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jetjack74
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Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Tue May 01, 2007 11:38 pm

LOS ANGELES — With millions of illegal immigrants planning to demand a path to citizenship by marching through the nation's streets on Tuesday, Los Angeles and other major cities are bracing for rally gridlock.

Demonstrators hope the marches will push Congress to answer their calls for action for an estimated 12 million illegal immigrants currently living in the United States before the presidential primary season.

Cities from coast to coast were preparing for the marches and voter registration drives stretching from California to New York on the May 1 International Workers' Day.

Have a great commute, especially for those in San Francisco. This will surely add to the pleasure of commuting into the city.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,269356,00.html
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futurecaptain
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:36 am

ILLEGAL being the main word. I hope we do not make them citizens, come here after following our immigration laws and then we'll talk.
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Derico
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:43 am

Quoting Jetjack74 (Thread starter):
Have a great commute, especially for those in San Francisco



For every 1 protest where streets are blocked in any country on this planet, there were 10 already that took place in Argentina, so the rest of the world shouldn't expect any sympathy from us.  headache 
My internet was not shut down, the internet has shut me down
 
CastleIsland
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:46 am

I think it's great that illegal immigrants are marching. Just keep marching back to your native country, and if you'd like, next time come here legally.
"People don't do what they believe in, they just do what's most convenient, then they repent." - Dylan
 
Superfly
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:47 am

Quoting Jetjack74 (Thread starter):
Have a great commute, especially for those in San Francisco.

Got to work this morning without any interruption.  wave 
The protest will not hurt underground subways.
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futureualpilot
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:48 am

They come here ilegally and demand citizenship? Surely you can't be serious! To me, this would be like a car theif asking for the keys before he steals the car. I don't even know where to begin with this. If they are so unhappy, then leave, or go back and return legally.

[Edited 2007-05-01 18:05:10]
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JAL777
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:55 am

Its great that illegal immigrants will all congregate in one area on one day - makes the job for the Immigration Officers so much easier to send them back.  Angry
 
MaverickM11
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 1:02 am

Quoting Jetjack74 (Thread starter):
Demonstrators hope the marches will push Congress to answer their calls for action for an estimated 12 million illegal immigrants currently living in the United States before the presidential primary season.

I agree, I hope they do push Congress to answer their calls for action....hopefully either sending them back and/or compensating the US for their expenses. Silly
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Charles79
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 1:36 am

This whole immigration issue is getting ridiculous. I understand why folks want to leave their native countries in search of a better life. I don't blame them, I would probably do the same thing if I were in their position. My issue is with our own government and the government in Mexico. The border should be closed, period, and if you want to come over to this country we will welcome you as long as you do it legally. It's interesting that a few months ago my mum watched a special on TV where they discussed how Mexican authorities treat illegals into their own country...no mercy whatsoever, turn around and go back to where you came from. Why should we tolerate it then?

I acknowledge that this country was built on immigration, and only a fool would downplay the contributions that immigrants have made in our history. But right now we have bigger social issues of our own and cannot continue to receive folks here looking for shelter. Again, I'm not that upset with the immigrants themselves, but with our government.

Cheers

Charles
 
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jetjack74
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 1:51 am

I think we've found a good use for the A380, transport illegal aliens back to their homeland. Use taxpayer money to purchase them for the INS and have daily service from Chicago, Los Angeles, New York, Houston, San Francisco, San Diego, Dallas and San Antonio to Mexico City and drop them off there.
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aloges
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 2:20 am

It still strikes me as unbelievable that a country that has for so much time depended on the immigration of the "huddled masses yearning to breathe free" is unwilling to find a way to let them immigrate honourably, for the better of everyone... but I guess illegal immigrants are just too easy to exploit. Some very similar events are happening in the EU, but to a much lesser extent plus we've only recently turned to an attractive place to immigrate to, with the Cold War over and all. It's a bloody shame our politicians let themselves be lobbied into putting economic benefit over the dignity of immigrants.

Quoting Charles79 (Reply 8):
we have bigger social issues of our own and cannot continue to receive folks here looking for shelter.

The thing is, they're looking for work, not just for shelter. They don't exactly seek asylum, do they?

