UAL777UK
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Joined: Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:16 am

Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 12:54 pm

This got me thinking.

The technology is there, certainly from a military point of view anyway, I appreciate civilian aircraft are somewhat larger

So taking my local airport as an example (LHR), if VTOL aircraft were used, low overflies over housing etc could be avoided, less runways needed.

Do you think there is a market or for that matter the balls from a manufacturer to look at this.

Any thoughts?
 
rfields5421
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RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 1:07 pm

The physics of fuel, payload, range and noise will limit VTOL aircraft to short runs. And very expensive runs at that. Helicopters compete very well against VTOL aircraft for that very small market.

Perhaps if there is a huge breakthrough in technology in the future, VTOL might completely change the air travel industry. But with current levels of technology - I don't seen any one investing the money in a civilian aircraft, or passengers paying the necessary prices to fly on them.
 
KRIC777
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RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 1:07 pm

Quoting ual777uk (Thread starter):
if VTOL aircraft were used, low overflies over housing etc could be avoided, less runways needed.

Assumng the problem with low overflies over housing is noise, I doubt VTOL aircraft would solve that problem. I've had a few V-22 Ospreys fly over my place at what wouldn't be called low altitude, and they were LOUD. And my understanding/guess is that VTOL mode in aircraft with such capability (say, a Harrier) burns a lot of fuel because all the lift comes from thrust in that mode, not aerodynamics.

My guess is that any civilian need for VTOL is a pretty small niche that is filled adequately by helicopters.
 
FlySSC
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RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 1:13 pm

Once upon a time, there was a project of this type back in the 60s ... It was the Fairey Rotodyne

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fairey_Rotodyne

 
dtw2hyd
Posts: 4339
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 12:11 pm

RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 1:28 pm

May be in general aviation. There is a possibility we will see VTOL flying car.

http://www.terrafugia.com/tfx-vision
 
PanHAM
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RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 2:10 pm

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 3):
Once upon a time, there was a
Quoting FlySSC (Reply 3):
Fairey

was that intentionally?

 

Another project with 3 prototyps was the DO31, for military purposes, but could certainly have been build in a comemrcial version.

If it would have been feasible.
Was Erlauben Erdogan!!!
 
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Boeing717200
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RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 2:17 pm

For GA it's probably a reality. For passenger service, highly unlikely. The noise that would be generated by the lift device, be it prop or turbine coupled with the amount of lift required for an economically viable payload pretty much kills it.

The better future will be high lift devices and maybe even vectored thrust reducing runway length requirements and improving climb rates ultimately reducing the impact around airports.
240 years and the top two candidates are named Dumb and Dumber. Stay classy!
 
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Mortyman
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Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 8:26 pm

RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 2:58 pm

Well in this video, Airbus is indicating both VTOL Aircraft and flying Aircraft carriers they can land on for longhaul flights ... Also several smaller Aircraft becoming one in midair and lifelike wings --- You have to wait though ... We're talking 2050 amd onwards ... That is if we are gonna beleve Airbus  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TEXAaTcaaWY
 
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ADent
Posts: 963
Joined: Fri Dec 22, 2006 12:11 pm

RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 10:28 pm

Helicopters are VTOL.

The AgustaWestland AW609, formerly the Bell/Agusta BA609, is still under development. Looks like they are planning on 2016 certification.



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Aesma
Posts: 8916
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RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Thu May 09, 2013 10:43 pm

I don't think VTOL is the proper answer to the stated problems due to the energy required. What are being studied (although nowhere near implemented) are solutions that don't cost any energy, or even save some. For example catapult launchers that would help planes climb with a very high angle and engines at low power, saving on fuel, engine wear, noise. Then a very steep descent/dive for landings, computer controlled.

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 3):
Once upon a time, there was a project of this type back in the 60s ... It was the Fairey Rotodyne

Didn't that thing use jets in the main propeller making it louder than the space shuttle ?
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
DiscoverCSG
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RE: Will We Ever See Vtol Civilian Aircraft?

Fri May 10, 2013 1:47 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKCl3lfAx1Q

That little experiment didn't go very well.

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