Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
na
Posts: 9770
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

RE: Bush's Farewell Address

Wed Dec 31, 2008 6:19 pm



Quoting WN700Driver (Reply 48):
Slave owners accounted for less than 1% of the Dixies.

Wikipedia gives 4,8% slave-owners, not 1 %. Still 1/3rd of the pre-1861 population in the South were slaves. And by volunteering to fight for the South even the non-slave owners there were fighting for it, the wrong cause, whatever other reasons they might have had.
I´m fully aware though that the CW was not just a black and white affair (in the sense of good and bad I mean).
Sidenote: when you google slave owners, the top findings are about black slave owners. Odd.

Quoting WN700Driver (Reply 48):
Careful there. There are a lot of people here who were directly affected by that.

My answer was cold-hearted as it was too short, sorry. I just wanted to make clear that the cruel Indian policy of some US presidents in the 19th century affected only a minority, while the mistakes of GWB affect the majority.
 
wn700driver
Posts: 1475
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2001 10:55 pm

RE: Bush's Farewell Address

Wed Dec 31, 2008 6:29 pm

Falcon, I have actually been meaning to read that, and probably will as soon as I get out of Dispatch school. I know Lincoln was probably one of our best leaders ever (though not for silly primary school reasons they teach here...), but a lot of America does not.

And I know FDR couldn't have known how bad entittlements would get. There weren't a lot of octogenarians around in the 1930s. My point is that his effects were/are lasting, regardless of intentions.

Relating to that, I feel the same about Bush. I don't think he was nearly as bad an contemporary (and vested with agendas) historians want him to be. I say this, first off, because the same was true with Clinton, albeit not to the same extent. Maybe 80%.

My rant was really more about how we have turned into a country of monday morning q-backs. Whatever my opinion, it doesn't make me any better than Bush if I go about bashing him for issues I may not have all the facts on. I wish more people would see that is all.

But as for Cheney, that man probably sh*ts concentrated evil. I will not be sad to see him outta there,  Wink
Base not your happiness on the deeds of others, for what is given can be taken away. No Hope = No Fear
 
wn700driver
Posts: 1475
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2001 10:55 pm

RE: Bush's Farewell Address

Thu Jan 01, 2009 3:40 am



Quote:
Sidenote: when you google slave owners, the top findings are about black slave owners. Odd.

Indeed. It is not a commonly known fact that there were a lot of Black slave owners. But, as you may know, the vast majority were what they called “benevolent” slavers. They bought slaves to prevent their abuse rather than to exploit them. It is an interesting side-note to the history of slavery in America that not many people seem to know about.
Base not your happiness on the deeds of others, for what is given can be taken away. No Hope = No Fear
 
MOBflyer
Posts: 150
Joined: Sun Sep 30, 2007 9:42 am

RE: Bush's Farewell Address

Thu Jan 01, 2009 5:35 am



Quoting Captaink (Reply 49):
The guy wasn't a good president, there is no way around that.

There is plenty way around that. You may not share my views, but you are not entitled to call me a fool for my own views. President Bush, in accord with many of our allies, was provided now known to be inaccurate intelligence that led to the two wars that we are in today. This is incredibly unfortunate, but not the fault of President Bush. Moreover, the current crisis is not attributable to him or even his party, as noted prior.

What we CAN be proud of is a president that has led the way he campaigned he would. He cut taxes, stimulated business growth, and governed with the conservative values he campaigned with.

Quoting Captaink (Reply 49):
Now if McCain won, would you have been happy? Then it is just an Obama or Democratic hatred. If you don't like McCain either then I guess you really do love Bush. Scary...

I do very much like Bush, as I also preferred McCain to Obama. McCain was NOT my first pick for president however, as I would have preferred Huckabee.
 
captaink
Posts: 4010
Joined: Wed May 23, 2001 10:43 am

RE: Bush's Farewell Address

Thu Jan 01, 2009 6:02 am



Quoting MOBflyer (Reply 54):
There is plenty way around that. You may not share my views, but you are not entitled to call me a fool

Poor choice of words on my part. I am sorry for saying that. It is just that I too have strong feelings but against Mr. Bush.
Look Up
 
Mir
Posts: 19491
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:55 am

RE: Bush's Farewell Address

Thu Jan 01, 2009 6:14 am



Quoting MOBflyer (Reply 30):
He has tried his darndest

If you're the president, that and a dollar could get you a copy of the morning paper.

Quoting ANCsupercub (Reply 35):
the situations we are in are not solely his administrations fault.

Some of them are. Iraq is definitely Bush's baby, as is Guantanamo and the image issues associated with it. Outside of that, I agree that there's nothing he's solely responsible for, though he does share responsibility for a lot of other things (including the state of the economy).

Quoting MOBflyer (Reply 54):
What we CAN be proud of is a president that has led the way he campaigned he would. He cut taxes, stimulated business growth, and governed with the conservative values he campaigned with.

Sorry, but I can't consider anyone who kept his veto pen under lock and key while his party passed spending bill after spending bill in Congress to have conservative values. Bush campaigned against the use of troops in foreign countries, and said he didn't think the troops should be used in nation-building - we see how that turned out. He pledged to work to bring an end to partisanship in Washington - that didn't go very well either. If you want to be proud of the way he led, that's fine (though I would disagree), but saying that he led the way he said he would in the campaign just isn't backed up by the facts.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
na
Posts: 9770
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

RE: Bush's Farewell Address

Thu Jan 01, 2009 2:47 pm



Quoting WN700Driver (Reply 52):
Indeed. It is not a commonly known fact that there were a lot of Black slave owners. But, as you may know, the vast majority were what they called “benevolent” slavers. They bought slaves to prevent their abuse rather than to exploit them. It is an interesting side-note to the history of slavery in America that not many people seem to know about.

I did not know that it was a benevolant measure in the first place (though its expectable).
Another fact is there were Indian tribes with slaves. The Confederates even made a slaveowning Indian chief a Colonel or even General.


So much for Lincolns times.
Back to Bush.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: casinterest, FGITD, GalaxyFlyer, N867DA, StarAC17 and 77 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos