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ouboy79
Posts: 4115
Joined: Sun Nov 18, 2001 1:48 pm

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 5:54 am

We'll see how polls change with Rudy dropping out, but these are the latest comparrisons for a nationwide election/match ups...

Poll Data is of late last week... http://www.pollingreport.com/wh08gen.htm

McCain - 46%
Clinton - 44%
Undecided - 10%

Huckabee - 41%
Clinton - 50%
Undecided - 9%

Romney - 36%
Clinton - 52%
Undecided - 12%

Giuliani - 37%
Clinton - 52%
Undecided - 11%

McCain - 42%
Obama - 42%
Undecided - 16%

Huckabee - 33%
Obama - 55%
Undecided - 12%

Romney - 35%
Obama - 48%
Undecided - 17%

Giuliani - 34%
Obama - 54%
Undecided - 12%

I think it is somewhat clear...McCain is the most attractive for the Republican ticket - especially being a more moderate candidate than the religious radical that the others sometimes put out. Obama doesn't look back on the Dems side...just not sure the country is ready for him.
 
EvilForce
Posts: 974
Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 4:12 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:00 am

If any of you think Obama is going to being "unity" or have a shot at bringing less divisiveness to Washington you are sorely mistaken.

If you remember back to 1992 when the economy was in the tank, a Bush was in the White House, a young energetic southern governor from a southern state was elected. What happened? Within in a few weeks, the Republican attack / smear machine went into overdrive...and not because Bill Clinton had done anything, but rather they decided to use any tactic possible to discredit a new Democratic President.

Are your memories so short that you've forgotten the bigot, hate monger, "Christian" Jerry Falwell put out the movie claiming had a "hit" arranged on a friend of his, killing him. The Wall Street Journal made up ridiculous accusations that Bill Clinton had ties to a major drug kingpin/smuggler that were as false as the "New Economy" and the resulting Dow 36,000 the WSJ blathered on about non-stop.

Hello Obama fans, have you not been hearing the rumors already starting? Obama's "radical muslim brother undermining the democracy of Kenya?" His ties to dirty money in Chicago? Seriously....you're deluded if you don't think the Swift Boating of Obama won't knock him down CONSIDERABLY.

Who else was elected recently by the electorate that claimed they wanted a "uniter not a divider"? Yeah.... you're dreaming if you don't think Obama will be vivisected by the Republicans.
 
EvilForce
Posts: 974
Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 4:12 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:14 am



Quoting Ouboy79 (Reply 50):
I think it is somewhat clear...McCain is the most attractive for the Republican ticket - especially being a more moderate candidate than the religious radical that the others sometimes put out. Obama doesn't look back on the Dems side...just not sure the country is ready for him.

LOL! Just 6 months ago polls had him dead... as in the grave. The polls you list have just as little meaning and chance of being correct 10 months from now.

For God's sake stop voting for someone you think "can win" because they don't piss people off. Vote for someone who STANDS for something. Vote for someone that you RESPECT and think will get something done. Stop this mealy mouthed, let's vote for this person because they have the best shot of beating _______________. Bush II wasn't elected on that. Nor Bill Clinton. Nor Ronald Reagan.

The minute you buy into the pundit b.s. is the minute you've become a drone and another cog in the machinery. Pundits don't know shyte.
 
rwsea
Posts: 2515
Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 2:23 pm

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:34 am

The USA used to be a progressive place that inspired freedom around the world. Now it's a backwards and oppressive country that is out of step with the rest of the world.

I think Obama or Hillary would send a strong a powerful message that the United States wants to return to our progressive, inspirational roots, and toss out the good ol' boys club that's been pulling us backwards over the better part of the last decade.
 
DfwRevolution
Posts: 9310
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 6:44 am



Quoting Matt727 (Reply 23):
If she becomes the president in November, she will enter a world that has been 100% man dominated for more than two centuries and I think it will be very interesting to see what will happen then.

Prepare to be underwhelmed.

Quoting EvilForce (Reply 52):
LOL! Just 6 months ago polls had him dead... as in the grave. The polls you list have just as little meaning and chance of being correct 10 months from now.

Which polls are those exactly? Looking back at this one, Obama was projected as having 23.5% of the national primary vote six months ago versus 33% now. Obama was never out of it.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epo...es/democratic_primaries_chart.html

Quoting EvilForce (Reply 52):
For God's sake stop voting for someone you think "can win" because they don't piss people off. Vote for someone who STANDS for something. Vote for someone that you RESPECT and think will get something done

It's too bad real people act rationally. Most people who take the time to vote don't want to throw their vote away. Rational people know that their interests and their ideal candidate do not always coincide with the rest of America. So they pick the next best thing; the "electable" candidate who comes closest to their preferences. This is a well established behavior.

