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bezoar
Posts: 746
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2001 4:47 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 6:23 am

Quoting LY744 (Reply 49):
You know what, it's so much more probable that this amazing world we live in is the product of a random process, than it is to believe that a series of concoctions from the minds of some arbitrary mortals can tell us the truth about how we came to exist.

Some concoctions from the minds of some abitrary mortals? Well, I'd consider Scientology to be a product of the human imagination. But unless you have some information that nobody else possesses, you can't know from any scientific study that the universe was not indeed created. That would simply be your belief.

In fact, the more science reveals, the more incredible the 'random' theory actually becomes. For some of us, to assume that a random process underlies the totality of our existence is a far greater leap of faith. I think that a creator would certainly be able to leave us some clues, particularly if that creator gave a hoot about us as part of creation. The revelations might not be arbitrary as one would think.

The Bible was written by 60 individuals over a period of several centuries, yet is incredibly consistent in pointing to Christ in Genesis, and revealing Him in the Gospels. The prophecies of the Bible and historical documentation have made it one of the most, if not the most, scrutinized collection of writings in the history of mankind. People have desperately sought to find justification to find it invalid, but they have failed. One cannot say that of Scientology.

That is, of course, my opinion.
"There are none so blind as those who will not see."
 
iamcanadian
Topic Author
Posts: 704
Joined: Wed May 30, 2001 6:53 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 6:25 am

Quoting LY744 (Reply 49):
Because he thinks Christianity is so different from Scientology, and I think it's not.

WHY do you think it's not? What about Christianity is so similar to Scientology?
Shut up and calculate.
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12647
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:06 am

Quoting Iamcanadian (Reply 51):

WHY do you think it's not? What about Christianity is so similar to Scientology?

Don't want to put words into anyone's mouth, but I think the idea here is that in 2000 years, Scientology (or any recent religion), could have supplanted Christianity as a dominant world religion.

It's very easy to write off something that has sprung up relatively recently, just on the basis that it's not as old as something else. But to do so on that basis alone has no merit.

Oh, and let's try and NOT turn this into religious people bashing non-religious people, and vice versa.  Smile

~Vik
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
TACAA320
Posts: 7153
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 3:03 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:20 am

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 36):

So why do so many Christians support the death penalty?

That's called "free will".
DISCLAIMER: As a Christian Roman Catholic, I don't support death penalty.
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
iamcanadian
Topic Author
Posts: 704
Joined: Wed May 30, 2001 6:53 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 7:45 am

Quoting Vikkyvik (Reply 52):
It's very easy to write off something that has sprung up relatively recently, just on the basis that it's not as old as something else. But to do so on that basis alone has no merit.

I am not "writing off" anything because, like I said:

Quoting Iamcanadian (Thread starter):
Now, I'm not one to judge which religions are worthy of being called a "real religion", but I think I'm entitled to say that Christianity and Scientology (and even radical CULTS) are not on the same level.

I'm not disregarding Scientology as a religion. I'm merely saying that you cannot compare the two at face value (like the author of the article is doing.). And I'm not basing this on the fact that one is older than the other either. I'll admit that it IS a factor I am taking into consideration, but it's not the basis of my argument. I'm basing it on the values each faith emphasizes, as well as the ORIGIN of each religion. The Bible was written by, as Bezoar mentioned, 60 authors. Despite the fact of numerous authors, the Bible is incredibly consistent in its transition from the Old Testament to the New Testament. Scientology was established by ONE author, who happened to be a science-fiction writer.

I hope you see my reasoning.  smile 

Quoting Vikkyvik (Reply 52):
Oh, and let's try and NOT turn this into religious people bashing non-religious people, and vice versa.

Agreed. Mind you, I'm NOT trying to turn this into a bashing of ANY sort.  goodvibes 
Shut up and calculate.
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12647
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:40 am

Quoting Iamcanadian (Reply 54):
I am not "writing off" anything because, like I said:

Didn't mean to say you definitely were, but it sort of comes off like that in the following quote:

Quoting Iamcanadian (Thread starter):

Yes, I know it's supposed to be *humourous*, but when you start ridiculing a religion that's been around for 2000 years, with archeological and recorded evidence, the same way you ridicule a "religion" that's been around for 55 years invented by a science fiction writer, you're out of line.



Quoting Iamcanadian (Reply 54):
I hope you see my reasoning.

I see your reasoning to an extent. But, to me, as a non-religious person, Scientology does not really seem any less valid than Christianity, in terms of some of the core beliefs.

Now, as for what each religion preaches: well, I'm not really qualified to comment on that.

My view has been and still is that religion was "invented" in order to explain things that were un-explainable at the time. As such, I believe that religion is largely false.

But, if it helps you get through your day, then so be it.
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:54 am

Quoting UALPHLCS (Reply 24):
That is all historical fact.

Based on what? Can you name one document, carving, etching or other form of communication from 2000 years ago that proves Jesus was alive? http://www.shroudstory.com/

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 36):
So why do so many Christians support the death penalty?

Ironic most of them are pro life too. 'Oh the fetuses are innocent'  Yeah sure You either believe that man has the 'right' to take the life of another or you don't; this innocense  redflag  is the biggest discredit to religion PERIOD.

Quoting ManuCH (Reply 40):
Remember - when you're poor and don't have anything to lose, you'll believe anything hoping your future will be brighter.

 yes 

Quoting ManuCH (Reply 40):
IMHO that's how religions all got started - out of desperation, needing to believe in something greater, to have a reason to keep on living. It's human nature, it's normal. Then the word spreads and many people believe in it, because it makes you "feel good".

 yes  checkmark  yes  checkmark  yes  checkmark  oh, and feeling lighter in your wallet..

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 41):
Either Jesus was a fraud, or was insane, or He was who He said He was. If you believe either of the first two choices, you MUST doubt the veracity of what He preached. If you believe the latter, you must hang on to what He said.

Or the people who created him were insane.

Quoting LY744 (Reply 45):
Buddhist

Not a religion..

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 50):
The prophecies of




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redngold
Posts: 6686
Joined: Wed Mar 22, 2000 12:26 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:05 am

Well, according to scientists, religion is not science and science is not fiction... You be the judge.
Up, up and away!
 
TheCol
Posts: 1857
Joined: Wed Jan 03, 2007 9:30 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:18 am

Quoting LY744 (Reply 49):
Because he thinks Christianity is so different from Scientology, and I think it's not.

In what way? If you're thinking along the lines of "Christianity has a spiritual belief system, and Scientology has a spiritual belief system", then they can be contrasted. If you believe that "the authors of the bible and L. Ron Hubbard pulled all that religious crap out of their asses", then you're entitled to that opinion. However, the doctrines of Christianity and Scientology are completely different.
No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.
 
Halcyon
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:47 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 9:34 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 56):
Ironic most of them are pro life too. 'Oh the fetuses are innocent' Yeah sure You either believe that man has the 'right' to take the life of another or you don't; this innocense redflag is the biggest discredit to religion PERIOD.

Well, you don't come across too many infants that are also murderers do you Ted? The fact that you just compared the two is very sad...there's a huge difference...
I believe that man has the right to preserve the life of the innocents, Ted, and if that involves putting down a foul beast who has no qualms with slaying little children, then so be it. That's the difference in how we think.
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 10:03 am

Quoting Halcyon (Reply 59):
The fact that you just compared the two is very sad

Just like your answer.

Literally speaking what is an abortion?
Literally speaking what does a executioner do to the condemed?

The only diference is the CIRCUMSTANCE of the two, and the 'belief' that one is 'alive'.

I would say they are inequal because I don't believe that one is alive, but you don't get that EXCUSE. You believe both are alive so literally what is happening is that one person is causing the other's death. The scenery and the rationale is background.

I'm pro death period, don't like it, don't die.
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bezoar
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RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 10:41 am

Ted, by your simplistic definition it would appear that our troops in Iraq and our local police would be in the same boat as the abortionists and murderers. I would presume that all of who condone our military and the police using deadly force would be considered to be accessories to the crime.

But, wait! Being 'pro-death,' it's all acceptable! Is this what you are saying?

If so, it shows very how limited the secular humanistic worldview is on dealing with moral issues. Such thinking, which deems God unnecessary, virtually eliminates the value of an individual human life, as life ultimately has no meaning - except what you make it, of course. One can only muster up relative truths, creating an atmosphere of tolerance so extreme that there is decay of the social fabric. Any morality is corrupted from the outset, and deteriorates from there.

Just my opinion.
"There are none so blind as those who will not see."
 
LY744
Posts: 5185
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2001 11:55 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:04 am

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 50):
But unless you have some information that nobody else possesses, you can't know from any scientific study that the universe was not indeed created.

Where did I say it wasn't?

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 50):
The Bible was written by 60 individuals over a period of several centuries

Sure was.

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 50):
yet is incredibly consistent in pointing to Christ in Genesis, and revealing Him in the Gospels.

I guess those writers could also read what their predecessor wrote. Good for them. I wish people on these boards would pay attention like that.

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 50):
The prophecies of the Bible and historical documentation have made it one of the most, if not the most, scrutinized collection of writings in the history of mankind. People have desperately sought to find justification to find it invalid, but they have failed.

Those two sentences right there are so loaded with subjectivity they would make an advertising executive blush.

Quoting Iamcanadian (Reply 51):
WHY do you think it's not? What about Christianity is so similar to Scientology?

Why don't you answer my questions?

And oh yeah, by the way, I've taken a class or two in university as well. Some of them might have had a thing or two to do with religion/God/philosophy/existence/whatever. I have also cracked the bible open on a few occasions. Coincidentaly I've read some science fiction books as well.

Quoting TheCol (Reply 58):
However, the doctrines of Christianity and Scientology are completely different.

Don't matter to me. I want to know why Christians in this thread think they are better/"righter" than Scientologists. Why is it more probably for a "good Christian" to die and go to heaven, than for a good Scientologist to end up on a spaceship that will take them to some paradise planet (I have no idea if the latter is actually part of their beliefs but you get the point)?


LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
TACAA320
Posts: 7153
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 3:03 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:07 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 56):

Or the people who created him were insane.

He was not "created", "...begotten, not made, being of one substance with the Father by whom all things were made..."
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:08 am

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 61):
how limited the secular humanistic worldview

Limited? How is it that considering we might have come from somewhere other then Adam and Eve "limited"? I think God gave us brains to THINK, not to stick our noses into a book and listen endlessly to preachers who take our money for nothing.

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 61):
dealing with moral issues

Morals Imply judgement as in passing judgment on others. I'll stick to ETHICS which is using your head to do the right thing.

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 61):
which deems God unnecessary

I never said God was un-necessary, just the books, the false preachers and all the money.

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 61):
life ultimately has no meaning - except what you make it

Absolutely true.
If you spend your whole life doing good things to get into heaven are you doing the good things in your life to get to heaven or are you doing them because you believe they are right? Don't say both, because I'll have to raise the red flag.

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 61):
Any morality is corrupted from the outset, and deteriorates from there.

Societies come and go. One of the reasons I don't believe in heaven and eternal reward is the almost irrefutable proof that everything in the universe has a cylical nature to it. People are born, people die. The sun rises, the sun sets. The seasons come and go. Planets are born and planets die with their Suns.

Heaven is a boring idea. Eternal life ever after is boring.
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bezoar
Posts: 746
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2001 4:47 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:25 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 64):
Absolutely true.

No, in your world there would only be relative truths. You don't get absolute anything.
"There are none so blind as those who will not see."
 
Halcyon
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:47 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:49 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 60):

I would say they are inequal because I don't believe that one is alive, but you don't get that EXCUSE. You believe both are alive so literally what is happening is that one person is causing the other's death. The scenery and the rationale is background.

Well, there is a point where you can use words to explain around anything, even if it does not make sense. It seems that we've reached that with each other. You see, I think that a baby is a person; since it can't talk or survive on its own, you don't care about it? I don't know. But I know a baby is better than a murderer.
 
Halcyon
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:47 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:51 am

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 65):
No, in your world there would only be relative truths. You don't get absolute anything.

 checkmark 

And that's where the baby/murderer/rapist all gets confused.
 
TACAA320
Posts: 7153
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 3:03 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 12:02 pm

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 63):
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
iamcanadian
Topic Author
Posts: 704
Joined: Wed May 30, 2001 6:53 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 1:56 pm

Quoting LY744 (Reply 62):
Why don't you answer my questions?

And oh yeah, by the way, I've taken a class or two in university as well. Some of them might have had a thing or two to do with religion/God/philosophy/existence/whatever. I have also cracked the bible open on a few occasions. Coincidentaly I've read some science fiction books as well.

You want me to answer your questions? Okay...

Quoting LY744 (Reply 29):
So if a Scientologist believes in his religion just as hard as you believe in yours, how is he wrong and you're right?

I'm not one to say who's "wrong" and who's "right". To each his own. Like I said, I never said either one was more "right". I believe what I believe, others believe what THEY believe.

Quoting LY744 (Reply 34):
Why is Christianity apples and Scientology oranges? How are they really different?

I have stated this MANY times. Their foundations are COMPLETELY different. The basis of the teachings are COMPLETELY different.

Quoting LY744 (Reply 45):
Tell me, why are you a Christian?

I have lived in a Christian home my entire life. I grew up going to Sunday school, and going to Catholic schools up until the end of High School. I've gone to Christian summer camps and retreats, and have been involved in a Christian life group for 6 years. I find peace and comfort in God, and I live a much happier life knowing that I was created for a reason and that God has a purpose and direction for my life.

Quoting LY744 (Reply 45):
Why aren't you a Buddhist, a Muslim, or whatever?

Like I said, I grew up in a Christian home. Christianity was all I was ever exposed to.

Quoting LY744 (Reply 45):
Have those not been around the sufficient number of years to qualify to be your religion of choice?

See above.

Are those answers sufficient enough? I don't know WHAT you want me to say. Now answer me this again:

Why do you think Christianity and Scientology are the same?
Shut up and calculate.
 
bezoar
Posts: 746
Joined: Sun Nov 04, 2001 4:47 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:19 pm

"Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion" - L. Ron Hubbard

Though the Church of Scientology claimed to be compatible with all religions and not a religion itself, Hubbard himself was an atheist. In fact, he reportedly said Scientology and Christianity were incompatible.

Some interesting clips of Hubbard speaking: http://www.sweenytod.com/cos/Sounds/index.html

Contrast that with:

"The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one. Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.' The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.' There is no commandment greater than these." - Mark 12:29-31
"There are none so blind as those who will not see."
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 8:52 pm

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 65):
No, in your world there would only be relative truths. You don't get absolute anything.

Ok, wrong word.. I meant fact, the 'truth' is something reserved for those who believe there is such a thing.

Quoting Halcyon (Reply 67):
And that's where the baby/murderer/rapist all gets confused.

I think you are confusing the circumstance with the literal acts. Sure If I had to choose between watching a murder like Couey die a miserable death and a viable fetus I'll kill Couey in the most tortuous way possible every time I got to make that choice. But that's not what we are talking about. We are talking about the fact our society allows for and does both; of which I agree with. 300 Million in the US is PLENTY. 6+ billion on the planet is TOO MUCH. Time to thin the heard.

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 70):
"Writing for a penny a word is ridiculous. If a man really wants to make a million dollars, the best way would be to start his own religion" - L. Ron Hubbard

 rotfl  rotfl  rotfl  rotfl 


Oh and by the way, I don't think anyone ever really answered:

Quoting Iamcanadian (Thread starter):
Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Religion talks about things that ALLEGEDLY happened 2000+ years ago and is almost complete fiction.
Science Fiction USUALLY talks about something that will likely never happen, but if it does, will be 2,000 years from now and is based on something in the realm of possibly true (unless your talking about a galaxy far, far away).
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UALPHLCS
Posts: 3232
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2001 5:50 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:07 pm

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 56):
Based on what? Can you name one document, carving, etching or other form of communication from 2000 years ago that proves Jesus was alive?

Yes, there is actually alot but the most common and publicized is the Jewish-Roman Historian Josephus. He wrote a history of Judea in an attempt to explain the Jewish revolt in 77 AD. Only one Gospel is as old as Josephus' History.

In addition as I said the Bible itself CAN be used as a historical document if you do it carefully. Specifically the Gospel according to Luke and Acts of the Apostles. Luke takes great pains to fix Jesus' like in the context of the Roman world. Coupled with Roman documents and history you can fix when Jesus was around.
A little less Hooah, and a little more Dooah.
 
Halcyon
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:47 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Mon Mar 19, 2007 11:13 pm

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 71):
6+ billion on the planet is TOO MUCH. Time to thin the heard.

You've been in big cities way too long Ted. Big grin Come to Montana some time.
 
andessmf
Posts: 5689
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:53 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Tue Mar 20, 2007 12:16 am

Quoting UALPHLCS (Reply 42):
But so long as the Society meets the needs of the majority of the population, they won't be looking for a new message so new messages will only relate to a few.

Society has always followed a certain message, sometimes these 'messages' are religious, sometimes political, sometimes other. But they all follow the same template. Some people take their political identity and try to 'convert' many to their viewpoint, by any means necessary. Witness communism, or even the environmental movement. Witness global warming, where it is not hard to find stories about changing our 'wicked' ways before we are all destroyed.

Quoting Bezoar (Reply 70):
Hubbard himself was an atheist. In fact, he reportedly said Scientology and Christianity were incompatible.

A little research would have shown you this:

The basic command followed by all life, "Survive!" is subdivided into eight dynamics (dynamic meaning urge, drive or impulse). All activities in one's varied life can be inspected, understood and harmonized with all others to increase survival.

8th Dynamic INFINITY, also commonly called God, the Supreme Being or Creator.
http://www.scientology.org/en_US/religion/presentation/pg009.html

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 71):
6+ billion on the planet is TOO MUCH

I always give the example from Ebenezer Scrooge is 'Ac Christmas Carol' , were the phrase 'decrease the surplus population' is used. It obviously was not really a problem 150 years ago, and it is still to be determined today. Ask any European here what measures their governments are taking now to provide incentives for their population to have children.
 
UALPHLCS
Posts: 3232
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2001 5:50 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Tue Mar 20, 2007 12:57 am

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 74):
Society has always followed a certain message, sometimes these 'messages' are religious, sometimes political, sometimes other. But they all follow the same template. Some people take their political identity and try to 'convert' many to their viewpoint, by any means necessary. Witness communism, or even the environmental movement. Witness global warming, where it is not hard to find stories about changing our 'wicked' ways before we are all destroyed.

True. Your point is well taken. Only since the Enlightenment have we divorced religion completely from politics. (Not that this is a bad thing) But what is missed by many who are antagonistic toward religion is that for most of humanity Society needed religion, society was religion.

Many people today who claim not to be religious turn secular political issues into religion. As you say witness the Environmental Movement, or Communism.

People need to have faith in something. It appears hardwired into our psyche. WHAT people believe IN depends very much on how the belief system satisfies the individuals needs. Atheists don't believe in God (what do they scream during orgasm I always wondered) but they DO supplant one belief system with another. Faith in Science and technology maybe.

What I have a problem with are people who don't get this fundamental truth. People need to have faith in something. WHAT people believe IN depends very much on how the belief system satisfies the individuals needs.

If you understand this if your a Fundamentalist Christian or a died in the wool atheist, you will respect the others point of view. The system of belief the other has is right for them.

The only thing I think is wrong with religion is when they teach that their way is the ONLY way. Mature religions like Catholicism, Most Protestant sects, Judaism, Buddism, don't teach that their way is any better than any other way. Pope John Paul II was very on point with this message. It is not a message you hear coming very loudly from Islam and some other religions. And all of these faiths have their extremists, Christian, Jew, Muslim and Hindu so don't think I'm making blanket statements.

On the other hand, you have agnostics and atheists who scoff and put down organized religion for its intolerance with the same intolerance they object to in the religious.

Quoting Disruptivehair (Reply 4):
To me, all religions are equally ridiculous.



Quoting LogansGirl (Reply 33):
mythology of Christianity

In the end I think it's important to understand what the role of religion is in society even if you don't prescribe to one, because it allows you to respect those that do and gives you the self awareness to realize that even the atheist has a belief system.
A little less Hooah, and a little more Dooah.
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Tue Mar 20, 2007 1:55 am

Quoting Halcyon (Reply 73):
Come to Montana some time.

I Love Montana. If I could last longer then a week there I would do so gladly.

PS Can I change my last name to Kazinski?  Wink

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 74):
It obviously was not really a problem 150 years ago, and it is still to be determined today

150 years ago everyone in the US could fit into a manhattan appartment on the west side.... ok, maybe not... but you didn't need much more then the original 13 colonies to get people enough space. Sure the Industrial revolution was begining and there were people living in horrible conditions on top of eachother, but if they wanted space the country was out there.

Quoting AndesSMF (Reply 74):
European here what measures their governments are taking now to provide incentives for their population to have children.

Yeah, instead of taking the measures to keep people in the country or inviting foreign investment they up taxes and drive out the working class, then realize that 'opps' we needed those people. Well they aint there and they aint comming. Too bad so sad. The US is making this mistake too, it's going to be tragic.
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Halcyon
Posts: 1622
Joined: Sat Jul 15, 2006 4:47 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:07 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 76):

I Love Montana. If I could last longer then a week there I would do so gladly.

Oh heavens Ted, I will feed you. Well...as long as you don't go changing your last name like that.  Wink

Lucas
 
TedTAce
Posts: 9098
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 12:31 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:39 am

Quoting Halcyon (Reply 77):
Oh heavens Ted, I will feed you.

Thanks, I appreciate the offer Big grin
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LY744
Posts: 5185
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2001 11:55 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Tue Mar 20, 2007 2:58 am

Quoting Iamcanadian (Reply 69):
Like I said, I grew up in a Christian home. Christianity was all I was ever exposed to.



Quoting Iamcanadian (Reply 69):
Are those answers sufficient enough?

Yep, that's all I wanted to hear.


LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
iamcanadian
Topic Author
Posts: 704
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RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:06 am

Quoting LY744 (Reply 79):
Yep, that's all I wanted to hear.

Good. Now would you care to answer my question now?

Thanks in advance.
Shut up and calculate.
 
aa757first
Posts: 3140
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2003 11:40 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Wed Mar 21, 2007 5:40 am

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 9):
EVERY Christian I have TRIED to learn from positively has at one time or another made the statment 'do as I say not as I do'.

Not good, but it is hard to follow all of the commandments and Church directives. For example, if you yelled at your kid for gunning it through a yellow light, wouldn't you be telling him/her "do as I say, not as a I do." (Assuming you have done that at one point or another.)

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 9):
If All Christians turned around tomorrow and said they were sorry, would give up their witch hunts against homosexuality and forget about bombing abortion clinics then I might start to think they are for real.

All Christians? That's a pretty broad generalization. I, personally, don't have anything to apologize for because I haven't done those things. Nor have any of the (many) Christians that I know.

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 36):

So why do so many Christians support the death penalty?

The Catholic Church is against the death penalty. Of course, people don't (usually) base their viewpoints solely around their faith. Since most Americans support the death penalty, its reasonable to assume that most Americans following Christianity will support the death penalty.

Quoting TedTAce (Reply 64):
Absolutely true.
If you spend your whole life doing good things to get into heaven are you doing the good things in your life to get to heaven or are you doing them because you believe they are right? Don't say both, because I'll have to raise the red flag.

Well you have to raise the red flag for me because I just don't understand what you're getting at. Isn't it possible to do both? Couldn't a person move to the developing world and run a homeless shelter, both because they believe it is right in both a secular and religious sense?
 
lehpron
Posts: 6846
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 3:42 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Wed Mar 21, 2007 6:57 am

Quoting Iamcanadian (Thread starter):
Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Question for people who hold this and the opposing view: If you have an opinion, why assume it to be obvious to everyone else? While you don't have to explain yourself, you are responsible for assuming we can read your mind.
The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
 
LY744
Posts: 5185
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2001 11:55 pm

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:03 am

Quoting Iamcanadian (Reply 80):
Now would you care to answer my question now?

"How is scientology and Christianity similar?" I presume. Here's how: if your parents were scientology followers you'd be in here discrediting Christianity right now.


LY744.
Pacifism only works if EVERYBODY practices it
 
andessmf
Posts: 5689
Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2006 8:53 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:11 am

Quoting LY744 (Reply 83):
Here's how: if your parents were scientology followers you'd be in here discrediting Christianity right now.

IIRC, Tom Cruise's mom is a practicing Catholic and a practicing Scientologist as well.
 
iamcanadian
Topic Author
Posts: 704
Joined: Wed May 30, 2001 6:53 am

RE: Religion, Science Fiction- One And The Same?

Wed Mar 21, 2007 8:07 pm

Quoting LY744 (Reply 83):
Here's how: if your parents were scientology followers you'd be in here discrediting Christianity right now.

I didn't ask "What makes Scientology 'as true' as Christianity?". I mean on a purely objective approach, side-by-side, how are Christianity and Scientology similar? How are their values similar? How are their teachings similar? How are the basis of faith similar?

If you want to talk about "Why do people believe in religion X instead of religion Y", that's a completely different topic. We are not talking about that. We are talking about the validity of more-or-less *equating* Christianity and Scientology, as per the article.
Shut up and calculate.

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