Does Your City Turn Off Its Traffic Lights?

flymia · Sun Jul 27, 2008 6:40 am

I live half the year in Washington DC where I go to school and the other half in Miami. One of the first things I noticed while in Washington DC is that all traffic lights remain on the whole day. Even at 2am in the downtown area which is empty at that time all the lights remain on and the cars traveling on these roads still need to follow the lights.
Here in Miami at intersections which are not busy 24/7 or are not dangerous intersections with blind spots they will turn the lights to flashing yellow on the main street side (busier street) and flashing red on the intersecting street side from around 12-1am-5-6am. I think its a great idea and it makes driving late at night much easier and enjoyable. When driving on main roads it makes it much quicker since you do not need to stop at 70% of the intersections. I told some friends about this which live in other cities around the US and they never heard of the concept and think its a dangerous idea.
So any other cities around the US and the world do this? Do you agree with the practice? Obviously I love it and think its a great idea.

LASoctoberB6 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:06 am

In Las Vegas? No. Not that I'm aware of..

Utica, NY does something similar to what Miami does...

planewasted · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:19 am

I don't see the need. Traffic lights here detect an incoming car at distance and switches to green if there is no other car coming in its way.

[Edited 2008-07-27 00:20:21]

Jpax · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:20 am

I've never heard of this until now, and I'm a night owl. I've been on the roads between midnight and sunrise some nights and have never see a light turned off anywhere.

It would be nice, though. Sucks waiting at a red light at 3am when there are no other cars around. Generally stop, triple check the intersection, and go at those lights. My luck though, a cop will be hiding out one night...

B747forever · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:33 am

Quoting PlaneWasted (Reply 2):
I don't see the need. Traffic lights here detect an incoming car at distance and switches to green if there is no other car coming in its way

That is the way it works in Sweden

larshjort · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:37 am

Quoting B747forever (Reply 4):

That is the way it works in Sweden

And most places in Denmark too.

/Lars

andz · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:45 am

Here it doesn't really matter, I see so many people running red lights I lose count. Especially at night but during the day too, cars will stop at red, see nothing coming and go. If the intersection is pretty open and you can see all the approach roads then sometimes they don't even slow down. The other morning (4am) I was stopped at a red light and was passed by a minibus doing about 60 km/h.

But to answer the question, in some places the flashing yellow/red combination is used.

ACDC8 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:52 am

Switching traffic lights to flashing red and yellow is quite common in Germany, usually between the hours of 10-11pm and 5-6am. Personally I like the idea, makes driving at night much easier.

The concept is pretty well much unheard of in Canada, but then again, our traffic techniques are decades behind more traffic friendly nations (such as Germany Wink

).

There are times when there is a power outage and the traffic lights go on back up flashing red in both directions, essentially turning it into a four way stop. Bring out the lawn chair, grab a bag of popcorn and let the entertainment begin! Such a simple thing and drivers here just don't get it.

Quoting FlyMIA (Thread starter):
and think its a dangerous idea.

Of course we do, because we are unable to grasp the idea. Locally, our city council is thinking of adding a second roundabout in town. People are up in arms over the idea because they simply can't grasp the concept that it works more efficiently then a four way stop or traffic light at not so busy intersection.

Quoting PlaneWasted (Reply 2):
I don't see the need. Traffic lights here detect an incoming car at distance and switches to green if there is no other car coming in its way.

Most traffic lights where I live are equipped with a contact underneath the pavement by the stop line. The idea is that when a car drives to the light and stops, the contact senses it and eventually changes the light to green. This is a great idea, it more or less actually prevents traffic from flowing. Its quite possible to drive down one of our main roads hitting every single red light because one car wants to cross.

HAWK21M · Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:14 am

At nights.....Flashing amber & flashing red is used,indicating....go slow at intersection or stop & proceed at intersection respectively.

regds
MEL

davehammer · Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:48 am

No, you just couldn't do it in London, much as sometimes I'd like it happen!

Goldenshield · Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:18 am

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 7):
Most traffic lights where I live are equipped with a contact underneath the pavement by the stop line.

Not a contact, but an inductor. When your car drives over the inductor, you change the magnetic field of the inductor, and that trips the light.

jamesbuk · Sun Jul 27, 2008 10:20 am

We have "part time" traffic lights in places, so they are only operational during the rush hours and other peak traffic periods so these are normally off during the night, but the normal traffic lights dont turn off.

Rgds --James--

777ER · Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:31 am

All lights are keeped im here in WLG, as most areas of the CBD are very busy even at 3am and it would only be asking for accident after accident to happen

PlymSpotter · Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:41 am

Quoting PlaneWasted (Reply 2):
I don't see the need. Traffic lights here detect an incoming car at distance and switches to green if there is no other car coming in its way.

Flash your lights at them whilst approaching in the UK and they'll change much more quickly, normally you don't even have to slow down let alone stop. Perhaps not wise in cities, but on many roads I use there are lights in the middle of no-where controlling traffic over single lane bridges or narrow sections of road.

Dan Smile

MYT332 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:57 am

In one of my local cities, Liverpool, the traffic lights are often turned off thanks to the local scouse community thieving the bulbs for their living rooms. Wink

Quoting PlymSpotter (Reply 14):
Flash your lights at them whilst approaching in the UK and they'll change much more quickly

Especially do that on the lights that are controlled by pressure pads on the road! Big grin

PlymSpotter · Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:08 pm

Quoting Myt332 (Reply 15):
Especially do that on the lights that are controlled by pressure pads on the road!

Ahem, this is Cornwall we're talking about, such technology has yes to venture so far South Wink

lincoln · Sun Jul 27, 2008 12:55 pm

Cleveland has random lights that are in the flashing mode at seemingly random times during the late night hours--I've yet to figure out the patten...

Quoting PlaneWasted (Reply 2):
Traffic lights here detect an incoming car at distance and switches to green if there is no other car coming in its way.

This is common in Southern California, as well, and works exceptionally well during off-peak hours. There are relatively few such lights on the East side of Cleveland.

I just wish Cleveland would do a better job of timing/setting up lights on the main thoroughfares-- for example there's a set of three lights on Chester (one of the main East/West roads on Cleveland's east side) whrere there is hardly any cross trafic, yet I always wind up having to stop at two of the three-- I've tried driving faster, I've tried driving slower, I've tried driving at exactly the speed limit, but I've never made it through all three without stoping (and of course, all three are on 24x7x365)

petertenthije · Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:20 pm

Our traffic lights are also controlled by pressure pads. Still, they are turned of around 11ish for all but the most dangerous/busy intersections. Well, those intersections that have not been replaced with roundabouts that is.

planewasted · Sun Jul 27, 2008 1:21 pm

Quoting Myt332 (Reply 15):
Especially do that on the lights that are controlled by pressure pads on the road!

I think the ones we have in Sweden reacts on magnetic materials, just like the pick-up for a electric guitar. No moving parts and cheap, sure you don't have similar types?
Sucks when you have a high-tech aluminum or carbon fibre car. Smile

GuitrThree · Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:18 pm

Quoting PlaneWasted (Reply 18):
I think the ones we have in Sweden reacts on magnetic materials, just like the pick-up for a electric guitar. No moving parts and cheap, sure you don't have similar types?
Sucks when you have a high-tech aluminum or carbon fibre car.

All that in the road stuff is going away.. new technology is to use "cameras." They have them here in the states.. Now, these aren't the ticket generating ones, the ones I am talking about are usually the long white slender cameras mounted right at the traffic lights. These cameras don't really take any pictures, nor can they really "see" good. They just sense the movement of the cars. However, just like the magnetic sensors in the road, most can't see motorcycles (here in TN, motorcycles CAN run a red light, after stopping completely and looking both ways, because if there are no other cars around, the light will never change).

The "camera" systems biggest advantage is that they aren't prone to the road damage the other systems mounted in the pavement are.

Oh, and to answer the question, many areas in TN do change overnight to Flashing Yellow/Red.

Anyway, new interesting technology.

andz · Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:21 pm

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 19):
here in TN, motorcycles CAN run a red light

They can, or they may? Big difference.

flexo · Sun Jul 27, 2008 2:47 pm

Here in Germany many cities turn off the traffic lights at night, mainly to save electricity. They flash towards the direction which has to yield and are completely off towards the "right off way" directions.

However, lately many cities have gone back to leaving the lights on during the night as accident rates seem to go up even at low density traffic intersections.

I'm really amazed that people can't follow simple yield rules at otherwise traffic light controlled intersections. They do it at millions of intersections where there are no traffic lights safely without any problems!

flymia · Sun Jul 27, 2008 4:21 pm

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 7):
There are times when there is a power outage and the traffic lights go on back up flashing red in both directions, essentially turning it into a four way stop. Bring out the lawn chair, grab a bag of popcorn and let the entertainment begin! Such a simple thing and drivers here just don't get it.

This reminds of when there is a hurricane in Miami and large areas of the city lose power. So with no power traffic lights and street lights around the whole city are off. Even at the busiest intersections in Miami they all become 4 way stops. Now that is a site to see and not an easy thing to drive thru.

seb146 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 4:24 pm

Quoting FlyMIA (Thread starter):
Here in Miami at intersections which are not busy 24/7 or are not dangerous intersections with blind spots they will turn the lights to flashing yellow on the main street side (busier street) and flashing red on the intersecting street side

That is interesting. I would think MIA would have them all working all the time.

The largest cities in Oregon have lights working 24/7: Medford, Portland, and Eugene. I can not think of any lights in the Portland or Medford area that flash. There are lights in Pendleton, Hood River, and The Dalles that flash overnight. My brother lives in Walla Walla. I don't think they flash their lights at night, but some intersections in Milton-Freewater and College Place do.

I don't think Seattle or Tacoma have flashing lights at night, either. Maybe the outer suburbs like North Bend.

lincoln · Sun Jul 27, 2008 4:39 pm

Quoting FlyMIA (Reply 22):
Even at the busiest intersections in Miami they all become 4 way stops. Now that is a site to see and not an easy thing to drive thru

Legally, they become all*-way stops, but do people actually treat them as all-way stops? Here in Cleveland, I've been nearly rear ended at least 3 times, and honked at plenty more than that for actually coming to a full and complete stop at an intersection where the lights are not in service.

The strategy of the natices here seems to be "Push the gas and pray" in such cases.

I know in the pre-Y2K hysteria a large number of intersections in California got uninterruptable power supplies (UPSes -- generally battery banks) capabile of running intersections "off-grid" for something like 24 hours. In Temecula, where I lived from 1989-2005, I can only think of about 4 power outages in 16 years -- here it seems like there's at leat one a quarter, so I'm kind of suprised that more intersections don't have that feature.

Pop quiz: What do you do when you get to a light that is (solid) Red and (solid) Yellow in all directions? (I.e. whichever side of the intersection you're coming from both the red and yellow lights are illuminated)... I've seen that twice in the past year...

Lincoln
* - Are 5, 6, and 7-way intersections unique to Northeast Ohio? There seem to be plenty of them here, and they're a little terrifying to navigate, even when the lights _are_ working... One example from near my Boss's house:

StarAC17 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:16 pm

Quoting Andz (Reply 6):
Here it doesn't really matter, I see so many people running red lights I lose count. Especially at night but during the day too, cars will stop at red, see nothing coming and go. If the intersection is pretty open and you can see all the approach roads then sometimes they don't even slow down. The other morning (4am) I was stopped at a red light and was passed by a minibus doing about 60 km/h.

I heard if you are driving at night in South Africa and you see a red light you don't stop because of the crime rates.

Phoenix9 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:31 pm

Here in Toronto they don't turn them off. But we do have the camera/inductor system which will change the lights depending if there is traffic approaching the intersection. If there is a power failure then all intersections become four way stops...and like ACDC8 said...its fun to watch but not fun to drive through.

On a side note: During the 2003 blackout that hit the eastern side of US and Canada, while the govt. officials were still thinking what to do...many people volunteered to direct traffic through the intersections and took turns until the lights were back on. Despite all the chaos, it worked out pretty well!

Gsoshutout55 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:47 pm

I live in Greensboro, NC and they turn the lights off here too. The same blinking yellow/red as miami.

StarAC17 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:48 pm

Quoting Phoenix9 (Reply 26):
Here in Toronto they don't turn them off. But we do have the camera/inductor system which will change the lights depending if there is traffic approaching the intersection. If there is a power failure then all intersections become four way stops...and like ACDC8 said...its fun to watch but not fun to drive through.

They have the pads as well in some places, and I believe it is timed during rush hour and at non peak times the busy street will stay geen until the crosswalk or pad is triggered.

Here is a trick, if you are turning left and can see the pad stop on it to trigger the advanced green light and you are the only one turning (It is usually 2-3 car lengths behind the line).

It doesn't work every time but is is nice when there is a huge line of cars in the other direction.

Phoenix9 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 5:52 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 28):
Here is a trick, if you are turning left and can see the pad stop on it to trigger the advanced green light and you are the only one turning (It is usually 2-3 car lengths behind the line).

I do that all the time and it works for the most part devil

I always thought those were the inductors and not pressure sensitive pads.

Fly2HMO · Sun Jul 27, 2008 6:08 pm

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 19):
The "camera" systems biggest advantage is that they aren't prone to the road damage the other systems mounted in the pavement are.

We have a lot of those at PRC and I HATE them. They are extremely slow to react to movement, and when I used to have my VW Type 1 they would NEVER detect my car, Even after rocking several feet back and forth.

I like the induction system, but the best in my opinion are those that are those synchronized with time. It's the best because the lights are timed to go green by the time you get to them, so you really never have to stop, if they are all timed correctly that is. Downtown Houston uses a combination of synchronizing and sensors.

Not to mention that it encourages people with the heavy lead foot syndrome (like moi) to drive at the speed limit to avoid stopping at a light.

ShyFlyer · Sun Jul 27, 2008 6:10 pm

I live in a small town with a grand total of 5 intersections with stop lights. They operate 24/7, though they are being upgraded with LEDs.

Now at Kirtland AFB, which incidentally has a population more than twice that of my town, all the signal lights turn to flashing red/yellow at around 5pm weekdays and all day on weekends.

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 7):
Most traffic lights where I live are equipped with a contact underneath the pavement by the stop line. The idea is that when a car drives to the light and stops, the contact senses it and eventually changes the light to green.

I hate those intersections. Thankfully, where I live all but one intersection uses those optical sensors instead.

AverageUser · Sun Jul 27, 2008 6:58 pm

We used to have flashing yellow at quiet traffic, which I think was helpful especially if you were driving in a strange city. Then came the EU and we were told it was against the regulations to show flashing yellow "unless there's a real fault in the lights" so the lights will stay now on. Go figure, at least it shows the level of Union influence in mundade details at some level.

helvknight · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:04 pm

Virtually all intersections except the busy ones go to flashing yellow at about 10 or 11 pm here (naturally it depends on the Kanton). The one at the bottom of my road does this.

The other thing they have a lot of here is receivers that will change the lights when a bus is coming to the intersection to give transit priority.

LTU932 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:05 pm

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 7):
Switching traffic lights to flashing red and yellow is quite common in Germany, usually between the hours of 10-11pm and 5-6am. Personally I like the idea, makes driving at night much easier.

It's also quite common on certain streets in Costa Rica, however some traffic lights have switched to full 24/7 operations.

StarAC17 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:26 pm

Quoting Phoenix9 (Reply 29):
I do that all the time and it works for the most part devil

I always thought those were the inductors and not pressure sensitive pads.

They probably are but I just called them pads because it is easier.

PSA53 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:37 pm

Quoting FlyMIA (Thread starter):
Does Your City Turn Off Its Traffic Lights?

No,they're all 24/7.In Fontana, the city is actually installing more lights.The main reason is construction expansion but also Foothill Bl. is notorious for drag racing as I can hear them at night.

Goldenshield · Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:59 pm

Quoting PSA53 (Reply 36):
No,they're all 24/7.In Fontana, the city is actually installing more lights.The main reason is construction expansion but also Foothill Bl. is notorious for drag racing as I can hear them at night.

The west side of the city is also out in the booneys. There's a reason why they call it Fontucky. Wink

aero145 · Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:02 pm

Quoting Larshjort (Reply 5):
Quoting B747forever (Reply 4):

That is the way it works in Sweden

And most places in Denmark too.

And in various places in Iceland too.

GuitrThree · Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:10 pm

Quoting Andz (Reply 20):
they may

They may. It is the LAW that motorcycles can pass through a red light AFTER STOPPING and visually checking both ways. It in no way lets them blow pass it at speed or even a rolling stop. They must fully stop, then they can go, but it is 100% legal.

I don't ride motorcycles, but finally, a law that makes sense.

iowaman · Mon Jul 28, 2008 12:34 am

Too bad there isn't any traffic lights in the whole county where I live. Wink

andz · Mon Jul 28, 2008 7:51 am

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 25):
I heard if you are driving at night in South Africa and you see a red light you don't stop because of the crime rates.

No, unfortunately it is just another facet of the total disregard for the law. What you mention above has been used as an excuse if people are caught (sorry officer but I didn't feel safe sitting at that red light). Some cops are sympathetic to this, especially if the driver is a woman alone.

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 39):
They may. It is the LAW that motorcycles can pass through a red light AFTER STOPPING and visually checking both ways. It in no way lets them blow pass it at speed or even a rolling stop. They must fully stop, then they can go, but it is 100% legal.

I don't ride motorcycles, but finally, a law that makes sense.

I do ride a motorcycle and it sounds useful, unfortunately here it would just exacerbate the problem I mentioned earlier.

Analog · Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:14 am

Quoting Jpax (Reply 3):
It would be nice, though. Sucks waiting at a red light at 3am when there are no other cars around. Generally stop, triple check the intersection, and go at those lights. My luck though, a cop will be hiding out one night...

Everywhere that I have lived (wealthy suburban towns, inner cities, and rural areas) the cops act as if solid red lights late at night are flashing for them. Red light + late night = stop sign for cops.

Call them on it (literally, by phone; I've done it a few times) and they'll claim they were responding to an emergency that required stealth. I must have a knack for picking high crime neighborhoods; the majority of police cars that I see between 1AM and 5AM are responding to emergencies that require stealthy approaches. Either that, or they are responding to emergencies that require that the flashing lights be activated only while crossing intersections.

This is a good reason to support red light cameras.

Goldenshield · Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:45 am

Quoting Analog (Reply 42):
This is a good reason to support red light cameras.

What about in instances where the light doesn't turn, no matter what you do?

pelican · Mon Jul 28, 2008 9:52 am

Quoting AverageUser (Reply 32):
Then came the EU and we were told it was against the regulations to show flashing yellow "unless there's a real fault in the lights" so the lights will stay now on. Go figure, at least it shows the level of Union influence in mundade details at some level.

And here we see how urban myth about the EU are born. I don't think this has anything to do with the EU because flashing yellow lights are very common over here during the nights.

pelican

NZ107 · Mon Jul 28, 2008 10:51 am

What a great idea. I wish they introduced that in Auckland.. Not only would it save power and the light bulbs but also the frustration of sitting at the lights for no cars at all at 3am in the morning! Once I sat at the lights for a good 3 minutes (possibly due to phasing problems) at a ridiculous hour of the morning. It's never busy at that time of day however I guess what applies to all cities around the world, you have to be cautious of hoons who would run the red anyway.

PHLBOS · Mon Jul 28, 2008 4:53 pm

Quoting Lincoln (Reply 24):
Pop quiz: What do you do when you get to a light that is (solid) Red and (solid) Yellow in all directions? (I.e. whichever side of the intersection you're coming from both the red and yellow lights are illuminated)... I've seen that twice in the past year...

In Massachusetts, a red & yellow light on at the same time means STOP for pedestrians crossing. While most of these lights have long since been replaced w/types w/WALK signals; at present, there are still some signals in Salem and Lynn that utilize the red & yellow mode.

Answer to the orignal question: by and large, the greater Philadelphia area does NOT turn off or put its signals in a flash mode after-hours. The Greater Boston area (where I used to reside) does not either.

Last night while driving to a movie theater, I noticed a light that was lighted solid red AND solid green; needless to say this signal was malfunctioning due to a thunderstorm that came through earlier that day.

Moose135 · Mon Jul 28, 2008 5:12 pm

Quoting FlyMIA (Thread starter):
Here in Miami at intersections which are not busy 24/7 or are not dangerous intersections with blind spots they will turn the lights to flashing yellow on the main street side (busier street) and flashing red on the intersecting street side from around 12-1am-5-6am.

Do they roll up the sidewalks at night there, also? rotfl

In New York, we leave the lights on all the time.

Quoting GuitrThree (Reply 39):

They may. It is the LAW that motorcycles can pass through a red light AFTER STOPPING and visually checking both ways. It in no way lets them blow pass it at speed or even a rolling stop. They must fully stop, then they can go, but it is 100% legal.

I don't ride motorcycles, but finally, a law that makes sense.

Why is it legal (and safe) for a motorcycle to do this, but not a car? If I'm sitting at a red light, and there is no traffic coming, what difference does it make what kind of vehicle I'm driving?

57AZ · Mon Jul 28, 2008 6:34 pm

Quoting Goldenshield (Reply 10):
Not a contact, but an inductor.

Here in Tucson, we use both motion cameras, red light cameras and magnetic induction loops. At least one intersection with magnetic induction loops is set up to detect streetcars approaching or waiting at the intersection-it has a streetcar line on one street. In the developed areas, the traffic control timing runs 24/7. In less developed or lower traffic areas, the control timing switches off during off peak hours. The primary route is given a green signal except when the loop or camera detect traffic on the secondary route. If the signal does not detect traffic approaching on the primary route within a pre-programed time frame, it will allow the cross traffic to move.

jcs17 · Mon Jul 28, 2008 7:38 pm

My municipality inside Dallas, from 12AM to 6AM, switches most its lights to flashing red or yellow.

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