snw
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 8:54 pm

Preserved Aircraft, Rego Confusion

Mon Nov 03, 2008 9:42 am

I have a picture of a preserved McDonnell Douglas F-4J Phantom on static display that I would like to submit but I'm a bit confused about its serial # and hence its history.

It's painted up as 155894, WD-00 from VFMA-212 however all sources of information that I can find suggest this airframe was delivered to the UK RAF in 1984 and was dumped then later scapped in '96.

Is it ok to submit this to the database with the above serial - as displayed? I just don't like not knowing if it is the actual airframe or a different airframe that has been reassigned for display. The pictures were taken earlier this year so it's still on display.

Any suggestions or further information would be much appreciated.
 
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ptrjong
Posts: 4121
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 9:38 am

RE: Preserved Aircraft, Rego Confusion

Mon Nov 03, 2008 12:04 pm

I believe that a.net policy is that aircraft should be uploaded under the registration/serial worn, whether fake or not. Of course, if you know the construction number you should list the true construcion number, not the one associated with the fake serial. In the remarks you can give the true identity, or say you're not sure.

Could the database editors comment on this? Some people are uploading such aircraft under their true serial.

Peter Smile
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)
 
GPHOTO
Posts: 799
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2004 11:44 pm

RE: Preserved Aircraft, Rego Confusion

Mon Nov 03, 2008 1:17 pm

You are spot on, Peter.

In the case of falsely painted aircraft, the registration painted on the aircraft should be used as the reg, even though it is not the real one. The same applies for any codes - use what is on the airframe.

The construction number should be the TRUE construction number for that airframe, not the one that matches the fake registration. Of course if you don't know the true identity, you won't be able to write in the true c.n.

I would always recommend that uploaders write the true registration, if it is known, in the remarks somehow, as it avoids confusion for the viewer (and the editors!).

This Hurricane photo shows the correct way to handle such problems:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © TZ Aviation



LF345 / ZA-P (cn unknown) Painted as LF345, this is actually LF658, one of six Hurricanes acquired after WW2 by the Belgians from the RAF. The Belgian AF flew three - this was one of the three gound-based instructional airframes. Displayed since 1963 in the fabulous Belgique Musée Royal de l'Armée et d'Histoire Militaire.

Best regards,

Jim

Edited to include remark text from photo in this post.

[Edited 2008-11-03 05:19:02]
Erm, is this thing on?
 
snw
Posts: 23
Joined: Tue Oct 30, 2007 8:54 pm

RE: Preserved Aircraft, Rego Confusion

Tue Nov 04, 2008 1:20 am

Thanks Peter and Jim for the very informative and helpful responses.

The construction number of the restored aircraft is unknown.
Given your advice a comment such as this should be ok:

"Originally delivered to the UK Royal Air Force (RAF) in 1984 as ZE364 and upgraded to a F-4J(UK), available information indicates it was scrapped in 1996. The origins of this restored airframe are unknown."

I'll get cracking on processing the image.

Thanks again for your help.
 
whappeh
Posts: 1058
Joined: Sun Mar 05, 2006 4:47 am

RE: Preserved Aircraft, Rego Confusion

Tue Nov 04, 2008 7:27 am



Quoting Ptrjong (Reply 1):
I believe that a.net policy is that aircraft should be uploaded under the registration/serial worn, whether fake or not. Of course, if you know the construction number you should list the true construcion number, not the one associated with the fake serial. In the remarks you can give the true identity, or say you're not sure.

I did this for this photo:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Brendan Gallagher



I uploaded it (and it was accepted) as: J-4035 / Switzerland - Air Force

A few days latter it was N159AM / J-4035 / Untitled

So who knows anymore.
-Travel now, journey infinitely.
 
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acontador
Posts: 1381
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2005 11:54 pm

RE: Preserved Aircraft, Rego Confusion

Tue Nov 04, 2008 1:06 pm

Hi Scott,

Quoting SNW (Reply 3):
UK Royal Air Force (RAF) in 1984 as ZE364

From the great page http://www.ukserials.com/ :

Quote:
cn: 3542, UK serial: ZE364, Phantom F-4J(UK) Ex USN 155894, departed AMARC 12/03/1984, d/d 26/11/1984, to Coltishall fire dump 1991, srapped 04/1996 by Milverton Metals, Coventry

Hope it helps  Smile !
Just sit back, relax and have a glass of Merlot...enjoy your life!
 
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ptrjong
Posts: 4121
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 9:38 am

RE: Preserved Aircraft, Rego Confusion

Wed Nov 05, 2008 5:04 pm

Quoting Whappeh (Reply 4):

For active aircraft, you do list the actual registration. See the help text with the Warbird category.

A bit confusing at first, but actually these rules are quite well thought out IMO.

Peter 

[Edited 2008-11-05 09:04:58]
The only difference between me and a madman is that I am not mad (Salvador Dali)

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