DutchAir
Posts: 104
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2000 6:09 pm

Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:33 am

Hi all,

Got this e-mail this evening. I have no clue if this is a fair request or not.
Can someone advise me on this matter?  Confused Thanks, Miguel

Picture:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Miguel Snoep



E-mail:

> Mr. Snoep,
>
> In reference to the photographs taken by you of N145RD we are
> asking that these pictures be withdrawn. Our permission was not
> given and these photographs are in violation of our certificate of
> operation. The FAA contacted us and requested we remove the
> pictures. In addition to printing the pictures without our
> permission you have erroneous information as to ownership and
> operation.
> If you have questions you can contact me at.... We
> appreciate your prompt coopeation and attention to this matter.
>
> Respectfully,
>
>

[Edited 2005-11-23 21:37:28]
"People are assholes when flying"
 
dc10tim
Posts: 1380
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 12:21 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:43 am

Hi Miguel,

Why would the FAA ask them to remove it and not contact you or airliners.net? Also, why would the FAA want it removing in the first place?

You don't need their permission to take the plane's photo, but I would be interested as to why it is in violation of their certificate of operation.

I would email the editors asking them to correect any wrong information, but I would seriously question the accuracy of what else they've told you. Just seems a bit far fetched for my imagination, but I'd definately check it out.

Regards,

Tim.
Obviously missing something....
 
aviopic
Posts: 2423
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2004 7:52 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:45 am

If you don't want to trash your own windows I would have it removed Miguel.
You want to be welcome another time somewhere don't you ?

Willem
The truth lives in one’s mind, it doesn’t really exist
 
Fly747
Posts: 1361
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2005 9:03 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:47 am

Quoting DC10Tim (Reply 1):
Why would the FAA ask them to remove it and not contact you or airliners.net? Also, why would the FAA want it removing in the first place?

Exactly my thoughts. I would ask them a few questions first but like Tim says it sounds a little fishy.

Good luck,
Ivan
 
DutchAir
Posts: 104
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2000 6:09 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:53 am

Thanks so far guys!

It seems a little far fetched to me too. I just found out that this person is from a company called "Airway Transport" located in California City.

I'll ask him these questions and let's see what they have to say.  Smile

Regards, Miguel
"People are assholes when flying"
 
EGGD
Posts: 11880
Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2001 12:01 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 5:58 am

I wouldn't pull it yet, because to me this sounds like absolute rubbish. Having a photo of your aircraft in the public domain a violation of certificate of operation? I don't think so. Why don't you try and contact the FAA on the matter as well? I'm pretty sure they would have contacted you directly in the first place, what business is it of theirs to be on Airliners.net looking for photos of aircraft and reporting it to airlines anyway? To me it's all a bit fishy. Ask questions and get answers!

Cheers

Dan
 
Stealthz
Posts: 5549
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:43 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 6:01 am

It is up to you but provided you were not trespassing then I do not see the issue.

Quoting Dutchair (Thread starter):
you have erroneous information as to ownership and
> operation.

..and so does the FAA then- Their database matches your info.

I wonder if any of the other photogs with this A/c in the db have been contacted. Perhaps a personal email to one or two of them may clarify things.

Regards

Chris
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
 
waketurbulence
Posts: 1264
Joined: Sun Apr 18, 2004 12:33 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 6:02 am

Did the other 6 photographers of this a/c have permission to shoot it and put it on A.net?
-Matt
 
aviopic
Posts: 2423
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2004 7:52 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 6:15 am

Quoting EGGD (Reply 5):
I wouldn't pull it yet, because to me this sounds like absolute rubbish.

Rubbish or not is probably not the point.
The one speaking "rubbish" is probably the same you need to get access another time, I can guess his answer already.
Especially when published on a bulletin board, we are not the only ones reading this.
The truth lives in one’s mind, it doesn’t really exist
 
Devil505x
Posts: 220
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2003 3:55 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 6:17 am

Oh boy isn't that one of those CIA planes they have been using to ferry terrorists all over the world. Nice knowing you!  laughing 
 
visityyj
Posts: 380
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2000 7:23 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 6:53 am

The FAA register is probably not up-to-date, as this DC3TP has been in and around California City for a year or so. It does appear that Airway Transport may own or at least lease it, which may have caused the sender of the email to have a hissy-fit.

As for the FAA request, it's total nonsense, he's just making it up to try to intimidate you. Since the photo was taken at Mojave not California City, he also has no say in giving or denying access there.

Tell him to take a hike.
 
eadster
Posts: 2125
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 7:31 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 7:13 am

Sounds like there's a bit more to this than meets the eye. As was said its not illegal to take pictures of aircraft but it sounds dodgy that it has been asked to remove the picture. Maybe there is something in the comments that was mentioned that shouldn't have been...
 
dacman
Posts: 380
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2000 9:22 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 7:24 am

I got the same request today. I shoot on the ramp at MHV a number of times every year, in fact I was told I could take photos of the aircraft.

The info on the aircraft that I posted was taken from the FAA website, so I don't understand how it can be wrong either, very fishy to say the least.

It is highly unlikely the FAA to contacted the company, telling them the photos are in violation of their operating certificate, no such animal exists to my knowledge. I think it is just someone throwing their uninformed weight around.

I deleted the e-mail with no reply of course, matter over as far as I am concerned.

Mike
dacman
LGB/LAX Local
"Airliner Photography is not a crime"
 
Newark777
Posts: 8284
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:23 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:01 am

Unless you took the picture while you were on the man's property, he has nothing. My guess is that he doesn't want people to know that either he or the plane were there at that time.

Quoting Aviopic (Reply 2):
If you don't want to trash your own windows I would have it removed Miguel.
You want to be welcome another time somewhere don't you ?



Quoting Aviopic (Reply 8):
Rubbish or not is probably not the point.
The one speaking "rubbish" is probably the same you need to get access another time, I can guess his answer already.
Especially when published on a bulletin board, we are not the only ones reading this.

What in the world are you talking about? How do you know that the e-mail writer is the one who let him there in the first place?

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
visityyj
Posts: 380
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2000 7:23 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:06 am

Quoting Dacman (Reply 12):
It is highly unlikely the FAA to contacted the company, telling them the photos are in violation of their operating certificate,

Highly unlikely is putting it mildly. Ask him to forward you a copy of the FAA directive  butthead 
 
User avatar
clickhappy
Posts: 9042
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2001 12:10 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:16 am

a classic case of win the battle but lose the war.

Perhaps they have a valid reason for asking, perhaps they don't. But why risk it? Are you better off for having the photo online? Perhaps they raise a big stink to the airport, or whoevers 'property' you were on, and next time you go back you are not welcomed.

For some reason they don't want pictures of the aircraft online, so why fight it? You will only make things worse for yourself, and your fellow spotters, in the long run. There is nothing to gain by leaving it up, but there sure is a lot to lose!
 
viv
Posts: 2953
Joined: Tue May 31, 2005 5:17 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:18 am

Leave it where it is. Do not be intimidated by unfounded threats.
Nikon D700, Nikkor 80-400, Fuji X Pro 1, Fujinon 35 f/1.4, Fujinon 18 f/2
 
YANQUI67
Posts: 358
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 2:57 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:29 am

Oh my, a DC-3 with Turboprops, what has the world come to?
 
F9Widebody
Posts: 1475
Joined: Thu Sep 18, 2003 5:47 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:30 am

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 15):
Perhaps they have a valid reason for asking, perhaps they don't. But why risk it? Are you better off for having the photo online? Perhaps they raise a big stink to the airport, or whoevers 'property' you were on, and next time you go back you are not welcomed.

For some reason they don't want pictures of the aircraft online, so why fight it? You will only make things worse for yourself, and your fellow spotters, in the long run. There is nothing to gain by leaving it up, but there sure is a lot to lose!

 checkmark 
YES URLS in signature!!!
 
dacman
Posts: 380
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2000 9:22 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:39 am

Royal,

They are e-mailing everyone that has a photo of the aircraft with the same request, it is rubbish to be sure.

I was given permission by the airport staff and the folks in the hanger where the aircraft was parked to photograph her, so in my book it stays.

I don't cave to these kind of folks with baseless requests. Next AA, UA, WN, and F9 will want all the photos of their aircraft removed from A.Net for some idiotic reason and if we did there would be no A.Net or any other airliner photo site.

Just my humble opinion.

Mike
dacman
LGB/LAX Local
"Airliner Photography is not a crime"
 
eadster
Posts: 2125
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 7:31 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:42 am

Yep I agree. It may be a legit email but then again it may not.

Why worry about it? Just get the shot taken down. Snap something better to replace it. Then whoever it is has nothing on you.
 
aviopic
Posts: 2423
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2004 7:52 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 8:44 am

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 13):
What in the world are you talking about? How do you know that the e-mail writer is the one who let him there in the first place?

Take it easy mate, it's just a matter of common sense.
Who cares about a DC3 without radial engines anyway ?

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 15):
a classic case of win the battle but lose the war.

 checkmark 

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 15):
Perhaps they have a valid reason for asking, perhaps they don't. But why risk it? Are you better off for having the photo online? Perhaps they raise a big stink to the airport, or whoevers 'property' you were on, and next time you go back you are not welcomed.

 checkmark 

It's just how I get access to places where others don't.
It's a well meant advice, nothing more.

Willem
The truth lives in one’s mind, it doesn’t really exist
 
DutchAir
Posts: 104
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2000 6:09 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 9:02 am

Okay, I've sent him a stupid message that I didn't understand him and here's the reply:

>Mr. Snoep: The pictures were shown on airliners.com and had your name as
>photographer. Our plane is a DC3-TP. If you keep the picture on line
>please just remove any information other basic such as register owner, tail,
>etc. Thank you......

So no FAA, CIA or any other government agency involved  relieved  Big grin
Just an owner who probably didn't like it to see his plane linked to the South African Air Force (or something like that).

Maybe I'll send in a correction... maybe not!
Thanks all for the replies; case closed  Smile

Miguel
"People are assholes when flying"
 
Lurch
Posts: 721
Joined: Mon Jul 21, 2008 11:54 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 9:06 am

This is from the FAA N Number site

FAA Registry
N-Number Inquiry Results


N145RD is Assigned


Assigned/Registered Aircraft

Aircraft Description

Serial Number 20175 Type Registration Corporation
Manufacturer Name DOUGLAS Certificate Issue Date 11/05/2002
Model DC3 Status Valid
Type Aircraft Fixed Wing Multi-Engine Type Engine Turbo-Prop
Pending Number Change None Dealer No
Date Change Authorized None Mode S Code 50133276
MFR Year 1942 Fractional Owner NO


---------------------------------------------------------------------------
Registered Owner

Name BAJA AIR INC
Street 2260 S XANADU WAY STE 340
City AURORA State COLORADO Zip Code 80014-6516
County ARAPAHOE
Country UNITED STATES

Airworthiness



Engine Manufacturer P&W Classification Standard
Engine Model PT6A SERIES Category Transport

A/W Date 05/19/1999

I hope its usfull to you!
 
dc10tim
Posts: 1380
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 12:21 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 9:44 am

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 13):
My guess is that he doesn't want people to know that either he or the plane were there at that time.



Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 15):
Perhaps they have a valid reason for asking, perhaps they don't. But why risk it? Are you better off for having the photo online? Perhaps they raise a big stink to the airport, or whoevers 'property' you were on, and next time you go back you are not welcomed.

It turns out it was a load of bull after all, as I suspected. My response to both points raised would be that wouldn't it have been better (and perhaps a more successful outcome for the owners) to just have emailed Miguel and said basically "look, you have a photo of our plane on a.net, but we don't wish to be publicized in such a way, can you remove it?" It would have saved all the hassle.

Regards,

Tim.
Obviously missing something....
 
skywatch
Posts: 851
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 11:36 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 10:56 am

Yep, they are really concerned about their privacy! They haven't even blocked it from flight tracking sites! Big grin

Information as of 11/21/2005 6:14:43 AM GMT
FlightID: N145RD (General Aviation Piston)
Status: TIMEOUT (What does this mean?)
Owner: BAJA AIR INC
Type: DC3 (McDonnell-Douglas Skytrain)
Origin Apt: SDM BROWN FIELD MUNI
Dest Apt: LVK LIVERMORE MUNI
Departed: 06:48 PM PST (0248Z)
Original ETA: 09:18 PM PST (0518Z)

If I wanted to, I could pay a little extra (24.95/mo) to fboweb.com and bring up a list of all of his IFR flights since 11/13/01. Each flight you click on contains a minute-by-minute chart showing the aircraft's exact coordinates, altitude, and speed. I guess they need to do some research on that! I find it kinda hilarious that they overlooked that. Very interesting that they would email you over something that trivial....are they going to ask the FAA to take the ownership info off of their website?! If you own an aircraft, and especially if you fly it IFR, you have to boot privacy out the window..for the most-part. A very interesting petition to say the least. Great photo BTW.

---Skywatch
------Forever Watchin' The Sky------
 
USAFHummer
Posts: 10261
Joined: Thu May 18, 2000 12:22 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 11:21 am

Chief A.net college football stadium self-pic guru
 
maiznblu_757
Posts: 4952
Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2002 12:05 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 2:43 pm

Quoting Skywatch (Reply 25):
If I wanted to, I could pay a little extra (24.95/mo) to fboweb.com and bring up a list of all of his IFR flights since 11/13/01

Here is a list of the 1000 most recent IFR flights for this aircraft/FlightID:
Ident Type Dept Dest Departure Time (GMT)
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 10/24/2005 2:48:26 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM BUR 10/17/2005 1:14:28 AM
N145RD DC3 PXN L71 10/3/2005 4:48:43 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/3/2005 1:47:58 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK 10/1/2005 3:39:35 PM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 8/25/2005 3:20:21 PM
N145RD DC3 LVK ECA 8/18/2005 3:39:18 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 7/25/2005 12:54:01 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 7/11/2005 12:34:08 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM MZB 6/13/2005 1:56:29 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM MZB 6/6/2005 1:43:42 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK L71 5/16/2005 5:28:15 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK ECA 5/7/2005 3:29:52 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 5/2/2005 1:56:09 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK BFL 4/23/2005 3:31:54 PM
N145RD DC3 L71 LVK 4/22/2005 10:26:44 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 4/18/2005 1:52:52 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 4/16/2005 3:29:10 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 4/4/2005 2:13:17 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 3/14/2005 2:41:00 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 3/12/2005 4:33:50 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 3/7/2005 2:25:22 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK IPL 2/19/2005 8:10:14 PM
N145RD DC3T L71 LVK 2/18/2005 11:46:08 PM
N145RD DC3T LVK BFL 2/14/2005 6:15:35 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 2/14/2005 2:53:08 AM
N145RD DC3T L71 LVK 2/12/2005 12:24:07 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 2/7/2005 2:42:18 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 2/5/2005 4:29:15 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 1/31/2005 2:27:11 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK ECA 1/22/2005 4:43:15 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM MZB 12/13/2004 1:51:55 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 12/11/2004 4:51:16 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 12/6/2004 7:36:12 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 11/15/2004 1:56:34 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 11/1/2004 2:21:04 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/25/2004 1:58:21 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/18/2004 4:03:00 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/11/2004 2:26:07 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK MZB 10/9/2004 3:26:02 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/4/2004 1:50:29 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 9/27/2004 1:57:49 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/30/2004 2:09:58 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 8/21/2004 3:26:26 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/16/2004 2:21:41 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK MZB 8/14/2004 3:19:39 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 8/9/2004 1:43:14 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/2/2004 2:02:46 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 7/31/2004 3:35:17 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 7/26/2004 2:01:48 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK MZB 7/24/2004 3:50:42 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 7/12/2004 1:53:17 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 6/28/2004 1:52:12 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 6/21/2004 2:27:59 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK SDM 6/19/2004 3:20:37 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 6/15/2004 1:15:27 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 6/14/2004 2:04:30 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 6/12/2004 3:06:50 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 6/7/2004 2:18:41 AM
N145RD DC3 SAN L71 5/27/2004 4:15:23 AM
N145RD DC3 SAN 5/27/2004 2:51:05 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 5/24/2004 2:20:55 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK 5/22/2004 3:39:10 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 5/17/2004 1:58:50 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 5/10/2004 2:07:07 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 5/3/2004 1:53:58 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 4/26/2004 2:19:01 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 4/19/2004 1:57:31 AM
N145RD DC3 MMSF 4/17/2004 4:54:55 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 4/5/2004 1:41:40 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 3/29/2004 2:34:37 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 3/27/2004 4:34:50 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 3/15/2004 2:28:28 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 3/8/2004 2:27:42 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 2/16/2004 2:28:55 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 2/9/2004 2:32:12 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK L71 2/2/2004 5:13:13 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 2/2/2004 1:53:14 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 1/26/2004 2:14:10 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK MZB 1/24/2004 4:43:48 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 12/15/2003 1:50:25 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK MZB 12/13/2003 4:33:45 PM
N145RD DC3 TTE LVK 12/13/2003 1:56:50 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK MZB 12/6/2003 4:21:09 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 11/24/2003 2:24:27 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 11/17/2003 3:11:00 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK MMSF 11/15/2003 4:59:27 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 11/10/2003 5:17:36 PM
N145RD DC3 LVK MZB 11/8/2003 4:15:51 PM
N145RD DC3 EHF LVK 11/7/2003 10:50:06 PM
N145RD DC3 LVK BFL 11/3/2003 5:40:02 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 11/3/2003 2:24:59 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/20/2003 1:49:06 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/13/2003 2:04:12 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/6/2003 2:18:10 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 9/29/2003 2:00:23 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK 9/27/2003 3:23:11 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 9/22/2003 1:28:41 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 9/8/2003 1:54:56 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/25/2003 1:41:56 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/18/2003 1:49:54 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 8/11/2003 2:10:47 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/4/2003 2:03:11 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK MZB 8/2/2003 3:27:10 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 7/28/2003 1:26:23 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 7/21/2003 1:57:49 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 7/14/2003 2:24:00 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 6/30/2003 1:53:52 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 6/23/2003 1:31:39 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 6/16/2003 1:39:18 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 6/9/2003 1:50:22 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 6/2/2003 1:24:17 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 5/19/2003 1:27:21 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 5/12/2003 1:44:10 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 5/5/2003 1:44:38 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK MMML 5/3/2003 3:45:41 PM
N145RD DC3T EHF LVK 5/2/2003 9:05:44 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 4/28/2003 2:10:06 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK BFL 4/14/2003 4:20:31 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 4/14/2003 1:43:51 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK MZB 4/12/2003 3:38:07 PM
N145RD DC3T LVK MZB 4/12/2003 3:32:31 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 4/7/2003 1:10:04 AM
N145RD DC3 WJF PMD 4/2/2003 8:12:14 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 3/31/2003 2:43:18 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 3/24/2003 2:16:08 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK OAK 3/22/2003 4:32:02 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 3/10/2003 2:43:27 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 3/8/2003 4:08:33 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM VNY 3/7/2003 12:01:28 AM
N145RD DCT3 SMO WJF 3/4/2003 1:28:10 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM SMO 3/3/2003 11:28:25 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 3/3/2003 2:37:37 AM
N145RD DC3T SMO MMCN 2/27/2003 7:12:43 PM
N145RD DC3 PMD SMO 2/26/2003 11:15:14 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 2/24/2003 2:33:00 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 2/17/2003 2:37:07 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK SDM 2/15/2003 4:29:53 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 2/10/2003 2:19:05 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 2/3/2003 2:32:28 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK ECA 2/1/2003 4:20:53 PM
N145RD DC3 LVK 1/20/2003 5:54:09 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 1/20/2003 2:24:54 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK 1/18/2003 4:40:57 PM
N145RD DC3T SJC SNA 12/27/2002 4:57:22 PM
N145RD DC3T EHF SJC 12/26/2002 10:29:00 PM
N145RD DC3 SCK BFL 12/16/2002 7:08:00 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 12/16/2002 3:19:31 AM
N145RD DC3T LVK SDM 12/14/2002 4:34:17 PM
N145RD DC3T EHF LVK 12/13/2002 10:44:47 PM
N145RD DC3 LVK 12/9/2002 5:57:32 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 12/9/2002 2:42:40 AM
N145RD DC3 EHF LVK 12/7/2002 1:17:25 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 12/2/2002 2:41:07 AM
N145RD DC3 PMD LVK 11/30/2002 2:31:25 PM
N145RD DC3 PMD LVK 11/30/2002 2:24:34 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 11/25/2002 2:27:17 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK 11/23/2002 4:25:26 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 11/18/2002 2:49:22 AM
N145RD DC3 TCY HWD 11/16/2002 3:38:17 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 11/11/2002 2:42:28 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK SDM 11/9/2002 5:32:02 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 11/4/2002 2:45:19 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/28/2002 2:53:29 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK MZB 10/26/2002 3:34:44 PM
N145RD DC3 L71 LVK 10/25/2002 11:50:47 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/21/2002 2:15:20 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM LVK 10/14/2002 1:48:17 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 10/7/2002 1:49:11 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 9/9/2002 1:35:41 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM PMD 9/5/2002 2:34:40 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/26/2002 1:18:50 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK 8/24/2002 3:44:08 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/19/2002 1:07:02 AM
N145RD DC3 LVK 8/17/2002 3:39:22 PM
N145RD DC3 OJC GCK 8/16/2002 12:15:11 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/12/2002 1:15:35 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 8/5/2002 1:49:02 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM LVK 7/29/2002 1:46:29 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM HWD 7/22/2002 1:53:17 AM
N145RD DC3 HWD SCK 7/20/2002 3:16:59 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 7/15/2002 1:26:16 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 7/13/2002 3:10:50 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 7/1/2002 1:42:48 AM
N145RD DC3 HWD SCK 6/29/2002 3:16:42 PM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 6/24/2002 4:08:32 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 6/24/2002 12:59:27 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM L71 6/21/2002 6:29:24 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM HWD 6/17/2002 2:08:56 AM
N145RD DC3 HWD OTPJ 6/15/2002 3:14:43 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 6/10/2002 1:04:15 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 6/3/2002 5:25:33 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 6/3/2002 1:47:58 AM
N145RD CT3 HWD BFL 6/1/2002 3:20:24 PM
N145RD DC3T HWD BFL 5/20/2002 6:19:18 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM HWD 5/20/2002 1:27:39 AM
N145RD DC3 HWD SCK 5/18/2002 3:16:30 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 5/13/2002 2:03:33 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 5/11/2002 3:23:16 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 5/6/2002 1:08:52 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 5/4/2002 3:07:26 PM
N145RD DC3 HWD L71 4/29/2002 4:49:13 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM HWD 4/29/2002 1:32:58 AM
N145RD DC3 HWD SCK 4/27/2002 4:13:48 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 4/22/2002 1:54:35 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 4/20/2002 3:55:15 PM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 4/15/2002 4:38:56 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 4/15/2002 1:24:20 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 4/13/2002 3:34:10 PM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 4/8/2002 6:18:33 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 4/8/2002 2:28:38 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 4/6/2002 4:39:11 PM
N145RD DC3 SMO OTN 3/31/2002 11:25:37 PM
N145RD DC3 SDM SMO 3/30/2002 3:10:14 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM MZB 3/27/2002 8:25:08 PM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 3/18/2002 8:32:39 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 3/18/2002 4:57:59 PM
N145RD DC3T HWD SDM 3/16/2002 4:18:45 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM PMD 3/14/2002 8:22:39 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM MZB 3/13/2002 4:13:23 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 3/11/2002 2:55:35 AM
N145RD DC3 HWD BFL 3/9/2002 4:11:57 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM PMD 3/6/2002 1:22:32 AM
N145RD DC3 HWD SCK 2/25/2002 6:21:08 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM HWD 2/25/2002 2:46:31 AM
N145RD DC3 HWD BFL 2/23/2002 4:20:13 PM
N145RD DC3 NLC HWD 2/23/2002 1:29:59 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM PMD 2/22/2002 3:23:48 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD BFL 2/18/2002 6:29:37 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 2/18/2002 3:34:05 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 2/16/2002 4:14:02 PM
N145RD DC3T EHF HWD 2/16/2002 2:35:19 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM SLI 2/15/2002 1:16:17 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM SMX 2/5/2002 8:36:25 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM MMHO 1/4/2002 6:36:13 AM
N145RD DC3T SJC BFL 1/2/2002 1:16:04 AM
N145RD DC3T SJC BFL 12/27/2001 4:56:18 PM
N145RD DC3T HWD BFL 12/17/2001 6:15:25 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 12/17/2001 2:44:18 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 12/15/2001 6:28:36 PM
N145RD DC3T HWD BFL 12/10/2001 5:59:26 AM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 12/10/2001 2:46:49 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 12/8/2001 4:29:10 PM
N145RD DC3 HWD BFL 12/3/2001 8:36:46 PM
N145RD DC3T SDM HWD 12/3/2001 2:50:15 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD BFL 12/1/2001 6:34:45 PM
N145RD DC3T EHF HWD 12/1/2001 4:11:40 PM
N145RD DC3 HWD SCK 11/19/2001 5:58:26 AM
N145RD DC3 SDM HWD 11/19/2001 2:45:10 AM
N145RD DC3T HWD SCK 11/17/2001 4:33:36 PM
1


