usair320
Topic Author
Posts: 909
Joined: Mon Nov 10, 2003 9:53 am

Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:49 am

Here's my short history:

1996 Republican primary:
Steve Forbes (R)

1996 General:
Dole/Kemp (R)

2000 GOP Primary:
John McCain (R)

2000 General:
Bush/Cheney (R)

2004 General:
Badnarik (L)

2008 GOP Primary:
Ron Paul (R)

2008 general:

Barack Obama (D)
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:53 am

1992 Democratic Primary
Bill Clinton

1992 General
Bill Clinton


1996 Democratic Primary
Bill Clinton

1996 General
Bill Clinton



2000 Democratic Primary
Bill Bradley

2000 General
Al Gore


2004 Democratic Primary
John Edwards

2004 General
John Kerry


2008 Democratic Primary
John Edwards

2008 General
Barack Obama
Bring back the Concorde
 
flymia
Posts: 7117
Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2001 6:33 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 3:55 am

2008 Election
McCain.
"It was just four of us on the flight deck, trying to do our job" (Captain Al Haynes)
 
rfields5421
Posts: 5907
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:27 am

72 - against Nixon
76 - Ford
80 - Reagan
84 - Reagan
88 - Bush
92 - Bush
96 - Dole
00 - Gore
04 - Kerry
08 - McCain

Damned, did not realize I've voted for that long.
 
usair320
Topic Author
Posts: 909
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:39 am



Quoting RFields5421 (Reply 3):
against Nixon

So McGovern?
 
N174UA
Posts: 1010
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:17 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:40 am

5 elections for me so far...

1992 - Bill Clinton
1996 - Bill Clinton (mainly a protest vote against Bob Dole)
2000 - George W. Bush
2004 - George W. Bush
2008 - John McCain

I'm 4-1...not bad. I plan to return to my winning ways in 2012...  biggrin 
 
andaman
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:41 am

1994 Mrs Elisabeth Rehn (Swedish Party, became 2nd)
2000 Mrs Tarja Halonen (Social Democratic, elected)
2006 Mrs Tarja Halonen (............................elected)

 Wink
Chinese cookie in SFO: "You're doomed to a life of forever travelling abroad and to be able to afford it!"
 
airxliban
Posts: 4307
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:50 am

Assuming we're talking about US Presidential elections:

1992: wasn't old enough to vote, but was sympathetic to Bush I based on personalities

1996: around grade 8, wasn't old enough to care

2000: wasn't old enough to vote, but helped campaign for the green party

2004: Ralph Nader

2008: Ralph Nader

2012: To be seen...
PARIS, FRANCE...THE BEIRUT OF EUROPE.
 
ArmitageShanks
Posts: 3780
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 5:30 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:07 am

2004: Bush
2008: McCain (wanted to vote for Barr)

Local elections I've voted republican as well because I know most of them personally and agree with what they believe.

I consider myself a Libertarian.
 
PhilGil
Posts: 228
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:29 am

1976: Carter
1980: I think I voted for John Anderson
1984: Mondale
1988: Dukakis
1992: Bush
1996: Dole
2000: No vote - couldn't bring myself to vote for Bush or Gore
2004: Kerry
2008: Obama
 
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Moose135
Posts: 3078
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 6:47 am



Quoting N174UA (Reply 5):
I'm 4-1...not bad. I plan to return to my winning ways in 2012... biggrin

Going to vote for Obama next time?

1980 - John Anderson
1984 - Walter Mondale
1988 - Mike Dukakis
1992 - Bill Clinton
1996 - Bill Clinton
2000 - Al Gore
2004 - John Kerry
2008 - Barak Obama
KC-135 - Passing gas and taking names!
 
N174UA
Posts: 1010
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:17 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 7:05 am



Quoting Moose135 (Reply 10):
Going to vote for Obama next time?

Maybe. But he's going to have to show me a LOT between now and then. If he can show me that he's a centrist willing to work with the minority to solve some big problems, then I will take that into account when I mark my ballot in 2012. I've voted for a Democrat before, and I might again - but....it all depends who runs....on both sides.
 
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fraspotter
Posts: 2248
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 7:24 am

At the age of 20 (at the time the elections took place), this election cycle was the first presidential election that I took part in.

March '08 Texas Primary
-Obama

November '08 General Election
-Obama

 Smile
"The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee."

— Gunter's Second Law of Air Travel
 
Elite
Posts: 2297
Joined: Thu Jun 29, 2006 6:31 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:05 am

I'll just start from the time I cared enough to chose and back one candidate:

2000: George Bush

2004: George Bush

2008 John McCain

[Edited 2009-02-10 00:05:25]
 
ABQ747
Posts: 648
Joined: Wed Dec 20, 2006 8:22 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 9:39 am

2004 - George W Bush (R)

2008 - John McCain (R)
 
kalakaua
Posts: 1430
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:23 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:04 am

00 Bush
04 Bush
08 McCain
Gravity explains the motions of the planets, but it cannot explain who set the planets in motion.
 
MarSciGuy
Posts: 456
Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2007 12:14 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 1:03 pm

00 NH Primary: McCain
00 General Election: Gore

04 NH Primary: Clark
04 General Election: Kerry

08 RI Primary: Obama
08 General: Obama
"There weren't a ton of gnats there where a ton of gnats and their families as well!"
 
rfields5421
Posts: 5907
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 1:26 pm



Quoting Usair320 (Reply 4):
So McGovern?

Don't remember - I think I did a write-in. I was sitting in a muddy tent close to Danang at the time I voted absentee in Oct 72 and only knew that Nixon's campaign speeches about peace with honor and accounting for ALL the POWs were lies.

I do remember my father telling me that the vote in our home town was unanimous for Nixon, until they opened the one absentee ballot. But by the time I got home in the spring of 74, nobody was proud of their votes for Nixon.
 
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falstaff
Posts: 5740
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 1:35 pm

Clinton, Bush, Kerry, and McCain are the presidents I voted for.

I usually vote Republican for anyone else running for anything. The exception being if the democrat in question is a strong pro gun canidate, such as John Dingell. I figure the dems need some more pro gun people.



Quoting PhilGil (Reply 9):
2000: No vote - couldn't bring myself to vote for Bush or Gore

That was probably a good choice. Gore would have been a horrible president.

Quoting Airxliban (Reply 7):
2000: wasn't old enough to vote, but helped campaign for the green party

2004: Ralph Nader

2008: Ralph Nader

Green heh? You must like Republicans. Superfly has a theory that GREEN means Getting Republicans Elected Every November. I agree with the fly on this one. People like Nader take votes away from Democrats. People that lean right will likely never vote for a green canidate.

Superfly,

I know you would have voted for Carter if you had been old enough!
My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
 
PHLBOS
Posts: 6516
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:38 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 2:30 pm

1984 Primary: Reagan
1984 General: Reagan

1988 Primary: Gephardt
1988 General: Bush

Moved from Massachusetts to Pennsylvania in 1990; reason for mentioning this is given below.

1992 Primary: DNV
(In Pennsylvania, registered Independents aren't allowed to vote for party candidates. In contrast, Massachusetts was one of 9 states that allowed Independents to register under one of the parties, vote & reregister as an Independent all on the same day - plus, Massachusetts is a Super Tuesday state whereas Pennsylvania is one of the last states to hold a primary)
1992 General: Bush

1996 Primary: Dole
(Registered as Republican well beforehand, then re-registered as an Independent)
1996 General: Dole

2000 Primary: Bradley
(Registered as Democrat well beforehand, then re-registered as an Independent) Note: Bradley dropped out of the race 3 weeks before the PA primary.
2000 General: Bush

2004 Primary: Bush
(Registered as Republican for the 2002 Primary to vote against Sen. Arlen Specter and remained a Registered Republican)
2004 General: Bush

2008 Primary: Paul
2008 General: McCain
"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
 
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STT757
Posts: 13966
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 2:35 pm

The first time I was old enough to vote in a Presidential election was 1996, I was 21. I'm registered as an Independent, here's my voting history.

1996:
Dole/Kemp

2000:
Bush/ Cheney

2004:
Kerry/Edwards

2008:
Obama/Biden

The only one I regret is voting for Bush/ Cheney in 2000, I was naive to believe the "compassionate conservative" line. I was also pissed about how Clinton treated the Office, even though he had a good Presidency I had visions of him in Sweat pants getting a BJ while smoking a Cigar and eating a bucket of fried chicken in the Oval Office. Also a big factor in my support for George W. Bush in 2000 was that I really admire his Father, George H.W Bush was probably our most competent President. I regret I was only 17 in 1992, otherwise I would have voted for him.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
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falstaff
Posts: 5740
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 4:20 pm



Quoting STT757 (Reply 20):
I had visions of him in Sweat pants getting a BJ while smoking a Cigar and eating a bucket of fried chicken in the Oval Office.