[Edited 2007-05-01 19:23:08]
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ATCGOD
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 2:24 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 10):
It still strikes me as unbelievable that a country that has for so much time depended on the immigration of the "huddled masses yearning to breathe free" is unwilling to find a way to let them immigrate honourably, for the better of everyone... but I guess illegal immigrants are just too easy to exploit.

I have no problem with people immigrating to the US for a better life. But there's a LEGAL way to do it and these people that are here illegally are demanding something they haven't earned.
 
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jetjack74
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 2:30 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 10):
is unwilling to find a way to let them immigrate honourably, for the better of everyone... but I guess illegal immigrants are just too easy to exploit. Some very similar events are happening in the EU, but to a much lesser extent plus we've only recently turned to an attractive place to immigrate to, with the Cold War over and all. It's a bloody shame our politicians let themselves be lobbied into putting economic benefit over the dignity of immigrants.

A society without law is a society in chaos. An honourable way to immigrate them in to the US is for them to go through the legal immigration process, just like anyone else. It's our laws, they should respect it, and not wipe their asses with it.

Quoting ATCGOD (Reply 11):
I have no problem with people immigrating to the US for a better life. But there's a LEGAL way to do it and these people that are here illegally are demanding something they haven't earned.

 checkmark Damn right.
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aloges
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 2:32 am

Quoting ATCGOD (Reply 11):
But there's a LEGAL way to do it

A legal, long-winded and extremely costly way in many, many cases AFAIK. For someone hardly able to pay for a tourist visa, that's as much demotivation as it needs to forbid the legal way. The way I see it, the immigrants want to go to the US, their US employers want them and the US government has a responsibility for the well-being of all in the country. Why not pass an immigration reform that would facilitate the immigration of workers? It would give everyone more stability and would put a lot of exploited currently illegal immigrants out of their misery. The only ones bound to lose some money are those employers who exploit, the others already paying fair(ish) wages would face little difficulty.

DISCLAIMER so as not to hurt anyone's feelings: you can still substitute "EU" for "US", as said above

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 12):
A society without law is a society in chaos.

You don't end up in chaos because Hernando Gonzalez from Monterrey, living in Albuquerque, lacks documentation. You'd end up in chaos though if e.g. an army of fully-legal John Does decided to march on Washington and were successful. Bottom line: you don't have to fear illegal immigrants.

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 12):
It's our laws, they should respect it, and not wipe their asses with it.

Safe for the immigration bit, I'd guess illegal immigrants are among the most law-abiding citizens of all - simply because they need to do everything to stay under the radar.

[Edited 2007-05-01 19:37:17]
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CastleIsland
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 2:42 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
US government has a responsibility for the well-being of all in the country.

The US Government has a responsibility for it's citizens and those others who are here legally.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
Why not pass an immigration reform that would facilitate the immigration of workers?

Not at all unreasonable, but our "leaders" seem incapable of agree to provisions of said reform.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
I'd guess illegal immigrants are among the most law-abiding citizens of all

By definition, they are not. They are here illegally and do not pay income taxes either. Other than that, I take your point.
"People don't do what they believe in, they just do what's most convenient, then they repent." - Dylan
 
ATCGOD
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 2:48 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
A legal, long-winded and extremely costly way in many, many cases AFAIK. For someone hardly able to pay for a tourist visa, that's as much demotivation as it needs to forbid the legal way.

I'm not saying it's right, but why would our country want the absolute poorest of Mexico? If you look at immigration laws they all require you to be able to support yourself financially. So why MUST we take them because they found a hole in our fence, or dug a tunnel underneath it? A recent case where I argue against illegal immigration is where an illegal immigrant (with a violent past) crossed our border and killed a Dallas police officer. So why are we putting up with this? A modest fee for application and processing costs (it's not as expensive as you think...a few hundred bucks IIRC), after all, why should the American taxpayer pay for someone who wants the opportunity to be free? They shouldn't, thus, the application fee.
 
aloges
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 3:00 am

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 15):
The US Government has a responsibility for it's citizens and those others who are here legally.

OK, here's where I'm coming from: article one of the German constitution ("Basic Law" in .pdf) reads as follows:

Quote:
Human dignity shall be inviolable. To respect and protect it shall be the duty of all state authority.

Personally, I apply that to any government of any country and assume that somewhere in the laws of every soundly democratic nation, there's a similar passage. I am of course not saying German law should be applied in the US, but you need to know this basic rule, even though it's violated too often, of the country I've grown up and been educated in to understand what I'm rambling on about.

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 15):
They are here illegally and do not pay income taxes either.

not necessarily: story (a random Google find) My point is that many illegal immigrants - notice I didn't say all - certainly do not wish to live in the US illegally, but consider it an evil necessary for a better life and aim to become legal residents some day they can't even foresee.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
MDorBust
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 3:12 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 16):
Human dignity shall be inviolable. To respect and protect it shall be the duty of all state authority.

Does that mean it's the duty of the German government to wipe your butt after you take a dump? To "respect and protect" your dignity after all.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 16):
Personally, I apply that to any government of any country and assume that somewhere in the laws of every soundly democratic nation, there's a similar passage.

And that's where you screwed up. The German constitution doesn't fly over here.

Respect and protect your own dignity over here, the government has nothing to do with it.

Line up the buses. Let them march right on in.
"I KICKED BURNING TERRORIST SO HARD IN BALLS THAT I TORE A TENDON" - Alex McIlveen
 
aloges
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 3:19 am

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 17):
Does that mean it's the duty of the German government to wipe your butt after you take a dump? To "respect and protect" your dignity after all.

Would you mind not ridiculing our constitution? Thank you.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 17):
The German constitution doesn't fly over here.

Would you mind reading my post? Thank you: "I am of course not saying German law should be applied in the US".

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 17):
Respect and protect your own dignity over here, the government has nothing to do with it.

So you're saying it's not your government's duty to protect human dignity?

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 17):
Line up the buses. Let them march right on in.

That's a very, very bad analogy. Suffice to say it reminds me of a "joke" we argued about some time ago which in the end got you banned.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
MDorBust
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 3:24 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):
Would you mind not ridiculing our constitution? Thank you.

Take it as a serious question.

If it's a function of the government to protect your dignity how far does that extend?

Falling down in a puddle of mud is undignified. Is it a neccessary function of the German government to prevent falling in the mud?

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):
Would you mind reading my post? Thank you: "I am of course not saying German law should be applied in the US".

Then why bring it up if you seriously think it's not pertinent or applicable?

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):
So you're saying it's not your government's duty to protect human dignity?

Bingo.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):
That's a very, very bad analogy.

It's not an analogy. Bus transportation is the most common form of deportation.
"I KICKED BURNING TERRORIST SO HARD IN BALLS THAT I TORE A TENDON" - Alex McIlveen
 
ATCGOD
Posts: 520
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 3:28 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 18):

So you're saying it's not your government's duty to protect human dignity?



Quoting MDorBust (Reply 19):
Bingo.

I got to agree with MD here. Being free means you can do what you want, dignified or opposite.
 
aloges
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 3:32 am

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 19):
If it's a function of the government to protect your dignity how far does that extend?

I take it you're not much into abstract concepts? Of course it's not the government's duty to protect me from the ordinary day-to-day mishap, but it is very much the duty of the legislature to pass laws in accordance with that paragraph and that of the government to enforce those laws also in accordance.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 19):
Then why bring it up if you seriously think it's not pertinent or applicable?

again, please read my post: "you need to know this basic rule, even though it's violated too often, of the country I've grown up and been educated in to understand what I'm rambling on about." I've put all these disclaimers and explanations in my posts, which I thought was overdoing it already, just so I have to go back and quote them.

Quoting ATCGOD (Reply 20):
I got to agree with MD here. Being free means you can do what you want, dignified or opposite.

Like you said, do what you want. That doesn't mean you should be subjected to any kind of bs law just because it miraculously found a majority in congress.

[Edited 2007-05-01 20:36:15]
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
MDorBust
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 3:42 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 21):
I take it you're not much into abstract concepts?

I'm what is called a constructionalist over here.

That means I want the constitution enacted as it is written... not with creative interpretations.

So, you'll have to understand that: "Human dignity shall be inviolable. To respect and protect it shall be the duty of all state authority." means exactly what it says to me, not...

Quote:
Of course it's not the government's duty to protect me from the ordinary day-to-day mishap, but it is very much the duty of the legislature to pass laws in accordance with that paragraph and that of the government to enforce those laws also in accordance.

You see, your constitution does in plain language say that protecting human dignity is the duty of government. I don't see anywhere that it makes exceptions for menial breaches of dignity. Nor do I see it anywhere stated that such a breech should only be protected by passing laws.

Here's a question for you.. does "all state authority" only include legislatures and exempt all other members of government who aren't in a position to "pass laws in accordance with that paragraph"?

Quoting Aloges (Reply 21):
again, please read my post:

My question still stands unanswered.

You know the answer and we know the answer. The truth isn't to establish your background as that isn't pertinent either. The truth is you wanted to make German law pertinent to the discussion.
"I KICKED BURNING TERRORIST SO HARD IN BALLS THAT I TORE A TENDON" - Alex McIlveen
 
MaverickM11
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 4:13 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 16):
Personally, I apply that to any government of any country and assume that somewhere in the laws of every soundly democratic nation, there's a similar passage

Does that mean all those Turkish immigrants will be German citizens asap? Wink

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
A legal, long-winded and extremely costly way in many, many cases AFAIK.

But that's the way it is right now. Either we need to enforce our current laws, or loosen them so that they meet our needs. I don't really care either way--what I don't like is having laws on the books that are not enforced, and people illegally coming here and demanding that we do something about them. The latter is entitlement at its absolute most offensive. If we permit that then we might as well send 12 million Americans down to Mexico to demand they improve their economy so as to stem the flow of economic refugees. It'll get us just as far.
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tz757300
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 4:38 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 10):
to find a way to let them immigrate honourably

Maybe they can come in honorably, then we'll talk.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
For someone hardly able to pay for a tourist visa, that's as much demotivation as it needs to forbid the legal way.

Maybe the immigrants country should get some discipline and start trying to correct the ways of its economy so the legal way is more "motivated".
 
Yellowstone
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 4:48 am

Quoting TZ757300 (Reply 24):
Maybe they can come in honorably, then we'll talk.

Risking death, a different society, and deportation so that they can support their families? I'm certainly not a fan of illegal immigration, but the risks illegal immigrants take to feed their children and families show a remarkable degree of familial loyalty that is not without some degree of honor.
Hydrogen is an odorless, colorless gas which, given enough time, turns into people.
 
aloges
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 5:14 am

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 22):
The truth is you wanted to make German law pertinent to the discussion.



Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 23):
Does that mean all those Turkish immigrants will be German citizens asap?

Will you stop putting words in my mouth? I'm getting tired of this bullshit, and fast. I referred to the German constitution out of the reasons I explained in reply 16. If that is not "the truth" you want to hear, then seal your ears, MDorBust because it's the only one you'll hear. Maverick, I mentioned that bit of law specifically because I wanted to explain that in my opinion, it's not only the human dignity of national citizens that a national government should not breach, but the dignity of all those it watches over which includes immigrants, legal or illegal.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 22):
You see, your constitution does in plain language say that protecting human dignity is the duty of government. I don't see anywhere that it makes exceptions for menial breaches of dignity. Nor do I see it anywhere stated that such a breech should only be protected by passing laws.

What does a constitution refer to mostly, the "menial" issues of daily life or the framework of the society that has adopted it?

Good.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 23):
Either we need to enforce our current laws, or loosen them so that they meet our needs.

That is where we agree. The thing is deportation of all illegal immigrants is very near impossible, and definitely impossible with respect to human dignity. The only pragmatic and enforceable solution is a reform of immigration and naturalisation rules, in the US (currently) as much as in Germany (in the foreseeable future). Laws and xenophobia have never been able to stop migration, and they never will - no matter what the xenophobes may dream and propagate.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
Charles79
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 5:17 am

Quoting Yellowstone (Reply 25):
I'm certainly not a fan of illegal immigration, but the risks illegal immigrants take to feed their children and families show a remarkable degree of familial loyalty that is not without some degree of honor.

Those of us that bash illegal immigration are not anti-immigrants at all. I value having different backgrounds and cultures around me, and interacting with different people from different parts of the world. But when folks enter the country illegally, I, as a tax payer and legal citizen, pay for them. How?
1. Children of illegal immigrants are allowed to attend school in most states (if not all). We pay for their education, not a bad thing to do (I love education) but takes away resources from our own kids.
2. Illegal drivers get into car accidents all the time. We end up with higher insurance premiums and expenses they won't be able to cover. Ok, a bit materialistic but still it's money that I earned lawfully.
3. Illegals are exploited by unscrupulous employers who do not want to pay minimum wage or benefits. I disagree with the statement that illegals do the jobs that we Americans don't want to do. The jobs they hold are not real, because the employers do not pay social security, medicare, taxes, etc on them. Besides, the wages they earn barely make their trip here worth it.
4. I could go on and list medical bills, well fare bills, and a myriad other expenses that we have to take care off on their behalf.

Point is, illegal immigration puts a strain on any country. Do we have laws that are too stringent? Perhaps. Could we make it easier to enter legally? Probably. Should we? Maybe we should, who knows if the next immigrant today becomes a great entertainer, or politician, or community leader, or what have you. We have a great country that unfortunately gives foreigners the impression that we don't want them. I see this immigration issue as an opportunity to make constructive changes...if only the politicians were listening!

Cheers
Charles
 
tz757300
Posts: 2741
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:21 am

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 5:20 am

Quoting Charles79 (Reply 27):
Do we have laws that are too stringent? Perhaps.

No, they are too loose

Quoting Charles79 (Reply 27):
Should we?

Hell no.

Quoting Charles79 (Reply 27):
Maybe we should, who knows if the next immigrant today becomes a great entertainer, or politician, or community leader, or what have you.

Or the next terrorist?

Quoting Charles79 (Reply 27):
We have a great country that unfortunately gives foreigners the impression that we don't want them.

If people are naive enough to get the impression that we don't want them...too bad.
 
Blackbird
Posts: 3384
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 5:33 am

I'm not anti-immigrant, I'm just anti-ILLEGAL immigrant.

Andrea Kent
 
MDorBust
Posts: 4914
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 6:00 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 26):
What does a constitution refer to mostly, the "menial" issues of daily life or the framework of the society that has adopted it?

Well, let's examine the constitution that is actually pertinent to this issue, that of the United States. Do you think that my freedom of speech and my right to bear arms are issues of daily life or measures of a nebulous framework of society? My rights to peaceable assemble, and to privacy? The prohibition of slavery and the right to vote? Are these just frameworks for society. No, not in the least. These are rules that protect us every day of our lives, while we are doing the "menial" things.

This is a typical  redflag  tactic from you Aloges. You came in here with something completely irrelevant to the matter, tried really damn hard to get offended by something that didn't mean what you wanted it too, and now have your panties in a wad because we won't play your Germany tangent. Too bad. It's completely irrelevant. It doesn't matter if your background is the German constitution any more than it matters that mine is the Japanese, German and US constitutions. Should UK posters be bopping in here telling us about the UK?

Nope, no way, nuh uh.

This is about an issue of illegal immigration in the US. There's only one government and one set of rules that matters here.

You want to make the German rules pertinent, we have twelve million illegal immigrants for you to take off our hands.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 26):
it's not only the human dignity of national citizens that a national government should not breach, but the dignity of all those it watches over which includes immigrants, legal or illegal.

And now for the point of view that matters on this issue. The American point of view. Our government isn't supposed to watch over illegal aliens. It's supposed to put them on the first bus leaving the country.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 26):
The thing is deportation of all illegal immigrants is very near impossible, and definitely impossible with respect to human dignity.

That's a two part statement:

1) It's very possible, we do it every day.
2) Human dignity - Irrelevant.

Wait. Weren't you just trying to say that it wasn't true that you were trying to make German law pertinent? Then WTF is that bit about Human Dignity doing in there? Kimosabe say Algoes speak with forked tongue.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 26):
no matter what the xenophobes may dream and propagate.

Ah yes, we want to enforce the laws of our nation so we are xenophobes... brilliant  sarcastic 
"I KICKED BURNING TERRORIST SO HARD IN BALLS THAT I TORE A TENDON" - Alex McIlveen
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18717
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 6:11 am

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 30):
1) It's very possible, we do it every day.

How do you deport 12 million people?
I don't take responsibility at all
 
MDorBust
Posts: 4914
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 6:12 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 31):
How do you deport 12 million people?



Quoting MDorBust (Reply 17):
Line up the buses.
"I KICKED BURNING TERRORIST SO HARD IN BALLS THAT I TORE A TENDON" - Alex McIlveen
 
tz757300
Posts: 2741
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 6:20 am

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 32):

Right on, Right on
 
LAXspotter
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 6:33 am

What is the rationale of these illegal immigrants? I immigrated to the United States, albeit it legally. However i do not concur with the people who are marching, they came here illegally which makes then criminals, what says that causing them to commit a crime the minute they entered this country is going to prohibit them from committing other crimes in the future? The fact that they dont have documentation makes it easier for people like those to commit and a crime and feel free to go back wherever they came from which having to face the consequences. The only real solution is see is deportation of the illegals back to their native lands, what sickens me is the fact they have the audacity to wave the flags of their countries of origin. What has that country given them except for economic starvation and hardship whereas this country has given them a chance to earn money and life a rather comfortable life. It makes me so angry to see the flags of foreign countries being waved in the USA.
"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
 
Boeinglover24
Posts: 293
Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2006 8:35 am

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 6:35 am

Quoting Superfly (Reply 4):
Got to work this morning without any interruption. wave
The protest will not hurt underground subways.

HA! every thought about how the protesters are going to get there since they're not allowed to have drivers licenses : )

Seriously though
Being able to come to these great United States is not a right it's a privilege.
You have your country we have ours, and if we don't want you crowding our schools and hospitals and 7/11s : ) not being able to speak our language, it's completely up to us.
I know most of you come here with good intentions, providing good living for your family etc. But guess what millions of others are out there and in bad and a lot of times worse situations than yours in their home countries willing to wait, and do it legally. Show some respect for our laws and in a way to us! You are not our responsibility, talk to your government maybe they can help, dysfunctional guess what? life's unfair! tough luck! I know I sound mean but really there are hundreds of millions if not billions of people living in poverty conditions we can't take in all of them!
I am tired of walking in my local convenient store and seeing some of these people [granted a small percentage] smoking with their shirts off crowding the place sometimes with alcohol, and whenever I park crowding my car thinking I'm looking for 'laborers'.

Just my 2 cents : )
Uhhh What?
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18717
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 7:11 am

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 32):
Quoting MDorBust (Reply 17):
Line up the buses.

And how do you backfill the work they were doing, and soften the blow of the skyrocketing prices that may cause?
I don't take responsibility at all
 
BMIFlyer
Posts: 8064
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 7:11 am

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 7:14 am

Quoting JAL777 (Reply 6):
Its great that illegal immigrants will all congregate in one area on one day - makes the job for the Immigration Officers so much easier to send them back.

My thoughts entirely.

Plenty of space in the Nevada desert for a temporary detention center  Wink



Lee
Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
 
MDorBust
Posts: 4914
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:10 pm

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 7:18 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 36):
And how do you backfill the work they were doing,

1) Since I'm already on the board for putting the management of companies knowingly employing illegal aliens in jail, there won't be any work to back fill as these companies will cease to exist.

2) Snarky comment about complaints about unemployment rates.

3) Welfare recipients. It's time to start getting something for our money.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 36):
and soften the blow of the skyrocketing prices that may cause?

And this won't happen under programs to legalize them, thereby mandating they be paid at least minimum wages?

Something to ponder: Are you seriously defending allowing illegal immigrants to stay based on an apparent need to abuse them by paying them substandard wages?
"I KICKED BURNING TERRORIST SO HARD IN BALLS THAT I TORE A TENDON" - Alex McIlveen
 
aloges
Posts: 14807
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 8:48 am

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 30):
This is a typical  redflag  tactic from you Aloges.

You put words in my mouth and claim to know what I'm thinking again, same as I recall from an earlier thread, yet I'm the one with "bullshit tactics"; since we all know what that little red flag means? Yeah, right.  sarcastic 

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 30):
You came in here with something completely irrelevant to the matter,

I came in here with this:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 10):
It still strikes me as unbelievable that a country that has for so much time depended on the immigration of the "huddled masses yearning to breathe free" is unwilling to find a way to let them immigrate honourably, for the better of everyone.

