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KLASM83
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UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:17 am

Per the Grand Forks Herald, the University of North Dakota will be given a directive to retire the Sioux Nickname. A decision by the North Dakota Supreme Court that stated, in short, that only the State Board of Higher Education (SBHE) has the exclusive right to retire the logo and nickname of UND. That means the previous vote to retire the nickname back in May '09 by the SBHE stands.

I know there are a few UND-er's on the a.net, and it would be nice to hear from my fellow (former) Sioux, but I wonder what the rest of you think on the issue.

No matter what the varying views are, this is a historical day for UND.
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pgh234
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:24 am

Time and time again American Indians claim that they do not care about Indian named sports teams all around the US. If anything, they say that they are proud of the affiliation.

However, the white people are so damn afraid of being politically correct that they have to keep making big issues over nothing. People need more important things to worry about.
 
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mbmbos
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 1:39 am

Quoting pgh234 (Reply 1):
Time and time again American Indians claim that they do not care about Indian named sports teams all around the US.

Really? How many? Are there any Native American institutions that have come out in support of such mascots? If so, please list them.

A quick search around the WWW shows several Native American institutions that have come out against the casual use of Native American names including the National Congress of American Indians, among the first.
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Mir
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:01 am

Quoting pgh234 (Reply 1):
Time and time again American Indians claim that they do not care about Indian named sports teams all around the US. If anything, they say that they are proud of the affiliation.

The American Indian tribes were actually mostly opposed to the Fighting Sioux name.

I don't know how much money UND has spent trying to fight this, but I can't help but thinking that it would be better spent on education for the students.

-Mir
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pgh234
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:36 am

Quoting MBMBOS (Reply 2):
Really? How many? Are there any Native American institutions that have come out in support of such mascots? If so, please list them.
Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
The American Indian tribes were actually mostly opposed to the Fighting Sioux name.

I admit that I know nothing about the UND situation in particular...but I was basing my statement on the well publicised Florida Seminoles issue and other things I have read about on the Cleveland Indians and Atlanta Braves. Most Indians enjoy the attention that the mascots bring to their cultures and enjoy the historical references to their ancestors as strong brave warriors.

From wikipedia:
Sports Illustrated said in a 2002 article that "There is a near total disconnect between Indian activists and the Native American Population on this issue"

In 2004, a poll by the Annenberg Public Policy Center at the University of Pennsylvania essentially confirmed the Sports Illustrated poll's findings, concluding that 91% of the American Indians surveyed in the 48 states on the mainland USA found the name acceptable and setting out in detail the exact wording of the questions.


Basically, no matter what you do in today's society...some activist group will find a way to complain about it.
 
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KLASM83
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 2:54 am

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):

I don't know how much money UND has spent trying to fight this, but I can't help but thinking that it would be better spent on education for the students.

In 2008 we used about 75% of our litigation fund on it. I totally agree, Mir. I've been saying that for a while-it's been too much of a divisive issue that's causing too many rifts and tension. I'm just glad that a decision has been made, that it's over and that we can move on finally.

Thanks for the input already and thanks in advance for any more!

[Edited 2010-04-08 19:56:21]
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BMI727
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 3:13 am

UND should tell whoever thinks the nickname is offensive to grow up. This whole thing is ridiculous and a waste of time.
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iflykpdx
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 3:35 am

I'm probably the only UND student who cares nothing about sports here. I did like the name though. It seemed more like it was honoring them than capitalizing on it. Oh well, as long as it doesn't change to something stupid.
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 4:12 am

Quoting MBMBOS (Reply 2):
Really? How many? Are there any Native American institutions that have come out in support of such mascots? If so, please list them.

A quick search around the WWW shows several Native American institutions that have come out against the casual use of Native American names including the National Congress of American Indians, among the first.

The Seminole Tribe is fully behind Florida State University being the "FSU Seminoles".
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:26 am

So is it the intent of those wishing to remove all Native American names, to completely wipe their existence from our collective memories? I would think that they would want to share those names, to remind a nation that they're still some of them around.

I mean seriously... twenty years from now when no team has those names, we will have completely met the goal of the Indian Wars: obliterate them from existence in both reality and our memories.
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:42 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 6):
UND should tell whoever thinks the nickname is offensive to grow up. This whole thing is ridiculous and a waste of time.

UND isn't the only school to have done this by any means, so I wouldn't be so quick to jump down their throats. Dartmouth used to be (unofficially) referred to as the "Indians" from the 1920s until the Board of Trustees banned its use in the 1970s....so nearly 40 years ago.
 
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 5:45 am

Quoting Cory6188 (Reply 10):

There have been plenty of teams that came under fire for this, and sadly quite a few have backed down like little girls.
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Mir
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Fri Apr 09, 2010 11:12 am

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 9):
So is it the intent of those wishing to remove all Native American names, to completely wipe their existence from our collective memories? I would think that they would want to share those names, to remind a nation that they're still some of them around.

That's a fair way of looking at it, and that point was made during the arguments, but ultimately it's the tribe's call to make whether they support using the name or not. It's not appropriate for the university to say "we know you don't like it, but trust us that this is for your own good".

The tribe decided they didn't want the name to be used, and the state agreed, so that should be it. I don't care either way, expect for the fact that so much money has been wasted on what is really a secondary issue for the school.

-Mir
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WESTERN737800
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 12:49 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 6):
UND should tell whoever thinks the nickname is offensive to grow up. This whole thing is ridiculous and a waste of time.

I'm from a bordering state and I agree.

Quoting iflykpdx (Reply 7):
I'm probably the only UND student who cares nothing about sports here. I did like the name though. It seemed more like it was honoring them than capitalizing on it. Oh well, as long as it doesn't change to something stupid.

Again I agree. Whatever they change it to it'll sound strange and unnatural.

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 9):
So is it the intent of those wishing to remove all Native American names, to completely wipe their existence from our collective memories? I would think that they would want to share those names, to remind a nation that they're still some of them around.

Exactly!

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 11):
There have been plenty of teams that came under fire for this, and sadly quite a few have backed down like little girls.

That is really sad.
I would like to know what percentage of UND students and alumni are for changing the name, against changing the name, or indifferent. I'll miss the Sioux nickname, its the first thing I think of when I think of Grand Forks.
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GQfluffy
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 1:11 am

One word, and it comes out of a male cow.
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LASoctoberB6
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 7:43 am

Quoting GQfluffy (Reply 14):
male cow.

Way off subject, but, isn't that called an ox or something?
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midcon385
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 11:17 am

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 9):
So is it the intent of those wishing to remove all Native American names, to completely wipe their existence from our collective memories? I would think that they would want to share those names, to remind a nation that they're still some of them around.

The issue is that in most cases, the tribes do not find the use of native names by sport teams honorable. It is the right of the tribe to decide whether its name is appropriate or not as a sports team name or an image of a Native appropriate or not as a mascot. In this case, the Sioux nation has decided it is not appropriate, and the courts have agreed.

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 9):
I mean seriously... twenty years from now when no team has those names, we will have completely met the goal of the Indian Wars: obliterate them from existence in both reality and our memories.

I highly doubt the only memory of Native Americans in this country is perpetuated through sports teams! As a Native American, I find this to be a ridiculous statement. The Native American/First Nations tribes and bands of this continent are still here, and we're not going away. Our hearts and spirits are strong even as many of us face great poverty. For the record, I am Lakota (Sioux) and don't approve of our name being used on sports teams, although there are far worse ones (Redskins, for example). Imagine if a similar name referring to blacks was used for a team. The outrage would be tremendous! I think it is time Native people take back their image and their names from sports teams and any other unncessary commercial usage, and decide for themselves just where and when their name and image can be used.

Tim
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midcon385
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 11:44 am

An addendum to my previous post, this time referring to using Native images as mascots:

Our clothing is not a costume to be worn for Halloween or for fun, it's a part of our past...and to mimic dances and rituals without any clue as to what they mean and how they're viewed by the actual Native peoples is unacceptable. The dances, rituals, and even the clothing and face paint, feathers, etc. all are sacred to us and not appropriate to be copied or stolen by outsiders. Indeed, many tribes do not share their religious or cultural practices with outsiders (non-Indians) for precisely this reason. One other point that would be useful is that the Hollywood sterotypes of Indians are not accurate either, for each tribe is very different and the differences between each group is extreme. There are not "generic Indian" images that can be used, for there are no "generic Indians". It seems that many try to take the Plains Indian style (warbonnets of eagle feathers, stylized face paint, tipis aka teepees) and use it, even when the actual Native tribe or group their team is named after wouldn't have ever looked even close. If you want to respect Native Americans, listen: This is our culture, it's not yours, please leave it alone. Don't dress up like you think we do and don't dance or pretend to do rituals you don't have a clue as to the meaning of.

There is a similar issue with the Boy Scouts and their Order of the Arrow...

[Edited 2010-04-10 04:46:53]
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SiouxATC
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 2:45 pm

Does this mean I have to change my user name?  


On a serious note, not a lot of happy people around campus, both students and staff.
 
srbmod
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 3:13 pm

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 6):
UND should tell whoever thinks the nickname is offensive to grow up. This whole thing is ridiculous and a waste of time.

Blame the NCAA, as this matter was started by them several years back. The NCAA has banned its' member schools from using Native American names and symbols (including mascots) as part of their athletic team name in any post-season competition or from hosting any NCAA post-season competition. Only three schools have been able to successfully appeal to the NCAA regarding their team names, Florida State, Central Michigan, and Utah. All three schools had the support of the Native American tribal nation whose name they use. The University of Illinois Fighting Illini and the William & Mary Tribe were able to keep their names by disassociating any Native American imagery with those name. A number of other schools have had to drop generic names that refer to Native Americans and include such imagery.

Unfortunately, the various groups within the Sioux Nation could not all agree to support UND and as a result, they have to relinquish the Fighting Sioux regardless of the ND Supreme Court ruling, as it was also part of an agreement made with the NCAA a few years back.

Here in Georgia, the University of West Georgia changed their team name from Braves to Wolves because of this NCAA rule (They were not among the original list of schools the NCAA listed when the edict from the NCAA was issued.).

What will be interesting is how the Engelstad family reacts to this decision. The Ralph Engelstad Arena and the Betty Engelstad Sioux Center are owned by the family and are leased to UND, and one of the conditions Ralph Engelstad made when he built the Arena was that UND had to keep the Fighting Sioux name indefinitely. Dropping the name could potentially force the university to play elsewhere.
 
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 5:00 pm

On a related note, I'm surprised no one ever brings up the rather obviously homophobic move to change the University of Hawai'i teams from the Rainbows to the Rainbow Warriors.

Quoting pgh234 (Reply 1):
Time and time again American Indians claim that they do not care about Indian named sports teams all around the US. If anything, they say that they are proud of the affiliation.

Depends on the team. The Seminole example is one that honors the team. Same with the Utah Utes. The Washington Redskins, however, should have had their name changed a very long time ago.

Quoting FlyDeltaJets87 (Reply 8):

The Seminole Tribe is fully behind Florida State University being the "FSU Seminoles".

As they should be. I think it would be cool if the new Los Angeles NFL team got the name "Chumash", though I don't think it would happen anymore given the connection with California native tribes and gambling. Naming your team directly after a tribe is honoring that tribe. Giving it a name like Redskins, or doing some stereotypical thing like the Tomahawk Chop, is a slap in their face.
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sat Apr 10, 2010 10:16 pm

Quoting pgh234 (Reply 4):
Most Indians enjoy the attention that the mascots bring to their cultures and enjoy the historical references to their ancestors as strong brave warriors.

Here one must make the distinction between a depiction of genuine Native American culture versus the grotesque caricatures inherent in the Clevland Indians and Atlanta Braves names. Anybody here remember Chief Noc-a-Homa back when the Braves played at Fulton County Stadium? I'm sure Ted Turner consulted closely with Native American leaders when his people decided to house the chief in a wigwam behind center field and run around like a spastic drunk.

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 9):
So is it the intent of those wishing to remove all Native American names, to completely wipe their existence from our collective memories?

I think Native Americans want to see their peoples depicted in a genuine fashion, not as a generic McIndian created somewhere on Madison Avenue rather than in the "Black Hills of Dakota" (apologies to the Beatles)

In the case of the UND Sioux, though, one could certainly argue that it's an example of "leave well enough alone".
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sun Apr 11, 2010 12:47 am

I am part Scottish and the Edinboro University Fighting Scots does not bother me at all. I think it's great. Their mascot is a kilt wearing highlander brandishing a claymore. Let's Go Boro! I guess because I am of European heritage my opinion does not count. It's not PC.

[Edited 2010-04-10 18:12:20]
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midcon385
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sun Apr 11, 2010 11:43 am

Quoting santosdumont (Reply 21):
I think Native Americans want to see their peoples depicted in a genuine fashion, not as a generic McIndian

Exactly. As most peoples would wish to be depicted in a genuine fashion...rather than sterotypically or generically.

Tim
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santosdumont
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sun Apr 11, 2010 7:32 pm

Quoting P3Orion (Reply 22):
I am part Scottish and the Edinboro University Fighting Scots does not bother me at all. I think it's great. Their mascot is a kilt wearing highlander brandishing a claymore. Let's Go Boro! I guess because I am of European heritage my opinion does not count. It's not PC.

The fundamental gulf between the depiction of the Fighting Scots -- or the Fightin' Irish for that matter -- and teams named after Indians, is that such European ethnic groups were never objectified ("animalized" is more the word) or hunted for sport (you don't see colleges lining up to adopt the Fightin' Bosnians or Rowdy Romas moniker). That 's like trying to argue that the motivation behind a name like the U. Penn Quakers and that of a fictitious team like, say, the Tuscaloosa SpearChuckers, are for all intents and purposes the same.
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FlyDeltaJets87
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Sun Apr 11, 2010 8:03 pm

Is the US Army going to have to rename its helicopters now, since they have the "Blackhawk", the "Apache", and although it never came online, the "Comanche"?

Quoting P3Orion (Reply 22):
I guess because I am of European heritage my opinion does not count. It's not PC

  
No one is throwing a fit over the "Boston Celtics".


I have to ask - are animals going to object now too? I know if I was a lion, I'd be embarrassed at my species being used to as the name for the Detroit Lions.   

[Edited 2010-04-11 13:24:29]
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bjorn14
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 2:40 pm

Quoting pgh234 (Reply 4):
I admit that I know nothing about the UND situation in particular...


Here’s the Reader’s Digest Version....a few years back there were some "leaders" in the tribe that tried to shakedown UND, a fight ensued adding liberals to the mix. The 'leaders" have since been voted out of office and some convicted of corruption and in jail. Current tribe leaders want UND to keep the name as do much of tribe but you know when the libs get involved....
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casinterest
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 3:01 pm

Quoting Midcon385 (Reply 17):
This is our culture, it's not yours, please leave it alone. Don't dress up like you think we do and don't dance or pretend to do rituals you don't have a clue as to the meaning of.

So I suppose things woiuld be olk if UND changed their name to the Gambling Sioux and then posted Casino adverts on their jersey's, or drunk bar singers for the mascot? That would be so much more accurate than as a fighting nation of proud people.


I agree that tribes should have a say, and quite honestly ... YOUR culture has a multitude of folks that have spoken and voiced their opinion. The Chippewas, Seminoles and Fighting Illinois have all kept their names through agreements with tribes. Stubborness and failure to work through these issues and fine commonalities with educational institutions will only relegate the Native American Histrory of the Sioux and their plight into the history books instead of keeping it alive and vibrant. The same with having a very isolationist attiutude.
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pgh234
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 4:27 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 26):
Here’s the Reader’s Digest Version....a few years back there were some "leaders" in the tribe that tried to shakedown UND, a fight ensued adding liberals to the mix. The 'leaders" have since been voted out of office and some convicted of corruption and in jail. Current tribe leaders want UND to keep the name as do much of tribe but you know when the libs get involved....

haha...Thanks...I figured there was some twist like that in the "real" story
 
nwadeicer
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 4:50 pm

Dear NCAA,

Which one of these would you define as offensive.



or

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midcon385
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 6:49 pm

Quoting casinterest (Reply 27):
So I suppose things woiuld be olk if UND changed their name to the Gambling Sioux and then posted Casino adverts on their jersey's, or drunk bar singers for the mascot? That would be so much more accurate than as a fighting nation of proud people.

I don't think the various tribes of the Sioux Nation have any casinos. As far as drunks, yes alcohol abuse is definitely a problem on the reservation, as is suicide. Even gang violence is beginning to be known on various reservations, beating up elders as part of their initiation. As you may know, traditional Native culture greatly reveres and respects elders, so that's precisely why the gangs do what they do.

Quoting casinterest (Reply 27):
I agree that tribes should have a say, and quite honestly ... YOUR culture has a multitude of folks that have spoken and voiced their opinion. The Chippewas, Seminoles and Fighting Illinois have all kept their names through agreements with tribes. Stubborness and failure to work through these issues and fine commonalities with educational institutions will only relegate the Native American Histrory of the Sioux and their plight into the history books instead of keeping it alive and vibrant. The same with having a very isolationist attiutude.

And that's fine. The tribes that have said "It's fine by us" have made their own decision. I'm not saying it's wrong. And yes, there are people with their heads in the ground on the tribal councils, just like anywhere else. I have never thought or said that the issues shouldn't be worked through by common consensus and respect from both sides. However, I have said that if the tribe doesn't want their name associated with a sports team, they have the right to voice that opinion and challenge it legally, if necessary. Finally, our history, our culture, and our traditions, are alive and well regardless of this or similar situations. Yes there are challenges due to the extreme poverty and stresses of living on the reservations (for the record I do not live on a reservation or even close to one though, nor have I ever). I agree that an isolationist attitude isn't right. There are some that want to make their own sovereign Indian nation, independent of the United States, but I don't agree with that! And I think those are a small but vocal minority. I don't think that is the traditional view and I doubt the majority of traditional elders and medicine people support that either.

Tim
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slider
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 7:00 pm

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 9):
So is it the intent of those wishing to remove all Native American names, to completely wipe their existence from our collective memories? I would think that they would want to share those names, to remind a nation that they're still some of them around.

I mean seriously... twenty years from now when no team has those names, we will have completely met the goal of the Indian Wars: obliterate them from existence in both reality and our memories.

Great point...and where does it end?

The NCAA dropped the hammer and took the politically easy but intellectually lazy way out by issuing a blanket order. Marquette was another school that had to lose the "Warriors" nickname, which is BS too.

But by taking this to the ridiculous extreme, you marginalize the very people who the PC police claim to be advocates of.
 
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casinterest
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 7:18 pm

Quoting Midcon385 (Reply 30):
I don't think the various tribes of the Sioux Nation have any casinos.

Unfortunately
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srbmod
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 7:22 pm

Quoting NWAdeicer (Reply 29):

The Notre Dame logo, as it perpetuates a stereotype about the Irish.

The UND logo was designed by someone of Native American/First Nation heritage (Bennett Bryant, who is of Ojibwa ethnicity.). It honors the Sioux (and Native American/First Nation groups) as opposed to perpetuating a stereotype.
 
bjorn14
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 8:50 pm

Quoting Slider (Reply 31):
Marquette was another school that had to lose the "Warriors" nickname

Yes and all the nomenclature too.
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
midcon385
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 11:02 pm

Quoting casinterest,repy=32]Unfortunately
http://www.dakotanationgaming.com/employment.htm[/quote]

I stand corrected. The Sisseton-Wahpeton Sioux Tribe obviously does have connections to casinos and gambling. I honestly did not know that.

[quote=srbmod (Reply 33):
It honors the Sioux (and Native American/First Nation groups) as opposed to perpetuating a stereotype.

Yes, indeed, that isn't a bad logo at all.

Tim
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seb146
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Mon Apr 12, 2010 11:15 pm

I don't understand why "tribe" is bad. I think the Portland NBA team should change it's name for encouraging drug use as "blazer" is another way of talking about smoking marijuana. University of Southern California should be suspended for encouraging pre-marital sex, Arizona State should be suspended for encouraging witchcraft... Where does it end? When all the schools and teams are named after vegetables and insects (California Santa Cruz and Scottsdale Community College)? Or are those hurtful, too?
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BMI727
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RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Tue Apr 13, 2010 1:19 am

Quoting seb146 (Reply 36):
Or are those hurtful, too?

Well, the Washington Bullets changed their name...and that was before one of their players brought his gat for show and tell.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
 
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KaiGywer
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 9:59 am

RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Tue Apr 13, 2010 4:35 pm

Quoting Midcon385 (Reply 30):
I don't think the various tribes of the Sioux Nation have any casinos
Quoting casinterest (Reply 32):
Unfortunately
http://www.dakotanationgaming.com/em...t.htm

Also:

Spirit Lake Casino & Resort
Tribal Organization
Spirit Lake Sioux Nation

Prairie Knights Casino and Resort
Tribal Organization
Standing Rock Sioux Tribe

For what it's worth though, Prairie Knights was a dump. Been there once, won't be back. Even the buffet sucked, come on, a casino with a buffet that sucks? Not acceptable  
“Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, an
 
srbmod
Posts: 15446
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:32 pm

RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Tue Apr 13, 2010 8:50 pm

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 38):
Even the buffet sucked, come on, a casino with a buffet that sucks? Not acceptable

You've obviously never been to Emperor Wang's Impotent Palace in Las Vegas......   

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 37):

Well, the Washington Bullets changed their name...and that was before one of their players brought his gat for show and tell.

I still think that name change was a knee-jerk reaction, and a crappy name change as well. Wizards are not the first thing that springs to mind when you say Washington D.C. Considering how bad they've been since becoming the Wizards, they should have changed their name to the Washington Generals.......
 
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KaiGywer
Posts: 11183
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 9:59 am

RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Tue Apr 13, 2010 9:21 pm

Quoting srbmod (Reply 39):
You've obviously never been to Emperor Wang's Impotent Palace in Las Vegas......   

I tend to not venture far from the Strip  
“Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, an
 
N1120A
Posts: 26557
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Wed Apr 14, 2010 5:31 pm

Quoting FlyDeltaJets87 (Reply 25):

No one is throwing a fit over the "Boston Celtics".

Boston's massive Irish population probably isn't complaining about it. Besides, Boston's issues have always been with racism against black people.

Quoting NWAdeicer (Reply 29):
Dear NCAA,

Which one of these would you define as offensive.

A bunch of Irish Catholics founded Notre Dame, so I'm guessing the logo got approval.

Quoting KaiGywer (Reply 40):

I tend to not venture far from the Strip

If srbmod is referring to the Imperial Palace, that is on the Strip. The only thing worth seeing there is the classic car museum.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
GulfstreamGuy
Posts: 633
Joined: Sat Jul 03, 1999 6:30 am

RE: UND To Retire 'Sioux' Nickname

Thu Apr 15, 2010 4:39 am

It's sad. Even though I lived in Grand Forks (actually I grew up on the air force base) and my mom's whole side of my family is from near there, I never attended UND. Almost everyone of my cousins and second cousins did.

They did the same thing here in Arkansas too. It used to be that mascot of the Arkansas State University was the Indians (it had been the Indians for over 75 years). Back in March of 2008, they officially changed to the ASU Red Wolves.

Change isn't always better. I'll miss seeing the Fighting Sioux on things.

GulfstreamGuy
"If we couldn't laugh, we would all go insane. " -Jimmy Buffett

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