That is a funny image and probably true. Don't forget the 40 ounce beer to wsh it down.
My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
 
srbmod
Posts: 15446
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:32 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 7:57 pm

1996 Primary: Steve Forbes (R)
1996 Election: Harry Browne (L)
2000 Primary: John McCain (R)
2000 Election: Al Gore (D)
2004 Primary: John Kerry (D)
2004 Election: John Kerry (D)
2008 Primary: Ron Paul (R)
2008 Election: Bob Barr (L)
 
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fxramper
Posts: 5838
Joined: Sun Dec 04, 2005 12:03 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:05 pm

00 Bush
04 Bush
08 McCain
 
LH423
Posts: 5922
Joined: Sun Jul 11, 1999 6:27 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 8:11 pm

For me:

2004: Kerry/Edwards

My 2008 absentee ballot never arrived so I wasn't able to vote in 2008 but had I it would have been for Obama/Biden.

LH423
« On ne voit bien qu'avec le cœur. L'essentiel est invisible pour les yeux » Antoine de Saint-Exupéry
 
Ken777
Posts: 9984
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 5:39 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:06 pm

1968 - Passed - on luxury cruise off North Vietnam
1972 - Nixon
1976 - Ford
1980 - Living in Australia for 8 years,
1984 - but I watched some old Reagan movies
1988 - Bush
1992 - Clinton
1996 - Clinton
2000 - Gore
2004 - Kerry, mainly against the swift boaters
2008 - Obama
 
JFKMan
Posts: 506
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2007 8:46 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:41 pm

Im only 17...so cant vote yet.

But I would of voted for Bush in 04 and McCain in 08.
NYC
 
tommy767
Posts: 4658
Joined: Sat Aug 09, 2003 12:18 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:50 pm



Quoting PhilGil (Reply 9):
1984: Mondale
1988: Dukakis
1992: Bush

This is an interesting one. Any particular reason why you voted dem during the reagan years and bush over clinton in 1992?
"KEEP CLIMBING" -- DELTA
 
greggarious
Posts: 239
Joined: Thu Jul 26, 2007 12:42 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:57 pm

2008: Barack Hussein Obama (feels good to say that!)

I didn't/couldn't vote in the FL primaries (I'm not registered with any party)
 
Jpax
Posts: 715
Joined: Sat Aug 05, 2006 5:01 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:59 pm

2008 - McCain

Of course, though, just stating my vote isn't important enough to be posted by A.net... (filler)
 
PhilGil
Posts: 228
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 7:21 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:55 am



Quoting Falstaff (Reply 18):
Quoting PhilGil (Reply 9):
2000: No vote - couldn't bring myself to vote for Bush or Gore

That was probably a good choice. Gore would have been a horrible president.

The most uninspiring candidate in my memory. However, in retrospect, I can't imagine any possible way he could have been worse than the winner of that election.

Quoting Tommy767 (Reply 27):
Quoting PhilGil (Reply 9):
1984: Mondale
1988: Dukakis
1992: Bush

This is an interesting one. Any particular reason why you voted dem during the reagan years and bush over clinton in 1992?

I've often wondered that myself. I think it's a combination of being a contrarian, a preference for competent managers over "celebrity" presidential candidates (my vote for Obama notwithstanding), an appreciation for Reagan Republicanism that developed after his term was over (and vanished during the Bush II years), and a distaste for the drama of the Clinton presidency.
 
usair320
Topic Author
Posts: 909
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:23 am



Quoting PhilGil (Reply 30):
The most uninspiring candidate in my memory. However, in retrospect, I can't imagine any possible way he could have been worse than the winner of that election.

Neither can I, but he might have only been slightly better. We would have still gone to Iraq for sure. I voted for McCain in the 2000 primary because I did not trust something about Bush. In the General I was on the fence, but ultimately went with Bush due to my respect for his father (and my Republican registration, which I still hold proudly even after voting for Obama) as a president. I guess my feeling was true, which is why I voted Liberterian in 2004 ( No way in Hell would have I voted for Kerry).
 
airxliban
Posts: 4307
Joined: Wed Oct 01, 2003 12:14 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Wed Feb 11, 2009 1:17 pm



Quoting Falstaff (Reply 18):
Green heh? You must like Republicans. Superfly has a theory that GREEN means Getting Republicans Elected Every November. I agree with the fly on this one. People like Nader take votes away from Democrats. People that lean right will likely never vote for a green canidate.

