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FlyDeltaJets87
Posts: 4479
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:51 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Thu Feb 08, 2007 10:43 am

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 26):
You're quite correct. What I was really getting at was that no head of state needs an aircraft of that size for personal transport. As far as Speaker Pelosi or any other state rep is concerned, I'm pretty much of the opinion that their non-commercial transport should be financed by their respective state and not the federal government. Perhaps Madam Speaker's place in line for the presidency should anything happen to Dubya or Darth Cheney makes her an exception to that idea, but otherwise, I think it should stand.



Quoting Aloges (Reply 9):
Agreed. Then again, you could as well argue if a flying command post needs to be the size of a 747-200.

*And other quotes on this topic.
Usually more than just the President flies on Air Force One though. Quite a bit of his staffers and advisors, as well as the press are on board as well. And business is conducted while aboard the aircraft.
If one could show me Mrs. Pelosi needed the space on the 757 to also transport advisors and staffers and conduct business on board the aircraft while enroute to California, I wouldn't gripe at all. But using it just as a status symbol and for the sake of personal transport to go home when there are more efficient options is a waste of taxpayer money.


Quoting JAL777 (Reply 7):
I guess actively working to reduce global warming is for OTHER people.

 rotfl  Isn't that the [sad] truth.
"Let's Roll"- Todd Beamer, United Airlines Flight 93, Sept. 11, 2001
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:01 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 48):
And whoever said that was wrong. While a certain amount of government waste is probably inevitable, that doesn't mean we should live with it.

Not too late to express your opinion. The thread's still open and unlocked:
Millions Wasted In Iraq Reconstruction, Report Con (by AeroWesty Feb 1 2007 in Non Aviation)

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 48):
What possible justification is there for all these perks?

Knowing our mutual history in the Golden State, I'm positive you'll recall that the last relatively high-placed government official to spurn such trappings of office was nicknamed "Governor Moonbeam" as a result. There could possibly be a collective expectation to lavish upon elected officials, and in return indulge themselves at our expense accordingly, but I'm not of that class. What's appropriate and cost-effective, yes. What's above and beyond that can always be paid for from their own pockets, if they so desire.

I am not opposed to providing government officials of sufficient rank what is needed for their security and to enable them to do their jobs efficiently. I am opposed to anything which could be construed as "grace and favor" or otherwise be suspect of recognizably courting their influence, whether from the private or public sectors. The bills we foot for things which could be considered as nothing but "luxury" should be restrained, especially since they're spending other people's money, and have a penchant for running the budget into deficits.
International Homo of Mystery
 
AirCop
Posts: 5553
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:10 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 48):
We've turned Congress into royalty. They don't have to fight for parking at DCA or IAD - they have spaces set aside. They can drive impaired, and the Capitol Police will give them a ride home. They have the most plush health care and pension plan imaginable. And the rest of us fight for parking, get arrested and thrown in jail, and either have shitty (or no) health care or have to pay through the nose for it.

Don't forget the other perks, free travel, staff paid for, office rents etc. Then of course the big ego = power, which is priceless.
 
dtwclipper
Topic Author
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Thu Feb 08, 2007 10:29 pm

Quoting OU812 (Reply 46):
Are you trying to bait me here Dtwclipper [

Now, why would I want to do that?

Just so you know, your favorite source for unbiased news has even jumped on the story......

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/A...Pelosi-Plane.html?_r=1&oref=slogin


Guess your theory of the Liberal Media needs some re-thinking.  scratchchin 
Compare New York Air, the Airline that works for your Business
 
PanAmOldDC8
Posts: 934
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Thu Feb 08, 2007 10:54 pm

Hey Guys we could go on with he said this she said that and never come to a conclusion
Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait
 
b777a340fan
Posts: 675
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2005 12:42 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Thu Feb 08, 2007 10:59 pm

Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 3):
Drive your ass to IAD, and book a First Class ticket on United Airlines. Ms. Pelosi has a case of "my dick is bigger than yours" syndrome. These people do not need to waste taxpayer money running a shuttle serveice, Democrats and Republicans.



Quoting Halls120 (Reply 8):
Her being SOH is no different, and you can't tell me she would be in danger on a UA domestic flight.

She should haul her ass out to IAD and fly on one of the many UA nonstops to SFO.

Her being SOH, hence second in line to the presidency, makes ALL the difference. I heard on the Today Show this morning that as SOH, she is entitled to special accomodations with the Air Force. The Secretary of State gets to use bigger airplanes, why not the SOH? For that matter, why not have the President/VP fly commercial? Think of how many frequent flyer miles they can accrue!

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 16):
Pelosi doesn't need a 757...I'd love to hear why Bush needs a 747 when most heads of state around the world seem to get by just fine with 737s and smaller. Excess is nothing new with U.S. politicians, quit digging for controversy.

Yup, not even accounting the more environmental friendly advantage.
 
TedTAce
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Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:48 pm

Quoting PanAmOldDC8 (Reply 54):
Hey Guys we could go on with he said this she said that and never come to a conclusion

So I guess we should all self delete like you threatened to but didn't?  stirthepot 
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RJdxer
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Thu Feb 08, 2007 11:57 pm

To the victor go the spoils. Let her have the 757. She's earned the right to the perk.
Warm winds blowing, heating blue skies, and a road that goes forever. I'm going to Texas!
 
halls120
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 12:10 am

Quoting B777a340fan (Reply 55):
Quoting Halls120 (Reply 8):
Her being SOH is no different, and you can't tell me she would be in danger on a UA domestic flight.

She should haul her ass out to IAD and fly on one of the many UA nonstops to SFO.

Her being SOH, hence second in line to the presidency, makes ALL the difference. I heard on the Today Show this morning that as SOH, she is entitled to special accommodations with the Air Force. The Secretary of State gets to use bigger airplanes, why not the SOH? For that matter, why not have the President/VP fly commercial? Think of how many frequent flyer miles they can accrue!

Sorry, for the intended use under discussion here, it makes NO difference.

If she is on an official trip representing the government of the United States, then by all means the SOH should be transported on a government aircraft. Just like the Secretary of State. But that isn't what we are talking about. We are talking about her trips home to California. Flights wholly within the continental U.S. Where we supposedly have efficient and effective TSA security.

Unless the OMB directive I referred to earlier has been rescinded, even Condi Rice has to travel commercial within the US unless certain criteria are met for the use of government supplied aircraft.

Unless I've missed it, not one person posting here has yet demonstrated the need for the SOH - or any other government official - to be afforded government-supplied transport when commercial transport is available. How is a nonstop UA flight from Dulles with a security detail on board unsafe?

What's going on here is this. Pelosi - like Hastert before her - doesn't want to have to mingle with the unwashed masses. How much more convenient to be able to travel without the bother of actually having to be exposed to the general public that pays her salary. In small increments, we are allowing our elected officials to insulate themselves from the people they supposedly serve.

As I've stated before, we are allowing them to become royalty, and it makes me sick.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
AirCop
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 12:24 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 58):
not one person posting here has yet demonstrated the need for the SOH - or any other government official - to be afforded government-supplied transport when commercial transport is available. How is a nonstop UA flight from Dulles with a security detail on board unsafe?

Expect for the title of SOH and power to control the agenda , is she/he really different than any other member of the House?
Remember when TWA was the primary airline for members of Congress between SFO-IAD.
 
TedTAce
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 12:40 am

Quoting RJdxer (Reply 57):
To the victor go the spoils. Let her have the 757. She's earned the right to the perk.

 redflag  She's earned the right to have access to a military a/c that is capable of getting her home in one fell swoop, not galavanting about with her cronies x-country.
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RJdxer
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 1:32 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 60):
not galavanting about with her cronies x-country.

The story does not relate to any "gallivanting" around, cronies or no. She is not asking for an aircraft that is not already in the inventory. I've personally seen the VP come into IAH more than a few times in a 757 and can vividly remember Al Gore, when he was VP bringing it into Nashville then tying up I40 at rush hour making his way out to Carthage. Those are shorter trips than Andrews to SFO. Since 9/11 due to security concerns evidently the Speaker is entitled so let'er fly. I do kind of like the name Pelosi One  rotfl . Look, they won the election so as I said, to the victor go the spoils. If she can't see that the humble thing to do would be to take the Gulfstream, it'll come back to bite someday. Meanwhile, enough other people seem to be making use of the 757, why not let her? And if she can fill it up with other CA congressional members, well that just makes the trip a little more cost effective.
Warm winds blowing, heating blue skies, and a road that goes forever. I'm going to Texas!
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 1:37 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 58):
As I've stated before, we are allowing them to become royalty, and it makes me sick.

I'm sure it'll be on the wires within minutes, but MSNBC just had a reporter put a microphone in Speaker Pelosi's face and asked, "do you really need a 757?" She answered, "Look, I don't know the numbers of the planes. I've flown home nonstop 1,000 times. When the Sergeant of Arms said I had use of a plane for security reasons, I said to make it something that could fly nonstop to California or I'd fly commercial."

She also asked aloud why Rummy still had a desk at the Pentagon.
International Homo of Mystery
 
N666FU
Posts: 135
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 1:49 am

What has two thumbs and doesn't give a shit?

 thumbsup  THIS GUY!  thumbsup 

No one really cares except for righties who are looking for something to smear her with. We have bigger problems to attend to.
KEPT DELTA OUR DELTA! Ask USAirPlatinum about it!
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:06 am

According to CNN, Tony Snow, the White House Press Secretary, has said this morning that "this is a silly story that's been unfair to Speaker Pelosi."
International Homo of Mystery
 
elmothehobo
Posts: 985
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:19 am

Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 5):
I will give you that, but the 757 is a widely used airplane.

Yup, and all four of them are right around the corner from where she works.

Quoting ORFflyer (Reply 4):
Maybe, but being 2nd in line, a few perks do come with the territory.

Amen, and people seem to forget that.

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 15):
Oh the wisdom of the 21-25 age range.

Gimme a break.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 21):
All these perks we are so eager to bestow on our new royal class are getting to be a bit much.

They really aren't. Is she really asking for too much? If the 89th Airlift has time to do Cadet flights with the C-40s and C-32s they have time to fly the Speak of the House to her home district.

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 24):
With all due respect, it wasn't Bush's idea to order the 747 (or maybe it was?) ? 

No, Reagan ordered it.

Quoting EWRCabincrew (Reply 49):
Hell, a crapload of politicians use taxpayer money for their travel. What's the diff? Because she is Speaker of the House?

... because she's a godless, freedom hating baby killer.

Quoting RJdxer (Reply 57):
To the victor go the spoils. Let her have the 757. She's earned the right to the perk.

Amen. As long as she doesn't abuse it.
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:22 am

Quoting N666FU (Reply 63):
No one really cares except for righties

 redflag 

I took as much glee as anyone over the dem's victory. Now that they APPEAR to be taking the same 'my way or the highway' attitude (not in this incident that I can tell; but others) that W used to have; they are shoring up my rationale to flush both parties down the toilet.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 64):
According to CNN, Tony Snow, the White House Press Secretary, has said this morning that "this is a silly story that's been unfair to Speaker Pelosi."

A rational response??  Wow!  Wow! Good Call Tony!!
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andessmf
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:22 am

Quoting RJdxer (Reply 61):
If she can't see that the humble thing to do would be to take the Gulfstream, it'll come back to bite someday.

The question is not whether she should get a military transport, the question is what type. I say the safe way to go is to get the same type that Hastert used, unless it can't fly coast-to-coast.
 
halls120
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:29 am

Quoting RJdxer (Reply 61):
Since 9/11 due to security concerns evidently the Speaker is entitled so let'er fly.

What security concerns? Everyone refers to them, but no one can explain them.

While I don't have access to the particular security evaluation that has informed the decision to fly the SOH on government aircraft, I have read and reviewed several other post 9/11 security briefs, and I can tell you that in virtually every instance, there are overblown and unjustified measures recommended based on extremely weak intelligence.

Here's what's going on, post 9/11. Someone identifies a potential threat, and beats the drums inside the intel community. Absent hard evidence to refute the supposition, unless there is someone willing to stand up and call BS, the evaluation goes forward, and poof, there is a new unneeded "security" requirement.

several months from now, unless sanity prevails, a new security measure (which I cannot now discuss) will be unveiled that is based on supposition on top of probability, seasoned with a dash of fear. Despite the consistent reminder from the IC that there is virtually NO evidence of an imminent threat. But because no one wants to be in the position of not having taken action and vilified in the next "__/__ Commission Report," millions of tax dollars will be wasted.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 62):

I'm sure it'll be on the wires within minutes, but MSNBC just had a reporter put a microphone in Speaker Pelosi's face and asked, "do you really need a 757?" She answered, "Look, I don't know the numbers of the planes. I've flown home nonstop 1,000 times. When the Sergeant of Arms said I had use of a plane for security reasons, I said to make it something that could fly nonstop to California or I'd fly commercial."

She also asked aloud why Rummy still had a desk at the Pentagon.

So what are those security concerns? We know why the President and VP get to fly on AF aircraft all the time, and why all cabinet officials get the same privilege while on overseas travel. What are these new post 9/11 concerns that specifically endanger the SOH?

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 64):
According to CNN, Tony Snow, the White House Press Secretary, has said this morning that "this is a silly story that's been unfair to Speaker Pelosi."

Snow is correct. The issue isn't Pelosi. It is how we are increasingly unwilling to confront the abuse of power exercised by our increasing royal ruling class.
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
searpqx
Posts: 4173
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2000 10:36 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:32 am

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 67):
I say the safe way to go is to get the same type that Hastert used, unless it can't fly coast-to-coast.

Which it can't, and is exactly the issue. In principal I'm with Halls, she should just fly coach, but since she will be flying in a gov't plane, it might as well be able to go nonstop. I did have an issue when it appeared she was trying to upgrade the size of the plane, to enable her to offer more seats to staffers, etc., but as long as she sticks to the most economical Air Force plane that can make the tripk, then this is much ado about nothing - as both Pelosi, the Military and now the White House are making clear.
"The two most common elements in the universe are Hydrogen and stupidity"
 
BladeLWS
Posts: 358
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2005 12:41 pm

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:37 am

I say give her the C-20, and it can refuel at a USAF base to get to CA. She just wants the C-32 to carry her entire CA Caucus along with her. Give her the same plane Hastert used, the C-20.
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:38 am

Quoting ElmoTheHobo (Reply 65):
Gimme a break.

Why? You are 16-20 which is even worse (as a general rule).

Quoting Searpqx (Reply 69):
then this is much ado about nothing - as both Pelosi, the Military and now the White House are making clear.

 yes 
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AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 2:39 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 68):
So what are those security concerns? We know why the President and VP get to fly on AF aircraft all the time, and why all cabinet officials get the same privilege while on overseas travel. What are these new post 9/11 concerns that specifically endanger the SOH?

In her quote, captured in a hallway of the House, interestingly, after a meeting on global warming, Speaker Pelosi responded with the security concerns as one of the reasons. It's been stated earlier there are also communications issues, and the use of a military plane was advised by the President for the Speaker's travels.

What the actual security and communications concerns are, are unknown to the public, as far as I know.

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 67):
The question is not whether she should get a military transport, the question is what type. I say the safe way to go is to get the same type that Hastert used, unless it can't fly coast-to-coast.

I agree. Apparently, last night or this morning the DoD, who has yet to even write the rules regarding the SoH's use of military aircraft, has offered the same plane former Speaker Hastert used to fly to Chicago. Speaker Pelosi has said, "fly me nonstop or let me fly commercial."

I believe it's clear that it's not Speaker Pelosi's job to go out and buy the perfect jet to fly her home. It's up to the government to provide what is reasonable and expected to accomplish the job. Nothing more, nothing less.
International Homo of Mystery
 
VSlover
Posts: 1860
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:05 am

the simple fact is if hastert had come from OR, CA or WA then he would have probably been given a plane that was capable of flying him to the west coast non-stop...and then the precedent would have been established, no questions.

it is such a laughable spectacle seeing those making a tempest in a teapot over the VERY SIMPLE PREMISE that there are planes to make it to SFO non-stop and that the SOH should be granted such an easy request or allow her to fly commercial, which she is obviously more than willing to do.
 
elmothehobo
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RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 4:34 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 71):
Why? You are 16-20 which is even worse (as a general rule).

... ah yes, age, an absolute determinate of one's character and intelligence, seeing as there is no such thing as an ignorant or presumptious 25+ year old.

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 72):
I believe it's clear that it's not Speaker Pelosi's job to go out and buy the perfect jet to fly her home. It's up to the government to provide what is reasonable and expected to accomplish the job. Nothing more, nothing less.

Absolutely, and if the government determines that a C-32 is the appropriate aircraft, so be it.

I'm pretty sure she didn't wake up one morning and ask herself "I wonder how many people I'd piss off by asking for SAM flight back to San Francisco."

As the speaker of the house, she is entitled to a SAM flight if the feds see it fit. Now if she takes advantage of the SAM flight and turns it into a party for her constituents, I can see a problem. Remember, you are innocent until proven guilty - she hasn't done anything to f*ck up yet!
 
JA54123
Posts: 128
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2001 11:55 pm

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 7:52 am

One thing that absolutely no one on this forum and no one in the news media seemd to want to point out is that the C-20 and the C-37 that the 89th Airlift wing has available out of Andrews AFB both have the range to fly across the US with ease. Below are two links from the USAF website that are the fact sheets on the C-20 & C-37. If one will engage brain and read, both of these aircraft have a range of over 4,000 miles for the C-20 (Gulfstream III and IV) and over 6,000 miles for the C-37 (Gulfstream V). Each one of these aircraft will fly 12 people. Why is this even an issue, when the data is so widely available for everyone to see?

http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=87
http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=91
You wouldn't understand, it's a Texas Thang!
 
speedbird747BA
Posts: 1312
Joined: Tue Sep 19, 2006 9:47 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:03 am

So-out of curiosity-is the 757 gonna be coming from Eglin? I saw the AF757 today circling to land. Never seen the bird in the air up until now. Its really quite nice. If it is, I can get close up pics for anybody that wants them. Theres a road that runs right out behind where it is kept, and its kept in the open so its an easy target.  Smile

Cheers,
Kyle
How long do I have to climb, up on the side of this mountain of mine?
 
stlgph
Posts: 11361
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:13 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 25):
From my understanding, it was the government itself that decided the Speaker of the House should fly by military transport. I don't make the rules, you don't make the rules, they make the rules.

Wow, only took 25 replies for someone with common sense to come forward and state the policies.

Quoting JA54123 (Reply 75):
One thing that absolutely no one on this forum and no one in the news media seemd to want to point out is that the C-20 and the C-37 that the 89th Airlift wing has available out of Andrews AFB both have the range to fly across the US with ease.

That's incorrect. It was pointed out in the ABC News Stephanie Sy package.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
DC10extender
Posts: 573
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 6:09 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 8:48 am

Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 3):
She doesn't need to use a 757. Drive your ass to IAD, and book a First Class ticket on United Airlines.

It would be a security nightmare for her to be flying United. The secret service would have too many problems in ensuring her saftey. It is much more practical to give her use of a military plane.
Did you ever read on your birth certificate that life is fair? Thats cause its not there.
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:07 am

Quoting DC10extender (Reply 78):
It would be a security nightmare for her to be flying United. The secret service would have too many problems in ensuring her saftey

There's nothing I've ever seen that indicates the Speaker of the House routinely receives Secret Service protection. Isn't it the Capitol Police who are responsible for the security of the House and Senate?

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/usc_sec_18_00003056----000-.html
International Homo of Mystery
 
AirCop
Posts: 5553
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:39 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:11 am

Quoting ElmoTheHobo (Reply 65):
because she's a godless, freedom hating baby killer.

What does this have to do with the topic at hand? Isn't she a mother of five and how many grandkids? Lets stay on topic can we!

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 64):
According to CNN, Tony Snow, the White House Press Secretary, has said this morning that "this is a silly story that's been unfair to Speaker Pelosi."

Someone speaking for common sense, Congressman Blunt and a couple of his friends are going to look bad, it they continue this.

Quoting DC10extender (Reply 78):
It would be a security nightmare for her to be flying United. The secret service would have too many problems in ensuring her safety. It is much more practical to give her use of a military plane.

The Bush administration made the rules regarding the transportation needs of the SOH, how every silly they may seem. If planes are available let her use it.
Her whole delegation would take up the entire first class section of a UA 320, and besides isn't Dulles one the worst TSA spots.
 
Falcon84
Posts: 13775
Joined: Fri Sep 10, 2004 11:52 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:18 am

Quoting BladeLWS (Reply 70):
I say give her the C-20, and it can refuel at a USAF base to get to CA. She just wants the C-32 to carry her entire CA Caucus along with her. Give her the same plane Hastert used, the C-20.

Uh, Hastert only had an hour hop to Illinois; Pelosi has a 4/5 hour hop to California. Why not allow the 2nd in line an aircraft that can get there nonstop.

And for all those bitching about Pelosi doing this, even the WH says this is silly, and that the Seargant-At-Arms is the one responsible for setting up the transportation.

You guys have a problem with the Speaker wanting to go nonstop, and not waste some time doing a fuel stop?

Talk about desperation to hang something on this woman, this is it. Another great GOP non-story.
Work Right, Fly Hard
 
BladeLWS
Posts: 358
Joined: Wed Dec 14, 2005 12:41 pm

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:23 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 81):

Uh, Hastert only had an hour hop to Illinois; Pelosi has a 4/5 hour hop to California. Why not allow the 2nd in line an aircraft that can get there nonstop.

And for all those bitching about Pelosi doing this, even the WH says this is silly, and that the Seargant-At-Arms is the one responsible for setting up the transportation.

You guys have a problem with the Speaker wanting to go nonstop, and not waste some time doing a fuel stop?

Talk about desperation to hang something on this woman, this is it. Another great GOP non-story.

The C-20 can make it their nonstop most of the time unless there is a big headwind. The C-37 can make it their easily nonstop all the time. There is absolutely no reason to use a 757 for this when a smaller aircraft will suffice.

Anyways the 757 will waste more fuel in one direction that the C-20 will with one refueling, and its like maybe an hour to refuel and continue. HARDLY an inconvenience.

[Edited 2007-02-09 01:25:06]
 
andessmf
Posts: 5689
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:53 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:23 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 81):
Another great GOP non-story.

Frankly, we don't know where the story originated, as you pointed out that:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 81):
even the WH says this is silly
 
OU812
Posts: 563
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:19 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:24 am

Quoting Dtwclipper (Reply 53):
Quoting OU812 (Reply 46):
Are you trying to bait me here Dtwclipper [

Now, why would I want to do that?

Just so you know, your favorite source for unbiased news has even jumped on the story......

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/us/A...Pelosi-Plane.html?_r=1&oref=slogin


Guess your theory of the Liberal Media needs some re-thinking.

Yah,
They jumped on the story. However, the NYT's article you provided contradicts your thesis of them not being biased. In fact, it proves my case even more. Since the NYT's article which you provided does nothing but defend Nancy Pelosi, while conveniently ignoring more significant issues that would make her look bad in this particular circumstance.

For example, the NYT completely ignored the fact that John Murtha is making harsh comments regarding the Pentagon in order for Pelosi to get the larger 757. It is starting to look like a he said she said situation. However, I have a much easier time believing the Pentagon over John the I'll consider the $50,000 dollars later Abstract Scandal Murtha any day!


Nice try Q! And thank you for proving my point!  bigthumbsup 

http://www.nationalledger.com/artman/publish/article_272611465.shtml

Nancy Pelosi Airplane Scandal, John Murtha Warns Pentagon
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
By Jack Kramer
Feb 8, 2007

Murtha then seemed to threaten the Pentagon again - or at least told them what to do. Murtha said he is convinced the Pentagon has been leaking information about the possibility that Pelosi would use large military planes to make her look bad. But he said, "They're making a mistake when they leak it because she decides on allocations for them,'' referring to the Pentagon budget.

The Washington Times earlier cited sources, who include those in Congress and in the administration, that said the Democrat was seeking regular military flights not only for herself and her staff, but also for relatives and for other members of the California delegation. A knowledgeable source called the request "carte blanche for an aircraft any time."
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:32 am

Quoting DC10extender (Reply 78):
Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 3):She doesn't need to use a 757. Drive your ass to IAD, and book a First Class ticket on United Airlines.It would be a security nightmare for her to be flying United. The secret service would have too many problems in ensuring her saftey. It is much more practical to give her use of a military plane.

BS. When Pat Buchanan was a Presidential candidate, he flew commerical on occasion. Complete with some kind of security detail. I know, because I flew on a flight with him once.

78 posts so far, and no one has yet posted even a generalized recitation of what these so-called security issues are.

And what do find out when we look closer into this issue? More attempts to live high on the hog, courtesy of the taxpayer.

Quote:
...According to reports, Speaker Pelosi requested the use of a military plane to attend a retreat in Williamsburg, Virginia, last week. ThatÕs 150 miles or a two-hour drive from Washington, D.C. That request, by all accounts, was denied.Ó (CNN, 2/5/07)

She can't drive to Williamsburg?
"Suppose you were an idiot. And suppose you were a member of Congress. But I repeat myself." Mark Twain, a Biography
 
stlgph
Posts: 11361
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:46 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 85):
BS. When Pat Buchanan was a Presidential candidate, he flew commerical on occasion. Complete with some kind of security detail. I know, because I flew on a flight with him once.

#2 in command in our Post 9/11TM World is far different than a former communications director that is running for office.

I'm actually amazed you are scraping this desperately.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
OU812
Posts: 563
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:19 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:51 am

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 81):
Talk about desperation to hang something on this woman, this is it. Another great GOP non-story.

Hhmm  scratchchin 

I am being to see things a bit more clearer now. Thanks to JA54123 providing us with the a/c that can do Pelosi's coast to coast mission. Both a/c have plus 4000 mile range. One over 6000!

Since these capable a/c exist. I see no reason why a Jumbo jet the size of a 757 was even brought up! However, it was. That being the case, it raising the chances that Pelosi in fact wanted the Big One!

 eyebrow 

The irony & hypocrisy of this situation is the fact that she Mrs. Pelosi & her lib friends always preach efficiency & protecting the enviorment. Yet, 1st chance they get they try to get the equivalent of an SUV in the skys!

 footinmouth 

http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=91

C-37A

General Characteristics
Primary Function: Special air missions
Builder: Gulfstream Aerospace Corp.
Power Plant: Two BMW/Rolls Royce BR710A1-10 high bypass ratio turbofan engines
Thrust: 14,750 pounds each engine
Length: 96 feet, 5 inches (29.38 meters)
Height: 25 feet, 11 inches (7.9 meters)
Wingspan: 93 feet, 6 inches (28.5 meters)
Speed: 600 mph (.885 Mach) maximum
Maximum Altitude: 51,000 feet (15,545 meters)
Maximum Takeoff Weight: 90,500 pounds (41,050 kilograms)
Range: 6,300 miles (5,500 nautical miles) normal cruise
Load: 12 passengers
Unit Cost: $36 million (1998 constant dollars)
Crew: Five
Date Deployed: 1998
Inventory: Active force, 9; Air National Guard, 0; Reserve, 0


http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?fsID=87&page=2

C-20

General Characteristics
Primary Function: C-20B/H, special air and operational support airlift missions
Builder: Gulfstream Aerospace Corp.
Power Plant: C-20B, two Rolls-Royce Spey Mark 511-8 turbofan engines;C-20H, two Rolls-Royce Tay Mark 611-8 turbofan engines
Thrust: C-20B, 11,400 pounds each engine; C-20H, 13,850 pounds each engine
Length: C-20B, 83 feet, 2 inches (25.4 meters); C-20H, 88 feet, 4 inches (26.9 meters)
Height: 24 feet, 6 inches (7.5 meters)
Wingspan: 77 feet, 10 inches (23.7 meters)
Speed: 576 mph (501 nautical miles per hour) maximum
Maximum Takeoff Weight: C-20B, 69,700 pounds (31,610 kilograms); C-20H, 74,600 pounds (33,832 kilograms)
Range: C-20B, 4,250 miles (3,698 nautical miles) long-range; C-20H, 4,850 miles (4,220 nautical miles) long range
Ceiling: 45,000 feet (13,716 meters)
Load: 12 passengers
Unit Cost: All models, $29.4 (fiscal 1998 constant dollars)
Crew: Five (pilot, copilot, flight engineer, communication system operator, flight attendant)
Date Deployed: C-20B, 1988; C-20H, 1992
Inventory: C-20B, Active force, 5; ANG, 0; Reserve, 0
C-20H, Active force, 2; ANG, 0; Reserve, 0
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 9:55 am

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 85):
78 posts so far, and no one has yet posted even a generalized recitation of what these so-called security issues are.

Now Halls, you and I both know it's not fair to only question one side of the priorities, there are "communications" issues as well. But as I already said ...

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 72):
What the actual security and communications concerns are, are unknown to the public, as far as I know.

You tell me which department I ask about what security and communication priorities there are for the Speaker of the House, and I'll do it, just promise in return you'll bake a file into a cake and bring it to me so I can break out of jail afterwards.  Wink
International Homo of Mystery
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:05 am

Quoting OU812 (Reply 87):
Since these capable a/c exist. I see no reason why a Jumbo jet the size of a 757 was even brought up!

1) A 757 a "Jumbo" jet? Dude, you do realize you're posting on an aviation site, right?  rotfl 

2) We've already covered this. There's no evidence Speaker Pelosi requested anything other than a jet capable to fly nonstop to California.

Damn, any more misinformation and I'm going to have to start calling this  redflag OU812GATE redflag  !!
International Homo of Mystery
 
PanAmOldDC8
Posts: 934
Joined: Tue Dec 05, 2006 9:25 pm

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:13 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 89):
) We've already covered this. There's no evidence Speaker Pelosi requested anything other than a jet capable to fly nonstop to California.

Even the White House has basically come out and said to let the matter rest, as she will get an aircraft. I know it was done for political reasons, but I think that we could debate this ad infinitum and still get nowhere. Agree Westy
Barbados, CWC soon, can't wait
 
AirCop
Posts: 5553
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:39 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:17 am

Quoting OU812 (Reply 87):
Since these capable a/c exist. I see no reason why a Jumbo jet the size of a 757 was even brought up!

You can thank the Fox News Network for reporting that she wanted to fly on a 747.

Quoting PanAmOldDC8 (Reply 90):

Even the White House has basically come out and said to let the matter rest, as she will get an aircraft. I know it was done for political reasons, but I think that we could debate this ad infinitum and still get nowhere. Agree Westy

 checkmark  Next issue please.
 
OU812
Posts: 563
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:19 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:18 am

AeroWesty,

It looks as though Plane-Gate has some staying power. And Pelosi has become real defensive to boot. She is now playing the victim & using the gender card. Looks like Nancy Pelosi can use the services of the Fleft Packers!

 eyebrow 

http://newsbusters.org/node/10704

Pelosi Blames Plane-Gate on Sexism, Rummy

Posted by Mark Finkelstein on February 8, 2007 - 14:14.

How can Nancy Pelosi tell she's lost the Plane-Gate argument? When even MSNBC brands it "Air Pelosi." Check the screencap.

But Pelosi has apparently decided to go down fighting. She's now playing the gender card, and for good measure has thrown in a soupçon of Rumsfeld-phobia. MSNBC just aired a clip of Speaker Pelosi making the following remarks on the issue of her request to the Pentagon for a large plane to transport her home:
 
OU812
Posts: 563
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:19 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:21 am

Quoting AirCop (Reply 91):
Next issue please.

Spoken like a true Fleft Packer! What you really mean is damage control!


 dopey 
 
AirCop
Posts: 5553
Joined: Mon Nov 28, 2005 2:39 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:25 am

Quoting OU812 (Reply 92):
http://newsbusters.org/node/10704

Not that newsbusters.org has an ax or bias to grind.
This case is another example of the hate, destructive politics of today's era.
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:25 am

Quoting OU812 (Reply 92):
It looks as though Plane-Gate has some staying power.

 redflag OU812GATE redflag !!

Talk about damage control!

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 89):
1) A 757 a "Jumbo" jet? Dude, you do realize you're posting on an aviation site, right?   

2) We've already covered this. There's no evidence Speaker Pelosi requested anything other than a jet capable to fly nonstop to California.

Prove a 757 is a "Jumbo", and that Speaker Pelosi requested such. THEN start flapping your lips.
International Homo of Mystery
 
DC10extender
Posts: 573
Joined: Mon Nov 06, 2006 6:09 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 10:26 am

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 79):
There's nothing I've ever seen that indicates the Speaker of the House routinely receives Secret Service protection. Isn't it the Capitol Police who are responsible for the security of the House and Senate?

The capitol police are the oes who provide protectio in the Capitol buildings themselves, and the secret service has a small detail assigned to the Speaker of the House as she is the third in line for presidency.

Quoting Halls120 (Reply 85):
BS. When Pat Buchanan was a Presidential candidate, he flew commerical on occasion.

That was on occasion. Besides, he wasn't a major player in the election and he was a low risk target. The current speaker of the house is a much higher level target and would fly much more frequently. Besides, Buchanan was probably just doing a "show every one I am like the common man" thing.
Did you ever read on your birth certificate that life is fair? Thats cause its not there.
 
max999
Posts: 1274
Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2005 11:05 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:08 am

1) This whole story is just another example of the republican noise machine...keep saying something over and over again, not matter how irrelevant and false it might be. Sad... If you say it enough, people might just start thinking it's true.

2) The House sergeant-at-arms has just put out a press release that said HE was the one who requested the 757, not Pelosi.

Quote:
WASHINGTON - The Air Force transport plane decried by Republicans as an extravagance for House Speaker Nancy Pelosi was requested by the House sergeant-at-arms as a matter of security, he said Thursday.

“I regret that an issue that is exclusively considered and decided in a security context has evolved into a political issue,” Bill Livingood said in a news release. He said because Pelosi lives in California he was compelled “to request an aircraft that is capable of making non-stop flights for security purposes, unless such an aircraft is unavailable. This will ensure communications capabilities and also enhance security.”

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/17035721/
All the things I really like to do are either immoral, illegal, or fattening.
 
OU812
Posts: 563
Joined: Sun Oct 29, 2006 2:19 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:20 am

Quoting Max999 (Reply 99):
1) This whole story is just another example of the republican noise machine...

The problem with your thesis is the fact that Nancy Pelosi is having such difficulty defending herself. With each passing day, she is looking more & more snagged & unprofessional!
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pelosi Requests The Use Of Military A/C.

Fri Feb 09, 2007 11:23 am

Quoting OU812 (Reply 100):
With each passing day, she is looking more & more snagged & unprofessional!

No, with each passing day the Republican minority is looking like a bunch of whiney-assed children who can't focus on the issues which need addressing, and make up fantasy stories about how Boeing 757s are "Jumbos" during their idle hours, while awaiting for the RNP to issue the daily talking points before they make their nightly appearances on the Fox Noise Channel.
International Homo of Mystery

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