Quoting MDorBust (Reply 49): This is a modified King Air RC-12

ohhh reallllly ! that looks most dangerous indeed ! but do you really want to say, with all your immense military wisdom, that with such a plane, you need to be right on top of a particular area to get information ? you must be joking. -
-

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 41): In other words, I was agreeing with Baroque.

Bullshit, sneering mockery of UN and French efforts as per usual.

Your country should put up or you should shut up.

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 41): I'm sure you know what I meant, but ignored it for the sake of the flag next to my username.

It's always just about you isn't it ................................

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 50): ohhh reallllly

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 50): but do you really want to say, with all your immense military wisdom, that with such a plane, you need to be right on top of a particular area to get information ?

I don't remember the article saying anything about how "right on top" the rc-12's were, just that they were circling overhead.

I wasn't an aerial survelience specialist, but just based off of common sense... Line of sight would be needed for any sort of photographic or video imaging. Some level of overhead travel would be necessary to overcome the slant angle blocking of buildings. Also, locating and intercepting satcom signals would require the craft to be between the base station and the satelite. Again, some level of overhead travel..

I'm sure the signals guys could answer better... I'm also sure they won't.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 52): Line of sight would be needed for any sort of photographic or video imaging.

Ever heard about an organisation named NASA ? Who can make photos of you leaving a shop in Beirut downtown. And ever heard about the point that the Israelis have access to such things. I am sure that their US friends will provide them with all the info required. And WHATEVER, the Israelis simply have NO RIGHT, ABSOLUTELY NONE, to overfly Lebanon. That NEEDS to be STOPPED. And the UN forces canNOT accept the overlying of their establishments by Israeli planes of whatever kind.
-

Only five months ago during this summer's Israeli / Lebanon conflict, Israel, in an "apparently deliberate targeting", quoting Kofi Annan, of a UN observation post killed four UN peacekeepers. Can it really be such a surprise to anyone that the French UN troops adopt a defensive stance when Israeli aircraft buzz their position in contravention of the UN cease fire resolution?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/5216230.stm

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 53): Ever heard about an organisation named NASA ? Who can make photos of you leaving a shop in Beirut downtown. And ever heard about the point that the Israelis have access to such things.

Ever hear of the fact that even the US, the proper owners of NASA, still fly surveillance aircraft?

In fact, we also fly the RC-12.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 53): And WHATEVER, the Israelis simply have NO RIGHT, ABSOLUTELY NONE, to overfly Lebanon. That NEEDS to be STOPPED

There's a lot of things that need to be stopped in the region.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 55): And WHATEVER, the Israelis simply have NO RIGHT, ABSOLUTELY NONE, to overfly Lebanon. That NEEDS to be STOPPED There's a lot of things that need to be stopped in the region.

May be, but this is ONE of them, and an urgent and important one.

Quoting Pacificjourney (Reply 51): Bullshit, sneering mockery of UN and French efforts as per usual. Your country should put up or you should shut up.

Prove it. Dead serious. Now it's your turn to put up or shut up because I was not making any sneering mockery of the French or the UN.

I will then wait for your apology.

Quoting Pacificjourney (Reply 51): It's always just about you isn't it ................................

Jealous?

  B4e-Forever New Frontiers  

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 53): . And WHATEVER, the Israelis simply have NO RIGHT, ABSOLUTELY NONE, to overfly Lebanon.

I disagree ,
If Hezbollah [which is funded by countries like Iran & Syria] are active in the region , then they have every right to overfly Lebanon , especially since there is terrorist activities & suicide bombers in such abundance just miles from Israel . What you want is cover for Terrorists !

Trust but verify !

Quoting OU812 (Reply 58): there is terrorist activities & suicide bombers in such abundance

rubbish! there is not such things "in abundance" in Lebanon. Neither in Syria. You mix it up with Iraq. And all such wild allegations cannot justify continued border violations.

Quoting OU812 (Reply 58): What you want is cover for Terrorists !

I do NOT want "cover for terrorists" but to have the Israelis respecting the sovereignty of Lebanon. And them to stop their bullying activities.
-

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 59): rubbish! there is not such things "in abundance" in Lebanon. Neither in Syria. You mix it up with Iraq. And all such wild allegations cannot justify continued border violations.

Oh really ?
I wonder how I got that idea ???

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/europe...irq.saddam.palestinians/index.html

RAFAH, Southern Gaza (CNN) -- Gaza has always been a place where former Iraqi president Saddam Hussein found a friendly crowd.

Saddam was a great supporter of the Palestinian cause and of all Arab people."

Even if Saddam was -- as Ahmed added -- a butcher.

Saddam funneled his funds through the front, which gave $25,000 to the families of suicide bombers

In January this year, Palestinians marched in support of Saddam Hussein.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 59): I do NOT want "cover for terrorists" but to have the Israelis respecting the sovereignty of Lebanon. And them to stop their bullying activities. -

As you can see , leaders such as Arafat & Saddam act only for their own self interests . They had no intentions of helping the Palestinian people , just kill Israel & spreading terrorism .


http://www.papillonsartpalace.com/stoAryof.htm

Story of Arafat's hidden billions

There has been much speculation about how much money went to support the lavish living of his wife, Suha, in Paris, with reports from her enemies in the Palestinian Authority of subsidies of some 100,000 dollars month.

But the Times said, sums were relatively small compared with Arafat's total holdings. Last year, an audit of Palestinian Authority finances by the International Monetary Fund disclosed that Arafat had diverted 900 million dollars in public funds to a bank account he controlled from 1995 to 2002.

http://www.sierratimes.com/04/11/14/...Arafat's_Secret_Bank_Accounts.htm

EU Ponders Arafat's Secret Bank Accounts

It is still unclear to what degree international aid was abused. Already there are concerns over $900 million that disappeared from Palestinian public accounts, trickling out through a murky system of bank accounts and bogus firms. And the money trail leads back to the European Union -- the Palestinian Territories' largest donor -- which finances schools, hospitals and agricultural projects in the region. ''Between 2002 and 2003, the EU paid €10 million monthly to the Palestinian authority without any controls,'' said Armin Laschet, a Christian Democratic Union member of the European Parliament and co-chair of the oversight committee responsible for Palestinian aid. ''This practice has now been stopped.''

''Between 2002 and 2003, the EU paid €10 million monthly to the Palestinian authority without any controls,'' said Armin Laschet, a Christian Democratic Union member of the European Parliament and co-chair of the oversight committee responsible for Palestinian aid. ''This practice has now been stopped.''

Quoting OU812 (Reply 60): that idea

Gaza is NOT in Lebanon, NOT in Syria, NOT in Jordan
-

Quoting OU812 (Reply 61): As you can see

there is nothing to be seen. You mention things which had nothing to do with Yassir Arafat
-

Quoting OU812 (Reply 61): Arafat's hidden billions

simply rubbish. Yassir Arafat, or rather Abdel-Rauf el Qudwa al-Husseini, was a very rich business tycoon when he founded el-Fatah, and he financed the whole thing out of his private fortune. He over the years invested billions INTO el-Fatah and so of course also at times took some money. He in reality was the OWNER of el-Fatah. He or possibly his el-Qudwa Enterprises was part-owner of the Jordan based "Arab Bank Ltd", a very good bank, he until 1964 was the owner of the "Palestine Construction Co" in Kuwait, he together with his brother inherited sizeable interests in shipping. So, to construct that he profited from el-Fatah -- PLO --- PA is ways off reality. You and others speak about financial help from other Arab countries usually declared at summit meetings, in disregard of the fact that most of that help never really became reality. Saddam and his payments to families of self-sacrifice attackers ? Strange is that most of those families received a single Dinar. Don't ask me whether the money ever left Iraq (I doubt it) or whether Hamas GOT the money and kept it.
-

Quoting OU812 (Reply 61): 'Between 2002 and 2003, the EU paid �10 million monthly t

that makes 120 millions Euro per year. Sounds tremendous, BUT please check up the budget of the state you live in ! and check what 120 millions in reality are. And that the PA apparatus down to the lowest level WAS corrupt is known. This corruption is a major reason why so many Palestinians in the last parliamentary elections voted for Hamas. What was the real problem ?
A) el-Fatah in a way was OWNED by Yassir Arafat
B) el-Fatah was the largest organisation under the PLO umbrella and so
- - controlled the PLO
C) the PLO controlled the P.A.
D) the PLO had a majority in the Palestinian parliament
E) as a result of point D), the PLO controlled the PLO which controlled the PA
----- all in all a recipe for corruption and disaster. I hope that the PLO alliance before the next parliamentary elections will break up into its very different parties, so that not only Hamas will lose its majority but that no party will have a majority and a real coalition has to be agreed upon.
-

ME AVN FAN ,
So you think Saddam giving $25,000 to Palestinian families of suicide bombers helped matters in this region ?

