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LTU932
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Thu Jul 31, 2008 6:46 pm



Quoting Mortyman (Reply 99):
Here is a new released picture of the man where the beard has been shawed off:

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/utenriks/1...59234

What's Karadzic smiling about in that picture? Isn't he aware that he will stand trial for genocide, or does he think he has a clean conscience, even after Srebrenica?
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Thu Jul 31, 2008 8:00 pm



Quoting LTU932 (Reply 100):
What's Karadzic smiling about in that picture?

Well he was smiling today and so was the judge !! The judge asked him if he wanted them to let someone know he had been arrested. Karadzic replied ''I dont think that there is anyone who does not know ''. They both laughed.
 
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Asturias
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Thu Jul 31, 2008 9:39 pm

http://www.russiatoday.com/guests/detail/1391

On the topic of Karadzic's arrest, Srdja Trifkovic offers an refreshingly concise and concise analysis.

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Klaus
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Fri Aug 01, 2008 4:55 pm



Quoting Asturias (Reply 102):
On the topic of Karadzic's arrest, Srdja Trifkovic offers an refreshingly concise and concise analysis.

Concise and on top of that concise? Wow!

Actually, it is pretty much just another instance of the rigorously controlled Kremlin/Gazprom media demonstrating their total disregard for anything approaching the rule of law.

The mere thought that a court could actually decide on the merits of the respective case rather than political machinations eludes them completely.

Trifkovic only perpetuates that sad authoritarian mind set.

Interesting what you find "refreshing".  eyebrow 
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Fri Aug 01, 2008 6:28 pm



Quoting Klaus (Reply 103):
Interesting what you find "refreshing".

 rotfl   rotfl 
 
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Asturias
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:16 pm



Quoting Klaus (Reply 103):
Actually, it is pretty much just another instance of the rigorously controlled Kremlin/Gazprom media demonstrating their total disregard for anything approaching the rule of law.

Oh should I have linked to the BBC interview with Trifcovic to shut you up?

Quoting Klaus (Reply 103):
Trifkovic only perpetuates that sad authoritarian mind set.

He's possibly one of the foremost experts on the entire Balkan war living today.

Perhaps you should refrain from the knee-jerk reactions you are displaying and make an effort to get to actually know things before you form an opinion about them.

You can google for the BBC transcripts.

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Asturias
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:21 pm

Oh what the heck! I know you won't look it up nor read it, but for other people willing to delve deeper into the Balkan conflict, here is the BBC transcript:

Quote:
The BBC talks to Dr. Trifkovic regarding the forthcoming Karadzic trial at The Hague Tribunal. “This trial would need to mark a new beginning by The Hague,” he says, “and yet I have no reason to believe that such a beginning will indeed be made.”

BBC: The fact that Karadzic could face trial at The Hague is causing consternation among those who consider the court to be anti-Serbian. Srdja Trifkovic is one of them. He is an American historian, journalist and political analyst, and an expert on Balkan politics.

TRIFKOVIC: It would be a hugely significant moment if it were to be followed by a fair and just trial that would seek to establish the facts of the case, not only on Srebrenica but also on what came to pass in Bosnia between 1992 and 1995. However, in Serbia many people—including those who favor the new, pro-European government—have a very jaundiced view of The Hague Tribunal, especially since the release of Nasir Oric, the wartime commander of the Muslim garrison in Srebrenica, came just before the capture of Karadzic. In fact, in Belgrade The Hague Tribunal is universally regarded as a politically motivated tool for providing quasi-legal justification of political decisions made by the powers-that-be back in the early 1990s.

BBC: What about the indictment against Mr. Karadzic? Do you think the war crimes were committed?

TRIFKOVIC: The war crimes were committed, absolutely. What remains to be seen is to what extent the war crimes committed by the Serbs will continue to be treated as uniquely more substantial, more evil and more massive, than those committed by the other two sides. What we have witnessed in the case of Nasir Oric in particular, is a truly egregious failure by The Hague Tribunal to connect the commander of Srebrenica with the war crimes which the Tribunal itself does not deny have taken place: thousands of Serbian civilians in the surrounding areas were killed between 1992 and 1995. For Serbia’s “European perspective,” for Serbia’s ability to come to terms with the past in the way that does not provide grounds for fresh resentment and revisionism, this trial would need to mark a new beginning by The Hague—and yet I have no reason to believe that such a beginning will indeed be made.

BBC: And yet this individual, who is charged with such heinous crimes, needs to be brought to justice, even if—as you argue—there are others still out there who haven’t been brought to justice. But here’s one opportunity to deal with one set of crimes, surely?

TRIFKOVIC: The problem is that dealing with “one set of crimes” in connection with “one individual” is not fulfilling the function of the Tribunal as stated at the time of its establishment in 1993, which was to establish an equivalent of an international “truth and reconciliation commission.” Quite the contrary, in the case of Serbia The Hague Tribunal has only generated fresh controversies and provided fresh grist for the mill of the nationalist wing of Serbia’s body-politic, which keeps claiming that the cards are stacked against the Serbs’ favor.

From BBC Radio 4, The World Tonight, Tuesday, July 22, 2008, 22:14 BST

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iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:25 am



Quoting Klaus (Reply 103):
Actually, it is pretty much just another instance of the rigorously controlled Kremlin/Gazprom media demonstrating their total disregard for anything approaching the rule of law.

I had that channel (russia today) before, for about a year, on globecast to be exact and its amazing the news that they showed, it was all propaganda, made especially in favor of Russia and its interests.

Quoting Asturias (Reply 105):
He's possibly one of the foremost experts on the entire Balkan war living today.

He's not an expert according to the Croats, Bosnians, Albanians, Montenegrins, Macedonians, Greeks, Slovenians, etc, he is an expert only to the Serbians because he protects their interests. Its simple as that Asturias.
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dc863
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 3:58 am



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 107):
he is an expert only to the Serbians because he protects their interests.

