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seb146
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 4:04 pm

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 1):
Wonder if FOX news is reporting on this?

My partners parents had FOX news on all day yesterday. I listened to it but heard nothing about any of this. All they were reporting on was the growing protests against health care and why would Dems vote yes when there is a crowd outside screaming no. But, nothing about this.

Quoting texan (Reply 4):
we should notice that the Tea Party and the Republican Party are two different animals. Republicans are courting members of the Tea Party and want to be seen as members in order to build populist support, but the Tea Party appears to reject many members of the Republican Party.

I would point out that the Tea Party, just like the Christian right, is willingly accepting endorsement from those within the republicans that are connected and willing to break their own moral and ethical code. Look at the two Seantors from Maine. They have been nearly dismissed from the republican party because they vote their concience, not with the party, it seems.

My first thought on reading this is: we were all told that the Tea Party is a civil and quiet protest. Even with all of the pics, speeches and Youtube clips that have show otherwise, we still are told this is a peaceful and civil movement. Anyone still believe that? Yes, there are. There are those that will be coming out saying "this was an isolated incident" and "this was just a few 'fringe' people that we do not support." But, think about it: Cindy Sheehan was deamonized as a "liberal" and hated by all the right-wing for speaking out against the war and against Bush. To the right-wing, Cindy Sheenan and Dems became inseparable. This is the exact same thing.
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AGM100
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 4:17 pm

I have been too 4 tea party events in Arizona . I have never heard anyone use a racial word at the rallies .... including rallies outside of our hispanic senators offices. We understand the left wants to brand us as racists and are just waiting for the trap to spring....it is they're only defence .

We were called racists , astroturfing , teabagging , McVey wannabees by the speaker and majority leaders of the house.... imagine if the previous administration would have said anything like that about the war protestors... amazing.

I cant say it did not happen ... but when the political advantage comes from branding your opponents as racist I can see how the claims would be made. The press is quick to jump on this .... meanwhile silent about the ourtages bribery corruption and mismanagement of this administration and its operators.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 4:58 pm

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 51):
but when the political advantage comes from branding your opponents as racist I

or branding them as "socialists"
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:08 pm

Quoting mt99 (Reply 52):
or branding them as "socialists"

That is not a racial term , that is a political referance and frankly... true. If they are offended by being called a socialist then they have a real problem..... mainly denial. Denying that this is a marxist tainted take over of our system is funny . I would have much more respect for them if they just showed they're colors openly and were honest.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:14 pm

Quoting windy95 (Reply 42):
The proof of burden is on the ones who claim it was said.


http://biggovernment.com/jhoft/2010/...roof/

Perhaps I'd be willing to consider this if it came from a source a tad less biased than biggovernment.com...

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 39):
That is a fair argument against people arguing that idiocy and bigotry is something confined to conservatives.

I disagree. This is not a pissing contest over whose transgression is worse. We should be able to condemn actions without having to qualify them. Furthermore, I'm not entirely convinced that the people who are qualifying their statements wouldn't have done so regardless of whether anyone claimed that the right wing is the only home of bigotry.

Quoting windy95 (Reply 45):
I would not doubt that the left wing nut jobs would place people in the crowds for this vey purpose of trying to make the Tea Party look like a bunch of racists.
Quoting AGM100 (Reply 51):
imagine if the previous administration would have said anything like that about the war protestors... amazing.

So true. They never stooped to anything low, all they did was brand them as un-American.

Quoting mt99 (Reply 52):
or branding them as "socialists"

  

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 53):
That is not a racial term , that is a political referance and frankly... true.
Quoting AGM100 (Reply 53):
Denying that this is a marxist tainted take over of our system is funny .

Unbelievable. Marxist? Are you for real? As I suggested above, please go spend a week in a Marxist system and then come back and tell me about the alleged Marxism of the current administration. These claims of a Marxist takeover of the country are becoming increasingly ridiculous.

