mirage
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What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 8:04 pm

Had this one rejected, I like it, I like the prespective and "attitude" of this A310 but I fail to see what's wrong, looking for some opinions to enlight me.

Anything can be improved in this picture?
Big version: Width: 1024 Height: 683 File size: 370kb


thanks
Luis
 
viv
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 8:30 pm

What was the rejection reason?
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mirage
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 9:09 pm



Quoting Viv (Reply 1):
What was the rejection reason?

I'm looking for unbiased opinions so for now it doesn't matter what was the rejection reason(s), just look at the image and tell me what can be improved.

thanks
Luis
 
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TupolevTu154
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 9:38 pm

Oversharpening is probably your main problem, especially around the tail and engines. I like the shot though!

Tom 

[Edited 2008-07-26 14:38:46]
 
viv
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 9:38 pm



Quoting Mirage (Reply 2):
'm looking for unbiased opinions so for now it doesn't matter what was the rejection reason(s), just look at the image and tell me what can be improved.

Don't waste my time. I am not here to second-guess the screeners.

But, since you ask so nicely, your shot is soft in parts and oversharpened in parts.
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Psych
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 9:41 pm

Hello Luis.

I hope this finds you well.

Okay I am going to have a guess that they didn't like the centring of this image. I can imagine some thinking that the 'centre of gravity' of the image is towards the bottom left.

Is the colouring somewhat less 'vibrant' than you might expect? The red of the 'P' seems a bit muted.

Take good care.

Paul
 
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airkas1
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 9:45 pm

It looks grainy and oversharpened (almost looks like you used too much noise reduction..(from what I usually get when I do that))
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9VSPO
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 9:54 pm

I'd say a centering rejection. It looks like an awkward composition with too much dead space on the right hand side of the photo.
 
Silver1SWA
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 10:00 pm



Quoting Mirage (Reply 2):
I'm looking for unbiased opinions so for now it doesn't matter what was the rejection reason(s), just look at the image and tell me what can be improved.

Well for one thing, if the rejection was for motiv, then this thread would be entirely useless as something like that cannot be fixed.

But anyway, something looks strange with the sky. I want to say dirty, but I can't tell if it's just the way the clouds are in the distance.
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ptrjong
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sat Jul 26, 2008 10:12 pm



Quoting Viv (Reply 4):
Don't waste my time. I am not here to second-guess the screeners.

I agree, but since I rather like the shot:

The 'centre of gravity' is not in the middle but the tailfin provides an excuse for that in my opinion. Maybe it would look better with a little bit more wing, though.

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 8):
if the rejection was for motiv, then this thread would be entirely useless as something like that cannot be fixed.

Depends on the original.

As others have said, it looks oversharpened and the colours look flat. The aircraft's butt looks a little dark. A curves correction could improve upon that and the flat colours.

Peter
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76794p
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:47 am

probably the angel of the shot
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AdamWright
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:16 am

is there a dead pixel on the P?
 
unattendedbag
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 4:31 am



Quoting AdamWright (Reply 11):
is there a dead pixel on the P?

which one? there are 6 P's.
Slower traffic, keep right
 
unattendedbag
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 4:37 am



Quoting Mirage (Reply 2):
so for now it doesn't matter what was the rejection reason(s),

I think close to every possible rejection reason has been given for this one particular shot.

You gonna give us a hint?
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dendrobatid
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:54 am

This is the type of thread in this forum that drives me mad.
I rejected this image and with a brief personal which explained what was wrong. He appealed and the Head Screeners agreed with me.
The personal was.......
colour is off, red cast very evident on sky
The initial reason was personal grainy, colour and common (120 + on db already)

Whilst others have skirted around the colour fault (Paul I am disappointed), no-one has totally got it, but take another look now.

I leave a lot of personals, particularly when I think the contributor might not see the problem. Here it is for all to see - take another look. There is a bluey-red cast which has also resulted in the muted reds as mentioned by Paul.

I have tried to correct it and it is not actually easy, even when the sky is right the colours look flat and horrible so I wonder if the WB was wrong when taking the shot.

Mick Bajcar
 
codeshare
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:25 am

Colour cast definately. Why common? Not much of frames like this one.

KS/codeshare
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mirage
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:50 am

Thanks a lot for the opinions, this photo was rejected for:

- quality
- colour
- grainy
- common

I asked your opinions because I don't see those reasons in my monitor, I don't see the grain, I don't see the off colour, I don't see any red cast (it was a dark grey sky, not a beautiful Algarve sunny day) and I think it's sharp and clean. Maybe the problem is my monitor, I used a CRT for 10 years but now I'm using a LCD which is tricky to edit photos. I'm not here to demand my photo to be accepted, just to read opinions, that's one of the purposes of this forum.

Quoting Viv (Reply 4):
Don't waste my time. I am not here to second-guess the screeners

If you don't want to waste time, don't reply.

Quoting Dendrobatid (Reply 14):
This is the type of thread in this forum that drives me mad.

What do you mean? Did I made something wrong?

Luis
 
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:01 pm



Quoting Mirage (Reply 16):
What do you mean? Did I do something wrong?

Luis
Yes, you did in my eyes.
I left you a personal which in a few words explained the problem. You appealed and evidently the Headscreenrs agreed with me otherwise they would have changed my decision.
I feel that it is rude, simply bad manners, that you ignored that when you started this thread. I tend to leave a lot of personals whenever I think it will help the contributor and my comment was intended to do just that, help you - I pointed out the cast.
If you would rather take help from the forum rather than the screener in future, please say so. I hope that at least others do appreciate the personals !
Mick Bajcar
 
mirage
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:38 pm



Quoting Dendrobatid (Reply 17):
Luis
Yes, you did in my eyes.
I left you a personal which in a few words explained the problem. You appealed and evidently the Headscreenrs agreed with me otherwise they would have changed my decision.
I feel that it is rude, simply bad manners, that you ignored that when you started this thread. I tend to leave a lot of personals whenever I think it will help the contributor and my comment was intended to do just that, help you - I pointed out the cast.
If you would rather take help from the forum rather than the screener in future, please say so. I hope that at least others do appreciate the personals !
Mick Bajcar

geez! so many assumptions you're making, hold on please, I'm sorry to say but you're wrong in those assumptions, I'm trying to improve the picture so I want more opinions, that's all, I feel free to ask opinions, I'm not judging the rejection or complaining, no need to get annoyed.

Luis
 
Granite
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:54 pm

Luis

The image is horrendous and correctly rejected by Mick.

Spend some time re-processing the image as per the rejection e-mail.

Regards

Gary
 
viv
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:02 pm

I am sorry to say this, but it appears to me that the real purpose of the initial posting was to elicit opinions that would fail to support the reasons for rejection that had been given. This, in turn, would have supported the conviction of the person posting that his shot was of uploadable quality and that the screener was wrong.

There is nothing wrong with posting rejected shots for comments, but the rejection reasons should be stated, in order to give viewers a real basis for comment. Not to do so is unfair to all concerned - not least the owner of the shot, who may be told that his shot is deficient in aspects not even mentioned by the screener - as indeed happened in this case.

It is generally better to post shots for comment before uploading them rather than after rejection.
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mirage
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:10 pm



Quoting Viv (Reply 20):
I am sorry to say this, but it appears to me that the real purpose of the initial posting was to elicit opinions that would fail to support the reasons for rejection that had been given. This, in turn, would have supported the conviction of the person posting that his shot was of uploadable quality and that the screener was wrong.

There is nothing wrong with posting rejected shots for comments, but the rejection reasons should be stated, in order to give viewers a real basis for comment. Not to do so is unfair to all concerned - not least the owner of the shot, who may be told that his shot is deficient in aspects not even mentioned by the screener - as indeed happened in this case.

It is generally better to post shots for comment before uploading them rather than after rejection.

No, sorry, that's not my point, I wanted more opinions to help me improve the photo, I'm not judging the rejection and I'm not complaining.

Luis
 
viv
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:14 pm



Quoting Mirage (Reply 21):
I'm not judging the rejection

Yes you are. You said:

Quoting Mirage (Thread starter):
I fail to see what's wrong

and

Quoting Mirage (Reply 16):
I don't see the grain, I don't see the off colour, I don't see any red cast (it was a dark grey sky, not a beautiful Algarve sunny day) and I think it's sharp and clean.

Nikon D700, Nikkor 80-400, Fuji X Pro 1, Fujinon 35 f/1.4, Fujinon 18 f/2
 
mirage
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:22 pm



Quoting Viv (Reply 22):
Quoting Mirage (Reply 21):
I'm not judging the rejection

Yes you are. You said:

Quoting Mirage (Thread starter):
I fail to see what's wrong

and

Quoting Mirage (Reply 16):
I don't see the grain, I don't see the off colour, I don't see any red cast (it was a dark grey sky, not a beautiful Algarve sunny day) and I think it's sharp and clean.

