“Joe the Plumber” now “Joe the War Correspondent”
http://www.toledoonthemove.com/news/news_story.aspx?id=243329
God help us all ....
Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mortyman (Thread starter): “Joe the Plumber” now “Joe the War Correspondent” |
What is going to happen to the plumbing business that he was about to buy with his hard earned work? Oh that's right...
A liar as a news person. Have you ever heard of such a thing!
Step into my office, baby
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
Obama wins and Joe Whackenberger leaves the country. Sounds like a victory for everyone.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mt99 (Reply 1): What is going to happen to the plumbing business that he was about to buy with his hard earned work? Oh that's right... |
That's what I was thinking.
I guess the plumbing gig didn't work out after all.
Bring back the Concorde
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Superfly (Reply 3): Quoting Mt99 (Reply 1): What is going to happen to the plumbing business that he was about to buy with his hard earned work? Oh that's right... That's what I was thinking. I guess the plumbing gig didn't work out after all. |
Maybe there's a Qassam with his name on it. They look like they were built by plumbers.
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
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RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
Maybe he's waiting for a bail-out package for plumbers.
Isn't this guy's "15 minutes" up yet?
G
Isn't this guy's "15 minutes" up yet?
G
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
Glad to see the same sentiment here as on CNN when they ran the piece. So much entitlement. How dare he try to be a correspondant! I guess the second you earn your living doing manual labor you forever precluded from anything else. Typical.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
What McCain or Palin had no type of job for him! Talk about luck, this dud sure is having a run.
You can cut the irony with a knife
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
Joe the plumber's helper was simply a dreamer. It looks as though he has abandoned his dream of having his own plumbing company.
At least he no longer has to worry about his wealth being redistributed if he ever became wealthy.
At least he no longer has to worry about his wealth being redistributed if he ever became wealthy.
Bring back the Concorde
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Superfly (Reply 8): At least he no longer has to worry about his wealth being redistributed if he ever became wealthy. |
Yea I love how when he called Obama out on that one. It was just as scary as when he did say spread the wealth. So glad he did the complete 180 as soon as the election was over.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Luv2fly (Reply 7): What McCain or Palin had no type of job for him! |
Especially considering the amount of houses McCain owns, you would have thought at least one of them would be having plumbing problems.
Read this very carefully, I shall write this only once!
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 6): I guess the second you earn your living doing manual labor you forever precluded from anything else. Typical. |
Oh, baloney.
I've laid out bodies in a morgue and I've been a barker in a strip club - but I've also lived the high life in Beverly Hills.
mariner
aeternum nauta
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RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
Cool, that means he won't be on welfare again.
Ain't I a stinker?
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Superfly (Reply 10): ...and Hamas can keep Samuel Joseph Wurzelbacher. |
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 12): I've laid out bodies in a morgue and I've been a barker in a strip club - but I've also lived the high life in Beverly Hills. mariner |
I was being sarcastic. You should have seen good ol Wolf Blitzer he actually looked offended that someone like Joe the Plumber would dare be a news guy. It was disgusting.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Corresponde
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 14): I was being sarcastic. You should have seen good ol Wolf Blitzer he actually looked offended that someone like Joe the Plumber would dare be a news guy. It was disgusting. |
I'm offended that Joe the Plumber thinks he could be a news guy. He's never trained for it, he's got no experience of it in his resume and we know he has no objectivity.
I'm offended that Wolf Blitzer is a news guy, but at least he trained for it and he has experience and I'm even more offended that Sean Hannity is considered a news guy by some. He's a biased political entertainer.
If someone is fool enough to employ Joe the Plumber as a news guy, he'd be a fool not to take the money.
But who's the greater fool?
mariner
aeternum nauta
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mortyman (Thread starter): “Joe the Plumber” now “Joe the War Correspondent” |
How bout "Joe, your 15 minutes of fame is up!"
