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Starbuk7
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Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:05 pm

http://apnews.excite.com/article/20080801/D929MHS00.html

Great?? Just what we need, another check. I would prefer that they drill for oil and lower the costs than give me money to pay the higher prices.
 
sv7887
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:23 pm



Quoting Starbuk7 (Thread starter):
Great?? Just what we need, another check. I would prefer that they drill for oil and lower the costs than give me money to pay the higher prices.

So after calling McCain's gas tax rollback a "gimmick" Obama comes up with one of his own?

And how exactly are we going to pay for this one? Borrow even more from the Chinese? We already are running up the deficit some more with the first stimulus package...

Between this and his genius "Oil Profits Windfall Tax" we'll pay even more for energy. I guess the population can't do the simple math and realize oil companies have a 8% margin and companies like Apple have much much more.
 
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falstaff
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 8:30 pm



Quoting Starbuk7 (Thread starter):
Great?? Just what we need, another check

I'll take their money....

Quoting Starbuk7 (Thread starter):
I would prefer that they drill for oil and lower the costs than give me money to pay the higher prices.

Exactly... However too many leftists, who claim to be for the working man, will stand up against drilling for oil even if it means screwing the working stiff. The planet is not more important than those who live on it.

How will this lower prices. Taxing oil companies isn't going to do anything, but make prices go even higher. Government can't fix all problems. The more reliant we become on government to fix our problems we lose are ability to fix things ourselves.

Mr. Obama can talk about all the jobs lost in the last 7 months, but we still have a low unemployment rate in comparison to some European countries.

I don't want to hear any whining from the EU crowd that they pay higher taxes on fuel so we should to. Just because you pay high taxes doesn't make it right. Maybe people in the EU should be demanding that their taxes should be lowered.
 
Pope
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:10 pm



Quoting Starbuk7 (Thread starter):
Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Let's call a spade a spade - this is socialism pure and simple. It's right out of the Marx's manifesto. From each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs.

People need to wake up and see that less than 20 years after socialism failed in the USSR, the presumptive Democratic party nominee is trying to impose it in the United States. Mark my words, this starts with Big Oil. Health Insurance is next (he's already said as much). Then comes Microsoft and Google. Pretty soon if Starbucks makes too much money we'll be looking at taxing their "windfall" profits to ensure that everyone can get a good cup of coffee.

In a country where the bottom 50% of taxpayers pay less than 5% of all federal income taxes, a populist call that results in more than 50% of taxpayer paying nothing is the slippery slope to economic socialism. Economics 101 tells us that anything that is free is consumed in inefficient quantities. Well if 50% of American's aren't paying anything in taxes, does it not follow that government services are free to them?
 
Platypus
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:16 pm



Quoting Falstaff (Reply 2):
Maybe people in the EU should be demanding that their taxes should be lowered.

They are, and have, hence Sarkozy and Merkel. A good part of the EU is moving right. Mr Obama wants to make the mistakes many nations in Europe already learned from! Obama's more of a Socialist than many leaders in the EU.

Quoting Sv7887 (Reply 1):
So after calling McCain's gas tax rollback a "gimmick" Obama comes up with one of his own?

Team Obama is shameless! Question is, will the liberal media point out his hypocrisy? It's not hard to find, and is plentiful.

Cheerio
 
skyservice_330
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:36 pm



Quoting Platypus (Reply 4):
They are, and have, hence Sarkozy and Merkel. A good part of the EU is moving right. Mr Obama wants to make the mistakes many nations in Europe already learned from! Obama's more of a Socialist than many leaders in the EU.

What leaders do you have in mind? And on what basis is Obama "more of a socialist?"

Political labels/sylos can be funny things. They are by no means air tight or absolute. For instance, the Conservative Party of Canada, who are currently governing, are committed to universal health care for Canadians and the existence of public broadcaster, which could both be considered 'socialist' causes.
 
Dougloid
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:40 pm

Quoting Pope (Reply 3):
It's right out of the Marx's manifesto. From each according to their abilities, to each according to their needs.

And he got it from Louis Blanc.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 5):
Isn't this sweet! Another conservative wanker-fest over Obama!

And the beat goes on.......

Well, lemme tell ya, Falc, the idea is to induce strokes and apoplectic fits in all the McCainozoids and turn them into vegetables by such 'proposals'. How's that for deviousness?

I'll bet they didn't read the part about making the oil companies pay for it.


   

[Edited 2008-08-01 14:42:28]
 
MaidensGator
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:44 pm



Quoting Falstaff (Reply 2):
Quoting Starbuk7 (Thread starter):
Great?? Just what we need, another check

I'll take their money....

Great, except it's not THEIR money, it's OUR money...

Quoting Pope (Reply 3):
Let's call a spade a spade -

As usual, Pope nails it...

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 5):
Isn't this sweet! Another conservative wanker-fest over Obama!

And as usual, the Obama crowd submits an educated, well reasoned opinion as to why Mr. Obama should be elected President...  Cool
 
lowrider
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 9:45 pm

If nothing else Obama has demonstrated that his grasp of economics is almost equal to that of the current president. Since it was such a good idea the first time, we will just print more money and give it away. Some days it is almost enough to make me run into the woods, build a cabin, and start working on my manifesto.
 
Falcon84
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:12 pm



Quoting MaidensGator (Reply 8):
And as usual, the Obama crowd submits an educated, well reasoned opinion as to why Mr. Obama should be elected President...

Has nothing to do with that at all. It's the feeding frenzy that the righties have, almost every day. It's like chum thrown in the water for them to gather around and bite blindly at, as a mindless shark does in the ocean.

They were obsessed with a certain president back in the 90's, and they're not obsessed with Barack Obama-even if many of them cannot stand John McCain, either.

It's hysterical.
 
AirStairs
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:17 pm



Quoting Sv7887 (Reply 1):
Borrow even more from the Chinese?

I don't like this trite argument that the Treasury is somehow trying to sell itself to the evil Chinese. Treasury securities are sold on the open market and US/"very friendly" companies cannot afford to buy up all the debt that the Treasury does and must issue. 66% of the public debt is in foreign hands; there is no way we can support that on our own. These are not puttable bonds so China couldn't just demand early repayment and cripple the system.

Anyway, it's true, handing out money when our citizens are the richest in the world is not the way to manage (much less balance) a budget.
 
sv7887
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:26 pm



Quoting AirStairs (Reply 11):
reasury does and must issue. 66% of the public debt is in foreign hands; there is no way we can support that on our own. These are not puttable bonds so China couldn't just demand early repayment and cripple the system.

They could easily dump those T-Bills on the market and cause all sorts of problems. Creating Debt is a bad thing!

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 10):
They were obsessed with a certain president back in the 90's

Just like liberals are obsessed with the current President?

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 10):
Has nothing to do with that at all. It's the feeding frenzy that the righties have, almost every day

Nope..Your candidate rolled out another half assed policy which he ironically attacked McCain for doing..

He's a hypocrite pure and simple.

Quoting Dougloid (Reply 7):
I'll bet they didn't read the part about making the oil companies pay for it.

Didn't see my comments on the even more half assed Windfall Profits Tax idea of his?

Quoting Sv7887 (Reply 1):
Between this and his genius "Oil Profits Windfall Tax" we'll pay even more for energy. I guess the population can't do the simple math and realize oil companies have a 8% margin and companies like Apple have much much more.

Oh by the way he's stealing Jimmy Carter's idea on taxing Big Oil:

"The tax eventually succumbed to its own disappointing results. It had proven to be a heavy administrative burden, both for taxpayers and the IRS. Oil industry representatives claimed annual compliance costs of $40 million to $50 million. Press reports suggested the IRS was spending as much as $15 million to collect the tax. Overall, it was a heavy cross to bear, complained oil executives. In 1984 a General Accounting Office report called the WPT "perhaps the largest and most complex tax ever levied on a U.S. industry."

Worse, the tax had yielded less revenue than anticipated throughout its existence -- and none at all in its later years. Oil prices had failed to continue their dramatic rise; between 1980 and 1986, they had fallen from $30 to just $10 per barrel. Meanwhile, the WPT's "base price" -- used to calculate tax liability -- had continued to rise with inflation, as required by law. Squeezed from both sides of the equation, the tax had become a negligible source of revenue. "

Source: https://www.taxanalysts.com/thp/readings.nsf/ArtWeb/EDF8DE04E58E4B14852570BA0048848B?OpenDocument

Sorry Obama once again demonstrates no knowledge of Economics...

CHANGE!
 
Platypus
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:27 pm



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 10):
Has nothing to do with that at all. It's the feeding frenzy that the righties have, almost every day. It's like chum thrown in the water for them to gather around and bite blindly at, as a mindless shark does in the ocean.

They were obsessed with a certain president back in the 90's, and they're not obsessed with Barack Obama-even if many of them cannot stand John McCain, either.

 rotfl   rotfl   rotfl   rotfl   rotfl 

Pope,
I feel it's time you hit our buddy Falcon84 with another Hypocrisy Meter. I do hope the Falconator doesn't damage it, because his hypocrisy is off the rector scale.

If your boy Obama didn't have friends like Rev Wright, call people in the weather underground friends, go to Europe with an anti-US attitude, talk to people in San Fran while referring to people in middle America as dumb, be flat out arrogant and push socialism , there would not be a need to jump on him. Don't blame us, blame him, he's the one constantly putting his foot in his mouth!!! I see why you admire him so much!  sarcastic 

Falcon84, you do not find this alarming?

Obama's friend of 20 years Rev Wright:

God Damn America http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hPR5jnjtLo

Cheerio
 
AirStairs
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:44 pm



Quoting Sv7887 (Reply 12):
They could easily dump those T-Bills on the market and cause all sorts of problems. Creating Debt is a bad thing!

The debt is created when the Treasurys are issued, so no new debt would be created by a second-party sale. A glut of Treasurys from a foreign sell-off would be a nasty thing but I would say that the Fed has more control over the desirability of the dollar than the Treasury probably does. The dollar has spooked some central bankers (I believe that China has voiced a draw-down in dollars, but Sweden of all places has actually acted on it), but it seems that we are still a way aways from devaluation that would trigger really large scale sell-offs (Sweden went from 90% to 85% of its reserve in dollars--still a staggering amount.)
 
sv7887
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:49 pm



Quoting AirStairs (Reply 14):
I would say that the Fed has more control over the desirability of the dollar than the Treasury probably does.

I know how the financial markets work given my education....My point is: Funding half assed programs like this are being funded with debt that we cannot afford to pack on more of.

We're already dealing with deficits, the point is not to make it even worse. As I have demonstrated Obama is pulling a page from the Jimmy Carter book of screwups.

Anyone with a basic background in Economics knows this doesn't work. And he claims to be the Messiah on our economy? ROFL
 
Phoenix9
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Fri Aug 01, 2008 10:50 pm

I wonder how many will see this as a $1000 bribe for a vote  box . Isn't this basically saying that you vote for me and I'll pay you $1000?

PS: I am not saying one candidate is better than the other...just trying to get my head around this idea.
 
Falcon84
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:04 am



Quoting Sv7887 (Reply 11):
Just like liberals are obsessed with the current President?

 rotfl 

Most of the stuff that the GOP tried to hang Mr. Clinton with was garbage: Ron Btrown; Vince Foster; Whitewater; Travelgate; Filegate. Bullshit.

The stuff that most Dems and the rest of the nation go after the President for has to do with policy, and what they see as his poor stewardship of this nation-not made-up crap like in the 90's. Bill Clinton's only mistake was giving ammuniton to his political enemies.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:07 am

OK, it strikes me that if you give everyone $1000, you are creating inflation. No?
 
MaidensGator
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:17 am



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 16):
Most of the stuff that the GOP tried to hang Mr. Clinton with was garbage: Ron Btrown; Vince Foster; Whitewater; Travelgate; Filegate. Bullshit.

That's why Bill was disbarred... Perjury is a felony, even if you think it's irrelevant. Evidently the Supreme Court of Arkansas and the US Supreme Court didn't think it was bullshit. The US Senate just didn't think he should be removed from office, which was probably the right decision.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 16):
The stuff that most Dems and the rest of the nation go after the President for has to do with policy, and what they see as his poor stewardship of this nation-not made-up crap like in the 90's. Bill Clinton's only mistake was giving ammuniton to his political enemies.

Falcon, you do it every time. This thread is about Obama's scheme to give out cash. Somehow you twist that into Bill was innocent and Bush has bad policy. Please explain what that has to do with this thread...

And this is after you wrote:

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 9):
Has nothing to do with that at all. It's the feeding frenzy that the righties have, almost every day. It's like chum thrown in the water for them to gather around and bite blindly at, as a mindless shark does in the ocean.

 
Falcon84
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:35 am



Quoting MaidensGator (Reply 18):
Falcon, you do it every time. This thread is about Obama's scheme to give out cash. Somehow you twist that into Bill was innocent and Bush has bad policy

Jesus Christ, keep your panties on, will you? Why don't you go back and read what I responded to? You know-Sv7887 brought up GWB, and his thought that the Dems are obsessed with him? I responded that that was a load of crap?

I see Platypus brought up Rev. Wright again, in a thread that has nothing to do with that. Where the hell is your exaspiration at that? Or is it because he's a rightie like you, and you'll let it slide?

Why don't you get on the case of Sv788, who brought up that in the first place, instead of someone who simply responded?  Yeah sure
 
sv7887
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:43 am



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 19):
Why don't you get on the case of Sv788, who brought up that in the first place, instead of someone who simply responded? Yeah sure

I wasn't the one who brought up Clinton...

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 9):
They were obsessed with a certain president back in the 90's, and they're not obsessed with Barack Obama-even if many of them cannot stand John McCain, either.

Your candidate rolled out another expensive "gimmick" oddly similar to what John McCain had called for.

Your candidate is supposed to represent "Change" yet his policies are the same old political gimmicks, and in this case taken from Jimmy Carter

Change We Can Believe In? Careful what you wish for
 
PPVRA
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 1:52 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 17):
OK, it strikes me that if you give everyone $1000, you are creating inflation. No?

Depends on where that money is gonna come from. If it's a tax rebate, no. If it is coming from his Gutenberg or from monetizing debt, yes.

Since U.S. expenditures are greater than revenues, you are correct that it will end up increasing inflation. Giving a tax rebate without cutting expenses back will lead to the same thing.

[Edited 2008-08-01 18:55:04]
 
Platypus
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 2:30 am



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 19):
Why don't you get on the case of Sv788, who brought up that in the first place, instead of someone who simply responded?

You're whining!

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 19):
You know-Sv7887 brought up GWB, and his thought that the Dems are obsessed with him?

Only to prove your hypocrisy, after you brought up Bush, the guy you have a fetish for!!!

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 19):
I see Platypus brought up Rev. Wright again, in a thread that has nothing to do with that.

I brought up "God Damn America" Rev Wright to demonstrate why so many intellectual honest people have questions regarding Obama's judgement and character, which BTW he lacks severely in.

Cheerio
 
Falcon84
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 2:59 am



Quoting Sv7887 (Reply 20):
I wasn't the one who brought up Clinton...

You brought up Bush, and this thread isn't about him. I responded to make a point. We're even.  Smile
 
RJdxer
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:30 am



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 16):
Travelgate;

That actually did happen and they did actually apologize to the people they unceremoniously dumped. Nothing illegal about what they did but the way they went about it sure showed no compassion.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 16):
Filegate.

That actually happened too. Once again, nothing illegal but it sure was strange that none of their friends files were in the bunch, only political enemies.

Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 16):
Bill Clinton's only mistake was giving ammuniton to his political enemies.

And he gave it to them by the boxcar load too.

Falcon, President Clinton doesn't have anything to do with $1000 emergency rebate checks so why is he even in this thread? At least a reference to President Bush has credibility since he has done rebates twice.

As to the rebate checks, why not just pass a tax cut for everyone and be done with it? This worked in 2001 because it was a mild recession and people wanted to spend the money to help out. Now it just looks like desperation on the part of a government that just can't face up to the fact we need to take a serious look at the entire budget. From third rails to defense spending.
 
Platypus
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 2:41 pm



Quoting Falcon84 (Reply 23):
You brought up Bush, and this thread isn't about him. I responded to make a point. We're even.

BS  redflag 

Even? You're still way out in front by a magnitude of a million!!!

For Obama to say the Oil companies are to blame is asinine. Oil companies are making record profits because of high demand, primarily from India and China. He's flat out lying!!!

Cheerio
 
jm017
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 4:39 pm



Quoting Starbuk7 (Thread starter):
Great?? Just what we need, another check. I would prefer that they drill for oil and lower the costs than give me money to pay the higher prices.

Politicians and their gimmicks. Ridiculous.

Quoting Lowrider (Reply 8):
If nothing else Obama has demonstrated that his grasp of economics is almost equal to that of the current president. Since it was such a good idea the first time, we will just print more money and give it away. Some days it is almost enough to make me run into the woods, build a cabin, and start working on my manifesto.

I think he is hoping we forget it was such a "great idea" the first time out. It's a gimmick, is all. No butt is beneath kissing to get the top job.
 
Pope
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sat Aug 02, 2008 5:01 pm

Let's get back on the topic - Obama is outright supporting the socialization of free enterprise. It would be one thing if he wanted to tax all corporations for this. But instead he's specifically targeting one industry to create a populist ground swell.

Sounds like a page out of Hugo Chavez's playbook.
 
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DocLightning
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sun Aug 03, 2008 11:08 am



Quoting PPVRA (Reply 21):
Since U.S. expenditures are greater than revenues, you are correct that it will end up increasing inflation. Giving a tax rebate without cutting expenses back will lead to the same thing.

That's what I thought. So these "stimulus checks" are really poor ideas, no?
 
ltbewr
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sun Aug 03, 2008 2:09 pm

To me what should be done instead is to expand the income ranges and payments for current in place programs for seniors, disabled and those with low incomes to help with energy costs for heating and air conditioning. My 79 year old widowed mom is able to keep her house and independence with such subsidies, of about $500+ a year to her Social Security and small widows pension. By expanding these programs it would help those in most need rather than just throwing money to those that really don't need it.
 
Cadet57
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sun Aug 03, 2008 2:26 pm



Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 29):
rather than just throwing money to those that really don't need it.

I could use $1000, idk about you. Tuition aint cheap. And thanks to the government there is even less money for students to access this year, Sweet!  sarcastic  Why is it I and my family pay taxes to the government but get bent over when we'd like some gov't grants/loans so I can go to college? Why is it the middle class gets screwed?

Sorry to de-rail here. Just needed to rant..
 
flexo
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sun Aug 03, 2008 2:30 pm



Quoting Platypus (Reply 4):

They are, and have, hence Sarkozy and Merkel. A good part of the EU is moving right.

Sorry, but that is wishful thinking. Merkel is responsible for the biggest tax raise in Germany's history.

Quoting Starbuk7 (Thread starter):

Great?? Just what we need, another check. I would prefer that they drill for oil and lower the costs than give me money to pay the higher prices.

Charging taxes and then handing out checks is really the stupidest thing economy wise that I have ever heard of. Fits more to Chavez than to a US leader.

As for the oil drilling, it seems Obama has changed his mind and is now also in favor of off-shore drilling:
http://www.tampabay.com/news/politics/article752928.ece
 
Pope
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sun Aug 03, 2008 3:12 pm



Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 29):
To me what should be done instead is to expand the income ranges and payments for current in place programs for seniors, disabled and those with low incomes to help with energy costs for heating and air conditioning. My 79 year old widowed mom is able to keep her house and independence with such subsidies, of about $500+ a year to her Social Security and small widows pension. By expanding these programs it would help those in most need rather than just throwing money to those that really don't need it.

Please don't take offense at the following. My mother is also a widow, though she still is quite young (just turned 65) though she was widowed 10 years ago when my father died.

That being said, what sort of retirement planning did your parents do? Why is it / should it be the state's responsibility to take care of people if they chose not to save enough for retirement? Certainly death is a foreseeable event. Why shouldn't people be responsible for the certain death of a spouse as some point?

In our case we learned that even a million dollars of life insurance isn't necessarily enough money to guarantee a good retirement. If my father had died just a year or two earlier (while my brothers and I were still in college) the impact would have been much more dramatic financially. With people now regularly living 20 to 30 years in retirement (or at least after age 65 retirement) it is more important than ever to ensure that you have adequate financial resources put away for a rainy day.
 
MaidensGator
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sun Aug 03, 2008 3:25 pm



Quoting Flexo (Reply 31):
Charging taxes and then handing out checks is really the stupidest thing economy wise that I have ever heard of. Fits more to Chavez than to a US leader

 checkmark   checkmark   checkmark 

Quoting Flexo (Reply 31):
As for the oil drilling, it seems Obama has changed his mind and is now also in favor of off-shore drilling:

Mr. Obama has to stick his head out the window before announcing any policy positions so he can see which way the wind happens to be blowing...  Big grin

Quoting Pope (Reply 32):
Why is it / should it be the state's responsibility to take care of people if they chose not to save enough for retirement?

Or if they don't want to work... or they want to go to school... or they want to go to the doctor... or they can't afford to pay their mortgage because they bought a house they couldn't afford... and on and on and on.....
 
flexo
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Sun Aug 03, 2008 3:57 pm



Quoting Pope (Reply 32):
Why is it / should it be the state's responsibility to take care of people if they chose not to save enough for retirement?

Exactly, it is really a slap in the face of those that do the responsible thing and save up money for their retirement, if everyone else just gets the money for free in the end.
 
PPVRA
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Mon Aug 04, 2008 3:13 am



Quoting DocLightning (Reply 28):
So these "stimulus checks" are really poor ideas, no?

Yup. The middle class squeeze is one of the effects of inflation.
 
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stasisLAX
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RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Mon Aug 04, 2008 4:01 am



Quoting Falstaff (Reply 2):
I'll take their money....

I'm on disability leave and in uber-debt right now - so I will damn sure take the money if President Obama offers it  yes 
 
StarAC17
Posts: 4266
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2003 11:54 am

RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Mon Aug 04, 2008 4:13 am



Quoting Sv7887 (Reply 1):
And how exactly are we going to pay for this one? Borrow even more from the Chinese? We already are running up the deficit some more with the first stimulus package...

He wants to tax the oil companies profits which will cause them to raise the price more, dumb idea.

Quoting SKYSERVICE_330 (Reply 5):
What leaders do you have in mind? And on what basis is Obama "more of a socialist?"

Political labels/sylos can be funny things. They are by no means air tight or absolute. For instance, the Conservative Party of Canada, who are currently governing, are committed to universal health care for Canadians and the existence of public broadcaster, which could both be considered 'socialist' causes.

Lets get one thing straight here the shift to the right in Europe in no where near towards even a centrist position in the United States. Their taxes might be cut and some services might be but they aren't giving up things like universal health care and priviatizing their transportation systems.

It could also be said that the US is shifting to the left in many ways. A fluctuation like this is healthy just like periods of low economic growth and a boom.
 
AirStairs
Posts: 402
Joined: Fri Jul 04, 2008 6:47 am

RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Mon Aug 04, 2008 7:49 am



Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 37):
He wants to tax the oil companies profits which will cause them to raise the price more, dumb idea.

Maybe not raise prices because they have already taken a consumption hit, but it would certainly cut into the expensive R&D and exploration factors of input that Mr Obama seems to be so energetic about but at the same time seems to not understand where the money comes from.

Or maybe it is that he will tax windfall profits, and then turn around and offer incentives for R&D. Somehow it seems that the more times money changes hands, the less there is in the end.  Yeah sure
 
sv7887
Posts: 1259
Joined: Tue May 20, 2008 7:31 pm

RE: Obama Proposes $1,000 Emergency Rebate Checks

Mon Aug 04, 2008 12:26 pm



Quoting Pope (Reply 32):
In our case we learned that even a million dollars of life insurance isn't necessarily enough money to guarantee a good retirement. If my father had died just a year or two earlier (while my brothers and I were still in college) the impact would have been much more dramatic financially. With people now regularly living 20 to 30 years in retirement (or at least after age 65 retirement) it is more important than ever to ensure that you have adequate financial resources put away for a rainy day.

You're exactly right there..My dad passed away nearly 6 months ago and he knew damn well his life insurance wouldn't cover my relatively young mother (58 yrs old) for the rest of her life..He made sure the house was paid for, and that between his 401K and life insurance she has enough money to last. Even before he had cancer, he always was focused on paying the house off ASAP and saving as much as possible.

I note that people here (US) seem to lack much planning for these kind of things..When I used to go to the Cancer Center with my father I saw this false optimism that it "wasn't that bad" or "We'll beat it." The truth was that most of them who were in that waiting room were going to die of their cancer, it was just a matter of when.

I see the same thing with the people my age..It seems like most of my American friends haven't given a thought to retirement, keeping an emergency fund, and avoiding debt.

When I remind them that their spending habits are wasteful they tell me, "Why are you taking my fun away, you are such a downer..." And this person is a teacher and ought to know better.

My other friend is a tow truck driver, who's gotten himself 10K in the red over a stupid wedding. I asked him, "What the hell is the point of an expensive wedding if you won't have enough money to eat?" He just turned 27 and doesn't have a cent put towards retirement..

The sad thing is that he was almost out of debt and had a good 7K banked before this stupid girlfriend of his and this wedding!!!

People need to plan for ALL circumstances. And yes, you need to take some responsibility for it too.

We live in a world where people know how expensive things are..I still can't believe the number of people who will take out a second mortgage on their house to renovate it, go on vacation or buy a car.

It is just completely stupid.

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