[Edited 2010-03-21 10:18:01]
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:23 pm

Quoting Lufthansa411 (Reply 46):
but the mentality of some of the Americans that I have seen is mind boggling. They do not act like adults, but small children at school

It is a sad situation but unfortunately it's true. I live here in DC so I've been in town for the two most recent Tea Party manifestations (the one from yesterday and one held during Fall last year). In both occasions what really shocked me were the personal attacks. Not since high school have I been called a homosexual in so many derogatory terms, some so hurtful that I don't even want to repeat them. I don't mind having protesters coming into my city but when they verbally abuse you for being who you are in your own city it is not only childish, it screams of hatred and intolerance.

What sums up the warped mentality of Americans today is the fact that there were more people yesterday demonstrating against health care than there were people demonstrating against wars. Really sad.
 
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:26 pm

Quoting charles79 (Reply 55):
What sums up the warped mentality of Americans today is the fact that there were more people yesterday demonstrating against health care than there were people demonstrating against wars. Really sad.

That is perhaps one of the sadder things to come out of this.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:34 pm

Quoting Yellowstone (Reply 47):
You do realize that's not how law works, right? Political parties are not forbidden, ergo they are allowed. And any step to ban them would be a clear violation of the First Amendment rights to assembly and free speech.

How about my rights as a non-partisan!? Why the hell do you guys get to dictate to different states when they'll have their primaries, practicality be damned!? Like how you punished Michigan. Why am I shut out from primaries because Republicans and Democrats want to choose their most extreme candidate giving me only those choices? Why do both parties work so hard to squeeze out everyone else?

This whole duopoly is a clear violation of the rights of all Americans. You're more than welcome to have free assembly and speech, just don't force your narrow views onto our government!

Our country is borken because too many people put party above country!

Quoting Yellowstone (Reply 47):
You seem to be unable to separate your antipathy towards partisan politicians from your views on the 60-plus percent of American voters that are registered Democrats or Republicans.

Of those 60%, how many are registered because they have no other choice if they wish to participate in primary elections?

Quoting Yellowstone (Reply 47):
Take me, for instance. I'm definitely not sub-human filth or legally retarded, and I'm a reasonable person. I agree with most (but not all) of the positions in the Democratic Party's platform. Any third party that I might be better aligned with, however, has no chance of winning an election.

And who's fault is it that these third parties have no chance when the Democrats and Republicans do nothing but maintain a stranglehold on our country?

How can a Democrat or Republican call themselves reasonable while accusing one side of doing harm while maintaining willful ignorance to what their own party does...or just excuses it away like a hypocrite!?

Such character usually indicates a dishonest person, ready to screw you at a moments notice. Such people cannot be trusted, and they certainly cannot be trusted to govern our nation!

Quoting Yellowstone (Reply 47):
I certainly recognize that Democratic politicians won't always live up to the principles in their platform, but they make decisions I agree with far more often than do Republican politicians, so I tend to vote for them. I also want to be able to weigh in on which candidate the Democrats run in general elections.

So once again, you willfully just dismiss that not all of your ducks will stay in their row? But has it ever come across your mind that one size doesn't fit all anyway? Please tell me you're not one of those straight ticket voters.

Quoting Yellowstone (Reply 47):
Why, then, is it wrong for me to be a registered Democrat?

How about the fact that you and your Republican nemesis have absolutely zero credibility on issues such as healthcare, the budget, science, national security, employment, the environment, etc.

It might have to do with the fact that rather than solving those issues, you and your enemies CREATED most of them!

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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:43 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 54):
Unbelievable. Marxist? Are you for real?

Marxist ideals are the common thread thoughout the agenda .... social planning and beuracratic control of the economy are clearly marxist ideas. This is what you all want isnt it ? You want the state to balance everything though fairness to the individual worker correct ? Union power and state centered control are exactly what Marx espoused .... so what are we seeing now ?

Just admit it .... we see it coming and going... denying it is ridiculous and it should not offend you or anyone on the left.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 5:59 pm

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 58):
This is what you all want isnt it ?

Everyone on the left? If I came on here and said that everyone on the right is a fascist, you and others would burn me at the stake, yet here you are painting the entire left with a broad brush.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 6:21 pm

You guys realize this story started in teh Huffington Post. I am amazed that otherwise wmi-intellengent libereals actually listen to that mad-womans rantings.
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AGM100
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 6:36 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 59):
Everyone on the left? If I came on here and said that everyone on the right is a fascist, you and others would burn me at the stake, yet here you are painting the entire left with a broad brush.

Didnt mean that ..not everyone is anything . But Pelosi and the President sure are .... frankly the democrats in pwer right now have no real convictions except central state power ..combine that with the "social justice" movement and you have a nice leftists cocktail. The President is a Ideologue ..read is book you will see his views are born of left wing teachings..then combine that with his learning at the feet of the militant preacher reverend Wright .... clarity.

Sorry ... to be so blunt but thier is no reason to deny any of it at this point. And you are free to agree with the views and you should ,if that is what you beleive in.
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BMI727
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 7:44 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 54):
This is not a pissing contest over whose transgression is worse.

The point is that it is fair to say that loss of civility in these types of matters is not something that is limited to those on one side of the political spectrum or the other.

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 57):
And who's fault is it that these third parties have no chance when the Democrats and Republicans do nothing but maintain a stranglehold on our country?

It is the way the system is set up. But we cannot blame or dislike things as broad as a whole political party which is non-ideological, will say anything to get their politicians elected, and contains its own broad spectrum of opinion. Deal with specific politicians on specific issues.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 10:16 pm

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 58):
Marxist ideals are the common thread thoughout the agenda

Yes, because healthcare reform is the same as the Politbureau breaking into your home and raping your wife and killing your children in front of you before they torture you to death.

You have NO idea what Marxism is and, in the name of everyone in the world who has ever suffered at the hands of an oppressive regime, you should be ASHAMED that you would even make such a comparison.

Disgusting. You sound like a spoiled brat child who accuses his parents of making him a "slave" for forcing him to clean his own room.
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seb146
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 10:39 pm

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 53):
If they are offended by being called a socialist then they have a real problem..... mainly denial. Denying that this is a marxist tainted take over of our system is funny . I would have much more respect for them if they just showed they're colors openly and were honest.

Wait, wait, wait.... first you call anyone on the left a "socialist" then they are "marxist." This is the same BS that every right-winger has been spouting off ever since.... I don't even know when. It's been too long. The American people want a better health care system. The Dems actually have the cajones to do something about it. Not the best deal in the world, but something. Yet, when they try to do something about what the American people want, they are shouted down and called "marxist, communist, socialist, liberal" and all kinds of other hate speech the right has come up with.

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 51):
I have never heard anyone use a racial word at the rallies .... including rallies outside of our hispanic senators offices. We understand the left wants to brand us as racists and are just waiting for the trap to spring....it is they're only defence

I am glad the four rallies you have been to have been relatively peaceful. But, what about rallies in Washington DC? Or Montana? Or Texas? Or Alabama? Been to those? What about rallies where there was hate speech? What about the rallies with people holding pictures equating Obama with Hilter ('respect the president' the right told us for eight years)? These hate-filled people come out to these rallies started by a lobbiest (Dick Army) and claim they are doing the work of the American people, even though the American people said they wanted health care reform..... And no one on the right sees a problem with any of this....
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 10:49 pm

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 1):
....America's finest! Wonder if FOX news is reporting on this?

Look for yourself.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2010...cial-slurs-hurled-black-lawmakers/
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UAL747
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 11:07 pm

Quoting Evan767 (Reply 65):
Look for yourself.

They are now...it seems, since the teabaggers have taken credit for it. They really have no other choice do they?
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 11:18 pm

I have been following this very closely. What I find is there apparently no witnesses outside of these members of congress, a staffer and a Hunington Post person to these words being used by anyone.

The spitting incident did happen, and no charges were filed.

I am wonding if our estemed members of the Congress are lying? Are they making up something that did not happen just for the PR and an attempt to get health care passed and turn people against the tea party?
 
UAL747
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Sun Mar 21, 2010 11:24 pm

Quoting KC135TopBoom (Reply 67):
I am wonding if our estemed members of the Congress are lying? Are they making up something that did not happen just for the PR and an attempt to get health care passed and turn people against the tea party?

Honestly, here...I mean no disrespect to your political beliefs, but is it too far out of sight to safely say that this was probably said about these congressmen? Even the Tea Party leaders are condemning it, and given the "heated" mouths these people seem to have, I have no hard time believing every word of it.

UAL
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:40 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 62):
It is the way the system is set up. But we cannot blame or dislike things as broad as a whole political party which is non-ideological, will say anything to get their politicians elected, and contains its own broad spectrum of opinion. Deal with specific politicians on specific issues.

The system never called for political parties to begin with. They simply set up shop and never left.

But to say the Democrats and Republicans are blameless when it is their fault for everything wrong in our country is mindboggling. Especially when their spectrums aren't as broad as you'd like to think. Hell one party considered "purity tests"!

It's going to take massive instability withing these parties, casuing them to completely splinter and lose all of their financing to free America and to punish Liberals and Conservatives.

The problem is that we seem to be able to do that to one party at a time, allowing the other to seize total control.

How many of you liberals or conservative would like to see your party be the only party around? Don't lie. Fess up to your hatred of democracy!

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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:40 am

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 58):
Marxist ideals are the common thread thoughout the agenda ....

Perhaps it is the American educational system that needs to be reformed if you seriously believe what you are saying is true. Go do a bit of studying and find out how Marxism actually works.

By the way, a spellcheck would be appreciated in your other posts as well.
 
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:52 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 63):

So when someone says that this will change America for the worse a good reply is "shut up, you haven't seen bad yet"

Quoting Boeing4ever (Reply 69):

The parties can't be blamed because they don't actually do anything, politicians do. Put twenty Republicans in a room and see if they agree on anything. And the purity test is stupid since nobody would ever pass it, and it would be all but impossible to say exactly what pure is.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 1:10 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 71):
The parties can't be blamed because they don't actually do anything, politicians do. Put twenty Republicans in a room and see if they agree on anything. And the purity test is stupid since nobody would ever pass it, and it would be all but impossible to say exactly what pure is.

If this was truly the case, explain to me how the healthcare vote is divided between party lines. Not one Republican supports the current plan. The handful of Democrats that oppose it will be harassed out of office by their own party. Republicans who switch and vote for the plan will see the same thing happen.

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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 2:04 am

Every single day I get more and more apathetic towards politics (just not quite to the point where I'm not willing to make my point in a matter, but getting there) because I cannot fathom that anyone regardless of their alignment would ever stoop to such ridiculously low tactics. When this country was founded and the government system was set up, the ideal was that lawmakers would be statesmen performing a civic duty and not politicians just doing their jobs. Lincoln served one term in congress and then returned to Illinois before he eventually became president. Today, people go to Washington as a career, and are looking out for their own interest, not those of their constituents or the country as a whole. The two party system has effectively thrown out any chance of ever returning to the way it should be because anyone who runs for office with the honest intent of serving the people will get immediately thrown under the bus by whichever party they side with, and they will have to side with one because if they don't they have even less chance of getting elected in the first place. The whole system is a bureaucratic mess and neither side is free from blame.
This incident is just further proof that the vocal minority on the extreme ends of the specrum will do whatever it takes to try and make everyone think the way they do whether it be forcing a message of hate towards groups of people they don't like or a bill that never should have been pushed this hard because whether it's an important issue or not, there are 100 more important things they should have been doing instead.
 
UAL747
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:02 am

On the topic of throwing around Marx:

Can I PLEASE get the definitions of:

Capitalism
Authoritarianism
Marxism
Fascism
Communism
Nazism
Elitism
Socialism

From our conservative members?

Have you EVER read the Communist Manifesto by Karl Marx?

Have you EVER studied the above, how they are used, where they are used, and in what context of history they are used?

I think this is probably the most annoying, uneducated thing I find about these people. The fact that they throw these terms around when they don't even know what they mean. What ARE you REALLY trying to say? I know probably 75% of their problem, but I'll just keep it to myself. (It has nothing to do with the above mentioned terms).

