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mpgunner
Topic Author
Posts: 28
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2015 4:08 pm

Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Mon Nov 15, 2021 11:40 pm

https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/11/debris-from-a-satellite-shot-down-by-the-russians-appears-to-threaten-the-iss/

This is insane. Seems like there could be some long term repercussions from this.
 
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Francoflier
Posts: 6007
Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2001 12:27 pm

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Tue Nov 16, 2021 2:45 am

Another brainiac move by Russia. :sarcastic:

It does bring up an interesting point however.
As warfare moves into orbit, the next major global conflict will undoubtedly involve massive destruction of hardware in space which will likely render Earth's orbit inaccessible to humans for the foreseeable future.

We really are too stupid for our own sake.
 
FlapOperator
Posts: 590
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2021 4:07 pm

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Tue Nov 16, 2021 5:43 am

Francoflier wrote:
Another brainiac move by Russia. :sarcastic:

It does bring up an interesting point however.
As warfare moves into orbit, the next major global conflict will undoubtedly involve massive destruction of hardware in space which will likely render Earth's orbit inaccessible to humans for the foreseeable future.

We really are too stupid for our own sake.


The Chinese created a huge debris field with their own test about 10 years ago that still threatens on orbit satellites.
 
ZaphodHarkonnen
Posts: 1174
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2015 10:20 am

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Tue Nov 16, 2021 6:25 am

For LEO a Kessler syndrome is unlikely to last for very long due to small debris being slowed by drag and self deorbiting. This is why SpaceX's Starlink orbits are as low as they are. Lose control and it just falls out of the sky after a few months. MEO could cause some problems but would largely be limited to stuff wanting to stay in that orbit. If you're just passing through the risk is probably acceptable. HEO/GEO? There's so much volume there you probably couldn't kick off Kessler syndrome even if you tried.

Pain in the ass move by the Russian government that will threaten their own people as well as any others around that altitude. Which includes China who have a couple of taikonauts in orbit right now as well.
 
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flyingturtle
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Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2011 1:39 pm

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Tue Nov 16, 2021 7:38 am

The US did such tests, too - in 1985 and 2008. I don't know why the US side is complaining...
 
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Dutchy
Posts: 12831
Joined: Sat Nov 03, 2007 1:25 am

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Tue Nov 16, 2021 10:20 am

two wrongs, don't make it right.
 
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ssteve
Posts: 1526
Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:32 am

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Tue Nov 16, 2021 1:17 pm

flyingturtle wrote:
The US did such tests, too - in 1985 and 2008. I don't know why the US side is complaining...


I mean, we drive on roads, too, why should we complain if you're drunk?
 
FlapOperator
Posts: 590
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2021 4:07 pm

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Tue Nov 16, 2021 4:58 pm

flyingturtle wrote:
The US did such tests, too - in 1985 and 2008. I don't know why the US side is complaining...


The ASM-135 test was conducted at low altitude and the debris field had limited impact.

The 2008 shot was less of a test than a desire to limit hydrazine exposure on the ground as there was a fear the tanks would survive reentry and pose a risk to whomever potentially stumbled across it. Hydrazine is really nasty stuff. The shot was taken at really altitude precisely to encourage fragments would burn up since the craft was already reentering.

Both the Chinese test and now Russian test appear to be conducted at far higher altitudes where many more conflicts exist and fragments will persist fr potentially decades.
 
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keesje
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Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2001 2:08 am

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Tue Nov 16, 2021 11:49 pm

I always put my coldwar BS filter on when events like this occur.
 
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Spacepope
Posts: 5643
Joined: Tue Dec 28, 1999 11:10 am

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:16 am

FlapOperator wrote:
flyingturtle wrote:
The US did such tests, too - in 1985 and 2008. I don't know why the US side is complaining...


The ASM-135 test was conducted at low altitude and the debris field had limited impact.

The 2008 shot was less of a test than a desire to limit hydrazine exposure on the ground as there was a fear the tanks would survive reentry and pose a risk to whomever potentially stumbled across it. Hydrazine is really nasty stuff. The shot was taken at really altitude precisely to encourage fragments would burn up since the craft was already reentering.

Both the Chinese test and now Russian test appear to be conducted at far higher altitudes where many more conflicts exist and fragments will persist fr potentially decades.


Indeed, Flying Turtle's "both sides are bad" whataboutism muddies the fact that the higher altitude Chinese and Russian tests are far more dangerous to future spaceflight than the US ones. The impacts aren't even in the same league.
 
ZaphodHarkonnen
Posts: 1174
Joined: Sun Jan 04, 2015 10:20 am

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:55 am

Good image from ULA on how fast things decay from various orbit altitudes. https://twitter.com/torybruno/status/14 ... 0284516354
 
mpgunner
Topic Author
Posts: 28
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2015 4:08 pm

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Wed Nov 17, 2021 9:01 pm

ZaphodHarkonnen wrote:
Good image from ULA on how fast things decay from various orbit altitudes. https://twitter.com/torybruno/status/14 ... 0284516354


Very interesting. Thanks
 
estorilm
Posts: 830
Joined: Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:07 am

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Wed Nov 17, 2021 9:22 pm

flyingturtle wrote:
The US did such tests, too - in 1985 and 2008. I don't know why the US side is complaining...

Maybe because it was a low / decaying orbit which burned up in a matter of months?

Russia only had one suitable old satellite to shoot down, and its orbit is nearly identical to that of the International Space Station, but they did it anyways. It will pose a threat to ALL objects in a VERY popular region of LEO for a long time to come.

That's why the US side is complaining. Also it's not just the US, everyone (including Russia's Roscosmos) is complaining!
 
wingman
Posts: 4209
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 4:25 am

Re: Russia just shot down their own satellite!!!

Thu Nov 18, 2021 1:13 am

I can easily envision the cave man from the show Ghosts and his twin brother drunk in the missile silo and firing off a shot without sending a text to Yuri at Roscosmos. It’s so ludicrous a story it could only come from Russia.

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