Correct, I fail to see what's wrong so I come to the forum asking more feedback, rejection was correct, but I want to improve the picture.

Luis
 
viv
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:27 pm



Quoting Mirage (Reply 23):
I want to improve the picture

Unless the original is in RAW, you will not be able to improve the colour cast.
Nikon D700, Nikkor 80-400, Fuji X Pro 1, Fujinon 35 f/1.4, Fujinon 18 f/2
 
mirage
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:34 pm



Quoting Viv (Reply 24):
Unless the original is in RAW, you will not be able to improve the colour cast.

It's RAW, I can send it to you by email if you want.

Luis
 
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:33 pm



Quoting Dendrobatid (Reply 17):
I hope that at least others do appreciate the personals !

believe me, we do!!

It is a tremendous help to receive a clue as to why the photo was rejected.
Slower traffic, keep right
 
dreamflight
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 6:43 pm



Quoting Dendrobatid (Reply 17):
I hope that at least others do appreciate the personals !
Mick Bajcar

Hi Mick,

The personal of a screener is a sign of repect against the photographer. So yes, I really appreciate this.

Cheers,

Jan
I feel the need for airspeed
 
SlamClick
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:19 pm



Quoting Mirage (Thread starter):
looking for some opinions to enlight me.

Gutsy move, asking for freestyle criticism like that. Reminds me of the woman who stepped out from behind the screen, fully nude and asked the man in the white smock: "Doctor, what's wrong with me?" He answered: "Well, three things; first you have on far too much makeup to be attractive, second, you are too heavy by forty pounds, and third, I'm an artist, the doctor is one flight down."

So it appears that you got a rejection which was pretty specific as to why. At that point you could have attempted to fix the problems listed and resubmitted it, or just took the lesson learned and tried harder on the next shoot. Instead you ask a bunch of people to criticise it and got a laundry list including:

Quoting TupolevTu154 (Reply 3):
Oversharpening



Quoting Viv (Reply 4):
soft in parts and oversharpened in parts



Quoting Psych (Reply 5):
centring



Quoting Psych (Reply 5):
less 'vibrant' than you might expect



Quoting AirKas1 (Reply 6):
grainy and oversharpened



Quoting 9VSPO (Reply 7):
centering



Quoting 9VSPO (Reply 7):
awkward composition



Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 8):
something looks strange with the sky



Quoting Ptrjong (Reply 9):
it would look better with a little bit more wing



Quoting Ptrjong (Reply 9):
oversharpened and the colours look flat



Quoting UnattendedBag (Reply 13):
close to every possible rejection reason has been given for this one particular shot



Quoting Codeshare (Reply 15):
Colour cast definately

...which is more rejection than I think I could handle.  Smile

I have to go with the screener on this one. It is kind of rude to get a specific rejection with reasons why and then, more or less ask the members here to tell the screener he is wrong. It's hard to see what you did as anything other than that.

As for the picture, I can see the point of any one of these criticisms, but the picture does have one big thing in its favor - if it can be improved, it is visually interesting, pleasing to the eye. It may not be for this database but just off the top of my head I could see muting, softening the colors even further so that it is almost like a watermark, and using it as wallpaper for my computer. I think that would be quite striking.

Oh, and as for the centering of the picture, that is one quarrel I've always had with the good folks running this database. In a photograph of an object that moves, it should usually be moving INTO the picture and not out of it. Your composition, in my opinion, got that right - the center of the airplane is moving toward the center of the picture-rectangle. Anything other than that is usually either awkward or boring.
Happiness is not seeing another trite Ste. Maarten photo all week long.
 
mirage
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:51 pm



Quoting SlamClick (Reply 28):
Instead you ask a bunch of people to criticise it and got a laundry list including:

lol, I've no problem with that, I'm adult enough to accept critics, that's what I asked for.

Quoting SlamClick (Reply 28):
I have to go with the screener on this one. It is kind of rude to get a specific rejection with reasons why and then, more or less ask the members here to tell the screener he is wrong. It's hard to see what you did as anything other than that.

ok, that's your opinion, not my purpose.

thanks
Luis
 
shep2
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:01 pm

Photo in question - definitely not one of Luis's best...

He put a discussion on the table - some bit hard - some bit easy - some take life too seriously...