VFR flight activity matches...
Ident Ctr When (GMT)
N145RD KSCT 6/13/2005 12:44:38 AM
N145RD KNCT 6/11/2005 3:17:54 PM
N145RD KNCT 3/5/2005 5:50:31 PM
N145RD KSCT 11/22/2004 12:45:08 AM
N145RD KSCT 6/12/2004 1:19:56 PM
N145RD KSCT 6/7/2004 12:56:59 AM
N145RD KSCT 5/25/2004 2:59:37 AM
N145RD KSCT 1/26/2004 12:59:18 AM
N145RD KSCT 12/15/2003 12:32:30 AM
N145RD KSCT 11/3/2003 12:59:37 AM
N145RD KSCT 6/23/2003 12:32:40 AM
N145RD KSCT 2/24/2003 1:18:39 AM
N145RD KSCT 12/27/2002 7:40:02 PM
N145RD KSCT 12/9/2002 1:28:22 AM
N145RD KSCT 11/4/2002 1:34:54 AM
N145RD KSCT 10/28/2002 1:37:58 AM
N145RD KSCT 10/14/2002 12:19:57 AM
N145RD KZAB 9/10/2002 6:54:47 PM
N145RD KSCT 9/2/2002 1:01:35 AM
N145RD KSCT 8/31/2002 6:24:16 PM
N145RD KSCT 8/19/2002 12:00:35 AM
N145RD KSCT 6/1/2002 5:01:21 PM
N145RD KSCT 5/20/2002 12:17:35 AM
N145RD KZLA 5/6/2002 4:55:07 AM
N145RD KSCT 4/8/2002 1:01:56 AM
N145RD KSCT 2/18/2002 2:07:49 AM
N145RD KZOA 11/17/2001 4:41:40 PM
 
eadster
Posts: 2125
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 7:31 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:00 pm

Come on guys, Why is it so hard? The guy has asked a simple question. It can be done, why take things this far? They've stated that its fine to keep the pic in the DB, just remove some of the info.

I know that every little detail on the aircraft can be found but lets just respect other folks wishes yeah?
 
skywatch
Posts: 851
Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 11:36 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 3:12 pm

Quoting Eadster (Reply 28):
I know that every little detail on the aircraft can be found but lets just respect other folks wishes yeah?

Yep. It's a good picture, and if a little info has to go, then so be it. It still seems like a stupid request, but hey, they own the plane! Of course, the final decision is up to Dutchair. As for every little detail about the plane and its last 1000 flights...that's just us crazy nerds showing off our flight tracking skills!  Wink I wonder if the owners have contacted other sites that have the aircraft's picture and reg on them? It would be interesting to know if they are really digging deep with this, or are just hitting the most-viewed sites.

Happy Thanksgiving!
----Skywatch
------Forever Watchin' The Sky------
 
Invader
Posts: 289
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2000 7:41 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Thu Nov 24, 2005 7:11 pm

In general, I recommend to never remove pictures by order of owners of aircraft as long as you haven't been trespassing. There have been other cases where owners insist that you have to ask them for permission to photograph or publish pictures of their property, even going so far to state that you have to ask permission from EVERY owner of an aircraft that you photograph. Then you better stop photographing alltogether! And when it is not for ownership then they start querying the photography of "trademarked" items, like the design of airline colour schemes or logos!

By giving in to these requests (orders) you make it worse for other photographers because those guys will note that they can be succesful with these requests and the end will be that you have to pay for publishing a picture of an item on which they claim they have the rights!

In this case of N145RD they were probably doing something not in compliance with FAA rules. Well, if that is the case they will have to be more careful in future, but they can't blame the photographer for highlighting this!

Peter Vercruijsse
Chief Database Editor
 
Devil505x
Posts: 220
Joined: Sat Dec 20, 2003 3:55 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:20 am

Quoting Eadster (Reply 28):
Come on guys, Why is it so hard? The guy has asked a simple question. It can be done, why take things this far? They've stated that its fine to keep the pic in the DB, just remove some of the info.

I know that every little detail on the aircraft can be found but lets just respect other folks wishes yeah?

Are you kidding?
 
visityyj
Posts: 380
Joined: Sat Jun 24, 2000 7:23 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:51 am

Quoting DutchAir (Reply 22):
Okay, I've sent him a stupid message that I didn't understand him and here's the reply:

>Mr. Snoep: The pictures were shown on airliners.com and had your name as
>photographer. Our plane is a DC3-TP. If you keep the picture on line
>please just remove any information other basic such as register owner, tail,
>etc. Thank you......

So no FAA, CIA or any other government agency involved
Just an owner who probably didn't like it to see his plane linked to the South African Air Force (or something like that).

I think you've hit the nail on the head. If he's happy about the basics, including ownership, being reported then it must be the plane's history that upset him. Can't imagine why, but I think it's a reasonable request to remove it. If he'd said that to start with instead of making up some BS about the FAA, it wouldn't have been a big deal at all.

Or perhaps he doesn't want the location shown, but then why would a short flight to MHV be any kind of a secret ?
 
jetav8r
Posts: 282
Joined: Fri Jul 02, 2004 4:01 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 3:20 am

Maybe one of the pilot's took the plane on a joy ride that the boss didn't know about biggrin 
 
User avatar
clickhappy
Posts: 9042
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2001 12:10 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 3:27 am

This thread highlights the two groups that dominate out hobby; Those who think taking pictures of airplanes is a privelege, and those that think it is a right.
 
dc10tim
Posts: 1380
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 12:21 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 3:53 am

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 34):
This thread highlights the two groups that dominate out hobby; Those who think taking pictures of airplanes is a privelege, and those that think it is a right.

Would you have removed the photo Royal, had you received that email? Seriously, if so then why?

Tim.
Obviously missing something....
 
eadster
Posts: 2125
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 7:31 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 5:30 am

Quoting Devil505x (Reply 31):
Are you kidding?

Why not? So you'd rather have people think of A.Net users as a bunch of uncooprative  butthead  holes?

In my eyes, change the info as requested, pic stays, owners happy, A.Net cooprative, case closed.
 
User avatar
clickhappy
Posts: 9042
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2001 12:10 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 5:45 am

Yes, I would have removed it. In fact I have been in this EXACT position before, and I typed up a really nasty email, but never sent it. I did send an email saying that I took the picture down, three days later they invited me out to see the plane and go for a ride. The experience was way more exciting than having a picture on a website, but your mileage may vary.
 
Newark777
Posts: 8284
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:23 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 5:50 am

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 34):
This thread highlights the two groups that dominate out hobby; Those who think taking pictures of airplanes is a privelege, and those that think it is a right.

And those who know the owner of the aircraft has no right to have the photo removed. Period.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
User avatar
clickhappy
Posts: 9042
Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2001 12:10 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:03 am

Harry, I see that you are "16-20" years old. When you grow up you will learn that life is a lot more complicated than being "right."

Like I said, win the battle, lose the war. Old-timers and those with common sense know what I am talking about. People like you don't.
 
User avatar
JeffM
Posts: 7569
Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 3:32 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 6:17 am

Quoting Newark777 (Reply 38):
And those who know the owner of the aircraft has no right to have the photo removed. Period.

Hardly Harry, you have a lot to learn if you think that scenario is cut and dried. There are plenty of situations where the owner is well within their rights to do what they did. But, you don't seem to understand as Royal rightly mentioned. Look at the "big picture" more, it's amazing what you'll see.

Your attitude will be something that holds you back if you keep it as is.
 
ChrisH
Posts: 1120
Joined: Mon Jul 26, 2004 4:25 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 7:18 am

I think you should e-mail him back with a friendly tone, ask what's up basically. Perhaps if you're lucky you'll get a ride like Clickhappy did.

Quoting JeffM (Reply 40):
Your attitude will be something that holds you back if you keep it as is.

You're dispensing attitude advice?  alert 
what seems to be the officer, problem?
 
User avatar
JeffM
Posts: 7569
Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 3:32 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 8:26 am

Quoting ChrisH (Reply 41):
You're dispensing attitude advice?

Absolutely. You got a problem with that?
 
dc10tim
Posts: 1380
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 12:21 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 10:22 am

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 37):
Yes, I would have removed it. In fact I have been in this EXACT position before, and I typed up a really nasty email, but never sent it. I did send an email saying that I took the picture down, three days later they invited me out to see the plane and go for a ride. The experience was way more exciting than having a picture on a website, but your mileage may vary.

That's fair enough, and as I say, it was a serious question, not a leading one. I haven't been in exactly the same position, but have been asked by an airline to remove comments (that were accurate btw) and done so, simply as it seemed easier than getting into a dispute with them, for the sake of a few people reading what basically amounted to gossip. I really don't however, warm to how in this instance the owners made up a load of crap to try and bully the photographer into removing the photo. It would have really annoyed me and I'd have probably left it there in principle. Dialogue is always best  Smile

Amazingly, I find myself agreeing with Jeff. Not always, but sometimes, it pays as we say, "to know on which side your bread is buttered". In other words, though you may dislike something, you go along with it to benefit in the long run.

Regards,

Tim.
Obviously missing something....
 
User avatar
jumbojim747
Posts: 2426
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 8:05 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 10:28 am

I think remove it .
For the simple reason to not put this sort of chance in the future in jeopardy.
If i was asked to delete one of my pics i would do so and not ruin my chances in the future.
Just my opinion
On a wing and a prayer
 
aeroweanie
Posts: 1577
Joined: Fri Dec 03, 2004 9:33 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 1:38 pm

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 39):
Harry, I see that you are "16-20" years old. When you grow up you will learn that life is a lot more complicated than being "right."

Clickhappy, I am 48 years old and agree with Harry. The owners of the airplane are totally out of bounds claiming that the photographers need their permission to post pictures of an airplane taken in a public place. Boundaries need to be set - thats a life in lesson I've learned. If they instead had asked nicely, it might have been different. Instead, they caught by the FAA, I'd guess for operating for hire with out the correct certificates and their response was to blame the photographers. Thats like blaming the witnesses for reporting a crime. You aren't going to get a free ride from them...

[Edited 2005-11-25 05:41:57]
 
fsgay
Posts: 23
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 9:49 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 2:41 pm

Just saw this thread, and went back and checked my email, and, sure enough, I got the same request. Interestingly, if the information on the aircraft's flight history from Maiznblu_757 doesn't include anything matching the location, time, and date on which my pic was taken (about 7:45 PM PDT on July 9, 2005 at KLVK - Livermore Municipal). Could have been a VFR flight where they just didn't contact NorCal Center, I suppose, but it does seem a bit odd. In any case, I think I'll sleep on it.

Dutchair, did you have any communications with them after the email in which the person described (in fairly sub-standard English, I might add) that they just wanted any info not related to the basic aircraft identification removed?
Contact Light!
 
DutchAir
Posts: 104
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2000 6:09 pm

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Fri Nov 25, 2005 9:15 pm

Quoting Fsgay (Reply 46):
Dutchair, did you have any communications with them after the email in which the person described (in fairly sub-standard English, I might add) that they just wanted any info not related to the basic aircraft identification removed?

Frederick,

I didn't reply to his last message. I've sent in a correction yesterday and for me this case is closed now. I don't see any reason why this picture should be removed. He left up the decision to me, and just asked to remove to remark. That's what I did.
"People are assholes when flying"
 
Key
Posts: 93
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 10:35 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:48 am

Quoting Clickhappy (Reply 39):
life is a lot more complicated than being "right."

Obviously true. But standing up for a right, even at cost to yourself, is a high value in life and found more with youth than others.
While your overall assessment of the situation may be right on, it goes a bit far to conclude together with Jeff that Harry has no common sense and an attitude problem, just because he states something that is factually right in 99% of the cases...

Let's help each other and learn from each other, without looking down on someone.

Thanks,
Erik
 
User avatar
JeffM
Posts: 7569
Joined: Sat May 07, 2005 3:32 am

RE: Should I Remove This Picture?

Sat Nov 26, 2005 1:21 am

Quoting Key (Reply 48):
But standing up for a right, even at cost to yourself, is a high value in life and found more with youth than others.


What kind of BS is that?

Quoting Key (Reply 48):
it goes a bit far to conclude together with Jeff that Harry has no common sense

You are stretching things a bit here, I did not say or imply Harry did not have common sense. I'm not sure why you say this, you've missed something in the translation...Re-read the remarks, hopefully you'll see the difference.

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