spencer
Posts: 1518
Joined: Sun Apr 25, 2004 8:30 pm

Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 3:28 pm

As a follow-on to a recent thread and something that has been concerning me for a while now, I was just wondering if any of you guys feel the same way about this hobby now, with regards to how we upload especially? I mean, spotting has definitely changed over the years, mainly due to the advent of the internet/web sites. I remember number crunching back in the day and being amazed and excited over how many new registrations and frames I had made. And if I was lucky enough to have captured something rare or exotic on film it made the entire experience that much better. But what is rare these days? What's considered amazing? I go out now and I'm thinking to myself, "Right, this has to be A.net acceptable", or "Will so and so accept this kind of arty shot?"! I shouldn't be doing that, no way!! It isn't even fun anymore! I know what you're all saying though, that you make your own fun, you play to your own rules. That's true. And I think that's what I'm going to have to get back to doing again. I really can't be arsed uploading shots due to them being potentially big hitters like some photogs do; it doesn't make you a better photog does it? It certainly will give you exposure though if your name is in lights every other week I suppose. Well, this is just a little rant that I'm going to fix myself. How do you guys feel though?
Spencer.
EOS1D4, 7D, 30D, 100-400/4.5-5.6 L IS USM, 70-200/2.8 L IS2 USM, 17-40 f4 L USM, 24-105 f4 L IS USM, 85 f1.8 USM
 
Newark777
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 3:43 pm

I still get that little rush everytime a plane flies low over my head. That little kid feeling at rotation in my window seat, shutter firing. Ducking behind an SUV as a cop rolls by. Eating the $0.99 breakfast at IKEA knowing a full day of spotting is ahead of me. Seeing high crosswinds in the forcast, and knowing it will be a fun for me, and horrible for the pilots. And not once do I even think about a.net.


And it helps a lot that I don't upload here anymore. Big grin

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 4:42 pm

For me, it's not like it used to be, even just 3 years into it. Oddly enough, those special amazing shots of aircraft, the ones that drew me into the hobby in mid-2002, That first google search of "airplane photos" that led me to this site, then being completely astounded when there was a whole slough of pictures already from Denver and being like "wow, they have that here?" and seeing the photographers and thinking "wow Alexander Kroychik, Tim Samples, Jeff Miller, and Aaron Mandolesi I wish I could be like those guys, that's so cool!" I hear talk about how quality standards have improved over the years but then yesterday I started looking at the shots that first brought me to this hobby, shots like:


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Photo © Alexander Kroychik
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Photo © Aaron Mandolesi




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Photo © Jeff Miller
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Photo © Tim Samples - CFI-CFII-MEI



And I began to wonder if that has really been the case all the time. This hobby is definetly not what it used to be.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
INNflight
Posts: 3526
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2004 5:11 am

RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 5:21 pm

Spencer, you're definitely right. Things changed over the years, but IMO it often got better.
Skipping in to what Harry said in reply 1, I still get up on every Saturday and Sunday between December and March, even if I am supposed to sleep long, like most of my friends do on weekends, looking out of the window at 7am, getting a glimpse of the first rays of sun and the snowy mountains, thinking "...camera, CF's, batteries, bag, hot tea,...lets get out!"

For me, standing out in the freezing cold snow at the beginning of a quiet day, with that lovely low sunshine, and the cold air where you could use a 100-400 lens even with a 2x converter and you wouldn't see any heat haze, with the first arrivals rolling in through the yet quiet valley - this all makes it SO worth, doing (aviation) photography!

Of course nowadays when getting home, I can't wait for having a look at the photos, with a hot cappuchino in front of the computer, and also uploading the best ones to A.net.

I am glad nowadays I can show off my best captures to a huge amount of people, because years ago, I would have gone home, get in front of TV and watch. During the next week I'd have brought the film rolls to store, and waited a couple of days. Not that much fun, is it?

Cheers,
F.
Jet Visuals
 
Granite
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 5:35 pm

Hi all

Nothing has changed for me.

Been photographing aircraft since the early 1980's and the fun is still with me today. Yes, Airliners.net has changed over the years but what you have to remember is:

"Photograph for YOU and not for the viewer"

I don't give a toss about hits. If an images gives me less than 100 hits I couldn't give a damn. If it's a nicely composed image, I am more than happy with that.

I don't want my name in lights. I don't want top of the day. I don't want the most popular of the year. I just want a nice image that looks good in print.

Regards

Gary
 
QANTAS077
Posts: 5171
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2004 5:08 pm

RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 5:44 pm

Quoting Granite (Reply 4):
Hi all

Nothing has changed for me.

Been photographing aircraft since the early 1980's and the fun is still with me today. Yes, Airliners.net has changed over the years but what you have to remember is:

"Photograph for YOU and not for the viewer"

I don't give a toss about hits. If an images gives me less than 100 hits I couldn't give a damn. If it's a nicely composed image, I am more than happy with that.

