tappan
Posts: 1478
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 1999 9:30 pm

Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Wed Nov 23, 2005 7:26 am

GREAT photo! important photo, artsy photo, beautiful photo, difficullt photo, VERY unique photo (has there been one quite like this)
VALUABLE photo....
SELL it!!

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ruben Hofs




Great job by the photographer....


Mark Garfinkel
 
waketurbulence
Posts: 1264
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Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Wed Nov 23, 2005 7:48 am

I just love that it is in the new colors. Makes it kind of ironic to me. Very nice shot though, probably once in a lifetime.
-Matt
 
Newark777
Posts: 8284
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:23 am

Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Wed Nov 23, 2005 7:54 am

Very cool indeed. Glad to hear everyone made it out okay.  Smile
US Airways Emergency Landing At Amsterdam Schiphol (by Singel09 Nov 22 2005 in Civil Aviation)

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
eadster
Posts: 2125
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 7:31 pm

Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Wed Nov 23, 2005 8:01 am

Ruben surely was in the right place at the right time with that snap!

Good to see it all worked out safely in the end.
 
User avatar
PW100
Posts: 2728
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 9:17 pm

Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Wed Nov 23, 2005 8:44 pm

Photo has appeared in Dutch newspaper:

http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/2...tuig_keert_terug_na_steekvlam.html


Kind Regards,
PW100
Immigration officer: "What's the purpose of your visit to the USA?" Spotter: "Shooting airliners with my Canon!"
 
tappan
Posts: 1478
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 1999 9:30 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:34 pm

The newspaper did'nt even give the kid any credit Sad...
They better not give it to the wire services for free or the kid will lose out on thousands of US $....
Once again, GREAT SHOT RUBEN......
and why shouldn't he make big bucks.....nobody died , nobody injured....I am quite sure that officials would love an enlargement of this photo for training purposes or whatever....

Mark G
 
tappan
Posts: 1478
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 1999 9:30 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:37 pm

HEY ALL.......

Are we sure that they bought the photo or is it possible that they took it off a.net

Mark G
 
LGW
Posts: 4281
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2000 6:07 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:53 pm

Mark,

Why no simply email the photographer direct as you would then get answers from the horses mouth and Ruben may not read the forums/be a member anyway

Cheers

Ben Pritchard
 
tappan
Posts: 1478
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 1999 9:30 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 12:56 am

Hi Ben,
I have been emailing the young Ruben......
No answer...
Mark G
 
chris78cpr
Posts: 2733
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 7:44 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 1:09 am

Great shot,

And yes there has been another like it, how could you forget this shot...


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © M.Oertle



Chris
5D2/7D/1D2(soon to be a 1Dx) 17-40L/24-105L/70-200F2.8L/100-400L/24F1.4LII/50F1.2L/85F1.2LII
 
draigonair
Posts: 624
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:37 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 2:47 am

I have contact with ruben, and yes the 'telegraaf' (dutch newspaper) stole the photo...he is asking money for it i believe..

cheers!

Nick
p.s
He told me he got about 40emails in about 2 hours for this shot...Think you can imagine why some people dint get a response!!

[Edited 2005-11-23 18:49:15]
cheers
 
INNflight
Posts: 3526
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2004 5:11 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:04 am

Quoting DRAIGONAIR (Reply 10):
He told me he got about 40emails in about 2 hours for this shot...

I would for sure be answering ( and charging ) all 40 of them, even if they come in half an hour.  bouncy 

What an unique photo, lucky opportunety to make some money with the exclusive photo.
Jet Visuals
 
Jan Mogren
Posts: 2014
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2000 2:47 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:14 am

Quoting INNflight (Reply 11):
I would for sure be answering ( and charging ) all 40 of them

Hmm, pretty straight forward business idea!

/JM
AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
 
IL76
Posts: 2237
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:43 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:22 am

Quoting DRAIGONAIR (Reply 10):
and yes the 'telegraaf' (dutch newspaper) stole the photo

They did???  Wow! I'm going to email them now! %@^%$$*&!!!

Ed
 
jwenting
Posts: 9973
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2001 10:12 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:47 am

Quoting INNflight (Reply 11):
would for sure be answering ( and charging ) all 40 of them, even if they come in half an hour.

If you were able to... Some of us have day jobs or go to school, cutting us off from their email for 10 hours or more a day.
I wish I were flying
 
draigonair
Posts: 624
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:37 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 4:15 am

Ed did you get any response yet?
cheers
 
IL76
Posts: 2237
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:43 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 4:18 am

Quoting DRAIGONAIR (Reply 15):
Ed did you get any response yet?

No, I don't think I will until tomorrow, or I will probably not get a reply from them at all. I'm very disappointed in "De Telegraaf", unless I know only half of the story. Are you sure Ruben was not contacted for the use of the photo?

E

PS, I suggest more people should email De Telegraaf at "redactie-i@telegraaf.nl", and/or "foto@telegraaf.nl".
They seem to have a reputation of ripping people off...

[Edited 2005-11-23 20:29:09]
 
timdegroot
Posts: 3258
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 10:37 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 4:34 am

De telegraaf is always stealing photos, their business practices are as bad as the newspaper they put out.

Tim
Alderman Exit
 
draigonair
Posts: 624
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:37 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 4:54 am

Ed,

yes im sure he didnt give permission. He is taking action but they are not responding.
cheers
 
LGW
Posts: 4281
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2000 6:07 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:19 am

Mark,

I wasn't aware you had contacted him, my apologies

Regards

Ben Pritchard
 
IL76
Posts: 2237
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 5:43 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:57 am

Quoting DRAIGONAIR (Reply 18):
He is taking action but they are not responding.

Hmm... I'm not surprised. I read on the forum at scramble.nl that somebody else has been trying to get money out of them for a while now about a stolen photo.
This is rediculous. I bet they think nobody will go through all the trouble to sue them, so they just don't reply. Ruben could sue their asses. But check where you stand first with a lawyer. If you win a case, doesn't the guilty party pay for the case?
Anyway, it was a headline topic. They should pay a lot for it.

E
 
tappan
Posts: 1478
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 1999 9:30 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 7:11 am

I know some don't like to talk about money but......
I am in this business and it is not the money but the fact that somebody did this to this kid. That somebody is home now having a glass of wine with his wife NOT REALIZING THE PAIN he has done to Ruben. This photo needs to get the attention of magazines. The way magazines find out is by the photo in a paper. The way magazines find out about where to buy the photo is by a photo credit. He got NO photo credit.
This photo should make between 7 and $10,000.00 USD.....
This WAS NOT AN easy photo to make. I would have been STUNNED and shocked to see this. Ruben was stunned and shocked BUT still has the photo tach sharp in focus and done VERY well!!!
Shame on that newspaper!!

Mark Garfinkel
 
Dehowie
Posts: 1065
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2004 8:41 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 7:50 am

Maybe ANET management should get a little involved in this to help Ruben out.
Something needs to be done and soon before the dust settles on this shot and any income Ruben could have made from it.
Darren
2EOS1DX,EF14.2.8LII,17TS,85/1.2,16-35L,24-70LII,24L,70-200F2.8LII,100-400,300/400/500/800L
 
Key
Posts: 93
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 10:35 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:08 pm

For those who read Dutch, here is the part on Scramble about this matter and this is a previous story. In short:
- When phoned with questions by the photographer De Telegraaf is very friendly, promises to correct matters and invites to email or write about it.
- When this is done, the photographer is ignored completely.
- When asked by third parties, replies are given like "We assumed this was stock material (and therefor could be taken??), correct us if we're wrong." Baloney of course...

Erik
 
Jan Mogren
Posts: 2014
Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2000 2:47 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Nov 24, 2005 9:58 pm

Try to find out if there is some sort of Photographers Association in The Netherlands. They should have some form of legal help.

We have a Bildombudsman here in Sweden that for a small fee will push it thru till they pay.  Wink Great stuff!

/JM
AeroPresentation - Airline DVD's filmed in High Definition
 
draigonair
Posts: 624
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:37 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Fri Nov 25, 2005 12:46 am

Wow allot of magazines etc have asked him for the picture. Anyways ill stay in contact with him to see what he is doing and i will tell him he should maybe get a lawyer. I told him he should tell his parents and maybe they can take action together with Ruben.

He got also some other newspapers who did ask for permission.

cheers

Nick
cheers
 
draigonair
Posts: 624
Joined: Tue Oct 10, 2000 8:37 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Fri Nov 25, 2005 4:06 am

Also one more thing, Ruben has asked me to leave a little message to everyone here:


""Hello all,

My name is Ruben Hofs And I made the 22e of november 05 the photo from the Usairways jet suffering an
Engine stalling now ive made 20± photo of the aircraft during take off with 4 photo's showing a flame
out of the back of the engine 1 is uploaded on A.net the other 3 I still have on my computer all 4 photo are
now for sale at a price op 7000,- Euros for the whole series, I know im late but I was so bussy the last days
and i Hope there still is someone or a magazine/newspaper anything like that that is intressted in this photos
maybe to write an article on it. So would people spread this around the world/Internet so maybe some one that is intressted
can contact me if he doesnt agree with the price he can do an other bid on it but i think that should be no problem at all

Only on serious buyer/bids will be reacted

or let them send me an Email so they can get details what they all get for their money.

