cathay112
Posts: 257
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An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:26 pm

Dear Site Admin, Staff, Photographers and forum browsers,

Is this site so reliant on receiving photos from Sam Chui that they offer immediate screening for him?

6 photos added and uploaded today, 1 photo still in screening which is ironically the only one from todays batch being screened.

It doesn't look good for the site seeing Screeners and individuals get preferential treatment like this without just cause (newsworthy event etc etc). Why is it that near everyone else happily sits in the queue but others consistently get their shots through the queue (some with severely questionable quality) with much ease.

Frankly I'm considering finishing up here at airliners.net once I reach 6,000 photos unless things change. Given the rules, conditions and courtesy extended to some don't actually apply to all I think the site administration really needs to examine who is actually doing what here.

Don't go taking this the wrong way either, Sam's photos are mostly quite interesting and are a pleasure to view. However, being a Screener and a regular traveller surely doesn't earn him the right to have his work displayed before others who quite happily wait in the queue get there work looked at. This is not an attack on Sam or his work, it is questioning the daily functions of this website.

I expect the usual array of people to attempt to flush this post away with their usual nonsense, but as an individual who happily waits for his uploads to get screened in sequence I find this sort of activity personally offensive.

Hopefully, things will change - I hope that some people who have become FAR too comfortable with their positions here are questioned accordingly.

Yours sincerely,
Craig Murray - happy and patient queue sitter.
 
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mighluss
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 12:52 pm

Don't worry... be happy!  Smile

Regards,

... sorry, don't remember who.

BTW: loved those 2...


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Craig Murray
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Craig Murray



[Edited 2004-10-12 06:05:48]
Miquel.
 
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clickhappy
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 1:03 pm

How do you know they were uploaded today? Do you keep track of Sam and his uploads?

It seems like you have serious beef with Sam, and you like to take it out in the forums. You also have beef with the screeners. Why? Bury the hatchet man, its a hobby.

Threatning a dummy spit is silly. You're a grown man, start acting like it.
 
N178UA
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 1:13 pm

Craig

Yes those photo were added priority, I didn't email or ask for it. I have no problem admitting any faults, since I am closely watched.

Most of the time, my photo sit in the Q like many others, I have no complaint and they get screened and rejected just like everyone else. You checked my email and Queue everyday......I have nothing to hide from watchman like you.

For a while i haven't upload, I got a few added instantly, what's the fuss? Bottom line is they will get added eventually as long as the quality justifies. And if someone else is getting priortity treatment, would you complaint that too??? I may have to keep an close eye on you too, if yours one day somewhat get priority screened too, do I have to downgrade myself to post an open letter too....

for the record, this is NOT first or second of likewise post question A.net from you. More constructive post instead of always picking on me would set you far better.

Sam

[Edited 2004-10-12 06:16:24]
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
SoBe
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 1:14 pm

Craig,

Have you addressed this with the staff privately? If not, I would suggest that to always be the first course of action if you have a concern.

Royal,

As a member of the CREW I would hope that a bit more professionalism would be shown when responding to someone. "You're a grown man, start acting like it." is not an appropriate response. Always better to take the high road and treat with respect even if you don't feel it. You are CREW and should act as such.

I've just joined and perhaps this is the norm but I find it improper.

Kind regards,
Michael
 
Guest

RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 1:26 pm

I am curious tho Sam, what was your motivation to become a screener? You already travel to the most exotic locations, have access no one else can get, and some of the top pictures on this site. What more can you ask for?

Brian - SPOT THIS!
 
SoBe
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 1:26 pm

By the way,

Sam, I have lurked around A.net for years just looking at photos. I went to your website and recognize many of them. You do great work and give those of us starting out something to shoot for. Thanks for your efforts.

Salud,
Michael
 
N178UA
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 1:30 pm

Brian

it is just the site I like so much, and I honestly believe I can donate a lot of time to screen photos when i am at home. Since I became a screener I have learnt an aweful lot of A/C and fighters/GA recognizing and editing skills. It all works out for me  Smile

Sam

For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
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Fly-K
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:13 pm

Sam: "a lot of time to screen when home"
Haha, good one, but when ARE you home?
 Big grin
I'd rather see you travelling and sharing photos with us.

Konstantin
Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been...
 
cathay112
Posts: 257
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:34 pm

Royal, the beef isn't at Sam mate. It's with the way uploads seem to happen around here with priority for some with proveable consistency. It's disgraceful and put simply, unfair to everyone else. As for your comments, I think something a little more constructive and a little more factually based would be a little more appropriate next time. I tried to raise my point in the most open way possible, your response certainly wasn't done in the same way.

You ask how I know they were added today, let's just say because I do! Myself, and many others keep a regular track of things like this simply because we know it happens. Queue stats/photos can be viewed by anyone, I know people sneak peek at mine to see what I'm uploading before it appears and I enjoy that very much.

The sooner the whole process is made fair and those who are really ruining it for everyone else are weeded out the better. It's been proven before, and it's been proven again that the upload queue is regularly perused (even without the photographers consent) to upload an individuals work before anyone elses. And as I've said before I'd be quite happy to see them pay by being removed from the screening crew.

As for commenting that I have a problem with screeners is nonsense, I admire most of the screeners work just as I do many others that upload here. It's the way in which the screening is done on occasions that bothers me.

Sam, my problem does not lie with you mate, it just seems that your work more often than not is uploaded consistently with priority over everyone else. You know it, I know it and I dare say many other people know it. What I want to know is why this happens? Not from you, all you did was upload....... which we all do. But somehow, somewhere..... someone is deciding that some photographers are worthy of more prompt screening than others.

Again, for the record, my point here is the queue - it's exactly that! Consistently it's being jumped and I would like to see this addressed by admin as a matter of priority. The very odd favour is one thing, but when it tends to happen regularly there's obviously a problem that needs addressing. I know some will viciously deny it happens......... but I suspect there are many who know the truth and are frankly quite sick of it.

And to answer another question, yes my original text had been e-mailed to the site admin.

For anyone that wishes to keep check on my queue statistics - I urge you to do it, because you won't ever see me jump it (excluding front page banner worthy items as is the case with everyone else). I'm proud of my reputation, fiercly proud. But I believe in equality and fairness for all........ something this site promotes but doesn't really seem to preach.
 
N754PR
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 2:59 pm

I can't comment on Sam but what I can say is there are pics that get on this site by Screeners that would not be allowed on by a non screener....

I'm talking about not focused, bad colours and just boring shots that are being rejected form other guys.

To cut it short the site needs RULES FOLLOWED BY ALL.

1) No screening of your own pics
2) The name of the photographer is not know unless its accepted.
Bush, your a sad, sad man.
 
EGBB
Posts: 527
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:39 pm

Excellent example of today's Anet 'photography' forum why so many of us don't post/contribute here anymore because of trouble makers like this who come here to S... stir rather than to offer any help or advice to others

Very sad some people’s lives must be to check on other photographers uploads is all I can say

Derek Pedley



 
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clickhappy
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 3:46 pm

1) No screening of your own pics
2) The name of the photographer is not know unless its accepted.


Impossible.

First, no screeners screen their own pictures. This is impossible, not allowed by the system. You can't even view your own pictures.

The name, and email, is essential. I'd say 10-15% of the queue is made up of people uploading (and reuploading) crap pictures, even after being banned. It would also take way the ability to see if the photog has similiar or the same shots already accepted.

I am quite sure some shots of so-so quality get thru, for both screeners and everyone else.

Is it really that bad? This site is huge, and growing everyday. Some pretty cool people are involved with it, and the photos and their quality are the best on the 'net.

 
Rotate
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:00 pm

ciao guys,

well, I dont want to comment on that "Sam" thing, cause I havent followed how fast and in what matter his pictures gets accepted as close as Craig did. But to be very honest I was very astonished as I saw that Sam was choosen as a screener as he is traveling 100% of his time and definetely doesnt have that much spare time screening. I know of some guys who wanted to become screeners -definetely expierenced enough and a lot of sparetime. But I find some things very strange recently. I only can speak for myself ...
-85% of my pictures get accepted (if they are not rejetced) exactly 1-3 hrs before 24:00. I really cant remember , when I was lucky to get them accepted some hrs after midnight or in the very early morning.
-while in the same time there are very often the same names , which come up with pictures accepted after 24:00.

I guess I am just unlucky - or? I think A.net should set a new system of accepting pics up. I know, it is nearly impossibel to have a timecounter for every single picture. Why not have 4 entrypoints during the day? 1st: 0:05 2nd:6:00 3rd:12:00 4th:18:00 ..... , this system would be much fairer for everybody .... or 6 entrypoints the day ....

This is just an example , how A.net could get rid of people moaning about strange accepting times ..... - there was another thread here some days ago.

Robin

ABC
 
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clickhappy
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:09 pm

Listen to yourselves...

But I find some things very strange recently. I only can speak for myself ...
-85% of my pictures get accepted (if they are not rejetced) exactly 1-3 hrs before 24:00

I guess I am just unlucky - or?


What are you saying? 85% of your pictures were added at a "bad" time so as to not get views? That doesn't make any sense. The more views the site gets the better the site does. Do you think Johan would allow such nonsense?
 
Rotate
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:33 pm

dear royal,

just to let u know: i actually dont care re views - believe me or not Smile/happy/getting dizzy to underline that , I guess I havent plugged a picture of mine for nearly 1 year or so, even if it would have added some value to the discussion ...

ahh, also to clarify , 85% not of all my pictures, but the recent time ....

anyway, it is the truth .... , I also checked to upload the 1st picture at different times, directly after 24:00 , at 6:00 in thze morning and so on, I allways end up with these strange times , when my pic gets accepted ...

dont get me wrong ... , I am not accusing .... as said I must be just unlucky .... - or?

so what do u think of that "entrypoints" idea?

Robin

[Edited 2004-10-12 09:35:19]
ABC
 
cathay112
Posts: 257
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:43 pm

If there is one more post about shots being accepted in this so called magic hour after midnight or whatever it is please delete this entire thread......... there is no way known to man I'll ever let my name be drawn into that argument...... in any way.

Derek, why is it then that it's common knowledge that people use two e-mail addresses to add their own work, why is it common knowledge that favours for fellow photographers are done....... why is it that I've heard this both beyond these forums, from screeners and in an abundance of e-mails last time I questioned the way the queue operates. You seem to have a problem with a post that is attempting to draw attention to an unfair system that's promoted as fair. Is that not a fair call for someone to make when they see a problem?

And again, let me make it perfectly clear this isn't a post about how long screening takes....... honestly, if someone is so desperate to get a shot on here within 1 day of uploading all the time they dead set really need to grab themselves a life.

I have an awful lot of respect for Johan, he has built us an awesome site. It's when people abuse a system that they're "hired" (term used VERY loosely) I find it both embarassing for the site and for Johan because it reflects on him.

As always, it's interesting to see that no-one from the "site" camp is willing to actively prove and discredit my claim. If someone was to explain the compelling reason these (and many others) photos are added in this manner.

Or is it that you are all to willing to tell people this doesn't happen, but when it does some people go mysteriously quiet?

I really question the integrity of some of you, I really really do. As for honesty, we couldn't possibly ask for that could we?
 
N178UA
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:00 pm

Robin

FYI, I have 18 days down time coming at home....and before my last week travel commence, I have consistently screened more photo than many other screeners. (in screeners stats which only available to screeners.) Your claim is NOT fair to me, although I travel lot of times, I also contribute lot of free time to this site. I have 3 ops base now in China, in LA and in Sydney, can screen from each base when i am there. I cannot help to explain how your photos added 3 hrs before midnight. It is not appropriate subject to complaint about. I got many times added before and also after midnight, it evens out..and I thought you never mind what good/bad timing they're added ....you don't care about hits right?

Sam
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
Unique
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:09 pm

85% of my pictures get accepted (if they are not rejetced) exactly 1-3 hrs before 24:00

Sorry, I don't get the point. Are you talking about local time or UTC? Midnight in Australia is morning in the U.S. and early afternoon in Europe. Both places have a lot of viewers. Midnight in Europe (UTC) is evening in the U.S. and early afternoon down under - again lots of views.

Does the time of acceptance really matter? As long as the pics are accepted...

Besides, the better the picture is, the more view it gets - just my two cents!
 
EGBB
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:17 pm

Sam,

I have been the target from Craig in the past as you might know - He is clever with his words for sure the way he slags off others but at the same time creeps up to Johan - my advice is to just ignore him as he is obviously just jealous and attention seeking- all very sad in my eyes

Derek Pedley
 
Rotate
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 5:25 pm

oh well ....

at Sam: I am sorry ..... , dont know u personally, dont know how much u ve screened recently.

at Unique: i am talking of 24:00 my time, which is also the "meter" of 24 - 48hrs for A.net. so it does defenetely make a difference, if a pic gets accepted at 23:00 or 1:00 , exactly 23 hrs "missing" time on "24 - 48" hrs ....

at All: I dont care about views, but about fairness, anyway I tried to bring up a solution - got understood wrong again.

u all can be sure that I wont bother you with my experiences and solutions again in the future.

Robin

Ps: and before anyone tells me now I am f.... up, NO I am NOT.
ABC
 
Unique
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 6:36 pm

Robin, fair enough, but somewhere is the drawn line. Why not suggest of going for the international date line? Lots of water "before and after" it, "only" the guys from Hawaii might complain...
 
pepef
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 7:12 pm

Clickhappy wrote:

The more views the site gets the better the site does. Do you think Johan would allow such nonsense?

I'd say yes.I have 19 pictures of Finnair Airbus cockpits on this site. Average views/picture is 11.633.
Any new inflight photo, even of a new registration I upload gets an instant rejection. Baddouble.

-pepef-




 
IL76
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:31 pm

This site is built and maintained by multiple people. It will never be possible to operate it completely homogenous (if that is proper English, but you know what I mean). Different people, different opinions, although of course Johan will try to make it as transparant as possible. But still, strange things happen, people scratch eachothers backs, it's plain obvious, but it happens all over the place. Not just this site. Some people know people who can do them favours... Airside access, cockpit access, upgrades... If you get an upgrade, wouldn't all the other economy passengers want the same if they found out? And that's just examples related to flying. It just happens. When a topic is brought up like this, I agree with Craig's point, however find it not worth to argue about. You can't fight it... (...until A.net becomes a commercial institution).
Cheer up Craig! No worries... Not worth it.  Big grin

Eduard
 
pepef
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 8:34 pm

Even though I always react strongly to the rejection of one my better shots, I usually calm down quickly.

On the whole, if the screeners just have a couple of people complaining out of 10.000 uploaders, they are doing a good job.

I see no problem even if the screeners were able to jump the queue all the time. That would be a small payback for the time they spend screening.

-pepef-
 
Danny
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:54 pm

"I only can speak for myself ...
-85% of my pictures get accepted (if they are not rejetced) exactly 1-3 hrs before 24:00. I really cant remember , when I was lucky to get them accepted some hrs after midnight or in the very early morning.
-while in the same time there are very often the same names , which come up with pictures accepted after 24:00."


You really watch too much of X-files.

"But to be very honest I was very astonished as I saw that Sam was choosen as a screener as he is traveling 100% of his time and definetely doesnt have that much spare "

Yet again you are very wrong. Hopefully I won't reveal any secret by saying that Sam screened almost 2 thousand photos just during last month.

Daniel
 
malandan
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:24 am

The way this thread deteriorated is yet another example of why I (and I suspect many others) are readers rather than contributers. Why DO some of you continue to resort to personal criticism and such puerile phrases as 'slag off, 'get a life', 'creeps up to Johan', etc.
I beleive that Craig went to great lengths to explain his reasons and not to point a finger and yet still fails to elicit a constructive response.
It is also unfortunate that nobody in-the-know has even attempted to an explanation or re-assurance. I for one am left wondering ...................!
As they say - 'just my two cents worth!'
My interest lies in the future as I am going to spend the rest of my life there!
 
res
Posts: 383
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:16 am

Some people should really stop complaining about the process. Especially if you aren't a first class member. This site is being provided to those individuals at only the charge of their personal time. Shame on you people for being so rude when you aren't financially supporting the service you are using.

Your photos are being arbitrarily screened/rejected just before midnight?
So why not make four different screening times, you ask? Well I'm no genious, but this will lead all of the primitive posts about the upload que being too large, where chances are, the screeners will be insulted yet, once again.

Give it a rest.

THANK you, screeners....for what you do, deal with, and continue to put up with.

Tim
FLY NAVY
 
mikephotos
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:33 am

Shame on you people for being so rude when you aren't financially supporting the service you are using.

Without the photographers, there wouldn't be any "service". Sure, the forums generate a lot of visits/hits but without the database of quality photos I don't think airliners.net would be where it is today. By uploading/adding photos, you are supporting the service.

Mike
 
runway23
Posts: 1916
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:38 am

Some how the problem here doesn't seem to be Sam Chui but Craig. Craig, can't understand why you try to attack Sam any time his photos make it in a few hours before they should have. So, he did have a preferential treatment, but aren't you happy when your photos are screened?

I think Sam is a fine individual and doesn't deserve your accusations. Airwhiners may be a better place to release your anger  Big grin

Once again a fine example of how this forum has come out to be a bitching field. There was a time when you could learn loads of stuff here, I fear those times are way gone.  Sad

Tim
 
res
Posts: 383
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:43 am

That IS supporting the service...but thats inconsistent to what I said in my post.
FLY NAVY
 
ake0404ar
Posts: 2379
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:36 am

Wholy cow.....I was about to miss one of those interesting discussions again.
Glad that i am tuning in again......Forum has been pretty boring the last couple of months.

I am all for it, let's fire away!!!!!

So, after reading all the facts, let me say this:

I am no troublemaker but some points just have to be brought up. It does not make sense to always shut up the ones who have a vaild point???? Does Craig have a valid point?
Are some photographers / crew members getting special treatment from their fellow crew members? I don't know.....

Right now, we are assuming. Assumption are not good enough. I want to see hard evidence.

Court of law, ever heard of it.

The suspect remains innocent until prooven guilty in a court of law. Wasn't it that way???????

So, let's call your first witness.....
Mr. Murray please provide your evidences

Vasco G.

p.s. I am curious how long it will stay open........
 
ChrisH
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:37 am


If someone gets faster screening I wouldnt be bothered with it much as long as photos are of anet quality. But when staff gets photos in that anyone else wouldn't even get into HQ-queue you know there's something wrong.

what seems to be the officer, problem?
 
Skymonster
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:12 am

Craig,

I'm not going to bash you for raising this topic (in many respects you're right to bring this up), but what's your solution? Complaining is one thing, but suggesting a solution would be FAR more constructive.

We have to have the facility to extract pictures from the queue out of sequence in order to get high-priority subjects onto database and the news banner quickly. The "search the queue" function has to include photographer to allow us to pick out pictures of [for example] a new paint job on a popular airline that only one photographer has caught without ending up having a process a deluge of non-priority pictures at the same time.

Just the fact that this facility exists (which is required by the owner of the site in order to attract visitors with hot new subjects) leaves the normal processing sequence for pictures open to potential abuse by us the screeners. The boss is absolutely dead-set against screeners helping out other screeners or helping their buddies, but none the less it happens from time to time - its impossible to deny. In the case of Sam (specifically) I can assure you no request for priority screening came to the crew in general, so I conclude that either (a) Sam made a private arrangement directly with another screener, or (b) one or more screeners decided, without provokation or request, to go looking through the queue for pictures from fellow screeners.


So, what's to do? Johan chews out all the screeners - it may cut it down for a while but it won't stop it. Fire the screener(s) concerned - it probably won't stop this happening all together. Or just live with the fact that where ANY process by necessity has to have some degree of human intervention from time to time, that process will inevitably be abused occasionally. I don't know of an answer that both meets the demands of the site but also prevents what occasional "assists". If you Craig can suggest a solution, then I'm sure your post would have much more credibility than just making an observation.

Andy
There are old pilots and there are bold pilots, but there are no old bold pilots
 
sulman
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:40 am

Andy's right.

The reality is, this is the way it works anywhere, in any line of business. These instances are still a relative minority though. If they weren't, Johan would have almost certainly have done something about it. The people running the place aren't stupid.


Cheers


James
It takes a big man to admit they are wrong, and I am not a big man.
 
fireguy274
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:54 am

Who gives a flying F#$% if sames pictures get screened first...If Sam wants to be a screener who is more qualified? This descussion is a waste of time ...Just my opinion.
 
andrewmorrell
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 9:47 am

Let me chime in as to Sam's value as a screener.

Whenever he screens any of my submissions, he *consistently* provides valuable feedback to me as a photographer, something I find to be greatly helpful.

Thank you Sam, thank you screeners, and thank you to all who contribute positive stuff to this website.

Andrew
Go Blue!!!
 
fireguy274
Posts: 291
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 10:06 am

I should probably edit my post next time.. it is discussion and Sam not sames and descussion...Anyway...Sam can screen my pics anytime and jump in front of me in line for screening...Its all good...Artie
 
US333
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 10:25 am

Can any of the crew actually respond to the question of why Sam has supposedly recieved preferential treatment in the screening process? I have read this whole post and it seems that no one has actually addressed the initial problem that Craig brought up. If this is actually true it doesn't seem fair to every other photographer on this site and some answers, not arguing, would be appreciated. Thanks!
 
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mx330
Posts: 793
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 10:35 am

At first I also thought Sam might not have the enough time to screen now I see he does and that makes me happy!

I really don't care if shots are screened before or not… What really pisses me off and I've seen it again and again is (although I know some of you will say they don’t) buddy screeners adding their pal shots at 1:00am.

And as Robin said... Don't ask me why but I always get poor time uploads... you know what I mean...

Juan APM
All Canon! EOS 5D mk III, 8mm, 17-40, 24-105, 70-200 f2.8, 100-400L
 
N178UA
Posts: 1688
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 10:45 am

US333
Let me assure you I do not ask for priority, and no favoritism is played during screening. My photos yesterday were added priority, which is a rare thing on here, I can assure you it dosen't happen 99% of the time. Since I found out I am so closely watched from A.net policeman here, there is absolutely NO reason to cheat and nor do I suggest I would like to do it that way. I think the priority yesterday was a one off and came from a friendly screener who likes my new uploads. I don't think it is worth complainting if for once I get a little favoritism, like passenger getting preferential upgrades because they have contribute long enough. Other Crew have already made the case clear here, by saying no favoritism is played and will not tolerate such practice. I have also set myself clear on here.

Craig: Thanks for getting this letter to the attentions, I have no problem oblige the rule like everyone else does here. It really have no impact on me since most are my uploads are treated just like anyone else in the Q. Plus the Q is shorter and shorter, no reason to jump at all! Are you really going to stop upload when you reach 6000???

Thanks for all others supporting, I will make things going absoultely the right way for everyone in the future. But I DOUBT the complaint on this fourm will get less.

Sam

[Edited 2004-10-13 04:08:17]
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
Dehowie
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 11:40 am

G'day
I'd have to say that as a reward for screening i cannot see a problem with express upload for screeners only for their photo's.
Screeners do work long and hard to keep the queue moving and a small reward like that is more than justified.
Just make a clear and simple statement that it is permitted and is a reward for long hours looking at a monitor.
What i dislike immensly is when screeners photo's which are far fom A.NET quality get speed screening and uploaded.
All the photographers in Sydney know which photo's we are talking about and it was blatant abuse of there positions to even upload some of those photo's.
These pics where not just poor quality some which might "sneak through" they where straight out bad.They have been commented on extensively on other forums and boards much to the embarrasment of A.NET.
As a team member you should be setting the standards in every respect and i personally expect more from people with positions at what claims to be one of aviations premier website's.
Craig is one of the great contributors to A.NET and for that alone should be entitled to voice an oinion without being personally attacked by people who had never even heard of A.NET when he was uploading here.
You may not agree with his opinion but there is no reason to resort to childish comments as we have all seen here and many from team members of the site.
And as yet none of the forthcoming crew members have answered for his question only inflammatory remarks in response.
I would have thought that a photographer who has 5997 photo's in the DB(the third highest at A.NET)would of at least deserved an answere rather than insults.
Really is it any wonder other websites are booming when people see this sort of thing happening.
As i said before by all means reward screeners for there hard work but make it open and make it clear so everyone knows where they stand.
Hard work deserves reward.

