Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
PPVRA
Topic Author
Posts: 8471
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

Freight Maglev Train In California?

Sun Apr 26, 2009 8:28 pm



Quote:
Freight maglev study
Intermodal train.

24 Nov 2008


USA: Despite a conspicuous lack of progress in developing maglev for the passenger sector, it seems that North America remains fixated with the concept.

We hear that Union Pacific has commissioned Skytech Transportation and American Maglev Technology to develop a feasibility study for an 8 km maglev line to carry freight. UP is planning to double the capacity of its Intermodal Container Transfer Facility in Long Beach to 1·5 million TEUs a year, bringing the prospect of even more drayage trucks shuttling containers to and from the ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach.

http://www.railwaygazette.com/news_v.../11/9080/freight_maglev_study.html





It's more of a shuttle thing, but it would be interesting to see it built. I also found a follow-up story, which is a bit more recent:

Quote:
Freight maglev on test
The General Atomics test track uses passive maglev technology. (Photo: David Lustig)

09 Feb 2009


USA: We reported last year that Union Pacific had commissioned a study into an 8 km maglev conveyor to shuttle containers between the ports of Los Angeles and Long Beach and its Intermodal Container Transfer Facility.

Suitable technology is now under development in San Diego, where General Atomics has built a 120 m long test track. Unlike the Transrapid maglev in Shanghai, which uses electromagnets on the vehicles to achieve lift and linear motors for propulsion, General Atomics has adopted a passive technology, with the equipment in the guideway.

According to Sam Gurol, the company’s Director of Maglev Systems, ‘there have been great strides in the last 15 to 20 years in how much magnetic field permanent magnets can produce, allowing us to make a system entirely of passive permanent magnets for both levitation and propulsion.’

This avoids the need for an onboard power supply. ‘You have the moving magnetic field produced by the track, and the chassis just goes along for the ride.’


http://www.railwaygazette.com/news_v...2/9313/freight_maglev_on_test.html

Sounds like a very creative idea to me, hope they find it worth it. I suppose they could also opt for standard tracks, possibly even driver-less.
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
Rj111
Posts: 3007
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:02 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Sun Apr 26, 2009 10:47 pm

Would have thought freight would benefit the least from maglev, given the extreme weight and little need for speed combo. In addition, freight tracks and carriages in general are simple and cheap. Maglev carriages and track would be complicated and no doubt expensive.

I could see why it would be useful for a shuttle between ports/yard though as it's basically doing the job of shunters. But i doubt we'll see it on mainline freight for a very long time.
 
cpd
Posts: 6305
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:46 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Mon Apr 27, 2009 11:19 am



Quoting PPVRA (Thread starter):

Sounds like a very creative idea to me, hope they find it worth it. I suppose they could also opt for standard tracks, possibly even driver-less.

The idea of the drive coming from the guide-way is exactly what Transrapid adopted so long ago. It's possible that this is a worthwhile use of the technology.
 
Stealthz
Posts: 5556
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:43 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Mon Apr 27, 2009 1:35 pm



Quoting PPVRA (Thread starter):
allowing us to make a system entirely of passive permanent magnets for both levitation and propulsion.’

I am having trouble with this part, I understand how a permanent magnet could be used for levitation and I have seen videos of how a linear arrangement of fixed permanent magnets will propel a perm. magnet along a guideway.
What I don't understand is how you control the vehicle.
How do you accelerate, brake and stop the vehicle?

Cheers
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!....well that might have changed!!!
 
Brendan03
Posts: 928
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2005 3:55 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Mon Apr 27, 2009 3:03 pm



Quoting StealthZ (Reply 3):
How do you accelerate, brake and stop the vehicle?

I'm no expert in the field but the easiest way I ever come to comprehend it, Is like playing with a model train set... You sit there playing with an electric switch to put current into the tracks, the decrease of current causes the vehicle to slow down, increasing it makes it speed up.
Coolier than thou.
 