Ruben hofs""

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ruben Hofs

cheers
 
1stspotter
Posts: 518
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 1999 3:13 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Fri Nov 25, 2005 4:11 am

De Telegraaf is indeed notorious for not asking permission for publishing. The rush for an exclusive scope is bigger than the will for asking permission.

A similar incident happened in 2003 when the newspaper used a picture of a V Bird A320 without permission. I contacted the newspaper about this and good the same reply "we will pay the photographer". I am not sure if they really did pay the photographer but will check on this.

There are other incidents with de Telegraaf described on severall internet sites.

If they do not pay Ruben I think we should start some sending some mails to the newspaper.
 
Key
Posts: 93
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 10:35 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Fri Nov 25, 2005 10:14 am

You can't actually start that anymore, they got numerous mails today, partly not nice at all.  bomb 
 
xiphias
Posts: 74
Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2004 3:29 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Sat Nov 26, 2005 2:57 am

Telegraaf suxx, they stole this image from me and posted it online on a variety of their sites and also in the printed paper.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Michael W. Rosa


Sent about 10 registered letters and no reply yet. Time give them a visit with my 34" Louisville Slugger.

-XiP
Xiph"i*as, n. [L., a swordfish, a sword-shaped comet, fr. Gr. xifi`as, fr. xi`fos a sword.]
 
timdegroot
Posts: 3258
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 10:37 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Sat Nov 26, 2005 3:03 am

I would hire an attorney. They cannot mount any defense.

Tim
Alderman Exit
 
1stspotter
Posts: 518
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 1999 3:13 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:14 am

After some email exchange with a journalist finally someone at the photodesk of the Telegraaf woke up. De Telegraaf states it is doing it's best to pay for the use of photos.

Ruben Hofs got an email today sent by the Telegraaf stating that he can send a bill worth € 125,- to compensate for the use of the photo on the website. That is a nice amount of money I guess.

I have good hopes the photo of Xiphias will be paid as well very soon now.

Marcel
 
dc10tim
Posts: 1380
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 12:21 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:28 am

EUR 125 does seem a small amount for the usage in the first place, let alone for the stress and inconvenience caused.

This is especially true when you bear in mind it is a national newspaper in the Netherlands.

I wonder, in comparison, how much the guys are going for who's photos were used in The Mail on Sunday recently in Britain?

I hope Ruben gets a fair settlement anyway.

Tim.
Obviously missing something....
 
xiphias
Posts: 74
Joined: Tue Aug 03, 2004 3:29 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Fri Dec 16, 2005 11:38 pm

Well, I finaly heard from the paper. I can send them a bill of €200 because it was used in multiple spots, in the printed paper and for my troubles.  Yeah sure I've spent more on registered letters to them and the hourly wage while writing them.  Angry

-XiP
Xiph"i*as, n. [L., a swordfish, a sword-shaped comet, fr. Gr. xifi`as, fr. xi`fos a sword.]
 
timdegroot
Posts: 3258
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 10:37 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Sat Dec 17, 2005 12:23 am

125 euros is a slap in the face!

Tim
Alderman Exit
 
INNflight
Posts: 3526
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2004 5:11 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Sat Dec 17, 2005 2:50 am

Quoting 1stspotter (Reply 31):
That is a nice amount of money I guess.



Quoting Tappan (Thread starter):
GREAT photo! important photo, artsy photo, beautiful photo, difficullt photo, VERY unique photo

EUR 1250 would be more appropriate for stealing a photo that unique. What a ripp-off.

F.
Jet Visuals
 
airlinelover
Posts: 5287
Joined: Thu Jun 07, 2001 8:03 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Sat Dec 17, 2005 6:19 am

Quoting Dehowie (Reply 22):
Maybe ANET management should get a little involved in this to help Ruben out.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! Thanks for a laugh, I needed it..

Kid's best bet is to file a lawsuit on it..

Chris
Lets do some sexy math. We add you, subtract your clothes, divide your legs and multiply
 
martin21
Posts: 335
Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2001 7:52 am

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Sat Dec 17, 2005 6:28 pm

First of all, "the telegraaf" is the biggest news paper
in Holland. So I am very disappointed that the steal
pictures while they have money enough.
They would have to shame !

The 125,- they are willing to pay is normal for a
photograph in a news paper, this is about the amount
that freelance photojournalist get for a picture.
But with all the trouble of not paying and not asking
permission I think that they should pay around
500-700 euro. And maybe a fee because it happens
more with this particular newspaper.

martin21
At 30.000 feet, the sun always shines !
 
tappan
Posts: 1478
Joined: Sat Oct 23, 1999 9:30 pm

RE: Look At This! Flaming Engine!

Sun Dec 18, 2005 8:09 am

TELL THEM that you will report them to World Press Photo and then see what they do....

Mark Garfinkel

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