wannabe
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Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:03 pm

At the risk of starting an Airbus vs. Boeing food fight, I thought I would fire up this topic. I've been waiting to make the investment in a DSLR, and have been real close to going with the 300D. But having looked this weekend at the Nikon D70, I am now re-thinking my plans. The D70 seems like a better camera, at least from it's feel. But since you are all the experts, let's hear what you'all have to say. (Not that anyone here is ever at a loss for words  Smile)

I have no investment yet in either brand, and about $2500 to spend. What would you do? No emotions please, just the facts.
 
JeffM
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:17 pm

The d70 is a full featured camera. The 300d is not. But Canon has better IS lenses. I own both a D100 and a 10d. I prefer the 10d using Canon's L IS lenses.

Have fun.

Jef
 
futterman
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:30 pm

Like Jeff said, the D70 right off the bat has a healthy combination of features and technology. I haven't read enough about the camera to make a proper comparison, but the D70 is much closer to the 'pro' (as opposed to 'budget') DSLRs than it's Canon counterpart.

Not to say the 300D isn't an amazing hunk of metal...err...plastic. Go ask Justin 'Terminal Hobo' Cederholm.  Big grin

As far as lenses are concerned, and I have to agree once more with Jeff, Canon gets my vote. If you go for the 300D, and stick up for some serious L glass, you'll be banging out great stuff. ie: Chad Thomas (300D/100-400, 70-200). I'll let him plug his own work...it's getting late.


-Brian
What the FUTT?
 
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mx330
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 12:51 pm

Well, In my opinion it is a divided decision.
I'll expose my points just as I have experienced them.

I don't want that this sounds as competition but I'll compare some of the shots I've taken standing next to an outstanding photographer whom is Ricardo Morales.

I think Canon images have better colors. Nikon is kind of more "cold colored"
I would pick Canon if what you like are colors.
Here are some examples of shots taken the same day at the same place. ( I shoot Canon, Ricardo does Nikon)

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Photo © Juan Carlos Guerra Aviation Photography of Mexico
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Photo © Ricardo Morales Aviation Photography of Mexico



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Photo © Juan Carlos Guerra Aviation Photography of Mexico
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Photo © Ricardo Morales Aviation Photography of Mexico



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Photo © Juan Carlos Guerra Aviation Photography of Mexico
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Photo © Ricardo Morales Aviation Photography of Mexico



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Photo © Juan Carlos Guerra Aviation Photography of Mexico
View Large View Medium
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Photo © Ricardo Morales Aviation Photography of Mexico



Nikon is faster though. Ricardo can shoot more images and are stored quicker on his camera than on mine. First I thought it was a matter of the CF card but is not. We even changed cards and his camera was faster and could shoot more images.

Most of Ricardo's shots are more sharpthan mine. I do have an old lens and it has a lot to do. I'll get a new one soon so then we'll see...

That is what I can say so far. Hope I was helpful... Anyways they are both great cameras worth every penny you pay for them.

Conclusion... Canon for colors. Nikon for quantity and speed.

Juan APM
All Canon! EOS 5D mk III, 8mm, 17-40, 24-105, 70-200 f2.8, 100-400L
 
andrewuber
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 2:03 pm

Canon. Period. You won't miss the features on the D70 unless you plan to take up extreme professional photography. Even then, most pro's will tell you (as they did above!) that Canon is still better.

I was going for a 10D, but could only afford the 300D with an IS lens. I chose the 300D, and was planning to auction it within a month or two so I could upgrade. I've now had it for 3 months, and my mad money is going for more glass - NOT the 10D. The 300D is absolutely perfect for me.

Not to feed the "Nikon vs Canon" fire here, but in my opinion there's just no comparison. Check these images out - they are straight out of my 300D - the only postprocessing done to them is a crop and resize.

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Photo © Freight-Dawg
View Large View Medium
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Photo © Freight-Dawg


Good luck with your decision!  Big thumbs up
I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
 
glennstewart
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 4:28 pm

>they are straight out of my 300D - the only postprocessing done to them is a crop and resize.

Ouch!
Being a 10D user and a screener, I would recommend against others with the 300D uploading without an edit.
Unlike most of the lower end digitals (which are really designed for DPOF), Canon design their higher end DSLR's for the professional market and as such

10D images are
1. softer out of camera than low end
2. Less saturation than low end

300D images are an extra +1 sharpened, but Photoshop does a MUCH better job. Canon DSLR images respond extremely well to USM  Smile


Glenn

Respected users.... If my replies are useful, then by all means...
 
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scbriml
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 7:17 pm

The D70 is looking like a more than credible competitor to the 300D. Combine it with the AF-S VR 70-200 f/2.8G IF-ED lens, and it's a great combo. I want one, and I want it now! Big grin
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
 
ckw
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 7:29 pm

The thing is that which ever model you buy, it will be superceded by the competition in no more than a year. Whichever model you buy, the likelihood is you will want to upgrade it within 2 to 3 years.

Hence I suggest you look at the system and ignore the camera - either one is capable of producing excellent quality, and any variations between output can largely be replicated in Photoshop anyway.

I would think about which lenses you want now and in the future and go with the company(s) that is most likely to meet your needs/match your wallet.

Cheers,

Colin
Colin K. Work, Pixstel
 
Staffan
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 7:30 pm

A digital body doesn't last very long and you'll probably replace it within a few years, but you'll be stuck with the lenses. It's more about chosing a system rather than just a digital body unless you are filthy rich and can afford to buy new lenses every time you change the body.
My suggestion is to go to a photo store for a few hours and try a few nikons and a conons.
If you think the nikon feels better, then by all means buy that. But once you decide for a brand, it can be very expensive to change your mind.
Neither Canon or Nikon are bad, just look at the "wars" we see here from time to time, both sides feel pretty strong for the respective system, so it's basically just a matter of personal taste.

Good luck with your purchase!

Staffan
 
andrewuber
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Tue Apr 27, 2004 8:09 pm

Glenn-

You said "I would recommend against others with the 300D uploading without an edit". You're right, most photos DO need post processing. I uploaded those shots straight out of the camera to prove a point - the 300D is absolutely capable of doing so. It even made it past the screening process at airliners.net which I'm sure you'll agree is one of the strictest out there!

I do quite a bit of post processing on most of my images. Some more than others, of course, but you're right - most do need it. But I'm still amazed at the quality of the JPG data that comes out of the Rebel.

My acceptance to rejection ratio has gone dramatically up since I bought the Rebel... I really REALLY wish we could track that statistic!!!

I'd rather shoot BAD_MOTIVE
 
mikephotos
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:21 am

Canon. Period. You won't miss the features on the D70 unless you plan to take up extreme professional photography. Even then, most pro's will tell you (as they did above!) that Canon is still better.

That was the funniest thing I have ever read. So, basically, the D70 is "better" but only if you're an extreme professional. But then, even if you're an extreme professional, you'll say Canon is better. Boy or boy, you Canon guys are funny as $hit  Smile Bwhahahahaha

It even made it past the screening process at airliners.net which I'm sure you'll agree is one of the strictest out there!

"Making it past the screening process at airliners.net" is more skill of the photographer then the camera. You put a 2MP sub-compact digital camera in the hands of a pro like Joe P, Tim D & Andy M vs. a 300D or D70 in the hands of a total newbie and I'll bet you'll see more accepted photos from the 2MP guys. Yes, a 300D (or D70) certainly makes lifer easier but I wouldn't review a camera (a make a buying choice) based on how it performs on the airliners.net screening circuit.


Mike
 
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mx330
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:24 am

AndrewUber,
My acceptance to rejection ratio has gone dramatically up since I bought the Rebel... I really REALLY wish we could track that statistic!!!

Mine too!! I hope we could see that also...

Juan APM
All Canon! EOS 5D mk III, 8mm, 17-40, 24-105, 70-200 f2.8, 100-400L
 
Staffan
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:31 am

Getting a photo past the screeners on a.net can hardly be considered as a benchmark for how good a camera is.. just as getting many views on a photo isn't a benchmark on how good of a photographer you are.

Staffan
 
maiznblu_757
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 3:23 am

I am extremely happy with my choice.


View Large View Medium
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Photo © Chad Thomas




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Photo © Chad Thomas




View Large View Medium
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Photo © Chad Thomas




 
manzoori
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 4:09 am

Juan,

Just looking at yours and Ricardo's shots... from the thumbnails the images from the Nikon do indeed appear to have more of a 'golden' look to them, but isn't that down to the post processing choices?

