abrelosojos
Topic Author
Posts: 4049
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 6:37 am

Feedback always appreciated.




I > Background:
I am increasingly involved in business development in the Indian Ocean region and was slated to go back to Mauritius for work. However, I had a weekend and decided to stop and pay a visit to my friend whose wife had just given birth in Dubai. Being in London, Emirates was the obvious choice with its various departure options. Moreover, it would give me the perfect opportunity to do a non-business trip and a trip report. For some weird reason, several people on A.Net (on the public forum or privately) have been wondering when my EK report would come. What was up with that? Anyways, here it is!

Having lived in Pakistan for work in the early 2000’s, Emirates used to be a great link via its expanding Dubai for me to escape. For me, their service had progressively lost its sheen and this was an opportunity for me to discover if they had regained it back. What better way than to fly their “flagship” 380 on their “flagship” flight. The rotation back from LHR to DXB.

While there has been several EK reports (surprisingly, several by EK ‘insiders’), I believe this would be the first on the 380 on the LHR-DXB link. Perhaps I am wrong?

II > Pre-Flight:

a) Before Airport:
Emirates is the national airline of Dubai, United Arab Emirates and operates around 2200 passenger flights per week, from its hub at Dubai International Airport Terminal 3, to 108 destinations in 60 countries across 6 continents.

Ticketing for the flight was done by the significantly improved Emirates site at www.emirates.com. The site has improved tremendously and I was able to even choose my seat. Later on, I could view my itinerary … though, could not make any changes or edit my seat choice.

b) At Airport:
Emirates uses Zone C @ terminal 3 at LHR. As usual, the EK check-in area was busy with the usual collection of passengers flying to DXB and beyond. The premium check-in counters were hidden and the staff at the entrance were busy gossiping and chatting on their mobile phones. Thankfully, my check-in agent was efficient in getting my boarding pass issued with my seat choice and telling me about the lounge. While extremely efficient, she wasn’t particularly hospitable.

Anyways, boarding card and departure card in hand, I made it past fast track security and soon made myself to the two-floor Emirates lounge at LHR. The check-in agent left much to be desired. When asked about the internet connection, she snapped, “sir, if you looked properly you would see it in front of you.” WTF. I did not want to get into a conversation about her manners so went inside.

The lounge is big for a carrier not based at the airport and the dining options are above average. However, it is the attention to detail that seems to be missing. For example, several of the internet terminals were either not working and/or did not have a mouse; several food items were not stocked for long periods; and I noticed dirty utensils left around.

Boarding for J and F passengers happen directly from the lounge, and while this may seem exclusive, it just isn’t. When you get an entire deck of “premium” passengers, the whole concept of “premium” and “intimate” gets lost. With significant lines to board, I felt like I was flying Y-class than J-class of a globally well established airline. Upon entering the big bird (my first time in commercial flight), I was shocked to see there were no flight attendants greeting us. In fact, they seem to be mostly chatting in the rear galley near the bar area. Not a great impression.

I was in for a second shock when I went to the bathroom prior to take-off to find it filthy with toilet paper everywhere and empty amenity drawers sticking out. While I can still understand this at the end of a flight, I just find it absolutely unacceptable at the beginning of a flight … that too in JCL! WTF! Of course, I made a note of it to the crew members hanging out in the rear galley (remember, this is the bathroom right there) who just shrugged with no apology and went to clean it.

J load was around 70%.

>Airport - External:

(Terminal 3, London)

*

Check-in:



Airport - Internal:
http://i90.photobucket.com/albums/k251/abrelosojosnow/AA155/003.jpg

(FIDS)
NONE

(Post Security @ LHR)

*

Scenes of the tarmac:

(Witnessing the diversity of LHR is probably the best thing that can be said of the Emirates lounge)

*

*

*

*

*

*

*


Lounge

(EK Lounge @ LHR)

*

*

*
(Would be better if it worked)
Boarding:

(Future of mass produced JCL)


III> In-Flight:

a) Service Schedule + Impressions:
While on the ground, water/OJ/champagne was offered. Menus were distributed and orders taken. Also offered were cold towels. After take-off, there was a drink run followed by lunch. No amenity kits, no further meals, and no further water runs. I was disappointed that no amenity kit or pyjamas were on offer … even on request.

b) Aircraft + Seats:
Emirates’ J class cabin on their 380 lacked the intimate feeling that a Business class cabin should have. I recognize the revenue potential of having this many JCL seats and also understand that from their business model perspective, volume is only way to profitability. However, I felt that EK’s configuration lost the very essence of what many seek from a J-class experience. Having said that, the seats themselves were fantastic offering several comfortable seating and relaxing options. It went to a full-flat bed seamlessly and the design offered ample privacy. There was enough storage space and I did like the “mini-bar” that came with it. It would have been nice if the water bottle actually was new and not empty. Attention to detail was again missing.

Controls for the seat were advanced and intuitive through a central console that detached. Sometimes the control would “lose signal”, but that was to be expected when seats become so complicated. Unlike many in-seat massage functions, this was actually useful and the ability to control the myriad of settings uniquely appealing.

The roped off upper deck also added to the allure of being in an exclusive club … which had become a tad too popular for its own good  . I was extremely disappointed at the way the bathrooms were managed. As mentioned, they were filthy at take-off … and manageable during the rest of the flight. It would have been nice if amenities were stocked given that no kit was given out.

Finally, the bar area was a nice touch. On this flight, it was also extremely social with an interesting combination of expats, locals, and those going beyond DXB.

Aircraft:
(388 @ LHR)

*

*
(The 744 is still the more graceful aircraft)


Views from Aircraft:

NONE


General Seat Views + Seat Legroom

(Seat controls)

*

*
(Too many errors however)

*
(Legroom)


(Seat Partition & Bar: though things were missing)

*


(Blanket)
NONE

(Storage)

*

*


(Seat)

*


Seat Recline + Angle View:


*


Cabin:


*

*
(Upper/Lower Deck)

*

*
(Sorry for picture quality – went to the bathroom without camera prior to take-off to find this)


(Amenities – later in flight – still missing items)


(View)


(The bar)


c) Meal + Beverage:
First off, the bar continues to be such a great idea. It is definitely a nice touch and a great place to mix and mingle and observe the “expat scene” (good and bad) in full flow.

Lunch started with excellent cold canapés (though, poorly presented) and really good mezze. However, it all went downhill from there. Why does it take 45 minutes between my mezze and Main course is beyond me. When it arrived, it was hastily put together and without much taste. I had the choice of 4 entrées and perhaps I chose the wrong one … but the rubbery chicken served was unmemorable … like someone had quickly cooked something and then just thrown some red sauce on it. Probably one of the lease impressive main courses I have had in JCL for a while. The dessert served was also mediocre … and when asked for port wine, I was served in a regular glass. Now, normally, these are things I overlook … but this has never happened in JCL for me and I was actually surprised at the lack of thought to presentation. Finally, EK … you need to bring back the old cutlery … these are just way too plain and white for me.

As mentioned, the other thing missing was any other water runs/food runs/etc. during the entire flight. While I have come to expect this from some European carriers, it is disappointing that an airline like EK was so blasé about service.

(Menu)

*

*


(Lunch Service)

*
(Unbelievable time between courses)
*

*

*
(Unbelievable time between courses - again)

*

*
(Not so nice main dish)

*


d) Inflight Entertainment:
This is probably Emirate’s most impressive selling point. Their system ICE is probably the best IFE out there. At least, it is the best I have seen in a long time … the only major IFE I have not “tested” is SQ’s new system. ICE has over 600 channels of premium entertainment including an amazing level of movies, television, sports, and other shows. You can also keep track of your flight and use the various cameras to watch what is above and ahead. News and communication would keep the most “connected” person be just that. All of this came with rather decent headphones. For sure, no one can complain about the IFE system on EK. Moreover, the controls were easy to navigate and could be done through touch-screen, detachable remote, or the wired joystick. My only “complain” was that it froze a little too many times … and perhaps the unresponsive crew made me feel that I could not properly take advantage of ICE.


*

*

*

*

*
(Shouldn’t they update this by now?)


(“In-flight magazines”, Boarding Passes, etc.)


e) Crew:
Crew makes and breaks a flight experience for me. Like a lot of my current EK legs, their crew was unimpressive and uninspiring. They were not memorable – and it seemed that they really did not care about their passengers. If an EK audit director was onboard, they would have been shocked. The crew I had (mostly Australian and 2 Kenyans in JCL) were just plain lazy. There were 2 good standouts (one South African and one Kiwi) which reaffirmed my belief that EK’s best crews are South African and South Asian. Unfortunately, these two did not serve the starboard side. I call the crew lazy because they were never to be seen … not during boarding and not during the flight (come on, not even one drink run?). I did my “call button” test and it went unanswered … even though, two of them passed by it. Most of the time, they could be found chatting loudly in the rear galley (for example, I found out the “gossip” on who was sleeping with who; crew parties; how they thrashed a hotel in London and are “non grata” there, the two tracks of salary and duty and how you move between the two, and of course the latest on which club in DXB gives the girls free drinks). Those of you who know EK’s 380 upper-deck would know exactly where I am talking about. Finally, when asked something, you felt like you were imposing on them. I felt this way when bringing the poor bathroom condition to their attention … and I felt like this again when it took several attempts to have someone reset my IFE.

Honestly, I have no idea how they are going to hire additional crew and maintain a standard if they have had their service slip to such horrid levels. Truly disappointing because EK crew was a joy to fly with and when I lived in Pakistan, I would look forward to being greeted by genuine cabin attendants who made you feel special. That Emirates is sadly long gone.

IV> Post-Flight:
Landing in Dubai was smooth and after the endless walk, I was through a rather quick immigration, and on to a big hug from my friend.

(DXB)

*


V> Impressions + Scores:
Emirates used to be a joy to fly with. For anything that can be bought by money, Emirates is stellar (aircraft, IFE, etc.). For me, however, it is an airline that lost her soul somewhere along the way. Emirates feels mass produced and not intimate for those of us who have a passion for flying. Passengers (especially in YCL) will be wowed by their IFE, their mood lighting, their shiny aircraft, etc. However, those interested in finding a service standard which is “special” will be left disappointed. Sub standard meals, crowded lounges with indifferent ground staff, poor drinks, etc. can be overlooked. However, the crew on board Emirates was just disappointing. Their attitude was completely misplaced – and as much as I have had consistently poor experience transiting at Doha, Qatar Airways on-board crew is really good. Perhaps, Emirates needs to look internally as it continues growing. And perhaps, it needs to revisit where it recruits her crew from.

I have had consistently poor experience on Emirates and have been able to moderate my expectations accordingly. I don’t fly them much for business and this experience reaffirmed why. I know a lot of you were waiting for an EK report from me ... and I wish I could have done a more positive review of them. Don’t get me wrong ... they do have great hardware, and ICE simply is awesome. However, I don’t like “wal-mart” like feel to JCL ... and service even worse than the smiling “wal-mart” attendants. I would fly them if they were the cheapest way to get somewhere – nothing more. Two thumps down.



VI> Other Trip Reports:

PREMIUM:
8.66: Brussels Airlines (93): FIH-BRU: 01/2010
8.64: Turkish Airlines (59): JFK-IST: 11/2008
8.63: Jet Airways (88): JFK-BRU: 10/2009
8.61: Air Canada (49): YYZ-SCL: 06/2008
8.54: Turkish Airlines (77): GRU-DKR-IST: 04/2009
8.36: Kingfisher (98): BOM-HKG: 01/2010
8.30: Jet Airways (74): KWI-BOM: 04/2009
8.23: United Airlines (72): SFO-SYD: 03/2009
8.11: Aeroflot (33): MOW-DEL: 09/2007
8.05: Air India (80): CCU-JFK: 06/2009
8.04: Korean Air (40): NRT-ICN: 10/2007
8.02: Delta Airlines (24): JFK-CDG: 08/2007
7.64: Royal Jordanian (91): AMM-YUL: 12/2009
7.46: LAN (55): YYZ-JFK: 09/2008
7.82: Singapore Airlines (06): EWR-SIN: 09/2006
7.25: Iran Air (88): BOM-IKA: 12/2009
7.23: Virgin Atlantic (81): BOS-LHR: 07/2009
7.14: Swiss (52): SCL-GRU: 06/2008
7.11: Austrian (79): VIE-JFK: 06/2009
7.07: Privatair (84): BOM-FRA: 08/2009
7.02: Qatar (68): DOH-JFK: 01/2009
6.96: Etihad (61): JFK-AUH: 12/2008
6.93: Delta Airlines (18): SEA-JFK: 11/2006
6.84: ConViasa (65): CCS-DAM: 01/2009
6.81: Air Canada (17): ICN-YYZ: 10/2006
6.70: KLM (32): EBB-AMS: 08/2007
6.52: Emirates (99): LHR-DXB: 02/2010
6.39: South African (97): EZE-JNB: 01/2010
6.36: Privatair (60): MUC-BOS: 12/2008
6.29: TAM Brasil (96): POA-EZE: 02/2010
6.25: Korean Air (45): NAN-ICN: 10/2007
6.21: Iberia (87): BOS-MAD: 10/2009
6.11: TAP Portugal (53): GRU-OPO: 06/2008
6.00: Gulf Air (75): BOM-BAH: 04/2009
5.88: African Express (89): DXB-NBO: 11/2009
5.75: Singapore Airlines (16): CCU-SIN: 10/2006
5.64: NorthWest (46): ICN-NRT-SEA: 10/2007
5.54: Ethiopian Airlines (95): ADD-BOM: 01/2010
5.46: Icelandair (83): KEF-BOS: 08/2009
5.39: LOT (54): WAW-JFK: 06/2008
5.21: Egypt Air (73): CAI-IST: 02/2009
5.07: TACA (66): JFK-SAP: 01/2009
4.42: Air France: CDG-JNB (25): 08/2007

ECONOMY: Long + Medium:
9.26: Air India (48): JFK-DEL: 02/2008
7.38: Avianca (01): BOG-LIM: 07/2006
7.07: Sri Lankan (62): KWI-CMB: 12/2008
7.00: LAN (94): IPC-SCL: 01/2010
6.41: Avianca (78): JFK-BOG: 05/2009
6.41: American Airlines (58): LHR-BOS: 11/2008
6.39: Condor (85): SEZ-FRA: 09/2009
6.26: Jet Blue (21): CUN-JFK: 02/2007
6.06: Air Canada (04): YYZ-YVR: 09/2006
5.89: USA 3000 (19): PUJ-BDL: 01/2007
5.85: Spanair (69): MAD-LPA: 02/2009
5.79: Air New Zealand (42): RAR-NAN: 10/2007
5.52: Aerolineas (86): USH-AEP: 10/2009
5.46: TAP Air Portugal (23): OSL-LIS: 05/2007
5.19: Air Europa (70): LPA-MAD: 02/2009
5.16: Iberia (71): MAD-BOS: 02/2009
5.11: Air China (82): FRA-PEK: 08/2009

ECONOMY: Short
8.56: Paramount Airways (38): BLR-MAA: 09/2007
8.56: Kingfisher (64): HYD-CCU: 12/2008
8.24: Kingfisher (14): IXA-GAU: 10/2006
7.87: Indian (34): BOM-MAA: 09/2007
7.72: Alliance Air (13): CCU-IXA: 10/2006
7.57: Indian Airlines (10): DEL-CCU: 09/2006
7.23: West Jet (03): YYC-YVR: 09/2006
7.15: JetLite (37): BOM-GOI: 09/2007
6.70: Spice Jet (09): CCU-DEL: 09/2006
6.63: Air Fiji (44): NAN-SUV: 10/2007
6.63: Jazeera (67): DAM-KWI: 01/2009
6.58: Air Tran (02): EWR-MDW: 08/2006
6.48: Air India Express (63): CMB-MAA: 12/2008
6.44: CO Micronesia (39): ROR-YAP: 10/2007
6.41: Pacific Sun (43): NAN-SUV: 10/2007
6.37: Skybus (47): SWF-CMH: 02/2008
6.33: Kenya Airways (29): NBO-BJM: 08/2007
6.33: Sky Europe (56): LTN-BTS: 10/2008
6.31: Indigo (15): GAU-CCU: 10/2006
6.31: easyJet (57): BUD-LTN: 11/2008
6.22: Air Link Swazi (28): MTS-JNB: 08/2007
6.22: Air India (36): HYD-BOM: 09/2007
6.13: Adam Air (07): SIN-CGK: 09/2006
6.13: Air Rarotonga (41): RAR-AIT: 10/2007
6.00: Transairways (27): INH-MPM: 08/2007
5.95: Air Canada (05): ALB-YYZ: 09/2006
5.85: SAS Norge (22): OSL-AES: 05/2007
5.81: LAM Mozambique (26): JNB-MPM: 08/2007
5.69: Air Deccan (12): IXZ-CCU: 10/2006
5.67: Rwanda Air Exp (30): KGL-NBO: 08/2007
5.37: Felix Airways (92): SCT-SAH: 12/2009
5.11: Aero Republica (76): BOG-CCS: 04/2009
5.07: Go Air (35): MAA-HYD: 09/2007
5.00: Sky Airline (51): IQQ-SCL: 06/2008
4.96: Valuair (08): CGK-SIN: 09/2006
4.78: Air Comet Chile (50): SCL-IQQ: 06/2008
4.74: Fly 540 (31): MYD-LAU: 08/2007
4.33: Viva Aerobus (20): ELP-MTY: 02/2007
4.11: Air Sahara (11): CCU-BOM: 09/2006

(Note on Codes: Y – Economy, J – Business, F – First :: I/D – International/Domestic :: SR/MR/LR – Short/Medium/Long Haul)
(Note on Date: Dates are modified to be +/- 3 days from actual flight date to not reveal actual flight pattern)

VII> Other Pictures:
(No Amenity kit]
Live, and let live.
 
toptravel
Posts: 100
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:36 pm

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 8:38 am

I agree with everything you say, I used to love EK but somehow lately the service on board has slipped, as much as I love the 380 I think the service is terrible. Somehow they have the service in B/C all screwed up, 45 minutes between courses you just loose interest and get tired of the whole thing. last time I flew from DXB to Sydney I had red wine spilt on me by a flight attended who was not paying attention, some time later I was given a RAG to wipe myself down, not a hint of 'Sorry' Now I'm a Gold member with them, so I have a lot of experience on EK, but as I said I've also lost interest in them. I like QR a lot better these days.
 
PlaneHunter
Posts: 6512
Joined: Tue Mar 14, 2006 3:17 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 8:48 am

Hi Alex,

great report, very entertaining. However, I'm a bit shocked that you had another negative experience on EK - somehow it seems the airline tries hard to disappoint whenever you are on board.  
Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
While there has been several EK reports (surprisingly, several by EK %u2018insiders%u2019), I believe this would be the first on the 380 on the LHR-DXB link. Perhaps I am wrong?

Yes, you are.  

A380 Really a Step Forward? LHR-DXB-DOH On EK

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Anyways, boarding card and departure card in hand, I made it past fast track security and soon made myself to the two-floor Emirates lounge at LHR. The check-in agent left much to be desired. When asked about the internet connection, she snapped, %u201Csir, if you looked properly you would see it in front of you.%u201D WTF. I did not want to get into a conversation about her manners so went inside.

Wow, not acceptable at all.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Upon entering the big bird (my first time in commercial flight), I was shocked to see there were no flight attendants greeting us. In fact, they seem to be mostly chatting in the rear galley near the bar area. Not a great impression.

Very odd. On my last EK journey they even said "Welcome on board, Mr. XXXX." at the door - on my way to the Y Class cabin, btw.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
I was in for a second shock when I went to the bathroom prior to take-off to find it filthy with toilet paper everywhere and empty amenity drawers sticking out. While I can still understand this at the end of a flight, I just find it absolutely unacceptable at the beginning of a flight %u2026 that too in JCL! WTF! Of course, I made a note of it to the crew members hanging out in the rear galley (remember, this is the bathroom right there) who just shrugged with no apology and went to clean it.

Unbelievable.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Lunch started with excellent cold canapés (though, poorly presented) and really good mezze. However, it all went downhill from there. Why does it take 45 minutes between my mezze and Main course is beyond me. When it arrived, it was hastily put together and without much taste. I had the choice of 4 entrées and perhaps I chose the wrong one … but the rubbery chicken served was unmemorable … like someone had quickly cooked something and then just thrown some red sauce on it. Probably one of the lease impressive main courses I have had in JCL for a while. The dessert served was also mediocre … and when asked for port wine, I was served in a regular glass. Now, normally, these are things I overlook … but this has never happened in JCL for me and I was actually surprised at the lack of thought to presentation. Finally, EK … you need to bring back the old cutlery … these are just way too plain and white for me.

That's bad to hear. From my experience EK Y Class meals belong to the best in the industry - both in terms of quality and quantity.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
This is probably Emirate’s most impressive selling point. Their system ICE is probably the best IFE out there. At least, it is the best I have seen in a long time … the only major IFE I have not “tested” is SQ’s new system.