Crappy when that happens huh.
 Yeah sure
 
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 10:12 am



Quoting Klaus (Reply 103):
another instance of the rigorously controlled Kremlin/Gazprom media

No, I think that in the factual aspects like how the hiding of Karadzic was organised etc he showed to be well informed and in at least one point clearly contradicted the TV-speaker who spoke about a big-scale operation. But he quite obviously is 100% on the Serbian side. His allegation against the court only to serve some "Western" interests and to work on the basis of pre-done sentencings clearly shows that his high emotions in a tragic way overshadow everything else

Quoting Asturias (Reply 105):
linked to the BBC interview with Trifcovic

I presume that he in a BBC interview even more heavily became a defender of Serbia, as he for sure regards the Brits as "on the other side".

Quoting Asturias (Reply 105):
the foremost experts on the entire Balkan war living today

as said above, an expert for sure, but of course totally one-sided. Kosovari experts for instance are neither better nor worse, just on the other side.
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 10:50 am



Quoting Dc863 (Reply 108):
Crappy when that happens huh.

LOL....  Wink
 
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Asturias
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 7:06 pm



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 107):
He's not an expert according to the Croats, Bosnians, Albanians, Montenegrins, Macedonians, Greeks, Slovenians, etc, he is an expert only to the Serbians because he protects their interests. Its simple as that Asturias.

All I know he's presented as an expert on this subject and that he has the education and CV to back up that claim. Obviously he's biased towards Serbia if only because he's born in Belgrad, but clearly he has no sympathy for anyone who committed war crimes in the Balkans. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.

In other words he's a reputable source for information on the Balkan conflict, I have not seen anyone dispute that except you... while he is rightfully biased towards his country of birth.

Nothing wrong with that.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 109):
I presume that he in a BBC interview even more heavily became a defender of Serbia, as he for sure regards the Brits as "on the other side".

While I'm always at the ready to correct your political fantasies, I can't because I don't understand your sentence. It makes no sense.

I guess I could decipher it to something like: "I presume that he defended Serbia with vehemence in the BBC interview because he considers the British to generally disagree with him."

IF that is an adequate translation of your words, then I still don't get it. You can read the BBC interview yourself, so you don't have to presume anything. I posted it above.

In these two interviews with him, he has not defended Serbia at all, but pointed out that the court in Haag is quite rightly a farce. It isn't a truth and reconciliation court. That's what everyone needs.

I agree.

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iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 7:19 pm



Quoting Asturias (Reply 111):
All I know he's presented as an expert on this subject and that he has the education and CV to back up that claim. Obviously he's biased towards Serbia if only because he's born in Belgrad, but clearly he has no sympathy for anyone who committed war crimes in the Balkans. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.

In other words he's a reputable source for information on the Balkan conflict, I have not seen anyone dispute that except you... while he is rightfully biased towards his country of birth.

Nothing wrong with that.

He clearly has sympathy for the Serbs because he's a Serb, you can't dispute that, so in a sense he is biased towards them, just like I am towards Albanians, but to call him an expert is wrong because the majority of the media doesn't need his opinion to know what has happened in the Balkans.
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 7:27 pm

I enjoyed this interview with Vuk Jeremic. Certainly was refreshing. Hopefully Serbia will begin EU accession talks ASAP. Their rightful place is in the EU .

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/hardtalk/7536925.stm
 
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 7:33 pm

Not until they recognize Kosovo OA260. I know you won't agree but that is a fact.


About Trifkovic, just read about him on wikipedia, and basically he's defending the crimes of the Serbians in the Bosnian and Croatian war. That definitely doesn't make him an expert.
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 8:15 pm



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 114):
Not until they recognize Kosovo OA260. I know you won't agree but that is a fact.

EU entry will never be based on Serbia recognising the breakaway Kosovo . Even the EU internally is divided on that . So sorry to dissapoint you but Kosovo will not be a blocking tool even though your country folk might dream it . If you really believe that then I am really sorry for you because whatever a few people in Brussels might tell you its not fact.

The real truth is that the EU want to fast track Serbia into the EU whilst a pro EU government is in power. Thats a fact !!
 
dc863
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 8:34 pm



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 114):
About Trifkovic, just read about him on wikipedia, and basically he's defending the crimes of the Serbians in the Bosnian and Croatian war

Like the Western media who defended the crimes of the Croats, Albanians, and B. Muslims. Of course the Western media were no experts but that didn't stop them from spreading their message. The public bought it, hook line and sinker.
 
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 8:39 pm

“Kosovo recognition not condition for EU entry”, B92
June 4, 2008 on 3:39 am | In In Focus, Kosovo & Metohija, News in English |

NOVI SAD — European Parliament (EP) Rapporteur for Serbia Jelko Kacin says no-one’s setting Belgrade recognition of Kosovo independence as a condition for EU entry.

“Individuals in Serbia are thinking that up as a condition. Serbia, instead of tackling the challenges it faces on its road to Europe, is concerned with Kosovo and Kacin and talk of the EP, in an attempt to escape from reality and do something for itself,” Kacin told Novi Sad daily Dnevnik.

According to the EP rapporteur, Serbia has a responsibility, not only to itself and to its EU future, but to the future of the whole region.

“When Serbia, with all its capacities, acts for the whole region as a kind of lighthouse, everything goes well, but when Serbia shuts its windows, that darkness has a negative bearing on all its immediate and indirect neighbors in the region,” he reflected.

Kacin added that Slovenia had once attempted to lead the whole of the then Yugoslavia into the EU, but that there had not been sufficient wisdom in Serbia at the time.

“Had Kosovo been recognized as the seventh republic of the SFRJ, Yugoslavia wouldn’t have been a federation, but would have survived as a confederation and would definitely already have been an EU member, would have its own commissioner and 35 MEPs; Slovenian wouldn’t be an official language of the EU, rather Serbo-Croat, and Kosovo would have received the greatest possible help from the EU. As it is, only Slovenia is in the EU,” lamented the EP rapporteur.

http://news.serbianunity.net/2008/06/04/7882/

____________________________________________________

Serbia has the tools ....not the EU !!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7510181.stm

The main hope for the EU is that the new pro-Western Serbian government, which has demonstrated its determination to make fast progress towards EU membership with the arrest of Radovan Karadzic, does indeed soften its position.Otherwise it could remain grounded in Kosovo for a long time.
 
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 9:26 pm



Quoting Asturias (Reply 111):
It makes no sense.

That you fail to understand it does not mean that it does not make sense
 
iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 10:31 pm



Quoting OA260 (Reply 117):
“Kosovo recognition not condition for EU entry”, B92
June 4, 2008 on 3:39 am | In In Focus, Kosovo & Metohija, News in English |

Figures, its B92, lol and they still continue to call it Kosovo i Metohija. Talk about living in the past.
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dc863
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sat Aug 02, 2008 11:11 pm



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 119):
Figures, its B92, lol and they still continue to call it Kosovo i Metohija

Well we could call it "Yet another failed state", or "Banana Republic of KosoVA" or "Smugglers Paradise". I'm partial to all three actually.
 
Beaucaire
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 8:41 am

http://www.focus-fen.net/index.php?id=n148164

true or false declaration ???
Please respect animals - don't eat them...
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 9:38 am



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 119):
Figures, its B92, lol and they still continue to call it Kosovo i Metohija. Talk about living in the past.


And indeed it is to them. Its their national territory that was illegally ripped away . The UCK and mafia sure did a good job for you all  Wink The Serbs sent in troops after KLA terrorists began a terror campaign against ethnic Serbs by bombing cafes and shooting policemen (check news stories from 1997 and 1998. I suppose you forgot.)

The sad thing is that Kosovo's future would have been best suited in a devolved government within Serbias walls and a whole unit within the EU . Kosovo will not see half the money that was promised to it , history tells us so. Kosovo now will be like a dead state. High unemployment , out of all the important international organisations , restrictions of movement and free trade and no EU entry. Serbia on the other hand will florish and join the EU which will give it more say over the EU's stance on Kosovo.

Whilst only a small assembly this will be another thorn in the side of any new Albanian Kosovo state and will grow . Kosovo will eventually split again .


Serbs in Kosovo have inaugurated their own assembly set up in defiance of the majority ethnic Albanian government.

Helen Fawkes reports from Mitrovica.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7479716.stm

All Kosovo will do for the next 40 years is look for handouts and turn a blind eye to its mafia.
 
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Asturias
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 1:06 pm



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 112):
He clearly has sympathy for the Serbs because he's a Serb, you can't dispute that, so in a sense he is biased towards them, just like I am towards Albanians,

I clearly said he was biased towards Serbia, I find it disingenuous of you to imply that I didn't.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 112):
but to call him an expert is wrong because the majority of the media doesn't need his opinion to know what has happened in the Balkans.

The mass media is notorious for its lack of comprehension of the simplest things. Pick any aviation related news for instance.

Individual people are experts, the media are a collection of people who sell a product. Fact checking, truth, knowledge and unbiased reporting are terms not known in the general media.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 113):
I enjoyed this interview with Vuk Jeremic. Certainly was refreshing. Hopefully Serbia will begin EU accession talks ASAP. Their rightful place is in the EU .

Very interesting interview. In it the interviewer demonstrated time and again that he doesn't understand the fundamentals of international law and EU proceedings. Jeremic had to spend quite some time trying to educate him on these fundamentals.

I expect the EU to continue with Serbia's EU ascension without raising the issue of Kosovo, at least while the EU itself can not form a unanimous decision about the unilateral declaration of independence.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 118):
That you fail to understand it does not mean that it does not make sense

No, not really. All it means you can't write English very well. At least not well enough to be understood. I don't blame you for it, some aren't as linguistically talented as others. I'm sure in your mind your sentence made sense, but in the English language it did not.

Actually, never mind. I don't really care what you were trying to say. It was most certainly something irrelevant.

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ALexeu
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 1:30 pm

Whatever happens I just hope that Karadzic's trial will not be as long as Seselj's.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 115):
The real truth is that the EU want to fast track Serbia into the EU whilst a pro EU government is in power. Thats a fact !!

And if Serbia joins the EU before Kosovo, Kosovo will never be able to join the union.
Btw, I hope to see Belgrade-Pristina flights in future... Has there been any Kosovo aviation thread?
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 2:33 pm



Quoting AlexEU (Reply 124):
I hope to see Belgrade-Pristina flights in future..

Not going to happen. JAT will get A380's before that happens. Serbia would have to acknowledge Kosovo to set up air links with Kosovo so dont hold your breath. The government in Pristina would treat it as an international flight.
 
iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 4:38 pm



Quoting OA260 (Reply 122):
And indeed it is to them. Its their national territory that was illegally ripped away . The UCK and mafia sure did a good job for you all Wink The Serbs sent in troops after KLA terrorists began a terror campaign against ethnic Serbs by bombing cafes and shooting policemen (check news stories from 1997 and 1998. I suppose you forgot.)

The sad thing is that Kosovo's future would have been best suited in a devolved government within Serbias walls and a whole unit within the EU . Kosovo will not see half the money that was promised to it , history tells us so. Kosovo now will be like a dead state. High unemployment , out of all the important international organisations , restrictions of movement and free trade and no EU entry. Serbia on the other hand will florish and join the EU which will give it more say over the EU's stance on Kosovo.

Whilst only a small assembly this will be another thorn in the side of any new Albanian Kosovo state and will grow . Kosovo will eventually split again .

I can debate you on this and let everyone here know that all of this is false, but to tell you the truth I'm very busy at the moment and that would take me time, but I know deep down your heart you too know what the truth is and what happened in the Balkans, but your Greek blood doesn't let you acknowledge that. You can still have your view just like the one you wrote on top, but no one will take it seriously. (maybe 20+ years ago when everyone believed the Serbs and their "stories")




Quoting AlexEU (Reply 124):
And if Serbia joins the EU before Kosovo, Kosovo will never be able to join the union.
Btw, I hope to see Belgrade-Pristina flights in future... Has there been any Kosovo aviation thread?

