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MrBren
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Rafale for Greece

Thu Sep 30, 2021 7:38 am

 
blackrock
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Thu Sep 30, 2021 8:59 am

They have already a connection with the French because they fly Mirage, there is not a real surprise. Even more, in the last year when they had a confrontation with Turkey for oil exploration, French sent their navy as support there is not a real surprise there is some tight commercial, military and political connection.

Now, if they will find the money to pay the fuel to fly them frequently enough, this is another subject...
 
RJMAZ
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Thu Sep 30, 2021 9:48 am

Are the extra 6 aircraft second hand? That would bring the order to 18 second hand and 6 new jets.

This is a brilliant sales strategy for France. Instead of paying for an avionics upgrade for their early Rafale aircraft they sell them second hand and buy brand new aircraft with the newer avionics. France then saves on the upgrade costs and they end up getting a brand new aircraft with a much longer service life. This also keeps the production line humming along. They are providing high quality aircraft to customers that would probably have purchased second hand F-16.
 
Pendennis
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:27 pm

Please remember that previously Greece operated the Mirage F1 and the Mirage 2000. With their main concern being their neighbour Turkey, having F-16s and previously Phantoms, just gives them parity in terms of equipment; the USA will only allow approved ancilliary equipment and weapons to be carried. The French apply no such limitations so if you can integrate French, Israeli, even Russian or any other nation's equipment, you can field something your enemy does not have first-hand knowledge of.
 
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Aesma
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Fri Oct 01, 2021 2:40 pm

Greece is also buying 3 FDI frigates : https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... om-france/
 
FlapOperator
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Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2021 4:07 pm

Re: Rafale for Greece

Sat Oct 02, 2021 12:36 am

I think that its great for France to get some export wins, and of course, the recent issues France has had with Turkey make arming the Greeks a no-brainer.
 
GDB
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Sun Oct 03, 2021 5:39 pm

FlapOperator wrote:
I think that its great for France to get some export wins, and of course, the recent issues France has had with Turkey make arming the Greeks a no-brainer.


Agreed, though I should have wanted the Arrowhead 140 competitor to win, I did not like the 'sweetner' of two RN Type 23's.
 
LHAM
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Tue Oct 05, 2021 11:32 am

RJMAZ wrote:
Are the extra 6 aircraft second hand? That would bring the order to 18 second hand and 6 new jets.


No, they are going to be newbuilds.

Aesma wrote:
Greece is also buying 3 FDI frigates : https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... om-france/

Yes it is three firm plus one option, first delivery 2025.
Also three Gowind class corvettes plus options.
 
FlapOperator
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Wed Oct 06, 2021 2:18 pm

GDB wrote:
FlapOperator wrote:
I think that its great for France to get some export wins, and of course, the recent issues France has had with Turkey make arming the Greeks a no-brainer.


Agreed, though I should have wanted the Arrowhead 140 competitor to win, I did not like the 'sweetner' of two RN Type 23's.


The Type 23 is pretty turn key though, and keeps some capability in ASW especially that is increasingly in demand and for which current smaller frigate designs aren't optimized.
 
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Kiwirob
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Thu Oct 07, 2021 1:42 pm

GDB wrote:
FlapOperator wrote:
I think that its great for France to get some export wins, and of course, the recent issues France has had with Turkey make arming the Greeks a no-brainer.


Agreed, though I should have wanted the Arrowhead 140 competitor to win, I did not like the 'sweetner' of two RN Type 23's.


What is wrong with the sweetener, they were offering older type 23's, one then has been out of service for a couple of years, which would have been refurbished in the UK giving jobs to UK shipyards.
 
GDB
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Re: Rafale for Greece

Thu Oct 07, 2021 3:16 pm

Kiwirob wrote:
GDB wrote:
FlapOperator wrote:
I think that its great for France to get some export wins, and of course, the recent issues France has had with Turkey make arming the Greeks a no-brainer.


Agreed, though I should have wanted the Arrowhead 140 competitor to win, I did not like the 'sweetner' of two RN Type 23's.


What is wrong with the sweetener, they were offering older type 23's, one then has been out of service for a couple of years, which would have been refurbished in the UK giving jobs to UK shipyards.


Then update them in the yards for RN service. All very well giving the RN new missions, new purpose, even tacking on their silly political slogans to ships not ordered by them, in the case of the carriers, what they tried to cancel.
I don't mind using the new OPV's on more global deployments, a lot of the time it makes some sense and they can be as useful as a Frigate or Destroyer for basic maritime security, anti piracy etc. But let's not fool ourselves, it's happened due to having too few escorts.

This Rafale and warship deal is a 'win' for Macron, it will take some of the sting out the Submarine issue domestically, might even calm things down a bit. Since the ignorant caricature of him, by the so reliable, honest, not at all tied in with criminal behavior and Met Police corruption that is the British tabloid press, is something to be ignored, his political fortunes are tied in with Western security interests, as compared to say Madame Vichy. Or less likely but not impossible, that old far left Fossil, (Le Len McClusky as I refer to him).

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