The latest ICE version (which you had on the A380) is still better than SQ's latest KrisWorld version. ICE offers a greater choice of features. And the camera views alone make a difference in my opinion.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Crew makes and breaks a flight experience for me. Like a lot of my current EK legs, their crew was unimpressive and uninspiring. They were not memorable – and it seemed that they really did not care about their passengers. If an EK audit director was onboard, they would have been shocked. The crew I had (mostly Australian and 2 Kenyans in JCL) were just plain lazy. There were 2 good standouts (one South African and one Kiwi) which reaffirmed my belief that EK’s best crews are South African and South Asian. Unfortunately, these two did not serve the starboard side. I call the crew lazy because they were never to be seen … not during boarding and not during the flight (come on, not even one drink run?). I did my “call button” test and it went unanswered … even though, two of them passed by it. Most of the time, they could be found chatting loudly in the rear galley (for example, I found out the “gossip” on who was sleeping with who; crew parties; how they thrashed a hotel in London and are “non grata” there, the two tracks of salary and duty and how you move between the two, and of course the latest on which club in DXB gives the girls free drinks). Those of you who know EK’s 380 upper-deck would know exactly where I am talking about. Finally, when asked something, you felt like you were imposing on them. I felt this way when bringing the poor bathroom condition to their attention … and I felt like this again when it took several attempts to have someone reset my IFE.

Very irritating. You should complain about that behavior.



What's your impression of the A380 itself? Do you also think it's over-hyped?


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
The777Man
Posts: 5911
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 8:52 am

Hi Alex!

Nice to see another report from you! Great pictures!

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
I was in for a second shock when I went to the bathroom prior to take-off to find it filthy with toilet paper everywhere and empty amenity drawers sticking out. While I can still understand this at the end of a flight, I just find it absolutely unacceptable at the beginning of a flight … that too in JCL! WTF! Of course, I made a note of it to the crew members hanging out in the rear galley (remember, this is the bathroom right there) who just shrugged with no apology and went to clean it.

This is really bad; even on the simplest charter carrier you would expect that at least the lavatories are clean....and this is J on EK.....????

No water run and no one to check on your call button ??? In J on EK ????

I had similiar experiences on EK both in Y and J so not too surprised about the bad crew. However my last flight with them in Oct last year, DXB-LAX, the crew in Y was actually really good especially a girl from Ghana. Not so many Australian F/As on that flight.

I also have had better experiences on QR than EK generally speaking.

I agree with you that the massive J class section makes it seem like less of a true J-class.

I also believe that the crew is the most important factor when it comes to serivce on board.

Too bad EK has sunk this low.

I recently flew V Australia (VA) and it was a great experience. See ,my trip report. You may want to try them in J, it would be interesting to hear how they would rate. I'll try TAM Brasil (JJ) in a few weeks.

The777Man

[Edited 2010-06-03 02:03:19]
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
WAC
Posts: 126
Joined: Sat Nov 29, 2008 10:31 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 9:33 am

i have never liked C product on EK and never fly with them. Flew 4 times in J/C and once in Y. Y was the best value of money. Their hard product is good but service and DXB airport just are a failure. TBH find AF/KE/LH and sometimes AZ better and flying direct Europe-Asia is just better for the body!
 
debonair
Posts: 2666
Joined: Sat Jan 03, 2004 10:50 pm

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 11:51 am

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
After take-off, there was a drink run followed by lunch. No amenity kits, no further meals, and no further water runs.



Thank you! You are so fantastic!!!
I had the same problem and guess what! Nobody believed me- "come on, you was flying EK, that can't happen!"
But true, even a German charter airline is offering more service than EK's policy on red eye flights: "Light on, meal service, light off, one glas of water (!!!!) before landing". At least I was expecting a cup of coffee and a biscuit, but not on EK.
 
abrelosojos
Topic Author
Posts: 4049
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 6:48 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:05 pm

Quoting toptravel (Reply 1):
I agree with everything you say, I used to love EK but somehow lately the service on board has slipped, as much as I love the 380 I think the service is terrible. Somehow they have the service in B/C all screwed up, 45 minutes between courses you just loose interest and get tired of the whole thing. last time I flew from DXB to Sydney I had red wine spilt on me by a flight attended who was not paying attention, some time later I was given a RAG to wipe myself down, not a hint of 'Sorry' Now I'm a Gold member with them, so I have a lot of experience on EK, but as I said I've also lost interest in them. I like QR a lot better these days.

= I think the problem is that they have lost their attention to detail in their attempt to make it a mass commodity.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 2):
However, I'm a bit shocked that you had another negative experience on EK - somehow it seems the airline tries hard to disappoint whenever you are on board.

= EK used to be good - until say 2002-2003. Here is my analysis on them. If you are sitting in YCL, you're immediately impressed by the ICE, menu cards, etc. and overlook the detail. In JCL, you notice the detail because they are all missing. The last decent EK flight I had was on BAH-DXB in 2009 with a wonderful South African crew.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 2):

Very odd. On my last EK journey they even said "Welcome on board, Mr. XXXX." at the door - on my way to the Y Class cabin, btw.

= This is impressive. If they can look at the boarding pass and say this in YCL, I am sure they are capable of service. I assume they looked at your boarding pass?

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 2):

What's your impression of the A380 itself? Do you also think it's over-hyped?

= Personally, I think it is a little over-hyped. The first experience is unique - and you're impressed by the size of it - after that, it loses its appeal. My biggest gripe with the EK configuration is that it does not feel intimate at all. I used to have a lot of interaction with CX upper management who believed that they were OK with a 40% load in F and 60% in J at the right yields to maintain "class". Now, I understand their philosophy much better.

What's your take on it?

BTW, I have a few of your reports to read.

Quoting The777Man (Reply 3):
This is really bad; even on the simplest charter carrier you would expect that at least the lavatories are clean....and this is J on EK.....????

= Yup. I had to take a picture and the camera phone was all I had.

Quoting The777Man (Reply 3):
I had similiar experiences on EK both in Y and J so not too surprised about the bad crew. However my last flight with them in Oct last year, DXB-LAX, the crew in Y was actually really good especially a girl from Ghana.

= Sorry to hear of your experiences.

Quoting The777Man (Reply 3):

Too bad EK has sunk this low.

= This is the most horrible part. When EK was a small airline in the region, it really was a pleasure to fly them.

Quoting The777Man (Reply 3):
You may want to try them in J, it would be interesting to hear how they would rate. I'll try TAM Brasil (JJ) in a few weeks.

= Australia is not on my list of countries to visit sooon, but would keep them in mind. Good to see you fly again. BTW, where is your report? I can't find any link  .

Quoting WAC (Reply 4):
i have never liked C product on EK and never fly with them. Flew 4 times in J/C and once in Y. Y was the best value of money. Their hard product is good but service and DXB airport just are a failure. TBH find AF/KE/LH and sometimes AZ better and flying direct Europe-Asia is just better for the body!

= You know ... I have had better experiences in EK YCL than in EK JCL. Go figure!

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
SASDC8
Posts: 530
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:01 pm

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 12:42 pm

Thanks for another great report  

Some of the things you noted is totally unacceptable for international J-Class, especially the filthy bathroom and EK's slooow lunch service.

Maybe they have grown to fast for real customer training and quality control of their cabin crews??

I was considering EK J for my next long haul, but after reading your report I am in no hurry to do so.

Thanks  

Cheers
Stein
2-3-2 is NOT a premium configuration
 
B747forever
Posts: 12855
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 9:50 pm

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 6:24 pm

Great TR

Quite surprised that you had such a bad experience on EK. I expected it to be a totally different story!

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
When asked about the internet connection, she snapped, %u201Csir, if you looked properly you would see it in front of you.



How rude.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
was in for a second shock when I went to the bathroom prior to take-off to find it filthy with toilet paper everywhere and empty amenity drawers sticking out. While I can still understand this at the end of a flight, I just find it absolutely unacceptable at the beginning of a flight %u2026 that too in JCL! WTF! Of course, I made a note of it to the crew members hanging out in the rear galley (remember, this is the bathroom right there) who just shrugged with no apology and went to clean it



Quite shocking to find the toilet in such a filthy state.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Witnessing the diversity of LHR is probably the best thing that can be said of the Emirates lounge)



Great pics.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
The 744 is still the more graceful aircraft)



I agree with you.


Thank you for sharing

B747forever
Work Hard, Fly Right
 
akhmad
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 7:06 pm

Hi Alex,

Thank you for this very well appreciated insight review of EK J product from LHR. Shame about your overall experience. I had expected the most of EK J on board their A380's.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
When asked about the internet connection, she snapped, “sir, if you looked properly you would see it in front of you.”

Why an answer in such way? It was not a silly question after all!

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
I was shocked to see there were no flight attendants greeting us. In fact, they seem to be mostly chatting in the rear galley near the bar area. Not a great impression.
Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
I was in for a second shock when I went to the bathroom prior to take-off to find it filthy with toilet paper everywhere and empty amenity drawers sticking out. While I can still understand this at the end of a flight, I just find it absolutely unacceptable at the beginning of a flight … that too in JCL!

Very bad! And just look how the attendants reacted upon your notification. I mean, it would have not bothered me if it was at a discotheque, but come on, they were doing business at a premium level there!

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Why does it take 45 minutes between my mezze and Main course is beyond me.

Me too. If it was at any restaurant on the ground, you could have stood up and left, but not that time.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
(Shouldn’t they update this by now?)

They should. If the blockbusters can get updated on monthly basis, why not their route network as well?

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Most of the time, they could be found chatting loudly in the rear galley (for example, I found out the “gossip” on who was sleeping with who; crew parties; how they thrashed a hotel in London and are “non grata” there, the two tracks of salary and duty and how you move between the two, and of course the latest on which club in DXB gives the girls free drinks).

OMG, even as a passenger, I would not dare talking such things loudly.

Somehow I am wondering how the F and Y passengers had experienced your flight.

Thanks again.

Cheers,
Suryo
Friends forever
 
The777Man
Posts: 5911
Joined: Sun Jul 04, 1999 4:54 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 8:29 pm

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):
Good to see you fly again. BTW, where is your report? I can't find any link .

Not sure how to post a link but check a bit farther down on the Trip Reports page or do a search on my username.

The777Man
Boeing 777s flown: UA, TG, KE, BA, CX, NH, JD, JL, CZ, SQ, EK, NG, CO, AF, SV, KU, DL, AA, MH, OZ, CA, MS, SU, LY, RG, PE, AZ, KL, VN, PK, EY, NZ, AM, BR, AC, DT, UU, OS, AI, 9W, KQ, QR, VA, JJ, ET, TK, PR, BG, T5, CI, MU and LX.. Further to fly.. LH 777
 
Flightsimboy
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 8:58 pm

Emirates is totally over-hyped. It's a hit and miss with them, with no consistent service on every sector like MH and LH. The shorter the sectors on EK, the more brilliant the crew, the longer the sector, some of the FAs start showing their anguish before they even take off. This one girl on the DXB-JFK looked so annoyed while boarding and stayed that way until she actually got some rest in the crew rest areas.

It doesn't take much to see that most EK crew are not career oriented, just working on EK for the fast lifestyle, glamorous accomodations and perks that come with seeing the world. In two to maximum four years, they've left, richer than when they joined and left the airline in a far worse condition then when they started, because their inhospitable attitude has contributed to the downfall. Quite frankly, when people see this airline spiraling out of control, the fewer people will be flying their J & F class products.

