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cpd
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:07 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 97):
Saw this. Just to make matters more complicated

Reports are now saying the Mig-23 was accidently downed by friendly fire - the rebels apparently mistakenly shot their own plane down. But, that's from Libyan TV - so take that with a grain of salt.

[Edited 2011-03-19 07:08:51]
 
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Aesma
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:23 pm

Gaddafi is saying he's abiding to the ceasefire and that current combats are between rebels (who aren't Libyans anyway, according to him) and Al Qaeda, so yeah, a big grain of salt !
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
ImperialEagle
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:30 pm

Quoting 11Bravo (Reply 9):
It might be wise for the US and UK to take a back seat on this if a No-Fly course of action is necessary. Perhaps it would be best if Mediterranean powers (France, Spain, Italy) take the lead. IMO
Quoting silentbob (Reply 19):
The US is in a no-win situation

I agree completely. The problem with doing battle with a skunk is that everybody involved ends up stinking.
"If everything seems under control, you're just not going fast enough!"
 
cpd
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:32 pm

French jets have apparently flown over Libya on recon missions, according to French sources.

Update: Sarkozy to address the media shortly. Waiting for his announcement now.

Dutch PM says first strikes from British, French and Canadian planes possibly later today. As a first strike, ahead of a wider action.

Sarkozy now.

[Edited 2011-03-19 07:46:41]
 
CometII
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:44 pm

French have lead this effort all the way: putting pressure on Gaddafi, recognizing the rebels, leading for a no-fly zone, now French jets first over Libya... Sarkozy to speak shortly.

I promise I will never make jokes about the French and WWII ever again, not that I really ever make many but I will cease complelely. They are showing brave leadership here.  
 
cpd
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:49 pm

French fighter jets are now over Benghazi, according to latest reports.

It was a very strongly worded speech from President Sarkozy - making clear the consequences for Col. Gaddafi - but also stressing that there is still time for Col. Gaddafi to step back, provided he does it completely and unreservedly.

British PM Cameron says "Gaddafi has made this happen..., has lied to the international community".

[Edited 2011-03-19 07:55:08]
 
JoKeR
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 3:16 pm

Italian fighter jets leaving bases for missions over Libya according to Serbian media.

Irrespective of the mission, the cause, must say hearing this sort of news always brings bitter memories of the bombing of Belgrade and Serbia because of one lunatic, almost to the day, 11 years ago.

Best wishes to the innocent Libyan people, hopes and prayrs for your safety.
 
F9Animal
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 3:44 pm

Quoting cpd (Reply 100):
Reports are now saying the Mig-23 was accidently downed by friendly fire - the rebels apparently mistakenly shot their own plane down. But, that's from Libyan TV - so take that with a grain of salt.

Oh man, media reports it was one of Gaddafis planes.  

Whatever the case, send the message. It is time to teach this punk a lesson.
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
janmnastami
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 3:44 pm

Quoting cpd (Reply 88):
Quoted for truth, huh?

Theoretically they're right, the treaty forbids Italy from allowing the use of its territory for hostile attacks to Libya.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 94):
I think he had no choice, just like Sarkozy. Both were seen licking Gaddafi's ass quite recently, they have to make us forget about that !

IMO, Sarkozy is pushing for an attack for political (2012 presidential elections, Marine Le Pen and immigration from north-Africa, France's image in the world) and economic reasons (contracts for oil companies).
 
cpd
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 3:54 pm

Italy will it seems provide bases at the moment, for now, and not planes right at the moment. That's confirmed by Mr Berlusconi. Germany has also confirmed it will not participate, but that it fully supports the action.

Reports are that Mirage and Rafale aircraft are in the air over Benghazi. The most crucial thing here is that the wide Arab consensus has really made this happen - their support has made this intervention less risky.

I don't think there will be many people who will be sad to see Col. Gaddafi gone.

Canadian F-18s are now on the move so it seems.

