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Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Fri Dec 31, 2021 3:44 pm

Welcome to the Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread 2022. Please continue your discussion and to post your news here.

Link to previous thread:

Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2021
 
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bikerthai
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Wed Jan 12, 2022 12:36 pm

The UK has received its 9th and final P-8A frames contracted.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.janes. ... Fp1cVMwPQ2

The capability gap has now been closed.

bt
 
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bikerthai
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Tue Feb 01, 2022 9:44 pm

ROK first P-8A have been painted.

Sorry no photos for now. Woody where are you?

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Thu Feb 03, 2022 3:53 am

bikerthai wrote:
ROK first P-8A have been painted.

Sorry no photos for now. Woody where are you?

bt


The 1st P8 for for the Republic of Korea Navy is now painted on the flight line.

9142 66448 N771DS 230921 737-8FV Republic of Korea Navy

Image
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Thu Feb 03, 2022 12:56 pm

Cool,

With deference to The Saint, I like this scheme the most so far.

by
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sat Feb 19, 2022 6:01 am

9180 170014 737-8FV US Navy - R/O
Image
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Thu Feb 24, 2022 10:55 pm

First Royal Norwegian air force P-8 has arrived in Norway.
 
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bikerthai
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Fri Feb 25, 2022 1:33 pm

https://www.overtdefense.com/2022/02/24 ... ives-home/

Some more on the P-8A for Norway info here.

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Fri Feb 25, 2022 11:12 pm

Mortyman wrote:
First Royal Norwegian air force P-8 has arrived in Norway.


Nothing like putting it to use immediately!
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Thu Mar 03, 2022 5:26 am

@RoyalAirForce @BoeingDefense E-7A Wedgetail AEW Mk1 (737-700) - C/N 66840 / LN 9103 rolled out of final assembly.

Image
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Fri Mar 04, 2022 12:35 pm

 
 
superbizzy73
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Thu Mar 17, 2022 2:38 pm

WoodysAeroimag wrote:
@RoyalAirForce @BoeingDefense E-7A Wedgetail AEW Mk1 (737-700) - C/N 66840 / LN 9103 rolled out of final assembly.

Image


Saw that aircraft flying into KBFI a couple of days ago, and it totally confused me...until I realized what it was!
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Thu Mar 31, 2022 12:04 am

170015 for the US Navy is out
Image
 
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WoodysAeroimag
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Thu Mar 31, 2022 12:05 am

The 1st P8 for @NZAirForce has arrived at Renton for final assembly.

9449 737-8FV Royal New Zealand Air Force
Image
 
BobLoblah
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Apr 10, 2022 10:38 pm

WoodysAeroimag wrote:
170015 for the US Navy is out
Image



ca350 on flickr got a picture of this one flying on 4/8/22 and gives its line number as 9257. I was expecting it to be ~9218. Did I miss one?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/148006280 ... 990353172/

Thanks!
 
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WoodysAeroimag
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Apr 11, 2022 12:15 am

BobLoblah wrote:
WoodysAeroimag wrote:
170015 for the US Navy is out
Image



ca350 on flickr got a picture of this one flying on 4/8/22 and gives its line number as 9257. I was expecting it to be ~9218. Did I miss one?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/148006280 ... 990353172/

Thanks!


9219 hasn't been seen at Renton yet. The line # is 9257

9296, 9334, 9373, 9411, & 9449 are in final assembly now.
 
BobLoblah
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Apr 11, 2022 3:01 am

Awesome info, thanks!
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Apr 11, 2022 3:12 pm

9218 is not a P-8 line number.
Looks like the commercials line numbers do not sync with the military line numbers in the production schedules.

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sat Apr 16, 2022 3:22 pm

The next P8 for the @USNavy rolled out of paint.

BuNo. 170016

Image
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Apr 25, 2022 12:23 pm

According to The Times, a US marine surveillance P-8 Poseidon aircraft, was tracking Moskva in the hours before it was attacked before supplying its location to the Ukrainian military.


Just speculation, but perhaps they can chalk up a first assist in sinking of a surface vessel.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... -ship.html

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 2:43 am

Germany has funded 7 more P-8 Poseidons, bringing total procurement to 12. This probably will pretty much replace the P-3Cs.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... ping-list/
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:05 am

N328KF wrote:
Germany has funded 7 more P-8 Poseidons, bringing total procurement to 12. This probably will pretty much replace the P-3Cs.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... ping-list/


I struggle to see why Germany needs 12 P8’s they have a rather limited area to patrol. Countries which need more of the are NZ, Norway, The UK, not Germany. It makes me think they don’t really know what to do with the increased budget.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:19 am

N328KF wrote:
Germany has funded 7 more P-8 Poseidons, bringing total procurement to 12. This probably will pretty much replace the P-3Cs.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... ping-list/

That's not official, and there still is the French-German MAWS project. Quoted from the article:
The list of investment priorities attached to the special fund bill doesn’t mention P-8s by name, saying only that an unspecific number of additional planes in the maritime-surveillance category should be bought. Defense officials did not return a request for comment on Friday afternoon.

On Twitter, a German MOD spokeswoman (privately) has contradicted the information.
 
Noray
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 11:21 am

Kiwirob wrote:
N328KF wrote:
Germany has funded 7 more P-8 Poseidons, bringing total procurement to 12. This probably will pretty much replace the P-3Cs.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... ping-list/


I struggle to see why Germany needs 12 P8’s they have a rather limited area to patrol. Countries which need more of the are NZ, Norway, The UK, not Germany. It makes me think they don’t really know what to do with the increased budget.

Ever heard of "NATO"? Guess what the "A" stands for and where Russian submarines will operate.

Germany once had just as many Breguet Atlantics as France.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 12:03 pm

Noray wrote:
That's not official, and there still is the French-German MAWS project.


The MAWS project is still a few years out. If the order for 7 more P-8A is true, then Germany may get the last of the 7 delivered before the MAWS project make first flight.

Noray wrote:
Ever heard of "NATO"? Guess what the "A" stands for and where Russian submarines will operate.


From the rumor mill and speculations: For a while, there was talk about NATO (specifically the Mediterranean countries) looking in to P-8s. However that discussion has pretty much gone silent. So it is conceivable that flushed with cash, Germany may be loading up on P-8s for NATO commitments in the Med as well.

Note that Boeing/US NAVY has offered Canada 20 P-8s. If that comes to pass, the North Atlantic would pretty much me covered. And the French may have to scale back the MAWS project.

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 12:33 pm

bikerthai wrote:
Noray wrote:
That's not official, and there still is the French-German MAWS project.


The MAWS project is still a few years out.

But if it is meant to be kept alive, it needs a budget as well, and money from the €100 bn special fund would come in handy.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 2:11 pm

Noray wrote:
But if it is meant to be kept alive, it needs a budget as well, and money from the €100 bn special fund would come in handy.


Only if France put money in the pot as well. At first they said the 5 P-8A Germany bought was an interim solution. I could see a scenario where Germany would transfer them to NATO once MAWS is implemented. If Germany is ordering 7 more, then you can take out the "interim" part.

And yes if they say order 7 it would be for a system currently in production and not developmental.

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 3:24 pm

Interesting discussion. Maybe the 7 more P-8 will end up in a NATO pool like the E-3 Sentry AWACS and C-17 Globemaster II at Papa Air Base.
That being said, Germany does have a need for maritime surveillance and anti-sub warfare aircraft. They have ports both in the Baltic Sea and the North Sea.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 3:46 pm

Also, P-8s are more than just anti-sub.

They are not only flying over the Black Sea, but doing loops over Romaina as well.

SIGNINT is also a major function.

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 4:05 pm

bikerthai wrote:
Noray wrote:
But if it is meant to be kept alive, it needs a budget as well, and money from the €100 bn special fund would come in handy.


Only if France put money in the pot as well. At first they said the 5 P-8A Germany bought was an interim solution. I could see a scenario where Germany would transfer them to NATO once MAWS is implemented. If Germany is ordering 7 more, then you can take out the "interim" part.

And yes if they say order 7 it would be for a system currently in production and not developmental.

bt

France has a requirement to replace the Atlantic 2 around 2035, they will need to pay for the development anyway.

Once more: The official German plan doesn't mention any number or type of aircraft, it just says "Procurement of more maritime patrol aircraft". "7 more P-8A" is a rumour that has been quoted by Defensenews, but denied by a German government spokesperson. It may be the idea of the naval leadership, but the decision rests with Parliament and the government.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Sun Jun 05, 2022 4:24 pm

Noray wrote:
France has a requirement to replace the Atlantic 2 around 2035, they will need to pay for the development anyway.


The question: Is France willing to start paying now. Even if the development takes 10 years, it would not be until 2025 when France have to put in serious money.

If we hear that France is starting MAWS funding in the next few months, then I may buy in to the posibility.

Something tells me all of Western Europe will be wanting to spend money on real hardware right now as opposed to something slated for 2035.