Look at his photos - look at his masterpiece stuff...

Believe me, Luis has put up some great images here - but this photo in question - he should have maybe hung it up in his personal collection ?

Luis - you have a GREAT eye...

[Edited 2008-07-27 15:19:38]
 
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walter2222
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Mon Jul 28, 2008 7:26 am



Quoting Dendrobatid (Reply 17):
I hope that at least others do appreciate the personals !

Much appreciated, Mick!!!! First of all, I learned a lot of it and - for me - it makes a rejection less hard  Smile I also do not see the rejection as a negative point, and the "personal" is a helping hand with advice on how to improve (from the trained eye)! In most cases, it is also a sign that improvement is possible and that with proper editing the shot can be accepted.

Best regards,

Walter
Canon 347d mkII ;-) - EFS10-22mm f/3.5-4.5 USM - EFS18-55mm - EF28-105mm f3.5/4.5 - EF100-400mm f4.5-5.6l IS USM - ...
 
Scotland1979
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:29 am



Quoting Dendrobatid (Reply 14):
colour is off, red cast very evident on sky

Yes, obviously the colour is off

Quoting Mirage (Reply 25):
It's RAW

Why should I try RAW? It could hurt colour quality to upload - I set camera in large size and it keep colours accurate

Quoting Shep2 (Reply 30):
he should have maybe hung it up in his personal collection ?

MyAviation is a perfect site to collect photos when they are not suitable for ANet
Jesus said "I am the Way and the Truth and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me" - John 14:6
 
javibi
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:48 am



Quoting Scotland1979 (Reply 32):
Why should I try RAW?

Maybe you should, maybe you shouldn't. I recommend you read this and then decide:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tu...rstanding-series/u-raw-files.shtml

j
 
Scotland1979
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Wed Jul 30, 2008 12:36 am

Thanks Javibi with the link

After I read this and I still struggling abit to understand this.
Meanwhile I stay with Large version in camera set for now til someone show me in person about the info of RAW before I can decide whether I should try RAW

Thanks again!
Jesus said "I am the Way and the Truth and the Life. No one comes to the Father except through Me" - John 14:6
 
lamyl_hhlco
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Fri Aug 08, 2008 7:01 am

wow ,I didn't know we have to be super pro on taking pictures and buying the 1000$ camera to be accepted on this site. I mean you guys reject pictures for any little tiny grain you find ,too sharp ,color is not right ,this and that...do we get paid for it ?
This picture looks acceptable for me as a viewer , the color of the sky doesn't really bother of all I wanna see is the plane it self and not the super quality of the image. Of course the picture has to have a good quality but you guys are going out of proportion on little details .
 
JakTrax
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Fri Aug 08, 2008 4:42 pm



Quoting Lamyl_hhlco (Reply 35):
wow ,I didn't know we have to be super pro on taking pictures and buying the 1000$ camera to be accepted on this site. I mean you guys reject pictures for any little tiny grain you find ,too sharp ,color is not right ,this and that...do we get paid for it ?
This picture looks acceptable for me as a viewer , the color of the sky doesn't really bother of all I wanna see is the plane it self and not the super quality of the image. Of course the picture has to have a good quality but you guys are going out of proportion on little details .

Maybe so, but it keeps everyone on their toes. We know 99.9% of the time the viewing public doesn't give a **** if it's a millimatre off centre of if there's an almost invisible dust-spot in the sky - but we pride ourselves on our work and many of us here want to get it perfect. We look at each others' work often and we know exactly how to spot supreme quality.

As for your shot Luis, first thing that struck me is that awful colour cast. I'm very surprised a man of your capabilities failed to notice it.

Karl
 
mirage
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RE: What Do You See Wrong In This Photo?

Fri Aug 08, 2008 5:08 pm



Quoting JakTrax (Reply 36):
As for your shot Luis, first thing that struck me is that awful colour cast. I'm very surprised a man of your capabilities failed to notice it.

Belive it or not, I still don't notice the red cast. It was a dark sky, sun was high, day was hazy and cloudy at the same time, we had some rain minutes after this photo was taken, the whites in the plane are white, the reds in TAP logo are not strong because the sun was covered by the haze and clouds, I don't see anything unusual with the white balance, if the day is kind of dull the photos are also kind of dull, I really can't explain much more.

But, I've quit uploading this photo, I also had forgoten this topic, life goes on.

Luis

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