Moderators: richierich, ua900, PanAm_DC10, hOMSaR

 
Simps747
Topic Author
Posts: 31
Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2007 10:35 am

Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:13 pm

Does anyone know whether the Qantas flight searching for Abby Sunderland is a diverted commercial flight or a flight specifically dispatched to search for her?
 
geardown
Posts: 108
Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2005 6:01 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:24 pm

I'm pretty sure it is a diverted flight. Or did Qantas donate the aircraft, crew, fuel, etc? Probably not.
 
PanAm747LHR
Posts: 179
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 12:58 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:28 pm

The aircraft was chartered out of PER, and is not a regular flight.

http://www.smh.com.au/world/search-o...ignals-released-20100611-y0tq.html
 
Simps747
Topic Author
Posts: 31
Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2007 10:35 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:43 pm

Any idea what the costs would be to charter an A330 for this? I realize this was probably donated or funded by donations. That said there are still costs involved.

Any idea how far away she is from Perth?
 
comorin
Posts: 3858
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 5:52 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:13 am

Another reckless, narcissistic adventure that puts rescuers at risk. Do anything you like, but don't expect other countries to pluck you out of the water at taxpayers' expense. Search and Rescue crew risk their lives everyday helping genuinely stranded and unfortunate victims - this is a travesty.

Sorry for the rant, but every year sailors do this kind of stuff in the Southern Ocean - a horrific place to sail. Every year, you have the Oz and Kiwi navies involved for no good reason.
 
Stealthz
Posts: 5558
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:43 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:46 am

Quoting Simps747 (Reply 3):
Any idea how far away she is from Perth?

Hey Simps747, you could read the article that PanAm747LHR linked but as that seems like a challenge the answer is approx 3200km. There is apparently some shipping in the area, that is relative term, approx 650km or some 40hrs away.
That will be a long time to be in the water or in an upturned hull.. that is a likely scenario in her boat!**


Quoting Simps747 (Reply 3):
I realize this was probably donated or funded by donations.

Likely not, it was chartered by the Aust. Maritime Safety Authority so while Qantas would not want to be seen price gouging it was likely at someting near commercial rates. There are established protocols for recouping costs if your aircraft(or vessel) is involved in SAR activities.



** What idiot lets their daughter loose in the Southern Ocean in a fin keeled, cruise/race design boat?
Yes, Laurence Sunderland I am asking you that question.
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!....well that might have changed!!!
 
COSPN
Posts: 1842
Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 6:33 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:53 am

How can parents allow this kind of ______ They need to be charged with child abuse.. when they are 18 they can risk their lives if they want to..


Friday, April 12, 1996

7-Year-Old Pilot Crashes, Killing 3 And Ending Cross-Country Quest

By Tom Kenworthy
The Washington Post
CHEYENNE, Wyoming

A little girl and her big dream died here Thursday morning.

Jessica Dubroff, a 7-year-old student pilot from Pescadero, Calif., taking off on the second leg of an audacious quest to become the youngest person ever to complete a round-trip flight across the country, was killed early Thursday when her single-engine plane crashed shortly after takeoff from Cheyenne Airport.

Her father, Lloyd Dubroff, 57, and her flight instructor, Joe Reid, also died when the plane nose-dived into the driveway of a single-story brick home in a residential area about one mile north of the airport.

Witnesses said the four-seat Cessna Cardinal 177 appeared in trouble almost from the moment it lifted off from Runway 30 in heavy rain and gusty winds, and was attempting to return to the airport when it stalled and fell nearly vertically to the ground.

"It was trying to gain altitude but was never in control. It was in trouble as soon as it was in the air," said Tom Johnson, an insurance company claims representative and veteran pilot who saw the crash. "I observed it to be overloaded. It was a slow, mushy type of takeoff," he said.

The crash immediately revived a debate over the propriety of allowing very young pilots to fly, even under the watchful eye of a flight instructor, who under Federal Aviation Administration rules must be in a position to take control of the aircraft and is legally considered to be the pilot.

The FAA said it will reassess its policy allowing very young children to take the controls.

Airport officials here said they did not know who was at the controls of the dual-control Cessna when it departed at 8:24 a.m. (10:24 a.m. EDT).

Flying at such a young age was only one part of an unconventional upbringing that Jessica's parents have described as centered around real-life experiences rather than schooling. Her mother, Lisa Hathaway, told the San Francisco Examiner last month that she had decided not to send Jessica or her two siblings - brother Joshua, 9, and sister Jasmine, 3 - to school and not to home-school them either. "They're getting a tremendous education from having their lives be in the real world," Hathaway told the Examiner.

On Tuesday, Lloyd Dubroff said he was inspired by another young girl's cross-country flight several years ago, and when Jessica expressed an interest in flying, he asked her if she would like to try such a flight.

She agreed. "I'm the culprit," the Associated Press quoted him as saying.

But he also said his daughter was the impetus. She "dragged her mother and me into this" rather than being pushed by her parents, AP quoted him as saying. Her interest in flying began after her parents gave her an airplane ride for her sixth birthday.
 
JBirdAV8r
Posts: 3468
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2001 4:44 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:01 am

Quoting COSPN (Reply 6):
Her mother, Lisa Hathaway, told the San Francisco Examiner last month that she had decided not to send Jessica or her two siblings - brother Joshua, 9, and sister Jasmine, 3 - to school and not to home-school them either. "They're getting a tremendous education from having their lives be in the real world," Hathaway told the Examiner.

.............

I remember when this happened. Now where to begin.....

How the HELL is pretending to fly an airplane at seven years old a real-life experience?

Back to Sunderland--for that matter, she may have been a decent sailor--but it's absolutely impossible for her to have the EXPERIENCE and maturity of a GOOD sailor.

[Edited 2010-06-10 18:02:24]
I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
 
antskip
Posts: 832
Joined: Mon Jan 02, 2006 8:53 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:37 am

Quoting Simps747 (Reply 3):
Any idea how far away she is from Perth?


"Last know position was reported as Latitude -34.885931, Longitude 74.53125":
http://www.sail-world.com/Australia/...d-Rescue-for-Abby-Sunderland/70615

and another article from sailing fraternity:
http://www.sailinganarchy.com/index_page1.php

[Edited 2010-06-10 18:38:09]
 
User avatar
Dan23
Posts: 168
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2005 11:12 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:41 am

Looking at the schedules, QF could have an A333 parked in Perth all day from when QF78 arrives at 0030. From memory on Friday mornings the aircraft usually repositions back to MEL or SYD as a domestic flight and is replaced later in the evening for QF67 to HKG. I'm not sure what knock effect there would be from not having the A333 return to MEL/SYD if this was the case.
146, 319, 320, 332, 333, 380, 717, 733, 734, 738, 743, 744, 752, 763, 772, 77W, 788, 789, 781, AT7, CR7, DH1, DHT, EM2
 
User avatar
zeke
Posts: 15950
Joined: Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:42 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 1:48 am

Quoting Simps747 (Reply 3):
Any idea what the costs would be to charter an A330 for this?

I would guess around US$10,000 per hour

Quoting Simps747 (Reply 3):
I realize this was probably donated or funded by donations.

No, paid by the Australian Goverment.

Quoting antskip (Reply 9):

"Last know position was reported as Latitude -34.885931, Longitude 74.53125":

That would make it about 2100 nm west of PER, take about 4.5-5 hrs to get there.
“Don't be a show-off. Never be too proud to turn back. There are old pilots and bold pilots, but no old, bold pilots.” E. Hamilton Lee, 1949
 
User avatar
SuseJ772
Posts: 1046
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:13 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:04 am

I agree with my OZ friends. Americans, we have become such generation of wusses. We are now trying to push the driving age back to 18. Then we wonder why 25 and 30 year olds are still living with mom and have no job. Why men in this culture are no longer men. My grandfather lied about his age to fight in World War II. Two generations later - thanks to the over protective and narcissistic baby boomer generation - we have a generation of children that don't take risks and are used to being caudled.

As to the Qantas helping out and the OZ government picking up the bill - it makes me proud of both entities to be honest. I am glad they understand that this is a life out there - and that it was a life of someone who was trying something great. We can't accomplish great things with out risk. And unfortunately we are don't seem to be willing to take risks anymore.

I for one am glad for the spirit like Orville and Wilbur Wright and Amelia Earhart and Alan Shephard and John Glenn and the rest of many, many great people who took risks to accomplish greatness.
Currently at PIE, requesting FWA >> >>
 
JBirdAV8r
Posts: 3468
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2001 4:44 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:10 am

Quoting suseJ772 (Reply 11):
I agree with my OZ friends. Americans, we have become such generation of wusses. We are now trying to push the driving age back to 18. Then we wonder why 25 and 30 year olds are still living with mom and have no job. Why men in this culture are no longer men. My grandfather lied about his age to fight in World War II. Two generations later - thanks to the over protective and narcissistic baby boomer generation - we have a generation of children that don't take risks and are used to being caudled.

There's a difference between strength and resolve, and foolhardiness. While I agree with your general sentiment, this is the latter.
I got my head checked--by a jumbo jet
 
ukoverlander
Posts: 408
Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 10:57 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:11 am

Quoting comorin (Reply 4):
Another reckless, narcissistic adventure that puts rescuers at risk. Do anything you like, but don't expect other countries to pluck you out of the water at taxpayers' expense. Search and Rescue crew risk their lives everyday helping genuinely stranded and unfortunate victims - this is a travesty.



Let's spare the rush to judgment shall we while we hope and pray that the life of this young girl can be saved if it is not already too late. As somebody who has invested their time to coastal, cliff and mountain rescue in the UK I feel sure there is not a single person in a rescue unit whose time is currently invested in saving the life of this young girl who is spending any time thinking thoughts like these right now. They are focused on saving her life if they can.

Youth is not necessarily an indicator of inexperience or recklessness in the same way middle age is not necessarily a sign of experience, maturity or wisdom. There are many highly competent young sailors and mountaineers as I'm sure and many older people who sail, hike or climb who lack the skills or experience to get themselves out of trouble on sea or land when the elements take control. This is why we have search and rescue services - to aid the experienced and inexperienced alike.

If as the article suggests this young girl's boat has lost it's keel and capsized then age and experience have little to do with any of it. When the keel separates from your yacht in the southern oceans you're going over no matter who you are and how long you've been sailing.

My thoughts go out to the parents of this young girl and I hope the hopes and prayers of all of us focus on a young life potentially in grave danger - not upon rushing to judgment or condemning the parents in a situation the circumstances of which none of us know very much about.
 
richm
Posts: 599
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2004 1:21 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:11 am

The article links to her sailing blog. It comments on this particular incident and also gives an insight into what she has been experiencing.

http://soloround.blogspot.com/

The ocean should never be underestimated. Hopefully she will be found alive and well.

[Edited 2010-06-10 20:12:35]
 
AFGMEL
Posts: 190
Joined: Wed Jul 18, 2007 8:39 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:24 am

Quoting comorin (Reply 4):
Do anything you like, but don't expect other countries to pluck you out of the water at taxpayers' expense. Search and Rescue crew risk their lives everyday helping genuinely stranded and unfortunate victims - this is a travesty.

Couldn't agree with you more. It is a HUGE expense for us. The Indian ocean is large and this is by no means the first time. Some witless Frenchman has come unstuck twice and we have had to send naval ships to rescue him. They should have to pay for the service. It's not the same as a ship getting into trouble. These are thrill seekers who are taking avoidable risks such as having the right craft, crew etc. Ridiculous.
B 727-44/200 732/3/4/8/9 767-3 742/3/4, 772/3, A319/20/21 332/333 342/3 , DC3/4/10, F28/50/100, ATR72
 
sasd209
Posts: 401
Joined: Thu Nov 01, 2007 4:32 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 3:34 am

Quoting AFGMEL (Reply 15):
These are thrill seekers who are taking avoidable risks such as having the right craft, crew etc. Ridiculous.

While of course I hope this young lady comes out of this well, I also hope the gallant rescuers who are now searching take care of themselves and take the appropriate precautions so they do not become casualties of this 'around the world' escapade. It certainly does take a special kind of person to risk all in the search of others, be it boat crew, helo crew, or in this case also a Qantas crew and others. Take care of yourselves lads, be careful, and good luck!
 
dstc47
Posts: 1493
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 1999 3:53 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 6:46 am

When I was sixteen my parents did not really approve of my going to the airport, 3 miles away, in case I got into trouble.
 
Springbok747
Posts: 3993
Joined: Sun Nov 14, 2004 9:13 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 6:53 am

Hope they find her...wooo...go Qantas...she has been found!

And as usual..CNN can't even get the spelling right..

A Quantas aircraft has been chartered from the western Australian city of Perth to fly over the area where Abby Sunderland and her small sailboat are believed to be. Lusk said the plane will try to radio the teenager when it nears her location.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/US/06/11/missing.teen.sailor/?hpt=T1

[Edited 2010-06-11 00:53:10]
אני תומך בישראל
 
dstc47
Posts: 1493
Joined: Thu Sep 16, 1999 3:53 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 7:06 am

Press now reporting this young lady found alive.
 
beakerltn
Posts: 126
Joined: Thu Jul 09, 2009 8:18 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 7:10 am

300/319/320/321/330/732/733/734/73G/738/744/772/77W/146/EMB135/EMB145
 
olympic472
Posts: 141
Joined: Wed Jun 04, 2008 5:37 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 7:10 am

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2010/06/11...chers-contact-calif-teen-lost-sea/

Good news. The Qantas jet spotted her and made radio contact. Boat upright with a broken mast.
Civil Aviation has a "Need for Speed"!
 
na
Posts: 9835
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 1999 3:52 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 7:10 am

One word: Stupid.





A few more words:
Waste of money to search for a stupid girl who put herself deliberately into danger . And an inappropriate and unpromising way to search for her. This money would better better invested elsewhere to help more people who really deserve it.
I have no sympathy for these teenie-world circumnavigations at all, not for the kids, and even less so for their parents.
 
MadameConcorde
Posts: 9265
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:08 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 7:19 am

Abby Sunderland located. Communication established with the young sailor.
Thank you Qantas!

Abby's Blog: Abby is Fine!
soloround.blogspot.com

We have just heard from the Australian Search and Rescue. The plane arrived on the scene moments ago. Wild Eyes is upright but her rigging is down. The weather conditions are abating. Radio communication was made and Abby reports that she is fine!We don't know much else right now. ...

  
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde
 
bjorn14
Posts: 3595
Joined: Sat Feb 27, 2010 2:11 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:15 am

Quoting stealthz (Reply 5):
** What idiot lets their daughter loose in the Southern Ocean in a fin keeled, cruise/race design boat?
Yes, Laurence Sunderland I am asking you that question.

Well, apparently idiocy runs in the family as her then 17-year old brother Zac successfully curcumvented the globe in 2009.
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
ZuluAlpha
Posts: 327
Joined: Sun Mar 21, 2010 7:22 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:26 am

Quoting AFGMEL (Reply 15):
Some witless Frenchman has come unstuck twice and we have had to send naval ships to rescue him

I think it was Tony Bullimore?
Flown on:_CRJ, CR7 D10 DHT DH8, DH2, DH3, DH4, EMB, E45, E75, E90, F28 J32 M80 SH6 320, 32B, 332, 333, 380, 717, 732, 733, 734, 73H, 743, 744, 752 762, 763, 772, 77W
 
skidmarks
Posts: 6614
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:51 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:29 am

Well, all I can say is, the people who condem this sort of exploit are the same people who would wrap children in cotton wool, not allowing any sort of adventure or risk taking.

This world is a very varied place and there are still challenges to be had, despite the dumbing down of much of it. Sailing the Southern Ocean is one of those challenges and it is gratifying that some parent thinks mollycoddling your kids to the point of stifling them is not the way forward.

So she needs help? So Australia helps out? So what? Get off your high horses and stop trying to make the world a dull, pointless and dreary place. Just because you lack the desire to push yourself to the limits of endurance, don't decry those that do. And stop trying to tell everyone else what they should or shouldn't be doing.

Andy   
Growing old is compulsory, growing up is optional
 
vfw614
Posts: 3996
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2001 12:34 am

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:35 am

Leaving the sanity of teenagers sailing around the world aside as a general issue, the problem is that they want to be youngest teenager to have sailed the world. As the clock ticks, those kids take extreme risk - like this young gal who decided to take a southern route during winter / monsoon time because it was the only way to beat the young Aussie girl who just finished her round the world sail.

And because of this "youngest who..." competition, they get younger and younger. In the Netherlands, authorities had to take away child custody from the parents of a 13 year old girl who was planning to go on such a trip (it was the girl who fled home afterwards and made it as an unaccompanied minor to the Caribbean on an Air France (?) flight).
 
bjorn14
Posts: 3595
Joined: Sat Feb 27, 2010 2:11 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 9:59 am

Reminds me of the old saying..."Success has a 1,000 Fathers but failure is left an orphan"
"I want to know the voice of God the rest is just details" --A. Einstein
 
SA7700
Posts: 2930
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2003 9:38 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 10:05 am

This thread will be locked as it has veered off-topic into a general non-aviation thread. All posts added to the thread, after the thread lock, will be removed for housekeeping purposes only.

If you would like to continue discussion on this topic, please do so in the following thread: RTW Teen Sailor "Feared Lost At Sea" - Located


Rgds

SA7700
When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
 
MadameConcorde
Posts: 9265
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:08 pm

RE: Teen Sailor Missing, Qantas To Search

Fri Jun 11, 2010 10:06 am

"" A rescue has not been made, however. The nearest ship bound for her position is about 30 hours away, but fierce winds and seas that had been upwards of 40 feet are abating. Australian, American and French search-and-rescue authorities are cooperating in the rescue attempt. ""

http://www.grindtv.com/outdoor/blog/...+safe+aboard+her+damaged+sailboat/

I was wonderng. Would it be possible for a helicopter to reach the boat at such far away distance - maybe from Diego Garcia? - and tow Abby up on the helicopter with a wire?

Her life is much more precious than the boat and all her gear. Insurance is there to take care of that.

Abby is now a world celebrity. Maybe this will get her sponsors and she can have a very strong and much bigger boat to undertake her next Round-the-World circumnavigation.

Go Abby! Go brave girl   
There was a better way to fly it was called Concorde

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: MarcoT and 56 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos