skyservice_330
Topic Author
Posts: 1371
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Canada #1 For Business

Tue Oct 11, 2011 7:27 pm

...according to Forbes magazine that is. Main reasons:

- strong financial sector and banking system.
- tax reform over the last few years including harmonization in Ontario and BC and the lowering/continual lowering of corporate tax rates provincially/federally.
- lots of natural resources, close trading relationship/surplus with the US, continued economic growth in touch economic seas.

More at:
http://www.forbes.com/lists/2011/6/b...st-countries-11_Canada_CHI019.html
http://business.financialpost.com/20...-ranked-best-country-for-business/
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toront...es-canada-best-place-business.html
 
Centre
Posts: 321
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 11:37 pm

RE: Canada #1 For Business

Thu Oct 13, 2011 4:48 pm

Quoting skyservice_330 (Thread starter):
financial sector and banking system.

Monopoly in action?

Quoting skyservice_330 (Thread starter):
- tax reform over the last few years including harmonization in Ontario and BC and the lowering/continual lowering of corporate tax rates provincially/federally.

How is HST any good to businesses?
In Ontario, All of our business costs went up by 8% since the introduction of HST, and I can't charge my clients more by even 0.5% as they will just go to my competition with less overhead costs.

Housing prices is on the rise, in the GTA, $500K can hardly buy you anything useful if you are looking for a family dwelling close to where you work.

Best of all: What we pay for TAX is more tan what we pay for Mortgage.

While I give credit to Canada for the stable economy, I think It's a country for the Rich and the Poor only. Middle class is vanishing.
Correction: It's a country for the Government Employees, the Rich, and the Poor only.

http://www.torontosun.com/2011/04/25/the-threat-of-big-government

Quote:
And Statistics Canada's latest labour force survey could not have been more timely.

Only days old, it showed more "takers" work in government across our vast country -- federally, provincially and municipally -- than any of the "makers," including manufacturing.

Canada has about 3.5 million working as public servants which is about 20% of the working force in Canada. That means they are 20% of the voting power in working Canada.
Heck, that's why we have so many stupid Civic Holidays!!!

Family Day for one!!!
I have cut 4 times, and it's still short.
 
connies4ever
Posts: 3393
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:54 pm

RE: Canada #1 For Business

Thu Oct 13, 2011 11:27 pm

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
Quoting skyservice_330 (Thread starter):
financial sector and banking system.

Monopoly in action?

Rubbish. There are six major national banks, all hustling for business. And several boutique banks.
But a major strength of our banking system is that it is well regulated, unlike the cowboy atmosphere south of the border.

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
How is HST any good to businesses?
In Ontario, All of our business costs went up by 8% since the introduction of HST, and I can't charge my clients more by even 0.5% as they will just go to my competition with less overhead costs.

Again, rubbish. only those costs previously not subject to PST went up 8%, others were largely, but not totally, unchanged. How is the GST/HST good for business ? Because tax is only paid on the value added at any step of the process.

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
Housing prices is on the rise, in the GTA, $500K can hardly buy you anything useful if you are looking for a family dwelling close to where you work.

Location, location, location. Look at Vancouver prices, you'll feel better. Although a housing correction is coming, no doubt.

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
Best of all: What we pay for TAX is more tan what we pay for Mortgage.

Move to Burlington.

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
While I give credit to Canada for the stable economy, I think It's a country for the Rich and the Poor only. Middle class is vanishing.
Correction: It's a country for the Government Employees, the Rich, and the Poor only.

At least here there still IS a middle class. As opposed to down south which seems to be rapidly morphing into a near feudal condition: the uber-rich and the filthy poor. 1 in 6 in the USA are now getting some kind of food assistance.

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
Quote:
And Statistics Canada's latest labour force survey could not have been more timely.

Only days old, it showed more "takers" work in government across our vast country -- federally, provincially and municipally -- than any of the "makers," including manufacturing.

Be wary of using Sun Media as a source. It's basically a Canadian extension of Faux News. As for government workers being "takers" rather than "makers" I could point out that my (government-owned) firm makes about 50% of the radioisotopes used in medicine around the world. And that's "taking" ?

Manufacturing has been exiting North America and Western Europe (largely excepting Germany) for well over a generation. First the Japanese, then the Koreans, now the Chinese. Next Indonesia, Malaya and Vietnam. Looking forward, higher tech, IT networks, info systems, genetics, and biosystems are where it's going to be at. And North America leads there.

Nothing ever stays the same, everything evolves.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
StarAC17
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 1:44 am

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
Monopoly in action?

  

Paul Martin stopped the some big 5 from merging to compete more internationally because they would be bigger (also too big to fail). Decisions like that are one of the reasons that Canada has the soundest banking system.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 2):
Manufacturing has been exiting North America and Western Europe (largely excepting Germany) for well over a generation. First the Japanese, then the Koreans, now the Chinese. Next Indonesia, Malaya and Vietnam. Looking forward, higher tech, IT networks, info systems, genetics, and biosystems are where it's going to be at. And North America leads there.

Some is coming back in Ontario, there is a highly educated population there which meand a lot of high tech stuff and green technology can be built there. We gotta move on from building cars and even that is coming back as well

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 2):
Again, rubbish. only those costs previously not subject to PST went up 8%, others were largely, but not totally, unchanged. How is the GST/HST good for business ? Because tax is only paid on the value added at any step of the process

   It makes business more efficient (paying one tax instead of 2) and it hasn't crippled anything with the things that have gone up in price such as energy. Also ironically it is a conservative policy and the conservatives were all pissed that the liberals in Ontario implemented it. I'm not in Ontatrio at the moment but I reckon this is why Onatrio (well the ones that voted) said no to Hudak.
Engineers Rule The World!!!!!
 
Centre
Posts: 321
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2010 11:37 pm

RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 4:24 am

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 2):
Again, rubbish. only those costs previously not subject to PST went up 8%, others were largely, but not totally, unchanged. How is the GST/HST good for business ? Because tax is only paid on the value added at any step of the process.

I'm running a business that is HST exempt to my clients... We don't charge it, so we can't claim it. What I pay for all of my contractors (Bookkeeper, accountant, lawyer, lawn maintenance....etc), plus heat and all of the associated building and business costs went up by 8% and I can't pass that to the clients.
It's very easy to sit there and judge me, but I'm the one who is feeling the heat of this rise.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 2):
Move to Burlington.

Even that is not an option anymore... one of my employee who just retired is moving all the way to lake Erie area, I think it's a town of 200 people.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 2):
Be wary of using Sun Media as a source.

I know Sun media, and definitely not a big fan, specially their TV and that Ezra guy is definitely not my favorite.

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 3):
It makes business more efficient (paying one tax instead of 2) and it hasn't crippled anything with the things that have gone up in price such as energy. Also ironically it is a conservative policy and the conservatives were all pissed that the liberals in Ontario implemented it. I'm not in Ontatrio at the moment but I reckon this is why Onatrio (well the ones that voted) said no to Hudak

read the above in regards to HST...
On a second note, I will never vote Conservative.
I have cut 4 times, and it's still short.
 
jcs17
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 4:44 am

The Canadian business climate is great, for now.

It's like moving a hockey team from Atlanta to Winnipeg. The CAD/USD exchange rate, and note all player salaries are paid in USD, looks decent now, but if you take a look at the 50-year average this is a huge anomoly. The Tories definitely won't move taxes upwards, nor downwards for the most part (can't rock the boat, don't want to have more electoral problems in the GTA or Vancouver).

What happens when the Liberals take control, God forbid the NDP, and a Greater Red-Green Alliance? Oil shale will be taxed excessively as will paper products.

European and Asian companies still relocate to the US and not Canada. Why? Executives will be taxed at a lower rate and there is so much less risk of tax hikes. If anything, in the next ten years, US taxes will be sliced. The US is a very risk averse market. Canada isn't much so.
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ACDC8
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 9:18 am

Quoting skyservice_330 (Thread starter):
- tax reform over the last few years including harmonization in Ontario and BC and the lowering/continual lowering of corporate tax rates provincially/federally.

The HST in BC is done ... got voted out in a recent referendum ... however it will still take a couple of years until the old GST/PST kick in again.
A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
 
connies4ever
Posts: 3393
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:54 pm

RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 1:32 pm

Quoting Centre (Reply 4):
I'm running a business that is HST exempt to my clients

I'd be interested to know what type of business is HST exept, actually.

Quoting jcs17 (Reply 5):
but if you take a look at the 50-year average this is a huge anomoly

Yes, looking backwards it's an anomaly (although I do recall when I was young the C$ trading well over the US$). But looking forwards I'm not so sure the historical averages will persist. With the enormous US indebtedness, I am fairly sure we will see America let it's dollar devalue and also allow inflation to increase to a) short-term improve trading position, and b) devalue the debt they owe.

Quoting jcs17 (Reply 5):
If anything, in the next ten years, US taxes will be sliced. The US is a very risk averse market. Canada isn't much so.

I can't see how taxes can be sliced in the US given the deficit/debt situation people are simply going to have to pay more. The idea that you can reduce taxes and grow the economy is an illusion. Show me an example of where this has actually worked. OTOH, in the G20 group of nations, the two economies that have gotten through the best (to date) the economic shitstorm we are in are Germany and Canada. Both highly regulated, both highly taxed. And that's not deniable.

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 6):
The HST in BC is done ... got voted out in a recent referendum ... however it will still take a couple of years until the old GST/PST kick in again.

It wil be interesting to see how the BC government gets out of the pickle their electorate put them in. They've already spent the approx $2B in adjustment payments the Feds gave them for signing on to the HST. So how do they pay it back ?
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
StarAC17
Posts: 3693
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 2:19 pm

Quoting jcs17 (Reply 5):
. The Tories definitely won't move taxes upwards, nor downwards for the most part (can't rock the boat, don't want to have more electoral problems in the GTA or Vancouver).

Don't count that the tories won't raise taxes, to get out of the red I could see them hiking the GST of necessary. They were the party who originally put it in place and the federal tories wanted the HST. While Canadians hate taxes as much as everyone else we are much more accepting of them if they acheive their desired effect be it additional services or less public debt.

None of Canada's politicians have a Grover Norquist.

Quoting jcs17 (Reply 5):
What happens when the Liberals take control, God forbid the NDP, and a Greater Red-Green Alliance? Oil shale will be taxed excessively as will paper products.

The NDP isn't getting into power, they are only the opposition this time because the Liberal party needs some rebuilding which also happened to the tories after Mulroney. The liberals are not the party that will excessively tax tax away, the NDP is that party and even I doubt that they would go crazy. Yes the libreals will be more left wing than the conservatives but not as left as you say they are the centre party. They had majorities not so long ago and eventually pissed off the people but when you are in power for 10 years eventually a change is wanted. Its a natural cycle in Canadian politics.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 7):
OTOH, in the G20 group of nations, the two economies that have gotten through the best (to date) the economic shitstorm we are in are Germany and Canada. Both highly regulated, both highly taxed. And that's not deniable.

Add in Australia which is very similar to both Canada and Germany if we are talking the G20. Very similar fundamentals to Canada and happen to be less reliant on the US (whose economy basically dictates Canada's economy).

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 7):
Quoting jcs17 (Reply 5):
but if you take a look at the 50-year average this is a huge anomoly


You might not see the Canadian dollar at par but I doubt that it will be at the 2002 low of 1 CAD = 62 US cents. You will see the Canadian dollor probably hovering around 90 cents to par where it has the best balance between manufacturers
and the resource industry.

[Edited 2011-10-14 07:25:03]
Engineers Rule The World!!!!!
 
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WildcatYXU
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 4:03 pm

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 2):
Because tax is only paid on the value added at any step of the process.



Definitely not. HST is not a VAT. However, what HST did was eliminating the stealth PST that was killing some small manufacturing businesses.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 7):
I'd be interested to know what type of business is HST exept, actually.



Generally, health care services. For example, optometrists, opticians, chiropractors and dentists. All off them bill the patient directly, but don't charge HST.
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Centre
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:21 pm

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 9):

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 7):
I'd be interested to know what type of business is HST exept, actually.



Generally, health care services. For example, optometrists, opticians, chiropractors and dentists. All off them bill the patient directly, but don't charge HST.

Thanks!!

We fall under that category...
It was a grey area at the beginning, so we got a ruling from CRA that it is HST exempt, and clients do pay tax on the service we provide.

TIP: Whatever you do, always make sure you get a ruling from CRA.
I have cut 4 times, and it's still short.
 
connies4ever
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 5:31 pm

Quoting WildcatYXU (Reply 9):
Definitely not. HST is not a VAT. However, what HST did was eliminating the stealth PST that was killing some small manufacturing businesses.

Wikipedia begs to differ with you: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goods_and_Services_Tax_%28Canada%29

although I will concede that Wikipedia is not necessarily the be all and end all of knowledge. More authoritatively, from the CRA: http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/bsnss/tpcs/gst-tps/gnrl/hw-eng.html -- it does not explicitly state that the HST is a value added tax, but the implicaiton is pretty clear.

What was actually hurting manufacturing was the 13.5% MST (manufacturers sales tax), not necessarily the PST.
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ACDC8
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 6:31 pm

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 7):
It wil be interesting to see how the BC government gets out of the pickle their electorate put them in. They've already spent the approx $2B in adjustment payments the Feds gave them for signing on to the HST. So how do they pay it back ?

It will be very interesting indeed, but the money has to be paid back and it will have to come from tax dollars, most likely by raising taxes elsewhere. Personally, I had no problem with the HST, I found it made life as a consumer a lot easier but 54% of BCers didn't agree with it. The only thing that did bother me about it is the way the Gordon Campbell and the Liberals introduced it. During the last election, they told BCers that it wasn't even on the table and within a couple of months of being re-elected they passed the approval to introduce it.

If aboloshing the HST in BC is going to be good for our economy and business was a good thing? Who knows.
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WildcatYXU
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:08 pm

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 11):
it does not explicitly state that the HST is a value added tax, but the implicaiton is pretty clear.

Yes, I guess you could call it VAT.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 11):

What was actually hurting manufacturing was the 13.5% MST (manufacturers sales tax), not necessarily the PST.

This is what I called the stealth PST.
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connies4ever
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Fri Oct 14, 2011 7:31 pm

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 12):
Personally, I had no problem with the HST, I found it made life as a consumer a lot easier but 54% of BCers didn't agree with it. The only thing that did bother me about it is the way the Gordon Campbell and the Liberals introduced it. During the last election, they told BCers that it wasn't even on the table and within a couple of months of being re-elected they passed the approval to introduce it.

Actually, I've always been in favour of consumption taxes, and VAT/GST/HST whatever, is very transparent, is effective, and, frankly, is a cash cow for the government. At the end of the day, the books have to be balanced.

I do agree, though, that Mr G Campbell is a dirty little sh*t who lied his ass off. Good riddance. Should be an interesting election campaign between Christie CLark and whomever.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
thegreatRDU
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Sat Oct 15, 2011 12:48 am

Quoting jcs17 (Reply 5):
If anything, in the next ten years, US taxes will be sliced. The US is a very risk averse market. Canada isn't much so.

Oh really? Says who?
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Ken777
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Sat Oct 15, 2011 2:00 am

Quoting Centre (Reply 1):
While I give credit to Canada for the stable economy, I think It's a country for the Rich and the Poor only. Middle class is vanishing.

It would have been nice if we had had a stage economy instead of Great Recession.

While you can have some taxes to complain about you should see the rip off Americans pay for private health insurance.
 
skyservice_330
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RE: Canada #1 For Business

Tue Oct 18, 2011 10:59 pm

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 7):
They've already spent the approx $2B in adjustment payments the Feds gave them for signing on to the HST. So how do they pay it back ?

Ottawa, if I had to guess, would simply garnish future transfers (CHST or other equalization payments for example) to BC until the debt (perhaps with interest) is repaid. The Health Accord is coming up for negotiation in 2014 and the repayment of the $2B to Ottawa could emerge in that, if not settled beforehand.

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