff...)
Or is it a place to document each and every airplane built in the world? (see many of the side shots)

Is it a place that provides modelers and other hobbyists different views of airplanes?
Is it a stock agency that helps advertisers etc in finding needed photos and providing a means for them to purchase photos?

Anet has become many things to many people....Some want photos of GA aircraft or business jets and never look at a 747. Others HATE military or GA....Remember that if you don't want to look at those photos, unless you are a screener, just ignore them.

Back to the original topic...Everyone, film or digital shooters, should self screen and limit themselves to 10 or so uploads at a time. (For the life of me I can't see looking at the upload screen long enough to upload 100 photos!!!)

Perhaps before new photographers should be limited to 5 or so uploads at a time. I know this asks much of the screeners, but if those newbies could get a more personal reject notice with more advice it would help them along and keep some of the whining down a bit. Experienced uploaders would still get the generic reject messages. Just a thought.
Tony
 
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JeffM
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:08 am

Vitaly, American MD-80's and United 737s are not generic to everyone, and it's not like someone's successful upload keeps any of your shots from being accepted. If your shot meets the current criteria, it gets in.

I really agree with the consensus that a limit should be imposed, whether it is daily, weekly, monthly, quarterly, or even yearly. Think of that. Knowing you can only upload xx amount of images for the year. I certainly would trash a lot of "plain jane" images, and save my quota for my favorites.

v/r
Jeff
 
timdegroot
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:12 am

A limit for a longer period would be a good idea I think.

Tim
Alderman Exit
 
ExitRow
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:13 am

Quality over quantity.

IMHO, the problem here is twofold

1.) What's the definition of "quality"? Everyone's is different, but A.net needs to decide what it's is.

2.) Judging from the stats-heavy slant to this whole site (i.e: hitfreaks, the "Top Uploaders" list and a monthly e-mail that looks more like a spreadsheet than an e-mail) it seems like quantity sometimes overrides quality of content.

And I think I know why. Commerce. Hits means page-views. Page-views mean advertising revenue and that is what keeps the site running, for better or for worse. It seems to be the reason the non-av forum still exists despite all it's problems and CREW energy expenditure.

What's the emphasis here? Interesting high quality imagery or simple page-views?

The only stat I care about is "Average views/photo." If that stays high, I know I am doing something right—taking photos people are interested in seeing.
 
Skymonster
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:26 am

The only stat I care about is "Average views/photo." If that stays high, I know I am doing something right—taking photos people are interested in seeing.

Well that's my thinking too, at least in part. But an underlying objective of another prolific airliners.net photographer who is a good friend of mine is to have his pictures of as many different registrations on the site as is possible - that doesn't mean he's not creative (far from it, he is), but he says that even if only [say] 50 people look at one of his pictures, its reward enough to know those 50 were interested enough to take a look.

Now I'll come back to why its only my thinking, IN PART. Its all too easy to upload pictures here that will get high hit counts. Cockpits, cabins, airport overviews, window views - they all get high counts, but they're cheap hits in my view. By concentrating on uploading those sorts of pictures, pretty much anyone could hold one of the highest averages on the site - some people have high counts for this very reason. It could be argued that if these pics get high counts, a lot of people are interested in them, therefore they justify their existance. But we all know they're not particularly creative, not in comparison to a photo outside of these categories that get high counts anyway.

Andy
There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots
 
Jan Mogren
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:51 am

>Its all too easy to upload pictures here that will get high hit counts.<

Yeah? I have to bust my ass to get them.

>Cockpits, cabins, airport overviews, window views - they all get high counts, but they're cheap hits in my view. <

How is that?

>By concentrating on uploading those sorts of pictures, pretty much anyone could hold one of the highest averages on the site - some people have high counts for this very reason.<

Uhu..

>It could be argued that if these pics get high counts, a lot of people are interested in them, therefore they justify their existance. But we all know they're not particularly creative, not in comparison to a photo outside of these categories that get high counts anyway.<

You lost me there!

/JM

AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
 
Granite
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:55 am

Hi all

Quality over quantity has ALWAYS been my comments on this site.

One thing to remember.........within a couple of years, the site will be saturated with common stuff incuding registrations.

There will come a time when you will see common stuff being rejected for that reason.

Cheers

Gary
 
SlamClick
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:57 am

Skymonster

I think I would agree with the "average views/photo" being a good stat to monitor and I've been watching mine since I got my second one accepted. But what would you say are good numbers here.

In 14 months I've uploaded roughly 40 pictures. I've had 24 accepted. Views range from a low of about 120 in two months for the least popular to about 1800 in one month for the most. Overall average about 380 per.

It seems like an okay stat to me especially since I've never scored one of the big eye-popping hundred thousand viewers kind of picture. What do you think? Anybody out there - thoughts on that? Or does it even matter.

Before I upload I search your DB for other pictures of the same airplane. Then I look at all those photos. If I don't think my picture contributes something to the database I don't bother to upload it. In some cases I just felt that my sky was more dramatic, or subject better lit, or ramp less cluttered or something like that.

All of this brings up a related question. Is it likely that aDOTn will ever start thinning out its database and dropping the lesser of two similar photos?

Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
Skymonster
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:57 am

Jan,

Please please don't think I was getting at you. We see some excellent flight deck shots, of which yours are probably the best of the best. We also see some less well executed flight deck shots which meet the standards of the site. Sorry to say it, but pretty much all flight deck shots get high hits, no matter what the quality of the execution is. Yours undoubtedly get more hits than most others, because (a) they stand out over and above the others and (b) regular visitors know of your quality and make a point of looking at it. Non the less, overall flight deck pictures get high hits, irrespective of the merits of the execution.

Andy
There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots
 
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Fly-K
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 6:23 am

Vasco, you and some others are bringing up some valid points, but since I know you a bit, I have to say your suggestion is a bit unfair, because I know you don't care that much about adding a new aircraft/airline to your collection, what matters to you is a quality image. That's great, but others (and I belong in both groups) get excited when they can add a new airline, or even just a new reg to their collection, and are eager to upload it. That's why, for example, you currently see me uploading a lot from my US trip, because a lot I shot there was new to me, and I see it as a way of broadening my portfolio. If someone is looking for a LH shot, I'll have it, if someone needs a Southwest, maybe I'll have it too.
1,000 photogs, 1,000 different approaches to airliners.net...

Konstantin
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
 
vafi88
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 6:24 am

Jeff - I meant AA Md 80s in Dallas, or UA 737s in Denver, they're too common, and this SHOULD NOT BE A SITE TO RECORD EVERY SINGLE REG!!!

This site is for the best of the best, if it wasn't, then the standards wouldn't be as high (Example: so what if this is the only reg in the database and it's grainy as hell??) over (This photo is really high quality or very interesting).

Like I said, if you want to fleet the airlines, upload somewhere else...


QUALITY OVER QUANTITY - I'm all for that!


Think about this if the above rule was implied: Less pictures in queue, only the best get in, every picture is interesting, more chance of pictures wanted by companies for their use!

I'm not saying that only beautiful shots like Mark's get in, I'm saying that Quality should be the top issue with photographers (other than shooting for your own pleasure (not like that you sicko) rather than for A.net)

Vitaly Kroychik
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I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
 
Skymonster
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 6:41 am

this SHOULD NOT BE A SITE TO RECORD EVERY SINGLE REG!!

Noooo! One of the objectives of this site, as defined by the boss, IS to have a picture of every registration, or at least to have a picture of as many as possible. That's why we relax the standards to a lesser or greater degree if we get a reg we haven't had before - less relaxation for brand new airplanes because there's a good chance we'll get another picture sooner or later, more relaxation for old regs that we don't have if we think its unlikely we'll get another pic of same.

Quality speaks for itself - check the hit counts. Some of it is novelty or type of picture, but mostly quality or uniqueness shines through. Just don't believe its the only criteria please.

Andy
There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots
 
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JeffM
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 6:46 am

Sorry, Vitaly, I disagree.

If you owned the site, then you could say this should not be a site to document every single registration. But, that is not the case. So even if you got 10 votes to my 2, neither would have any weight compared to Johan's single vote.

As noted above, the goal of some photographers is to have a photo of each registration. And why are you telling these guys to go upload somewhere else? Isn't that a little presumputous to assume your opinion will be the one Johan adopts?

Jeff
 
vafi88
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 6:57 am

Think of the most popular shot! (sorry to say) that the quality is not as high as it is now, yet it's at a location that is very popular with the aviation photographers, spotters and enthusiasts, in fact, the top photographs (by views) half of that page is of the quality that would not be accepted here anymore. I am not blaming photographers for their quality, I'm just saying that Quality does not always outshines the less...
I'd like to elect a president that has a Higher IQ than a retarted ant.
 
2912n
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RE: Digital Era.....changed The Whole Game

Mon Jan 05, 2004 12:12 pm

Vitaly...You wanna try that one again? Either I can't read well or you did not phrase your argument well...

Are you comparing older images in the database to what is acceptable now? That one has been dealt with...the older images, even tho the quality is poor compared to today are in and will stay in.

Photos that were taken years ago don't have to be to the quality of todays photos either. Terrible won't make it, but decent quality will.


Using myself as an example...I shoot airliners, general av., business jets, military and just about anything that flies. Most of the shooting locations at SAN are good, but don't lend themselves to "creative" shots. So most of my shots from there are generic side on landing shots. Sometimes I get access to areas that give better views and I try to be creative. I also shoot down at Brown Field which is a general avn spot. I can work on technique here and get unique airplanes that probably are not in the database. Many of the photos won't generate big hits. But I enjoy shooting them and, as a benefit, most of the photo sales I have made have been of either GA or business airplanes.

I sense a bit of frustration from you...sort of the "why did that photo make it in when mine did not." (Apologies if I misread you...) My advice is to set that aside and enjoy shooting whatever it is you shoot. Work on and develop your own technique and ENJOY yourself. Getting frustrated just takes the fun out of the hobby.

Cheers, Tony

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