[Edited 2011-03-19 09:00:10]
 
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Aesma
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 4:13 pm

Apparently among Lybian planes downed by the rebels (not today), there was also an Algerian pilot. Among troops on the ground, there are countless nationalities, from Africa and even Europe. So, it seems that Gaddafi doesn't have enough Libyans ready to die for him as he pretends !
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
JJJ
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 4:25 pm

4 Spanish F18 are currently deploying to Sigonella base.

An Aegis frigate and another 4 F18 are on standby.
 
cpd
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 4:34 pm

You'd have to say that it would be a wise time for pro-Gaddafi forces to rethink their alliances in the face of very overwhelming force that is on its way.
 
LMP737
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 4:42 pm

The million dollar question is what happens if Gaddafi decides to press on with his ground assault while keeping his air force on the ground. If he does that then what? In order to bomb effectivley in a changing battlefield you need someone on the ground to designate targets. Is NATO prepared to do this? If not then IMHO you're just wasting a lot of Jet A.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
cpd
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 4:59 pm

France has fired the first shot of the conflict. They fired on a vehicle - this comes from the French themselves. Some 20 aircraft are involved at the moment. There is no word what kind of vehicle it was, but it was destroyed.

For the moment, it seems the Armée de l’Air is doing the heavy lifting.

[Edited 2011-03-19 10:08:00]

[Edited 2011-03-19 10:11:08]
 
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Aesma
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:09 pm

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 113):
The million dollar question is what happens if Gaddafi decides to press on with his ground assault while keeping his air force on the ground. If he does that then what? In order to bomb effectivley in a changing battlefield you need someone on the ground to designate targets. Is NATO prepared to do this? If not then IMHO you're just wasting a lot of Jet A.

NATO is not involved if I understand correctly.

Sarkozy has made it clear that shooting targets on the ground is part of the plan, including moving targets.

I wonder if there is a communication channel with the rebels to help discrimination.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
LMP737
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:24 pm

Quoting Aesma (Reply 115):
NATO is not involved if I understand correctly



When you look at the countries invovled it certainly looks like NATO.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 115):
Sarkozy has made it clear that shooting targets on the ground is part of the plan, including moving targets.



How's he going to do that if he's not sure who is who?

Quoting Aesma (Reply 115):
I wonder if there is a communication channel with the rebels to help discrimination.



Does anyone know who we are really dealing with here? If we do I seriously doubt that any of these rebels have a clue as to how to call in an air strike. They might end up getting a JDAM droped right on top of them.
Never take financial advice from co-workers.
 
GDB
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 5:45 pm

It's very likely SF troops are on the ground, since the UK government do not comment on their operations they officially will not be, likely French ones too.

Despite it's much publicised mechanical issues, reports suggest that the carrier Charles De Gaulle is at sea - it had been reported stuck in dock.
 
baroque
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 6:11 pm

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/eu...e/2011/03/2011319132058782326.html
Franch jets attack Gaddafi targets
Warplanes destroy four tanks used by Libyan leader's army as military action to enforce UN-ordered no-fly zone begins.


They get to be French jets just below a picture of a rather quizzical Sarkozy.
Around 20 aircraft are involved in operations over Libya, the French defence ministry said.

As LMP writes, hope they have their communications organized. Makes you wonder what all that kerfuffle of the UK diplomat being arrested with his "friends" was really all about. One day we will know I suppose.
 
baroque
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 6:14 pm

I wonder if this relates in any way?

Al Jazeera has been suffering interference on its Arabsat satellite frequency. During jamming Al Jazeera English can be watched on Hotbird 13E Frequency: 11034 Vertical FEC: 3/4 Symbol rate: 27500; on Badr4/Eurobird 2 (26East) Frequency: 11680.8 Horizontal; SR: 27.5: FEC: 3/4; and on Nilesat/ Atlantic Bird4A (7West) Frequency: 11393 Vertical; SR:27.5; FEC: 3/4. Al Jazeera Arabic can be watched on Nilesat 7W Frequency: 11555 Vertical FEC: 3/4 Symbol rate: 27500.

Hmmm. Who is doing that and why?
 
AeroWesty
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 6:14 pm

I'm very very happy to see that the US isn't bullying its way to the front to lead the effort against Gaddafi. Obama has left on his trip to South America, to let others let us know what support they need.
International Homo of Mystery
 
GIANCAVIA
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 7:46 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 120):
I'm very very happy to see that the US isn't bullying its way to the front to lead the effort against Gaddafi. Obama has left on his trip to South America, to let others let us know what support they need.

US is firing missiles at Libya as we speak  
 
GIANCAVIA
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:17 pm

USA has now taken command of the entire operation.
 
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Aesma
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:21 pm

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 116):
When you look at the countries involved it certainly looks like NATO.

Qatar ?

But anyway, NATO is an organization, with commanders calling the shots. Here, they're not calling the shots, so it's not NATO, just countries that happen to be NATO members (and probably even some NATO hardware and logistics as needed).

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 116):
How's he going to do that if he's not sure who is who?

Does anyone know who we are really dealing with here? If we do I seriously doubt that any of these rebels have a clue as to how to call in an air strike. They might end up getting a JDAM dropped right on top of them.
Quoting GDB (Reply 117):
It's very likely SF troops are on the ground, since the UK government do not comment on their operations they officially will not be, likely French ones too.

I was gonna say the same thing.

As for Gaddafi's aviation, French mechanics were there some months ago to help, apparently most planes were in an advanced state of disrepair and full of sand.
New Technology is the name we give to stuff that doesn't work yet. Douglas Adams
 
AeroWesty
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:25 pm

Quoting Giancavia (Reply 122):
USA has now taken command of the entire operation.

Where are you seeing this? That's not being reported on the BBC, CNN, NYTimes, Telegraph, etc. that I've seen.
International Homo of Mystery
 
BMIFlyer
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:55 pm

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 113):
The million dollar question is what happens if Gaddafi decides to press on with his ground assault while keeping his air force on the ground. If he does that then what? In order to bomb effectivley in a changing battlefield you need someone on the ground to designate targets. Is NATO prepared to do this? If not then IMHO you're just wasting a lot of Jet A.


Target designation is being done using the RAF 'Sentinel' aircraft.....

http://www.raf.mod.uk/equipment/sentinelr1.cfm
Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
 
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AirPacific747
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 8:58 pm

Quoting prebennorholm (Reply 87):
Denmark (4 x F-16AM)

+ 2 backup F-16s, so 6 in total.
 
scrubbsywg
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 9:34 pm

Quoting Baroque (Reply 119):
I wonder if this relates in any way?

Al Jazeera has been suffering interference on its Arabsat satellite frequency. During jamming Al Jazeera English can be watched on Hotbird 13E Frequency: 11034 Vertical FEC: 3/4 Symbol rate: 27500; on Badr4/Eurobird 2 (26East) Frequency: 11680.8 Horizontal; SR: 27.5: FEC: 3/4; and on Nilesat/ Atlantic Bird4A (7West) Frequency: 11393 Vertical; SR:27.5; FEC: 3/4. Al Jazeera Arabic can be watched on Nilesat 7W Frequency: 11555 Vertical FEC: 3/4 Symbol rate: 27500.

Hmmm. Who is doing that and why?

Throughout the egyptian and libyan crises, AJ has had messages like that either scrolling the screen or on the live stream page. I'm not sure if anything is different today from 3 weeks ago. Someone is apparently jamming AJ in those areas, and I reckon it is Libya.
 
kaitak
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 9:34 pm

The Beeb is reporting that the US and UK have fired 110 cruise missiles at 20 sites within the country. I presume this includes air bases - possibly Tripoli Airport as well?
 
Mortyman
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 9:39 pm

Quoting LMP737 (Reply 113):
Is NATO prepared to do this? If not then IMHO you're just wasting a lot of Jet A.

This is an operation pushed for by the Arab nations. It is led and started by the French and now has the USA and several other European countries backing it up. No it's not a NATO operation at this time. Just alot of countires that also happen to be part of NATO doing a non NATO operation.


That is'nt to say that NATO wont get involved at a later point.

Countries involved / getting involved in some form:

France
Denmark
USA
UK
Norway
Spain
Italy
Germany
Canada
Belgium
Greece
Qatar
Arab Emirates

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/verden/1.7556664
 
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fraspotter
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 9:44 pm

Quoting kaitak (Reply 128):
The Beeb is reporting that the US and UK have fired 110 cruise missiles at 20 sites within the country. I presume this includes air bases - possibly Tripoli Airport as well?

I heard CNN mentioning AA Sites as some of the targets... After all, in order to effectively maintain a NFZ you need to take out those targets that could pose a threat to the planes in the air...
"The strength of the turbulence is directly proportional to the temperature of your coffee."

— Gunter's Second Law of Air Travel
 
AeroWesty
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 10:11 pm

Quoting Mortyman (Reply 129):
That is'nt to say that NATO wont get involved at a later point.
The New York Times is now reporting exactly that:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/20/world/africa/20libya.html?hp

"... Mrs. Clinton emphasized that the United States was not leading the effort. “We did not lead this,” she said. “We did not engage in unilateral actions in any way, but we strongly support the international community taking action against governments and leaders who behave as Qaddafi is unfortunately doing so now.”

By midweek, NATO will take over the operation of the no-fly zone and arms embargo, because it alone has sufficient command and control capabilities, under the direction of the supreme allied commander of Europe, officials said."
International Homo of Mystery
 
GIANCAVIA
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sat Mar 19, 2011 10:18 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 124):

Where are you seeing this? That's not being reported on the BBC, CNN, NYTimes, Telegraph, etc. that I've seen.

It was on sky news, The US has command because they currently have the best command and control assets until the Charles De Gaule Arrives. (Apparently)
 
GDB
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:05 am

Quoting BMIFlyer (Reply 125):
Target designation is being done using the RAF 'Sentinel' aircraft.....

The very same aircraft deemed as not needed in the Treasury hatchet-job masquerading as a 'Defence and Security Review' just a few months ago.

110 Tomahawks? Good grief, from those US warships/subs and RN sub/subs.

What is really needed, is a decoupling of Gaddafi's forces/mercenaries, a bit of self preservation on their part kicking in, that's the best, maybe the only way to unseat that ghastly ruling family.
You don't have to read between the lines much to see that is the logic of the UN resolution, to achieve it's aims of protecting civilians.

Today's action though, is likely the easy part.
 
BMI727
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:24 am

Quoting GDB (Reply 133):
110 Tomahawks? Good grief, from those US warships/subs and RN sub/subs.

I have to wonder if the Ohio SSGNs are involved. They carry 154 each.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
 
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par13del
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:33 am

Quoting GDB (Reply 133):
The very same aircraft deemed as not needed in the Treasury hatchet-job masquerading as a 'Defence and Security Review' just a few months ago.

Saw a lovely cartoon of a UK ship yard taking apart the Ark Royal when a call comes from the PM asking if they could put her back together aging, funny as hell. 
 
11Bravo
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 12:47 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 134):
I have to wonder if the Ohio SSGNs are involved. They carry 154 each.

Yes, apparently USS Florida was/is part of the attack.
WhaleJets Rule!
 
TheCol
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 2:33 am

Quoting cpd (Reply 112):

It's likely a lot of Mercs will be running for the hills once their air support is obliterated and the bombs start dropping on them.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 115):
I wonder if there is a communication channel with the rebels to help discrimination.

It's a given that the fleet has been monitoring com traffic extensively. If the word on the street is true, which it probably is, about British and other special forces operating in Libya, then you can also bet that military intelligence has been tapping the coms as well.
No matter how random things may appear, there's always a plan.
 
UH60FtRucker
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:08 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 134):
I have to wonder if the Ohio SSGNs are involved. They carry 154 each.
Quoting 11Bravo (Reply 136):
Yes, apparently USS Florida was/is part of the attack.

This is pretty cool - marks the first time in history that an Ohio class has fired in anger... and the world, as we know it, didn't end in the process!
Your men have to follow your orders. They don't have to go to your funeral.
 
NAV20
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:31 am

Quoting GDB (Reply 133):
You don't have to read between the lines much to see that is the logic of the UN resolution, to achieve it's aims of protecting civilians.

Today's action though, is likely the easy part.

Trouble is, though, it appears to be the 'only' part........ Obama's already ruled out 'troops on the ground' - except for special forces, that is, spotting targets and assessing damage; as TheCol suggests, they'll already be in there.

Since, as it happens, my earliest memories are of bombs dropping (and even missiles coming over) I suppose that I can say 'from experience' that bombing without subsequent occupation doesn't achieve anything in military terms. All it does is kill or 'de-house' a lot of civilians.

And the LAST people to be harmed by it (or influenced by it) will be Gaddafi and his cronies - they'll have plenty of deep shelters to dive into......

[Edited 2011-03-19 20:33:19]
"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
 
janmnastami
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 3:43 am

In some parts of Libya Ghaddafi has a strong support from the population.
 
ltbewr
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 4:05 am

I wish that instead of bombing and killing a lot of innocents, why couldn't we just cut off Libya from the outside world as to access to financial markets, banking, and most communications as well as a sea an air embargo. Any monies due for sold oil would be put into an account managed in a neutral country with a transparent and respected banking system and not paid until a new government is in place.

OK, here are some other problems with this new war in Libya: We get Daffy Qaddafi out of office (and preferably killed by his own people) - then who takes over? The Military? The rebels who many not have our best interest at heart but want to control the oil wealth for themselves? You know our and allies missiles and aircraft will kill 'innocents'; will that mean triggering terror acts against the USA or Europe? Then there the billions this will cost the American taxpayers already overwhelmed by other wars and financial crises.

I think this is going to be potential serious mess for the USA if not handled carefully and I don't trust the USA politicians over it.
 
BMI727
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 4:35 am

Quoting UH60FtRucker (Reply 138):
This is pretty cool - marks the first time in history that an Ohio class has fired in anger... and the world, as we know it, didn't end in the process!

Yeah, for all the screwups DoD has made, converting some of the boomers to Tomahawks was one of the best moves they've made lately. That is a lot of firepower that is liable to show up anywhere at any time.

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 141):
We get Daffy Qaddafi out of office (and preferably killed by his own people) - then who takes over?

That's the catch, and really the most compelling reason for a hands off approach, but that ship has sailed. Hopefully the international community will bear more of that burden. I'm all for taking out evil dictators, but it has to be the best course of action for America, and not just the Libyans.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
 
NAV20
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 4:56 am

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 141):
as well as a sea and air embargo

In fairness to the military, ltbewr, an essential 'first step' in achieving that embargo is to knock out their air defences (radar as well as airfields). That appears to be what all those missiles, so far, are intended to do; establish 'air superiority.' And I've no doubt that they'll succeed, in large part.

But I think that what all or most of us can't see, at the moment, is what comes next? You may well be right that trade embargos etc. should and will follow.

But the effect of any such embargos on things like oil prices might hurt all of us a lot more than it hurts Gaddafi?

PS - breaking news. Our radio news just played a phone interview with a Tripoli resident who lives quite close to Gaddafi's 'lair.' He said that there had been half an hour of very heavy anti-aircraft gunfire over Tripoli, ending only ten minutes ago.

Just possibly, this was an attempt at 'decapitation' - knocking out Gaddafi himself. If so, good - if I was a politician given the job of 'handling' this problem, that's what I would probably try........

[Edited 2011-03-19 22:13:36]
"Once you have flown, you will walk the earth with your eyes turned skywards.." - Leonardo da Vinci
 
11Bravo
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 6:39 am

Quoting NAV20 (Reply 143):
PS - breaking news. Our radio news just played a phone interview with a Tripoli resident who lives quite close to Gaddafi's 'lair.' He said that there had been half an hour of very heavy anti-aircraft gunfire over Tripoli, ending only ten minutes ago.

Just possibly, this was an attempt at 'decapitation' - knocking out Gaddafi himself. If so, good - if I was a politician given the job of 'handling' this problem, that's what I would probably try........

Probably easier said than done. Our efforts to do that in Iraq and Serbia didn't work very well. We've been trying to kill OBL for nearly ten years now and it looks like that hasn't worked either ???

I bet Gaddafi is at the preverbial "undisclosed location". We may find him with SIGINT, but he's probably very careful at this point. He knows we're hunting him. Of course if he's not communicating as a safety precaution, that makes it very hard for him to control his resources.
WhaleJets Rule!
 
QANTAS077
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 7:50 am

^ probably easier done, he appears in public plenty so I am still stunned that a sniper hasn't taken him out.
 
BMI727
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:48 am

Quoting 11Bravo (Reply 144):
Our efforts to do that in Iraq and Serbia didn't work very well.

Quite on the contrary in the case of Iraq. While their leaders survived, much of the command and control infrastructure was mostly smashed within hours. Even though they were alive, Sadaam and other Iraqi leaders couldn't lead so the decapitation was actually quite effective. Decapitation and assassination are not necessarily the same thing.
Why do Aerospace Engineering students have to turn things in on time?
 
GDB
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RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 8:52 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 134):
I have to wonder if the Ohio SSGNs are involved. They carry 154 each.

I hadn't thought of that and it's clearly the case.

On the embargo idea, yes but for many years that was the case, it was the reason that Gaddafi 'came in from the cold' in 2004.
But it took 20 years and did not remove him from power, it was also likely the idea of his sons with an eye on the dynasty.
(Odd that, in a 'State Of The Masses', the masses of his brood?)


From a UK Ministry of Defence statement;

We have launched Tomahawk Land Attack Missiles from a Trafalgar Class submarine and Stormshadow missiles from Tornado GR4s. The fast jets flew 3,000 miles from RAF Marham and back making this the longest range bombing mission conducted by the RAF since the Falklands conflict. This operation was supported by VC10 and Tristar air-to-air refuelling aircraft as well as E3D Sentry and Sentinel surveillance aircraft.

That was a long old trip by the GR.4's, notwithstanding the circa 150 mile Stormshadow range.

[Edited 2011-03-20 02:02:06]

[Edited 2011-03-20 02:02:51]
 
cpd
Posts: 6715
Joined: Sat Jun 28, 2008 4:46 am

RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 11:33 am

Quoting ltbewr (Reply 141):

I think this is going to be potential serious mess for the USA if not handled carefully and I don't trust the USA politicians over it.

Well, the serious mess will be short lived, as the USA can dump a heap of cruise-missiles at targets and then wash its hands of it and let the French and UK carry all the unwanted baggage. After all, it was the French and the UK that were the hawks this time, and the French fired the first shots.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 142):
I'm all for taking out evil dictators, but it has to be the best course of action for America, and not just the Libyans.

As said above. USA isn't the lead in the operation.
 
Mortyman
Posts: 5930
Joined: Sat Aug 12, 2006 8:26 pm

RE: No Fly Zone Over Libya?

Sun Mar 20, 2011 11:40 am

Quoting cpd (Reply 148):
As said above. USA isn't the lead in the operation.

Hard to say actually. The US certainly seem to be the most active one in the battle...
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