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 59): And them to stop their bullying activities.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/meast/11/19/mideast/index.html

Israel, Gaza militants trade fire across border
POSTED: 2:25 p.m. EST, November 19, 2006

Four Israelis were wounded -- one critically -- when Palestinian militants fired four Qassam rockets into the Israeli town of Sderot on Sunday morning, Israeli ambulance services said.

The critically wounded Israeli is a 17-year old male. Sderot is located about 3 miles (5 km) from Gaza.

Quoting OU812 (Reply 63): So you think Saddam giving $25,000 to Palestinian families of suicide bombers helped matters in this region ?

no, Saddam wanted to do whatever to de-stabilize matters in Palestine

Quoting OU812 (Reply 64): Gaza militants

you now talk about GAZA, which is a different topic

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 65): no, Saddam wanted to do whatever to de-stabilize matters in Palestine

Arafat didn't seem to mind !   

Quoting OU812 (Reply 67): no, Saddam wanted to do whatever to de-stabilize matters in Palestine -- Arafat didn't seem to mind ! eyebrow

-
in the phase you referred to, Saddam's support went to Hamas, the competition of el-Fatah, and Arafat DID mind, and was rather fuming and felt betrayed, BECAUSE he a decade before in 1990/91 had given his political backing to Saddam

In other news, the French dismantled the missile sites today after they heard an airplane approaching and feared attack. The airplane turned out to be a C-172 on a leisure flight, which saw the white flags being raised and promptly notified Israeli and Lebanese officials. Paris is scrambling to get the soldiers released from captivity, but appearantly they locked themselves in an underground bunker and have stated they will only emerge when Lance Armstrong's Tour de France titles are revoked.

(Joking, people. I love France)

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 1): Sounds pretty familiar. The French sold Roland III anti-aircraft missiles to Saddam even while sanctions were in place prior to the 2003 Iraq war.

You should read the thread title before you do this. It was about the French army, not French weapons sold to another army.

Quoting Cfalk (Reply 1): The US downplayed the whole issue due to desires of improving strained US-French relations, but it's one more lesson as to who are your real friends in the world.

Actually not. They didn't continue in this way, because it appeared to be a big lie, or at the minimum a confusion (convenient at this time).
But we all know, that the US never lie about weapons in Iraq, do we Cfalk ?

Quoting KSYR (Reply 69): (Joking, people. I love France)

The first couple may be mildly funny but in the end it gets quite boring.

US servicement I've met usually have nothing but compliments to their French colleagues when they've been in the field together.

As usual, I storm into a thread in a hurry, and leave in a hurry. 


Two quick points:

1- Don't waste too much time and attention on the French call, never ever would a UN force shoot at these planes. Still, it's very courageous of the French to do this, because the overflights are uncalled for, and Israel needs to be wiser than this. It's a good method to oppose the Israeli overflights.

2- And point 2:

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 12): Yes, the extreme humiliation of being circled by a King Air.

MDorBust you're such a moron, Israel overflies Lebanon with F-15's, usually a pair. Goddamit, haven't you spent enough time on the issue to know even that?

Kay

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 70): But we all know, that the US never lie about weapons in Iraq, do we Cfalk ?

If Bush lied regarding WMD , then France ,Britain & many other nations did as well . It was believed that Saddam did have WMD . There is more to this story than you want to believe !

Giving the benefit of the doubt to Saddam , hah ?

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=1167592004

Saddam and the French Connection
FRASER NELSON, FRASER NELSON AND JAMES KIRKUP

SADDAM HUSSEIN believed he could avoid the Iraq war with a bribery strategy targeting Jacques Chirac, the President of France, according to devastating documents released last night.

Memos from Iraqi intelligence officials, recovered by American and British inspectors, show the dictator was told as early as May 2002 that France - having been granted oil contracts - would veto any American plans for war.

Saddam, it says, even fooled his own military chiefs into believing that he had WMD. This was designed to deter uprising from rebel Iraqis, on whom he deployed mustard gas in 1988, and aggressors in the Middle East.

Quoting JJJ (Reply 71): The first couple may be mildly funny but in the end it gets quite boring.