Quoting Boeing744 (Reply 44):
This is absolutely right. The US used to be a great, innovative nation which was looked upon for leadership and progress from throughout the world. They are still a great country, but seem to be in something of a "rut". Americans need another president like JFK who can unite the nation and move forward.

This is the kind of statement that shows a cursory perception of U.S. history and politics. Perceptions do not equal reality. If you look at attitudes for specific time periods, you will find that the prevailing attitude is that the United States has been "in a rut" since 1776. JFK was an extremely divisive figure at times. There were full page ads taken in major newspapers accusing him of treason.
 
FriendlySkies
Posts: 3540
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2004 3:57 pm

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 12:30 pm



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 51):
Hello Obama fans, have you not been hearing the rumors already starting? Obama's "radical muslim brother undermining the democracy of Kenya?" His ties to dirty money in Chicago? Seriously....you're deluded if you don't think the Swift Boating of Obama won't knock him down CONSIDERABLY.

Umm...the GOP will do that to ANY Dem candidate. And I'd be willing to bet that Hillary has considerably more dirty laundry than Obama.

You're probably one of the people who thinks Obama's middle name and the fact that he went to a Muslim school for a few years (while living in heavily-Muslim Indonesia) makes him a terrorist.
 
LHStarAlliance
Posts: 2096
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 1:03 pm



Quoting B747forever (Reply 6):
I really hope for Obama

yea Obama , best candidate , maybe Edwards too , but he has no real chance ..

Constantin
 
halls120
Posts: 8724
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 3:24 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 1:12 pm



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 51):
Who else was elected recently by the electorate that claimed they wanted a "uniter not a divider"? Yeah.... you're dreaming if you don't think Obama will be vivisected by the Republicans.

Sadly accurate. No matter who gets elected, the other party will commence search and destroy operations. true bipartisanship in DC is dead.

Quoting LHStarAlliance (Reply 56):
maybe Edwards too , but he has no real chance ..

Edwards has no chance because he's a pretty boy with no substance.
 
EvilForce
Posts: 974
Joined: Fri Jan 12, 2007 4:12 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 1:55 pm



Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 54):
Which polls are those exactly? Looking back at this one, Obama was projected as having 23.5% of the national primary vote six months ago versus 33% now. Obama was never out of it.

Sorry if I wasn't clear. I was talking about McCain.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 54):
It's too bad real people act rationally. Most people who take the time to vote don't want to throw their vote away.

That's what I'm saying. If people vote for the person they think "can win against the other candidate" they are in fact throwing away their vote, as the last 1/2 dozen elections have proven. Kerry was picked because voters "thought he could win against Bush", but he inspired no one. He just had the least negatives. The exact same thing can be said about Bob Dole vs. Clinton. Simply voting for the guy you think is "electable" is a recipe for losing.

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 55):
Umm...the GOP will do that to ANY Dem candidate. And I'd be willing to bet that Hillary has considerably more dirty laundry than Obama.

LOL! Hilary Clinton has had a Republican microscope up her arse for the past 16+ years. I assure you if they haven't found it by now.... they ain't going to be finding it. Obama? LOL! Prepare for more revelations about his past than you can possibly imagine.

Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 55):
You're probably one of the people who thinks Obama's middle name and the fact that he went to a Muslim school for a few years (while living in heavily-Muslim Indonesia) makes him a terrorist.

 laughing  Um...no. If Obama is the nominee I am voting for him. I'm telling you the rumors just starting to circulate right now about him. I was at dinner with a friend / client of mine, and she mentioned that "Obama's brother lives in Kenya, a radical Muslim, and is there working on overthrowing the government". She's a staunch Republican and said this is what is now being said about him. Plus I've heard other things about him. Obviously most of it misleading at best.

My point is, if you are going to vote for Obama in the primaries thinking "he can be a uniter", or "wins independants", or has the lowest "negative numbers" as a reason to vote for him, you are doing yourself a great disservice. Vote for him if you like him, but don't vote for him because you think "he can win because he isn't objectionable". The attack machine is just warming up against him.
 
CaptOveur
Posts: 6064
Joined: Thu May 06, 2004 3:13 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 1:57 pm

I'm writing in for ANCFlyer's hat.. All of the "serious" candidates running are a bunch of flippin' idiots.
 
AsstChiefMark
Posts: 10465
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2004 2:14 pm

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:06 pm

MSNBC just reported that Edwards is calling it quits in New Orleans later today. He's going to support Obama.
 
rfields5421
Posts: 6374
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:29 pm



Quoting Allstarflyer (Reply 45):
What was Reagan in your eyes?