BTW, I just got called a Communist Fascist Homosexual who deserves to be sterilized so I cannot reproduce my type on a small town Oklahoma Newspaper website where I had written something. This coming from the same person who said, in the same thread, there weren't any problems with the blacks until the lunatic MLK started making his lunatic speeches and marches. (on that website).

UAL

[Edited 2010-03-21 20:06:32]

[Edited 2010-03-21 20:07:40]
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UAL747
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:11 am

Oh, and we have another Joe Wilson moment where a Republican yells at Rep. Bart Stupack and calls him, "BABYKILLER!" on the floor of the US House of Reps. just a moment ago.

UAL
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AGM100
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:25 am

Quoting DocLightning (Reply 63):
You have NO idea what Marxism is

Kicking in doors and rapeing ??? I was not suggesting that .

Apples to oranges.... Marx never say's in his teachings too do any kicking and raping either. And their will be none of that going on here... we live in a far more sophisticated age now.

But like Obama and the Dems ..Marx spoke only of the utopian ideas of the collective ... not the blunt object that assists the state in getting thier.

Quoting Boeing744 (Reply 70):
By the way, a spellcheck would be appreciated in your other posts as well.

No.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 4:24 am

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 76):
No.

Alright, your choice. The spelling and grammar certainly doesn't help your argument though...
 
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 5:19 am

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 14):
I firmly believe it will as well. The US is more divided now than it has ever been, and it's getting to the point I'm not sure if a solution can actually be had.

Indeed.

Quoting Lufthansa411 (Reply 46):
The same thing is happening now, but these people are not in grade school. People who are angry at congress or Obama try to humiliate by yelling fag and nigger at them, trying to feel better about themselves by making others feel worse

America is becoming quite the mess I am afraid. Interesting, with this administration it is less covered in international news.

Really sad to see this turn of events. And what's more, this board is a nice representation of the state of affairs in the country. Two sides, fighting endless, not realizing how futile it all is.
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sv7887
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 5:31 am

Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):
A pretty sad situation, and an indication of just how divided this country is these days:

It's unfortunately a sign of the times. I am very worried where this country is going. There's nothing wrong with dissent whether it be against Wars or Legislation, but using such offensive language is unbecoming of a civilized society.

Although I wasn't alive in the late 1960s, from what I read, I'm seeing much of the same ugliness pervading our society today.

There's nothing wrong with having different beliefs, because that is what makes us who we are as a nation. When we resort to these things of thug tactics, (and fringe elements of both parties have done it) it reflects badly on ALL of us.
 
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 6:17 am

Quoting OA412 (Reply 38):
Been there, done that. The excuses get really old, really fast. The words "faggot" and "nigger" are loaded, hurtful, and have no place in civilized conversation. There is no such thing as "well I heard it on South Park so it's OK for me to say it." Sorry, but it's not OK. I don't appreciate being called a fag. I can't help the fact that I was born gay, but that certainly doesn't give anyone the right to call me names.

I have heard people say, "oh slavery happened so long ago, get over it." Really? It's very easy to say that when you're not on the receiving end of racism or homophobia. Anyone who honestly believes that racism and homophobia don't exist in this country (and believe me some people do), is living in a fool's paradise.

A story:

A coworker of mine, some time ago, complained to management about one of the TVs in the break room being tuned to a certain episode of South Park, which used the word "nigger" quite frequently.

A couple of weeks ago, the same coworker was part of a group conversation, in which one of the group used the same word to refer to another person. Not only was there not a hint of disapproval, the person who originally complained about the TV show went about like it was a normal utterance.


Unfortunately, there is a HUGE double standard regarding certain words. While "faggot" is not generally used even by the gay people I know (except in cases of satire, ala South Park), it seems "nigger" is used frequently by the very people offended by it.


So, my point:

The people complaining about it? GET OVER IT.

Quoting futurepilot16 (Reply 43):
I'm sure it was a claim, says the hundreds of news sites and T.V. news shows, and radio news shows that have covered the story.

Based on the account of not more than 5 people, one of which we assume does not have an agenda. I'm not trying to suggest one way or the other that it did or didn't happen (although, given the size of the crowd, the statistics would suggest that at least one person was gonna say it), but the reality is that every single news site, TV show, and radio program that reported it basically stole the account from one other person.

Numbers do not equal truth.
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OA412
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 6:23 am

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 80):
A coworker of mine, some time ago, complained to management about one of the TVs in the break room being tuned to a certain episode of South Park, which used the word "nigger" quite frequently.

A couple of weeks ago, the same coworker was part of a group conversation, in which one of the group used the same word to refer to another person. Not only was there not a hint of disapproval, the person who originally complained about the TV show went about like it was a normal utterance.


Unfortunately, there is a HUGE double standard regarding certain words. While "faggot" is not generally used even by the gay people I know (except in cases of satire, ala South Park), it seems "nigger" is used frequently by the very people offended by it.


So, my point:

The people complaining about it? GET OVER IT.

I know what you're referring to. I'm not black so I can't comment to the use of "nigger", but let me discuss "faggot". We often use those words to demystify them and to lessen the horrible impact that they have. Granted, you're right that we don't use the term "faggot" to describe each other, even in jest. However, we do often jokingly refer to each other as "nelly", "queen", "queer", etc. We take a hurtful word and turn it around and have fun with it.

Now, I'll admit that there does some to be an overuse of the term "nigger" by some in the black community, but I think that there is a clear distinction between one black person saying it to another and a white person saying it to a black person. The word carries very different meanings in depending on who the user is. By the same token, the words mentioned above being said to me by another gay person will receive a much different reaction than if they are said to me by a straight person.

[Edited 2010-03-21 23:31:27]
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 6:46 am

Quoting OA412 (Reply 81):
Now, I'll admit that there does some to be an overuse of the term "nigger" by some in the black community

I'm not talking about overuse, but the double standard which you mention below:

Quoting OA412 (Reply 81):
but I think that there is a clear distinction between one black person saying it to another and a white person saying it to a black person.

Which is complete and utter crap.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 81):
The word carries very different meanings in depending on who the user is.

No; it carries meaning based on how the user wants it to mean.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 81):
the words mentioned above being said to me by another gay person will receive a much different reaction than if they are said to me by a straight person.

As a straight person with a few gay friends, I can certainly contradict that statement, as I have called them all kinds of "homophobic" names, in jest the same way they do.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 7:41 am

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 66):
They are now...it seems, since the teabaggers have taken credit for it. They really have no other choice do they?

why the fascination with that homo erotic act?
what does that have to do with the topic at hand?..

are you gay bashing or something?
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:30 am

It truly is pathetic to see people distracting from totally unacceptable, current behaviour, by pointing to other past misdeeds as though that somehow makes this all ok. It is also utterly ridiculous that people can't handle being in opposition to the extent that everything they don't agree with is labelled as dictatorial or 'Marxist'. People really need to grow up.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 11:37 am

Quoting AGM100 (Reply 58):
Marxist

By your standards, pretty much every European conservative party would be maxist.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 12:21 pm

Well, way to go Tea Baggers.

Did anyone catch Stupak being called a "Baby Killer" while he was reading his amendment?

But hey, I'm sure it was just some extremest tea-bagger who slipped into the chambers of congress. That or liberal-biased Obama reporters skewing it as always.

Let it go, it passed.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Mon Mar 22, 2010 3:34 pm

Quoting OA412 (Reply 81):
I know what you're referring to. I'm not black so I can't comment to the use of "nigger", but let me discuss "faggot". We often use those words to demystify them and to lessen the horrible impact that they have. Granted, you're right that we don't use the term "faggot" to describe each other, even in jest. However, we do often jokingly refer to each other as "nelly", "queen", "queer", etc. We take a hurtful word and turn it around and have fun with it.

Now, I'll admit that there does some to be an overuse of the term "nigger" by some in the black community, but I think that there is a clear distinction between one black person saying it to another and a white person saying it to a black person. The word carries very different meanings in depending on who the user is. By the same token, the words mentioned above being said to me by another gay person will receive a much different reaction than if they are said to me by a straight person.

