The UK may replace all of the Royal Air Force’s (RAF’s) current 60-strong fleet of Boeing CH-47 Chinooks with new-build examples to enable the operation of the tandem-rotor type well into the future.

London has already signaled its interest in acquiring 16 F-model Chinooks, likely the long-range MH-47G variant, but has not previously indicated a wider requirement. US approval for a potential $3.5 billion deal was granted in 2018.

ThePointblank wrote:

Plans are to replace the oldest Chinooks in the fleet via tranche one, and the remainder of the 60 odd Chinooks will be replaced at a later date. The article notes that the majority of the RAF's Chinook fleet is well on its way to fly beyond 10,000 hours per frame by 2034:

https://www.flightglobal.com/defence/uk ... 42.article

US approval for a potential $3.5 billion deal was granted in 2018.

texl1649 wrote:

Of course, I’d assume the AW149 or Airbus would be favored there (cheaper than AW609, same size vs. the puma). Both seem like good options. There really isn’t a true competitor still on the drawing board to be certified/available in production by 2030 though for the Chinooks.

N328KF wrote:

texl1649 wrote:

Of course, I’d assume the AW149 or Airbus would be favored there (cheaper than AW609, same size vs. the puma). Both seem like good options. There really isn’t a true competitor still on the drawing board to be certified/available in production by 2030 though for the Chinooks.

Anything from AW would probably have some sort of leg up due to local workshare (AW still being sort of perceived as British) but I don't see how Eurocopter would have any sort of advantage. The fact that FVL is what they want clearly means that they're willing to consider US options and let's be frank, the US is picking up more and and more of their procurement recently.

With that said, I wonder if the US could sell them FVL with some sort of interim option to cover the worst-hit airframes.

Could we retitle this theead "Future UK vertical lift?"

GDB wrote:

With the Chinooks, it's been a long journey with some procurement bumps along the way, though as you can see they have been everywhere and done everything.

bennett123 wrote:

No only is there a 5 year gap between when the FVL will be needed and when it will be available, there are two other factors.

1. Will EIS be delayed.

2. If EIS is in 2030, the first ones will be for the US military. How soon before any are available for export?.

bikerthai wrote:

GDB wrote:

With the Chinooks, it's been a long journey with some procurement bumps along the way, though as you can see they have been everywhere and done everything.

The French sure appreciated those UK Chinooks during their Mali operations. So much so they are also considering getting some themselves.

bt

Myv40 wrote:

bikerthai wrote:

GDB wrote:

With the Chinooks, it's been a long journey with some procurement bumps along the way, though as you can see they have been everywhere and done everything.

The French sure appreciated those UK Chinooks during their Mali operations. So much so they are also considering getting some themselves.

bt

And RAF C17's to get their APC's to theatre! I find it astonishing that the French military with its reasonably large standing army and Legacy colonial commitments (like Mali) lacks both heavy tactical airlift and heavy rotor lift capability!

GDB wrote:

Ironically, they [The French] did build a chopper, which while not of CH-47 nor CH-53 capability, was more than they had for Puma's/Super Pumas.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A%C3%A9ro ... per_Frelon

Mainly used by them in the Naval role, utility ones were exported, here's an export one (Israel) from the underrated 1980's Afghanistan set movie The Beast'.
(Israel later upgraded their fleet with US engines, France could have done the same with local powerplants);

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y03YxzyKsWk

There is a better quality clip but this shows the utility version better.
(A few years later, the filmmakers could have got a Mi-8 rather than using this chopper as a stand in).
.

GCT64 wrote:

The French could stick with the Super Frelon by going for the Avicopter AC313 / Changhe Z-18 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicopter_AC313

N328KF wrote:

GCT64 wrote:

The French could stick with the Super Frelon by going for the Avicopter AC313 / Changhe Z-18 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avicopter_AC313

Do you really see a chance of that happening? There would be so many things wrong with going this route.

The U.K. and the Pentagon reached agreement on a $2 billion sale of 14 Chinook helicopters built by Boeing Co., as well as engines, machine guns, radar and missile-jamming equipment for the choppers, according to officials and documents.

The agreement was confirmed in a previously undisclosed March 25 letter from the U.K.’s embassy in Washington that paves the way for signed contracts. But the letter also indicates that the U.K. wants to delay delivery of the helicopters by as much as three years, in part due to impacts from the Covid-19 pandemic.

Myv40 wrote:

bikerthai wrote:

GDB wrote:

With the Chinooks, it's been a long journey with some procurement bumps along the way, though as you can see they have been everywhere and done everything.

The French sure appreciated those UK Chinooks during their Mali operations. So much so they are also considering getting some themselves.

bt

And RAF C17's to get their APC's to theatre! I find it astonishing that the French military with its reasonably large standing army and Legacy colonial commitments (like Mali) lacks both heavy tactical airlift and heavy rotor lift capability!

N328KF wrote:

texl1649 wrote:

Of course, I’d assume the AW149 or Airbus would be favored there (cheaper than AW609, same size vs. the puma). Both seem like good options. There really isn’t a true competitor still on the drawing board to be certified/available in production by 2030 though for the Chinooks.

Anything from AW would probably have some sort of leg up due to local workshare (AW still being sort of perceived as British) but I don't see how Eurocopter would have any sort of advantage. The fact that FVL is what they want clearly means that they're willing to consider US options and let's be frank, the US is picking up more and and more of their procurement recently.

With that said, I wonder if the US could sell them FVL with some sort of interim option to cover the worst-hit airframes.

Could we retitle this theead "Future UK vertical lift?"

kitplane01 wrote:

N328KF wrote:

texl1649 wrote:

Of course, I’d assume the AW149 or Airbus would be favored there (cheaper than AW609, same size vs. the puma). Both seem like good options. There really isn’t a true competitor still on the drawing board to be certified/available in production by 2030 though for the Chinooks.

Anything from AW would probably have some sort of leg up due to local workshare (AW still being sort of perceived as British) but I don't see how Eurocopter would have any sort of advantage. The fact that FVL is what they want clearly means that they're willing to consider US options and let's be frank, the US is picking up more and and more of their procurement recently.

With that said, I wonder if the US could sell them FVL with some sort of interim option to cover the worst-hit airframes.

Could we retitle this theead "Future UK vertical lift?"

It's not obvious that the UK could/should afford the FVL. If it costs 2x or 3x as much as a conventional helicopter (with 2x or 3x increase in running costs too), maybe the UK would do better buying a conventional helicopter.

texl1649 wrote:

kitplane01 wrote:

N328KF wrote:

Anything from AW would probably have some sort of leg up due to local workshare (AW still being sort of perceived as British) but I don't see how Eurocopter would have any sort of advantage. The fact that FVL is what they want clearly means that they're willing to consider US options and let's be frank, the US is picking up more and and more of their procurement recently.

With that said, I wonder if the US could sell them FVL with some sort of interim option to cover the worst-hit airframes.

Could we retitle this theead "Future UK vertical lift?"

It's not obvious that the UK could/should afford the FVL. If it costs 2x or 3x as much as a conventional helicopter (with 2x or 3x increase in running costs too), maybe the UK would do better buying a conventional helicopter.

I know I am skeptical but Bell claims to have an ability to build and sell V-280’s for $20 million each. I don’t think it is likely to cost significantly more to operate than a conventional helicopter, unless the final engines do in fact cause a lot of maintenance/reliability issues. If the Lockheed/Sikorsky wins, I think we all expect that to cost a fortune, LOL.

https://www.wired.com/2016/07/bell-v280 ... placement/