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Fiveholer
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What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:13 am

Hey guys,

I just got a couple of badinfo rejects. Which is basically my most hated one. Why? Because with out a message, you have no idea where you screwed up.
Anyway, I took these at the Tulsa Air and Space Museum which is on airport property. Here are the shots and the info I uploaded them with.

http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/rejections/big/N5710TASM112205.jpg

USA - Navy
Bell 47K
Bell 47

Tulsa - International (Municipal) (TUL / KTUL)
USA - Oklahoma, November 2005

Reg: N5710
Code:
Cn:
Tulsa Air & Space Museum. [Canon 20D]

Categories: MILITARY,HELICOPTER,PRESERVED

http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/r...jections/big/101AcesTASM112205.jpg

USA - Navy
Grumman F-14A Tomcat
Grumman F-14 Tomcat

Tulsa - International (Municipal) (TUL / KTUL)
USA - Oklahoma, November 2005

Reg: AJ-101
Code:
Cn: 164341
"Black Aces" Tulsa Air & Space Museum. [Canon 20D]

Categories: MILITARY,PRESERVED

Edit: Crap, just realized, the Bell is civil reg'd so maybe Military was the wrong category, but I am still lost on the F-14

Thanks,
Danny

[Edited 2005-11-29 03:14:22]
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spartan13
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Tue Nov 29, 2005 12:12 pm

Danny I really like that angle on the Tomcat.
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Fiveholer
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:47 pm

Screeners? Anyone? Bueller??? Big grin

Danny
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JeffM
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:54 pm

The registration and cn are wrong on the Tomcat. Replace it with the buno. 101 is the modex or 'side number'.

I'm thinking you may have other problems with the shot.
 
viv
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:54 pm

You need to include the military codes, as well as the civil registration.
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Fiveholer
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Tue Nov 29, 2005 11:57 pm

The reg I got for the Tomcat was what I found for it digging around the site. I had done google searches as well. It was a tough one to find. What other problems MAY I have with the shot? Also, what is buno? There was no civil reg on the Tomcat.

Danny
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viv
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:09 am

I was referring to the Bell 47.

"buno" = Build number".
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viv
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:10 am

Any former miltary aircraft carrying a civil registration is not "military", but "warbird".
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willo
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:13 am

A read of this topic may give some clues as to the correct categories. The first should probably be a "warbird" if it has a civil registration.
 
viv
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:13 am

For me, the Tomcat is "bad motive" because of the person in the shot.
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Rotate
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:19 am

Quoting JeffM (Reply 3):
I'm thinking you may have other problems with the shot.



Quoting Viv (Reply 9):
For me, the Tomcat is "bad motive" because of the person in the shot.

same here .....


Robin
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:33 am

Quoting JeffM (Reply 3):
I'm thinking you may have other problems with the shot.



Quoting Rotate (Reply 10):
same here .....

Why not share your thoughts?

Quoting Viv (Reply 9):
For me, the Tomcat is "bad motive" because of the person in the shot.

If anything that would be NOA_people. The plane is unobstructed so no NOA_motiv here.

As for the info. For the Tomcat the reg is painted on the rear end of the acft (not visible in your shot), at least I think so.
The helicopter I dont know. I leave shots where I am not sure about this to the more experienced screeners.
-
 
viv
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:35 am

The helicopter has a civil reg.

You are right about "NOA people", sorry.
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Rotate
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 1:06 am

Quoting PUnmuth@VIE (Reply 11):
Quoting JeffM (Reply 3):
I'm thinking you may have other problems with the shot.



Quoting Rotate (Reply 10):
same here .....

Why not share your thoughts?

Quoting Viv (Reply 9):
For me, the Tomcat is "bad motive" because of the person in the shot.

If anything that would be NOA_people. The plane is unobstructed so no NOA_motiv here.

well that was, what I was trying to say .... , I will be more precise in the future !!!

Robin
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JeffM
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 2:03 am

Quoting Viv (Reply 6):
"buno" = Build number".

Buno = Bureau Number

www.history.navy.mil/avh-1910/APP09.PDF

Navy and Marine Corps aircraft are procured by the Navy, so they use Navy Bureau Numbers. A Bureau Number is assigned to an aircraft when it is initially ordered, not when it is actually delivered to the Navy.

As to the Modex, carrier-based fighter squadrons typically have three-digit side numbers 1XX 2XX, or 3XX. Though the 1, 2, or 3, is not always included, but is rare. Usually, the squadron CO's plane is numbered 101 or 201, etc, the executive officer's plane 102 or 202, etc, and subsequent planes numbered in order of pilot seniority. 100, 200, or 300 is used to represent the CAG's (Commander of Air Group) plane.

Quoting PUnmuth@VIE (Reply 11):
Why not share your thoughts?

I did, Thought the people would be obvious.
 
viv
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 2:36 am

Quoting JeffM (Reply 14):
Buno = Bureau Number

Quite right, my mistake.
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LeanOfPeak
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 11:43 am

The civil reg for the Bell (Which is correct) means it'll need to be WARBIRD instead of MILITARY and Untitled instead of USA - Navy.

The F-14 has a little bit of info-swapping going on. The Bureau Number is considered to be the Reg. AJ-101 is the Code. The CN is the manufacturer's serial number, 616/D-21, not the BuNo. And it's an F-14D.
 
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Fiveholer
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 11:48 am

Ok, thanks a lot guys! I realize now how I should have uploaded the Bell with WARBIRD. So, for the F14, what exactly is the reg? I realize there is a person in the shot, but so is there in a shot that I have from a week ago, also standing right behind an aircraft. So if I get the correct reg. I will risk a rejection on the F14 again. Thanks for the help guys.

Danny
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JeffM
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 12:49 pm

Quoting LeanOfPeak (Reply 16):
And it's an F-14D.

With F-14A P&W TF-30-P-414A enginges? Look again. Strange, those are "A" model engines, I've never seen a "D" with downgraded TF-30's. Even the F-14B's had the GE F-110-GE-400's.

I think Danny may have the wrong BuNo, or the one painted on the side is false.

If this is 164341, some interesting info on it. On Nov. 6, 2002 this F-14 took off from NAS Fallon with a VIP in the back seat - a Naval officer from the cruiser Anzio who was on "FAM Hop". In flight, when the pilot pulled a "negative 1g," the gravity force moved him off his seat. He reached down to reposition himself and accidentally pulled the ejection lever. The cockpit canopy flew off and out went the VIP. The ejection seat automatically opened his chute. He landed safely in the desert and was "rescued". The Pilot had a windy return to base.
 
LeanOfPeak
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 4:33 pm

JeffM, you are exactly right (That's what I get for taking the BuNo given at face value). It's not 164341. It IS an F-14A, 161598 being the identity that seems to hold up to scrutiny (That's the BuNo, which is what goes in the reg field unless 164341 was actually painted on the aircraft). Code AJ-101, CN 457.

Quite a story on 164341, though.
 
viv
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 6:24 pm

Quoting JeffM (Reply 18):
On Nov. 6, 2002 this F-14 took off from NAS Fallon with a VIP in the back seat - a Naval officer from the cruiser Anzio who was on "FAM Hop". In flight, when the pilot pulled a "negative 1g," the gravity force moved him off his seat. He reached down to reposition himself and accidentally pulled the ejection lever. The cockpit canopy flew off and out went the VIP. The ejection seat automatically opened his chute. He landed safely in the desert and was "rescued". The Pilot had a windy return to base.

What a story! Was he not briefed "don't touch yellow stripey thingies"?
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JeffM
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RE: What Did I Do Wrong? Reject Help. :)

Wed Nov 30, 2005 11:18 pm

Quoting Viv (Reply 20):
What a story! Was he not briefed "don't touch yellow stripey thingies"?

LOL, yea, he was briefed...but unless you have ever experienced -1g or more, it's hard to describe. Reaching down is a reflex, and the handle is very convenient, I found it easier (safer) to put my hands up on the canopy and push down.

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