User avatar
falstaff
Posts: 5744
Joined: Sun Jun 25, 2006 6:17 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Mon Apr 27, 2009 3:39 pm



Quoting RJ111 (Reply 1):
I could see why it would be useful for a shuttle between ports/yard though as it's basically doing the job of shunters. But i doubt we'll see it on mainline freight for a very long time.

I can see it being usefull to for this application. Also the type of railroad cars being used are all the same, shipping containers in this case. However on the mainline trains can be made up of many different types of cars. Another area that it wouldn't work would in local freight service. The local may stop at dozens of business along a route each possibly needing a different type of rairoad car(s). The time and money needed to upgrade the entire railroad car fleet and industrial spurs/sidings would be cost prohibitive.
My mug slaketh over on Falstaff N503
 
Stealthz
Posts: 5556
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:43 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Mon Apr 27, 2009 9:14 pm



Quoting Brendan03 (Reply 4):
You sit there playing with an electric switch to put current into the tracks, the decrease of current causes the vehicle to slow down, increasing it makes it speed up.

By my understanding of the subject this would not work with permanent magnets as you cannot control the field.

Cheers
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!....well that might have changed!!!
 
Brendan03
Posts: 928
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2005 3:55 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:43 am



Quoting StealthZ (Reply 6):
By my understanding of the subject this would not work with permanent magnets as you cannot control the field.

Don't they use electromagnets on the train? using a stronger field to attracted then propel?
Coolier than thou.
 
Stealthz
Posts: 5556
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:43 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:50 am



Quoting Brendan03 (Reply 7):
Don't they use electromagnets on the train? using a stronger field to attracted then propel?

Yes, the Transrapid version as used in Shanghai uses a linear motor(effectively a series of electromagnets) for propulsion and braking.
The model proposed for Long Beach proposes permanent magnets and I don't see how you would control these.
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!....well that might have changed!!!
 
Brendan03
Posts: 928
Joined: Wed Aug 03, 2005 3:55 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:16 pm



Quoting StealthZ (Reply 8):
Yes, the Transrapid version as used in Shanghai uses a linear motor(effectively a series of electromagnets) for propulsion and braking.

I've caught that, Very interesting and smooth... I didn't realise it was a permanent magnet system either... No idea how this will work then either...
Coolier than thou.
 
User avatar
LTU932
Posts: 13702
Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:34 am

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:13 pm

It will be very expensive. Billions of Euros have been spent on developing the Transrapid in Germany and so far, it's the most expensive failure in German history. Not a single train operator in Germany, not even Deutsche Bahn, has built a single maglev track for the Transrapid, despite plans to build the airport shuttle that should connect MUC with Munich Central Station, and one to build a Transrapid track between Hamburg and Berlin in 1993. Nothing has ever happened. Shanghai is the only place where the Transrapid has found an application, and it's a fact that the Chinese will reverse engineer this technology, basically stealing it from the German companies that developed the Transrapid.

As for a freight maglev, I have my doubts about it, even more doubts than for the passenger maglev, especially if you're trying to haul metal containers from A to B with a huge electricity source beneath them. In conventional electric freight trains, you at least have only the locomotive connected to the electric overhead wiring via a pantograph, not the whole train.
Sometimes the only thing more dangerous than a question is an answer. - Ferengi Rule of Acquisition 208
 
flyboyseven
Posts: 803
Joined: Sun Feb 04, 2007 12:24 pm

RE: Freight Maglev Train In California?

Wed Apr 29, 2009 11:54 pm



Quoting LTU932 (Reply 10):
As for a freight maglev, I have my doubts about it, even more doubts than for the passenger maglev, especially if you're trying to haul metal containers from A to B with a huge electricity source beneath them. In conventional electric freight trains, you at least have only the locomotive connected to the electric overhead wiring via a pantograph, not the whole train.

Someone correct me if I am wrong, but only the part of the track that the train is over, as well as just ahead and behind is actually powered at any time. I remember that form watching tv shows about the MAGLEV. I think it would be a really cool addition to any port.
As long as the number of take-offs equals the number of landings...you're doing fine.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: SL1200MK2 and 14 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos