andz
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Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:34 am

THE woman who knocked over Pope Benedict XVI as he celebrated Christmas Eve Mass at the Vatican was behind a similar attack last year, sources claim.

The woman, dressed in a red jacket and dark trousers, leaping a barricade and rushing at the 82-year-old pontiff in St Peter's Basilica.

She also knocked over French Cardinal Roger Etchegaray, 87, who was taken to hospital for a check-up.

The Pope got to his feet and completed the service with no further incident.

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/pop...tican/story-e6frf7jo-1225813573645
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futurepilot16
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:40 am

I would have shot her, despite the Pope being right there. I don't know if the Pope's bodyguards carry guns, but if they do, I would have shot her. Talk about stupid, f**king stupid. What does a person gain out of doing something like this? Not just once, but twice. It's pathetic.
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DeltaMD90
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:44 am

If they shot her there'd be an international outrage and I'm sure the Church would receive bad publicity. And as stupid as she is, I don't think deadly force should be used on an attack of non-deadly force (I know he's in his 80s but still)
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 5:01 am



Quoting FuturePilot16 (Reply 1):
I would have shot her, despite the Pope being right there. I don't know if the Pope's bodyguards carry guns, but if they do, I would have shot her. Talk about stupid, f**king stupid. What does a person gain out of doing something like this? Not just once, but twice. It's pathetic.

The plainclothes Swiss Guards, who act as the Pope´s bodyguards, carry guns, but they have a policy to only use them in case of a mortal threat to the Pope. When the Pope is outside, or riding in his "Popemobile", you´ll always see some fit young to middleaged men dressed in dark suits around him. They are members of the swiss guard on plainclothes duty. Occasionally you can see the wind lifting e.g. the back of a jacket of one of these, and then you can see the holster with the SIG pistol at their belts.
While the Swiss Guards have primarely ceremonial duties, they all have served in the Swiss Army and have, besides the ceremonial halberds and swords (though the halberds and swords are sharp and the Swiss Guards know how to use them), also modern Swiss military rifles and pistols in their arsenal. They act like a police force within the Vatican, taking care of security duties. But like any civilised police force they have to use the means suitable to the threat. They can´t just kill somebody who attacks with bare hands if a short wrestling match is enough to counter the threat.
In any case, the Pope needs to be close to his congregation, and such an attack will always come as a surprise, especially since anybody can walk into St. Peter´s Cathedral. I´m quite sure that the Pope is aware of this and knows that at any time he can become the victim of a nutcase.

Jan
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 7:47 am



Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 3):

A woman jumped the barriers in St Peter's Basilica mugged the Pope and knocked him down while he was walking during the procession with all the priests. She also knocked down Cardinal Roger Etchegaray, who was taken to hospital for a check up. The Pope got up and continued his walk to the main Altar to celebrate the Christmas eve's Mass.

Link with video from the BBC site.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/8430118.stm

There have been similar incidents in different circumstances, the security breach at the White House, the attatck on Prime Minister Berlusconi and now a breach during an official ceremony at the Vatican. Looks like something's in the air. I wonder who will be next...

Sky News video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mztswNcTJo4

Cell phone video by someone sitting behind the mugger

http://www.breitbart.tv/cell-phone-v...o-shows-moment-woman-topples-pope/

They say like the did for Berlusconi thaat the woman is "mentally unstable". She was arrested by the police. The Pope got out unraffled and unaffected.

From Wiki. "Benedict XVI is theologically conservative, and his teaching and prolific[2] writings defend traditional Catholic doctrine and values. After a long career as an internationally noted academic, serving as a professor of theology at various German universities, he was appointed Archbishop of Munich and Freising and cardinal by Pope Paul VI in 1977. In 1981, he settled in Rome when he became Prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, one of the most important offices of the Roman Curia. At the time of his election as Pope, he was also Dean of the College of Cardinals, and as such the primus inter pares among the cardinals."
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Tiger119
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 8:02 am



Quoting Andz (Thread starter):
Andz

Andz, the topic name "Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky," I am sure you meant luckily the Pope was not injured or something like that, right? Not wishing the Pope bad-will? And I hope that lady gets some mental help.

David
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 8:51 am

Any A.netters here versed in psychiatry?

Why are these attackers always deemed "mentally unstable"? The one who mugged Berlusconi was said 'mentally unstable' the same with this woman who jumped the crowd from her seat in St Peter's to mug the Pope and why did she wear a bright red garment I wonder?
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andz
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 9:09 am



Quoting Tiger119 (Reply 5):
Andz, the topic name "Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky," I am sure you meant luckily the Pope was not injured or something like that, right? Not wishing the Pope bad-will? And I hope that lady gets some mental help.

I meant that this was the second time she tried it and this time she was successful. Of course I mean no ill will to the Pope.
After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
 
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scbriml
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 9:20 am

Looking at the video on the BBC's website, it's far from clear if she actually managed to lay a hand on him. One of the Swiss Guards is on her in a flash and it seems to me the pope went down in the general melee.

Quoting FuturePilot16 (Reply 1):
I would have shot her

No doubt.  sarcastic 
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777236ER
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 9:33 am

Given his views that:

"although the particular inclination of the homosexual person is not a sin, it is a more or less strong tendency ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil; and thus the inclination itself must be seen as an objective disorder"

"The various forms of the dissolution of matrimony today, like free unions, trial marriages…by people of the same sex, are rather expressions of an anarchic freedom that wrongly passes for true freedom of man."

Remember, if you voted for Obama you're "cooporating in evil',

He thinks books will "corrupt" people. He condems millions to death by telling them not to use condoms. He condemns millions to poverty by telling people not to use contraception. He refuses to ordain women, he attacks rock music...the list goes on.

He is the leader of a large group of people, claimed to be >1bn. Yet his views and actions are incompatible with the Western world and our concepts of democracy and freedom. Were he a political leader he would be rightly condemned for his bizarre ideas.

Whilst violence is not the answer in this case, this women may hopefully raise the issue of the extreme fundamentalist positions that the Catholic church takes.
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EA CO AS
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:19 am



Quoting 777236ER (Reply 9):
He is the leader of a large group of people, claimed to be >1bn. Yet his views and actions are incompatible with the Western world and our concepts of democracy and freedom.

...yet last I checked, most of those 1 billion followers were in the Western world.  sarcastic 
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fca767
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 11:44 am

Quoting 777236ER (Reply 9):
Given his views that:

"although the particular inclination of the homosexual person is not a sin, it is a more or less strong tendency ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil; and thus the inclination itself must be seen as an objective disorder"

"The various forms of the dissolution of matrimony today, like free unions, trial marriages…by people of the same sex, are rather expressions of an anarchic freedom that wrongly passes for true freedom of man."

Remember, if you voted for Obama you're "cooporating in evil',

He thinks books will "corrupt" people. He condems millions to death by telling them not to use condoms. He condemns millions to poverty by telling people not to use contraception. He refuses to ordain women, he attacks rock music...the list goes on.

He is the leader of a large group of people, claimed to be >1bn. Yet his views and actions are incompatible with the Western world and our concepts of democracy and freedom. Were he a political leader he would be rightly condemned for his bizarre ideas.

Whilst violence is not the answer in this case, this women may hopefully raise the issue of the extreme fundamentalist positions that the Catholic church takes.

I remember hearing bad things about the vatican...on UK tv but I couldn't remember...and it was annoying me that everyone here seems to like him...
I also remember Vicors who sexually abused children, and the vatican trying to cover it up...
I never heard of the vatican before this... as some may know the system is a bit backwards, though I may believe in god, just not this man made part that is the church and books made by people)

[Edited 2009-12-25 03:46:39 by FCA767]
 
777236ER
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 1:05 pm



Quoting Fca767 (Reply 11):
I also remember Vicors who sexually abused children, and the vatican trying to cover it up...

Given the repeated, systematic sexual abuse of children carried out by the Catholic church (following by the conspiracy and cover-up) one could quite easily called it a paedophile network.

"Woman pushes over head of paedophile ring" has a different tone, doesn't it?
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fca767
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 1:11 pm



Quoting 777236ER (Reply 12):
Given the repeated, systematic sexual abuse of children carried out by the Catholic church (following by the conspiracy and cover-up) one could quite easily called it a paedophile network.

"Woman pushes over head of paedophile ring" has a different tone, doesn't it?

Yes! If it wasn't for that Documentary, I would never of heard of the Vatican and I'm 27 years old, and someone who likes to learn about everything in our world.
Oh and Tomb Raider...all of a sudden the past 2 years I've heard a few mentionings of this pope and the words vatican...
 
Speedbirdie
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 2:01 pm



Quoting 777236ER (Reply 12):

Well well well, Welcome back! Big grin
Never give up..
 
AR385
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:06 pm

I believe that these attacks, the one that originated this thread, the recent Berlusconi nose job, and some others mentioned here are cowardly, distasteful and by themselves, an attack on Western values of freedom of expression and transit. It doesn´t matter whether you agree with the views and ideas of the people being attacked. These people are exposing themselves to others in public settings in order to express their views, what they believe in and their ideas. No matter how much security they have around them, at some point they are out there in the open.

I do not agree with Ratzinger. I think he is one of the most backward and intransigent Catholics out there. And I am Catholic. I think Berlusconi is a 2nd class gangster. But physically assaulting them or redoing Berlusconi´s face with Milan´s Duomo is as backward and shows as much intransigence.
 
EMBQA
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 4:14 pm



Quoting FuturePilot16 (Reply 1):
I would have shot her, despite the Pope being right there

Listen to you.. You can't just shoot people. They must pose a deadly threat to the other person. Jumping a barrier and leaping at someone is not deadly threat. Even if they have a knife in their hand it's not deadly threat until they come withing striking distance.

Quoting FuturePilot16 (Reply 1):
What does a person gain out of doing something like this? Not just once, but twice. It's pathetic.

It's called mental illness... they don't reason
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
777236ER
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Fri Dec 25, 2009 6:27 pm



Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 10):
...yet last I checked, most of those 1 billion followers were in the Western world.

So there's never been incidious evil in the west?

Quoting Speedbirdie (Reply 14):
Well well well, Welcome back! Big grin

A year goes quickly! Merry xmas Hannah.
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cgnnrw
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sat Dec 26, 2009 4:31 pm

Even if the woman is "mentally ill" nobody can deny she isn't physically fit...did you see how quickly and easily she jumped over the barrier? How many a.netters here could do that????
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MadameConcorde
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sat Dec 26, 2009 5:03 pm

The victim (Pope) is also the Head of State. Religion really has nothing to do with it.

Most countries have laws specifically tailored to protect its Head of State/rulers/presidents and such.

She assaulted the Head of State in his own country.

This is becoming an annual Christmas ritual for the woman.

Vatican drama: Pope attacked at Midnight Mass by SAME 'mentally unstable' woman who jumped barrier last year

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worl...-jumped-barrier-Midnight-Mass.html

She grabs hold of Pope Benedict XVI, circled, and drags him to the floor of the church (linked picture)
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777236ER
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sat Dec 26, 2009 5:26 pm



Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 19):
Religion really has nothing to do with it.

No, I quite agree. He's the head of an organisation that has systematically and repeatedly sexually abused young children. I'm surey you're well aware of the Catholic church's support of the Vichy government?

How much does an organisation have to do to justify attacking its leader?
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Kiwirob
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sat Dec 26, 2009 5:28 pm



Quoting FCA767 (Reply 13):
Yes! If it wasn't for that Documentary, I would never of heard of the Vatican and I'm 27 years old, and someone who likes to learn about everything in our world.

I can't understand how someone could be 27 years old and not heard of the Vatican, especially someone living in the UK, have you been living in a cave?
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sat Dec 26, 2009 6:43 pm



Quoting 777236ER (Reply 17):
Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 10):
...yet last I checked, most of those 1 billion followers were in the Western world.

So there's never been incidious evil in the west?

 redflag 

Never said that - but then again, neither did you in your original comment. Your original comment was that the Pope's views are "incompatible with the Western world," as if to imply that his views somehow are in the same vein as the backwards, extremist ideologies of Islamic fundamentalists, neo-Nazis, etc and are rejected by those in Western society.
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JBirdAV8r
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sat Dec 26, 2009 6:45 pm



Quoting FCA767 (Reply 13):
I would never of heard of the Vatican and I'm 27

I'm sorry the school system has failed you so much.
I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
 
cwapilot
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sat Dec 26, 2009 7:46 pm

Well, it took longer than I thought for someone to try to justify or glorify the attack because they don't like the Pope or don't like the Church. That's out of character for this board.
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fca767
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sat Dec 26, 2009 10:02 pm



Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 21):
I can't understand how someone could be 27 years old and not heard of the Vatican, especially someone living in the UK, have you been living in a cave?

Religion isn't the centre point in UK Schools...we do touch upon it briefly before our exams around 13-14 years...
War pretty much revolves around religion, I realise that much.
Plus the only time I did hear about the vatican was in the documentary about Children being abused and the vatican sweeping it under the carpet...
Infact School didn't even mention the word Vatican once...I hear it alot from americans now on flikr when they go to rome

Quoting JBirdAV8r (Reply 23):

I'm sorry the school system has failed you so much.

It's ok  Smile I learnt french and maths and english and geography though  Smile but even then I had to self teach french because they didnt really teach much french
 
Fabo
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sun Dec 27, 2009 12:25 am



Quoting FCA767 (Reply 25):
I learnt french and maths and english and geography though

Are you implying that you learnt geography and never heard about the smallest country of the world?
The light at the end of tunnel turned out to be a lighted sing saying NO EXIT
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sun Dec 27, 2009 7:58 am



Quoting FCA767 (Reply 25):
Religion isn't the centre point in UK Schools...we do touch upon it briefly before our exams around 13-14 years...
War pretty much revolves around religion, I realise that much.

It's just basic general knowledge, noithing to do with religion, the Vatican is a country and you should have learnt that it is the smallest country in school. Did you ever hear about the Pope?
 
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fca767
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sun Dec 27, 2009 10:17 am



Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 28):
It's just basic general knowledge, noithing to do with religion, the Vatican is a country and you should have learnt that it is the smallest country in school. Did you ever hear about the Pope?

Exactly

Quoting Fabo (Reply 27):
Are you implying that you learnt geography and never heard about the smallest country of the world?

We never got taught about the pope, nor hears about him...I did funnily enough go to church a few times and never was told about the pope...the only words I knew were Vicar and Priest...This was usually at Christmas time when I did take part in a choir singing one xmas through school and I think I went a few times in primary school. So it's not like I was trying to be Ignorant to anything either  Smile
 
Fabo
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sun Dec 27, 2009 2:10 pm

Yet, funily enough, you claim to be a man with general knowledge  Smile

Please do not take this as personal assault on you, but stop making fool of yourself.
The light at the end of tunnel turned out to be a lighted sing saying NO EXIT
 
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fca767
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sun Dec 27, 2009 2:23 pm



Quoting Fabo (Reply 30):
Yet, funily enough, you claim to be a man with general knowledge Smile

Please do not take this as personal assault on you, but stop making fool of yourself.

Don't talk to me like that! It's not my fault we don't care about some thing called a pope...I learn things all the time now...did you learn about the Sex Abusers of the Catholic Church with cover ups from the Vatican?
 
Pyrex
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sun Dec 27, 2009 3:01 pm



Quoting FCA767 (Reply 25):
It's ok I learnt french and maths and english and geography though

Obviously you learned nothing about history (of your own country, no less).

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 26):
Quoting Cwapilot (Reply 24):
Well, it took longer than I thought for someone to try to justify or glorify the attack because they don't like the Pope or don't like the Church. That's out of character for this board.

It's ok. People are just ignoring them for the most part. Notice 777236ER keeps blabbing and no one is really listening

He's been quite for a while now. Maybe he is just in those threads about the Nigerian bomber in Detroit, no doubt somehow trying to justify his actions with the way Islam has been kept down by the West all these years or some crap like that.
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Kiwirob
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sun Dec 27, 2009 3:05 pm



Quoting FCA767 (Reply 28):
We never got taught about the pope, nor hears about him...I did funnily enough go to church a few times and never was told about the pope...the only words I knew were Vicar and Priest...This was usually at Christmas time when I did take part in a choir singing one xmas through school and I think I went a few times in primary school. So it's not like I was trying to be Ignorant to anything either

I honestly don't believe you come from the United Kingdom as your flag sugests, I seriously don't believe that the UK school system has been dumbed down to that extent. Surely you must have learnt about Henry IIIV, if you did and I would feel pretty confident he would have been mentioned when you went to school, then you would have heard about the Pope.
 
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fca767
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Sun Dec 27, 2009 4:06 pm



Quoting Pyrex (Reply 31):
Obviously you learned nothing about history (of your own country, no less).

Well thanks for saying the obvious then...
 
Fabo
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Mon Dec 28, 2009 1:49 am



Quoting FCA767 (Reply 30):
Don't talk to me like that! It's not my fault we don't care about some thing called a pope...I learn things all the time now...did you learn about the Sex Abusers of the Catholic Church with cover ups from the Vatican?

You mean, as in school? No, but there are such things as newspapers, and TV, and the internet... and we use them. So yes, I know about the scandal. And I know that war in Yugoslavia is long since over, and that Czechoslovakia split up (okay, you can attribute that to different things, see flag Big grin ) and so on.
My point is, how is that even remotely possible for even someone not remotely caring, not to know who pope is, and what is Vatican?

That is like saying, the Queen of England? Dunno, never heard of her. What is England, anyway?
The light at the end of tunnel turned out to be a lighted sing saying NO EXIT
 
andz
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Mon Dec 28, 2009 5:27 am



Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 32):
Henry IIIV

I guess they didn't teach Roman numerals in your school!

It is Henry VIII  Smile
After Monday and Tuesday even the calendar says WTF...
 
Kiwirob
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RE: Woman Attacks Pope - Second Time Lucky

Mon Dec 28, 2009 7:08 am

woops, not thinking properly, long day too many kids, I want to go back to work.

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