Well said. I don't see how any rational person can't come to that conclusion. As a black person, I don't use the word nigger, then again, I am not American, where the words seems to proliferate so much. But if a black person calls me 'nigger' depending on the context used, I may not get upset. But a white person calling a black person nigger is usually in a derogatory context, so it is obviously intended as an insult. And taking into consideration the history of the word and the race relations between black and white in American, i don't see how in the name goodness people can't see that the use of the word as an insult should be avoided. Now, just to point out a black person cannot insult another black person using the word nigger, that would a case of the pot calling the kettle black, no pun intended.

So yes it is somewhat of a double standard, but that is the way the cookie crumbles and not just with black people and the word nigger, no, it happens in many groups. So lets not be ignorant and try to make utterance of this word in a public/professional forum any less stupid and uncalled for.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:42 am

Quoting PSA53 (Reply 2):
If it is true,shameful! I read the Yahoo story.

Have you seen the video's and heard the "N" word?

Quoting ATTart (Reply 15):
A CNN producer overheard the word "faggot" yelled at Frank several times in the lobby of the Longworth building. Frank said he heard someone yell "homo" at him.

But for some reason the CNN cameras were not rolling when this happened?

[Edited 2010-03-22 18:42:52]
 
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 1:58 am

Quoting Ken777 (Thread starter):
A pretty sad situation

That the entire episode can't be verified by one single piece of film or audio recording even in this day and age where virtually every cell phone has that capability.

Meanwhile, with thousands of protestors in the Capitol over the weekend, only 3 arrests were made.

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0310/34817.html


Although thousands protesters stormed Capitol Hill over the weekend, officials Monday said only three arrests were made and the grounds sustained no damage — an accomplishment that has everyone from the House Committee on Administration to the speaker’s office singing the praises of Capitol Police.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:05 am

Absolutely disgusting, immoral and irrational behavior. This is my fear about the tea party, it's just too motivated by anger and frustration issues, no matter if you agree with them or not....these two elements together can severely cloud the movement's vision and spirit.
I hope people don't take this unfortunate, shameful word toss and make it the tea party's image.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 3:17 am

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 84):
It truly is pathetic to see people distracting from totally unacceptable, current behaviour, by pointing to other past misdeeds as though that somehow makes this all ok.

Agreed. What has happened in the past does not excuse what happened the other day.

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 84):
It is also utterly ridiculous that people can't handle being in opposition to the extent that everything they don't agree with is labelled as dictatorial or 'Marxist'.

I actually find their behavior frightening. It's almost as though they only ever want their own party to be in power. Obviously, everyone loyal to any given party wants to see that. However, their behavior goes far beyond this simple fact. It's as though they cannot understand that living in a democracy means that seeing your party in opposition is a fact of a life, and that they'd be perfectly happy living in a single party dictatorship where their party is always in power.

Quoting UA777222 (Reply 86):
Did anyone catch Stupak being called a "Baby Killer" while he was reading his amendment?

Another moment of sheer class.

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 82):
As a straight person with a few gay friends, I can certainly contradict that statement, as I have called them all kinds of "homophobic" names, in jest the same way they do.

Well I should have been more clear. Obviously, there are straight people who can joke with us and I have absolutely no problem with it when I know that it comes from a place of acceptance. When it comes from a straight homophobe, it's a whole different ball game.

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 82):
Which is complete and utter crap.

Why? We're talking about context here. Do you honestly believe that when one black person calls another a 'nigger', that the meaning is the same as when a racist says it? I agree that there is a double standard, but that's how it is. All that said, it's such an awful word, I don't think anyone should be using it as cavalierly as some people do.

I guess what confuses me is why people are so upset about the double standard. Are you saying that you should be able to use the word without repercussions? I'm honestly not trying to be provocative, just trying to see what you're getting at.

[Edited 2010-03-22 20:20:25]
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:26 am

What happened in the past is relevant not as a justification since the is none in this case, but rather pointing out that loss of civility and class is not a phenomenon limited to one side of the spectrum.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:30 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 92):
What happened in the past is relevant not as a justification since the is none in this case, but rather pointing out that loss of civility and class is not a phenomenon limited to one side of the spectrum.

I highly doubt that this is the reason why some people are bringing up past transgressions. As is always the case, some people will always try and minimize the impact when their side is made to look bad.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:41 am

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 10):
Later on that night I explained to them why I thought "faggot" was an inappropriate term for the evening, and you know what they did? They tried to back pedal and say that they were saying it only like they say on the South Park episode where they call bikers "Fags." I'm like, uhhh huh.

I don't know. I hear and use the term pretty regularly, but in my circle, a faggot is generally more of the twink persuasion. I will say though, that it can be useful sometimes. I was recently advanced upon by my boss, who happens to be a female. I explained to her that I'm "out." She really didn't get it, so I had to tell her, and I quote "I'm sorry, but I'm actually a faggot, so that won't likely work out." I know, there are a lot of us who would be offended by that, but as I've said in other threads, I think we need to move on beyond this level of hypersentivity.

Now, mind you, that's not to say that I condone the term "fag" or "faggot" being used in an openly hateful or threatening way at all.

Quoting UAL747 (Reply 14):

I firmly believe it will as well. The US is more divided now than it has ever been, and it's getting to the point I'm not sure if a solution can actually be had.

First part, I agree. The second, not so sure. Take a look at Russia. Far worse off this way (and many others), but still held together (even if somewhat loosely...)

Quoting Maverick623 (Reply 80):
Unfortunately, there is a HUGE double standard regarding certain words. While "faggot" is not generally used even by the gay people I know (except in cases of satire, ala South Park), it seems "nigger" is used frequently by the very people offended by it.

Again, I use it all the time. But as with anything, there is a time and a place. It doesn't bother me to be called one (except when people say such brilliant things like "well of course that wouldn't bother you... you don't look like a faggot.. Ok, that one really bothers me for some reason...) as long as I know it is not the product of open hatred.

So I see why some people are okay with the use of the N-word (which IMHO has largely done to the phrase 'brother' what 777s have done to 747s...). But what I don't agree with is the double standard-ism behind it. I understand not using the N-word in a hateful manner, sure. But to say that it can't be said by certain people because it's 'our word' is just total crap. It's good or it's not. Anyway, just my opinion...
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 4:50 am

Quoting wn700driver (Reply 94):
well of course that wouldn't bother you... you don't look like a faggot.. Ok, that one really bothers me for some reason...

That one bothers me too. I think it's the stupidity of it all, you know assuming that being gay means you should look or act a certain way.

Quoting wn700driver (Reply 94):
I'm sorry, but I'm actually a faggot, so that won't likely work out

That's actually kind of funny. Sometimes you just have to be blunt as hell to get your point across.
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RE: Tea Party Turns Nasty - Tosses Out "N" Word

Tue Mar 23, 2010 6:01 am

Quoting DXing (Reply 89):
singing the praises of Capitol Police.

Yes, because of course it had nothing to do with the protesters being rational?

Just more spin from the same sources.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 91):
When it comes from a straight homophobe, it's a whole different ball game.

It is; I'm not trying to suggest it isn't. I think that we agree in principle, but are arguing over two different points. See below.

Quoting OA412 (Reply 91):
Do you honestly believe that when one black person calls another a 'nigger', that the meaning is the same as when a racist says it?

Absolutely not, but..... (I'll get to my point, I swear!)

Quoting OA412 (Reply 91):
I guess what confuses me is why people are so upset about the double standard. Are you saying that you should be able to use the word without repercussions? I'm honestly not trying to be provocative, just trying to see what you're getting at.

Absolutely, I should be able to use the same words as anyone other social group. As I said earlier, I was upset that someone got offended in the presence of the exact same word used in almost the exact same context by a white person, and complained, only to ignore it when said by a black person.

So, to prove my point:

If someone (black, white, asian, hispanic, etc...) calls me "cracker" or even "white boy" in a joking manner, I'm not gonna get offended.

If someone else calls me "cracker" or "white boy", suggesting I was somehow inferior to them (ie, racist), I'm gonna laugh at them and walk away.

When you take the "taboo" out of a word, it can't be used as a weapon anymore.


Again, I think we can agree on this....
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