Regarding their ICE system, it's just sparkles and dazzles so that you get so engrossed in it, you practically don't realise the crappy service around you. But for the seasoned traveller and especially those in J & F class who savour the experience, they are the ones who can actually see where this airline is heading. Just read any of the reviews of the last few days on www.airlinequality.com and the amount of x red cross marks on those reports.

Thanks for exposing the crappy service on the J class sectors of this carrier.

PS: Interesting that you mentioned that some EK reports here are from EK insiders...Hmmmm!!

I was just lucky with my last experience with them where they redeemed themselves, but overall their crews are no match to some of the world renowned cabin crew like MH! Whoever hires these EK FAs needs to be sacked and sent packing home!!

[Edited 2010-06-03 14:26:16]
 
ChrisCruise
Posts: 91
Joined: Wed May 19, 2010 6:46 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 9:59 pm

Hey Alex,

Great report and well argumented criticism.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Boarding for J and F passengers happen directly from the lounge, and while this may seem exclusive, it just isn’t. When you get an entire deck of “premium” passengers, the whole concept of “premium” and “intimate” gets lost.

I can imagine! Although never flew business/first before, I can imagine the nice thing about it is the feel of exclusivity to be onboard with just a few people in a small cabin.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Emirates used to be a joy to fly with. For anything that can be bought by money, Emirates is stellar (aircraft, IFE, etc.). For me, however, it is an airline that lost her soul somewhere along the way. Emirates feels mass produced and not intimate for those of us who have a passion for flying. Passengers (especially in YCL) will be wowed by their IFE, their mood lighting, their shiny aircraft, etc. However, those interested in finding a service standard which is “special” will be left disappointed. Sub standard meals, crowded lounges with indifferent ground staff, poor drinks, etc. can be overlooked. However, the crew on board Emirates was just disappointing. Their attitude was completely misplaced – and as much as I have had consistently poor experience transiting at Doha, Qatar Airways on-board crew is really good. Perhaps, Emirates needs to look internally as it continues growing. And perhaps, it needs to revisit where it recruits her crew from.

In my opinion the logical sacrifice an airline has to make when expanding so vastly! Growing on such a scale can only mean sacrificing on employee quality and customer service. They just need the people to staff their aircraft and then you cannot permit to hire only top-notch.

I hope that if their expension drift slows down, they are able to focus again on improving customer service!

Thanks for sharing and looking forward to your next one!

Adios,

Christian
Flown:319, 320, 321, 343, 388, 733, 738, 742, 744, 752, 763, 764, 772, 77W, CR7, CR9, DC9-31, E70, E90, F70, F100, MD11
 
daron4000
Posts: 604
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 03, 2010 10:03 pm

No surprises here. The EK product has gone so far downhill that while I once used to look forward to flying them, I now seek to fly other airlines. Primarily for the same reason that is disinterested crew. While I have only read reports about Qatar and Etihad, it seems that they are still small enough that the culture of cabin service means something. I used to think of EK as THE Middle Eastern quality airline, especially at the time they introduced those novel and amazing looking suites on the new A345. However, that is long gone, and their A380 flagship interiors look cheap and mass produced. Nowadays, it seems to me like it is Etihad that leads the pack in service quality. Shame for EK. Good news for SQ and the like of traditional high quality airlines that are so threatened by EKs expansion.
 
Milesdependent
Posts: 581
Joined: Sat Sep 08, 2001 5:27 pm

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jun 04, 2010 3:26 am

NIce report Alex, thanks for posting. I agree that EK in J class is not great. Although I have only done 5 or so longhaul EK flights in J class, they were all varying degrees of poor. I have been more impressed with EK in economy class. Some of the crew are friendly and warm people, and in Y class where you don't expect much, this is really noticable. I have had quite a few long chats with EK crew in the galleys on long Y class flights.

For business class I'd never fly EK. But for Y class, the seats are decent and the ICE system is tremendous, so they will continue to get my Y class business. I'd take EK Y class over almost any other airline for a long-haul.
 
User avatar
vivekman2006
Posts: 400
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jun 04, 2010 3:29 am

Hey Alex,

Another fine Trip report from you! I am aghast to see what you experienced on a supposedly premium product on their flagship flight!  Wow!
Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
I am increasingly involved in business development in the Indian Ocean region and was slated to go back to Mauritius for work.

To Mauritius?? On Work?? WOW! I really envy you.  


Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Later on, I could view my itinerary … though, could not make any changes or edit my seat choice.

I wonder why?? I mean, I just checked my intinerary a couple of days ago, and made quite a few changes/modifications including seat selection. Is this an exception?

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
When asked about the internet connection, she snapped, “sir, if you looked properly you would see it in front of you.”

That is RUDE!

And coming from a person in the customer service industry is absolutely unacceptable!   

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Upon entering the big bird (my first time in commercial flight), I was shocked to see there were no flight attendants greeting us

Man! That has never happened to me. Even on the cheapest low cost carrier!  Wow!


Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Most of the time, they could be found chatting loudly in the rear galley (for example, I found out the “gossip” on who was sleeping with who; crew parties; how they thrashed a hotel in London and are “non grata” there, the two tracks of salary and duty and how you move between the two, and of course the latest on which club in DXB gives the girls free drinks).

This is seriously pathetic. I wonder if you thought of lodging a formal complaint with EK. Although I have heard and read mainly positive reviews about EK crews, these seemed to be from another planet altogether. Such bad apples give the whole airline a bad name. They deserve to be punished - so that other passengers do not have a similar experience!  

I have an EK flight coming up in a few days and I am starting to wonder how the experience would be!   


- Vivek
 
lalib
Posts: 39
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jun 04, 2010 6:53 am

abrelosojos,

A very informative report thanks!

I agree with you that the crew is the most important aspect of the flight and I myself can't stand laziness.

My experince SQ's has one of the best crew
 
Carfield
Posts: 2026
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jun 04, 2010 7:29 am

Thanks for another trip report!

I whole heartedly agree with you regarding EK service. It has gone downhill significantly, while other airlines in the region like Qatar and Oman Air, seem to catch up quickly. QR is especially an excellent airline when comes to onboard service. Emirates is no longer the same airline as before!

I had a couple trips in F for the past couple months and none were memorable. Service standard really varies and the F/As were less attentive than before. I had another flight tomorrow and am hoping for better, but not setting up any expectation. EK Business Class seats look nice though, but it definitely takes much effort to maintain it. Restocking all the mini bars in J look difficult considered the amount of drinks, but it is still no excuse. EK may just need to hire more cleaning staff or uses another company at LHR.

Thanks again for the report and look forward to your next one!

Carfield
 
AI151
Posts: 287
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:20 pm

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jun 04, 2010 10:35 am

Hi Alex yet another great and informative TR. Its a shame that you didn't get the real EK on this flight.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
When asked about the internet connection, she snapped, “sir, if you looked properly you would see it in front of you.” WTF. I did not want to get into a conversation about her manners so went inside.

Despite flying from LHR so many times, these comments come from all staff whether they be at the information points, check-in desks or in the lounges.

For the first time I actually read more negative than positive comments about EK and I have to fully agree with you. Having to queue up from inside the lounge has taken away the exclusive J class feeling. The on board welcome normally shows as to how the entire flight would go. In this case it would have been good to at least have got one!!

Toilets looked a shambles and very messy as it seems that the cleaning staff didn't even get on board to do anything! The food looked nice however as you said presentation was not good at all.

Definitely agree with you that the most positive aspect is the ICE entertainment system.

On the whole could it be a sign of the times that EK's standards might be falling whereas airlines like QR, WY and EY are on the rise.

Sandeep (AI151)
Modern Vision. Timeless Traditions...
 
pacifique75
Posts: 105
Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 2:20 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sat Jun 05, 2010 4:46 pm

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Upon entering the big bird (my first time in commercial flight), I was shocked to see there were no flight attendants greeting us. In

Can I just ask - do you mean no F/A in the cabin or actually at the door?? If it was at the door, it is very strange and actually breaching the British civil aviation rules that state flights into or from the UK must have every pax boarding card checked by a crew member at the aircraft door...
So, things onboard EK even in J arent as marvellous as countless people tell me when they are flying the airline I work
for and make remarks such as "If this was on EK...". You even found an empty bottle of water in the J cabin.
From an F/A point of view, I am curious to know if that is restocked by catering or the crew before pax boarding.
Ah, regarding the toilet - I am almost certain what happened is that a pax used the toilet before you got in and left it
in that state. I just find it hard to believe that F/A wouldnt spot it during the preboard/security checks!
While it is a really bad first impression, I guess F/A were busy in the cabin during the boarding stage and didnt notice
the state of that lavatory.
I have flown 2 sectors on EK (LHR-DXB-LHR) and in my view it is well overrated, at least in Y.
Thanks for the TR, yours always make an interesting reading.
 
toptravel
Posts: 100
Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:36 pm

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Wed Jun 09, 2010 8:26 am

Really the problem EK have with B/C on the A380 is that the galley is at the back of the cabin, a lot of walking from the back to front carrying meals etc, a bad time and motion situation, that really needs to be addressed if the service on such a beautiful airplane can be corrected.
 
abrelosojos
Topic Author
Posts: 4049
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 10, 2010 6:19 am

Quoting WAC (Reply 4):
i have never liked C product on EK and never fly with them. Flew 4 times in J/C and once in Y. Y was the best value of money. Their hard product is good but service and DXB airport just are a failure. TBH find AF/KE/LH and sometimes AZ better and flying direct Europe-Asia is just better for the body!

= I agree with you completely. Y is definitely good value for money especially given some of the hard products. If you shut up and endure the hard product, EK is a fine choice.

Quoting SASDC8 (Reply 7):
Maybe they have grown to fast for real customer training and quality control of their cabin crews??

= Well, a good airline management usually plans for these things.

Quoting akhmad (Reply 9):
I had expected the most of EK J on board their A380's.

= So had I.

Quoting akhmad (Reply 9):
Very bad! And just look how the attendants reacted upon your notification. I mean, it would have not bothered me if it was at a discotheque, but come on, they were doing business at a premium level there!

= This is more of the issue - and totally shocking the response that was generated by the crew.

Quoting akhmad (Reply 9):
OMG, even as a passenger, I would not dare talking such things loudly.

= Agreed. But hey, now I know all the dirty scoop on Emirates  .

Quoting The777Man (Reply 10):
Not sure how to post a link but check a bit farther down on the Trip Reports page or do a search on my username.

The777Man

= I am trying to, but still not able to find.

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 11):
Emirates is totally over-hyped.

= Seems increasingly to be the consensus here.

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 11):
The shorter the sectors on EK, the more brilliant the crew, the longer the sector, some of the FAs start showing their anguish before they even take off. This one girl on the DXB-JFK looked so annoyed while boarding and stayed that way until she actually got some rest in the crew rest areas.

= Completely agreed. As mentioned, there are several good short sectors I had great EK crew on.

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 11):
But for the seasoned traveller and especially those in J & F class who savour the experience, they are the ones who can actually see where this airline is heading. Just read any of the reviews of the last few days on www.airlinequality.com and the amount of x red cross marks on those reports.

= Wow. I just read airlinequality.com and am shocked at how poor some of the reviews have been.

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 11):
PS: Interesting that you mentioned that some EK reports here are from EK insiders...Hmmmm!!

= Yup ...

Quoting ChrisCruise (Reply 12):
In my opinion the logical sacrifice an airline has to make when expanding so vastly! Growing on such a scale can only mean sacrificing on employee quality and customer service. They just need the people to staff their aircraft and then you cannot permit to hire only top-notch.

= I don't necessarily agree. Several airlines have been successful in doing both.

Quoting daron4000 (Reply 13):
No surprises here. The EK product has gone so far downhill that while I once used to look forward to flying them, I now seek to fly other airlines. Primarily for the same reason that is disinterested crew.

= Wow. Seems like the general consensus.

Quoting daron4000 (Reply 13):
However, that is long gone, and their A380 flagship interiors look cheap and mass produced.

= This is a great choice of words .. mass produced.

Quoting MilesDependent (Reply 14):
I have been more impressed with EK in economy class.

= Me too.

Quoting vivekman2006 (Reply 15):
To Mauritius?? On Work?? WOW! I really envy you.  

= Trust me ... during work trips, all you do is shuttle between the airport, client site, and hotel.

Quoting vivekman2006 (Reply 15):
I wonder why?? I mean, I just checked my intinerary a couple of days ago, and made quite a few changes/modifications including seat selection. Is this an exception?

= Is your itinerary all EK segments?

Quoting vivekman2006 (Reply 15):
I wonder if you thought of lodging a formal complaint with EK. Although I have heard and read mainly positive reviews about EK crews, these seemed to be from another planet altogether. Such bad apples give the whole airline a bad name. They deserve to be punished - so that other passengers do not have a similar experience!  

= I did. Its been months and have not heard anything from them.

Quoting Carfield (Reply 17):
I whole heartedly agree with you regarding EK service.

= Wow. Again, seems like the emerging consensus.

Quoting Pacifique75 (Reply 19):
Can I just ask - do you mean no F/A in the cabin or actually at the door?? If it was at the door, it is very strange and actually breaching the British civil aviation rules that state flights into or from the UK must have every pax boarding card checked by a crew member at the aircraft door...

= Definitely a violation of British CAA rules. I have already notified some contacts on the same.

Quoting Pacifique75 (Reply 19):
Ah, regarding the toilet - I am almost certain what happened is that a pax used the toilet before you got in and left it

= Perhaps - though, this is surprising as it was a JCL cabin. What was disappointing was the response of the crew when I pointed it out.

Wow. I am surprised that there has been such an overwhelming response of people saying negative things about Emirates. I guess their product has sharply declined since yesteryears.

Thanks for reading.

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
tk747
Posts: 288
Joined: Fri Sep 04, 2009 8:53 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 10, 2010 6:47 am

I definitely agree with you about EK's falling levels of service. I flew them SYD-DXB-ZRH-DXB-BKK-SYD and the service on all legs except BKK-SYD was far below that of other airlines. The crew for the most part seemed uninterested and even a little tired.

The Australian members of the crew were probably the worst, you could hear them in the galley discussing their latest erm "exploits". On all of my flights the only crew who seemed to remotely enjoy what they were doing were the Arab and South Asian members of the crew.
 
kaitak
Posts: 8934
Joined: Wed Aug 18, 1999 5:49 am

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:59 pm

It's a bad experience from what should be a good carrier; however, it is important that they know about it. It's all very well for us to gripe about it here, but the message needs to be put across strongly to EK itself. The service you received from EK was nothing short of disgraceful and personally, if I received service of this level, I'd be looking for a refund.

Have you written to EK about this? Do you plan to? With EK's expansion plans (as evidenced by a slightly increased A380 order book this week), they're going to need to "kick some ass" on the service quality front. They can't be unaware of the increasing level of disappointment among pax. Maybe it'll take something like a banner headline in a major industry publication, along the lines of "the world's most overrated airline".
 
bastew
Posts: 740
Joined: Fri Sep 15, 2006 9:21 pm

RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:25 pm

Hey, a really interesting trip report to read, especially from the cabin crew POV.

I have a few friends that fly for EK, or I should used to. Many describe almost being 'duped' into the offer of a glamorous expat lifestyle by slick recruitment campaigns but the reality is miles apart. There was an interesting article in the Economist this week which mentions that EK aircraft and crew utilisation are amongst the highest in the industry. EK crew work some crazily exhausting work patterns. For example they can do a flight from europe landing into their home base of dubai on say Monday and check in for a Manila at 02:30 on Tuesday. The opportunity for rest here is minimal. We stay at the same hotel as the EK crew in Sydney and some of their slips in Sydney are as little as ten hours. Or 18 hours on a non stop DXB - GRU. And they have some crazy policies regarding rest on board.....they are allowed to sit in the rest seats but NOT close their eyes. And this applies on sectors even as long as DXB - PER.

This should never be an excuse for poor or rude service. But pure tirdness is definitely a factor. Just think about how much more productive people are in their own jobs when they've had a good rest.

All these sort of conditions: minimal rest at home base, on board and down route are going to lead to crew that are tired and not willing to go the extra mile. Also i'm sure many crew join an airline to see the world.....which would be difficult to do with emirates downroute rest time. It would just become a job. Easy-ish money and trying to hang in there to get your five year sevice bonus. The accommodation provided in dubai is not luxurious and all apartments are shared. And while Dubai isn't too bad on the 'cosmpolitan' scale for the mid-east it certainly isnt sydney, paris, london, new york, LA etc. Freedoms are still pretty limited and remember......EK OWN you while you are there.

I think the motivations for the SE asian and subcontinent crew working for EK are diffierent (and perhaps even the sth africans). They are working for a company that offers vastly superior terms and conditions than any they could work for in their home country. Whereas the western europeans, Aussies, kiwis, canadians, american et al know that they are being worked hard and the expat life is not all they had hoped. The crew recruited from the poorer countries NEED this job as they know opportunities like this to send money home are few and far between.

Perhaps the other middle eastern carriers are avoiding this conundrum. I flew Qatar Airways about 8 years ago from London to Bangkok via Doha. There was a real mix of crew, but predominatly they were western european....brits, french, italian etc. I flew with them again in April to the maldives and was suprised that on out of all four sectors I didnt encounter a single western european/aussie/kiwi crew member. They were all south/southeast asian or eastern european.
 
ba319-131
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sat Jun 12, 2010 8:17 am

Hi Alex,

Nice read, another well documented journey, thanks for posting.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
While there has been several EK reports (surprisingly, several by EK %u2018insiders%u2019), I believe this would be the first on the 380 on the LHR-DXB link. Perhaps I am wrong?
Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Emirates’ J class cabin on their 380 lacked the intimate feeling that a Business class cabin should have. I recognize the revenue potential of having this many JCL seats and also understand that from their business model perspective, volume is only way to profitability. However, I felt that EK’s configuration lost the very essence of what many seek from a J-class experience

- You have a good point, the only time it feels intimate IMO is when you are tucked away in your window seat.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Having said that, the seats themselves were fantastic offering several comfortable seating and relaxing options. It went to a full-flat bed seamlessly and the design offered ample privacy. There was enough storage space and I did like the “mini-bar” that came with

- Indeed the seats are good as is storage. The mini bar is nice though lacks any cooler for the drinks themselves.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
(Not so nice main dish

- Indeed, presentation is pretty weak.

Overall your flight shows a pretty weak product, hardware might be nice but the soft stuff, staff, food etc need to be to standard, they are what really make a flight a good one.

Regards

Mark
111,732,3,4,5,7,8,BBJ,741,742,743,744,752,762,763,764,772,77L,773,77W,L15,D10,30,40,AB3,AB6,A312.313,319,320,321,332,333
 
PlaneHunter
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sat Jun 12, 2010 9:07 am

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):
If you are sitting in YCL, you're immediately impressed by the ICE, menu cards, etc. and overlook the detail.

Well, on most of my EK flights I didn't have a reason to complain about the cabin crew - they were nice and delivered a good service.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):
This is impressive. If they can look at the boarding pass and say this in YCL, I am sure they are capable of service. I assume they looked at your boarding pass?

Yes, they saw my name on the boarding pass. I remember someone here saying that EK flight attendants are encouraged to say the name if it can be easily pronounced.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):
= Personally, I think it is a little over-hyped. The first experience is unique - and you're impressed by the size of it - after that, it loses its appeal.

Exactly my thoughts.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):
What's your take on it?

Y Class passengers can find the same product on other aircraft, too. EK and SQ for example have almost the same Y Class interior on newer 777s. As for the low cabin noise level on the A380 - I don't think it's an advantage because you hear other (mostly unwanted) sounds better.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):
BTW, I have a few of your reports to read.

  


PH
Nothing's worse than flying the same reg twice!
 
abrelosojos
Topic Author
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sun Jun 13, 2010 4:05 am

Quoting tk747 (Reply 22):
The Australian members of the crew were probably the worst, you could hear them in the galley discussing their latest erm "exploits". On all of my flights the only crew who seemed to remotely enjoy what they were doing were the Arab and South Asian members of the crew.

= Must agree here. I have also found their South African and British crews to be excellent.

Quoting kaitak (Reply 23):
It's a bad experience from what should be a good carrier; however, it is important that they know about it. It's all very well for us to gripe about it here, but the message needs to be put across strongly to EK itself. The service you received from EK was nothing short of disgraceful and personally, if I received service of this level, I'd be looking for a refund.

= I took this trip in February and wrote to them almost immediately. It is middle of June and have not heard anything back from them.

Quoting kaitak (Reply 23):
Maybe it'll take something like a banner headline in a major industry publication, along the lines of "the world's most overrated airline".

= Do you think they would care? Increasingly, I find their customer service more like Spirit's with a amazing lack of interest in customer feedback.

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
I have a few friends that fly for EK, or I should used to. Many describe almost being 'duped' into the offer of a glamorous expat lifestyle by slick recruitment campaigns but the reality is miles apart. There was an interesting article in the Economist this week which mentions that EK aircraft and crew utilisation are amongst the highest in the industry. EK crew work some crazily exhausting work patterns. For example they can do a flight from europe landing into their home base of dubai on say Monday and check in for a Manila at 02:30 on Tuesday. The opportunity for rest here is minimal. We stay at the same hotel as the EK crew in Sydney and some of their slips in Sydney are as little as ten hours. Or 18 hours on a non stop DXB - GRU. And they have some crazy policies regarding rest on board.....they are allowed to sit in the rest seats but NOT close their eyes. And this applies on sectors even as long as DXB - PER.