Darren
2EOS1DX,EF14.2.8LII,17TS,85/1.2,16-35L,24-70LII,24L,70-200F2.8LII,100-400,300/400/500/800L
 
US333
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 11:56 am

Thanks for the simple and straightforward response Sam. I now have some clarification of the situation.

-Kyle
 
Bronko
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 1:25 pm

Craig, maybe this will help. Think of it as a screener courtesy reach around.  Smile
Jet City Aviation Photography
 
Sydneybuses
Posts: 105
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:52 pm

Well done Darren.  Big thumbs up - that is the only reply to Craig's initial message that has 100% truth in it.
 
cathay112
Posts: 257
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:41 pm

For those that ask for evidence, here is a screen print of Sam's queue stats on the day of the 12th October 2004 at 1312 local time. You will note that the only shot in screening is Sam's as his individual photo list says "1 photo in Screening".



I haven't read alot of the above as I've been far too busy at work, I'm glad to see that mostly, people haven't been launching into me for posting this topic. I appreciate that, and hopefully we can collectively come up with some ideas to eliminate this sort of thing all together.
 
ckw
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:21 pm

I'm not going to comment on whether Sam was favoured or not - and frankly I don't care. Perhaps a screener simply got bored looking at a batch of marginal shots and wanted to see if there was anything more interesting to look at  Smile

However I would ask if, in the overall scheme of things, it really matters? I know a number of screeners and I can tell you it is this (in their eyes) "petty" bickering which pisses them off - they want to do their job without constantly being asked to justify themselves. This is the reason they don't post in the forums much anymore. This is the reason why some of them don't screen as much as they used to and who knows, may cause some to give up altogether.

Now some of you may say "so what?" there are plenty of others who would do the job! Well, perhaps there are plenty of others who think they want the job, but not that many are capable of doing the job, and of those who are, many would soon become non-productive once they see how tedious, thankless and time consuming the job can be.

So while Craig raises a valid question and perhaps it can ultimately be proved that screener X broke the rules, I say that this would be a hollow "victory" indeed. What then? Hound that screener off the team? Risk many of the other screeners saying "sod this, I don't need this sort of hassle in my life"?

I suggest you let the screeners get on with their job as they see fit. Believe me, if any screener steps seriously out of line, they sort it amongst themselves - or Johan steps in. Leave them alone, and the queue will be cycling through in just a few days - suck what fun there is out of their job, and perhaps we'll all get uploaded in the correct order, but we'll be waiting weeks. Your choice.

Cheers,

Colin
Colin K. Work, Pixstel
 
N178UA
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:28 pm

Craig, I already admitted 6 photos of mine have been screened priority, you've gone to such a strength to even save a screen shot to prove it!! Well Done mate, you can be hired as private investigator anytime...actually you're overqualified.

May I ask why do you checking people's email Q status for? just to catch the abnormal one and bringing them to attention in the forum and ask for a fair trial? What does 5 photos screened faster cost personally on you? It seems to me that you only check a few person's Q status that you like to use it against with, including another fellow Australian screener that you post about he Q jumped a while ago (site-related forum). You are a good lovely guy in person when we met at airport but have different reaction on the internet.


Sam
For more of myself and my flight reviews visit http://www.SamChui.com
 
runway23
Posts: 1916
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RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:31 pm

Sam,

Like you say Craig seems to be overly qualified to be the official a.net policeman.

I can't help thinking that the time this has used up has only taken the screeners away from screening pictures. People shouldn't come screaming if your pictures stay in the queue for ever...

Tim
 
TZ
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Joined: Sat Mar 29, 2003 9:21 am

RE: An Open Letter To Airliners.net

Wed Oct 13, 2004 5:44 pm

One way in which we can eliminate this problem is the forthcoming introduction of password-protected user stats. Eventually all of the data regarding your own photos and their place in the queue will only be available via the http://www.airliners.net/myphotos interface.

It is not fair for individual's photographs to be viewable by others while they are in the queue. Pre-screened images should not be publically available, and this will soon be rectified.

This is definately the right way to go although I'm sure some will say it'll contribute to the "conspiracy" theory.

I am all for it since I believe people "spying" on others queue-stats is, at best, rather impolite.

Tamsin (a.net screening crew)
TZ Aviation - Aeropuerto de los Banditos Team Images

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