I know some people believe this - and there it may be some truth to it, however I am unaware of any proof that Nader ever cost the Democrats any election. Obviously not in 2008, certainly not in 2004, the only argument to possibly be had is that he cost Gore the election in 2000.

From one point of view, why do we have to scapegoat Nader for this? There are so many other more relevant factors as to why Gore lost the election - you have the ballot issue, the disenfranchised voters issue, and the fact that Gore even failed to win his home state - which would have secured him the election if he had won it. Why is Nader the scapegoat, why can't we (rightly) identify the other factors including Gore's failures as a candidate to explain why GWB won the election?

In addition, I have yet to read a definitive account of whether polling data supports the conclusion that Nader stole the election from Gore. I have seen different sources which all come to different conclusions. If anyone has a strong viewpoint on the issue or a good link, let me know. If you tally up the Florida votes - Bush, Gore, Nader, Other, and then you break the Nader votes down into how many would have voted for Bush, Gore, Other candidates, or not voted at all then add them to each candidate's respective tallies then that would at least give us an accurate picture of whether Gore would have won if Nader had not been a candidate.

Even if that was the case, I don't think that the conclusion should be for Nader to have withdrawn or for the voting population to not for him. Why we always have to vote for the better of two evils? Why can't we vote for the person who we believe is the best candidate for the job even though he may not have a chance of winning? If people always vote one of the two major candidates, then we can basically ensure that third parties will never have a reasonable chance of accessing public funds, getting on the ballot, and partcipating in the debates. Less choice, less democracy?
PARIS, FRANCE...THE BEIRUT OF EUROPE.
 
rfields5421
Posts: 5907
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Wed Feb 11, 2009 2:55 pm



Quoting Airxliban (Reply 32):
why do we have to scapegoat Nader for this?

It is not scapegoating, it is just math.

Of the votes cast for Nader in Florida - if 22% of them had voted for Gore and 20% for Bush and 58% stayed home - Gore would have been President.

Strongish third party candidates always make the winner electoral vote look stronger than it was. Perot's 18.9% of the 1992 election costs Bush between 59 and 80 electoral votes which probably would have given him a second term.

George Wallace's 46 electoral votes would not have put Humphrey in the White House - but another 45 electoral votes would likely have gone to Humphrey rather than Nixon - which would have given HHH the victory.

While questions about 1968 and 1992 require a hard look at the state vote totals, sometimes even county level votes, 2000 is easy to identify - because the difference was so small - 537 votes.

Though you could also make the argument that Buchanan, Browne, Hagelin, Phillips each changed the results - even Phillips 1,378 votes going vastly to Gore would have swung the election.
 
JakeOrion
Posts: 1090
Joined: Fri Oct 07, 2005 11:13 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:10 pm

2000: Bush
2004: (Reluctantly) Bush
2008: Bob Barr
Every problem has a simple solution; finding the simple solution is the difficult problem.
 
PhilGil
Posts: 228
Joined: Mon Jan 31, 2005 7:21 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Wed Feb 11, 2009 9:37 pm



Quoting Usair320 (Reply 31):
We would have still gone to Iraq for sure

Why do you think Gore would have gone to Iraq? The Clinton administration (and a hypothetical Gore administration) would have continued to talk tough on Iraq, but I can't imagine they would have initiated a ground invasion.

The Iraq invasion was was advocated and supported by members of the Bush administration who had bought into the ideas disseminated by of Bill Kristol's organization The Project for the New American Century.
 
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seb146
Posts: 21228
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 1999 7:19 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Thu Feb 12, 2009 2:24 am

I do not remember who I voted for in any of the primaries except this last one: I wrote in Kuscinich. However:

1992: Clinton
1996: Perot
2000: Gore
2004: Kerry
2008: Obama

I registered to vote when I turned 18 in 1989. My first "real" election was the 1990 Oregon governers race when I voted against Babs Roberts.

I find it interesting that some of the other posters felt they had no choice but McCain or Obama. Were there not third party candidates in other states? I know they are not usualy in all 50 states, but, surely there must have been a candidate closer to your beliefs than just those two.
You bet I'm pumped!!! I just had a green tea!!!
 
ltbewr
Posts: 14494
Joined: Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Thu Feb 12, 2009 2:42 am

Since 1972, the first year I could vote (and the first Presidential 18 year olds could vote in the USA) I have always voted for a Democrat. In the primaries I have voted in for Demo canidates, I most likely voted for the winner of the nomination as until last year, the primary elections were in early June.
 
MD11junkie
Posts: 2514
Joined: Tue May 10, 2005 4:59 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Thu Feb 12, 2009 3:38 am

2003 - Presidential: Ricardo López Murphy (RECREAR)
2007 - Presidential: Elisa Carrio (Coalición Cívica)

Saludos,

[Edited 2009-02-11 19:56:40]
There is no such thing as Boeing vs Airbus as the queen of the skies has three engines, winglets and the sweetest nose!
 
N174UA
Posts: 1010
Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 4:17 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Thu Feb 12, 2009 4:46 am



Quoting Seb146 (Reply 36):
I registered to vote when I turned 18 in 1989. My first "real" election was the 1990 Oregon governers race when I voted against Babs Roberts.

My first governor's election was also in Oregon, in 1994. Voted for Kitzhaber. Then moved to WA where I voted for that Locke idiot (twice!) and then switched over to Dino Rossi. Maybe I should just stop talking about my voting record for governor...but, they're not that bad. My Aunt and Uncle actually voted for Rod Blagoyevich...at least I don't have to deal with that shame.

Back to the Prez record - I've become more conservative as I get older, hence the switch to W in 2000. Still, McCain would have been a better president from 2001-09. I'd be willing to vote for a conservative Democrat, but I just don't see any viable candidates who fit that mold.

As far as a 3rd party goes - unless one of them gets a big donation and establishes a big enough network, I don't see anyone challenging the establishment. A spoiler maybe, and we've seen that twice ('92 and 2000).
 
Confuscius
Posts: 3674
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RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Thu Feb 12, 2009 6:44 pm

1984 - Hall / Davis

Ain't I a stinker?
 
NorthstarBoy
Posts: 1416
Joined: Tue Jun 07, 2005 12:53 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Fri Feb 13, 2009 3:22 am

1988-Dukakis
1992-Bill Clinton
1996-Bill Clinton
2000-Al Gore
2004-John Kerry
2008 primary-Hillary
2008 General-Obama

as for state/local elections, i vote party line democrat.
Yes, I'd like to see airbus go under so Boeing can have their customers!
 
Braniff747SP
Posts: 2576
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:56 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Fri Feb 13, 2009 3:56 am

Cant vote, but I am Pro-GOP.
The 747 will always be the TRUE queen of the skies!
 
FlyDeltaJets87
Posts: 4479
Joined: Fri Aug 11, 2006 3:51 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Sun Feb 15, 2009 4:32 am

First Presidential Election I was able to vote in was this past one: 2008

2008: McCain
"Let's Roll"- Todd Beamer, United Airlines Flight 93, Sept. 11, 2001
 
KL642
Posts: 250
Joined: Mon May 24, 2004 5:07 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Thu Feb 19, 2009 7:38 am

1980-Reagan
1984-Reagan
1988-Bush
1992-Clinton
1996-Clinton
2000-Gore
2004-Kerry
2008-Obama
 
dragon-wings
Posts: 4123
Joined: Fri Apr 06, 2001 4:55 am

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Thu Feb 19, 2009 8:37 am

1992 - George H W Bush
1996 - Bill Clinton
2000 - George W Bush
2004 - John Kerry
2008 - Barack Obama

I registered to vote in my senior year of high school, and I don't remember how I registered. I don't know if Im a registered Republican, Demorcrat, or Independent.
Don't give up don't ever give up - Jim Valvano
 
max550
Posts: 725
Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2007 9:46 pm

RE: Your Presidential Voting History?

Thu Feb 19, 2009 5:15 pm

I've only been able to vote for 6 years but here it is:
'04 PA Primary: Dennis Kucinich (at the time of our primary in late April Kerry was already the nominee)
'04 General: Kerry/Edwards

'08 Primary: Obama (since it mattered that time)
'08 General: Obama/Biden

Why does the spell check still think I spelled both Obama and Biden wrong, is there some right wing conspiracy going on here?

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