That is so much more polite, JJJ, than the comments deserve. With all due respect JJJ, Kay's comment might be closer to the mark.

It is no longer possible to have a sensible discussion on this type of thread, which is a pity because folk such as you and Kay and MAF have many interesting things to say.

Quoting Kay (Reply 72): MDorBust you're such a moron, Israel overflies Lebanon with F-15's, usually a pair. Goddamit, haven't you spent enough time on the issue to know even that? Kay

Quote: "At the same time, two Israeli reconnaissance RC12 aircraft were circling above the headquarters of the French battalion located in Jabal Marun," east of the southern port city of Tyre, he said.

Is an RC-12 a new version of the F-15?

There's a picture of one in Reply #49 if you care to go look for yourself.

Also, look at the last sentence of Reply #29 if you want a clue on what Israel would do to REALLY threaten the UN forces in the area. I get the feeling you guys have watched Iron Eagle way too many times. Playing in the mud isn't a threatening profile from jets unless there is a very active air defense network, which Lebanon does not have. I would be worried when Israeli jets start flying medium altitude tracks. You know, something within the weapons delivery envelope.

Don't feel too bad though. Judging by your opening sentence you didn't bother to spend any quality time on the matter.

BTW: It's "God damn it."

http://au.gamespot.com/users/godamit/?user=godamit
or it might be the Scots way of spelling
http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=goddammit

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 70): But we all know, that the US never lie about weapons in Iraq, do we Cfalk ?

Also Sebolino,
I can understand anyone being against this war . However , this wasn't something Bush just cooked up after 911. There much talk regarding Saddam's WMDs' back in 1998 . Saddam remained defiant all the way up to the war as well .

http://www.glennbeck.com/news/01302004.shtml

What Did The Democrats Say About Iraq's WMD


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JANUARY 30, 2004 | Printable Version
"Without question, we need to disarm Saddam Hussein. He is a brutal, murderous dictator, leading an oppressive regime ... He presents a particularly grievous threat because he is so consistently prone to miscalculation ... And now he is miscalculating America's response to his continued deceit and his consistent grasp for weapons of mass destruction ... So the threat of Saddam Hussein with weapons of mass destruction is real..."
- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Jan. 23. 2003 | Source

"I will be voting to give the President of the United States the authority to use force -- if necessary -- to disarm Saddam Hussein because I believe that a deadly arsenal of weapons of mass destruction in his hands is a real and grave threat to our security."
- Sen. John F. Kerry (D, MA), Oct. 9, 2002 | Source

"One way or the other, we are determined to deny Iraq the capacity to develop weapons of mass destruction and the missiles to deliver them. That is our bottom line."
- President Clinton, Feb. 4, 1998 | Source

"If Saddam rejects peace and we have to use force, our purpose is clear. We want to seriously diminish the threat posed by Iraq's weapons of mass destruction program."
- President Bill Clinton, Feb. 17, 1998 | Source

"We must stop Saddam from ever again jeopardizing the stability and security of his neighbors with weapons of mass destruction."
- Madeline Albright, Feb 1, 1998 | Source

"He will use those weapons of mass destruction again, as he has ten times since 1983."
- Sandy Berger, Clinton National Security Adviser, Feb, 18, 1998 | Source

"[W]e urge you, after consulting with Congress, and consistent with the U.S. Constitution and laws, to take necessary actions (including, if appropriate, air and missile strikes on suspect Iraqi sites) to respond effectively to the threat posed by Iraq's refusal to end its weapons of mass destruction programs."
Letter to President Clinton.
- (D) Senators Carl Levin, Tom Daschle, John Kerry, others, Oct. 9, 1998 | Source

"Saddam Hussein has been engaged in the development of weapons of mass destruction technology which is a threat to countries in the region and he has made a mockery of the weapons inspection process."
- Rep. Nancy Pelosi (D, CA), Dec. 16, 1998 | Source

"Hussein has ... chosen to spend his money on building weapons of mass destruction and palaces for his cronies."
- Madeline Albright, Clinton Secretary of State, Nov. 10, 1999 | Source

"We begin with the common belief that Saddam Hussein is a tyrant and a threat to the peace and stability of the region. He has ignored the mandate of the United Nations and is building weapons of mass destruction and th! e means of delivering them."
- Sen. Carl Levin (D, MI), Sept. 19, 2002 | Source

"We know that he has stored secret supplies of biological and chemical weapons throughout his country."
- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002 | Source

"Iraq's search for weapons of mass destruction has proven impossible to deter and we should assume that it will continue for as long as Saddam is in power."
- Al Gore, Sept. 23, 2002 | Source

"We have known for many years that Saddam Hussein is seeking and developing weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Ted Kennedy (D, MA), Sept. 27, 2002 | Source

"The last UN weapons inspectors left Iraq in October of 1998. We are confident that Saddam Hussein retains some stockpiles of chemical and biological weapons, and that he has since embarked on a crash course to build up his chemical and biological warfare capabilities. Intelligence reports indicate that he is seeking nuclear weapons..."
- Sen. Robert Byrd (D, WV), Oct. 3, 2002 | Source

"There is unmistakable evidence that Saddam Hussein is working aggressively to develop nuclear weapons and will likely have nuclear weapons within the next five years ... We also should remember we have always underestimated the progress Saddam has made in development of weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Jay Rockefeller (D, WV), Oct 10, 2002 | Source

"In the four years since the inspectors left, intelligence reports show that Saddam Hussein has worked to rebuild his chemical and biological weapons stock, his missile delivery capability, and his nuclear program. He has also given aid, comfort, and sanctuary to terrorists, including al Qaeda members ... It is clear, however, that if left unchecked, Saddam Hussein will continue to increase his capacity to wage biological and chemical warfare, and will keep trying to develop nuclear weapons."
- Sen. Hillary Clinton (D, NY), Oct 10, 2002 | Source

"We are in possession of what I think to be compelling evidence that Saddam Hussein has, and has had for a number of years, a developing capacity for the production and storage of weapons of mass destruction."
- Sen. Bob Graham (D, FL), Dec. 8, 2002 | Source


[edit-typo]

[Edited 2006-11-20 14:18:48]

Quoting Baroque (Reply 76): http://au.gamespot.com/users/godamit/?user=godamit or it might be the Scots way of spelling http://www.urbandictionary.com/defin...ammit

Gamespot and Urban Dictionary...

  

Need I even comment?

Quoting JJJ (Reply 71): US servicement I've met usually have nothing but compliments to their French colleagues when they've been in the field together.

And vice-versa. US special ops guys and Seals share training facilities with their French counterparts in former French colonies. There are numerous other examples.
US and French Navies, for example, have stronger ties than anybody could imagine.

Quoting OU812 (Reply 73): http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/index.cfm?id=1167592004

... that source consistently shows a great deal of bias against France. Am not sure it could give credence to arguments involving France. This from somebody who supported the decision to go to war against Irak.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 75): jets start flying medium altitude

the Israelis DO overfly even cities like Beirut and Sa'ida with M-15, and NOT with King Air !
-

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 80): the Israelis DO overfly even cities like Beirut and Sa'ida with M-15,

Isn't the M-15 in England?

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 81): M-15 in England?

Sorry, I mean F-15 (mis-spelling)

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 75): I would be worried when Israeli jets start flying medium altitude tracks.

Ah ok, so, the F15's plunging towards the French base and scaring them sh*tless, at low altitude, in a clear attempt to mock them, triggering the French to advertise their "next time we'll shoot" stance, isn't worrying for you. Good.

Oh wait, I must dig up a link, otherwise what I am saying didn't happen.

Waste of time,
Kay

PS: If I say that I've had those F15's fly over my head, would that burry your foot too deep in your mouth? Ok I won't.

Quoting Kay (Reply 83): Ah ok, so, the F15's plunging towards the French base and scaring them sh*tless, at low altitude, in a clear attempt to mock them, triggering the French to advertise their "next time we'll shoot" stance, isn't worrying for you. Good.

No, not particularly.

Dipping and plunging may be fine and dandy for avians and bad movies, but isn't a very good profile for an actual attack.

Quoting Kay (Reply 83): Oh wait, I must dig up a link, otherwise what I am saying didn't happen.

Never said it didn't happen.

Pointless rejoinder to a comment never made.

Quoting Kay (Reply 83): PS: If I say that I've had those F15's fly over my head, would that burry your foot too deep in your mouth? Ok I won't.

Not really. But... It would make me think those pilots need some refresher courses in navigation since they appear to be in Vienna now.

Now, if you would care to go back and read (yes, I know rare for A.neters) I've never denied what Israel is doing. I never said I thought what Israel was doing is right, nor should they be doing it at all. I have been saying that the French proposed solution is the wrong solution. I even proposed a better solution if you care to go read the thread.

Now, whose foot is tickling tonsils?

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 84): I've never denied what Israel is doing. I never said I thought what Israel was doing is right, nor should they be doing it at all.

That's more progress than I hoped. And all I am saying, additionally to what you just said, is that some of the people that are being overflown in Lebanon do have half a brain, they are not reacting like that because they couldn't think of the ingenious solutions you or me came up with. The situation is boiling down there, and even you, or me, would probably do the exact same thing as them.

Kay

PS: Well you may be surprised but after the summer war, the jets plunging again is somewhat worrying. 4 UN peacekeeprs died in the summer.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 84): for an actual attack.

nobody said it was an ACTUAL attack. It is said that it was a bullying action, mockery, derision and ridiculing against both the UN and Lebanon
-

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 84): I never said I thought what Israel was doing is right, nor should they be doing it at all.

but you made the impression of a person condoning and supporting and celebrating what Israel was/is doing
-

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 84): I have been saying that the French proposed solution is the wrong solution.

you said the French WANTED to shoot down Israeli fighters. While they simply threatened to shoot AT the Israeli fighters. The solution proposed by the French is Israel stopping their overflights.
-

Quoting Frequentflyer (Thread starter): French UN Troops Prepare Guns Against Israeli Jets

The Rambo state should try to not make more mistakes like the air strike that hit a United Nations post in southern Lebanon on July last summer.
Alex!!!

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 86): nobody said it was an ACTUAL attack. It is said that it was a bullying action, mockery, derision and ridiculing against both the UN and Lebanon

Well, if you are going to start killing people it better have been an actual attack.

Am I to believe that you support killing people for: Bullying, mockery, derision and ridicule?

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 86): but you made the impression of a person condoning and supporting and celebrating what Israel was/is doing

  

This is right up there with you claiming I was making comments against the French.

Pure    on your part.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 86): you said the French WANTED to shoot down Israeli fighters.

That is generally what happens when you fire anti aircraft weapons at aircraft.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 86): While they simply threatened to shoot AT the Israeli fighters.

Do you laugh when you type stuff like this?

So now, you think that the French forces should just unload deadly artillery into the sky to ... "scare off" the Israelis without actually intending to hit them?

I want you to conduct an experiment at home.
Step 1: Go outside and find a rock
Step 2: Throw it straight up in the air.
Step 3: Stand directly under it and observe.

This experiment also works with 20mm explosive cannon shells and missiles of all types.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 88): So now, you think that the French forces should just unload deadly artillery into the sky to ... "scare off" the Israelis without actually intending to hit them?

This is ridiculous.
Israeli planes were heading down to the French soldiers, and they naturally prepared to defend themselves. It was a provocation, and very stupid.

Someone do something about Israel like remove them they stole the palestinaians land

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 89): It was a provocation

Provocation and arrogance are two of many Israeli traditions !

Alex!!!

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 89): This is ridiculous. Israeli planes were heading down to the French soldiers, and they naturally prepared to defend themselves. It was a provocation, and very stupid.

It's called saber rattling.

It's nothing new when opposing military forces are in proximity.

You didn't see the US threatening to sink the Chinese sub that snuck up on a carrier group recently did you? You didn't see US a Russian aircraft flaming the bombers that used to wander up and down each others coasts did you?

The trick is NOT to get your hackles up. Provoking the other side into acting like morons is exactly the point. In this case Israel wins the point as they goaded the French commander into making a rather poor choice. The best way to counter is of course through the use of counter shame. I would love to see the French chase an RC-12 off with a Gazelle.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 92): You didn't see the US threatening to sink the Chinese sub that snuck up on a carrier group recently did you? You didn't see US a Russian aircraft flaming the bombers that used to wander up and down each others coasts did you?

LOL
I imagine the comments you would have made if the French soldiers didn't prepare a defense, but just waited, looking at the planes, and hoping that they didn't shoot. I suspect that many nice words like "cowards", "surrenderers", "monkeys" would have been used.

By the way, do you remember the US shooting down an Iranian civil plane ?
According to the U.S. government, the Iranian aircraft was mistakenly identified as an attacking military fighter. The Iranian government, however, maintains that the Vincennes knowingly shot down a civilian aircraft.

You choose the version you prefer.

Do you remember the US destroying an aspirin factory ?

If the nationalities were different, let's say Iranian planes and US army, first the Americans would have probably shot the planes down, and you would be complimenting them for that.
Your were very hypocritical today.

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 93): I imagine the comments you would have made if the French soldiers didn't prepare a defense, but just waited, looking at the planes, and hoping that they didn't shoot. I suspect that many nice words like "cowards", "surrenderers", "monkeys" would have been used.

You have quite an active imagination then.

Shall we get back to the point in the thread earlier where others were accusing me of having ill will towards the French.

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 93): By the way, do you remember the US shooting down an Iranian civil plane ?

Yes I do.

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 93): Do you remember the US destroying an aspirin factory ?

Yes I do.

Now for the correct questions... Do I believe either action on the part of the US was correct in either of the two incidents? No, they were both complete disasters.

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 93): If the nationalities were different, let's say Iranian planes and US army, first the Americans would have probably shot the planes down, and you would be complimenting them for that.

It's hard to imagine the US being in a peace keeping role with Iran nearby.. but just for laughs and giggles.

If the US is in a peacekeeping operation, and Iran is pestering them, then it is incumbent upon the US troops to not re-ingite a shooting war. If that means sitting on their hands while Iran puts on an airshow above them, then that is exactly what they need to do.

Interesting that you choose Iran and the US since Iran has been of late conducting several "exercises" in very close proximity to the US Navy without a single peep from the squidies about blasting Iran.

Quoting Sebolino (Reply 93): Your were very hypocritical today.

How can I have been hypocritical before I even offered an answer to your post?

Were you perhaps pre-judging my answers based on an expectation of me to defend the errant actions of the US in the past?

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 88): Am I to believe that you support killing people for: Bullying, mockery, derision and ridicule?

no, but I support such perpetrators be told to stop, or else ................
-

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 88): you said the French WANTED to shoot down Israeli fighters. -- That is generally what happens when you fire anti aircraft weapons at aircraft.

not really, only a very small percentage of anti-aircraft missiles hit their targets
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Quoting MDorBust (Reply 88): While they simply threatened to shoot AT the Israeli fighters. -- Do you laugh when you type stuff like this? -- So now, you think that the French forces should just unload deadly artillery into the sky to ... "scare off" the Israelis without actually intending to hit them?

yes, I expect them to MIS-aim deliberately. One missile behind them, one on the left, one on the right
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Quoting MDorBust (Reply 92): an RC-12

that RC-12 thing apparently is an obsession of you ! Again, we talk about F-15 FIGHTER-BOMBERS and not about some sort of King Air !
---- well, here the "Gazelle" I have in mind :

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Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 95): no, but I support such perpetrators be told to stop, or else ................

Or else what?

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 95): yes, I expect them to MIS-aim deliberately. One missile behind them, one on the left, one on the right

You truly are hopeless. You really expect the UN to lob lethal projectiles all over the place and hope that no one gets hurt? Will it be Israels fault when 20mm shells start landing in houses and spent missiles come raining out of the sky?

Do you also support police shooting guns out of criminals hands.

This "non-lethal" use of lethal force is about the most ridiculous thing I have ever read.

  

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 95): that RC-12 thing apparently is an obsession of you ! Again, we talk about F-15 FIGHTER-BOMBERS and not about some sort of King Air !

Then how did the RC-12 get into the article in the OP?

Do I have such great force of will that I projected my imagination into the internet and gave it reality? Or did I just use my amazing mental powers to directly insert the suggestion into the mind of the author, there by forcing him to bend to my will and write it into the article?

None the less, if you wish to chase Israeli F-15s around the sky with French jets, please take note that I suggested this way back in Reply #30.

[Edited 2006-11-20 17:34:52]

MDorBust,

I'm not adding oil to the fire here. However your profile does give a bypasser the impression that your interests are far from, say, gardening.

:P

What's the deal? Did you serve in the past?

Kay

Quoting Kay (Reply 97): What's the deal? Did you serve in the past?

Please referance Reply #34

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 34): The word "intercept" comes to mind

OK, Bust, I actually agree with you.

But under current circumstances Pellegrini has no AF to do it.

So what should he have done in your opinion, instead of letting his staff prepare air defense?