frippe
Posts: 185
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 4:24 pm

Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 7:52 pm

Hello again,

I need your advice as to how to center this one:

http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/r...big/20060303_EIDHJ0961nefFeb22.jpg

I suspected a Quality rejection but now it was centering. Shall I crop the plane igher or lower in frame?

Frippe
 
timdegroot
Posts: 3258
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 10:37 pm

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:08 pm

Needs to be a bit higher I think.

Tim
Alderman Exit
 
glapira
Posts: 185
Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 2:39 am

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 8:26 pm

I like the shot and I like the editing.. I wouldn't say it is a bad centered. Anyways, try making it a little higher as Tim has said.

Congratulations!
Kind Regards, Radial360
 
Psych
Posts: 2944
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:17 am

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 9:43 pm

I need to apologise before I start, because I know my mood is not great, and that may be seeping out here.

But this site is crying out for some better definition of this criterion. There sometimes appears to be a lottery regarding this rule and - for me, Frippe - there is very little wrong with the centering of this aircraft. It seems a number of threads come along with this issue, but it never feels to me that it is resolved.

As I see it, in a photo like this, the aircraft is from the tail to the wheels, and if you made a rectangle with the upper edge on the tail and the lower edge on the wheels then that rectangle is broadly speaking centered in the overall frame. To my eye having the aircraft higher in the frame - as I know is the preference of many uploaders (with the nose/fuselage lying in the middle) - would leave the photo looking unbalanced, with a lot of foreground before we get to the plane, and little above the tail. The way it is as in Frippe's example is closer to the 'rule of thirds', which is more aesthetically pleasing, I think.

But if having the plane higher in the frame is the preference for the site, so be it. Some further clarification is really needed, as it seems unfair that one person's centered would be another's rejection. Yes, some criteria have a degree of subjectivity that cannot be escaped - like 'motive' - but this should not really be the same.

Paul
 
Granite
Posts: 5026
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 5:55 pm

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 9:54 pm

Hi all

If any photographer is unhappy or needs a second opinion, please press the Appeal button.

Regards

Gary
 
Psych
Posts: 2944
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:17 am

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 10:08 pm

Gary

Great to see you back in the Forum  bigthumbsup 

Paul
 
Granite
Posts: 5026
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 5:55 pm

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 10:11 pm

Hi Paul

Thanks but it's only for a trial period only  Wink

Regards

Gary
 
Psych
Posts: 2944
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:17 am

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 10:22 pm

Gary,

I have just emailed you before I saw your reply, but I will reply in public so that my sentiments can be read by others.

I, for one, have missed your input greatly in the Forum. Having active screener participation is crucial to the positive functioning of this Forum. I really hope that you find the level of debate mature and broadly constructive, so that you feel this is a place worthy of your time, and that your input (and that of everyone else's, for that matter) is treated respectfully.

Let's hope a corner was turned and that the 'trial' period will be passed.

All the best.

Paul

P.S. My apologies to you Frippe for stealing your thread here, but I feel confident you won't mind too much.
 
bubbles
Crew
Posts: 1124
Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 11:54 am

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Fri Mar 03, 2006 11:38 pm

Quoting Psych (Reply 3):
But if having the plane higher in the frame is the preference for the site, so be it. Some further clarification is really needed, as it seems unfair that one person's centered would be another's rejection.

I agree with Paul.

Sometimes, when editing photos, I feel hard to decide how to center the plane in the frame. If it's as simple as leaving exactly same room above the tail and under the wheel, the shot might feel balanced aesthetically in some cases.

Quoting TimdeGroot (Reply 1):
Needs to be a bit higher I think.

I agree with Tim, and also feel the plane should be put a little higher in the frame. But if doing so, that will noticeably leave more space under the wheel than above the tail.

Here, I would like to share my experience, which might be totally wrong. If it's wrong, hope someone could correct me. The following shot was puzzled me a lot for centering issue, when I was editing it.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Hongyin Huo



If Frippe takes Tim's suggestion and centers the plane a bit higher, the final looking of his shot might be similar to mine shown above. In my case, I decided to draw a line from the left wingtip to right one, and used this line as reference to center the whole photo. The line is just a reference; of course, it is NOT the centerline for the frame. By using this line, and moving it up or down around the center, I could easily find which position to put the plane in the frame is the best place.

I know this might sound ridiculous. But it seems working well in some cases. Even that has made the space under the wheel a bit more than above, it could help the whole photo look better and balanced.  biggrin 

Quoting Psych (Reply 7):
I, for one, have missed your input greatly in the Forum. Having active screener participation is crucial to the positive functioning of this Forum. I really hope that you find the level of debate mature and broadly constructive, so that you feel this is a place worthy of your time, and that your input (and that of everyone else's, for that matter) is treated respectfully.

This point is what I also agree with Paul.  Smile

_Hongyin_  wave 
 
timdegroot
Posts: 3258
Joined: Wed Apr 24, 2002 10:37 pm

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Sat Mar 04, 2006 12:52 am

Quoting Psych (Reply 3):
But this site is crying out for some better definition of this criterion. There sometimes appears to be a lottery regarding this rule

Paul, that is something that I will try to work on. Maybe rejections with examples in them will be better for this centered rejection...?

Tim
Alderman Exit
 
dc10tim
Posts: 1380
Joined: Mon Jan 03, 2005 12:21 am

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Sat Mar 04, 2006 2:13 am

Quoting Psych (Reply 3):
To my eye having the aircraft higher in the frame - as I know is the preference of many uploaders (with the nose/fuselage lying in the middle) - would leave the photo looking unbalanced, with a lot of foreground before we get to the plane, and little above the tail. The way it is as in Frippe's example is closer to the 'rule of thirds', which is more aesthetically pleasing, I think.

I agree entirely with this Paul. There are some circumstances when the overall aesthetics of a shot need to be taken into account, which I think is the case here. Obviously the fuselage isn't centred vertically within the frame, but I believe, along with some of the other comments, that to have to aircraft higher in the frame would then, ironically, make it look 'badcentred'.

I would appeal this shot Frippe and keep your fingers crossed  crossfingers 

Regards,

Tim.
Obviously missing something....
 
frippe
Posts: 185
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 4:24 pm

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Sat Mar 04, 2006 2:35 am

Hello again and thanks very much,

I am very thrilled and thankful that a question from a new member can get so much attention.

Now I have tried to demonstrate the problems I face when deciding how to center.

1. First I always centered like this with the PS hair cross in the middle of the fuselage:

http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/big/ready/CTBhigh.jpg

2. Then there is the method, or at least I interpret it so, that Paul is suggesting in his post, maybe something like this:

http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/big/ready/CTBlow.jpg

3. Third, this compromise is what I personally find most common today, or what do you say?

http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/big/ready/CTBmedium.jpg

Maybe this post of mine here is of no great use, but I hope that it can be used as examples.

Please note - these are only quick edits, with many other imperfections, I am sure.

AND if my use of upload space for this purpose should violate any rule I do not know about, please tell me at once so I can remove the three photos as they are extremely DOUBLES. (I have no other server for uploads.)

Thanks for your patience, and once again thanks for help and clarification,
Frippe

(who is happy and proud to be a member of such a great world wide community as Airliners and for all helpful comments from its members.)

[Edited 2006-03-03 18:37:05]
 
Psych
Posts: 2944
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 2004 1:17 am

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Sat Mar 04, 2006 3:42 am

Frippe.

Thanks so much for posting these examples above. This is just the way in which we can have a sensible debate about this centering issue.

I think you are getting to know me well now  wink  - shot number 2 is closest to what I prefer.

Take care.

Paul
 
linco22
Posts: 1278
Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2005 6:16 am

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Sat Mar 04, 2006 5:07 am

i'll go with Paul on this one, the rule of thirds applied here makes sense. Nice shot. Good to see an all round sensible debate with constructive critism. The way it should be!

Regards
Colin  Smile
 
frippe
Posts: 185
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 4:24 pm

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Sat Mar 04, 2006 10:41 pm

Hi again,
Let me just inform that I just got an email from the headscreeners, saying that my photo was not added. The conclusion seems to be that for the present at least the fuselage has to be centered higher than I did in my first upload.
Frippe

[Edited 2006-03-04 14:43:05]
 
frippe
Posts: 185
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 4:24 pm

RE: Bad Centered - How To Correct?

Sun Mar 05, 2006 5:20 pm

Hello again and Good Morning,

This edit is now in the queue. What do you say about its chances of being better centered?

http://www.airliners.net/addphotos/big/ready/EIDHJ0961nefNEWafter.jpg

Thanks for your interest and help,
Frippe

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