atomother
Posts: 389
Joined: Sat May 22, 1999 8:47 am

Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:35 am

I have been struggling as of late to get some good shots from inside the cockpit that show both the controls inside the cockpit along with the runway ahead or whatever else outside the aircraft. Here are some examples of what I am trying to do.


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Photo © Sven De Bevere
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Photo © Patrick Lutz




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Photo © TriplET
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Photo © Sven De Bevere



Usually I can either get the inside or outside in focus and properly lighted but rarely both. Either you can see the controls and then the outside is way overexposed or the inside is too dark and the outside looks fine.

My technique I have been using is to use the flash and focus on the inside then raise the camera so that the outside is in the frame and then pull the trigger. This rarely gives me the desired results though.

Sooooo, my question is, what settings are you guys using for photos like above? I am using a 300D with the kit lens.
 
Newark777
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RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 6:09 am

Not sure about the lighting, as I have never shot inside a cockpit before, but I assume that if you use a wide enough lens with a low focal length, plus a high f-stop, you could probably get the depth of field you are looking for.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
DLKAPA
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Joined: Wed Dec 03, 2003 10:37 am

RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 6:26 am

Do you have a separate flash or are you using the camera popup? If the latter, you're pretty much SOL on these types of shots, because what you need to do is Bounce the flash off the cockpit ceiling, so that the controls don't reflect the flash.

A good way to do this to take your exposure settings by shooting in M mode and metering the outside of the aircraft, then slightly (between 0 and -.3f) underexposing the outside. Using the light settings, point the flash at the ceiling of the aircraft, then set the focus point down on the controls. Press shutter.

You could do it with the popup pointing straight at the controls, but if the controls reflect too much, you're pretty well SOL.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
atomother
Posts: 389
Joined: Sat May 22, 1999 8:47 am

RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:18 am

Well, I just have the popup flash, but am thinking something like this will work? 18mm at about f/3.5 1/80th, ISO 400 and a flash. Perhaps it would help if I held it back away from the controls as much as possible rather than two or three feet away?
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 10:54 am

That might help, but you can still expect alot of reflections off the guages, as the glass is hitting them straight on.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
dendrobatid
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Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:40 pm

RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:17 pm

In the four examples that you use two stand out for their front to back sharpness, the two from Sven.
The clue is in the picture, the curved horizon showing that a very, very wide lens has been used and that accounts for the great depth of field.
The one from Patrick, the outside is not actually that sharp, but who cares?
The other one, from tripIET....I don't know how the photographer managed that unless flash was used in the cockpit to perfectly balance the bright outside light.
And would that be allowed on finals ?
Mick Bajcar
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:24 pm

Quoting Dendrobatid (Reply 5):
The clue is in the picture, the curved horizon showing that a very, very wide lens has been used and that accounts for the great depth of field.

I can give you a great depth of field from a 400mm lens. Focal length has nothing to do with depth of field, that belongs to the aperture. The smaller the aperture, the greater the depth-of-field.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
dendrobatid
Posts: 1646
Joined: Sat Nov 06, 2004 3:40 pm

RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 3:48 pm

I totally agree and I guess I was being over simplistic.
At a given aperture a wide lens will ALWAYS give a greater depth of field than a telephoto. No matter how much you stop down a telephoto you will never get a great depth of field.
With a fish eye, which Sven's might even be, at F8, the depth of field will be from infinity to almost close up. And it shows!
Mick Bajcar
 
Jan Mogren
Posts: 2014
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2000 2:47 am

RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:15 pm

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 6):
I can give you a great depth of field from a 400mm lens. Focal length has nothing to do with depth of field, that belongs to the aperture.



 liar 

It has VERY much to do with focal length!

/JM
AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
 
wietse
Posts: 3630
Joined: Thu Oct 18, 2001 12:49 am

RE: Cockpit Photos Clear In And Out...

Tue Mar 22, 2005 9:38 pm

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 6):

I can give you a great depth of field from a 400mm lens. Focal length has nothing to do with depth of field, that belongs to the aperture. The smaller the aperture, the greater the depth-of-field.

Even though you are on the right path, you are not quite "there" yet. It does have a lot to do with focal length. The DOF relative to the apperture is much greater when using a wide angled lens.

For instance; a 17mm at 2.8 will have a much greater DOF than a 200mm at 2.8 does. So you are right about the fact that the apperture controls the DOF, but it is very much so connected to the focal length.

Wietse
Wietse de Graaf

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