Cheers!

Rez
 Big thumbs up
Flightlineimages DOT Com Photographer & Web Editor. RR Turbines Specialist
 
maiznblu_757
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 4:23 am

What the FUTT. LOL. I missed the shout out.  Sad  Big grin
 
MIA777
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:06 am

I think Colin hit the nail on the head (as always)...think about what you want in years to come and then think about the lenses you are going to have when you decide to upgrade. I really like Canon's large selection of IS lenses and pretty much all of the L glass allows for incredible images (in terms of sharpness) and are very fast. If this is your first DSLR, you may not even need the extra features that the D70 has (well maybe speed if you are doing sports, etc.). However, look at guys like Jeff Miller who posted above that he is very happy with his switch from Nikon especially because of the great lenses Canon has to offer. The choice is yours...
MIA777
 
ghost77
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:10 am

Wannabe,

Check this link...:

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/aviation_photography/read.main/126768/6/

As you can see A.net pics and the origianal files, colors are very similar to each other. I did a very little manituplation with the ones I uploaded.

Get yourself a real camera! Go buy the D70! (also, gotta tell you that I make this decision due to the fact that I already have lenses for the Nikon).

Finally a plug! One of my recent favourite pictures taken with the D70!!:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ricardo Morales Aviation Photography of Mexico



Ricardo APM  Smile

Ricardo Morales - flyAPM - ¡No es que maneje rapido, solo estoy volando lento!
 
Guest

RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:45 am

Hahahaha you digital guys make me laugh.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

I guess atleast me and McLaughlin don't have to waste our money every 2 years buying a new camera like you digital guys do because our camera's don't get superceded by the competition.  Laugh out loud

Stephen
 
maiznblu_757
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 8:19 am

because our camera's don't get superceded by the competition.

LOL. You mean, your cameras do not get superceded over and over again, they have already been superceded once.  Big grin

[Edited 2004-04-28 01:47:19]
 
COPA737
Posts: 327
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 9:51 am

I prefer the Canon 300D, which is the one that I have.

I talked with Juan Carlos and Ricardo from Mexico about the cameras, and the D70 have some advantages over the 300D, as a faster shutter and more features etc. But I prefer Canon colors and image quality.

I made my decision for the Canon 300D because all my lens were Canon. And the camera was selling in Panama for a good price.

Regards,

Felipe

Panamá Crece y Copa Airlines crece con Panamá!
 
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mx330
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 1:12 pm

Manzoori,

Probably. Take a look at this two
I downloaded Ricardos from the page and worked out as if it was mine and looked out pretty much the same.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ricardo Morales Aviation Photography of Mexico
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Juan Carlos Guerra Aviation Photography of Mexico


I also picked Canon because of my lenses.

Juan APM
All Canon! EOS 5D mk III, 8mm, 17-40, 24-105, 70-200 f2.8, 100-400L
 
manzoori
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 2:26 pm

Thanks for the update Juan!

Cheers!

Rez
 Big thumbs up
Flightlineimages DOT Com Photographer & Web Editor. RR Turbines Specialist
 
Kay
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 7:20 pm

I don't have a digital camera and it would be my first SLR too. From what I've seen, Canon colors have always been better, since the days of the G3. However, I also do believe that the "yellowish" tone seen on Mr. Ricardo Morales' pictures is not something seen on other D70 pictures. The color difference isn't so accentuated and can definitely be replicated on Photoshop. Joint with the fact that the D70 feels more pro in one's hand, it is not a bad deal.

There's a very large number of 300D users on here who learnt a long time ago how to make the most of their cameras. There are less D70 users, thus less awesome pictures to see.

Canon colors are irreplaceable. But the fast clicking and feel of the D70 might take the edge for someone like me, for whom both cameras will produce more than acceptable pictures. And I might shoot sports too.


kay
 
andyhunt
Crew
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Wed Apr 28, 2004 10:26 pm

Honestly, I think whether you choose the 300D or the D70, you'll be happy as a pig in sh1t Big grin All down to what lenses you have, or want.