The largest increases in federal spending during his first four years of any administration to that point in history.

The largest increased in taxes of any administration to that point in history (total tax income, not individual rates).

The largest deficit budgets of any administration to that point in history.

Great increases in federal oversight and intrustion into our daily lives.

Great decreases in states rights.

Those are not the policies / practices of a conservative.
 
RJdxer
Posts: 3523
Joined: Thu Nov 09, 2006 1:14 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:34 pm



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 51):
If you remember back to 1992 when the economy was in the tank, a Bush was in the White House, a young energetic southern governor from a southern state was elected. What happened? Within in a few weeks, the Republican attack / smear machine went into overdrive...and not because Bill Clinton had done anything, but rather they decided to use any tactic possible to discredit a new Democratic President.

I remember in 1981 a seasoned politician running on a conservative platform with a great message and ideas that would work to bring the economy out it's worst recession since the great depression. Within weeks of his nomination the DNC attack machine went into overdrive and didn't stop for the next 8 years. Not because this former Governor of California had done anything, but rather they decided to use any tactic possible to discredit a conservative Republican. The DNC going back to the era of Lincoln invented this crap.

Quoting EvilForce (Reply 51):
Hello Obama fans, have you not been hearing the rumors already starting? Obama's "radical muslim brother undermining the democracy of Kenya?" His ties to dirty money in Chicago? Seriously....you're deluded if you don't think the Swift Boating of Obama won't knock him down CONSIDERABLY.

Yeah I have, I sure wish the Clintons would stop spreading those lies.
 
oldeuropean
Posts: 1686
Joined: Thu May 19, 2005 5:19 pm

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:39 pm

I hope for Obama, but I'm afraid that the cold and calculating lady will win the presidency.

Axel
 
EvilForce
Posts: 974
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:41 pm



Quoting RJdxer (Reply 62):
Yeah I have, I sure wish the Clintons would stop spreading those lies.

Try again. It's the Drug Limbaugh Brigade and the pseudo-Christians invoking God at every turn while pulling a Larry Craig in an airport bathroom with the Republican party leaders.
 
RJdxer
Posts: 3523
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:45 pm



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 64):
Try again. It's the Drug Limbaugh Brigade and the pseudo-Christians invoking God at every turn

Then you haven't listened to Rush Limbaugh any time during the campaign. He does not support Obama but neither does he castigate him like the Clintons have. The Clintons have been the ones bringing up the supposed dirt on this guy, Republicans have their own primary battles going on.
 
EvilForce
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 2:48 pm



Quoting RJdxer (Reply 65):
The Clintons have been the ones bringing up the supposed dirt on this guy,

Link?
 
RJdxer
Posts: 3523
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:10 pm



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 66):
Link?

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll...AID=/20080122/POLITICS01/801220386
Obama repeatedly questioned the accuracy of assertions made by Clinton and her husband, former President Clinton, about his record in public life, and Hillary Clinton charged that Obama is unwilling to take responsibility for his actions.

Clinton reacted with a reference to the legal work Obama once did for a "slum landlord," a reference to Chicago real estate developer Antoin "Tony" Rezko, a longtime fundraiser for Obama who has been charged with fraud, attempted extortion and money laundering. Obama's campaign said Saturday it was giving to charities more than $40,000 from donors linked to Rezko.

One of the sharpest exchanges came when Obama tried to defend his recent comments about Republican ideas and Ronald Reagan and Clinton interrupted to say she has never criticized his remarks on Reagan.

"Your husband did," Obama said.

"I'm here. He's not," she replied.

"Well, I can't tell who I'm running against sometimes," Obama countered.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/uselection...,2245244,00.html?gusrc=rss&feed=12

But Obama is outnumbered in this fight. The Clintons are running a tag team in their negative attacks on him. While Bill spent yesterday on the ground in South Carolina, Hillary was in Washington to accuse Obama of failing to back up his records with deeds, before flying off to campaign in California.

Although her husband famously coined the phrase "the politics of personal destruction" to describe his critics when fighting off impeachment, she dismissed suggestions that the attacks on Obama had gone too far. However, Democrats, including Ted Kennedy, are concerned that the Clintons' strategy is unbecoming and risks dividing the party along racial lines.

Clinton: "You talked about admiring Ronald Reagan and you talked about the ideas..."

What exactly did Obama say?