"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety!" B.Franklin
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mortyman (Thread starter): http://www.toledoonthemove.com/news/news_story.aspx?id=243329 |
Heading for Gaza, only if he among a select few to be "embedded"???? The snipers should have good photographs of their target.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 15): I'm offended that Joe the Plumber thinks he could be a news guy. He's never trained for it, he's got no experience of it in his resume and we know he has no objectivity. |
So Caroline Kennedy has never held a political job in her life but she is getting nothing but passes from everyone and will probably be picked to be NY's new Senator. What's your point? Joe will get on the job training, just like Leon Panetta.
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 15): I'm offended that Wolf Blitzer is a news guy, but at least he trained for it and he has experience and I'm even more offended that Sean Hannity is considered a news guy by some. He's a biased political entertainer. |
Wolf isn't biased? Look Hannity isn't the greatest but at least he isn't so elitist that he can't handle the fact someone like Joe the plumber is going to isreal to shove a microphone in people's faces and ask questions. I mean CNN is getting real bad. I listened to Anderson Cooper before whine that some Australian politician is the one who is making Obama stay in a hotel and why couldn't they kick him out and let Obama stay. I mean the entitlement just oozes out of these people. I love how threatened you feel by this guy.
| Quoting StasisLAX (Reply 16): How bout "Joe, your 15 minutes of fame is up!" |
Well as long as CNN tries to knock the guy it isn't. I guarantee you CNN runs with this and tries in some way to discredit him.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 18): So Caroline Kennedy has never held a political job in her life but she is getting nothing but passes from everyone and will probably be picked to be NY's new Senator. |
What this got to do with Caroline Kennedy? We're talking about newspeople, not politicians.
Or do you have no respect for news as fact, rather than opinion?
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 18): Wolf isn't biased? |
Of course, he's biased, why do you think I am offended by Blitzer? I respect news, I don't want opinion. I got opinions up the wazoo.
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 18): I mean the entitlement just oozes out of these people. I love how threatened you feel by this guy. |
Threatened? You make astonishing leaps of the mind. I am amused by it.
mariner
aeternum nauta
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 18): Well as long as CNN tries to knock the guy it isn't. I guarantee you CNN runs with this and tries in some way to discredit him. |
I'm having trouble figuring out whether you think Joe da War Correspondent is a suspect or a victim. I think Joe's got an eye for the main chance and fooling around in the middle east is probably better duty than thawing frozen pipes in the middle of a Toledo winter-or owning a plumbing shop that sends guys out to thaw frozen pipes in the middle of a Toledo winter.
Parenthetically, commie queer though I may be I see a lot of myself in Joe-only because unlike some people here I have blue collar working class roots and I've never forgotten them.
How are your working class credentials?
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 18): I love how threatened you feel by this guy. |
More like amused by him. Just like we are all amused by Sarah Palin.
Do you watch "The Office".. Yup.. its kinda like that
Step into my office, baby
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Dougloid (Reply 20): I'm having trouble figuring out whether you think Joe da War Correspondent is a suspect or a victim. I think Joe's got an eye for the main chance and fooling around in the middle east is probably better duty than thawing frozen pipes in the middle of a Toledo winter-or owning a plumbing shop that sends guys out to thaw frozen pipes in the middle of a Toledo winter. |
Mmm, any chance that Paris HIlton will become a war zone presenter? Never having paid any attention to the lady (no not even that), I was rather taken by her response to the fame (I am famous) ad. And as she said (if I remember correctly ) I'm hot. Added to which even the GOP think she is famous. So I humbly suggest she has all the attributes.
Added to which, in my mind she is now irrevocably associated with the rise of Obama. So as Obama starts his term(s) it seems only proper that Paris attain a more public role. (careful not to miss the "l" out of that word).
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 18): I listened to Anderson Cooper before whine that some Australian politician is the one who is making Obama stay in a hotel and why couldn't they kick him out and let Obama stay. I mean the entitlement just oozes out of these people. |
Anderson Cooper is a 3rd generation Vanderbilt. How could he not ooze some kind of entitlement? Upper crust New York elite are always oozing something...but they rarely put their asses on the line in places like Niger, the Congo, and swimming cageless with great white sharks in South Africa to highlight a serious environmental issue with global implications (imagine the wars we'd have if seafood stocks went awry thanks to shark extinction?) Give the guy at least a little credit...he quite easily could have ended up being just another rich gay son on Entertainment Tonight.
If you need someone to blame / throw a rock in the air / you'll hit someone guilty
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 19): You make astonishing leaps of the mind. |
He's just following the leader. Have you seen Joe's interviews? (Where Joe is the one being interviewed) What he says makes no sense, has no basis in truth and he cannot defend his positions with sources of any kind.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eSJuWgZGYo
It is somewhat ironic that Joe claimed Obama means the death of Israel, now he is on the way to that still-exsiting country. I imagine in several months he will be paraded around right-wing circles as the "savior" of Israel and several unnamed posters here will be lined up to clean out his plumber's crack with their tongues.
Journalism is a profession. Journalists have sources and facts. Joe is not a "journalist". He was sent on assignment by a website to report whatever they tell him to report and get the site some publicity. That can range from PR to marketing to consulting. But not journalism.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 23): Anderson Cooper is a 3rd generation Vanderbilt. How could he not ooze some kind of entitlement? |
And he is HOT!
| Quoting WellHung (Reply 24): Joe is not a "journalist". |
He is barely a plumber!
Step into my office, baby
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting WellHung (Reply 24): I imagine in several months he will be paraded around right-wing circles as the "savior" of Israel and several unnamed posters here will be lined up to clean out his plumber's crack with their tongues. |
You made my day.
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
Surprised you guys didn't catch this from the article:
"Often lost"!?? What the hell is "often lost" about the Israeli reason? We see pictures of the air raids, Kassam missiles, frightened Israelis etc. every single day. But probably still not often enough in Mr Wurzelbacher's eyes.
This Wurzelbacher character simply has a very conservative agenda. I suspected that during the campaigns already; I somehow had the feeling that he wasn't really interested in the taxating plans. He just wanted the conservative candidate to win.
| Quote: Wurzelbacher will travel to Israel to report for the conservative website, pjtv.com. He intends to get the, often lost, Israeli reason for the offensive against Hamas. |
"Often lost"!?? What the hell is "often lost" about the Israeli reason? We see pictures of the air raids, Kassam missiles, frightened Israelis etc. every single day. But probably still not often enough in Mr Wurzelbacher's eyes.
This Wurzelbacher character simply has a very conservative agenda. I suspected that during the campaigns already; I somehow had the feeling that he wasn't really interested in the taxating plans. He just wanted the conservative candidate to win.
Samson was a biblical tough guy, but his dad Samsonite was even more of a hard case.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 19): We're talking about newspeople, not politicians. |
Don't both do a job?
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 19): Threatened? You make astonishing leaps of the mind. I am amused by it. |
Maybe not you but some here and most certainly CNN. If Joe begins to take off and become popular I can't wait to see the look on Wolf and Cooper's faces. Priceless!
| Quoting Dougloid (Reply 20): I'm having trouble figuring out whether you think Joe da War Correspondent is a suspect or a victim. I think Joe's got an eye for the main chance and fooling around in the middle east is probably better duty than thawing frozen pipes in the middle of a Toledo winter-or owning a plumbing shop that sends guys out to thaw frozen pipes in the middle of a Toledo winter. Parenthetically, commie queer though I may be I see a lot of myself in Joe-only because unlike some people here I have blue collar working class roots and I've never forgotten them. How are your working class credentials? |
Why call him "da War" anything? Why the insult? I don't think neither of him but I applaud his actions either way. He is just some guy taking advantage of the same hateful media that makes celebs out of people everyday. I am just so happy that he has totally pissed off CNN.
| Quoting Baroque (Reply 22): Mmm, any chance that Paris HIlton will become a war zone presenter? |
More insults. What does she have to do with this?
| Quoting Aaron747 (Reply 23): Give the guy at least a little credit...he quite easily could have ended up being just another rich gay son on Entertainment Tonight |
Yout absolutely right. It is funny to watch how miffed he is at this though.
| Quoting WellHung (Reply 24): I imagine in several months he will be paraded around right-wing circles as the "savior" of Israel and several unnamed posters here will be lined up to clean out his plumber's crack with their tongues. |
Wow I just found someone who is more scared of this guy than Anderson Cooper.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 28): Don't both do a job? |
They both "do a job," but the requirements are diametrically different.
It is similar to people saying that they don't need to speak good English as long as people understand them.
An airline pilot or a concert violinist or a doctor can't say that. Or - hopefully - doesn't.
Reporting news is, or should, be a discipline - just the facts.
Opinion is anyone's guess and any ol' Joe can become a politician, just as it seems any ol' Joe can become a news person these days.
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 28): What does she have to do with this? |
About as much as Caroline Kennedy, perhaps.
mariner
aeternum nauta
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Canuckpaxguy (Reply 5): Isn't this guy's "15 minutes" up yet? |
Appaently not, unfortunately
| Quoting Pyrex (Reply 11): Especially considering the amount of houses McCain owns, you would have thought at least one of them would be having plumbing problems. |
Considering his age, McCain's "plumbing" problems are probably of a more personal nature
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 28): Quoting WellHung (Reply 24): I imagine in several months he will be paraded around right-wing circles as the "savior" of Israel and several unnamed posters here will be lined up to clean out his plumber's crack with their tongues. Wow I just found someone who is more scared of this guy than Anderson Cooper. |
Pucker up!!
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 28): Why call him "da War" anything? Why the insult? |
OK. Joe da Victim it is.
You didn't tell me about your working class cred, though. I mean, I'm blue collar to the core and I think I have a pretty good idea of what makes Joe tick. Do you?
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Dougloid (Reply 32): Joe da Victim |
Joey Joe Joe Junior Shabbadoo da tax evader
Joe da guy who collected unemployment then cried about his non-existant "wealth" being "redistributed"
| Quoting Dougloid (Reply 32): You didn't tell me about your working class cred, though |
He brought a backpack on a boat once. He's a longshoreman.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting WellHung (Reply 24): I imagine in several months he will be paraded around right-wing circles as the "savior" of Israel and several unnamed posters here will be lined up to clean out his plumber's crack with their tongues. |
That was the best quote in this thread!
Bring back the Concorde
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Dougloid (Reply 32): You didn't tell me about your working class cred, though. I mean, I'm blue collar to the core and I think I have a pretty good idea of what makes Joe tick. Do you? |
No of course not. I was born into a rich family and never have worked.
Don't worry, if you want to be the who works for a living police trust me I have earned everything I have and know what makes Joe tick.
| Quoting WellHung (Reply 33): He brought a backpack on a boat once. He's a longshoreman. |
LOL, good one.
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 29): Opinion is anyone's guess and any ol' Joe can become a politician |
Well if some reject like Al Franken can it just proves that anyone can, even if your name is not Kennedy and you can just make a phone call.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
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RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 35): Well if some reject like Al Franken can it just proves that anyone can, |
Reject? On the contrary...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_mwsDFm7bQ
Mick, eat your heart out.
Ain't I a stinker?
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 6): Glad to see the same sentiment here as on CNN when they ran the piece. So much entitlement. How dare he try to be a correspondant! I guess the second you earn your living doing manual labor you forever precluded from anything else. Typical. |
That's not how I read the response.
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 15): I'm offended that Joe the Plumber thinks he could be a news guy. He's never trained for it, he's got no experience of it in his resume and we know he has no objectivity. |
As some stated, its not even his experience, as that can be acquired. His comment about Obama being the death of Israel speaks volumes to his "objectivity", or more precisely, lack of objectivity.
Franken and Kennedy, neither are rejects. They have impressive resumes. As stated, they too will learn as they go.
Forum moderator 2001-2010; He's a pedantic, pontificating, pretentious bastard, a belligerent old fart, a worthless st
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Corresponde
| Quoting Mirrodie (Reply 39): As some stated, its not even his experience, as that can be acquired |
It is for me. Nothing in his resume equips him for this job - neither training nor experience.
But there are fine schools of journalism in Ohio, and I'd be pretty sure that there are excellent graduates who could use this experience to advantage in their career.
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 35): Well if some reject like Al Franken can it just proves that anyone can, even if your name is not Kennedy and you can just make a phone call. |
You complain because Caroline Kennedy may - stress "may" - get selected to be a Senator but you also complain because Al Franken is elected a Senator.
You complain that Caroline Kennedy may be inexperienced and is relying on considerable celebrity.
But you cheer because Joe the Plumber gets a job for which he has zero experience and only a teensy weensy moment of celebrity.
Odd. Very odd.
mariner
aeternum nauta
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 40): You complain because Caroline Kennedy may - stress "may" - get selected to be a Senator but you also complain because Al Franken is elected a Senator. |
May? Come on you must be joking. She laid the biggest powerplay on the Gov of NY. He has no choice at this point. He will pick her.
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 40): But you cheer because Joe the Plumber gets a job for which he has zero experience and only a teensy weensy moment of celebrity. |
Wrong on both counts. I have never cheered him, only pointed out how CNN reacted like "how dare he!" and respected his right to do what he is doing without the eilitst fraternity condemning him because he never went to learn to carry a microphone. Also I think his celebrity is a bit more than a "teensy weeney" and only growing the more Sir Anderson Cooper gives him time on CNN. I got my popcorn and I am going to sit back and watch this guy get bigger and bigger while the Aristocrats and Poppy Babcock cry foul because his blood isn't blue.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 41): He will pick her. |
He may. I cannot predict the future.
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 41): I have never cheered him |
You give a good impression of it:
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 41): I got my popcorn and I am going to sit back and watch this guy get bigger and bigger while the Aristocrats and Poppy Babcock cry foul because his blood isn't blue. |
"getting bigger and bigger" reads like cheering him on to me.
mariner
aeternum nauta
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 42): He may. I cannot predict the future. |
I would be a monkey's uncle if he didn't. She laid so much pressure on his shoulders and I am sure he is getting pressure from other angles. Time will tell but something tells me it's been a done deal for some time now. Business as usual.
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 42): You give a good impression of it |
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 42): getting bigger and bigger" reads like cheering him on to me. |
Sir if not agreeing with the crowd here that hates this guy because he exposed Obama for what he was (at the time) and is just some johnny lunchbox until he of course dared to do something that only college educated Anderson Cooper types are allowed to do well then I guess I am cheering him. In reality I am cheering the fact he irks the lot of you and CNN in addition to hoping he only gets bigger so that vein in you neck gets bigger. Ok here you go.
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Rah Rah Joe!
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 44): I guess I am cheering him. |
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 44): In reality I am cheering the fact he irks the lot of you and CNN in addition to hoping he only gets bigger so that vein in you neck gets bigger. |
The reasons are irrelevant. You;re still cheering him on.
You're cheering the fact that he gets a job for which he is totally unqualified when that same job could go to someone who might actually deserve it.
I shrug.
mariner
aeternum nauta
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 40): But you cheer because Joe the Plumber gets a job for which he has zero experience and only a teensy weensy moment of celebrity. |
Not surprising at all. I think the brother can see Russia from his back yard
.
If you believe in coincidence, you haven't looked close enough-Joe Leaphorn
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting Mariner (Reply 45): You're cheering the fact that he gets a job for which he is totally unqualified when that same job could go to someone who might actually deserve it. |
Oh my this has really gotten to you hasn't it? You hate this guy so much for the same reason you hate Palin. Give it a rest. His job could go to someone else? Please. Sounds like a CNN sound byte. Stop hating somoene simply because he wouldn't stay in his punch clock world. The guy can do whatever he wants. This is America. We don't have the caste system where you have to know someone or have the right last name to get a job that doesn't entail carrying a toolbox. The more you hate him the more I will cheer that he does succeed and that we see this guy in the news all the way to the 2012 election! Boy would that be a treat.
90 Day Fiancé has taught me that Russian woman are excellent.
RE: “Joe The Plumber” Now “Joe The War Correspondent”
| Quoting NIKV69 (Reply 47): Oh my this has really gotten to you hasn't it? You hate this guy so much for the same reason you hate Palin. |
You keep making these weird associations. Where do you get all this "hate" from?
How does a statement of opinion become an expression of hate? Is it something deep inside yourself?
mariner
aeternum nauta