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Francoflier
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Re: Stratolaunch

Sat Jun 01, 2019 6:07 am

Any other eccentric billionaire out there who doesn't have a space venture yet?
They're all the rage I hear.
I'll do my own airline. With Blackjack. And hookers. In fact, forget the airline.
 
DarthLobster
Posts: 371
Joined: Thu Feb 25, 2016 3:40 am

Re: Stratolaunch

Sat Jun 01, 2019 7:11 am

Francoflier wrote:
Any other eccentric billionaire out there who doesn't have a space venture yet?
They're all the rage I hear.


Maybe Branson’s in need of something new and shiny that he can paint a half-naked woman onto...
 
tapairbus370
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Re: Stratolaunch‘s Carrier Aircraft Production

Sat Jun 01, 2019 7:27 am

 
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QuarkFly
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Re: Stratolaunch‘s Carrier Aircraft Production

Sat Jun 01, 2019 8:02 pm

Interesting aircraft, but even if Paul Allen were still with us -- this Stratolaunch concept would have gone nowhere. Air launched satellite boosters have proved both technically and economically infeasible...

...Sorry Pegasus, you will be gone soon too, Pegasus worked, but also should never have been built -- but thanks for keeping a L-1011 in the air for a while longer !!

Wonder what museum this Stratolaunch aircraft will end up at ??
Always take the Red Eye if possible
 
cpd
Posts: 6012
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:46 am

Re: Stratolaunch‘s Carrier Aircraft Production

Sun Jun 02, 2019 6:57 am

QuarkFly wrote:
Interesting aircraft, but even if Paul Allen were still with us -- this Stratolaunch concept would have gone nowhere. Air launched satellite boosters have proved both technically and economically infeasible...

...Sorry Pegasus, you will be gone soon too, Pegasus worked, but also should never have been built -- but thanks for keeping a L-1011 in the air for a while longer !!

Wonder what museum this Stratolaunch aircraft will end up at ??


Apparently the company is continuing on. Looks shaky however.

What are parts like engines worth? Could it be broken up? Might be the economical solution. No museum will be able to fit it.

Perhaps just cut up a nose section for preservation.
 
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lightsaber
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Re: Stratolaunch‘s Carrier Aircraft Production

Mon Jun 03, 2019 6:11 am

cpd wrote:
QuarkFly wrote:
Interesting aircraft, but even if Paul Allen were still with us -- this Stratolaunch concept would have gone nowhere. Air launched satellite boosters have proved both technically and economically infeasible...

...Sorry Pegasus, you will be gone soon too, Pegasus worked, but also should never have been built -- but thanks for keeping a L-1011 in the air for a while longer !!

Wonder what museum this Stratolaunch aircraft will end up at ??


Apparently the company is continuing on. Looks shaky however.

What are parts like engines worth? Could it be broken up? Might be the economical solution. No museum will be able to fit it.

Perhaps just cut up a nose section for preservation.

The engines were selected for minimal cost. They were bought off scrapped 747s. PW4000s go for less than CF6s typically.

I'm a fan of the concept of air launched rockets.

Lightsaber
IM messages to mods on warnings and bans will be ignored and nasty ones will result in a ban.
 
KFLLCFII
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Re: Stratolaunch‘s Carrier Aircraft Production

Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:37 am

cpd wrote:
QuarkFly wrote:
Interesting aircraft, but even if Paul Allen were still with us -- this Stratolaunch concept would have gone nowhere. Air launched satellite boosters have proved both technically and economically infeasible...

...Sorry Pegasus, you will be gone soon too, Pegasus worked, but also should never have been built -- but thanks for keeping a L-1011 in the air for a while longer !!

Wonder what museum this Stratolaunch aircraft will end up at ??

No museum will be able to fit it.


Pima should be able to get it in full to the outskirts of the property, at least to around its southeast corner after landing next-door at Davis-Monthan Air Force Base (13,600' x 200' runway)...Might just need to grade their dirt taxiway from the base a little wider to accommodate (how hard is it to grade desert?) and temporarily relocate a fence or two.
"About the only way to look at it, just a pity you are not POTUS KFLLCFII, seems as if we would all be better off."
 
cpd
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Re: Stratolaunch‘s Carrier Aircraft Production

Mon Jun 03, 2019 7:48 am

lightsaber wrote:
cpd wrote:
QuarkFly wrote:
Interesting aircraft, but even if Paul Allen were still with us -- this Stratolaunch concept would have gone nowhere. Air launched satellite boosters have proved both technically and economically infeasible...

...Sorry Pegasus, you will be gone soon too, Pegasus worked, but also should never have been built -- but thanks for keeping a L-1011 in the air for a while longer !!

Wonder what museum this Stratolaunch aircraft will end up at ??


Apparently the company is continuing on. Looks shaky however.

What are parts like engines worth? Could it be broken up? Might be the economical solution. No museum will be able to fit it.

Perhaps just cut up a nose section for preservation.

The engines were selected for minimal cost. They were bought off scrapped 747s. PW4000s go for less than CF6s typically.

I'm a fan of the concept of air launched rockets.

So the thing is effectively worthless aside from being part of a launch system.

We've seen those concepts before - even the XB-70 was mooted at one point to launch an orbital vehicle. The humble 747 was proposed as a launch vehicle for an ICBM (as was the C5 Galaxy) and the AN-225 was to launch the enormous HOTOL vehicle in flight. Boeing also developed another TSTO system.

One of the Boeing proposals in that line would carry just over 50 tonnes of JP4 and 129 tonnes of cryogenic fuel. :eek: The thing was nearly as heavy as a 747 - and that was just the carrier plane, not including the vehicle it would carry to launch. It would have been an extremely impressive ride from takeoff to launch altitude, the profile of that was truly extreme.

One of the other derivatives in that program had a front fuselage section that looks strangely similar to one front fuselage section on the Stratolaunch plane...
 
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Phosphorus
Posts: 612
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Re: Stratolaunch‘s Carrier Aircraft Production

Mon Jun 03, 2019 3:57 pm

lightsaber wrote:
cpd wrote:
QuarkFly wrote:
Interesting aircraft, but even if Paul Allen were still with us -- this Stratolaunch concept would have gone nowhere. Air launched satellite boosters have proved both technically and economically infeasible...

...Sorry Pegasus, you will be gone soon too, Pegasus worked, but also should never have been built -- but thanks for keeping a L-1011 in the air for a while longer !!

Wonder what museum this Stratolaunch aircraft will end up at ??


Apparently the company is continuing on. Looks shaky however.

What are parts like engines worth? Could it be broken up? Might be the economical solution. No museum will be able to fit it.

Perhaps just cut up a nose section for preservation.

The engines were selected for minimal cost. They were bought off scrapped 747s. PW4000s go for less than CF6s typically.

I'm a fan of the concept of air launched rockets.

Lightsaber


My hunch is that, if Stratolaunch shutdown and wind-down happens, Northrop Grumman is a perfect new home for the Roc/Carrier aircraft.
They designed it, they know it better than anyone else (Stratolaunch company included).
If they persist with Pegasus program, they need to think about successor to the L-1011. Come on, we all love the plane, and are happy that there is at least one example operational -- but still, it's a converted airliner, with engines that are a subtype of RB211 that no-one else uses, and a spare parts pool that's shrinking by the day.

While Roc is in itself a unique design, if NG/Scaled Composites did their job well -- then it should be inherently a simple inexpensive design (rather than a passenger airliner that was a pinnacle of advancement for its time), benefiting from existing supply chains in the industry.
AN4 A40 L4T TU3 TU5 IL6 ILW I93 F50 F70 100 146 ARJ AT7 DH4 L10 CRJ ERJ E90 E95 DC-9 MD-8X YK4 YK2 SF3 S20 319 320 321 332 333 343 346 722 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 744 74M 757 767 777
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Stitch
Posts: 26376
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Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:29 pm

Vulcan has put Stratolaunch up for sale with an asking price of USD 400 million. This includes the airframe, intellectual property and facilities.

https://www.digitaltrends.com/cool-tech ... aul-allen/
 
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AirlineCritic
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Joined: Sat Mar 14, 2009 1:07 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Sat Jun 15, 2019 6:33 pm

Sad. I vote for museum, a new museum with a cheap hangar to house this wonderful piece of engineering. I'm sure it would draw a lot of people. But no, not at 400M...
 
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N14AZ
Topic Author
Posts: 3793
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Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:28 pm

Stitch wrote:
Vulcan has put Stratolaunch up for sale with an asking price of USD 400 million. This includes the airframe, intellectual property and facilities.

I guess it’s because of me...

Some years ago I, when working abroad and separated from my family I invested much time in the A380-production-threads... production will end in two years.

Then, about three years ago, I thought we need a thread for this large aircraft and started this thread... and now this.

From now on I will refrain from posting in threads about large aircraft... I will concentrate on Cessnas and Pipers...

But seriously, 400 million USD sounds like a bargain. Does anybody know how much they had invested so far in Stratolaunch?
 
Spar
Posts: 487
Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2019 7:37 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Mon Jun 17, 2019 1:54 am

AirlineCritic wrote:
Sad. I vote for museum, a new museum with a cheap hangar to house this wonderful piece of engineering. I'm sure it would draw a lot of people. But no, not at 400M...

How is two old 747s hacked together and without any useful function, "a wonderful piece of engineering"?
 
cpd
Posts: 6012
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Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Tue Jun 18, 2019 11:58 am

Spar wrote:
AirlineCritic wrote:
Sad. I vote for museum, a new museum with a cheap hangar to house this wonderful piece of engineering. I'm sure it would draw a lot of people. But no, not at 400M...

How is two old 747s hacked together and without any useful function, "a wonderful piece of engineering"?


It seems most likely to be broken up. It’s worthless by the sound of it, too large to display anywhere and And it never did what it was intended to do. :(
 
SuperiorPilotMe
Posts: 71
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:55 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Tue Jun 18, 2019 2:38 pm

[twoid][/twoid]
Spar wrote:
AirlineCritic wrote:
Sad. I vote for museum, a new museum with a cheap hangar to house this wonderful piece of engineering. I'm sure it would draw a lot of people. But no, not at 400M...

How is two old 747s hacked together and without any useful function, "a wonderful piece of engineering"?


That’s not what it is, it uses salvaged 747 systems but the fuselage is largely bespoke and carbon fiber. This should be obvious after looking at it for about two seconds, which I therefore ask what have you been looking at?

So not only is there significant money sunk into the project, apparently to honor the wishes of a guy already dead (great resource prioritization there) but it’ll be complicated and expensive to scrap.

With all the talk of low-cost launch by the government or other private corporations you’d think this thing would find some buyer but the fact that it has not implies the concept of an airborne conventional fixed-wing as a first stage is deeply flawed, and that Paul Allen wasted immense resources in life and in death.
Stop the stupids!- Claus Kellerman
 
DarkKnight5
Posts: 192
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Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:10 pm

SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
[twoid][/twoid]
Spar wrote:
AirlineCritic wrote:
Sad. I vote for museum, a new museum with a cheap hangar to house this wonderful piece of engineering. I'm sure it would draw a lot of people. But no, not at 400M...

How is two old 747s hacked together and without any useful function, "a wonderful piece of engineering"?


That’s not what it is, it uses salvaged 747 systems but the fuselage is largely bespoke and carbon fiber. This should be obvious after looking at it for about two seconds, which I therefore ask what have you been looking at?

So not only is there significant money sunk into the project, apparently to honor the wishes of a guy already dead (great resource prioritization there) but it’ll be complicated and expensive to scrap.

With all the talk of low-cost launch by the government or other private corporations you’d think this thing would find some buyer but the fact that it has not implies the concept of an airborne conventional fixed-wing as a first stage is deeply flawed, and that Paul Allen wasted immense resources in life and in death.

I think you could put it to good use by carving it up into about 10 million ice hockey sticks. It would be a decent way to recycle it.
 
SuperiorPilotMe
Posts: 71
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:55 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Tue Jun 18, 2019 6:39 pm

DarkKnight5 wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
[twoid][/twoid]
Spar wrote:
How is two old 747s hacked together and without any useful function, "a wonderful piece of engineering"?


That’s not what it is, it uses salvaged 747 systems but the fuselage is largely bespoke and carbon fiber. This should be obvious after looking at it for about two seconds, which I therefore ask what have you been looking at?

So not only is there significant money sunk into the project, apparently to honor the wishes of a guy already dead (great resource prioritization there) but it’ll be complicated and expensive to scrap.

With all the talk of low-cost launch by the government or other private corporations you’d think this thing would find some buyer but the fact that it has not implies the concept of an airborne conventional fixed-wing as a first stage is deeply flawed, and that Paul Allen wasted immense resources in life and in death.

I think you could put it to good use by carving it up into about 10 million ice hockey sticks. It would be a decent way to recycle it.


Doesn’t work that way but hey it at least matches the technical expertise of who we “elected” “President”.
Stop the stupids!- Claus Kellerman
 
DarkKnight5
Posts: 192
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2016 3:36 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Wed Jun 19, 2019 12:25 am

SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
DarkKnight5 wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
[twoid][/twoid]

That’s not what it is, it uses salvaged 747 systems but the fuselage is largely bespoke and carbon fiber. This should be obvious after looking at it for about two seconds, which I therefore ask what have you been looking at?

So not only is there significant money sunk into the project, apparently to honor the wishes of a guy already dead (great resource prioritization there) but it’ll be complicated and expensive to scrap.

With all the talk of low-cost launch by the government or other private corporations you’d think this thing would find some buyer but the fact that it has not implies the concept of an airborne conventional fixed-wing as a first stage is deeply flawed, and that Paul Allen wasted immense resources in life and in death.

I think you could put it to good use by carving it up into about 10 million ice hockey sticks. It would be a decent way to recycle it.


Doesn’t work that way but hey it at least matches the technical expertise of who we “elected” “President”.

What?
 
SuperiorPilotMe
Posts: 71
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Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:13 pm

DarkKnight5 wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
DarkKnight5 wrote:
I think you could put it to good use by carving it up into about 10 million ice hockey sticks. It would be a decent way to recycle it.


Doesn’t work that way but hey it at least matches the technical expertise of who we “elected” “President”.

What?


. . . s m h
Stop the stupids!- Claus Kellerman
 
DarkKnight5
Posts: 192
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2016 3:36 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:29 am

SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
DarkKnight5 wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:

Doesn’t work that way but hey it at least matches the technical expertise of who we “elected” “President”.

What?


. . . s m h

So I guess when I said “what” I meant “why did you shoehorn some sort of political diatribe into a reply to my obviously facetious post?” Care to respond with something other than shaking your head?
 
SuperiorPilotMe
Posts: 71
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:55 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Thu Jun 20, 2019 1:00 am

DarkKnight5 wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
DarkKnight5 wrote:
What?


. . . s m h

So I guess when I said “what” I meant “why did you shoehorn some sort of political diatribe into a reply to my obviously facetious post?” Care to respond with something other than shaking your head?


It was the response that was deserved. In all cases.
Stop the stupids!- Claus Kellerman
 
DarkKnight5
Posts: 192
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2016 3:36 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Fri Jun 21, 2019 5:23 am

SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
DarkKnight5 wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:

. . . s m h

So I guess when I said “what” I meant “why did you shoehorn some sort of political diatribe into a reply to my obviously facetious post?” Care to respond with something other than shaking your head?


It was the response that was deserved. In all cases.

You’re acting like an ass, and I’m willing to get banned to say it.
 
SuperiorPilotMe
Posts: 71
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:55 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:35 pm

DarkKnight5 wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
DarkKnight5 wrote:
So I guess when I said “what” I meant “why did you shoehorn some sort of political diatribe into a reply to my obviously facetious post?” Care to respond with something other than shaking your head?


It was the response that was deserved. In all cases.

You’re acting like an ass, and I’m willing to get banned to say it.


In that case, and again, in both cases, I gave you exactly the response called for.
Stop the stupids!- Claus Kellerman
 
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Aesma
Posts: 11834
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Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:04 pm

Now that Falcon 9 has proven you can reuse a first stage, an air launch becomes much less attractive. With improvements in SpaceX's design for more reuse, a cheaper engine etc., the nails are being driven into Stratolaunch's coffin.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
SuperiorPilotMe
Posts: 71
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:55 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Sat Jun 22, 2019 3:55 pm

That’s what I’m getting at. Put a linear aerospike engine on Falcon and that might be the final nail in the coffin.
Stop the stupids!- Claus Kellerman
 
meecrob
Posts: 106
Joined: Sun Jun 19, 2016 6:15 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Sun Jun 23, 2019 3:58 pm

The final nail in the coffin was literally the final nail going into Paul Allen's actual coffin. It was his pet project. Slapping a linear aerospike engine onto a cylindrical rocket designed for 9 engines sounds to me like how to turn a successful design into another Stratolaunch-type failed concept.
 
SuperiorPilotMe
Posts: 71
Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:55 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Sun Jun 23, 2019 9:20 pm

There’s concepts for it. You don’t need engines that literally are shaped like the thing they power. It might seem more counterintuitive for a rocket but it’s true.
Stop the stupids!- Claus Kellerman
 
tapairbus370
Posts: 216
Joined: Fri May 09, 2008 1:37 pm

Re: Stratolaunch Discussion Thread

Fri Oct 11, 2019 6:32 pm

https://spaceflightnow.com/2019/10/11/s ... Eko2lvdbvE


some fresh news about this amazing machine.

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