Page 1 of 1

A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Sat Mar 21, 2015 8:41 pm
by GlobalMoose
Does anyone know how the first variants of the A400 came to be known as the 'Grizzly?'

Any chance that it was an Airbus marketing tactic to position the jet against the Boeing (née McDonnell Douglas) C-17 'Moose?'

Thanks,

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Sat Mar 21, 2015 10:31 pm
by mwhcvt
Are they not both NATO destinations?

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Sat Mar 21, 2015 10:49 pm
by kanban
found on the web:

Of course, crews had no particular fondness for the stilted name of "Globemaster III", and apparently it is best known as the "Mighty Moose" or more typically just "Moose" -- one mass C-17 exercise being designated Operation FURIOUS MOOSE. Other nicknames are the "Buddha", the aircraft being short, fat, and revered; and "Barney", a mixed tribute to the classic FLINTSTONES caveman cartoon show and the bigger C-5A Galaxy, known as the "Fred" (more more less meaning "Fantastic Ridiculous Economic Disaster"), Barney Rubble being Fred Flintstone's smaller sidekick.

the A400 history is here Airbus A400M - Grizzly Or Atlas? (by gphoto Jul 12 2012 in Aviation Photography) I always thought "Grizzly" was just so much bravado, and "Atlas" delusional.. "Musk Ox" might have been better

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Sun Mar 22, 2015 12:07 am
by JohnM
Quoting kanban (Reply 2):
"Fantastic Ridiculous Economic Disaster"),

Another word is used in the place of fantastic.

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Sun Mar 22, 2015 6:57 am
by Max Q
Well Americans generally don't like to use names for Aircraft, you won't hear them call a C130 a 'Hercules' or a 747 a 'Jumbo'



And honestly 'Grizzly' or 'Atlas' are pretty lame as far as names go so why not just call it the A400 ?

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 6:33 pm
by zululima
Quoting Max Q (Reply 4):
Well Americans generally don't like to use names for Aircraft, you won't hear them call a C130 a 'Hercules' or a 747 a 'Jumbo'

That has never been the case. Also, the 747 isn't even named "Jumbo".

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 5:26 am
by Moose135
Quoting Max Q (Reply 4):
Well Americans generally don't like to use names for Aircraft, you won't hear them call a C130 a 'Hercules'

Sure they do, although you'll often hear it referred to simply as "The Herk".

And how is that I'm just now learning that they call the C-17 "Moose"???
 

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 2:08 pm
by ptrjong
My hypothesis, see caption.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Peter de Jong


RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:01 pm
by Revelation
Quoting kanban (Reply 2):
the A400 history is here Airbus A400M - Grizzly Or Atlas? (by gphoto Jul 12 2012 in Aviation Photography) I always thought "Grizzly" was just so much bravado, and "Atlas" delusional.. "Musk Ox" might have been better

I can imagine there is some truth in:

Quote:
'Grizzly' is not a good nickname for a type of aircraft made by a European company because grizzly bears' natural habitat is in North America.

However I prefer the "Grizzly" nickname because my recollection is that it came from the people doing flight test, whereas "Atlas" came from the suits/brass. IMHO the troops should get the honor of naming the aircraft, not the brass, even if it means the a/c gets nicknames like "Warthog", "Turkey", "Bug", "FRED", "BUFF", "SLUFF", etc.

Quoting Max Q (Reply 4):
Well Americans generally don't like to use names for Aircraft, you won't hear them call a C130 a 'Hercules' or a 747 a 'Jumbo'

Huh? Around my American glider club we spoke of the "Birddog" and the "Pawnee", and I have no idea what model numbers they have.

Quoting ptrjong (Reply 7):
My hypothesis, see caption.

My recollection is the flight test team gave it that nickname because of its husky shape and its black nose.

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 3:34 am
by L-188
Quoting Revelation (Reply 8):

Huh? Around my American glider club we spoke of the "Birddog" and the "Pawnee", and I have no idea what model numbers they have.

hmmmm....I can think of a lot of aircraft that end up being better known by their names or nicknames.

Mustang
Falcon (F-16)
Warthog
Eagle
Trotter (DHC-6)
Beaver
Otter
Diesel-8
Herk
Blackhawk
Huey
Cobra
Blackbird

Of course I have never heard anybody call a 206 a Stationain 6 or a 185 a Skywagon

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 11:30 am
by ptrjong
American military aircraft carry a number designation as their primary designation. Official names are generally added only belatedly, so that even the good ones (Tomcat) don't become very popular. In adddition, the official names are often too long, artificially constructed and somewhat bombastic (Fighting Falcon, 'Globemaster III). It's little wonder that such names don't stick, I think.

In the British MoD system, the name is the primary designation (which some people fail to understand) and the names are generally more real and easy to use (Tornado, Typhoon). French aircraft are also often known only by name (Rafale).

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 1:20 pm
by bikerthai
Quoting ptrjong (Reply 10):
Official names are generally added only belatedly,

The US assign a designation to an aircraft as soon as it enters the procurement system (even if it's only for a prototype). Imagine if they have to assign a name for each of these aircraft, they would run out of good names fairly quickly. As it is they are already having a tough time with the names.

bt

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Wed Apr 01, 2015 9:32 pm
by Revelation
Quoting L-188 (Reply 9):
hmmmm....I can think of a lot of aircraft that end up being better known by their names or nicknames.

Your list made "Aardvark" and "Phantom" pop into my head pretty quick.

Quoting ptrjong (Reply 10):
American military aircraft carry a number designation as their primary designation. Official names are generally added only belatedly, so that even the good ones (Tomcat) don't become very popular. In adddition, the official names are often too long, artificially constructed and somewhat bombastic (Fighting Falcon, 'Globemaster III). It's little wonder that such names don't stick, I think.

Makes me miss the McD names such as Voodoo, Banshee, Phantom...

Quoting bikerthai (Reply 11):
As it is they are already having a tough time with the names.

I know. "Lightning II" sucks, but it was dubbed that because LM (via Lockheed) and BAe (via English Electric) both had previous Lightning products.

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 8:49 am
by Max Q
Quoting L-188 (Reply 9):
hmmmm....I can think of a lot of aircraft that end up being better known by their names or nicknames.

Mustang
Falcon (F-16)
Warthog
Eagle
Trotter (DHC-6)
Beaver
Otter
Diesel-8
Herk
Blackhawk
Huey
Cobra
Blackbird

Maybe on aviation web sites but not by the people that fly them !

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 10:18 am
by angad84
Quoting Max Q (Reply 13):
Maybe on aviation web sites but not by the people that fly them !

Really? Note that he said "names or nicknames" so even if they aren't known by their official names, they're often given nicknames that do stick.

I've heard Super Hornet pilots call the plane the Rhino.
The Phantom has ALWAYS been the Phantom.
The F-16 is the Viper (heck, one of the solo demo teams is called VIPER West)
The F-15 is usually called the Eagle, heard pilots stateside say it, as well as a couple of Eagle Drivers (again, common parlance) at Aero India 2015 a few months ago.
The A-10 will forever be the Warthog or just the 'hog.
The SR-71 was Sled or Habu.
The F-14 was often called Turkey (or at least I know one former USN F-14 pilot who continues to refer to it as such even today).


I could go on, but you get the point.

Cheers
Angad

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:32 pm
by thegman
Quoting L-188 (Reply 9):
Mustang
Falcon (F-16)
Warthog
Eagle
Trotter (DHC-6)
Beaver
Otter
Diesel-8
Herk
Blackhawk
Huey
Cobra
Blackbird

Lets try the Twotter for the DHC-6 (short for Twin Otter)
And as mentioned before Viper is a more commonly used name for F-16 (even though the official name is Fighting Falcon)

Quoting Max Q (Reply 13):
Maybe on aviation web sites but not by the people that fly them !

That's false. I know many people that only use the names and sometimes the names and sometimes the number.

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 1:53 pm
by sprout5199
Quoting L-188 (Reply 9):
185 a Skywagon

Not sure about a 185 but a friend of mine has a 180 and when he announces in the pattern he uses "Green and white Skywagon" vs his N number.

Dan in Jupiter

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Mon Apr 20, 2015 9:22 pm
by Eagleboy
Quoting angad84 (Reply 14):
I've heard Super Hornet pilots call the plane the Rhino.

My understanding was that this was to distinguish these aircraft from legacy Hornets during flight ops as they had different handling parameters.
Why "Rhino" however? I can understand "Bug" for the F-18A-D.

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Wed Apr 22, 2015 8:53 am
by larshjort
Quoting Eagleboy (Reply 17):
Why "Rhino" however? I can understand "Bug" for the F-18A-D.

Maybo after the rhinoceros beetles. Because it is a very big bug.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynastinae

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Thu Apr 23, 2015 5:13 am
by rheinwaldner
Swiss pilots always only used "Mirasch, Hönter, Vämpi und de Tiger" (Tiger pronounced as at 1:58 in this video: Swiss Air Force Tiger Evaluation Tigris Helveticus 1.avi)

Don't know though whether the F/A 18 is called other than "F/A 18"...

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Thu Apr 23, 2015 7:40 am
by angad84
Quoting rheinwaldner (Reply 19):
Swiss pilots always only used "Mirasch, Hönter, Vämpi und de Tiger" (Tiger pronounced as at 1:58 in this video: Swiss Air Force Tiger Evaluation Tigris Helveticus 1.avi)

To be fair only one of those has a formal alpha-numeric designation (the Tiger). The rest, per European convention, have a noun as their formal designation, with alpha-numeric variant identifier as necessary.

Quoting rheinwaldner (Reply 19):
Don't know though whether the F/A 18 is called other than "F/A 18"...

Not Bug? Or any Swiss equivalent?

On the other hand, this line of thought reminded me of something I heard in Sweden a few years ago. I am an unabashed fan of the sleek little Gripen (pronounced 'Gree-penn'), and I tend to refer to it by name rather than alpha-numeric. A Gripen pilot overheard me talking about "Gripen-this" and "Gripen-that" and after a while, he said "None of us actually call it Gripen, we just call it '39.'" Not JAS, not JAS-39, just plain old 39. I found that rather interesting.

Cheers
Angad

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:55 pm
by pygmalion
Officially the F-18 is known as the "Hornet". The F-18E/F models as the "Super Hornet" and the two seat electronic warfare version, the EA-18G is known as the "Growler"

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 11:06 pm
by zanl188
Quoting Moose135 (Reply 6):
And how is that I'm just now learning that they call the C-17 "Moose"???

C-17 picked up the "Moose" nickname because of the noise the fuel vents make during refueling. It tends to grunt.

RE: A400 Grizzly And The C-17 Moose

Posted: Thu Apr 30, 2015 1:15 am
by Moose135
Quoting zanl188 (Reply 22):
C-17 picked up the "Moose" nickname because of the noise the fuel vents make during refueling. It tends to grunt.

Me too!