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art
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Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Tue May 05, 2020 1:12 pm

The Swedish government has authorised FMV to procure replacement aircraft for the SAAB SK60 trainer fleet. The tender document is available for response until July 31. That's less than 100 days for offers to be made.

The parts that will be included in the contract and the contract are:
-- aircraft
-- flight safety equipment (helmets, mask, lifejacket, parachute, etc.)
-- simulators
-- Part Task Trainer (simpler PC type simulators)
-- CBT (Computer Based Training)
-- TLS (Through Life Support), engineering support for the product's life
-- aircraft maintenance (operational aircraft on the line and heavy maintenance)
-- maintenance of simulators


https://www.defense-aerospace.com/artic ... force.html

I have no idea which suppliers will offer and which will be selected. Do you?
 
GalaxyFlyer
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Tue May 05, 2020 3:19 pm

Either Pilatus or Embraer offerings
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Tue May 05, 2020 3:19 pm

Would the Pilatus PC-9 / T-6A up for the task? Or do they need something more upscale and advanced? Do pilots go straight from the SK60 to the JAS39 now? It would be tricky for a small airforce which wants to have the whole pilot training inhouse. The. Swiss do it like that, right?
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seahawk
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Tue May 05, 2020 7:27 pm

Currently from Sk60 to Grippen. Planed is from Turboprop to jet trainer to Grippen D to Grippen E. Interim solution will be from Turboprop to Grippen D and then to E. If you look at the sk60 I think PC-21 could be it, later added by the T-7A Red Hawk. (which imho will be the jet trainer for obvious reasons)
 
Gingersnap
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Tue May 05, 2020 8:00 pm

I don't see why any manufacturer would bother offering up a tender?

The T-7A will be the chosen platform regardless.
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744SPX
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Tue May 05, 2020 9:54 pm

Yeah I'm thinking PC-21 as well...
 
RJMAZ
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 06, 2020 8:59 am

The T-7A would probably cost more than a twin seat Gripen.

I expect the PC-21 to get this. The RAAF aircraft can simulate a modern fighter very well. Sweden could transition straight from the PC-21 to the Gripen without any issue.
 
Ozair
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 06, 2020 10:48 am

RJMAZ wrote:
The T-7A would probably cost more than a twin seat Gripen.

I expect the PC-21 to get this. The RAAF aircraft can simulate a modern fighter very well. Sweden could transition straight from the PC-21 to the Gripen without any issue.

A few nations do transition from PC-21 straight to a fighter but the RAAF isn't one of them, they have Hawk 127s for lead in training.
 
texl1649
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 06, 2020 12:52 pm

RJMAZ wrote:
The T-7A would probably cost more than a twin seat Gripen.

I expect the PC-21 to get this. The RAAF aircraft can simulate a modern fighter very well. Sweden could transition straight from the PC-21 to the Gripen without any issue.


I thought the unit cost on the T-7's is somewhere around $20 million each in the 9.2 billion program (it includes development and simulators etc.) I kinda doubt a 2 seat gripen can be had for under $70M?
 
RJMAZ
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 06, 2020 2:15 pm

texl1649 wrote:
I thought the unit cost on the T-7's is somewhere around $20 million each in the 9.2 billion program (it includes development and simulators etc.) I kinda doubt a 2 seat gripen can be had for under $70M?

You do realise Sweden has like 100 Gripen fighters in storage that have used only a fraction of their fatigue life?

Hungary and Czech Republic lease these used Gripens. Some of these were recently offered to Colombia, Botswana and Croatia. Sweden still have plenty left in storage.

As part of the sale they get updated to the latest C model for way less than the cost of a T-7. For a trainer the Gripen would not need a fancy radar.
 
ThePointblank
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 06, 2020 3:00 pm

RJMAZ wrote:
texl1649 wrote:
I thought the unit cost on the T-7's is somewhere around $20 million each in the 9.2 billion program (it includes development and simulators etc.) I kinda doubt a 2 seat gripen can be had for under $70M?

You do realise Sweden has like 100 Gripen fighters in storage that have used only a fraction of their fatigue life?

Hungary and Czech Republic lease these used Gripens. Some of these were recently offered to Colombia, Botswana and Croatia. Sweden still have plenty left in storage.

As part of the sale they get updated to the latest C model for way less than the cost of a T-7. For a trainer the Gripen would not need a fancy radar.

I would not bet that those Gripens are in flyable condition, as it is very likely that the Swedes have extensively cannibalized them for parts to keep their active fleet going. I wouldn't be shocked if all that was left was the airframe, sitting on blocks, completely stripped of parts.
 
SuperiorPilotMe
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 07, 2020 3:50 am

The stored Gripens are actually very well-maintained but they're also far less numerous than is being claimed in here. A single squadron at most.
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Ozair
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 07, 2020 4:13 am

SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
The stored Gripens are actually very well-maintained but they're also far less numerous than is being claimed in here. A single squadron at most.

I wasn't aware there were any left. All the A's had been converted to C models already and all offers by Saab to new customers have been for new build aircraft. The Swedish Air Force isn't letting go any Gripen C/Ds just yet either, the proposed plan is to increase the Air Force size as the E arrives.
 
milhaus
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 07, 2020 6:39 am

What about Aero L39NG, which will be certified this year?
 
ThePointblank
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 07, 2020 7:31 am

milhaus wrote:
What about Aero L39NG, which will be certified this year?

Too dated, even with the upgrades to it. Plus, they only exist as reworked and refurbished older aircraft; they haven't gotten around to new production yet, and even then, it's only a handful for one user.

The Swedes are probably looking at something like the BAE Hawk, or the Alenia M-345. Maybe if they are looking at something higher end with a little more performance to act as a lead in trainer, the M-346 Master.
 
angad84
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 07, 2020 12:31 pm

I can't imagine the Swedes want a jet-BTA. My money is on Embraer or Pilatus.

There's a preference for side-by-side seating, but only the Grob 120TP comes close to offering enough performance with this configuration (and even then doesn't meet the reqs outright).
 
art
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Fri May 08, 2020 7:21 am

angad84 wrote:
I can't imagine the Swedes want a jet-BTA. My money is on Embraer or Pilatus.


What can't a turboprop do in the training role fulfilled by SK60 that a jet can do? If a turboprop were selected, would that mean more hours training on Gripen to convert to the type?

I imagine that any type chosen will be in service for 30+ years. As far as jet trainers are concerned, the T-7 should be in production and upgraded for decades whereas where Hawk, M-346 are concerned, that is probably not the case. Why would Sweden choose any jet other than T-7, especially since SAAB is a partner in the T-7 program?
 
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SAS A340
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Fri May 08, 2020 10:47 am

I have read almost anything available on this subject here in Sweden, from amateurs to experts and everybody talks about Turboprops. 20-25 units have been mentioned. It also seems that SAAB has some form of involvement in the swiss Pilatus and were agreed upon the time SAAB promoted the Gripen E to Switzerland. It also mentioned that future Gripen pilots will do their advance flight training in Gripen D before entering the Gripen E. Although I wouldn't mind seeing the T-7 been selected :D
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RJMAZ
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Fri May 08, 2020 11:57 am

Ozair wrote:
I wasn't aware there were any left. All the A's had been converted to C models already and all offers by Saab to new customers have been for new build aircraft. The Swedish Air Force isn't letting go any Gripen C/Ds just yet either, the proposed plan is to increase the Air Force size as the E arrives.

Heaps are left.

There are just over 70 Gripens in Sweden that are stored with life left. More than a dozen or so are in very good condition. The others are stored but could easily be made flyable. Only a handful have parts missing.

204 purchased in total by Sweden. 28 leased out and 12 sold. Only 80 are in service with the Swedish Airforce. There has been half a dozen crashes.

With 28 two seater Gripens built they could refurb a few extra Gripen D aircraft to take the extra training workload. Pilots can then go straight from the PC-21 to the Gripen D.
 
texl1649
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Fri May 08, 2020 12:32 pm

art wrote:
angad84 wrote:
I can't imagine the Swedes want a jet-BTA. My money is on Embraer or Pilatus.


What can't a turboprop do in the training role fulfilled by SK60 that a jet can do? If a turboprop were selected, would that mean more hours training on Gripen to convert to the type?

I imagine that any type chosen will be in service for 30+ years. As far as jet trainers are concerned, the T-7 should be in production and upgraded for decades whereas where Hawk, M-346 are concerned, that is probably not the case. Why would Sweden choose any jet other than T-7, especially since SAAB is a partner in the T-7 program?


These are great points. I forgot that Saab has like 40 percent of the T-7, and also it has engine commonality with the Gripens of course. I believe the tail sections are the pieces built in Linkoping, though they also opened a plant in Indiana for the full rate production, so I’m not real sure what work is really done where. It will be an interesting decision in any case.
 
superbizzy73
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sun May 10, 2020 1:36 am

Boeing could have had a heck of a deal if the Embraer deal worked out. Offering up a package deal of EMB 312 Tucano's along with the T-7 and all of the parts, pieces, training, CBT's, etc. would have been pretty sweet. Not sure about the pricing (or the actual feasibility of said deal), but one could dream...
 
ThePointblank
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sun May 10, 2020 5:40 am

texl1649 wrote:
art wrote:
angad84 wrote:
I can't imagine the Swedes want a jet-BTA. My money is on Embraer or Pilatus.


What can't a turboprop do in the training role fulfilled by SK60 that a jet can do? If a turboprop were selected, would that mean more hours training on Gripen to convert to the type?

I imagine that any type chosen will be in service for 30+ years. As far as jet trainers are concerned, the T-7 should be in production and upgraded for decades whereas where Hawk, M-346 are concerned, that is probably not the case. Why would Sweden choose any jet other than T-7, especially since SAAB is a partner in the T-7 program?


These are great points. I forgot that Saab has like 40 percent of the T-7, and also it has engine commonality with the Gripens of course. I believe the tail sections are the pieces built in Linkoping, though they also opened a plant in Indiana for the full rate production, so I’m not real sure what work is really done where. It will be an interesting decision in any case.

Didn't Saab partner with Pilatus to offer the PC-21 as a replacement for the SK60's?

If the Swedish requirement hinges around cost for acquisition and operation, then I don't see how the T-7 would fare well in that sort of situation; it would be too costly for unwanted extra performance.
 
RJMAZ
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sun May 10, 2020 6:51 am

ThePointblank wrote:
Didn't Saab partner with Pilatus to offer the PC-21 as a replacement for the SK60's?

If the Swedish requirement hinges around cost for acquisition and operation, then I don't see how the T-7 would fare well in that sort of situation; it would be too costly for unwanted extra performance.

They did.

https://www.flightglobal.com/saab-pilat ... 11.article

Saab also makes some of the avionics for the PC-21. Including the main large moving map. Saab could easily modify the screen to closely replicate the Gripen. The PC-21 has easily won this, but they need to run a competition to make it look fair.
 
art
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sun May 10, 2020 12:25 pm

Someone might be able to provide an informed guess on these:

How much would the specified package cost for PC-21 and T-7?

Specified package:
-- aircraft
-- flight safety equipment (helmets, mask, lifejacket, parachute, etc.)
-- simulators
-- Part Task Trainer (simpler PC type simulators)
-- CBT (Computer Based Training)
-- TLS (Through Life Support), engineering support for the product's life
-- aircraft maintenance (operational aircraft on the line and heavy maintenance)
-- maintenance of simulators

How would the marginal CPFH compare? What I mean by marginal CPFH is the extra cost incurred by flying the aircraft for 1 hour (rather than leaving it in the hangar).

Additionally, how many extra hours on a Gripen trainer would be required to convert to Gripen for a pilot trained on PC-21 compared with with a pilot trained on T-7?
 
mxaxai
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sun May 10, 2020 1:50 pm

RJMAZ wrote:
They did.

https://www.flightglobal.com/saab-pilat ... 11.article

Saab also makes some of the avionics for the PC-21. Including the main large moving map. Saab could easily modify the screen to closely replicate the Gripen. The PC-21 has easily won this, but they need to run a competition to make it look fair.

That was tied to the acquisition of the Gripen E by Switzerland, though. With Switzerland excluding the Gripen from the latest competition, there will be less political motivation to choose the PC-21 over other options. The T-7A is Saab's current choice when advertising their training solutions.
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sun May 10, 2020 2:50 pm

RJMAZ wrote:
ThePointblank wrote:
Didn't Saab partner with Pilatus to offer the PC-21 as a replacement for the SK60's?

If the Swedish requirement hinges around cost for acquisition and operation, then I don't see how the T-7 would fare well in that sort of situation; it would be too costly for unwanted extra performance.

They did.

https://www.flightglobal.com/saab-pilat ... 11.article

Saab also makes some of the avionics for the PC-21. Including the main large moving map. Saab could easily modify the screen to closely replicate the Gripen. The PC-21 has easily won this, but they need to run a competition to make it look fair.


Interesting, so the PC-21 will have it. The question still is if this type will be the only one to replace the 40odd SK.60 in service or that the T-7 still has a chance to get an order fo 15-20.
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SAS A340
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sun May 10, 2020 5:49 pm

Dutchy wrote:
RJMAZ wrote:
ThePointblank wrote:
Didn't Saab partner with Pilatus to offer the PC-21 as a replacement for the SK60's?

If the Swedish requirement hinges around cost for acquisition and operation, then I don't see how the T-7 would fare well in that sort of situation; it would be too costly for unwanted extra performance.

They did.

https://www.flightglobal.com/saab-pilat ... 11.article

Saab also makes some of the avionics for the PC-21. Including the main large moving map. Saab could easily modify the screen to closely replicate the Gripen. The PC-21 has easily won this, but they need to run a competition to make it look fair.


Interesting, so the PC-21 will have it. The question still is if this type will be the only one to replace the 40odd SK.60 in service or that the T-7 still has a chance to get an order fo 15-20.

The Pilatus-21 is by far more advance than the SK-60 despite it´s not a jet trainer, the Pilatus would more than enough replace the SK-60 alone. I would love the T-7, but i dont think its economly feasible. I wouldn´t exclude the super Tucano either. :wave:
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ThePointblank
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Mon May 11, 2020 10:41 am

Dutchy wrote:
RJMAZ wrote:
ThePointblank wrote:
Didn't Saab partner with Pilatus to offer the PC-21 as a replacement for the SK60's?

If the Swedish requirement hinges around cost for acquisition and operation, then I don't see how the T-7 would fare well in that sort of situation; it would be too costly for unwanted extra performance.

They did.

https://www.flightglobal.com/saab-pilat ... 11.article

Saab also makes some of the avionics for the PC-21. Including the main large moving map. Saab could easily modify the screen to closely replicate the Gripen. The PC-21 has easily won this, but they need to run a competition to make it look fair.


Interesting, so the PC-21 will have it. The question still is if this type will be the only one to replace the 40odd SK.60 in service or that the T-7 still has a chance to get an order fo 15-20.

Unless Sweden changes their training regime, I suspect no chance.

Other countries generally go from a basic trainer, such as something like a Grob G 120, to a more intermediate trainer such as a Pilatus PC-9, and if they are selected to go to a fighter, than a more advanced trainer, such as the BAE Hawk, and then onto the fighter itself.
 
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seahawk
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 13, 2020 4:26 pm

Sweden plans to partly replace the SK60s with the new phase 1 trainer and to later add a tactical trainer (T-7A).
 
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Dutchy
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 13, 2020 7:36 pm

seahawk wrote:
Sweden plans to partly replace the SK60s with the new phase 1 trainer and to later add a tactical trainer (T-7A).


source?
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seahawk
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 14, 2020 4:53 am

Last Air Forces monthly issue.

But this article gives more or less the same summary: https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news ... ic-trainer
 
RJMAZ
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 14, 2020 9:56 am

seahawk wrote:
Last Air Forces monthly issue.

But this article gives more or less the same summary: https://www.ainonline.com/aviation-news ... ic-trainer

The only thing that is official in that link is the speed requirement for the trainer.

A minimum of 220 knots top speed. That is clear enough. Sweden are not looking at the T-7A.

It is pretty crazy to think that a small air force like Sweden would need a supersonic jet trainer to transition to a small single engine fighter that aleady has a twin seat version.
 
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 14, 2020 9:59 am

seahawk wrote:
Sweden plans to partly replace the SK60s with the new phase 1 trainer and to later add a tactical trainer (T-7A).

If true, the selected props probably will be like the Grob 120, and then use the SK60 for a couple of more years before entering to Gripen D for its advanced training, then replace the SK60 with not unlikely a jet trainer, or a more advanced Turboprop like the Tucano or P-21 because going from a Grob 120 to Gripen D would be ridiculous :lol:
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seahawk
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 14, 2020 10:10 am

Sweden is very different in the way they train their pilots. At the moment they start with the Sk60, so I think they will still start with a turboprop in the future. And the current tender is meant to replace the Sk60 with the 1st Sqn. of the flight training school, that handles the basic training.
 
744SPX
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Thu May 14, 2020 8:49 pm

I'd like to see Pilatus come out with a 500+ mph version of the PC-21. That would further erode any perceived advantages of subsonic jet trainers. Honestly, it should be pretty doable with the PT6A-67F at 1800shp or perhaps the GE Catalyst turboprop.
 
jollo
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Fri May 15, 2020 7:44 am

M-345 anybody? Same operating costs as a comparable turboprop (or lower, with today's fuel price), uses the same Williams International FJ44-4M tubofan as SK60, modern avionics, freshly certified...
 
SuperiorPilotMe
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Fri May 15, 2020 9:16 pm

Then you argue why not T-7A which apparently is very close in operating and procurement costs if not (significantly) cheaper and has a "home-grown" advantage. So what if it's supersonic? If it's a better value overall then just don't use the extra capability if you can't.

The outwardly most logical options would either be PC-7/9, T-7A, a combination of both or the PC-21 (which potentially has performance to cover both the PC-7 lower end and T-7A upper end).
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art
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sat May 16, 2020 3:32 pm

I wonder (because I have no idea) if an all glass trainer cockpit can be designed to switch from Gripen C to Gripen E configuration.
 
jollo
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Sat May 16, 2020 4:32 pm

SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
Then you argue why not T-7A which apparently is very close in operating and procurement costs if not (significantly) cheaper and has a "home-grown" advantage.


Not really: the T-7A is very close in operating and (apparently) cheaper in procurement costs vs. the M-346 Master, which was pitched for the T-X competition against the T-7A. The M-345, despite the external "family look", is a completely different airframe: different mission (basic training syllabus cost reduction), different powerplant (single engine, nowhere near transsonic) and much lower acquisition and operations costs. Still has a full glass cockpit, though.

The "home-grown advantage" is undeniable, but has the T-7A already achieved initial military certification?
 
SuperiorPilotMe
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Mon May 18, 2020 12:22 am

jollo wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
Then you argue why not T-7A which apparently is very close in operating and procurement costs if not (significantly) cheaper and has a "home-grown" advantage.


Not really: the T-7A is very close in operating and (apparently) cheaper in procurement costs vs. the M-346 Master, which was pitched for the T-X competition against the T-7A. The M-345, despite the external "family look", is a completely different airframe: different mission (basic training syllabus cost reduction), different powerplant (single engine, nowhere near transsonic) and much lower acquisition and operations costs. Still has a full glass cockpit, though.

The "home-grown advantage" is undeniable, but has the T-7A already achieved initial military certification?


Other than the point about initial military certification I fail to see how this contradicts my post at all. We're practically saying the same things.

art wrote:
I wonder (because I have no idea) if an all glass trainer cockpit can be designed to switch from Gripen C to Gripen E configuration.



...Good Mother of Jesus and Mary, why? There's absolutely no point I can possibly conceive. Unless you're prepared to argue that someone who trains in a Piper Cherokee cannot possibly fly a Cessna product at all.
Stop the stupids!- Claus Kellerman
 
art
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Tue May 19, 2020 8:24 am

SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
art wrote:
I wonder (because I have no idea) if an all glass trainer cockpit can be designed to switch from Gripen C to Gripen E configuration.


...Good Mother of Jesus and Mary, why? There's absolutely no point I can possibly conceive. Unless you're prepared to argue that someone who trains in a Piper Cherokee cannot possibly fly a Cessna product at all.


I know nothing about training aircraft. What I was wondering was whether one trainer could simulate either a Gripen C or Gripen E cockpit display at the flick of a software switch.
 
jollo
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Tue May 19, 2020 5:53 pm

SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
jollo wrote:
SuperiorPilotMe wrote:
Then you argue why not T-7A which apparently is very close in operating and procurement costs if not (significantly) cheaper and has a "home-grown" advantage.


Not really: the T-7A is very close in operating and (apparently) cheaper in procurement costs vs. the M-346 Master, which was pitched for the T-X competition against the T-7A. The M-345, despite the external "family look", is a completely different airframe: different mission (basic training syllabus cost reduction), different powerplant (single engine, nowhere near transsonic) and much lower acquisition and operations costs. Still has a full glass cockpit, though.

The "home-grown advantage" is undeniable, but has the T-7A already achieved initial military certification?


Other than the point about initial military certification I fail to see how this contradicts my post at all. We're practically saying the same things.


Ah, just wanted to make sure you noticed I am talking about two very different planes: the M-346 (which is comparable to the T-7A, and lost the T-X competition) and the M-345 (which is way cheaper, was not entered in the T-X competition because it had nowhere near the required performance and is aimed squarely at basic training).

I suggested the M-345, you replied "why not T-7A?". Because they are not comparable and not in the same price class.
 
SuperiorPilotMe
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 20, 2020 12:11 am

art wrote:
I know nothing about training aircraft. What I was wondering was whether one trainer could simulate either a Gripen C or Gripen E cockpit display at the flick of a software switch.


There's no point in even arguing if it's theoretically possible because there's no reason to. You don't need to train someone to use an exact screen or interface because said interface is designed to be usable to someone who understand the broad points. It'd be like giving someone driving instruction, the particular car they train on is irrelevant because operations are going to be broadly the same across all cars; or even more relevant, someone familiar with Win10 will probably figure out iOS Whatever The Latest Version Is, Trust Me It Updates All The Time well enough on their own, because you only need to train the broad concepts of an OS, not how to specifically use Win10 or iOS. That's broadly how tactical aircraft operate as well; if you know how to fly it, you can figure out the details on your own very quickly.

Or to address your original point, anybody who knows how to fly a Gripen C can probably figure out how to operate the cockpit display of a Gripen E with little or no additional instruction. In fact come to think of it they're probably absolutely identical anyway, by design.
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art
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 20, 2020 7:18 am

@SuperiorPilotMe

Thanks for your explanation.
 
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 20, 2020 8:52 am

The PC-21 cockpit is very similar to the Gripen C/D with the three LCD displays. The PC-21 can simulate all the advanced features of the latest fighters such as a Gripen and Super Hornet. Saab was responsible for most of the these advanced features so they could easily make the PC-21 have all the features of the Gripen E.

Spain for instance replaced their Aviojet with the PC-21 and they transfer straight to the Eurofighter. The PC-21 flies nearly 100km/h quicker than the PC-9, T-6 and Super Tucano. It is within 100km/h of the cheap jet trainers.

The turboprop gives lower fuel burn and greater endurance than say the M-345. The M-345 as mentioned here would be a great second choice for Sweden. It is less than half the weight/thrust and much cheaper than the M-346 or T-7.
 
art
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 20, 2020 12:58 pm

Saab Signs Support Agreement for SK60

Extends support to 2025. I suppose this allows for procurement of a new trainer to be somewhat delayed. Coronavirus the culprit? We do not know what will happen to the rate of infection as European countries ease restrictions and we do not know what effect the northern winter will have on the rate of infection.

https://www.defense-aerospace.com/artic ... -2025.html
 
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Re: Sweden invites tenders for new phase 1 trainer

Wed May 20, 2020 2:00 pm

art wrote:
Saab Signs Support Agreement for SK60

Extends support to 2025. I suppose this allows for procurement of a new trainer to be somewhat delayed. Coronavirus the culprit? We do not know what will happen to the rate of infection as European countries ease restrictions and we do not know what effect the northern winter will have on the rate of infection.

https://www.defense-aerospace.com/artic ... -2025.html

This talks more for a lighter trainer like the Grob 120TP instead of for example PA-21. Phase 1 is Grobe, Phase 2 is SK60 and then Gripen D before entering Gripen E. If so, the SK60 still needs to be replaced with something within a couple of years, and that this tender isn´t really a replacement of the SK60...? :stirthepot:
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