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ptrjong
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Russia To Abandon Red Star

Sun Feb 08, 2009 8:23 pm

The Russian parliament has voted to change the red star nationality marking for military aircraft:

http://eurorus4en.wordpress.com/2008...ian-combat-planes-turn-multicolor/

Although the red star is originally linked to communism of course, it suprises me that they feel the need to change it now, so many years after the fall of communism and the USSR.

Politics aside, I personally regret this move because that simple red star is such a good-looking marking.

This aircraft has some blue in the star - does anyone know if this is the new look?

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Photo © Oleg Chaplin



Peter 

Disclaimer: I don't subscribe to the views of the website I linked to. I first saw this news in Dutch-language media, but couldn't find another link in English.

[Edited 2009-02-08 12:56:33]
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Sun Feb 08, 2009 10:02 pm

The blue outline on the red star is had to pick out. If the outline were more bold looking, I think it would be a good looking marking. It is not unusual for countries to change the markings (roundels) on their military aircraft. The US, for example has had 7 different designs for its military aircraft roundels, not including the low visibility version used on many USAF, USN, US Army, and USMC combat aircraft.

http://cocardes.monde.online.fr/v2ht...en/pays/etats_unis.html#etats_unis
 
ebj1248650
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Mon Feb 09, 2009 12:04 am

Maybe they want to eliminate any visual reminders of the cold war era.

Around the time the F-15 came about, there was a proposal for a new US "roundel" and it was in a pentagon shape with red and white stripes on the lower half and a blue field with a white star on the upper half, as I recall. The idea didn't go over well at all, as I recall.
 
F27Friendship
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Mon Feb 09, 2009 5:12 pm

Very interesting news this.

A couple of years ago I read that they decided to keep the red star, despite no longer being communist since the "red star is holy to the Russian soldier" . It is also a symbol of the Red army that defeited fascism during the great war of the Motherland (or whatever they call it).

Another more practical thing about it was they didn;t have to replace numerious uniforms, repaint all equipment etc.
 
Acheron
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Wed Feb 11, 2009 12:47 am

One could argue that is one of the most identifiable symbols on military planes out there. Too bad they decided to change it.
 
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Devilfish
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:14 am

I guess it's okay as long as it doesn't start looking like the "Rising Sun".....

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Photo © Max Bryansky - Russian AviaPhoto Team
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Photo © Max Bryansky - Russian AviaPhoto Team


Quote:
"After more than 90 years, the Russian stars will no longer be all red. They’ll be red, white and blue."

Good that it will still be a star. A roundel in those colors would seem like a soda's logo.  Wink
 
hunterson
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Wed Feb 11, 2009 4:20 am

I do not really think that such a move will go any further than being just a bill proposed by the Russian Parliament.
The move was obviously a narrow political action aimed at scoring some party political points in the Duma ( Russian Parliament) and I agree entirely with F27friendship in that on grounds of practicalities and costs, as well as nationalist sentiments, the "Red Star" for the Russians is much more than simply a "ramnant" from the communist past.
Indeed the same issue was debated in Russia back in the 1990s, just after the break-up of the then Soviet Union, and it was decided at the time to keep the "Red Star" as a national insigna for the new Russian Air Force. Of course, as can be seen on numerous Russian aircraft these days, the "Red Star" is actually used side by side with the Russian fflag on the tails of these planes, so I would not rule out the possibility that both symbols would be used to identify Russian aircraft.
After all, they changed their national anthem when the Soviet Union broke up, and then decided to go back to the old Soviet national anthem soon after Vladimir Putin came to power.
Just like the Battle of Stalingrad, and the Great Patriotic War ( WW2), the "Red Star" for the Russians is a national rather than a communist emblem.
 
mascmo
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Wed Feb 11, 2009 7:12 am

Would it surprise anyone if they came out with some type of variant of this???
Big version: Width: 640 Height: 480 File size: 114kb

 Confused
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Wed Feb 11, 2009 9:25 am



Quoting DEVILFISH (Reply 5):
Good that it will still be a star. A roundel in those colors would seem like a soda's logo.

They did use a roundel in Czarist times.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Im...erial_Russian_Aviation_Roundel.svg

But yes, I shouldn't have said 'abandon' as it will still be a star if they do change it.

Quoting Mascmo (Reply 7):
Would it surprise anyone if they came out with some type of variant of this???

Yes, that would surprise me. I would put my money on something like this.

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Photo © Evgeniy Nikolov



I hope that Hunterson is right, though, and that it will not actually change.

Peter Smile
 
deskflier
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Wed Feb 11, 2009 10:07 pm



Quoting Hunterson (Reply 6):
After all, they changed their national anthem when the Soviet Union broke up, and then decided to go back to the old Soviet national anthem soon after Vladimir Putin came to power.

Work is in progress to write new lyrics, containing more nationalism and lacking communist slogans. More nationalism will be a hard feat to accomplish, since the "Hymn to the Soviet Union" was written to replace "L'Internationale" as the Soviet national anthem. Internationalism wasn't very PC in the USSR in 1942.
 
F27Friendship
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Thu Feb 12, 2009 7:59 pm

after the break-up of the soviet union the new Russian Federation kept the same anthem (it is a good anthem!) but changed the tekst.

as far as I know..
 
ebj1248650
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Fri Feb 13, 2009 12:06 pm

Have there been any illustrations showing what the new star will actually look like?
 
Severnaya
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Fri Feb 13, 2009 1:34 pm



Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 11):
Have there been any illustrations showing what the new star will actually look like?

Before i see at least 10 painted on various aircraft i believe this "news"....

Quoting F27Friendship (Reply 10):
after the break-up of the soviet union the new Russian Federation kept the same anthem (it is a good anthem!) but changed the tekst.

This is not completely correct  Smile.

The melody of the current anthem is the same as the anthem (1944 version) of the Soviet Union. Lyrics however are different.

From 1990 till 2000, there was the Патриотическая Песня, something like the Patriotic Song in use, which was used in the Russian Soviet Republic until the country was renamed into Russian Federation.

Then, the nowadays anthem was adopted in late 2000, which shares the melody of the 1944-version of the anthem,and has new lyrics.
 
F27Friendship
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Sat Feb 14, 2009 7:08 pm



Quoting Severnaya (Reply 12):
The melody of the current anthem is the same as the anthem (1944 version) of the Soviet Union. Lyrics however are different.

well wasn't that what I wrote?
 
Severnaya
Posts: 646
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Sun Feb 15, 2009 12:25 am



Quoting F27Friendship (Reply 13):
well wasn't that what I wrote?

no, because you wrote:

Quoting F27Friendship (Reply 10):
after the break-up of the soviet union the new Russian Federation kept the same anthem (it is a good anthem!) but changed the tekst.

with saying that you forgot about the 10 year period of the Patriotic Song -Патриотическая Песня- from 1990-2000; which had another melody & lyrics, it was completely another anthem  Smile

Quoting EBJ1248650 (Reply 11):
Have there been any illustrations showing what the new star will actually look like?

AFAIK not, but suggestion of reply 8 is pure speculation,as that star features green, which won't be used.
 
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ptrjong
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Sun Feb 15, 2009 2:45 am



Quoting Severnaya (Reply 12):

Before i see at least 10 painted on various aircraft i believe this "news"....

You don't believe that the Duma cast this vote, or you don't believe that it will be implemented? These are two rather different things...

Quoting Severnaya (Reply 14):
suggestion of reply 8 is pure speculation,as that star features green, which won't be used.

A Russian version of that would use blue, of course, not green. But yes, it is pure speculation.

Quoting F27Friendship (Reply 10):
it is a good anthem

 checkmark 

Peter Smile
 
F27Friendship
Posts: 1099
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RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Sun Feb 15, 2009 1:46 pm



Quoting Severnaya (Reply 14):
with saying that you forgot about the 10 year period of the Patriotic Song -Патриотическая Песня- from 1990-2000; which had another melody & lyrics, it was completely another anthem  

ah! thanks! I didn't get that!

Learned something today  Smile
 
Severnaya
Posts: 646
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 5:03 pm

RE: Russia To Abandon Red Star

Sun Feb 15, 2009 11:42 pm



Quoting Ptrjong (Reply 8):
I hope that Hunterson is right, though, and that it will not actually change.

I agree, the red star is a symbol which shouldn't be replaced.

Quoting Ptrjong (Reply 15):

You don't believe that the Duma cast this vote, or you don't believe that it will be implemented? These are two rather different things...

sorry for being unclear  Yeah sure.

I don't doubt the voting of Duma. But i believe it won't be implemented soon (not within close future) as there are more important things which need to be done.

Quoting F27Friendship (Reply 16):
ah! thanks! I didn't get that!

You're welcome  Smile

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