Andrew
Full frame always beats post processing
 
wannabe
Posts: 652
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Thu Apr 29, 2004 2:16 am

Well, I thank you all for your responses. On top of all the pro-Canon responses, I spoke to an old acquaintance who now shoots tennis tournaments. He also shoots Canon, and told me that, if I want to upgrade a body in the future, he has both 10D and 1D bodies he would consider selling. So.....based upon this, I went with Canon at Adorama in NYC. Bought the 300D with the kit lens, along with a 512 card, the 70-200 4.0 and some other toys. Look for my glorious posts to start flowing soon.

Again, thank you all for the responses. This is a great forum.


 
JeffM
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Thu Apr 29, 2004 2:27 am

When you get done at Stewart, cross the river and get some shots at Dutchess County Aiport will 'ya? I used to live about 4-5 miles from there, and there are no shots in the DB.

Enjoy your purchase.
 
MIA777
Posts: 1110
Joined: Thu Sep 05, 2002 10:47 am

RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Thu Apr 29, 2004 8:27 am

Jeff--

You used to live in Dutchess county? Is that where Green Haven and Pawling (also Poquag) are?

Anyways, to make my post somewhat relevant...good buy! I am sure you will be satisfied!
MIA777
 
JeffM
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Thu Apr 29, 2004 9:36 am

Poughkeepsie. I used to live there.

Jeff
 
wannabe
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Thu Apr 29, 2004 11:10 am

JeffM,
Does this mean you're a beamer or ex-beamer?
 
wannabe
Posts: 652
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Fri May 07, 2004 10:10 am

I'm a true member now. Got my DSLR, L Glass and my first two rejections.  Smile

Here they are if you want to see them. Comments to make me a better shot are surely welcome.

http://myaviation.net/?uid=4091

I tried the to link the pictures to here, but could not get it to work.

[Edited 2004-05-07 03:26:48]
 
maiznblu_757
Posts: 4952
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2002 12:05 pm

RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Fri May 07, 2004 11:36 am

Great shots. It looks like your post processing is what killed you. Those photos might be able to be saved.

I also noticed your crop was off. I usually go for 1024 x 683 or 718.



 
wannabe
Posts: 652
Joined: Wed Jun 30, 1999 3:37 am

RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Fri May 07, 2004 1:11 pm

Probably. They were shot in late afternoon, around 1/2 hour before sunset. I tried to reduce the shadows, but it's my first time playing with photoshop. I'll learn, it just takes longer to teach an old dog new tricks.
 
jwenting
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Fri May 07, 2004 2:08 pm

In any and all comparisons between the two the D70 blows the 300D completely away.
Better mechanical and optical quality, higher performance, better feature set, etc. etc.

My dealer (whose tried them both, he considers he has to to make a good advise to potential customers) says that that's accurate, the D70 is far better value for money as well as a far better camera.

As to Canon having more IS lenses, SO WHAT? There's no need for image stabilisation in many of the IS lenses Canon offers, it's just a marketing gimmick.
For Nikon there's a 24-120, 70-200, 200-400 and 80-400 which together cover just about everything. Of course you can expect to pay real money for those (especially the 200-400 which comes in at around €4000) but that's the price for quality.
I wish I were flying
 
JeffM
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Fri May 07, 2004 2:52 pm

"As to Canon having more IS lenses, SO WHAT? There's no need for image stabilisation in many of the IS lenses Canon offers, it's just a marketing gimmick."

LOL... the same "gimmick" Nikon is pushing?

I dunno, if you try the 600mm L IS



and think you can hand hold that as well as the IS does your nuts.  Big grin

Magic, is what it is.
 
Staffan
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Fri May 07, 2004 3:00 pm

"In any and all comparisons between the two the D70 blows the 300D completely away.
Better mechanical and optical quality, higher performance, better feature set, etc. etc."


Not really surprising to hear that from you considering you where praising the D70 even before it hit the market (before any tests where available too, go figure..). You really seem to have a beef against Canon, but that's your loss...  Big grin

Staffan
 
B777
Posts: 378
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RE: Canon 300D Or Nikon D70

Mon May 10, 2004 4:14 am

Wannabe, congrats on your new camera! I have gone Canon recently too...just aquired a used D30. My main reason for choosing the Canon over Nikon was my limited budget and having to compromise between camera features and the lenses I expected to buy. I think the D30 and D60 are still good buys if you can find one in excellent condition. They cost less than the 300D and D70 but are loaded with features and allow you to spend your $$$ on lenses.

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