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Matt D
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The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:35 am

 
KROC
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:46 am

You have out done yourself on this one!  Big thumbs up
 
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Aaron747
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:49 am

Disgusting. Absolutely repugnant. And not altogether atypical of the reactionary mindset of California's newest minority - white people.

 
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Aaron747
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 5:05 am

At least now we've established the subtext for rational arguments against immigration and 'overpopulation' in this state.
 
covert
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 5:21 am

And Matt D cries about the new license once again....
 
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lindy field
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 5:22 am

Matt D,

Didn't you claim you were going to move to Arizona months ago? Or did you decide to stay so you can regale us with your rants about California? As a member of the left, let me thank for discrediting a legitimate right-wing criticism of Californian Democratic policies by displaying (once again) your racism to the world. Well done. We need more like you.
 
rojo
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 5:27 am

Mexicans are getting back what used to be part of their territory, but in a different way (no war and no $$$ like in the past), this time it is called Illegal Immigration. Interesting phenomena!!

I guess people are really mad about the decisions taken by politicians in California.
 
JAL777
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 5:53 am

 
DeltaSFO
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 5:58 am

Here's to you, Matt!

 
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Aaron747
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 6:07 am

LOL - that is perfect!! I needed that after getting all worked up DL  Big grin
 
DeltaSFO
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 9:37 am

My pleasure Aaron...

We aim to please.
 
BlatantEcho
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 11:45 am

Never met one white person who works harder than a Mexican immigrant.

Those guys bust their asses for $10/hour and you have the gall to make fun of them. This is America friend, you're as free to leave as they are to move here.

Worst thread ever.

George
 
flight152
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 12:19 pm

Never met one white person who works harder than a Mexican immigrant.

Riiiiiiiiiight. If this was the case, they could work their way into the country legally.
 
BlatantEcho
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 12:27 pm

Flight152-

You're from NY, hum, I was born there, and there ain't too many Mexicans in those parts.

I mean, how do you want someone to get into a country? Ask for a better life at the border?

Sometimes is takes a little more effort than that. You do reazlie that an illegal immigrant is risking death just to cross some land so he MIGHT look forward to a better life don't you? How bout having to learn a new language on the fly? Did you ever risk your life for a CHANCE to work hard?

You can't just sit around and collect $$$, you need to bust your ass, and when everyone else knows that, you have to work that much harder to get a leg up.

As the Mexican population in this state continues to rise, and as the generation born here continues to grow up, their amazing work ethic coupled with a good education will no doubt push them far ahead of any lazy white kid looking for work.

George
 
flight152
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 12:39 pm

Sometimes is takes a little more effort than that. You do reazlie that an illegal immigrant is risking death just to cross some land so he MIGHT look forward to a better life don't you? How bout having to learn a new language on the fly? Did you ever risk your life for a CHANCE to work hard?

Yeah, guess what? Almost every immigrant into the United States (or any country, for that matter) has to overcome these things. These things are not limited to Mexicans running across the boarder.

Give me a break.  Yeah sure
 
BlatantEcho
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 12:49 pm

*sigh*

you missed all the important stuff, and tried to gloss over everything I said by selecting a little quote and trying to brush it off.

So, do you hate all immigrants, or just Mexican immigrants? Since everyone has a hard time, and you're only picking on Mexicans, you're either racist or utterly confused. Unless you're Native American, you've got a lot of explaining to do.

George
 
flight152
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 1:06 pm

So, do you hate all immigrants, or just Mexican immigrants?

Show me where I said that.

Since everyone has a hard time, and you're only picking on Mexicans, you're either racist or utterly confused.

Racist? lol. I was just arguring your statement that ALL Mexicans work harder then white people. Don't backpedal now. YOU mentioned how the Mexicans have had a hard time..I mentioned how it has always been like that.
 
RNOcommctr
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 1:08 pm

Matt D... and who the hell buses your table and washes the dishes when you go to a restaurant? Who trims the landscaping and cuts the grass? Who watches your kids? Who cleans the bathrooms and waxes the floors at restaurants, office buildings, and airports? Who picks the fruit and vegetables you eat? Yes, that's right, Matt... Mexican-Americans! They do the menial jobs (and many have two or three jobs) that you and I and other gringoes won't do.

And yes, my wife is from Mexico, so I am doubly offended.
 
BlatantEcho
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 1:16 pm

I'm not here to argue semantics with you.

You've brought nothing to this conversation except a firm conviction that your life in New York has somehow addequetly prepared you to discuss Mexican immigration in California.

I've never heard anyone say "lol" in a sentence and gone on to expect someone to take them seriously. I'll say very plainly that your attitude is unfortunetly the most prevelant one I see today, ignorant and judgmental of a culture you not only do not understand, but one that you feel the need to chastice at the slightest hint that someone might be making inroads on your lifestyle.

I live in a country that is the melting pot of the world. I don't give a shit how you got here, none of us rode in on a golden horse. Hard work pays off unless you're born rich, and I'll tell you what, Mexican immigrants, legal or not, are busting their collective asses to make life better for themselves and their familes. You let that bother you all you want, I'll live in a world where hard work speaks a helluva a lot lounder than right and left wingers bitching about any of it.

George
 
L-188
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 2:10 pm

Why does that guy need a license?

It after all is a form of "Badge".

Besides there is one potential error in that card, it gives him the right to bear arms. The right to bear arms is severly oppresed in California and the crime rate is skyrocketing there because of it.
 
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Jetsgo
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:34 pm

In my opinion, I think you missed the whole reason Matt D posted this thread. It wasn't to get at Mexican-Americans or anything of that nature, but more towards to show his thoughts on Davis' recently passed law allowing illegal immigrants the right to a California drivers license. THEY ARE ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS!!! Tell me why an illegal immigrant has the same right to a license as I do. To me that just about throws away all meaning of an American citizen. If they legally come here, then I have no problem whatsoever with them obtaining a license or voting or anything like that.

Very funny picture, already sent it to several people  Big thumbs up

Chris

Matt D, gotta say I have agreed with every one of your political related posts... Matt D for Governor  Big thumbs up
 
VonRichtofen
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 3:40 pm

Illegal immigrants aren't seriously allowed to vote are they?
 
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Aaron747
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 5:57 pm

No they aren't...jesus christ.

Jets, disagreeing with policy is one thing. This image goes *far* beyond rational disagreement and makes a blatantly racist statement. Every pixel of that despicable picture oozes with negativity. For those of us who are Latinos (going to LAW SCHOOL HERE, mind you!), it's a fucking slap in the face. And you know what? The vein in which it's presented is *unacceptable* in the strongest sense of the word.
 
Matt D
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 9:57 pm

Aaron747 & DeltaSFO:

First of all, I'm the first to laugh at that "modified" picture. I'm a white guy and know and laugh at every "cracker" joke there is. Second, if you're going to do THAT, then do it right: Bakersfield is an agricultural and "trucking" town, so your choice of city is a bit suspect. Now had you chosen-say Barstow or Hemet, then that would've been priceless.

Third: Congratulations. You just shot yourself in the foot. While talking out of one side of your ass, you brand me for posting a "blatantly racist" picture, then, out of the other side, you turn around and do the very same thing.

Even I have never managed to destroy my credibility on an issue that quickly before.


BlatantEcho wrote: Never met one white person who works harder than a Mexican immigrant. Those guys bust their asses for $10/hour and you have the gall to make fun of them. This is America friend, you're as free to leave as they are to move here.

That may or may not be true, but again, what does that have to do with the topic at hand? Being a hard worker does not negate the need to come here within the letter of the law. And that's right. This is America, where I was born. I've been here for 30 years. THIRTY YEARS. Most of these clowns have been here a lot less than that. Let THEM go somewhere else, or, as I said, work your way up the socioeconomic ladder the right way, just like the rest of us do.


Sometimes is takes a little more effort than that. You do reazlie that an illegal immigrant is risking death just to cross some land so he MIGHT look forward to a better life don't you? How bout having to learn a new language on the fly? Did you ever risk your life for a CHANCE to work hard?

Oh cry me a river. Can you hear the fiddle playing?

These heart tugging tales of terror and ambition never seem to amaze me. But again, that is THEIR problem, and not mine. If they are fleeing their homeland because of conditions over there, again that's THEIR PROBLEM AND NOT MINE.

The blatant hypocrisy again here is mind boggling. The rest of the world bitches and moans about the USA sticking its nose in everyones affairs, but the minute some destitute schmuck comes over here, it is our duty to "embrace" them. I guess it's ok not to go trodding over the world, but the minute something gets dumped in our lap, we have a moral obligation to support them.


RNOcommctr
Matt D... and who the hell buses your table and washes the dishes when you go to a restaurant? Who trims the landscaping and cuts the grass? Who watches your kids? Who cleans the bathrooms and waxes the floors at restaurants, office buildings, and airports? Who picks the fruit and vegetables you eat? Yes, that's right, Matt... Mexican-Americans! They do the menial jobs (and many have two or three jobs) that you and I and other gringoes won't do.

The first group: Almost always, high school kids who are usually working their first job. The second group: Usually folks here on a Visa, or at least having a Green Card.

The third group: Does not apply; I don't have any kids. But most people I know have FAMILY watching over kids, not some stranger with an unknown or questionable background.

Let's get something straight here. I'm not picking on Mexicans per se. I'm picking on PEOPLE WHO ENTER THE COUNTRY ILLEGALLY AND THEN DEVELOP AN ENTITLEMENT ATTITIUDE. Do you see the difference, or do I have to pick you up by the nose and rub your face in it? You're right. A lot of them do have two or three jobs and do jobs that most Gringos won't.

But again, what does that have to do with the issue of coming here legally, and circumventing our laws just because "it's the compassionate thing to do"?

Mexican immigrants, legal or not, are busting their collective asses to make life better for themselves and their familes.

So lets reward the illegal ones by granting them all of the PRIVILEDGES normally reserved for citizens. And while we're at it, let's PUNISH the citizens by taxing them more and more to support these people "who only want a better life". Lets raise the insurance premiums that citizens pay because you know goddamm well that once these illegals hit the road, they aren't going to be buying it. Not only can't they afford it, but again "they are only trying to make a better life for themselves." The insurance companies, not being stupid, are going to have no choice but to raise premiums because of the addition of 5 million uninsured motorists on the road.

JetsGo:

You hit the nail squarely on the head.








 
Marcus
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 10:01 pm

As a Mexican (and this being a post from Matt D).......I find this very very funny....really I do.

I find it ammusing how some users (I won't say names) still find it neccesary to show the redness of their necks and the ignorance of their points of view.........keep up the good work folks.....we needed a laugh in this forum.
 
KROC
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 10:09 pm

To those that Matt D just knocked the **** out, and you know who you are...this is for you

 
cptkrell
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 10:34 pm

It appears that most folks replying don't understand the meaning of the word ILLEGAL. I don't find MattD's post racist, or even prejudiced for that matter. I know more than a few LEGAL Mexican immigrants in the Detroit area (there is a quite large American-Mexican population here) who are quite disturbed at Gray Davis' stance on the California license issue. Good post, JetsGo...Jack
 
BlatantEcho
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 11:32 pm

Matt D- people are as free to come into this country as you are too leave. If you are unhappy, get the hell out of here.

Legally or not, we don't have a fucking Statue of Liberty for nothing. Unless you're a native american, YOU came here illegally too kid. And your blood KILLED people to live here. At least Mexican immigrants are only risking their own lives, and not making treaties, breaking them, and forcing the native people onto reservations.

Don't use some fall back about this thread is a jab at Davis. It's a racist tyraid pure and simple. Illegal or not, the Mexicans who come to this country are fucking people. They deserve respect and compassion from dumbass like you who have it a lot better. And yet they don't ask that, they just ask to work hard to make their lives better.

Mad at politics? DO SOMETHING! Write letters to papers, get out the vote.
Covering up racism with wit? Post it on the internet.

George
 
DeltaSFO
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Fri Sep 19, 2003 11:46 pm

First of all, I'm the first to laugh at that "modified" picture. I'm a white guy and know and laugh at every "cracker" joke there is. Second, if you're going to do THAT, then do it right: Bakersfield is an agricultural and "trucking" town, so your choice of city is a bit suspect. Now had you chosen-say Barstow or Hemet, then that would've been priceless.

Third: Congratulations. You just shot yourself in the foot. While talking out of one side of your ass, you brand me for posting a "blatantly racist" picture, then, out of the other side, you turn around and do the very same thing.

Even I have never managed to destroy my credibility on an issue that quickly before.


Matt, glad you enjoyed it. I might point out that from my perspective, it seems that folks of the sort pictured in my little piece of work generally are abundant wherever the trucking and agricultural industries are well established. I've been to Bakersfield before and I'd say just about anywhere around there, you can find yourself some white trash dude, and plenty of folks from south of the border too. Although, I should point out, that I was going to use Barstow, but wanted a place that would be a little more recognized as "a city I've heard of that's not in LA or the Bay Area" by non-Californians.  Big grin

I never called you a racist, never even criticized your post. Other individuals have done that. I merely responded by doing exactly what you did. So I don't think I have shot myself anywhere.

I agree completely on the need to stem the flow of illegal immigrants, and I happen to believe that providing drivers licenses to illegal immigrants is not the way to do that. Extending any sense of legitimacy, no matter how trivial it may seem, will only serve to encourage the flow of illegal immigrants. It will be seen as a quiet acknowledgment by the state that there's nothing we can do about illegal immigrants, so we might as well give 'em licenses.

On the other hand, this state has a huge black market for labor that is fed entirely by illegal immigrants from Mexico. A good number of our most powerful business leaders in California don't want to control the flow of illegals any more than the illegals themselves want us to. The agricultural industry, not only in California, but in most of the United States, is almost completely dependent on illegal labor, simply because no American or resident alien is willing (read: desperate enough) to do work as backbreaking as picking strawberries, lettuce, etc. Are we willing to pay five dollars for a head of iceberg lettuce? I'll tell you what, I'd prefer not to, if I could avoid it.

Finally, it's a humanitarian issue. People down there, in the rural parts of Mexico, are suffering. Their economy is shaky in the good times, so you can imagine what it's like right now, with the industrialized world (especially their northern neighbor, us) in the midst of a recession. Most illegal immigrants come up here and don't commit any crime other than being here illegally and everything that entails. They work hard, don't make much, and send most of what they do make back to their families in Michoacan/Sinaloa/Veracruz/etc. Most of them, given the choice, would rather be back home in Mexico, with their families, in the country where they were born and raised. It's simply an economic issue.

My mother immigrated legally to the United States from Mexico many years ago. She is one of the lucky ones. She was not poor or desperate. She was a young college graduate from Mexico City, looking for better career opportunities "up north." She didn't have to leave Mexico, but chose to do so. She has worked hard here, and she is a very successful person, both career-wise and personally. It angers me that there are perhaps hundreds of thousands of people like her in Mexico, educated, skilled professionals, that would love nothing more than to come here and pursue their careers here, but sit, and quietly steam as the more desperate folks from the countryside sneak across the border, giving all Mexicans a bad name up here.

It's a tough issue. I don't know the answer to it. But I think a little understanding would help all sides to stop being so hostile and try to come to a solution that works for everybody.
 
KROC
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:26 am

Matt D- people are as free to come into this country as you are too leave. If you are unhappy, get the hell out of here.

Hey hotshot. People are free to come to this country LEGALLY! Being pissed off because ILLEGAL Immigrants are coming in, and costing me and every other tax payer millions upon millions is our right as provided by this country.

Legally or not, we don't have a fucking Statue of Liberty for nothing. Unless you're a native american, YOU came here illegally too kid. And your blood KILLED people to live here. At least Mexican immigrants are only risking their own lives, and not making treaties, breaking them, and forcing the native people onto reservations.

I hate to break it to you kid, but the "fucking" State Of Liberty represents all the LEGAL Immigrants that flowed into this country. Ellis island and all. "Give me your tired, your poor" was great 150 years ago. Now it is saying no vacancy. And all those tired and poor that came to America came here legally. They learned English, they learned our customs etc. They did not come in illegally and start taking advantage of the welfare system. They did not cost the tax payers all this money. They did not demand education in their native language. They came and they fit in. They worked their asses off to make it in this country. They did not sneak across the border so they could pop out a baby in a U.S. Hospital making that baby a "U.S. Citizen" and entitling it to all kinds of welfare. Oh and chief, you are here illegally as well according to your theory. As for your Indian take.....NOBODY said they did not and have not gotten a raw deal. Fact is, by the time my ancestors had legally emigrated over here, the damge had/was being done. Guess what, I cannot go back in time and change any of that. Maybe we should just blame Columbus for all of our problems.  Insane

Don't use some fall back about this thread is a jab at Davis. It's a racist tyraid pure and simple. Illegal or not, the Mexicans who come to this country are fucking people. They deserve respect and compassion from dumbass like you who have it a lot better. And yet they don't ask that, they just ask to work hard to make their lives better.

A racist tyraid? What are you reading? Originally if was a humerous jab at a serious problem. Matt D listed several legit concerns due to illegals, including insurance rates for those of us that drive according to the law as well. Nobody is saying that Mexicans, illegal or otherwise are not people, BUT the ones that bear the cost of the illegals are PEOPLE too. They are hard working and law abiding. If they cannot come to this country legally, they have NO business being hereThe illegals can be people in their own country as well. They deserve compassion? No, you are suggesting they deserve a free ride. Are you going to happily pay for their free ride?.....didn't think so. Oh, and "dumbasses" (and you better make sure you are not spitting into the wind when you use statements like that slugger) like us have it better because we work for it, and work hard. And because I have it better off, and I bust my ass to be better off, I am not going to FUND illegal's because some clown mistakes "compassion" for a free ride.

Mad at politics? DO SOMETHING! Write letters to papers, get out the vote.
Covering up racism with wit? Post it on the internet.


How do you know what someone does off of this site? And you might want to get a clue about racism as well, because you have no idea what racism is based on your views here.

Finally, it's a humanitarian issue. People down there, in the rural parts of Mexico, are suffering. Their economy is shaky in the good times, so you can imagine what it's like right now, with the industrialized world (especially their northern neighbor, us) in the midst of a recession. Most illegal immigrants come up here and don't commit any crime other than being here illegally and everything that entails. They work hard, don't make much, and send most of what they do make back to their families in Michoacan/Sinaloa/Veracruz/etc. Most of them, given the choice, would rather be back home in Mexico, with their families, in the country where they were born and raised. It's simply an economic issue.

This is a tough issue as DeltaSFO said, and I agree with allot of the above statement. But for all hard working ones who sneak in here trying to better their life in Mexico, there are just as many that sneak in here then wait and get a free ride. I'm not opposed to helping.......but helping those that come to this country legally and according to the law.
 
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Aaron747
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:36 am

Free ride? Since when did welfare sitters and hard-working immigrants become the same people?
 
KROC
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:38 am

Aaron. What part of ILLEGAL Immigrants and those that emmigrate correctly did you not understand?
 
Matt D
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:38 am

They're not. No one ever said they were.

But why do you still refuse to acknowledge that there is a sharp black and white distinction between LEGAL immigrants versus ILLEGAL immigrants?
 
Marcus
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:47 am

Let's not forget that illegal inmigrants contribute more to the economy than what they take out........so my friend you are completely wrong when you say that illegals cost the taxpayer money.

I have posted this before and I will post it again................

"The Myth Of Illegals
Prop 187 advocates seem to deny the paradox of this law: movements like "Save Our State" are torn between wanting to get rid of the illegals (and the deterioration of the American social fabric and standard of living they represent) and wanting to exploit them for all they're worth to enhance their own standard of living. People who criticize today's immigrants contend that, as a whole, the current newcomers are fundamentally different from the 13 million Eastern and Southern Europeans who immigrated to the U.S. in the first half of this century. Thirty-eight percent of today's arrivals are white, compared with 88 percent of those who came before 1960. Critics also argue that our highly developed economy now demands brains, not brawn, which means poorly educated and indigent immigrants have little hope of following their predecessors into the middle class.
Contrary to what many Americans believe, the vast majority of today's immigrants--legal and illegal--are doing well, or are at least striving to pave the way for their children to live better lives. Those immigrant families who arrived in the U.S. before 1980 boast a higher average income than that of native-born Americans. Few immigrants come to America to get on welfare. Immigrant children aren't devouring precious education dollars: only four percent of the $227 billion we spend on education is spent on educating legal immigrant children and just two percent is spent on the estimated 648,000 children who are here illegally. Immigrants are not long-term drains on our economy. Yes, the estimated 3.8 million illegal immigrants cost the country $2 billion a year, chiefly because they work in low-wage jobs and often don't pay income taxes. But as a group, the foreign-born pay $25 to $30 billion a year more in taxes than they consume in government services, and working-age, non-refugee immigrants are much less likely than natives to receive welfare, according to the Urban Institute."

Source: http://www.digitas.harvard.edu/~perspy/old/issues/1995/may/187cons.html

But I guess trying to reason with you will not help in one bit......since you have now stablisehd the fact that you DO support the shooting of illegals because of being here in the US.
 
Tom in NO
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:48 am

1) Props to Matt D. He is spot on!

Tom at MSY

2) "You're in America now, speak Spanish"

Sincerely,
Paul Rodriguez

Yes, if you're in the US legally, have your documentation, etc, etc, it's all good, welcome to the US. It's the illegals that are the problem. And passing out DL's to them is not the answer.
 
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Aaron747
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:56 am

First of all, I've made no comments regarding illegal vs. legal immigration. My responses here have been geared toward the mean-spirited aspects of the offending image.

I wish I didn't have to state the obvious, but everyone in California would like to see illegal immigration curbed to whatever degree possible, including me. It's not good for anyone other than a handful of fat cats heading agricultural conglomerates. I'm just not willing to achieve it via the means Matt has proposed - such as giving Border Patrol and border residents a carte blanche shoot-to-kill policy.

Like Delta said, resolution is not something any of us can claim to have an easy answer to. Given the degree to which corruption is rampant in Mexico and the resultant systemic issues in the country's economic arena, it's unlikely things will improve to a significant enough extent that motivation to leave is reduced.

What's interesting are the numerous directions in which this discussion gets spun. While overpopulation criticisms are unfounded, the tax revenue consumption impacts of illegals are quite well-documented. On the issue of drivers' licenses, the common criticism thus far has been a Democratic game of vote-getting, but I think it wouldn't surprise many to know that substantial influence from the business lobby in this state has been involved too.

As for the oft-used Harvard study Marcus, much of that data I wouldn't dispute save for one thing - the long term tax impact isn't what concerns most residents. It's true that even illegals pay themselves off in the long run through generational attrition. The problem is the short-term impact. The bulk of spending on illegals isn't felt by federal or state budgets - it's local and county funds that suffer most.

[Edited 2003-09-19 17:59:31]
 
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B747-437B
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 12:59 am

why do you still refuse to acknowledge that there is a sharp black and white distinction between LEGAL immigrants versus ILLEGAL immigrants?

There also is a distinction between two different classes of ILLEGAL immigrants as well (and this view is shared by the immigration authorities in their classification and enforcement action).

The first class is those illegal aliens who are considered "Uninspected". These are the folks who enter the United States through various means without being subjected to primary inspection at the port of entry. The vast majority of illegal alien Mexicans fall under this category.

The second class is those of illegal aliens who are consider "Out of Status". These are persons who enter the United States legally (eg. as tourists, students, etc..) and subsequently modify their activities in the country without filing the appropriate paperwork. Often, these folks fall foul of impractical technicalities in the immigration law. eg. An Indian woman whose husband was killed on 9/11/01 was arrested and deported for being "illegal" on 9/17/01. She was legally in the country on her husband's visa when he was alive, so technically once he was dead she had until the end of the same calendar day to leave the country or else be deported.

The irony of course is that enforcement action is always stronger against the latter class of aliens than the former, because while the latter attempt to play somewhat within the system but mess up (either intentionally or inadvertently), they leave a trail that makes it easy to follow up and take action against them. The former group tend to disappear into the underground economy and take too much work to track except in special circumstances.

The US immigration system is so badly broken that it needs a complete overhaul before it can ever become effective. This would involve not only stronger enforcement, but clearer and simpler legislation to define the overall goals of the enforcement action. Right now the United States has an estimated 8,000,000 folks classified as "undocumented aliens" in the country (approx. 3% of the population). That number is impractically high and should serve as a wakeup call to the Federal Government (more so than the states) to get off their ass and do something.
 
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Aaron747
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:01 am

Yes well this just happens to be one issue of many the feds have grown accustomed to pawning off on the states to bear the brunt of (see infrastructure thread).
 
BlatantEcho
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:17 pm

the worst part of this entire thread are the broad strokes you all allow yourselves in being able to categorize and sterotype an entire people.

I know this is the internet, and nothing any of you say matters, but that doesn't make your generalizations any less ignorant or awful.

Hitler blamed the Jews for everything evil, much like Bush is blaming terrorists for everything. The fact was these are all broad generalization fed to people like yourself who lap them up without regard for fact or fallicy.

I guess we can site lack of personally responsibility, the continuing trend to keep up with the Jones driving economic desire ever hire. At least Marcus linked us to an article that wasn't entirelly conjecture. And what does any of this mean?

It means when the shit hits the fan, everyone in this room would run to save themselves, and the people who need assistance would be left behind, because of a legal rammification of where they were and why.

Your ego would cloud the better judgment to help others who are in need. Me is the only important person. I am the only thing to be served.

This is self-gloss at it's worst, and you're too busy blaming other people and pointing out the legality of something to even see it.

George
 
Matt D
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RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 9:53 pm

It means when the shit hits the fan, everyone in this room would run to save themselves, and the people who need assistance would be left behind, because of a legal rammification of where they were and why.


You bet your red, white, and blue ass.

Your ego would cloud the better judgment to help others who are in need. Me is the only important person. I am the only thing to be served.

That's right I'm going to look after myself first. If you're crawling in here through the desert on all fours, emaciated and dehydrated, all I can say is:


sucks to be you.






 
BlatantEcho
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Joined: Wed Sep 27, 2000 10:11 am

RE: The New California Drivers License

Sat Sep 20, 2003 11:54 pm

"for some moments in life, there are no words"


....................
George
 
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IHadAPheo
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Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2001 3:26 pm

RE: The New California Drivers License

Sun Sep 21, 2003 2:47 am

I can not imagine amking the tript from Mexico, Central or South America to try to "sneak" into America. The trip is a long and dangerous one, being stuffed in a hidden comaprtment in a truck with a few strangers or jammed in a trunk of a car for hours not to mention a possible trek across the desert just to get into the US. Not to mention that once you get here you have to live in fear that someone from immigration will find you you'll end up being deported. Working taking any job for any pay, minimum wage, overtime (comp tome if Mr. Bush has his way) are but a dream ah yes living the good life in US.

I can see why the illegals com, even woking under the conditions stated above, they still may make 5-10 times what they did in their homeland. Not to mention having an In-N-Out Burger nearby.

There is no real answer to the question of illegal immigration... if the illegal's where suddenly legal and subject to the workers regulaion would prices go up do to their increased madatory minimum wages and related costs?? Yes they would. If the now legalalized alens were now subject to income tax and social security deduction how would this ffect the government's budget??. I do not have a clue if it would be a net positive or negative.

Yors,
IHadAPheo

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