I don't want my name in lights. I don't want top of the day. I don't want the most popular of the year. I just want a nice image that looks good in print.

Regards

Gary

what he said! been doing it since the mid 80's and hits are irrelevant to me, i just enjoy watching planes and collection rego data, sitting in the fresh air and maybe coming home and uploading a few to different sites...best bonus is travelling to different locations and meeting the local people!
 
Stealthz
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 6:08 pm

Right there with Q077,

Gary and I don't always see eye to eye but on this question I would have written my reply in almost exactly the same words!!

Not a huge reg data collector.. just like photographing planes!!

Regards

Chris
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
 
javibi
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:17 pm

It is the photography and not the spotting that brought me here and since I have so much to learn I do not think I am gonna stop having fun trying the impossible shot anytime soon. I do suffer the A.net syndrome sometimes, which I feel does impair my photography (meaning I sometimes think "is this A.net worthy?" when shooting instead of just shooting the way I like) but I am trying to get over it. I am seriously thinking of following other people's examples and getting myself a nice personal web to show my not A.net material though.

Regards

j
 
GPHOTO
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 9:29 pm

Quoting Javibi (Reply 7):
I do suffer the A.net syndrome sometimes, which I feel does impair my photography (meaning I sometimes think "is this A.net worthy?" when shooting instead of just shooting the way I like) but I am trying to get over it

It's ok, when you get ideas from other Airliners.net photographers and want to try it out. If you have plenty of memory card space, I wouldn't worry about shooting an angle that you like and then one for Airliners.net. Choose both if you can, but if you can only choose one, shoot for yourself.

Best regards,

Jim
Erm, is this thing on?
 
spencer
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 1:17 am

Of course I agree with all of the above! No doubt. I still enjoy it immensely, however things have changed over the last few years. I've been at this since the late 70s, started out merely as a bit of fun as a kid. It grew on me and became an obsession!! I love it as much now as I did then, but it seems to be more commercial now. I was talking to Ryan Hemmings and Christopher Hammarborg about this the other day; It could all be down to me at the end of the day, who knows? I enjoy being the first out, even on early cold mornings. I enjoy the chase as it's known! It's a fun day out and can involve a lot of travelling, which luckily enough I get to do. I'll still book a flight depending on type and airline even, so to say the fun has disappeared entirely is incorrect of me. I just sometimes wonder if I'm doing this for the right reasons still.....
Spencer.
EOS1D4, 7D, 30D, 100-400/4.5-5.6 L IS USM, 70-200/2.8 L IS2 USM, 17-40 f4 L USM, 24-105 f4 L IS USM, 85 f1.8 USM
 
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Bruce
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 1:25 am

I don't get the chance to shoot any truly rare or exotic planes (except for Airventure...) but for me personally, what is "rare" is any out-of-the-ordinary aircraft at my local airport. Those are the ones I would love to see online even if the plane is not "rare" in the aviation world. For example, a DC10 tok off from GRB with the football team. They only use the DC10 maybe twice a year here at GRB so this is way rare for me, however, there are 100 shots of this plane on the database.

bruce
Bruce Leibowitz - Jackson, MS (KJAN) - Canon 50D/100-400L IS lens
 
GPHOTO
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 1:39 am

Quoting Spencer (Reply 9):
I just sometimes wonder if I'm doing this for the right reasons still.....

Whatever, you do, NEVER think about why you are doing this!  Smile No, really, what we do is strange and illogical and if you think too hard about it, you might just realise how weird we all are and 'drop-back-in' to normal society, never to photograph an aircraft again!

Seriously, you may need to take a bit of time off from aviation photography, then see how long you can last before it sucks you back in.....

Best regards,

Jim
Erm, is this thing on?
 
spencer
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 1:41 am

Jim, I know! It's like a bloody vacuum!!!!
Spencer.
EOS1D4, 7D, 30D, 100-400/4.5-5.6 L IS USM, 70-200/2.8 L IS2 USM, 17-40 f4 L USM, 24-105 f4 L IS USM, 85 f1.8 USM
 
Rotate
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 1:48 am

Quoting Granite (Reply 4):
"Photograph for YOU and not for the viewer"

same with me here ... , though you I have ups and downs ...

Robin
ABC
 
Cathay111
Posts: 517
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 12:23 pm

The fun is still here! There's lots of fantastic people to meet here!

I shoot because I absolutely love taking photos of planes, being able to share them here (or anywhere else online for that matter) just makes the hobby that little bit more enjoyable.

Who cares how many people look at your photos......

I'm just as grateful to the 76 people that viewed this photo as I am to the 200,000+ that have viewed my most popular photo.....



Gary summed it up perfectly in his post above!!!! And he's one of the fantastic people I've had the pleasure of meeting through this site.
 
DLKAPA
Posts: 7962
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 12:33 pm

Quoting Granite (Reply 4):
Hi all

Nothing has changed for me.

Been photographing aircraft since the early 1980's and the fun is still with me today. Yes, Airliners.net has changed over the years but what you have to remember is:

"Photograph for YOU and not for the viewer"

I don't give a toss about hits. If an images gives me less than 100 hits I couldn't give a damn. If it's a nicely composed image, I am more than happy with that.

I don't want my name in lights. I don't want top of the day. I don't want the most popular of the year. I just want a nice image that looks good in print.

Regards

Gary

Spot on the nose.
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
fergulmcc
Posts: 1877
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 8:36 pm

RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:53 pm

Quoting QANTAS077 (Reply 5):
best bonus is travelling to different locations and meeting the local people!

This is the best line in this whole thread and I thought I was the only one thinking about it. With the amount of low fare airlines these days, you can get pretty much anywhere in Europe on a budget if you play your cards right get some really cheap flights. You can be pretty much anywhere in Europe in about a 90 min flight. Put a post in the forum of where you are going and I'm sure you'll get a response from someone in the area who would be willing to show you around, and that goes for DUB anyone, just make sure it's a weekend and I would be happy to show anyone around here. I haven't uploaded for a good while now and that's because I have been doing most of my photography for myself. I will get to A.net when I have a chance but right now my photography is more important. I still go out and belive me I have a good few Gig's of photos to process.  Smile

By the way Florian, I have to come and visit your place one of these days, sounds great in the winter,  cold  Big grin

Take care

Fergul  sun 
Zambian Airways, Where the Eagles fly free!!
 
QANTAS077
Posts: 5171
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 6:09 pm

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 16):
This is the best line in this whole thread and I thought I was the only one thinking about it.

of course it is mate...it's cos i said it!  Silly seriously though, i've met some of the most generous, fun and accomodating people over the last 4 years and they've made spotting that much more enjoyable, whether it be in America with the great crew in New York, Europe with the crazy spotters in Germany or Japan where white lenses are common place, these are the people that keep me interested and make it fun, knowing that i can call on them and visit just about anytime of the year is enough reason to go out n take photos!

i've been blessed with the love of travel and being a people person, can get along with anyone and chew the fat, not just about planes either, if i could do it for a living i'd be a made man!
 
fergulmcc
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Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 8:36 pm

RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 6:19 pm

Quoting QANTAS077 (Reply 17):
New York, Europe with the crazy spotters in Germany or Japan where white lenses are common place, these are the people that keep me interested and make it fun, knowing that i can call on them and visit just about anytime of the year is enough reason to go out n take photos!

. . . . uhhhhhhmm what about good ole Ireland Monty?? Don't forget us chaps over here. Big grin Always welcome.

Fergul  sun 
Zambian Airways, Where the Eagles fly free!!
 
QANTAS077
Posts: 5171
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 6:38 pm

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 18):
. . . . uhhhhhhmm what about good ole Ireland Monty?? Don't forget us chaps over here. Big grin Always welcome.

2006 is the year of Europe and Russia for me mate, january will be back to the USA for a shot at La, Miami and Vegas then i'll plan to head back to Europe later in the year, Russia is a place that's pulling at me and needs doing! i'll be sure to pop into Ireland too, Aussies have a great affection for Ireland! in discussion with Sam about Sth America for july of 2006 also, one place that i really need to visit!

[Edited 2005-10-10 11:43:07]
 
chris78cpr
Posts: 2733
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 7:44 am

RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 7:55 pm

Quoting Cathay111 (Reply 14):
I'm just as grateful to the 76 people that viewed this photo as I am to the 200,000+ that have viewed my most popular photo.....

300,898 to be precise mate! Big grin

Chris
5D2/7D/1D2(soon to be a 1Dx) 17-40L/24-105L/70-200F2.8L/100-400L/24F1.4LII/50F1.2L/85F1.2LII
 
linco22
Posts: 1278
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 11:07 pm

Well i think i'll add my little 2p's worth now....... *yawns*

Just remember you all have it good where you lot are! I'm stuck with BFS (Easyjet) and BHD (FlyBe) so mabye get away to mainland UK once maybe twice a year. I do because I get a buzz out of it. A buzz out of standing following a plane through your lens and capturing its best moments in your eyes. That will always do it for me. The sounds, the looks, everything.

I went to MAN back in August and didnt see any locals but still had a blast. And i'd do it again if I had the money! Even though i can proudly say I own 350D my photography skills are nothing compared to most of the people on here. But thats the other side to it too. Learning. Each time I go out I do something different. And I learn something each time. Usually not to do something again!

And its been said time and time again, do this hobby for YOU. Nobody else. As much as I wish I had more than my pathetic 9 shots on here, keeping the smile on your face each time doesnt compare.

Colin
 
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Fiveholer
Posts: 893
Joined: Fri Jun 11, 1999 6:27 am

RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 10, 2005 11:38 pm

Quoting Granite (Reply 4):
Hi all

Nothing has changed for me.

Been photographing aircraft since the early 1980's and the fun is still with me today. Yes, Airliners.net has changed over the years but what you have to remember is:

"Photograph for YOU and not for the viewer"

I don't give a toss about hits. If an images gives me less than 100 hits I couldn't give a damn. If it's a nicely composed image, I am more than happy with that.

I don't want my name in lights. I don't want top of the day. I don't want the most popular of the year. I just want a nice image that looks good in print.

Regards

Gary

Well said! I don't need to be a "view whore" to be happy! Big grin

Danny
Bring back Bethune!
 
IngemarE
Posts: 281
Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 4:46 pm

RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 11, 2005 12:22 am

The other day I came home from GSE and had shot 71 frames (is it allowed to call dig.pic's "frames"?!? Wouldn't want to upset the slide shooters!  Wink) Out of those, 68 were non-A.net-potential material. (Horses, birds, rabbits, butterflies, trees.......and the list goes on.)
That's because I do this for me, myself & I,....and for fun!
I just like to use my camera and experiment with it. Most of the time pic's don't come out the way I was aiming for, but I don't really care. At least I had fun, pressing that shutter release! That's what counts, isn't it?!

I'm not going to let myself become too bl**dy serious about this whole aviation-photography thing. It's supposed to be fun, and I intend to keep it that way!
Would love to be able to travel a bit more and go to other airports. If for no other reason, just to meet people with the same interest!
....but all that in due time!
In thrust I trust.
 
spencer
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 11, 2005 3:38 am

I think that's where I've slowly being going wrong IngemarE; been jetting off here and there, shooting like a nutter, not bothering to take in the surroundings and the realness of it all. Just concerned about getting decent shots that I could upload perhaps. The thing is, I was never like that before and I intend on not being like it anymore. I want to get the fun back in this crazy hobby again. For sure, along with the travelling/flying it's the other people I meet along the way that really makes it worthwhile; that and getting a set of shots that you really are happy with. For me this hobby is great and I'll never stop doing it. I know I bitch a bit, but when I'm out there shooting, especially with a friend, then I don't think I really moan that much!! Weird. It's good to see what you others feel on this subject too. Right, now then, let's get wet down that bog called Myrtle! Quick BA 320! Alrighty then!
Spencer.
(In contradictory personal turmoil!!!!!)
EOS1D4, 7D, 30D, 100-400/4.5-5.6 L IS USM, 70-200/2.8 L IS2 USM, 17-40 f4 L USM, 24-105 f4 L IS USM, 85 f1.8 USM
 
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Scooter
Posts: 836
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 11, 2005 4:40 am

Quoting Spencer (Reply 24):
been jetting off here and there, shooting like a nutter, not bothering to take in the surroundings and the realness of it all.

That is EXACTLY what burned me out a couple years ago. One day I just woke up and realized that I was travelling a lot, but I wasn't taking the time to look around and enjoy the surroundings (because I was too focused on photography). Aviation photography was controlling my life, and it soon became a "pointless" thing to me. I was so burned out that I quit for a whole year. I even sold all my gear.

Now, I'm shooting again (for myself - I don't upload anywhere), and aviation photography is secondary to me. Travel (and living life) is #1, and it won't kill me if I don't make it out to the airport every weekend.

The key is balance.
My name is Scott, and I am addicted to writing trip reports.
 
ryangooner
Posts: 956
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 11, 2005 8:23 am

For me the fun has gone, I haven't been for a days spotting at a major airport since july and thats only because 2 mates came over to England and i had to show them around LHR ! (lol).

I think ive got the heavy blues and have not found it fun for a while shooting the usual heavy traffic down the local, this year ive enjoyed the airshow season far more and found it more fun to shoot props and old warbirds than 747's and the like...

Will i get that buzz back again for the heavies? - Im not sure...

At the moment these shots are what im talking about, i prefer these to my heavies - am i going mad too?


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Photo © Ryan Hemmings
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Photo © Ryan Hemmings



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Photo © Ryan Hemmings
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Photo © Ryan Hemmings



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Photo © Ryan Hemmings
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Photo © Ryan Hemmings


Ryan Hemmings
ooh to ooh to be ooh to be a gooner!
 
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aerorobnz
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 11, 2005 1:48 pm

I don't upload to Airliners.net so I still get enjoyment out of taking a photo that matches my own criteria for excellence and updating my collection with my database.
Like Spencer I just decided to go and see the world rather than just the airports, I just made sure that if I go travelling I set some time for spotting, and time for seeing the places that I want to visit.
Flown to 120 Airports in 44 Countries on 73 Operators. Visited 55 Countries and counting. Wanderlust is like Syphilis, once you have the itch it's too late for treatment.
 
viv
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 11, 2005 10:40 pm

Ryan,

Those shots of yours are BEAUTIFUL!
Nikon D700, Nikkor 80-400, Fuji X Pro 1, Fujinon 35 f/1.4, Fujinon 18 f/2
 
LHRSIMON
Posts: 1314
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 11, 2005 11:31 pm

I have given the aviation photography a break for a while to be honest. I was getting so sick of the security/Police looking at me like some sort of criminal. Then when i got a lecture about 9/11 from a policeman who looked about 18 that was the last straw.

I am now 100% Sports/Ice Hockey at the moment. I must say the added bonus is that people look at me and respect me saying things like " i love your photos" etc etc. Rather than at LHR when people seem to think its ok to shout out cars as they pass by things like "you sad wan##er !!!!!" etc etc

I still have thousands of aviation photo's to process so im sure you will see a bit more of my work here , time permitting.

Simon C
Canon 1D Mk III,Canon 20D+17-40 L f4.0,70-200 L IS USM f2.8,400 L USM f5.6,135 mm L f2.0, 50 mm f1.8,1.4 x II extender
 
Cadet57
Posts: 7174
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 12:26 am

Quoting Spencer (Thread starter):
I go out now and I'm thinking to myself, "Right, this has to be A.net acceptable", or "Will so and so accept this kind of arty shot?"! I shouldn't be doing that, no way!! It isn't even fun anymore!

I think its is espicially hard for new photogs, like me, all 16 shots rejected, every one appealed, and all I got was an upload on myaviation....


Quoting Newark777 (Reply 1):
I still get that little rush everytime a plane flies low over my head. That little kid feeling at rotation in my window seat

Thats always a good feeling, but according to my friends, I need to get that checked out...
Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
 
satx
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:26 am

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 30):
think its is espicially hard for new photogs, like me, all 16 shots rejected, every one appealed, and all I got was an upload on myaviation....

I gave up on the upload part. Only maybe 1 out of 1,000 images I take has any chance at all of being accepted and even then I'd have to endlessly play around with the levels, sharpness, contrast, colors, and cropping to get it through. Is that what this hobby is all about? Buying several thousand dollars of equipment and learning how to be a post-processing wiz?
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
linco22
Posts: 1278
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 8:00 pm

Dont lose sight of what you're doing. If i've learnt anything from the leading photographers on here and on other sites along with the people i've met, its take photographs for you. No-one else. Learn to perfect photography. Push yourself as far as you want and as far as you can. I personally have 12 shots on here and I used to get really annoyed when I get rejections. And i must admit sometimes I still do if i'm having a bad day! I have shots on other websites and i'm now exploring other types of photography.

I enjoy taking photographs of airplanes and always will, but dont do it for this website. I enjoy looking at other peoples pics and yes, this website has influenced me big time, but its not the end of the world!

Just my other 2p's worth......again lol

Colin
 
wickster
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 11:26 pm

I'm bran new to this and have loved Airplanes since I was old enough to understand they flew, which has been a long time, 1944 I just loved the P51. Well recently my son in the Air Force bought me a Canon S2IS and a computer. May I say I been in heaven ever since. I'm retired and work in the Upper Penn of Michigan in the old USA. Only have two small airports nearby but am sure having fun between them and AirVenture in Oshkosh. Still learning about Technology and stuff but loving it.
None
 
fergulmcc
Posts: 1877
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 12:41 am

Quoting SATX (Reply 31):
even then I'd have to endlessly play around with the levels, sharpness, contrast, colors, and cropping to get it through. Is that what this hobby is all about? Buying several thousand dollars of equipment and learning how to be a post-processing wiz?

What...... and you think the pros don't???!!!!
I'm no pro trust me, but I still have to do a good bit of editing in photoshop to get my shots to A.net standard as everybody else does, welcome to the digital world. You don't need several thousand dollars worth of equipment to get photos onto a.net. There are quite a few photographers who have point and shoot cameras and can still get photos onto A.net. I will admit you are restricted to what you can do, but nevertheless you can still do it. If you are really still having problems then e-mail me your best original photo and I will have a go at it for you, I'd be happy to help you out. When shooting always set your camera to the max quality, i.e. large and fine. To do digital photography then yes you will have to learn photoshop if you are to enhance your photos.
I have expensive equipment, but that's because I hope to go professional one day.

Hope that helps

Take care

Fergul  sun 

PS: If you think prices for camera gear are expensive in the USA, have a look at Ireland, our prices are double to what you pay, just a thought.
Zambian Airways, Where the Eagles fly free!!
 
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Scooter
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:16 am

Quoting SATX (Reply 31):
and even then I'd have to endlessly play around with the levels, sharpness, contrast, colors, and cropping to get it through. Is that what this hobby is all about?

Yes, that is exactly what it's about. Pressing the shutter button is only one small step in the digital photography process. I don't upload my images anywhere (I shoot 100% for myself), yet I will usually spend 5-10 minutes per image tweaking what I can to make it the best it can be.
My name is Scott, and I am addicted to writing trip reports.
 
GPHOTO
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:46 am

Quoting SATX (Reply 31):
Buying several thousand dollars of equipment and learning how to be a post-processing wiz?



Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 34):
You don't need several thousand dollars worth of equipment to get photos onto a.net.

I've had 498 photos accepted here. I have had a few point-and-shoots, never held a DSLR let alone owned one and use Photoshop Elements 3.0. Hardly expensive kit and I spend 10-30 minutes editing each picture up to A.net standard. Put some music on, pour a drink and edit away to your hearts content. It is not so hard, just takes a little care and time to learn the basics. With the basics, you can begin having acceptances here, it is all that is needed. If your camera doesn't cut it, get one that can. There are several excellent point-and-shoots on the market that are low cost but suitable for use here.

True, I don't have any breathtaking images like some of the guys here, but that's fine. I'm not ready to push myself there yet (financially, skills-wise or motivationally). I'm just in this to have fun, which I am having.

Best regards,

Jim
Erm, is this thing on?
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:45 am

Quoting GPHOTO (Reply 36):
Put some music on, pour a drink and edit away to your hearts content.

Maybe that's not such a good idea Big grin
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
satx
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 10:58 am

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 34):
What...... and you think the pros don't?

No, I'm quite sure they do. However, I'm not sure how I gave the opposite impression.  confused 

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 34):
You don't need several thousand dollars worth of equipment to get photos onto a.net.

No, but it sure helps. Many of the rejection messages seem to be a nice way of saying "your camera sucks." Big grin That's not to say that even a bottom-of-the-line entry level camera wouldn't take good shots in the hands of a pro, just that a newbie with an entry-level camera and no post-processing experience has the odds really stacked against them. I think getting photos accepted at today's A.net has become difficult enough that I'd rather spend the time just showing a coworker or two instead of endlessly filtering my photos into something that hardly matches what my very own eyes saw when I took them. At work I'll at least get a "that's cool", or "where'd you take this" instead of BAD_this and BAD_that.

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 34):
PS: If you think prices for camera gear are expensive in the USA, have a look at Ireland, our prices are double to what you pay, just a thought.

It's true. The US has some of the best prices for consumer goods in the Western world; probably because we just can't seem to put our credit cards away whenever we think we're getting a good deal. How many other societies squander so much of their income on material items and save virtually nothing for a rainy day? Look at what happened with the hurricanes for Pete's sake.

Quoting Scooter (Reply 35):
Yes, that is exactly what it's about. Pressing the shutter button is only one small step in the digital photography process. I don't upload my images anywhere (I shoot 100% for myself), yet I will usually spend 5-10 minutes per image tweaking what I can to make it the best it can be.

Sure, I spend a few minutes getting the photo cropped, sized, and adjusting the levels a bit. Jumping through endless hoops of vague requirements that sometimes result in unnatural looking photos doesn't really appeal to me though. I mean, sometimes a picture is hazy because you took it in a disgustingly smoggy city. Sometimes a backlit silhouette is as sexy as the best lit aircraft. Why should we try to filter these things out? Why does the plane have to fill the whole photo (or nearly so)? I guess I'm just on a completely different wavelength from where A.net has ended up. I'd rather have some novice give me a compliment of questionable significance than have a respected authority tell me why exactly where I went wrong.  Smile

In the end we're all free to do as we please. If you enjoy the acceptance process, then by all means keep at it. If you find the whole thing a bit esoteric and tedious, then don't. I, for one, found that having my photos on somebody else's site isn't quite the big deal it's cracked up to be. Maybe that means I shouldn't be posting here, but sometimes I think it helps to remind people that endless battles with the screening process isn't always the best way to spend your free time. I often wish people would just say "Hey, checkout my new favorite!" instead of "How can I bastardize this image until it will be accepted?" or "How can I circumnavigate this or that aspect of the screening process?"  Sad
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
GPHOTO
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 2:47 pm

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 37):
Maybe that's not such a good idea

I didn't say it had to be alcohol containing  Smile

But, yes, after I've finished the drink, I either find that I'm ready to get very creative or I need to stop and do something else  Smile .

Best regards,

Jim
Erm, is this thing on?
 
Stealthz
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 3:40 pm

Quoting Scooter (Reply 35):
Yes, that is exactly what it's about. Pressing the shutter button is only one small step in the digital photography process.

Nothing to do with "digital", pressing the shutter was only one small step in film based photography as well, do you think Ansel Adams' masterpieces from Yosemite came out of the camera like that?
Back in the good old days (nights mostly) of red/orange lights and smelly chemicals many of us spent hours sometimes days getting a print "just right", nothing really has changed except the instant gratification we expect in the 21st century.
Sure, you may say 35mm slides are all orginals.. not always true BTW.. but for every perfectly exposed properly composed slide most slide shooters will have many rejects sitting in box somewhere!!.

Getting back to the topic.. where has the fun gone? For me, the fun is in the photography, the people, the planes. Perhaps some of the fun has gone out of "database" photography, I admire A.net stance on quality, but I no longer see the need to compromise my photographic(artistic??) standards to fit the db. If I have a shot I like that fits the A.net criteria I will upload but that is not what makes me get up and go to the airport in the morning.

Regards


Chris
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
 
fergulmcc
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:07 pm

SATX,

You raise some good points but the only persson that can answer them is yourself ... and maybe you have.

Quoting SATX (Reply 38):
I, for one, found that having my photos on somebody else's site isn't quite the big deal it's cracked up to be. Maybe that means I shouldn't be posting here, but sometimes I think it helps to remind people that endless battles with the screening process isn't always the best way to spend your free time. I often wish people would just say "Hey, checkout my new favorite!" instead of "How can I bastardize this image until it will be accepted?" or "How can I circumnavigate this or that aspect of the screening process?"



Quoting SATX (Reply 38):
Why should we try to filter these things out? Why does the plane have to fill the whole photo (or nearly so)? I guess I'm just on a completely different wavelength from where A.net has ended up

I have only been with A.net for a year now and it's still the same allbeit a lot more tougher to get photos accepted, but that unfortunately comes with popularity. You can't stop that. If you were in business you'd be the same, you pick the best and dicard the rest, simple as that. A.net want the whole frame filled with the a/c, that hasn't changed, apart from a few sunset type shots, this is what is accepted, did you not notice that when you joined. It's a data base for aircraft, not a photography club. The rule of thirds doesn't apply here!
If you want those other shots then create your own web site, host them on Pbase or something or join a camera club. I did, and I am enjoying every bit of it, I hardley miss a meeting.
Photography is about enjoying yourself, do it for yourself, NOT for A.net. I'm not trying to be rude or sarcastic but if A.net doesn't fill your needs then why stick around. There are a lot better things in life than A.net, trust me. I haven't uploaded in a while now, Sunday was the first time in since mid August. I upload for myself and if a.net reject it then I don't bother reworking it to try to get it in, it's their loss. The only ones I resubmitt are bad info's. Remember this is a hobby, enjoy it!  Smile

Funny you picked up all my other points but not this one.

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 34):
If you are really still having problems then e-mail me your best original photo and I will have a go at it for you, I'd be happy to help you out.

Take care

Fergul  sun 
Zambian Airways, Where the Eagles fly free!!
 
BO__einG
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 4:57 pm

My excitement of aviation photography comes from not from digital camera use for taking shots of planes.
(I actually hate digital cameras due to their ridiculous cost and how short of a lifespan it lasts before failing or forcing to pay more for updated models)
MOst of the times I get satisfaction from shooting slides and getting my slides back 3 weeks later with perfectly lit and composed shots.
Considering I still use a 1979 Nikon EM model adjusting everything by hand, aviation photography this way is challenging. Trying to do all this while snapping a series of photos of a plane landing at 140kts at 150-300mm is not easy. FIghter jets are nearly impossible especially with slow film.

Recently I was thrilled at how my KR64 slides have been turning out. That film is by far the most daunting to shoot using my antique camera because most of the time it screws up the exposure as it can't compensate for the extra lighting needed to properly expose a shot.

One of the prime examples was a picture of a 744F lining up on the runway after sunset while the clouds were still glowing peach and orange. I managed to somehow make a handheld 1/4 second shot at 200mm at 3.8 aperature.
From my batch of shots, 90% of my attempt for this scene was blurryness and darkness except one shot which came out perfectly beautiful as the plane itself morphed into a serene or orange and pink reflected from the sky.

I think it is the advent of DSLR's that have begun taking away some of the fun for some of you guys. It makes photographers look lazy as they can litteraly point the camera, turn the lens and push the button and then it does the rest by itself. Because of that, many amazing shots can be pulled off so easily including novices within their first few months of this hobby.