Not going to happen Alex, you can book me on this, and bookmark it actually, and in a few years come back to see it, Kosovo and Serbia both will enter the EU at the same time. There will be no blocking like you think or otherwise Serbia will be blocked to enter EU and NATO, we both know that Croatia, Albania have entered NATO and will enter EU shortly, same goes with Macedonia (until they fix the name problem) so I don't think it would do Serbia any good starting to talk about blocking Kosovo etc. Actually they will have to recognize first before thinking about joining. (that is a fact)

As for the flight, I hope it happens too, maybe in 3 to 5 years? We just started a flight to Zagreb by Croatian airlines.  Smile

Quoting OA260 (Reply 125):
Not going to happen. JAT will get A380's before that happens. Serbia would have to acknowledge Kosovo to set up air links with Kosovo so dont hold your breath. The government in Pristina would treat it as an international flight.

Maybe you don't want it to happen?  Wink

It will happen though, just give it time.
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zak
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 5:04 pm

people in the balkans, just like those in the middle east, need to stop the "blame game". all the whining about the past and who is to blame for what bullshit doesnt progress your not so stellar situation even a cm. look at the current core of the eu, all the way to world war 2 it was a blame game power struggle bullshit. look how things changed, lessons were learned and the mistakes of the past are not forgotten, but they are not injected into every issue that comes up.
the only government that played this card was the former polish one, being singled out quickly by the eu AND the polish voters since people have realized that this way is the wrong way.

untill people in serbia, albania, and the whole middle east realize that, there will be little progress towards a society that makes living worthwhile for people.
10=2
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 5:15 pm



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 126):
Greek blood doesn't let you acknowledge that.

Its got nothing to do with ''Greek blood'' as you put it . What a lot of crap.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 126):
believed the Serbs and their "stories")

Well unfortunately the West swallowed the ''Stories'' of the UCK. They fell for it hook line and sinker. Nice marketing campaign, if there were awards they would certainly get one.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 126):
Maybe you don't want it to happen? Wink

Id love to see JAT get A380; s  Wink

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 126):
Kosovo and Serbia both will enter the EU at the same time.

Oh please.... come on. You are an intelligent guy most of the time dont let your emotions and fantasies rule your brain. Kosovo is at best 20-30 years from EU dreams. Serbia is around 5-7 years away from full entry. We will remember this conversation in a few years time and I will quote you on it . You have to seperate dreams from reality. The EU does not even have a joint opinion on the self declared independance. It only takes one to block Kosovo and I can assure you there are more than just one .
 
iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 5:38 pm

It will also take one to block Serbia, that one being Germany, Italy, France, or any other EU country. (or countries like Albania, Croatia that will enter definitely before Serbia)

Quoting OA260 (Reply 128):
Id love to see JAT get A380

Me too, I'd love to see that.  Smile
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Klaus
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 5:57 pm



Quoting Asturias (Reply 105):
Oh should I have linked to the BBC interview with Trifcovic to shut you up?

You seem to have failed to grasp the essential issue about that interview:

He was consistently trying to excuse Karadzic, basing his claims that he'd be innocent on nothing but explaining that he was such a nice bloke that he couldn't possibly have done anything wrong.

The reason I'm harshly criticizing this interview is that nowhere did the question of actual evidence even come close to being mentioned, as if the judgments of the court in the Hague were merely arbitrary decisions pulled out of thin air and the evil anti-serb prejudices of the justices.

That verdicts have been passed based on actual researched evidence is completely absent from his rants — he is merely feeding age-old serbian propaganda, pushing the hard realities completely from his horizon.

One may have issues with particular pieces of evidence or with particular procedures; In such a case we could debate the merits of his claims.

But he never even came close to a valid and verifiable argument — it was all tired propaganda, no substance whatsoever.


Some germans have objected to the Nürnberg trials as well, as if the number of convictions weren't related to crimes actually committed but merely to imaginations of the judges.

The tone and lacking substance of Trifcovic's rants and attempted one-sided exculpations is starkly reminiscent of these same "critics" on the outer right fringe of our own spectrum.

Quoting Asturias (Reply 111):
All I know he's presented as an expert on this subject and that he has the education and CV to back up that claim. Obviously he's biased towards Serbia if only because he's born in Belgrad, but clearly he has no sympathy for anyone who committed war crimes in the Balkans. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.

In other words he's a reputable source for information on the Balkan conflict, I have not seen anyone dispute that except you... while he is rightfully biased towards his country of birth.

A "reputable source" would be capable of addressing actual proceedings and evidence used (presumably wrongly) by the court. But he is apparently incapable of that, merely attempting a wholesale whitewash of Karadzic on grounds of him being such a nice guy.  Yeah sure

Quoting Asturias (Reply 111):
In these two interviews with him, he has not defended Serbia at all, but pointed out that the court in Haag is quite rightly a farce. It isn't a truth and reconciliation court. That's what everyone needs.

He has not "pointed out" anything about the court. He has merely made completely unsubstantiated claims about a presumable bias without being able to provide any actual evidence. There is a world of difference between the two.

Quoting Asturias (Reply 123):
Very interesting interview. In it the interviewer demonstrated time and again that he doesn't understand the fundamentals of international law and EU proceedings. Jeremic had to spend quite some time trying to educate him on these fundamentals.

None of what you've presented allows that qualification.
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 6:05 pm



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 129):
that one being Germany, Italy, France, or any other EU country

Really if you believe that then I must buy you a box of tissues to cry into when reality sets in and it all comes crashing down around you . Serbia's EU accession talks date is already decided behind closed doors in Brussels. Just like Kosovo's future was established before Serb troops entered the province  Wink

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 129):
Albania

 rotfl   rotfl  Let me change my pants before I answer this one ....Albania will join the same day as Tunisia and Algeria I heard. Also Kosovo cant join because Switzerland wants to join and we cant have two Switzerlands in the EU  Wink

As always thanks for the laughs. Its been a crappy rainy day here in Ireland and you brought some comedy to it all. If US Airways ever goes under you can always go into comedy. Big grin
 
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Asturias
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Sun Aug 03, 2008 7:25 pm



Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
You seem to have failed to grasp the essential issue about that interview:

It is you who has an issue with that interview, which reflects your poorly educated mind and biased opinions which you then try to present to other lesser minds as 'truth'.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
He was consistently trying to excuse Karadzic, basing his claims that he'd be innocent on nothing but explaining that he was such a nice bloke that he couldn't possibly have done anything wrong.

Trifcovic gave his personal description of Karadzic, which he is more than qualified to do since he obviously knows more about his person than you or others who ape the innuendos of the general media circus. Pathetic accusations against the interview, the interviewer and the interviewee don't lift your so called 'argument' one inch. You can attack the source all you like, which is why I pointed you to the BBC instead.

While more humble people would have re-examined their bias at that moment, you did not. Unsurprisingly. In fact you figure your opinions are more interesting and certainly more valuable than those who have education and ability to understand this issue.

Never did Trifcovic excuse Karadzic, rather he simply said that genocide or such atrocities were out of character for him. He laid no judgement, but presented his knowledge of Karadzic. Nobody should care either way what you think about that.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
The reason I'm harshly criticizing this interview is that nowhere did the question of actual evidence even come close to being mentioned, as if the judgments of the court in the Hague were merely arbitrary decisions pulled out of thin air and the evil anti-serb prejudices of the justices.

The interview wasn't the Haag tribunal, nor did Trifcovic assume the guilt or innocence of Karadzic. He simply told things as they are. Calling a spade a spade. Interviews where guilt and innocence are pre-established are the lowest form of journalism, but they are pleasing to people who relish in hearing what they want to hear. Unlike yourself, I don't relish reading trash like Bild which excels in your kind of journalism.

He certainly questioned the motives of the Haag tribunal and indeed its motives can be questioned. It is after all a political entity which by definition has its own agenda. On the surface it is truth and reconciliation, in practice it is no such thing. The people of former Yugoslavia all yearn for truth and reconciliation. They are getting none of that from the Haag tribunal, which is too bad.

There is no argument that actions deemed to be war crimes were committed on all sides, but at the same time it is pathetically obvious that the Serbs are getting the blunt of the blame and other accused war criminals are being found not guilty. Either the court is incompetent or its bias is showing.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
That verdicts have been passed based on actual researched evidence is completely absent from his rants — he is merely feeding age-old serbian propaganda, pushing the hard realities completely from his horizon.

The only one ranting here is you. Which is probably why the BBC isn't calling you for your shrill apologism of the Haag tribunal's inability to either find evidence against or convict people who committed war crimes in the Balkans other than Serbs. Again, if you think the tribunal is non-political I have a bridge to sell you.

You should put your money where your mouth is and show me one instance of where Trifcovic is feeding propaganda or pushing realities 'from the horizon'. I can't read anything else from his interviews that the Serbs committed war crimes and those responsible should be found guilty as charged, while at the same time doing exactly the same for the other sides in this conflict. It isn't this Trifcovic feeding propaganda.

It is you.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
One may have issues with particular pieces of evidence or with particular procedures; In such a case we could debate the merits of his claims.

Well, there you go. You managed to debate yourself in a circle ending up in the very place I began in. Well done. Well done.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
But he never even came close to a valid and verifiable argument — it was all tired propaganda, no substance whatsoever.

But you never came close to a valid and verifiable argument - it's all tired propaganda, no substance. ... See how easy that is? Well, that's the lamest sort of debating technique, but widely used by people who have an over-inflated opinion of themselves.

His argument was simple enough; re-examine the position of the Haag tribunal because seemingly it isn't fulfilling its job as a truth and reconciliation force, understand that the EU is not going to expand in the foreseeable future, especially in the light of the failed Lisboa referendum and that all sides committed war crimes but Serbs are getting the blunt of the blame in both the media and from the Haag tribunal which again damages any efforts towards truth and reconciliation. These are political realities, not your Bild toilet journalism.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
Some germans have objected to the Nürnberg trials as well, as if the number of convictions weren't related to crimes actually committed but merely to imaginations of the judges.

Indeed, the history of your nation isn't very pretty. In fact it is the most despicable in modern times, without any argument. I have little sympathy for those Germans who committed atrocities, but comparing Serbs to Nazis is something I thought would surely be below even you.

That has to be the most pathetic segue I have yet read in this debate. I guess this also ends the debate. You just don't bring up Nazi comparisons and expect anything meaningful after that.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
The tone and lacking substance of Trifcovic's rants and attempted one-sided exculpations is starkly reminiscent of these same "critics" on the outer right fringe of our own spectrum.

As established before, you're the one doing the rants here, comparing Serbs to Nazis and spouting confused comparisons in hopes that it somehow, just somehow doesn't make you look the fool and that it brings any validity to the trite politically correct monologue you've been spouting in this thread.

Pathetic.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
A "reputable source" would be capable of addressing actual proceedings and evidence used (presumably wrongly) by the court. But he is apparently incapable of that, merely attempting a wholesale whitewash of Karadzic on grounds of him being such a nice guy.  

What you read into the interview is just the bias you bring with you. There is no whitewashing, there is no excusing of Karadzic, but a personal opinion of Karadzic's character. If you can't handle that, if that breaks your tabloid image of the man as a stereotypical German Nazi-wannabe, I don't really care.

You aren't any expert, just a product of what the media has told you. Imagine if Karadic will be found innocent. What would happen to your world view then? You've been in no uncertain terms equating him with Nazis and such genocidical maniacs, prejudging and pre-assuming Karadzic's guilt. Who are you to do that?

Isn't that the court's decision? Or do you think, as well as this Trifcovic guy, that the judgement is already made. Putting Karadzic on a tribunal is merely a formality? Apparently, you think he's guilty. Yet, that hasn't been established yet before any court. It will, but as of this moment it hasn't been done. That's Trifcovic's point and it is people like you who are the problem. Not people who dare to defy the accepted public consensus. Sheeple.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
He has not "pointed out" anything about the court. He has merely made completely unsubstantiated claims about a presumable bias without being able to provide any actual evidence. There is a world of difference between the two.

Indeed, yet it is hardly within the scope of an interview to delve into the specifics, however I am certain that Dr. Trifcovic could easily provide specifics were he asked. That's kind of his job. In fact that's why he's apparently asked for interviews by respected media, not you. The fact that you think you know better is so laughable it need not be addressed.

Quoting Klaus (Reply 130):
None of what you've presented allows that qualification.

What nonsense. But then, that's kind of in character, isn't it?

asturias
Tonight we fly
 
iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 3:40 am



Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
Really if you believe that then I must buy you a box of tissues to cry into when reality sets in and it all comes crashing down around you

I don't cry that easy my friend, not after losing my house and everything in it, and then having to leave my country.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
Serbia's EU accession talks date is already decided behind closed doors in Brussels

Yeah, and you were the first one reported with the story, wait was it B92? Or some other one-sided agency?

Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
Just like Kosovo's future was established before Serb troops entered the province

Kosovo's future was decided when Serbia ethnic cleansed me and 999,999 other Albanians, and burned our houses, killed 10,000 of us, raped 3000 women, and hid 4000 men to this day which the location is unknown. (we all know they're in serbia in some massive grave)

Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
Let me change my pants before I answer this one

Why? Did you crap on them?

Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
Albania will join the same day as Tunisia and Algeria I heard

This is why I don't take you seriously, because being that you're Greek, for you Albanian and Albanians automatically are labeled bad, criminals, basically devils. You can't see it otherwise, so again automatically you have to defend our enemy, which in this case would be the Serbs, just like you've shown it here on a.net time after time.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
Also Kosovo cant join because Switzerland wants to join and we cant have two Switzerlands in the EU

You have to come with a better excuse than that.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
If US Airways ever goes under you can always go into comedy

I know you wish they'd go under, just come out and say it.
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dc863
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 3:48 am



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
I don't cry that easy my friend, not after losing my house and everything in it, and then having to leave my country.

Yep my relatives lost the same, ethnically forced from the Krajina, Vinkovci Croatia, and then to make matters worse my relatives from the Krajina were transfered to a refugee camp within a stones throw from Kosovo. They were uprooted after that during Nato's crime wave bombing in '99 and moved to southern Belgrade where one of them had a stroke.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
Or some other one-sided agency?

Now you're complaining about an agency being one sided. Jeez you people got your 15 minutes of fame and more during 1999. Albanian this, KLA that blah blah blah blah poor Kosovars, blah blah blah.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
This is why I don't take you seriously, because being that you're Greek, for you Albanian and Albanians automatically are labeled bad, criminals, basically devils. You can't see it otherwise, so again automatically you have to defend our enemy, which in this case would be the Serbs, just like you've shown it here on a.net time after time.

I don't take you seriously because of your Albanian nationalism. I'm defending OA because Serbs and Greeks have to watch each others backs.
You're a hypocrite Iliri.
 
iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 4:19 am



Quoting Dc863 (Reply 134):
I don't take you seriously because of your Albanian nationalism.

You don't have to, since you're Serbian, ja razumem to.

Quoting Dc863 (Reply 134):
You're a hypocrite Iliri.

Svaka ti cast moj prijatelj.  Smile
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ALexeu
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 9:45 am



Quoting Zak (Reply 127):
eople in the balkans, just like those in the middle east, need to stop the "blame game". all the whining about the past and who is to blame for what bullshit doesnt progress your not so stellar situation even a cm. look at the current core of the eu, all the way to world war 2 it was a blame game power struggle bullshit. look how things changed, lessons were learned and the mistakes of the past are not forgotten, but they are not injected into every issue that comes up.
the only government that played this card was the former polish one, being singled out quickly by the eu AND the polish voters since people have realized that this way is the wrong way.

untill people in serbia, albania, and the whole middle east realize that, there will be little progress towards a society that makes living worthwhile for people.

But Palestinian problem is hanging for over 50 years, EU/NATO/USA didn't do anything about that. Same for other regions. Kurdistan, Turkish Cyprus, Krajina etc. etc. Kosovo is the only region to gain independence.

http://www.blic.co.yu/infocus.php?id=2645
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 10:53 am



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
I don't cry that easy my friend, not after losing my house and everything in it, and then having to leave my country.

I know two Kosovo Serbs who lost their homes and were refugees. Your not the only one and whilst Im truly sorry for your loss and I dont doubt for a moment that it was heart breaking it was just as hard for many Serbs.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
Yeah, and you were the first one reported with the story, wait was it B92? Or some other one-sided agency?

I have articles from Western unbiased media that I will post for you later .

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
Kosovo's future was decided when Serbia ethnic cleansed me and 999,999 other Albanians, and burned our houses, killed 10,000 of us, raped 3000 women, and hid 4000 men to this day which the location is unknown. (we all know they're in serbia in some massive grave)

As above , there are also Serbs in many parts of the Former Yugoslavia that were killed,raped,tortured so dont claim that your people were Saints and Angels. I have said it before and I will say it again you were all as bad as eachother. Just because your community only killed so many people it does not make it any better because the numbers killed were less than the Serbian side. You all have blood on your hands . Not you personally but the people who claim to represent your community.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):

Why? Did you crap on them?

No pissed them with laughter.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
This is why I don't take you seriously, because being that you're Greek, for you Albanian and Albanians automatically are labeled bad, criminals, basically devils

Now I dont take you seriously because you always make generalisations and accusations to do with being Greek. Your biased views are understandable as it was drummed into you from an early age but I actually have two very good Albanian friends who live and work in Athens and are very happy. I dont have any issues with them at all. In fact im closer to them then many of my Greek friends. So to throw that one at me is both ignorant and false.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
You have to come with a better excuse than that.

I was actually ''quoting'' you my friend. I have a memory that never fails me. It was a quote that I will always link to you.

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 133):
I know you wish they'd go under, just come out and say it.

No I wish they would offer a decent product and not try to keep Envoy passengers by trying to keep premium fares and offer the bare minimum. Also it would be nice to have a response to my complaint that I sent into ''Customer Services'' which is a joke in itself. Maybe you should have gone for a TSA job in BOS  Wink
 
iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 2:34 pm



Quoting OA260 (Reply 137):
I know two Kosovo Serbs who lost their homes and were refugees. Your not the only one and whilst Im truly sorry for your loss and I dont doubt for a moment that it was heart breaking it was just as hard for many Serbs.

I understand they lost their houses as well, but the point I'm trying to make is that the Serbian govt is to be blamed (not the current one of course) for trying to ethnic cleanse us, for no apparent reason, just to have the land free of Albanians.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 137):
Now I dont take you seriously because you always make generalisations and accusations to do with being Greek. Your biased views are understandable as it was drummed into you from an early age but I actually have two very good Albanian friends who live and work in Athens and are very happy. I dont have any issues with them at all. In fact im closer to them then many of my Greek friends. So to throw that one at me is both ignorant and false.

I'm glad you have Albanian friends, but you need some Kosovo Albanian friends  Wink.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 137):
I was actually ''quoting'' you my friend. I have a memory that never fails me. It was a quote that I will always link to you.

I know you were quoting me, thats why I said that. lol

Quoting OA260 (Reply 137):
No I wish they would offer a decent product and not try to keep Envoy passengers by trying to keep premium fares and offer the bare minimum. Also it would be nice to have a response to my complaint that I sent into ''Customer Services'' which is a joke in itself. Maybe you should have gone for a TSA job in BOS Wink

I'm not at BOS, lol, I wish I was though. Its an hour away. And there are no flight benefits with TSA.
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:04 pm



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 138):
the Serbian govt is to be blamed (not the current one of course) for trying to ethnic cleanse us, for no apparent reason, just to have the land free of Albanians.

I know but I think most people will agree that Milosovic was a dictator. He even mis treated his own people and if you remember there were thousands of Serbian people who rose up against him because they wanted peace. People often forget that when talking about present day Serbia and the current government. Serbia has proved it has changed and therefore thats why it will join the EU. There are still many hurdles for Kosovo to jump to get anywhere near to the point where Serbia is now. Both human rights and the judicial system are just a few on the list.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/453251.stm

New protests against Milosevic in Serbia


Several thousand people have been taking part in opposition rallies across Serbia to demand the resignation of President Slobodan Milosevic.

At least twenty-thousand people gathered in the capital, Belgrade, and there have been smaller demonstrations in other cities and towns.

_ ---------------------------------------------------

100,000 Serbs Take to Streets Against Milosevic

More than 100,000 jeering demonstrators hurled eggs at the state-run television headquarters, blocked city streets for more than eight hours and roared their approval when opposition leaders vowed to shut Belgrade down until the Serbian President, Slobodan Milosevic, was removed from power.

http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpag...9F04E4DE113DF935A15752C1A960958260

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 138):
Kosovo Albanian friends Wink.

I thought I already had one .  Wink


I know you want Kosovo to join the EU etc... and thats only natural but you must be realistic if you think that they will join the same day as Serbia. Like it or not Serbia is streets ahead. Kosovo is a place that still does not have any real powers without international agreement. The EU will be there keeping the peace in some shape or form for the next 20 years at least. ( Even though they wont admit to it ).

The ethnic make up of Kosovo will be its enemy to peace and stability and thats just the blunt truth.
 
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:20 pm



Quoting Asturias (Reply 123):
to be understood.

-
I presume that he in a BBC interview even more heavily became a defender of Serbia, as he for sure regards the Brits as "on the other side".
-
Let's explain it. When he gave an interview to the BBC, he had to face the reality that British journalists most likely are NOT as pro-Serbian as Russian journalists, and would not so readily accept his positions. Which MUST have made him a defender of these positions.
-

Quoting AlexEU (Reply 124):
Serbia joins the EU before Kosovo, Kosovo will never be able to join the union.

-
Which means that Serbia AND Kosovo had to become members at the same time, whenever it is to happen, as happen it will.
-

Quoting OA260 (Reply 125):
The government in Pristina would treat it as an international flight

-
This indeed would be an international flight.
-

Quoting OA260 (Reply 128):
You are an intelligent guy most of the time dont let your emotions and fantasies rule your brain. Kosovo is at best 20-30 years from EU dreams. Serbia is around 5-7 years away from full entry.

-
Right in a way. HOWEVER, Bulgaria and Romania by your criteria still would be decades away from EU-membership, but in fact ARE E.U.-members. Kosovo will be taken as member by some twisted criterias in order to proceed with Serbia, Croatia, Macedonia, Montenegro and Albania. I accept your stance that some of this club are farther ahead and others farther behind, but it is obvious that the E.U. will have to do some political "acrobatics".
-

Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
..Albania will join the same day as Tunisia and Algeria I heard

-
Morocco, Algeria and Tunisia, together with Egypt, Lebanon, Syria and Jordan, have gone into a framework of far-reaching bilateral treaties with the E.U., which means that most of the Arab League in fact is now associated with the E.U. . I would not have expected such rapid progress when the late King Hassan II launched this idea.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 131):
because Switzerland wants to join and we cant have two Switzerlands in the EU

twooo Switzerlands ????  Confused  Confused  Confused beside the point that Switzerland does NOT want to join for the foreseeable future but is intent on going on with the uncountable "Bilaterals". So that the way for Kosovo is freeee !
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Mon Aug 04, 2008 5:43 pm



Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 140):
HOWEVER, Bulgaria and Romania by your criteria still would be decades away from EU-membership,

Well thats a whole new thread.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080723/ap_on_re_eu/eu_bulgaria

EU freezes aid to Bulgaria, citing corruption

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 140):
twooo Switzerlands ???? Confused Confused Confused

Oh its a long standing joke between IIiri and myself.
 
iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:44 am



Quoting OA260 (Reply 139):
I know but I think most people will agree that Milosovic was a dictator. He even mis treated his own people and if you remember there were thousands of Serbian people who rose up against him because they wanted peace. People often forget that when talking about present day Serbia and the current government. Serbia has proved it has changed and therefore thats why it will join the EU.

I agree that he was some kind of a dictator, but the point is that many generals (in the army) agreed to whatever he asked for, and in the process destroyed Yugoslavia.

Quoting OA260 (Reply 139):
I thought I already had one . Wink

Bebaios.  Smile (< I hope that was right) lol

Quoting OA260 (Reply 139):
Like it or not Serbia is streets ahead.

I agree here as well, I've said it on other threads before that they're much more prepared than Romania for example, or even Bulgaria you can argue for.
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iliribdl
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Tue Aug 05, 2008 2:45 am



Quoting OA260 (Reply 141):

Oh its a long standing joke between IIiri and myself.

In 5 years it won't be a joke anymore. lol  Smile
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dc863
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Tue Aug 05, 2008 3:54 am



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 142):
but the point is that many generals (in the army) agreed to whatever he asked for, and in the process destroyed Yugoslavia

Quite a few external forces pushed for the breakup of Yugo. Within Yugo the Slovenes and Croats have wanted to separate since 1960.
 
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:02 am



Quoting Dc863 (Reply 144):
Quite a few external forces pushed for the breakup of Yugo. Within Yugo the Slovenes and Croats have wanted to separate since 1960.

And then that fueled other communities as well.

I actually wish Yugoslavia existed today, with all the different nationalities, religions etc. Economically it would have been right up there with France, Italy, Spain. (if the wars hadn't happened of course)
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dc863
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:08 am

The Federal Gov't asked for a 4 billion dollar loan to help keep everything together in late 90 early '91. It was denied. By whom? I have no idea.

The cost to repair all of Iraq back to modern standards.....150 billion. What a comparison.
 
ALexeu
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Tue Aug 05, 2008 8:10 am



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 138):
I understand they lost their houses as well, but the point I'm trying to make is that the Serbian govt is to be blamed (not the current one of course) for trying to ethnic cleanse us, for no apparent reason, just to have the land free of Albanians.

But it is against int'l law to give independence to Kosovo, there are no excuses.

Why not give independence to Darfur or Southern Sudan? Omar Al Bashad also done crimes against humanity.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 140):
Which means that Serbia AND Kosovo had to become members at the same time, whenever it is to happen, as happen it will.

But Serbia will not join if that happens, even Tadic said that.

Quoting ME AVN FAN (Reply 140):
This indeed would be an international flight.

Not really, that would be a flight like Mainland China-Taiwan or Mainland China-Hong Kong/Macau.
 
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OA260
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Tue Aug 05, 2008 8:19 am



Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 142):
Bebaios.

100% Akrivos....

Quoting AlexEU (Reply 147):
Why not give independence to Darfur or Southern Sudan? Omar Al Bashad also done crimes against humanity

Because the West are cowards and wouldnt dare bomb them . I wonder when they will bomb China over Tibet  Yeah sure

They tried to bring Serbia to its knees and it failed. Look how many days they lasted for. It even shocked NATO !!

Quoting IliriBDL (Reply 142):
I agree here as well, I've said it on other threads before that they're much more prepared than Romania for example, or even Bulgaria you can argue for

Yep in the old days Bulgarians used to travel to Serbia on their Blue passports as they had many things that Bulgarians couldnt get at home.
 
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RE: Serbia Captures Fugitive Karadzic

Tue Aug 05, 2008 4:30 pm



Quoting AlexEU (Reply 147):
not give independence to Darfur or Southern Sudan

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Darfur in fact is just a territory without ethnic identity, there are no "Darfuris". Southern Sudan however for many years DID demand independence, and now was granted considerable autonomy by General Bashir. When getting Anglo-Egyptian Sudan under control in the 19th Century, the Brits distrusted some local rulers in the Uganda/NorthernKenya region and therefore combined those territories with their Khartoum-condominium.
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Whatever, giving independence to what at present is "Southern Sudan" might become an option at some point in the future.
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"international law" in case of former Yugoslavia is rubbish, rubbish in so far as all now independent countries on that territory (exclude Serbia if you wish) are BREAKAWAY countries. I remember Yugoslav diplomats in the West loudly declaring the secessions of Slovenia and Croatia to be "illegal ........" .
-

Quoting AlexEU (Reply 147):
Which means that Serbia AND Kosovo had to become members at the same time, whenever it is to happen, as happen it will.

But Serbia will not join if that happens, even Tadic said that.

This would then become a problem for Serbia, and indeed would be regrettable.
-

Quoting AlexEU (Reply 147):
This indeed would be an international flight.

Not really, that would be a flight like Mainland China-Taiwan or Mainland China-Hong Kong/Macau.

Hongkong and Macau are autonomous regions INSIDE the PRC, and whenever having autonomy with their own CAAs, both are PART of China. Taiwan officially by self-definition IS CHINA and the PRC a breakaway part of the Taipei-governed country, while the PRC by self-definition IS CHINA (as well) and so regards Taiwan as part of China, so that they both agree in a strange way. All four "Chinese entities" register their civilian airplanes as
B- ...., whenever the PRC and the RoC use numbers and HK + Macau letters as registrations. Kosovo is in contact with organisations like the ITU and ICAO, and these organisations allow separate nationality-marks for various fields also for countries NOT (yet) recognized by either the UN or the EU or whomever (example Isle of Man) . True, legally Kosovo still is in a way "YU" just as Serbia, but exactly this is subject to change.
-

Quoting OA260 (Reply 148):
They tried to bring Serbia to its knees and it failed.

-
WHO tried to "bring Serbia to its knees" ?
+ WHAT exactly failed ?
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