"Completely irrelevant" to the matter? I thought this place was for discussing opinions. That was my opinion and I added that we in the EU are facing similar, albeit smaller problems so as not to offend US members... even thought the thread has nothing at all to do with illegal immigration into the EU. Curious how using German law to explain myself is condemnable, yet bringing EU problems into an unrelated thread doesn't even raise an eyebrow, isn't it? It seems like someone

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 30):
tried really damn hard to get offended by something that didn't mean what [he] wanted it too [sic]

As for myself, I'm offended? What do you know.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 30):
and now have your panties in a wad because we won't play your Germany tangent

I wear shorts, but thanks for worrying about the state of my clothing.  sarcastic 

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 30):
You want to make the German rules pertinent

The hell I want. As I've explained numerous times, first one right when I made the reference to German law, I made that reference because I wanted to explain why I was saying what I was saying. I also made clear, in the very same reply, that I was "of course not saying German law should be applied in the US". But, as I also said earlier:

Quoting Aloges (Reply 26):
If that is not "the truth" you want to hear, then seal your ears, MDorBust because it's the only one you'll hear.

That's all, really, that I have to add. If you hate my opinion, then there's no merit in discussing it or further explaining myself.
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
Blackbird
Posts: 3384
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 9:17 am

I think what these people are trying to say is this: "There are twelve million of us, you can't stop us all" therefore "you have to do what we want" which is "make us legal immigrants" -- These are not *my* views, these are simply the views that I perceive these people to have.

On a dark note: I wonder if this is somehow orchestrated by elements in our administration. Think about it. There was a law passed which would make it easier for the President to declare martial-law, if I recall, by modifying the Insurrection Act. The law also allowed the President to take direct control over the National Guard Units with greater ease.

While the National Guard units are largely in Iraq, there still is room for a manipulative President to declare Martial-Law.

With Martial-Law declared, the President could pretty much do whatever he wants. Our country is not a police state, but if Martial Law was declared it sure as hell could be!


Andrea Kent
 
tsaord
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 9:40 am

Quoting ATCGOD (Reply 11):
I have no problem with people immigrating to the US for a better life. But there's a LEGAL way to do it and these people that are here illegally are demanding something they haven't earned.

Exactly.

I hope our government acts accordingly as well as my representatives in Chicago and IL. I will not be voting for anyone soft on immigration. I do not understand why people sneak in and expect to just get a free ride. I know people are desperate but Its not the right way.
there are icons, then there are legends, then there is rick flair
 
MDorBust
Posts: 4914
Joined: Fri Sep 30, 2005 10:10 pm

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 9:56 am

Quoting Aloges (Reply 39):
I came in here with this:

That's not what I was talking about and everyone here knows it. More  redflag 

Quoting Aloges (Reply 39):
As for myself, I'm offended? What do you know.

You weren't offended?

What's this then: "That's a very, very bad analogy. Suffice to say it reminds me of a "joke" we argued about some time ago which in the end got you banned." -Aloges

Perhaps just an Emo streak?

Quoting Aloges (Reply 39):
I also made clear, in the very same reply, that I was "of course not saying German law should be applied in the US".



Quoting Aloges (Reply 26):
The thing is deportation of all illegal immigrants is very near impossible, and definitely impossible with respect to human dignity

For some reason... these two quotes just don't match up...

I'll make a deal with you. When we have a thread on German immigration problems I'll discuss it in the framework of German law and German social standards. In the mean time, why don't you try and reciprocate?
"I KICKED BURNING TERRORIST SO HARD IN BALLS THAT I TORE A TENDON" - Alex McIlveen
 
Charger
Posts: 264
Joined: Mon Oct 16, 2006 11:20 am

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 9:56 am

Quoting CastleIsland (Reply 3):
I think it's great that illegal immigrants are marching. Just keep marching back to your native country,

I agree with you 100%.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 10):
The thing is, they're looking for work, not just for shelter. They don't exactly seek asylum, do they?

Doesn't make a bit of difference. when they cross our borders illegally, they should be immediately be picked up and returned. No ifs, ands, or buts.

Quoting ATCGOD (Reply 11):
I have no problem with people immigrating to the US for a better life. But there's a LEGAL way to do it and these people that are here illegally are demanding something they haven't earned.

I have no problem with legal immigrants. Hell I'm married to one. No one living here illegally is entitled to anything.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
The way I see it, the immigrants want to go to the US, their US employers want them and the US government has a responsibility for the well-being of all in the country.

The US government does not have a responsibility to anyone living here illegally.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 13):
A legal, long-winded and extremely costly way in many, many cases AFAIK

Thats to bad. Life isn't fair at times. They will just have to deal with it. I married a lovely woman from Ireland and somehow we managed to have her immigrate legally.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 26):
The thing is deportation of all illegal immigrants is very near impossible

Yes it will take quite a while but I don't think it's very near impossible.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 26):
and definitely impossible with respect to human dignity.

I don't give a rats ass about their human dignity. They are criminals plain and simple.

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 30):
And now for the point of view that matters on this issue. The American point of view. Our government isn't supposed to watch over illegal aliens. It's supposed to put them on the first bus leaving the country.

Hit the nail right on the head there MDorBust

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 30):
1) It's very possible, we do it every day.
2) Human dignity - Irrelevant.

Nailed it again.
 
andessmf
Posts: 5689
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 10:10 am

As an immigrant who became a US citizen, let me say a few words.

Quoting Aloges (Reply 10):
It still strikes me as unbelievable that a country that has for so much time depended on the immigration of the "huddled masses yearning to breathe free" is unwilling to find a way to let them immigrate honourably, for the better of everyone... but I guess illegal immigrants are just too easy to exploit.

There are plenty of ways for people to immigrate here legally, especially those who work thru the process. I know of several personally. The US still receives plenty of LEGAL immigration every single year. Right now in our office, we have two individuals (out of 25) here in an H-1 visa.

I was talking to my wife today (originally from Mexico, now a US citizen) and she was getting pissed off at the attitude of the immigrants, where by their mere presence here, they expect the same rights that citizens receive. There was even talk at one point of time of allowing illegals to vote!

Here's a chart that shows that the US received almost 500,000 legal residents just last year.

http://www.dhs.gov/xlibrary/assets/s...96_LPRFlowReport_04vaccessible.pdf

In all the talk about illegals, it is forgotten that the US has more than welcomed legal immigration.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 18717
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 10:14 am

Quoting MDorBust (Reply 38):
Are you seriously defending allowing illegal immigrants to stay based on an apparent need to abuse them by paying them substandard wages?

No I just think it's funny that you think the government is capable of doing anything so complex. Moving hundreds of thousands of troops halfway around the world is hard enough, and those people actually signed up to go and the government knows who they are. Now multiply that times 20, put them all in hiding, and give the bleeding heart liberals a head start to slow you down.  Silly
I don't take responsibility at all
 
LAXspotter
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RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 11:47 am

I guess we can agree that theyre criminals, they'll do it again and that is why we need to get rid of them.
"Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel" Samuel Johnson
 
fumanchewd
Posts: 2878
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 7:43 am

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:10 pm

Quoting Aloges (Reply 10):
It still strikes me as unbelievable that a country that has for so much time depended on the immigration of the "huddled masses yearning to breathe free" is unwilling to find a way to let them immigrate honourably, for the better of everyone... but I guess illegal immigrants are just too easy to exploit.

Brilliant idea. We should just let anyone who wants to work here, work here. That will work out great!
In the time of chimpanzees, I was a monkey...
 
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gunsontheroof
Posts: 3712
Joined: Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:30 am

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:26 pm

Quoting Futurecaptain (Reply 1):
ILLEGAL being the main word. I hope we do not make them citizens, come here after following our immigration laws and then we'll talk.

American corporations cross THEIR borders unimpeded on a daily basis in search of cheaper labor sources to exploit and people like you (and I imagine many others in this thread) have the audacity to get angry about your precious birthrights being threatened when they come here looking for something (scarcely) better for themselves than working in a "free trade zone" sweatshop. Hell, all they're doing is answering the corporate call for cheap labor on your side of the border!

Of course, I'm sure you'd stay on your side of the border out of respect for American "birthrights" if you found yourself in their shoes...hungry kids be damned.

Happy May Day to anyone else who's fed up with the exploitation of workers around the world. They're not asking for much.
Picked a hell of a week to quit sniffing glue.
 
tz757300
Posts: 2741
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2005 6:21 am

RE: Immigration Protests Planned Across U.S.

Wed May 02, 2007 12:34 pm

Quoting Gunsontheroof (Reply 48):
hungry kids be damned.

Hungary kids be damned then. If the certain country below us had their shit together, we wouldn't be having this problem and they wouldn't be having their problems either.

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