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 7:21 am

Noray wrote:
Kiwirob wrote:
N328KF wrote:
Germany has funded 7 more P-8 Poseidons, bringing total procurement to 12. This probably will pretty much replace the P-3Cs.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... ping-list/


I struggle to see why Germany needs 12 P8’s they have a rather limited area to patrol. Countries which need more of the are NZ, Norway, The UK, not Germany. It makes me think they don’t really know what to do with the increased budget.

Ever heard of "NATO"? Guess what the "A" stands for and where Russian submarines will operate.

Germany once had just as many Breguet Atlantics as France.


Still doesn't mean they need 12.
 
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bikerthai
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 2:43 pm

Whether they need 12 or not . . . the quantity is confirmed and wait for government approval.

https://www.aviacionline.com/2022/06/ge ... s-project/

Sounds to me the MAWS project is cooked. Canada will be forced to go by way of the P-8A as well . . . the reasoning will sound familiar . . . Interoperability with other NATO members and available now.

I can see it now, German with their cash can provide the high end MMA and those with less funds can supplement with smaller airframes.


bt
 
stratable
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 3:05 pm

Potentially having 12 aircraft also comes back to Germany planning to be more involved internationally, especially in the South China Sea. I could see a situation where in a few years time, German P8s will be operating out of say South Korea or Japan as part of an international mission.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 4:09 pm

bikerthai wrote:
Whether they need 12 or not . . . the quantity is confirmed and wait for government approval.

https://www.aviacionline.com/2022/06/ge ... s-project/

Sounds to me the MAWS project is cooked. Canada will be forced to go by way of the P-8A as well . . . the reasoning will sound familiar . . . Interoperability with other NATO members and available now.

That article was published two days ago by an Argentinian author who doesn't seem to be specialized in Germany (possibly just echoing Defensenews?), round about the same time a German MOD spokesperson disclaimed that information. How can you call this a confirmation? In Germany, there are Pentecost holidays and no real news are to be expected right now.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 4:20 pm

From what I hear the German government have approved the budget with the 7 P-8s. I just can not find a newer article. We may have to wait a few more hours or the next day.

Edit:

Still not 100% confirmation, but all clues leads to the P-8A.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... ping-list/

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 4:35 pm

bikerthai wrote:
From what I hear the German government have approved the budget with the 7 P-8s. I just can not find a newer article. We may have to wait a few more hours or the next day.

Edit:

Still not 100% confirmation, but all clues leads to the P-8A.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... ping-list/

bt

That's the same article we've been discussing since yesterday, see #22.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 5:13 pm

We will have to wait for the official announcement then.

Until then we can speculate on what other than P-8A would the German consider.

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 6:14 pm

bikerthai wrote:
Sounds to me the MAWS project is cooked.
bt

I do not think you will see France buying the P8, and with the line winding down they can use the old tech as a crutch. France will have their own patrol a/c, even if not 100% of the P8 capability, it will be 100% non-USA, which seems to be the prime motivator to ensure the European or French industrial base.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 6:47 pm

par13del wrote:
do not think you will see France buying the P8, and with the line winding down they can use the old tech as a crutch.


I agree that higher probabilities that France will not buy P-8s. However, I think the A320 MMA will be to costly for France to go it alone (with out Germany). They may settle on a smaller frames.

par13del wrote:
it will be 100% non-USA,


This will be difficult if they want to be NATO compatible, specially in the field of electronics.

bt
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 7:47 pm

France should take the opportunity go for a real MPA. the P-1.
 
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par13del
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 8:52 pm

744SPX wrote:
France should take the opportunity go for a real MPA. the P-1.

That's a very workable idea, strengthen their ties in Asia, may even allow them to develop future industrial ties, Japan carriers finally went Airbus, so why not a reciprocal with a major European power? The frame is already in operation, they could quickly customize their electronics.
Brilliant thought.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Mon Jun 06, 2022 9:01 pm

par13del wrote:
The frame is already in operation, they could quickly customize their electronics.
Brilliant thought.


Brilliant politically.

Technically? Financially?

Let's just say Boeing seems to know enough about the P-1 to offer an unsolicited bid of the P-8 to Japan. Of course Japan turned them down.

But I guess buying the P-1 may cost less than putting lots of money to develop your own.

I can see that happening . . . but then where is the local industrial participation? I mean at least with the P-8A, you have the CFM connection. With the P-1 you are paying extra dollars to thumb your nose at them uncouth Americans. :mischievous:

bt
 
744SPX
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Tue Jun 07, 2022 12:21 am

bikerthai wrote:
par13del wrote:
The frame is already in operation, they could quickly customize their electronics.
Brilliant thought.




Let's just say Boeing seems to know enough about the P-1 to offer an unsolicited bid of the P-8 to Japan. Of course Japan turned them down.


bt


Boeing seriously did that? :shakehead: Must be those 737-worshipping bean counters. Can't think of a worse insult than offering an ally an inferior aircraft when said ally invested in their own purpose built, significantly superior aircraft. That's the sort of delusion that raises all kinds of flags.

The only point they could possibly argue is that the P-8 has superior sensors. Platform to platform, its no contest. The P-1 beats the overweight converted airliner like a rented mule.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Tue Jun 07, 2022 12:59 am

744SPX wrote:
The only point they could possibly argue is that the P-8 has superior sensors. Platform to platform, its no contest.


Can't say much about the sensors, but the NAVY keeps upgrading them as time passes, and anyone who fly the P-8A can get them without laying out development costs.

But the thing about the bean counter is probably on point as the P-8A is much cheaper to buy, operate, and maintain. And that was the selling point. I guess the Japanese value pride above price.

Would concur that the P-1 is probably better quality than the P-8A build wise.

bt
 
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par13del
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Tue Jun 07, 2022 3:24 am

Imagine if the Japanese were like the French / Europeans and started accusing the USA of being nationalistic and not buying foreign equipment......the USA government could have reacted by getting some P1's for the Coast Guard....
 
bajs11
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Tue Jun 07, 2022 6:51 am

744SPX wrote:
bikerthai wrote:
par13del wrote:
The frame is already in operation, they could quickly customize their electronics.
Brilliant thought.




Let's just say Boeing seems to know enough about the P-1 to offer an unsolicited bid of the P-8 to Japan. Of course Japan turned them down.


bt


Boeing seriously did that? :shakehead: Must be those 737-worshipping bean counters. Can't think of a worse insult than offering an ally an inferior aircraft when said ally invested in their own purpose built, significantly superior aircraft. That's the sort of delusion that raises all kinds of flags.

The only point they could possibly argue is that the P-8 has superior sensors. Platform to platform, its no contest. The P-1 beats the overweight converted airliner like a rented mule.


bikerthai wrote:
744SPX wrote:
The only point they could possibly argue is that the P-8 has superior sensors. Platform to platform, its no contest.


Can't say much about the sensors, but the NAVY keeps upgrading them as time passes, and anyone who fly the P-8A can get them without laying out development costs.

But the thing about the bean counter is probably on point as the P-8A is much cheaper to buy, operate, and maintain. And that was the selling point. I guess the Japanese value pride above price.

Would concur that the P-1 is probably better quality than the P-8A build wise.

bt


Got any numbers or analyses made by reputable military analysts?
 
Avatar2go
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Tue Jun 07, 2022 7:58 am

As others have noted, the advantages of the P-8 are lower operational and sustainment costs, at the expense of lesser offensive capabilities and low-altitude performance. The sensor suite is designed accordingly, to operate at altitude and to maximize surveillance area.

Other designs such as the P-1, have higher costs but are more effective offensively and at low altitude. And have sensor suites designed to take advantage of those capabilities.

For the US that has many available assets for target prosecution, the lack of offensive capability is not a significant issue. For other countries that may be relying on the aircraft to prosecute targets, it may be an issue.
 
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Re: Boeing P-8 Poseidon News, Production and Delivery Thread - 2022

Tue Jun 07, 2022 10:58 am

bajs11 wrote:
Got any numbers or analyses made by reputable military analysts?


The only numbers available are the FMS sales published by the US Navy. Not sure if there are any available for the P-1.

Avatar2go wrote:
For the US that has many available assets for target prosecution, the lack of offensive capability is not a significant issue. For other countries that may be relying on the aircraft to prosecute targets, it may be an issue.


The P-8 has the full offensive capabilities required for MMA. The argument that the P-1 can operate more efficiently at low altitude which may be true. But it does not mean the P-8A can not drop down on the deck. If you put that argument on its head though, one would ask, has the P-1 been upgraded to be able to drop torpedoes from high altitude? Or operate in situation where high altitude is more advantageous?

If other nations need additional offensive capabilities, its only a matter of puting out money for software upgrade and flight tests.

Here is an article discussing potential upgrades.

https://www.militaryaerospace.com/senso ... a-poseidon.

The Navy also is interested in fitting the Poseidon aircraft with 500-to-2,000-pound versions of the Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM); MK 62, 63, and 65 mines; Small Diameter Bomb (SDB-II); Miniature Air Launched Decoy (MALD); Bomb Rack Unit BRU-55; and Universal Armament Interface (UAI).


Is there an argument to say the P-1 has not won any foreign sales because of Japanese policy? Perhaps when thay policy is dropped, it will make it easier for foreign sales.

bt

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Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos