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Catatonic
Topic Author
Posts: 1096
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 3:58 am

African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 6:51 am

Why are Black people in the US referred to as African American? Its like they are not totally acknowledged as being all American. Doesn't this just serve to create social segregation? I mean if a Black person is born in the US then they are American. My point is that although I think its used as an acknowledgement of their roots, you don't get White people referred to as 'Franco-American' or 'Anglo-American' so why African American? My friend said she would be offended if someone called her Afro-British and its a term that you don't hear that much, which I think is good in a way as being British, French, German or American shouldn't automatically be associated with your average white person but should rather be synonymous with a thought that reflects the united multicultural societies we are.
Equally Cursed and Blessed.
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 6:55 am

IT's all PC Bull$hit!!!


Signed,

The White Right Wing
This space intentionally left blank
 
B744F
Posts: 2927
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 4:52 pm

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:00 am

Many blacks hate the term, but it caught on because the term black was somewhat seen as a derogatory term
 
mdsh00
Posts: 4050
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:04 am

It's PC crap. Frankly I'm tired of this whole "______ American" usage.
 
airbuzz
Posts: 335
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:06 am

A little off topic question, but i'm curious: saying "black man" for specifying a person is consider offensive in US? I mean, is politically correct?

I don't find it offensive at all, it is like saying "the person with black skin" as like "the person with blonde hair". As I find "white guy" not offensive at all.
 
slider
Posts: 7630
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:42 pm

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:07 am

I agree Mdsh....

I don't believe in hyphenating Americans.

If you're an American, you're an American. Doesn't matter what stripe, race, nation of origin, ethnic or sexual persuasion.

E Pluribus Unum.
 
cfalk
Posts: 10221
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:08 am

Quoting Catatonic (Thread starter):
Why are Black people in the US referred to as African American? Its like they are not totally acknowledged as being all American. Doesn't this just serve to create social segregation?

It is black people who wanted it in the first place. Personally, I would prefer them to simply be called Americans. Unless you are a first-generation immigrant from Africa, you are NOT African American. You're an American.

And, by the way, a white immigrant from South Africa or a refugee from Zimbabwe would also be an African American.

Charles
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:09 am

It's 'safe' to say Black, OK.

I personally am not a fan of the term African American but if that's what some prefer, so be it.
No need for any non-Black to get bend out of shape about it.


Catatonic :
You might want to talk about this at a website that has a higher concentration of Blacks/African Americans.
I am not sure if Airliners.net is the place to get the answer you are looking for.  Smile
Bring back the Concorde
 
Newark777
Posts: 8283
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:23 am

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:09 am

I'm white. That guy down the hall from me is black. Think that is offensive? If you do, I honestly don't give a shit. People think way too many things are offensive these days, and their feelings really don't effect me at all.

Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
Catatonic
Topic Author
Posts: 1096
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:13 am

Quoting Superfly (Reply 7):
You might want to talk about this at a website that has a higher concentration of Blacks/African Americans.
I am not sure if Airliners.net is the place to get the answer you are looking for.

I am not looking for answers from any group specifically, just wanted to know what peoples opinons were.
Equally Cursed and Blessed.
 
mdsh00
Posts: 4050
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:16 am

Quoting Airbuzz (Reply 4):
I don't find it offensive at all, it is like saying "the person with black skin" as like "the person with blonde hair". As I find "white guy" not offensive at all.

I think in general, many people in the US (including all the monorites) aren't offended. It's usually in situations where someone is addressing the public or people they don't know.
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:17 am

Quoting Catatonic (Reply 9):
I am not looking for answers from any group specifically, just wanted to know what peoples opinons were.

Trust me the usual right-wing suspects with scream  hissyfit and moan about it.
Bring back the Concorde
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18255
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:22 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 1):
IT's all PC Bull$hit!!!

You all KNOW that when someone says "African American" they mean "black" and not my friend Sven who grew up in South Africa and went to college in the US but happens to be white. Nevermind the fact that "African Americans" are more "American" than the whites and other groups in the US or the fact that very few "African Americans" know their origins in Africa for obvious reasons. For God's sake, call it what it is. If you want to talk about people's skin color, and that's the case 99.999% of the time, just say white or black. Forget this "African American" or "Caucasian" bullshit.
I don't take responsibility at all
 
ZRH
Posts: 4371
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 1999 11:32 pm

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:24 am

Quoting Catatonic (Thread starter):
Why are Black people in the US referred to as African American? Its like they are not totally acknowledged as being all American. Doesn't this just serve to create social segregation? I mean if a Black person is born in the US then they are American. My point is that although I think its used as an acknowledgement of their roots, you don't get White people referred to as 'Franco-American' or 'Anglo-American' so why African American? My friend said she would be offended if someone called her Afro-British and its a term that you don't hear that much, which I think is good in a way as being British, French, German or American shouldn't automatically be associated with your average white person but should rather be synonymous with a thought that reflects the united multicultural societies we are.

I absolutely agree. I never understood this name. Here with have Swiss citizens. Most are white a few are black, but for sure no African-Swiss. I don't see it to be racist to call a man white or black, it is only fact. Some of the black Swiss are born here, they are Swiss-Swiss with a black color.
 
B744F
Posts: 2927
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:29 am

Let's just say many people are ashamed of our past and black people in this country have always been treated "a little" differently compared to others. Lets say we are more sensitive to offending a group of people who just recently were allowed to think of themselves as human beings with equal rights.

This whole "blah blah PC" nonsense totally ignores the harsh realities of our past

[Edited 2005-09-15 00:29:20]
 
11Bravo
Posts: 1683
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:34 am

A friend of mine at work will look at you like you're a complete moron if you call him an African-American. A while back we were talking about this issue and he said:

"What if we were in Australia? Would you call me an African-Australian? How about Japan, an African-Japanese or African-Asian? It's just stupid. Look, it's real simple, I'm Black, you're White, see how that works?"
WhaleJets Rule!
 
QANTASforever
Posts: 5791
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 7:37 am

I love this quote that British comedian Lenny Henry made when he referred to himself as an "English African American".

I just want to call people (if I must) by any term that is the least derogatory.
I don't want to offend people, I want to communicate. As African American seems to be the more accepted term, I'm inclined to use that.

QFF
Fighting for the glory of the Australian Republic.
 
ME AVN FAN
Posts: 12970
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 8:39 pm

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 6):
an African American.

also people from Morocco, Algeria, Tunisia, Libya, Egypt are "African" but Whites
- but the term of course refers to "Black Africa" .
 
767Lover
Posts: 3254
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 6:32 am

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 9:24 pm

It's a term widely used by liberals who fear they are offending people by saying "black." However, as many have said, I agree that it is more offensive, because after all, this ethnic group are simply "Americans" rather than some derivation of Americans.

My ultra-liberal friends say African American. My politically centric and conservative friends say "Black." My black friends say "Black."

The funny (sad) thing is that the people who say AA use the term for any black person regardless of whether they in fact may be a British citizen or a citizen of a Caribbean nation or whatever.
 
bhmbaglock
Posts: 2489
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 9:28 pm

Quoting B744F (Reply 14):
This whole "blah blah PC" nonsense totally ignores the harsh realities of our past

No, it simply states a truth.
Where are all of my respected members going?
 
Banco
Posts: 14343
Joined: Mon Oct 29, 2001 11:56 pm

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 11:15 pm

Quoting QANTASFOREVER (Reply 16):
I love this quote that British comedian Lenny Henry made when he referred to himself as an "English African American".

Wasn't he talking about when a certain American journalist referred to him in that way? I remember hearing him talk about it and saying that whilst he included it in his act for a while he was actually somewhat pissed off about it.
She's as nervous as a very small nun at a penguin shoot.
 
desertjets
Posts: 7693
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2000 3:12 pm

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 11:43 pm

In the US we do have an obsession with labels... the same problem that you have with the term African-American you also have with Hispanic. And even moreso when these terms intersect. How then do you "classify" a person who is of African descent but it from the Domincan Republic and whose native tounge is Spanish?

What about those who are hispanic b/c they are from a Latin American country, but are clearly white... no American Indian or African ancestory, strictly European. In dealing with minority students a lot of the Caribean students (Jamaicans, Trinidadians, etc...) do not like the term African-American, b/c it completely ignores their own cultural and family background. And don't get me started on multi-racial people... especially when they can only check one box.

As another example, my boss was born in Guyana. But he is of Indian descent. Now what do you classify him as?



It would be nice to live in a society where these labels did not matter. But unfortunately the do.
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
 
jtamu97
Posts: 630
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2001 1:33 am

RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 11:50 pm

I do not know who started the term, but I was under the impression it was also a way to still link them with there past in the slave trade so they could use the oppression word. Being black in America does not sound as good as African American. There are many activists who love this word as they believe it gives them that direct link to back to their Motherland of Africa. I agree that all of my friends who are black despise this term. I guess I should call me self and Irish-German-Cajun-American Big grin!
Propeller, we don't need no stinkin propeller
 
Falcon84
Posts: 13775
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RE: African Americans

Thu Sep 15, 2005 11:51 pm

I once posed a question to a women I knew at work, who was, shall we say, militant on the fact that she felt blacks should be called "African-Americans".

I asked her the following: say a white man, living in Zimbabwe, emmigrates legally to the United States, and, after awhile, gains American citizenship. Does he, as a white man, who emmigrated from Africa, have more of a right to call himself an "African-American" than she does?

She got all pissed off, and clamied the term was solely for blacks, and I asked her "did YOU ever live in Africa", and she said no, but my ancestors did, and I countered that, under my premise, this guys IS FROM AFRICA!

She didn't budge. I would have liked to call her the racist that she was, but I wanted to keep my job.  Smile
Work Right, Fly Hard
 
ME AVN FAN
Posts: 12970
Joined: Fri May 31, 2002 12:05 am

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 12:14 am

Quoting DesertJets (Reply 21):
those who are hispanic

A "Hispanic" is somebody of Spanish language and culture, but at home "in the Americas". Most "Hispanics" therefore are Whites.
 
cornish
Posts: 7651
Joined: Fri Feb 18, 2005 8:05 pm

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 12:18 am

But I also regularly hear the term Italian-American and Irish-American too.

But Cubans always seem to be Cubans or Hispanics not Cuban-Americans and Mexicans just seem to get called illegals  Wink
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
Catatonic
Topic Author
Posts: 1096
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2004 3:58 am

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 12:29 am

Quoting Cornish (Reply 25):
But I also regularly hear the term Italian-American and Irish-American too.

What about Cornish-American? Or perhaps this is just shortened to Cornicans?
Equally Cursed and Blessed.
 
cptkrell
Posts: 3186
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2001 10:50 pm

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 12:44 am

"But I also regularly hear the term Italian-American and Irish-American too."

You bet, and sometimes more derogitory terms also. Interestingly, USAers have always been fond of identifying a person's background with "terms of ethnicicity"". I suppose it's somewhat meaningful if one is describing a person that another cannot "see" or "hear". My Dad told me long ago not to get offended if I heard someone refer to him (or me) as a "tight Scotsman", meaning penny-pinching in a spendthrift sense (or just downright "cheap").

Terms for black folks in the USA have been in a constant state of change since I can remember. I have been through "Negro" (and the bastardized offensive term), "Colored", "People of Color", a few more I'm sure, and now the seemingly fashionable "Black" and "African American". Not long ago, one of the local college kids became offended in the saloon when someone used the term "Colored", in a non-offensive way, I might add. I was tempted to remind this young man that I was personally aware that the efforts of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People was helping put him through college, but I let it pass and didn't get envolved with the conversation. I'm too old to get riled by prejudices and ignorance. Regards...Jack
all best; jack
 
FDXmech
Posts: 3219
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2000 9:48 pm

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 1:05 am

Quoting Cornish (Reply 25):
But I also regularly hear the term Italian-American and Irish-American too.

You're exactly right. African-American isn't IMO a pc thing at all. It's just the evolution of how one formally refers to a black person. From "colored" to "negro" to "black", etc.

I've a couple good friends (co-workers) where I work who are black. If we're talking and I ask, "Do you know such and such guy"? He'll say, "I don't know, whats he look like?" I reply "Well, he's tall, wears glasses, always works Flt2 and has a slight lisp". My friend says, "I'm not sure.....is he a black guy?" I say, "Yeah". He says "Oh yeah, I know him. Why didn't you tell me he was black?" I say, "Forgot to mention it". Smile

But back to Cornish's observation. You're very correct. As a matter of fact if you meet any person in the states and ask, "What are you?" The answer will 99.99% of the time be, I'm Irish, Italian, Japanese, Chilean, 1/2 Swiss and 1/2 French. Only one time since I heard that question was the response, "American". I heard that and was nearly floored. It actually never occurred to me to make that response.

I've never heard a black person (not born in Africa) say, Chadian, Namibian, etc. Just the generic African-American. Though black people as far as I know aren't ordinarily asked; What are you? Unless from the Carribean.
You're only as good as your last departure.
 
prosa
Posts: 5389
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RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 1:21 am

"African-American" inspired an attempt some years back to promote "European-American" as a term for whites. I'm not sure who was backing the idea, but in any event it didn't get far. There is no real synonym for "white" in the United States, "Caucasian" being regarded as somewhat obsolete and silly (though not offensive) unless used solely in an anthropological context.
"Let me think about it" = the coward's way of saying "no"
 
omoo
Posts: 650
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 12:35 am

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 2:20 am

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 6):
It is black people who wanted it in the first place. Personally, I would prefer them to simply be called Americans. Unless you are a first-generation immigrant from Africa, you are NOT African American. You're an American. And, by the way, a white immigrant from South Africa or a refugee from Zimbabwe would also be an African American.

Exaclty! This scenario was actually an issue in one university in the US regarding admission policies to its law school. Apparently there was a "white" kid who was born and raised in Tanzania. Immigrated to the USA with his parents and applied to the law school. On the demographic forms he filled "African American" but when the school found out he doesnt even look black they denied him and he sued. Sociologists argued and argued about who and what constitues an "African American" and who is and who is not. In the end the kid won.
Fly Air Popobawa
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
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RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 2:22 am

Quoting B744F (Reply 2):
but it caught on because the term black was somewhat seen as a derogatory term

 checkmark 
Same thing starting to happen here, with, Afro-Brasilians

thing is, Black people have been suffering for ages and ages, and maybe it´s a way to determinate who they are.
Blacks are starting to rise in societies, specially in places like USA, Brasil, where there´s considerable number of blacks. Brasil has almost 50% of it´s population Black, besides from black countries in Africa and Central America, where can we find such thing?USA?Canada?England?
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AsstChiefMark
Posts: 10465
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RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 5:02 am

If I'm a Jew that emmigrates to Israel, am I an American-Israeli?

American-Italian? American-Japanese? American-Canadian? And so on.

It's all silly to me.

BTW...What the hell makes one Hispanic a Hispanic and another a Latino?

Mark
Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Red tail...Damned MSP...Red tail...Red tail
 
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OzarkD9S
Posts: 5734
Joined: Tue Oct 23, 2001 2:31 am

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 6:30 am

As long as I'm an Employed-American I don't care what you call me.  Wink

Wouldn't it be great if we just had a skin-tone chart (for those who worry about such things) and just say I'm a "2" or a "9" or whatever?

But then we have the problem should "1" be lightest or darkest...the dilemma continues.
Next up: STL DEN PSP DEN STL
 
767Lover
Posts: 3254
Joined: Fri Sep 26, 2003 6:32 am

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 9:46 am

Quoting OzarkD9S (Reply 33):
Wouldn't it be great if we just had a skin-tone chart (for those who worry about such things) and just say I'm a "2" or a "9" or whatever?

That is hysterically funny! Thanks!
Except for those of us on the paler side of the scale, it could get embarrassing.
 
flyboy36y
Posts: 2897
Joined: Sun Mar 19, 2000 1:45 pm

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 2:36 pm

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Reply 32):
If I'm a Jew that emmigrates to Israel, am I an American-Israeli?

You dont have to be a jew.

I call people black. i dont refer to anyone as an african american because to do so is arrogant. whow the hell do i know if the dude is african or even americam. at my law school there is a cool black dude. 1st generation in America. North America, that is. He's canadian....

Even if they are really from africa, then id rather hear the country you are from. a real african will rather identify with their country than the continent....
 
ZRH
Posts: 4371
Joined: Tue Nov 16, 1999 11:32 pm

RE: African Americans

Fri Sep 16, 2005 8:59 pm

Quoting FDXMECH (Reply 28):
"negro" to "black",

The funny thing is that "negro" and "black" means exactly the same: negro (or similar) is black in Latin and many latin languages (Italian, Spanish etc). It is not political correct to call a black man "negro" but there are several African countries which call themselves like this: Nigeria, Niger. Oh, is this complicated  Wink
 
B744F
Posts: 2927
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2006 4:52 pm

RE: African Americans

Sat Sep 17, 2005 2:41 pm

Quoting Flyboy36y (Reply 35):
because to do so is arrogant.

To not care about if you might offend someone by using a term which in some cases has been used as derogatory is arrogant.
 
cfalk
Posts: 10221
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2000 6:38 pm

RE: African Americans

Sat Sep 17, 2005 3:14 pm

Quoting B744F (Reply 37):
To not care about if you might offend someone by using a term which in some cases has been used as derogatory is arrogant.

But it is far better than calling them African American, which is logically incorrect, can often be factually incorrect, and is a few too many sylables than I am willing to devote to the issue.
The only thing you should feel when shooting a terrorist: Recoil.
 
ME AVN FAN
Posts: 12970
Joined: Fri May 31, 2002 12:05 am

RE: African Americans

Sun Sep 18, 2005 12:20 am

Quoting ZRH (Reply 36):
and "black"

Further complicated by things like the point that many NON-Blacks (Asia/Australia) are "blacker" than most "Blacks" and that many "Blacks" are almost "white" .
 
omoo
Posts: 650
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 12:35 am

RE: African Americans

Sun Sep 18, 2005 1:08 am

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 39):
Further complicated by things like the point that many NON-Blacks (Asia/Australia) are "blacker" than most "Blacks" and that many "Blacks" are almost "white" .

Where are these "Whiter Blacks" from ? Africa ? or America ?
Fly Air Popobawa
 
ME AVN FAN
Posts: 12970
Joined: Fri May 31, 2002 12:05 am

RE: African Americans

Sun Sep 18, 2005 1:25 am

Quoting Omoo (Reply 40):
Where are these "Whiter Blacks" from ? Africa ? or America ?

the Americas

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