"I think Ronald Reagan changed the trajectory of America in a way that Richard Nixon did not and in a way that Bill Clinton did not. He put us on a fundamentally different path because the country was ready for it." Obama went on to say: "The Republican approach has played itself out." He then immediately said the sentence that the Clintons have used against him. "I think it is fair to say that the Republicans were the party of ideas for a pretty long chunk of time there the last 10 or 15 years in the sense that they were challenging conventional wisdom."

Obama: "You just said that I complimented the Republican ideas. That is not true."

How did the Clinton camp portray Obama's comments?

Clinton did not actually refer to Reagan in the debate - as Obama claims - but has commented frequently on his remarks in recent days.

Obama: "While I was working on those streets watching those folks see their jobs shift overseas, you were a corporate lawyer sitting on the board at Wal-Mart."

Is this true?

Yes. In February 1977 - just months after her husband's election as attorney general of Arkansas - Hillary Clinton joined the Rose law firm, the biggest corporate law firm in the state which represented Wal-Mart, Tyson foods, and the local newspaper. She served on the board of Wal-Mart from 1986 to 1992. The New York Times reported on May 20, 2007, quoting fellow board members, that she was silent about the firm's anti-union stand.

Obama: "The irony of this is that you provided much more fulsome [sic] praise of Ronald Reagan in a book by Tom Brokaw that's being published right now, as did - as did Bill Clinton in the past."

What does the book say?

According to Tom Brokaw, during an appearance on NBC television on January 20, Hillary Clinton told him that she admired how Reagan balanced the interests of the middle class and opposed the Soviet Union. Clinton also told newspaper editors in New Hampshire, when she was seeking their endorsement, that she admired Reagan's communications skills.

Clinton: "I was fighting against those ideas when you were practising law and representing your contributor, Rezko, in his slum landlord business in inner city Chicago."

Is this true?

Yes. Antoin "Tony" Rezko was a contributor. Obama did five hours' legal work for him. Rezko is a Chicago property developer currently facing trial on extortion and money laundering charges. Obama has admitted a friendship with Rezko since 1990, and that Rezko raised between $50,000 and $100,000 for him during his political career. Obama later donated $11,500 of Rezko's donations to charity.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


It's the old, vote for one get one free effort by the Clintons. But to get the point where they can really start going after a Republican, they have to bash a few democrats first.
 
EvilForce
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:20 pm

What does any of that have to do with what I posted? That's all background noise. I specifically said:

Quoting EvilForce (Reply 51) :

Hello Obama fans, have you not been hearing the rumors already starting? Obama's "radical muslim brother undermining the democracy of Kenya?" His ties to dirty money in Chicago? Seriously....you're deluded if you don't think the Swift Boating of Obama won't knock him down CONSIDERABLY.

To which you replied:

Quoting JRdxer:
Yeah I have, I sure wish the Clintons would stop spreading those lies.

I was specifically referring to the campaign ending type rumors. Who said what to whom, when on the campaign trail? 95% of American's don't care about that or pay attention to it.
 
rfields5421
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Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:26 pm



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 68):
His ties to dirty money in Chicago?

Not to be off topic - but can there ever be any candidate from Chicago or New York without "ties to dirty money"

Or from Texas without ties to the Savings and Loan Scandel?

Or from Louisiana without ..... well, let's just say the rest of the states are amateurs.

But - yes to your point - the vicious rumors have started and run long - and I don't think Obama will ever be able to convince millions of voters that he is not secretly islamic.

Which is truely sad, but reality.

In political campaigns - perception and rumors are more important than the truth sometimes.

i certainly remember the 1964 presidential race and one of the dirtiest tricks every played on an opponent.
 
RJdxer
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:27 pm



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 68):
I was specifically referring to the campaign ending type rumors.

Which would include rumors that a democratic rival was actually a closet republican, or even thought a republican had a good idea. It would also include charges of drugs, which the Clintons have hinted at. As well as charges of working for an evil slum lord. Nice try at back tracking, next time try doing a little research before making outlandish claims which you have yet to back up.
 
EvilForce
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 3:29 pm



Quoting RFields5421 (Reply 69):
Quoting EvilForce (Reply 68):
His ties to dirty money in Chicago?

Sorry, I just realized I had included this in my post above. JRdxer's comments then do apply. I shouldn't have included those as it wasn't what I was concerned with. It was more of the Swift Boat type attacks.
 
steeler83
Posts: 7702
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:08 pm



Quoting Airfoilsguy (Reply 3):
Quoting IFEMaster (Reply 2):
None of the above.

There's not a competent candidate amongst them.

I second that.

I agree, my pick goes to:

Quoting RJdxer (Reply 19):
17 posts and not one for Ron Paul. Where have all the libertarians gone?

Ron Paul is the only sane candidate left among the bunch!

I am terrified to death over Clinton. I see whatever is left of our sovereignty going out the window with her in office, and the same but to a lesser extent than with Obama. Huckleberry, I mean, Huckabee, is way too right-wing conservative and wants to make a Constitutional amendment to outlaw abortion and gay marriage. I am against abortion, but that should be up to the states to decide, and what the hell is wrong with gay marriage?! We can eliminate Edwards and Giuliani because they've dropped out. I don't know enough about Romney. McCain still wants us to be at war, so that means hundreds of billions of dollars more going to that when we really should be trying to rectify our economy and transportation. Our government is backwards enough...


Paul is against both abortion and I believe gay marriage, but at least he's got the right mindset to not enforce any federal laws banning either one. I think he also has good views on how to turn around the economy. He wants to pull our solders out of Iraq and redistribute them around our borders to protect our national identity. Besides, that's how 19 certain bastards got into this country, weak border patrol, especially at our airports.

If Hillary Clinton gets into the White House, I will spend the next 4 years curled up in the fetal position and wondering how long before our national identity is completely gone. This coming from a DEMOCRAT mind you; I think that says something!!! This lady is bad news, VERY bad news!!!

(I kept wanting to type "Clingon" for some very odd reason, but I don't want to inadvertently resort to ad hominum name calling) Wink
 
PSA53
Posts: 2939
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 1:54 pm

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Wed Jan 30, 2008 7:29 pm



Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 72):
Quoting RJdxer (Reply 19):
17 posts and not one for Ron Paul. Where have all the libertarians gone?

Ron Paul is the only sane candidate left among the bunch!

The problem with Paul,he's too "controversial" for the media.Paul,like Giuliani,needed media exposure.But Giuliani beat himself,which I thought he,Giuliani, would run super tuesday to see if he might be able to recover from his tardiness of getting into campaign.
 
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kc135topboom
Topic Author
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:27 am



Quoting FriendlySkies (Reply 55):
Hello Obama fans, have you not been hearing the rumors already starting? Obama's "radical muslim brother undermining the democracy of Kenya?" His ties to dirty money in Chicago? Seriously....you're deluded if you don't think the Swift Boating of Obama won't knock him down CONSIDERABLY.

Umm...the GOP will do that to ANY Dem candidate. And I'd be willing to bet that Hillary has considerably more dirty laundry than Obama.

I'm sorry to correct you, but the rumors of Obama's involvement with Kenya's politics, selling illegal drugs, and ties to slum lords in Chicago all came from the Hillary campaign. There was no involvement by the Republicans. We are not running against him, or her, yet.

Quoting EvilForce (Reply 58):
Sorry if I wasn't clear. I was talking about McCain.

There's another looser. His "endorsment" by someone who couldn't figuer out how to play politics on a national scale means nothing to me. Rudy, like Edwards, is looking for (hoping for) a job in the next administration, both would like either the VP on the ticket, or the AG position in the Cabinet. After all, Giuliani was a former US Attorney, and Edwards was an Ambulance Chaser.

Has anyone realized that 3 of the 4 remaining candidates (I do not count Huchabee or Paul any more) are Senators? Senators have ZERO excutive experience. They have ZERO forign policy experience. They have ZERO budget experience. They have ZERO experience dealing with a legislative body. No, Hillary's experience as a former First "Lady" means NOTHING. Giving tea parties is not forign policy experience, she had ZERO influence on human rights, as she claims.

At least a State Governor has experience in three of the four catagories. Gov. Romney is the only choice here.

Quoting AirCop (Reply 4):
If your going to vote for him at least learn how to spell his name correctly. its Romney.

Oops, me bad.  banghead 

Quoting AirCop (Reply 4):
I actually think with the large LDS base, and business leaders in Arizona, Romney will upset McCain in the Grand Canyon State.

I think you are right, but McCain also is unpopular in his home state because of his soft stand on illegal immigration.
 
EvilForce
Posts: 974
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 6:36 am



Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 74):
as anyone realized that 3 of the 4 remaining candidates (I do not count Huchabee or Paul any more) are Senators? Senators have ZERO excutive experience. They have ZERO forign policy experience. They have ZERO budget experience. They have ZERO experience dealing with a legislative body. No, Hillary's experience as a former First "Lady" means NOTHING. Giving tea parties is not forign policy experience, she had ZERO influence on human rights, as she claims.

Someone being a senator and therefore not having "executive" experience and therefore don't get elected have nothing to do with each other IMHO. The reason why senators don't get elected is because they have years worth of votes on hundreds, and thousands of bills. The American electorate is simply too stupid and uninformed as to how bills get made into laws. The classic "I voted for it, before I voted against it" being one example. The dolts of the American electorate then hear some sound byte how candidate _________ voted for/against this ____________ massively important law. Getting things done in Washington isn't easy or simple.
 
jonathan-l
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:08 am

An experience as a senator among other things is better than experience as state governor as the only thing.
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:31 am



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 75):
Getting things done in Washington isn't easy or simple.

It doesn't have to be that way. If we, the voters, threw out the whole bunch and replaced all 435 Congressman and 34 Senators up for re-election this year, it would send a BIG message the people are not going to take their crap any more. The remaining 66 Senators will notice that.

Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 76):
An experience as a senator among other things is better than experience as state governor as the only thing.

No, it is not. Just what "experience" do Senators have? None. Senators don't have to manage a budget, nor do they run any agencies, nor work with a legislature, nor work with a State Supreme Court, nor work more than 80 days per year (and don't have to actually show up for any of them). Any State Governor does all of that, and more. Most County Dog Catchers work harder than US Senators.
 
EvilForce
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 12:07 pm



Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 77):
It doesn't have to be that way. If we, the voters, threw out the whole bunch and replaced all 435 Congressman and 34 Senators up for re-election this year, it would send a BIG message the people are not going to take their crap any more. The remaining 66 Senators will notice that.

I couldn't agree with you more. The Senate has very arcane rules, which I"m sure has benefitted those old-timers quite well. But we can throw out the whole lot this year and replace the open 34 incumbents this year with challengers. Works for me.
 
LH423
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 3:11 pm



Quoting AirCop (Reply 4):
I actually think with the large LDS base, and business leaders in Arizona, Romney will upset McCain in the Grand Canyon State.

But Romney may just take a beating in his home state of Massachusetts. So, even if Romney wins AZ he could very well lose MA, which would essentially cancel out McCain's loss (actually, McCain would stand to benefit slightly).

Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 76):
An experience as a senator among other things is better than experience as state governor as the only thing.

Not really. Maybe in the sense that a US senator will have a more intimate knowledge of the politics of Washington, but the roles of state governor and president are much more closely aligned than a senators. After all, a governor and the president are both executives. The difference is that the president is the executive of federal government responsibilities while a governor oversees state responsibilities. So, while the duties of the office may differ, the overall position is almost the same.

For me, my ideologies have me leaning toward Obama. I really have no love for any of the Republicans though if I had to choose I guess I'd choose Ron Paul or McCain.

LH423
 
RJdxer
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:28 pm



Quoting Jonathan-l (Reply 76):
An experience as a senator among other things is better than experience as state governor as the only thing.

I have to respectfully disagree. Presidents and Governors are excutives, Senators either at the State or National level are legislators. It's a different experience. Kennedy was last person to come directly from the Senate to the Executive Office and his initial bungling of the job shows what the difference is. One good thing that can happen, if you look at LBJ who served first as VP and then President is that since he had been in the House and Senate for so long he knew the leadership. He also knew where all the bodies were buried and exactly how to twist certain arms to get what he wanted. If there is a plus to being a Senator vs. a Governor that would be it but only Senator McCain could claim that experience and he has a lot of enemies on both sides of the aisle.
 
davestanKSAN
Posts: 1532
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:33 pm



Quoting RJdxer (Reply 80):

So you're saying you would rather have Sen. Clinton as president? Yes?  tongue 

Dave
 
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Aaron747
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:34 pm

Did anybody catch Huckabee giving Schwarzenegger an earful once CNN turned off the mikes post debate?
 
RJdxer
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Thu Jan 31, 2008 11:46 pm



Quoting DavestanKSAN (Reply 81):
So you're saying you would rather have Sen. Clinton as president? Yes?

Nope, I don't have a candidate in the race this year. I'll vote since it is my civic duty but I already feel as though I'll be voting for the lesser of two evils.

One thing I did hear this afternoon while driving around picking up project stuff that just turned my stomach, some idiotic woman caller on a talk show actually suggested electing Senator Clinton and then moving as quickly as possible to demand an impeachment. On what charge I do not know, I hit the mp3 player before I could listen to any more. No matter if the GOP or DNC candidate takes the election, that kind of talk is just wrong. If members of either party go into the next administration with that kind of thinking we are on our way to third world government.
 
steeler83
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:18 am



Quoting LH423 (Reply 79):
Ron Paul or McCain.

Same here. I will vote democrat or republican -- whoever I think the better person is. Heck, I will vote independant if neither the democratic nor the republican nominee is any good.

I think of those two, Ron Paul is the better choice. McCain still wants to continue the war, but other than that, I think he's a fine candidate.
 
PSA53
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:35 am



Quoting Steeler83 (Reply 84):

I think of those two, Ron Paul is the better choice. McCain still wants to continue the war, but other than that, I think he's a fine candidate.

But Paul is getting stiffed at the debates like last night.And when he does gets the time,he is squeezing his message in so fast it makes him look like a man about to pop a blood vessel.Paul, also, was the only one to mention the big W.Meaning welfare was out of control.
 
EvilForce
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Fri Feb 01, 2008 1:48 am



Quoting RJdxer (Reply 83):
...demand an impeachment. On what charge I do not know,

You must be joking? Yet you think Bill Clinton's b/j in the oval office was an impeachable offense?

IMO, Clinton should have played the "Bush" card and told the Supreme Court to go f**k themselves, as no sitting President need answer to another branch of govt.

As far as impeaching the idiot, even John Dean (Republican) said: "Bush is the first President to admit to an impeachable offense." He said this in regards to the warrantless wiretapping Bush specifically authorized the NSA to engage in.

But no worries, this President has stretched any meaning of executive powers. I have no doubt he will pre-pardon most of all his staff. My gut feel also tells me he will attempt to pre-pardon even himself if a Democrat wins the Presidency.
 
RJdxer
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Fri Feb 01, 2008 3:27 am



Quoting EvilForce (Reply 86):
Yet you think Bill Clinton's b/j in the oval office was an impeachable offense?

Nope, but lying about it while under oath in a court of law where he was the defendant in a sexual harassment suit sure was.

Quoting EvilForce (Reply 86):
"Bush is the first President to admit to an impeachable offense."

Fortunately Mr. Dean is just that, Mr. Dean, private citizen with a right to his own viewpoint no matter how flawed it may be.
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Fri Feb 01, 2008 9:56 am



Quoting LH423 (Reply 79):
US senator will have a more intimate knowledge of the politics

Are you talking about the Ted Kennedy and Chris Dodd "sandwich" rumor of a waitress back in the 1980s"

 rotfl   rotfl   crowded   rotfl   rotfl   highfive 

Quoting EvilForce (Reply 86):
as no sitting President need answer to another branch of govt.

I don't think all those Congressional and Senate "investigations" committees agree with you.

Quoting EvilForce (Reply 86):
I have no doubt he will pre-pardon most of all his staff. My gut feel also tells me he will attempt to pre-pardon even himself

The US Constitution only allows the President the power of pardons, he does not have a "pre-pardon" power.
 
scottieprecord
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Fri Feb 01, 2008 10:28 am

I can see Obama more as a President than I can any other candidate.

McCain and Romney are doing the "he said, she said bullshit," to quote Limp Bizkit lyrics. I honestly can't see either in the White House. McCain is a respectable man, but he's a career legislator; I don't think he's capable of actually leading our country. Romney... I just don't trust him. His motives in wanting to run our country are questionable in my mind.

Hillary has that distinct cackle that I just can't take seriously. In the debate tonight she seemed bent more on getting in those little sound-bite quotes than actually debating the issues. I liken her style tonight more to that of the Harlem Globetrotters than an NBA team.

I'm excited about Obama's ability to unite and interest my generation. I think even though he lacks experience, he is an incredibly smart man and is easily the best person to LEAD our country. The President's ability to be a great speaker and to inspire and motivate his/her citizens is extremely important - and Obama can definitely do that.

For now, Obama '08... But hey, it's only Feb  Wink

Mike
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:00 am



Quoting Scottieprecord (Reply 89):
McCain is a respectable man, but he's a career legislator

So is Obama.

Quoting Scottieprecord (Reply 89):
I can see Obama more as a President than I can any other candidate.

Why pick this "career ligislator" over the other one?

Quoting Scottieprecord (Reply 89):
Hillary has that distinct cackle that I just can't take seriously. In the debate tonight she seemed bent more on getting in those little sound-bite quotes than actually debating the issues. I liken her style tonight more to that of the Harlem Globetrotters than an NBA team.

White women can't jump, but she can "dribble"  bouncy   duck   embarrassed 
 
cfalk
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Sat Feb 09, 2008 12:58 pm



Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 90):
Quoting Scottieprecord (Reply 89):
McCain is a respectable man, but he's a career legislator

So is Obama.

At a far more junior level, and he made his first headlines by refusing to take unpopular positions - Instead of Yes or No, he voted 'Present' in something like two thirds of the time. WTF?
 
[email protected]
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Sat Feb 09, 2008 1:13 pm

I hope Obama is the next president, but my gut painfully tells me it'll be Clinton. And if she win, it'll be fascinating to see what a dual-presidency (Clinton-Clinton) is like.
 
comorin
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:16 pm

Here's my take:

1. Romney (don't want to be an elitist by spelling his name correctly) lost because of his hair and pleated pants.

2. Rudy - sic semper tyrannis! - did he whiten his teeth or were those new dentures? Will he turn off his cellphone during a SOU address?

3. Huckabee - plays a mean guitar - everybody trusts a musician! - I'm sure he doesn't really believe in the stuff he says!

4. Clinton - need to lose a few pounds - Americans hate Fat! - The tears work as it reminds me of Miss America pageants.

5. Obama - Is he the Messiah that will lead us to the promised land? Head in the clouds but feet on the ground ?

6. McCain - If I hear 'My Friend ...' one more time I'll scream. This man is a Trojan Horse - question is, is the Horse carrying Conservatives or Moderates in its belly? His big asset is Cindy, who has serious First Lady looks.

7. Edwards - His speeches always sounded like he was addressing a Jury - lighten up Guy!

I'll vote for Obama as the country needs an inspirational leader now - tired of wallowing in the mire...
 
a380us
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Mon Feb 11, 2008 6:30 pm

As much as I am not happy with ant of the choices I would guess Obama.
 
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LTU932
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Mon Feb 11, 2008 8:02 pm

I made a decision already: even though I can't vote in the US, my choice is Obama. And if it has to be a Republican, make it John McCain. That Mike Huckabee guy just scares me.
 
prebennorholm
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Tue Feb 12, 2008 7:55 pm

I'm an outsider in this issue - looking through the press on the US presidential election procedure. And we are literally bombed day by day, probably because there is too little more local stuff to report.

What scares me a little is that none of the candidates seem to be able to discuss political issues. They are barely able to construct a sentence of four or five words, all in black or while, and then raise their hands awaiting a noisy applause. It all seems so primitive.

Watching them on TV, listening to the radio, or reading about their speeches in a newspaper, it's all the same. I can't help but think: "OMG, among 300 million Americans there are hopefully at least 250 million candidates who are better qualified than that".

It reminds me too much about the Russians. When they finally got the chance, after the collapse of the Soviet Union, then they elect - yes they did - a former KGB chairman. How can it happen? A man who has taken on such a job can of course never be a political leader. There are way over a hundred million better qualified Russians for that job. I'm not talking about his physical height, but intellectually he doesn't reach the ankles of people like Czech Vaclav Havel or Estonian Lennart Meri - just examples.

It is of course not relevant to compare US and Russian politics. Anyway, from the sideline there are too many cosmetic similarities. The US president is not an elected dictator, but rather a spokesman for a large and complicated administration.

But wouldn't it be a great advantage to have as spokesman a woman or man who is able to explain complicated issues as they are in various shades of grey instead of these four/five words sentences of black and white? Or virtually little more than a chearleader at a basebal match?
 
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SAS A340
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RE: The Next President Of The US?

Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:02 pm

Please,let it be Obama!!! NOT!! Clinton anyway!!! She would sell her soul for power......
 
cfalk
Posts: 10221
Joined: Mon Dec 04, 2000 6:38 pm

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Tue Feb 12, 2008 8:25 pm



Quoting Prebennorholm (Reply 96):
What scares me a little is that none of the candidates seem to be able to discuss political issues. They are barely able to construct a sentence of four or five words, all in black or while, and then raise their hands awaiting a noisy applause. It all seems so primitive.

Correct. Welcome to Sound-Byte Democracy, where if you can't say ing in 6 words or less, it will not be reported.

I agree. Our presidential debates are a joke. Certain candidates have so far gotten by appearing on easy, easy venues like women's daytime TV shows like The View.

How about testing? If you are en employer looking to hire someone from a field of candidates, you look at their resumes. Send the candidates for a testing cycle. IQ Test. Stress tests. Situational tests (like wargames) "You are president and you get an anonymous call saying that there is a nuke in Washington and it will explode in 30 minutes. What do you do?". I want to know how they respond to pressure. On TV, that means tough questions where I want to see the sweat pour out from under the makeup.

Otherwise, you know what? We would be better off taking just about any Naval Aviator, or better yet, a nuclear submariner, one who commanded missile boats, and making him President. They are people who are experienced with great levels of stress, who have experience the loneliness of command - especially in a submarine where there is nobody you can bump up the hard questions to. Just a thought...
 
a380us
Posts: 1447
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:55 am

RE: The Next President Of The US?

Tue Feb 12, 2008 10:01 pm



Quoting SAS A340 (Reply 97):


Please,let it be Obama!!! NOT!! Clinton anyway!!! She would sell her soul for power......

YEP welcome to america

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