= Tough conditions. However, one would think that the girls/guys would do their research before signing up no?

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
This should never be an excuse for poor or rude service. But pure tirdness is definitely a factor. Just think about how much more productive people are in their own jobs when they've had a good rest.

= Again, if some crew members can do it, why not others?

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
I think the motivations for the SE asian and subcontinent crew working for EK are diffierent (and perhaps even the sth africans). They are working for a company that offers vastly superior terms and conditions than any they could work for in their home country. Whereas the western europeans, Aussies, kiwis, canadians, american et al know that they are being worked hard and the expat life is not all they had hoped. The crew recruited from the poorer countries NEED this job as they know opportunities like this to send money home are few and far between.

= I disagree with this. First because, there are enough emerging market carriers expanding and offering relatively good perks to their national staffers - I work as an aviation consultant and trust me, crew expenses are not that different.

Secondly, the good crew I have received have also been Kiwis, and a few Brit here and there.

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
Perhaps the other middle eastern carriers are avoiding this conundrum. I flew Qatar Airways about 8 years ago from London to Bangkok via Doha. There was a real mix of crew, but predominatly they were western european....brits, french, italian etc. I flew with them again in April to the maldives and was suprised that on out of all four sectors I didnt encounter a single western european/aussie/kiwi crew member. They were all south/southeast asian or eastern european.

= Crews should be chosen irrespective of nationality based on them being able to handle a job.

Quoting ba319-131 (Reply 25):
Overall your flight shows a pretty weak product, hardware might be nice but the soft stuff, staff, food etc need to be to standard, they are what really make a flight a good one.

= I have been on my most severe work travel schedule ever to places where dial-up is a major perk ... it is on my priority to-do list  . You have many trips coming up?

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
Flightsimboy
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sun Jun 13, 2010 6:09 am

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
The Australian members of the crew were probably the worst, you could hear them in the galley discussing their latest erm "exploits". On all of my flights the only crew who seemed to remotely enjoy what they were doing were the Arab and South Asian members of the crew.
Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
Perhaps the other middle eastern carriers are avoiding this conundrum. I flew Qatar Airways about 8 years ago from London to Bangkok via Doha. There was a real mix of crew, but predominatly they were western european....brits, french, italian etc. I flew with them again in April to the maldives and was suprised that on out of all four sectors I didnt encounter a single western european/aussie/kiwi crew member. They were all south/southeast asian or eastern european.

Looks like the Aussies are only there to experience the World LOL, which would be very difficult to see otherwise. Don't get me wrong, I love Australia, love the Aussies and wouldn't have been there four times already   
 
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NZ107
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Tue Jun 22, 2010 4:26 am

Hi Alex,

An excellent and very interesting report showing yet another inconsistent display by Emirates. I'm sorry to hear about this bad experience, it just seems so unacceptable to be treated like that. Thanks for sharing! I'm sure you felt obliged to as soon as that bad service came around.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
I could view my itinerary … though, could not make any changes or edit my seat choice.

That's strange.. I can always change my seats whenever I book Economy.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
When asked about the internet connection, she snapped, “sir, if you looked properly you would see it in front of you.”

What on earth.. Not very good impressions at all, leading back to check in as well.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Boarding for J and F passengers happen directly from the lounge, and while this may seem exclusive, it just isn’t. When you get an entire deck of “premium” passengers, the whole concept of “premium” and “intimate” gets lost. With significant lines to board, I felt like I was flying Y-class than J-class of a globally well established airline.

I've always thought it'd be awesome to board straight from the lounge. Now I guess I've thought twice about it. But in fair honesty, if you were on a 77L or another plane, it'd probably feel much different than what you experienced.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
I was shocked to see there were no flight attendants greeting us. In fact, they seem to be mostly chatting in the rear galley near the bar area. Not a great impression.

I have been impressed with Emirates ever since I took that flight early last year SYD-AKL on the A380. Each time I was greeted by name. All of this in Economy Class. It could be that flying Y is the way to go with EK as their meals are generally better than anyone else's and the IFE is good like you've mentioned above. But I don't see how they can give Economy passengers a nicer perception than what Business passengers get.. Maybe it's a factor of Y class passengers thinking how excellent their Y experience was that they'd try J the next time round. I feel as though service has gone downhill on the A380.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
I was in for a second shock when I went to the bathroom prior to take-off to find it filthy with toilet paper everywhere and empty amenity drawers sticking out. While I can still understand this at the end of a flight, I just find it absolutely unacceptable at the beginning of a flight … that too in JCL! WTF! Of course, I made a note of it to the crew members hanging out in the rear galley (remember, this is the bathroom right there) who just shrugged with no apology and went to clean it.

Horrible. I would also question the ground staff in that case, sounds like some jealous person came and took everything. Still no excuse for the mess.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
and no further water runs.

I was fortunate enough to try EK's A345 service in April (TR a little way off) and I was a bit surprised at how much better the service was on the smaller plane. MEL-AKL had a FA doing water runs in Y. I was very impressed and thought that the service was a big step up from the A380 even though supposedly EK have put a lot of emphasis into their service onboard the A380. I guess that's just gone to waste. Just to compare with that A345 flight - there were NO water runs on any of my 3 A380 flights AKL-SYD and v/v.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Why does it take 45 minutes between my mezze and Main course is beyond me.

Sounds just like my agonising wait for a drink with my meal in the A380.

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
This is probably Emirate’s most impressive selling point.

Definitely. But recently I've just been listening to my iPod instead so it hasn't been as big a grab as it used to. I'm sure it wins kids over!

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
There were 2 good standouts (one South African and one Kiwi) which reaffirmed my belief that EK’s best crews are South African and South Asian

Since when was New Zealand part of South Asia?   And don't say Australia either!

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):
The first experience is unique - and you're impressed by the size of it - after that, it loses its appeal.

Exactly. It loses its charm. Too bad it operates the only EK AKL-SYD flight.. I guess I should keep up trying different airlines on the trans Tasman.


Regards,
Nicholas
It's all about the destination AND the journey.
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jun 25, 2010 4:14 pm

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 28):
Looks like the Aussies are only there to experience the World LOL, which would be very difficult to see otherwise.

= I wonder how service is like on Qantas. Usually, I have read it's very good ... and I need to try it one of these days to find out myself.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
An excellent and very interesting report showing yet another inconsistent display by Emirates. I'm sorry to hear about this bad experience, it just seems so unacceptable to be treated like that. Thanks for sharing! I'm sure you felt obliged to as soon as that bad service came around.

= Actually, I decide on what airline/route/flight I would report on BEFORE I fly ... this way, my report is more objective and not a rant. Of course, if its crappy service (like this one), it is reported as such.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
That's strange.. I can always change my seats whenever I book Economy.

= I am beginning to think that perhaps EK needs to be flown only in YCL  . I have actually had fairly decent experience in Y.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
I've always thought it'd be awesome to board straight from the lounge. Now I guess I've thought twice about it. But in fair honesty, if you were on a 77L or another plane, it'd probably feel much different than what you experienced.

= You're probably right.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
I have been impressed with Emirates ever since I took that flight early last year SYD-AKL on the A380. Each time I was greeted by name. All of this in Economy Class. It could be that flying Y is the way to go with EK as their meals are generally better than anyone else's and the IFE is good like you've mentioned above. But I don't see how they can give Economy passengers a nicer perception than what Business passengers get.. Maybe it's a factor of Y class passengers thinking how excellent their Y experience was that they'd try J the next time round. I feel as though service has gone downhill on the A380.

= I also think that this might be because expectation from YCL pax is low these days ... so put them on an airline with a top notch IFE and a meal service with options, and we think it's a great airline?

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):

I was fortunate enough to try EK's A345 service in April (TR a little way off) and I was a bit surprised at how much better the service was on the smaller plane. MEL-AKL had a FA doing water runs in Y. I was very impressed and thought that the service was a big step up from the A380 even though supposedly EK have put a lot of emphasis into their service onboard the A380. I guess that's just gone to waste. Just to compare with that A345 flight - there were NO water runs on any of my 3 A380 flights AKL-SYD and v/v.

= Interesting (and sad) observation.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
Sounds just like my agonising wait for a drink with my meal in the A380.

= Perhaps, they need more crew ... or more pro-active crew for sure ... my JCL had plenty of crew ... though, many did not work!

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
There were 2 good standouts (one South African and one Kiwi) which reaffirmed my belief that EK’s best crews are South African and South Asian

Since when was New Zealand part of South Asia? And don't say Australia either!

= LOL. Well, there are not that many Kiwi crews I have encountered on EK ... if I did, perhaps it would be changed to "best crews are South African, South Asian, and New Zealanders"  .

Saludos and thanks for reading,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
sq_ek_freak
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jun 25, 2010 6:37 pm

Hey there, unfortunate had such a poor experience with us. Definitely should be reported, and it's shameful the company hasn't contacted a high value customer like yourself back in all this time ( and in reality it should be any passenger who lodges a complaint, not just high value passengers).

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
For example they can do a flight from europe landing into their home base of dubai on say Monday and check in for a Manila at 02:30 on Tuesday.

On very rare occasions that does happen, but in 1.5 years of working with EK it hasn't happened to me. You just need to be creative with rostering. That said, EK is working crew very hard these days, as there is a mass shortage of us. They even have business class crew working coach and first class crew working business these days.

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
EK crew work some crazily exhausting work patterns

Yes there are several tiring patterns, but again I signed up for the job with all it's tremendous perks, KNOWING full well of the hardships as well. There are some real nice patterns to work too.

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
And this applies on sectors even as long as DXB - PER.

That was when the A343 was flying the route without a crew rest area (which to me would be ridiculous). Though PER is now flown with crew rest equipped aircraft.

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
This should never be an excuse for poor or rude service. But pure tirdness is definitely a factor. Just think about how much more productive people are in their own jobs when they've had a good rest.

Yes and no, in that I really don't think it's an excuse. If I'm really tired and working a flight, I still smile and do my job well. I may not be proactively cheery as I might, but it seems as though the crew on this flight straight up didn't do their job. And this is compounded by the fact that the A380 crew (cabin crew who fly on the A380 only work on the A380) have way better schedules than us on the main fleet simply because they have a limited amount of destinations and flights to work so far.

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
The accommodation provided in dubai is not luxurious and all apartments are shared

You know going in it's shared accomdation, but you have your own bedroom and bathroom. While I wouldn't call the apartments luxurious, they still are quite nice.

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
And while Dubai isn't too bad on the 'cosmpolitan' scale for the mid-east it certainly isnt sydney, paris, london, new york,

By no stretch of the imagination. It's a fun city if you like doing certain things, but my god it's small.

Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
Perhaps the other middle eastern carriers are avoiding this conundrum. I flew Qatar Airways about 8 years ago from London to Bangkok via Doha. There was a real mix of crew, but predominatly they were western european....brits, french, italian etc. I flew with them again in April to the maldives and was suprised that on out of all four sectors I didnt encounter a single western european/aussie/kiwi crew member. They were all south/southeast asian or eastern european.

I believe QR stopped recruiting in Australia for a bit, but have since returned and picked up a few Aussies last I checked.

Quoting PlaneHunter (Reply 26):
Yes, they saw my name on the boarding pass. I remember someone here saying that EK flight attendants are encouraged to say the name if it can be easily pronounced.

Yes we are - and really it depends on the seniors on your flight. Some are a joy to work with and actively do things to encourage good crew morale and practice while others couldn't give a toss or are simply power hungry. This can be especially trying on a 9 day pattern to Australia and back.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 27):

= Again, if some crew members can do it, why not others?

Exactly! It kills me when I'm trying my best to represent EK well and I see a colleague across my cart simply itching to get off the plane and start downing mojitos at the crew hotel.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 27):
= I disagree with this. First because, there are enough emerging market carriers expanding and offering relatively good perks to their national staffers - I work as an aviation consultant and trust me, crew expenses are not that different.

Secondly, the good crew I have received have also been Kiwis, and a few Brit here and there.

I agree. It's different styles of service I feel, just given our cultural backgrounds which can compliment each other very well and give awesome service, but it's all about the will to try to do that.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 27):
= Crews should be chosen irrespective of nationality based on them being able to handle a job.

        

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
When asked about the internet connection, she snapped, “sir, if you looked properly you would see it in front of you.”

What on earth.. Not very good impressions at all, leading back to check in as well.

That's horrendous!

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 29):
I have been impressed with Emirates ever since I took that flight early last year SYD-AKL on the A380. Each time I was greeted by name. All of this in Economy Class. It could be that flying Y is the way to go with EK as their meals are generally better than anyone else's and the IFE is good like you've mentioned above. But I don't see how they can give Economy passengers a nicer perception than what Business passengers get.. Maybe it's a factor of Y class passengers thinking how excellent their Y experience was that they'd try J the next time round. I feel as though service has gone downhill on the A380.

Well us on the mainfleet are better   In all seriousness, I do believe that EK has missed the mark a bit in the way they've tried to structure the service regiment on the A380, especially in light of the way they've configured the aircraft. If they wanted a trayless service in business class (rest of the fleet still use tray service which is another issue of mine...if QR is going trayless fleet wide, should we not as well to stay up there with the best!?!) did they really think that having the ENTIRE galley in the rear of the aircraft would be efficient!? The configuration of the aircraft does not compliment the new service protocols at all - end result? Shoddy service. That said this is by no means an excuse, because regardless of what caused the absolute worst service I've heard of on EK, it's all about putting on the best face you can for the customer and working hard to ensure your passengers have a good ride. It's about overcoming difficulties to ensure people keep coming back. Be it crew fatigue, lack of coordination, blase seniors or bad configuration, EK has lost several customers in the course of this thread, and I'm sure lost the premium business of many passengers flying with you that day.

It's frustrating to me because the hardware is there, it's just the software that's lacking. There are sets of crew that I've worked with that were such a joy - we just got along so well and worked cohesively as a team and I could tell it showed...as crew you can sense when your passengers are enjoying the flight. We were the EK that our marketing teams tout on those days. On others, we resemble GF more than we do anything else.

It's too bad. Because I really think we can be a great airline - the best even - if we just tried harder.
Keep Discovering
 
abrelosojos
Topic Author
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sat Jun 26, 2010 4:01 pm

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
Definitely should be reported, and it's shameful the company hasn't contacted a high value customer like yourself back in all this time ( and in reality it should be any passenger who lodges a complaint, not just high value passengers).

= I am actually kind of shocked by this. It is end June, and no one from EK has bothered contcting me. Then again, I once wrote a compliment to a wonderful EK crew, and she later emailed to thank me for receiving the same in her post box ... it took 14 months for her to receive it! This is sad coming from an airline that is supposedly good. More so, ironic, because in the 1990s, I had sent them a complaint letter re: an experience their old A-300's on DXBKHI and got a personal call from customer relations within 3 days. How times have changed.

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
Yes there are several tiring patterns, but again I signed up for the job with all it's tremendous perks, KNOWING full well of the hardships as well. There are some real nice patterns to work too.

= Good attitude.

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
And this is compounded by the fact that the A380 crew (cabin crew who fly on the A380 only work on the A380) have way better schedules than us on the main fleet simply because they have a limited amount of destinations and flights to work so far.

= Interesting. How are the 380 crew chosen? Is this the whole thing I heard gossip on about the two tracks - and how to move between them?

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
Quoting bastew (Reply 24):
The accommodation provided in dubai is not luxurious and all apartments are shared

You know going in it's shared accomdation, but you have your own bedroom and bathroom. While I wouldn't call the apartments luxurious, they still are quite nice.

= I have actually seen enough pics of the crew accomodation at DXB to tell me that they are actually pretty decent apartment buildings.

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
By no stretch of the imagination. It's a fun city if you like doing certain things, but my god it's small.

= Yup ... especially if you stay within the circles.

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
Exactly! It kills me when I'm trying my best to represent EK well and I see a colleague across my cart simply itching to get off the plane and start downing mojitos at the crew hotel.

= Yup. Look, I have lesser problem witnessing EK crew on their off-duty thrash hotel rooms during this Carnaval in Rio ... there were a bunch there, but on duty, be professional.

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
Well us on the mainfleet are better In all seriousness, I do believe that EK has missed the mark a bit in the way they've tried to structure the service regiment on the A380, especially in light of the way they've configured the aircraft. If they wanted a trayless service in business class (rest of the fleet still use tray service which is another issue of mine...if QR is going trayless fleet wide, should we not as well to stay up there with the best!?!) did they really think that having the ENTIRE galley in the rear of the aircraft would be efficient!? The configuration of the aircraft does not compliment the new service protocols at all - end result? Shoddy service. That said this is by no means an excuse, because regardless of what caused the absolute worst service I've heard of on EK, it's all about putting on the best face you can for the customer and working hard to ensure your passengers have a good ride. It's about overcoming difficulties to ensure people keep coming back. Be it crew fatigue, lack of coordination, blase seniors or bad configuration, EK has lost several customers in the course of this thread, and I'm sure lost the premium business of many passengers flying with you that day.
Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
It's frustrating to me because the hardware is there, it's just the software that's lacking. There are sets of crew that I've worked with that were such a joy - we just got along so well and worked cohesively as a team and I could tell it showed...as crew you can sense when your passengers are enjoying the flight. We were the EK that our marketing teams tout on those days. On others, we resemble GF more than we do anything else.

It's too bad. Because I really think we can be a great airline - the best even - if we just tried harder.

= I just want to appreciate the fact that you took time to comment on this trip report. I think it is important to take time to recognize weakness as it only goes on to improve strenghts. While I have not agreed with your assessment in the past, I am extremely impressed by the well-written analysis of what is wrong with EK. Hopefully, higher-ups @ EK will recognize the systematic issues and embark on addressing them.

Truly, thank you for sharing.

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
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NZ107
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sun Jun 27, 2010 12:29 am

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 30):
I wonder how service is like on Qantas

You also need to do a long haul Air NZ one sometime too!  
Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 30):
Actually, I decide on what airline/route/flight I would report on BEFORE I fly ... this way, my report is more objective and not a rant. Of course, if its crappy service (like this one), it is reported as such.

Oh ok, I just got that impression because you're not one to report on every single flight you take.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 30):
I am beginning to think that perhaps EK needs to be flown only in YCL

Indeed, I'd like to try a flight on J for the experience but sure enough, so many reports seem to head this way. All bar Y in the A380 lol.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 30):
I also think that this might be because expectation from YCL pax is low these days ... so put them on an airline with a top notch IFE and a meal service with options, and we think it's a great airline?

Down under, I guess we do have a wealth of great carriers, especially if one was to fly to Europe (and for that matter even Australia) - CX, SQ, NZ, QF, EK, TG etc. Therefore expectations of Y still remains quite high down here if you do choose to fly these carriers.

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
Well us on the mainfleet are better

Yep, I do agree with this comment!

Quoting SQ_EK_freak (Reply 31):
It's frustrating to me because the hardware is there, it's just the software that's lacking. There are sets of crew that I've worked with that were such a joy - we just got along so well and worked cohesively as a team and I could tell it showed...as crew you can sense when your passengers are enjoying the flight. We were the EK that our marketing teams tout on those days. On others, we resemble GF more than we do anything else.

It must be frustrating Especially when you are one to also experience this inconsistency seen by passengers. It must be a really hard life sometimes.


Cheers,
Nicholas
It's all about the destination AND the journey.
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sun Jun 27, 2010 1:52 pm

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 33):
Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 30):
Actually, I decide on what airline/route/flight I would report on BEFORE I fly ... this way, my report is more objective and not a rant. Of course, if its crappy service (like this one), it is reported as such.

Oh ok, I just got that impression because you're not one to report on every single flight you take.

= Oh trust me ... I don't have the time to do a flight report on all flights I take ... besides, a weekly report on (say) CCSFRA would be kinda boring. And given I don't report on business flights, reports are usually for a very small segment ... and usually on routes which are not covered too heavily on A.Net.

I have some cool reports in the pipeline though.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 33):
You also need to do a long haul Air NZ one sometime too!

= Sadly, living in Venezuela, NZ becomes a very hard airline to take ... unless, going to NZ ... which is LONG overdue for sure!

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
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NZ107
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sun Jun 27, 2010 11:14 pm

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 34):
I don't have the time to do a flight report on all flights I take

Oh, I definitely acknowledge that! That's why I'm still stuck in November with mine! Come to think of it, I looked at the list above and find no TRs on CCS-FRA   But fair enough. Definitely looking forward to reading these up and coming ones.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 34):
Sadly, living in Venezuela, NZ becomes a very hard airline to take ... unless, going to NZ ... which is LONG overdue for sure!

I guess so but don't forget LAX-LHR/HKG-LHR for all your other travels!   Their new Y+ will be very interesting to try out when it comes. I'll be waiting for that report too!


Cheers,
Nicholas
It's all about the destination AND the journey.
 
kiramakora
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Tue Jul 13, 2010 10:31 pm

Shocking service from EK. Their in-flight service continues to slide downhill. Sad for an airline that used to pride itself (rightfully so) with excellent service.
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Mon Jul 19, 2010 7:06 pm

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 35):
Oh, I definitely acknowledge that! That's why I'm still stuck in November with mine! Come to think of it, I looked at the list above and find no TRs on CCS-FRA But fair enough. Definitely looking forward to reading these up and coming ones.

= Nicholas, the CCS-FRA flight is so routine that it is funny. 75% is work travels, so no TR's. Also, its a flight around 5pm (depending on the day) and I usually have a quick dinner, pop pills, and go to sleep.

Quoting NZ107 (Reply 35):

I guess so but don't forget LAX-LHR/HKG-LHR for all your other travels! Their new Y+ will be very interesting to try out when it comes. I'll be waiting for that report too!

= I *really* want to try the new NZ product. HKG-LHR seems most likely flight I would probably take ... but then I'd not have any excuse to visit NZ which I love!

Quoting kiramakora (Reply 36):
Shocking service from EK. Their in-flight service continues to slide downhill. Sad for an airline that used to pride itself (rightfully so) with excellent service.

= You said it  .

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
jacobin777
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Tue Jul 20, 2010 3:17 am

Quoting abrelosojos (Thread starter):
Emirates used to be a joy to fly with

  

Quoting toptravel (Reply 1):
I agree with everything you say, I used to love EK but somehow lately the service on board has slipped,

  

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):

= I think the problem is that they have lost their attention to detail in their attempt to make it a mass commodity.

  

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 6):
= EK used to be good - until say 2002-2003.

I think even until 2004 they were decent. When I flew their JFK-DXB-JFK on the A345, they had started the route only a couple of weeks prior, they were excellent to fly with.

I've been flying EK from various locations to Pakistan since the 1990's....their service used to be truly 5-star (or close to it). Even when I flew EK long haul out of LHR on a B77E or from CDG on an A330, their services was great. I recently found an old ticket itinerary of mine for DXB-KHI on an A310..  

I only fly EK now for short-haul trips to/from Pakistan only because of their scheduling, otherwise I wouldn't even fly EK if I had better choices. I feel their services have gone down quite a bit.

While the J-looked spacious, I actually like BA's J-Class as well..its a bit smaller, but feels more "private" (now I haven't flown on EK's A380 J-class so I might be mistaken with my opinion).

Apropos, excellent trip report..  
"Up the Irons!"
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Tue Jul 20, 2010 8:21 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 38):
I think even until 2004 they were decent. When I flew their JFK-DXB-JFK on the A345, they had started the route only a couple of weeks prior, they were excellent to fly with.

I've been flying EK from various locations to Pakistan since the 1990's....their service used to be truly 5-star (or close to it). Even when I flew EK long haul out of LHR on a B77E or from CDG on an A330, their services was great. I recently found an old ticket itinerary of mine for DXB-KHI on an A310..

I only fly EK now for short-haul trips to/from Pakistan only because of their scheduling, otherwise I wouldn't even fly EK if I had better choices. I feel their services have gone down quite a bit.

While the J-looked spacious, I actually like BA's J-Class as well..its a bit smaller, but feels more "private" (now I haven't flown on EK's A380 J-class so I might be mistaken with my opinion).

Apropos, excellent trip report..

= Thank you. It really is a shame EK has gone so downhill ... and the BA J cabin is infinitely better. See, JCL should offer a sense of space and privacy ... the EK cabin does nothing to this effect. For my numerous business trips to Pakistan, I usually now fly PK to DXB and connect to CCS via ATL on DL.

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
jacobin777
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Tue Jul 20, 2010 11:29 pm

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 39):
. For my numerous business trips to Pakistan, I usually now fly PK to DXB

I'm surprised you fly PK-IMHO, they are a bit lets just say, "not on the ball" sometimes...my wife and mother are flying KHI-LHE-BCN-ORD (right now in fact). They don't even have a plane assigned on the LHE-BCN-ORD sector and I couldn't even get seat reservations for them.

PK is targeting many 5th freedom BCN-ORD-BCN pax. From what I hear, they range from 40 up to 70 pax. I do believe the 40 because I've seen a number of pax who were traveling to BCN.

Point being, if PK wants to establish itself as a reputable air carrier, it has to be professional on multiple levels.

That being said, I do like PK and their service is quite consistent. I also like their food... 
Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 39):
See, JCL should offer a sense of space and privacy ... the EK cabin does nothing to this effect.

That's the feeling I got thanks to your excellent trip report...  
"Up the Irons!"
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Tue Jul 20, 2010 11:38 pm

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 40):
I'm surprised you fly PK-IMHO, they are a bit lets just say, "not on the ball" sometimes...my wife and mother are flying KHI-LHE-BCN-ORD (right now in fact). They don't even have a plane assigned on the LHE-BCN-ORD sector and I couldn't even get seat reservations for them.

= It is definitely not on the ball on many things ... and I think I commented on your post when this flight was introduced that they would have a dismal time given their crappy distribution in the U.S.

Having said that, I have got tremendously generous service on them. I remain convinced it is because I am one of the few full paying J/F pax and they are always amused at a random white guy being so involved in their service and being social to them  . Their catering on Isloo-DXB is REALLY good ... DXB-Isloo not as much.

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 40):

PK is targeting many 5th freedom BCN-ORD-BCN pax. From what I hear, they range from 40 up to 70 pax. I do believe the 40 because I've seen a number of pax who were traveling to BCN.

= They need to get their distribution right ... first of all, they will have an image issue especially in the U.S ... then, how many Americans wake up thinking ... ooo ... let me go to PIA's site for my next trip to Barca ...

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 40):
Point being, if PK wants to establish itself as a reputable air carrier, it has to be professional on multiple levels.

= Yup.

Thanks for reading.

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
Flightsimboy
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Wed Jul 21, 2010 1:28 am

"Isloo" and travelling on PK, you do have a bit of Pakistan in you lol. Would love to see a trip report on your PK flights to DXB, but I know you don't put up business trips here.
 
jacobin777
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Wed Jul 21, 2010 4:01 am

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 41):

= It is definitely not on the ball on many things ... and I think I commented on your post when this flight was introduced that they would have a dismal time given their crappy distribution in the U.S.

I agree-but so far, ostensibly, they are doing ok as the flights have been basically "jammed pack"...of course, right now is the busy season so things will slow down a bit until the "second busy season" of winter holidays starts (but its not as busy as it is during the summer).

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 41):
Having said that, I have got tremendously generous service on them. I remain convinced it is because I am one of the few full paying J/F pax and they are always amused at a random white guy being so involved in their service and being social to them . Their catering on Isloo-DXB is REALLY good ... DXB-Isloo not as much.

What's interesting about PK is (and I've been mentioning this for a number of years), while they might not have the "latest and greatest" amenities such as 400 cd's and 200 movies, etc. their overall J price/service is amongst the best. In fact, I would fly their J-class, especially if its on one of their newer planes over many other carriers.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 41):
PK is targeting many 5th freedom BCN-ORD-BCN pax. From what I hear, they range from 40 up to 70 pax. I do believe the 40 because I've seen a number of pax who were traveling to BCN.

= They need to get their distribution right ... first of all, they will have an image issue especially in the U.S ... then, how many Americans wake up thinking ... ooo ... let me go to PIA's site for my next trip to Barca ...

I agree....this is an issue which needs to be addressed if they want to make the route work year-round. That being said, I did receive an email from one of their directors about some concrete steps they are taking   -working with AA, IB regarding pricing agreements and possible codeshares and possible codesharing with CO (while he didn't mention CO specifically, he mentioned there is "another carrier" which flies to BCN from EWR..kind of gave it away...). Also, I've seen a heck of a lot of advertising here (Chicago) in the local media....much more than I'm used to seeing from PK over the years.

Also, I had a long chat with the local director here in Chicago. Seems they are a bit more serious than they have been the prior years.

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 41):
Thanks for reading.

You're welcome... 


...and I apologize for taking this thread off course....my bad...
"Up the Irons!"
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jul 23, 2010 4:08 am

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 42):
"Isloo" and travelling on PK, you do have a bit of Pakistan in you lol. Would love to see a trip report on your PK flights to DXB, but I know you don't put up business trips here.

= You know I lived in Pakistan before right?

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 43):
What's interesting about PK is (and I've been mentioning this for a number of years), while they might not have the "latest and greatest" amenities such as 400 cd's and 200 movies, etc. their overall J price/service is amongst the best. In fact, I would fly their J-class, especially if its on one of their newer planes over many other carriers.

= Interesting. The ORD-BCN flight is operated by a 772 right? Do these have the semi-flat seats in JCL?

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 43):

I agree....this is an issue which needs to be addressed if they want to make the route work year-round. That being said, I did receive an email from one of their directors about some concrete steps they are taking -working with AA, IB regarding pricing agreements and possible codeshares and possible codesharing with CO (while he didn't mention CO specifically, he mentioned there is "another carrier" which flies to BCN from EWR..kind of gave it away...). Also, I've seen a heck of a lot of advertising here (Chicago) in the local media....much more than I'm used to seeing from PK over the years.

Also, I had a long chat with the local director here in Chicago. Seems they are a bit more serious than they have been the prior years.

= Are there other places to buy their seats besides their website? Also, when are you flying this route with your family?

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
Flightsimboy
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jul 23, 2010 5:50 pm

Quoting abrelosojos (Reply 44):
You know I lived in Pakistan before right?

I assumed you just visited Pakistan on business trips. Does "I lived in Pakistan" in that case mean you were actually there for a number of years, due to a job/project.

Or on the other hand "I lived in Pakistan" as in my case, could also mean you were born Pakistani   (and now live in Venezuela    )
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Fri Jul 23, 2010 11:03 pm

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 45):

I assumed you just visited Pakistan on business trips. Does "I lived in Pakistan" in that case mean you were actually there for a number of years, due to a job/project.

Or on the other hand "I lived in Pakistan" as in my case, could also mean you were born Pakistani (and now live in Venezuela )

= Haha ... no, definitely not Pakistani ... don't think the Indians would have been that liberal with my Indian visa.

I headed a large development agencies Isloo office and lived (2+ years) in sector E and F.

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
Flightsimboy
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sat Jul 24, 2010 12:02 am

So then did you ever have time to visit the glorious North of Pakistan. I'm ashamed to say having lived there for the earlier part of my life there, I never did. And now I regret it. Of course some parts like Swat are now not safe for foreigners. Glad to know you lived in Isloo for two years. It's the nicest and cleanest city in Pakistan, also being the state capital.
 
abrelosojos
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sat Jul 31, 2010 1:40 pm

Quoting flightsimboy (Reply 47):
So then did you ever have time to visit the glorious North of Pakistan. I'm ashamed to say having lived there for the earlier part of my life there, I never did. And now I regret it. Of course some parts like Swat are now not safe for foreigners. Glad to know you lived in Isloo for two years. It's the nicest and cleanest city in Pakistan, also being the state capital.

= Yes. I used to escape to the northern areas pretty often ... though, sadly, none of those areas are safe anymore. When were you last there?

Saludos,
A.
Live, and let live.
 
Flightsimboy
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RE: Emirates EK 2: 12/FEB/10: LHR-DXB: J Cabin

Sat Jul 31, 2010 2:53 pm

It's unfortunate to say, I've never visited the North of Pakistan (even while I lived there). And now as you say it is unsafe to be there. Maybe someday in the future. Though you can say I have re-visited Pakistan a lot of times as seen through my numerous flight reports.

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