My fun and passion comes from the pictures I produce from my own experience and skill of doing this using my old and reliable camera that is older than I am which still has a few more peps left in its near end lifespan.
Yes the manual tinkering for everything is annoying but many times, it is worth it.
I plan to get a DSLR someday but meanwhile, I willl continue to delightfully snap planes in my old fashioned way. It would take a long time for a DSLR to bring me the same kind of satisfaction as my EM did.
Follow @kimbo_snaps on Instagram or bokimon- on Flickr to see more pics of me and my travels.
 
fergulmcc
Posts: 1877
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:08 pm

Quoting Bo__einG (Reply 42):
My fun and passion comes from the pictures I produce from my own experience and skill of doing this using my old and reliable camera that is older than I am which still has a few more peps left in its near end lifespan.
Yes the manual tinkering for everything is annoying but many times, it is worth it.

That's my whole point Bo, enjoy it, be it slides, film or digital. Too often, myself included, we get so frustrated with a rejection and we loose the head. Now I just don't bother. If it's rejected then it's A.net's loss, NOT mine.
It's a hobby, not an IQ test!

Have fun and take care

Fergul  sun 
Zambian Airways, Where the Eagles fly free!!
 
satx
Posts: 2771
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 7:45 pm

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 41):
Funny you picked up all my other points but not this one.

Okay, whatever.

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 41):
I'm not trying to be rude or sarcastic but if A.net doesn't fill your needs then why stick around.

I enjoy the forums and viewing the photos, I just don't enjoy jumping through all the hoops that must be navigated to get a photo accepted. Funny you didn't pick up on that.  sarcastic 
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
fergulmcc
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Tue Oct 18, 2005 9:14 pm

Quoting SATX (Reply 44):
I enjoy the forums and viewing the photos,

You don't say!! Missed that point!

Quoting SATX (Reply 44):
I just don't enjoy jumping through all the hoops that must be navigated to get a photo accepted. Funny you didn't pick up on that.

I did! I just thought I could help, remind me next time not to bother. You are the one that is moaning about what has to be done to a photo to get it accepted here, I'm not.

Anyway, take care of yourself and enjoy your photography, where ever you decide to show it.

Fergul  sun 
Zambian Airways, Where the Eagles fly free!!
 
f4wso
Posts: 942
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Wed Oct 19, 2005 2:39 am

I think the fun is still here on a grand scale! I had a great week photographing at Frankfurt. It was great to see some different airlines; skies were mostly sunny. There were many friendly spotters, all spoke English better than I spoke German. Thanks to the Rhein Main Aviation Society website that had directions to best locations on either end.
Gary
Cottage Grove, MN
Seeking an honest week's pay for an honest day's work
 
jwenting
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Wed Oct 19, 2005 7:44 pm

Quoting Granite (Reply 4):
"Photograph for YOU and not for the viewer"

Well said, which is why I stopped uploading anywhere. I don't want to spend hours to make something look just like it comes out of a Canon DSLR so it may be "acceptable" to someone I've never met.

That may be a controversial statement but that's my experience from the rejection comments I got over time, which were mostly due to things looking different from what they would have done had they been made by a D60 (yes, it was that long ago).

I love the high colour of Velvia and use that exclusive, if a.net (or other sites) don't like that, too bad for them.

The only reason I'd shoot what someone else wants instead of what I want is when that person pays me to do the shot his way.
And as that's not happened yet people'll just have to put up with what I prefer myself if they want to look at my work.
I wish I were flying
 
satx
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Thu Oct 20, 2005 2:23 am

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 45):
I just thought I could help, remind me next time not to bother.

Just because many/most posts on the photography forum are cries for help doesn't mean that my post was meant in the same vein.

Quoting Fergulmcc (Reply 45):
You are the one that is moaning about what has to be done to a photo to get it accepted here, I'm not.

How would you like me to say it in a way that isn't "moaning"? You sound like someone who calls any sort of blunt criticism to be "moaning". If you want me to pucker up every time I'm about to mention A.net, you can forget it.

Quoting Jwenting (Reply 47):
Well said, which is why I stopped uploading anywhere. I don't want to spend hours to make something look just like it comes out of a Canon DSLR so it may be "acceptable" to someone I've never met.

 checkmark  100%
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
MarkJBeckwith
Posts: 158
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RE: Where's The Fun Gone People?

Thu Oct 20, 2005 3:22 am

Holy cr#p!

I take pictures, enjoy the day out, upload if I feel like it and I don't take it personally when this PRIVATELY OWNED site which makes its own rules rejects my picture(s). This site isn't like a public park, it's a private "club" which is allowed to set its own rules.

Simple market forces take over after that, if lots of people like it and accept the rules, it'll survive. If the majority don't like it - it'll fail, and another that does work for the majority will flourish.

Bottom line, having pictures on this DB isn't a God-given right!

Take pictures, enjoy life, it's too short to get so worked up about the small stuff like this...

Submitted for your collective consideration.

Mark.
One day, I might be good at this...

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