Questionable Olympic Sports

Aeroflot777 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 2:11 am

Quoting GEEZER (Thread starter):
syncronized "ribbon twirling"

WOW, I don't even know what to say here dude, nor even where to start. I think your comment is incredibly naive. My grandfather was the president of the International Gymnastics Federation (FIG) for twenty years after an incredible career as a 4-time world champion and nine time Olympic medalist in artistic gymnastics.

I grew up around various world championships and Olympic games and am very close to all FIG-related sports (both artistic and rhythmic gymnastics, aerobics and trampoline). Rhythmic Gymnastics has been recognized as an FIG discipline since 1961 and an Olympic sport since '84. Just because you happened to stumble upon some synchronization exercises and truly have absolutely no understanding of what this sport actually entails, doesn't entitle you to say the sport is questionable. Synchronization in RG is one of many different events that the girls perform, the main of which consist of individual disciplines with the use of clubs, hoop, ball and ribbon. The accessories the athletes use in conjunction with the routines are just a tiny sliver of skill that is needed. The sport combines aerobics, ballet, gymnastics and dancing all into one, creating incredible flexibility and intricate complexity in their routines.

I can go one for days about this, but considering you obviously haven't done your homework prior to posting such a childish post, I won't even bother. Unless you truly want to learn what RG is all about, then feel free to message me and we can discuss.

People follow and participate in various sports. Just because you don't know anything about them, doesn't mean they are inferior, questionable or any other word you want to use here. It's incredibly disrespectful to the athletes and the sports they all and devote their entire lives to.

Aeroflot777

Pyrex · Sun Aug 12, 2012 2:14 am

Three out of the four swimming strokes. They know which one is the fastest, why bother with the rest? Seems like it would be the equivalent to having the 100 meters bunny-hop in the Track & Field event.

Aesma · Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:09 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 49):
When even the practice of a popular sport can draw more attention than the top competition of Olympic sports, it means that the Olympic sports are not popular.

It's interesting that you should say that when the sports you're mentioning (baseball, hockey) are popular in one part of the world only. The Olympics are a worldwide event.

ltbewr · Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:15 am

As to what should or should not be Olympic sports, history, politics, popularity, practiced in several continents, recognized international regulations, money or a combinations for those factors. For purposes of these discussions, I am limiting to the Summer games.
A number of events, including a number of track and field, archery, wrestling, some horse events and weightlifting have connections to the ancient Greek Olympic games.
Some events or variations of them have strong regional interest - like Greco-Roman wrestling which is popular in the middle east - and to include them helps the Olympics seem more inclusive.
Some events are sufficiently popular throughout the world at a competitive level to be included, for example Judo.
Some events have strong organizations that can lobby to the Olympics for inclusion.
Over time, some events have been added, some dropped. In particular you now have near equity for women with only a few events exclusive to men, many sports now are available for both men and women. Baseball/Softball really got dropped as really only played on a competitive high level in maybe 7-8 countries (USA, Canada, Japan, Taiwan, Cuba, Mexico being the most dominate).
Then you got events that attract younger or other large demographic groups, like the BMX events to keep the relevant to the viewers.
Still, some events should be dropped. I would like to see all gun related events dropped (summer and winter) due to the usually military connections as well as the large number of countries with strict gun control laws. Perhaps end Greco-Roman wrestling, retaining only 'freestyle' wrestling. As to men's basketball, some are suggesting only allowing, as with men's soccer, to where the teams must be dominated by those 23 or under, with only 2 over 23. "Rhythmic Gymnastics' are very popular with a major country, Russia, so to drop it would face huge protests by a major country in the games.

BMI727 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:23 am

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 50):
WOW, I don't even know what to say here dude, nor even where to start. I think your comment is incredibly naive.

Ooh, somebody's leotard is in a twist.

Quoting Pyrex (Reply 51):
Seems like it would be the equivalent to having the 100 meters bunny-hop in the Track & Field event.

There's already racewalking, which is every bit as ridiculous as it sounds.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 52):
It's interesting that you should say that when the sports you're mentioning (baseball, hockey) are popular in one part of the world only.

Most sports are popular only in a few parts of the world. And ones that are popular in multiple regions basically have all of their best athletes congregate in a one or two leagues. If the point of the Olympics is to get all the best athletes in the world together to compete, then you have the NBA, NHL, etc. all doing that all the time already, hence the Olympics serve no purpose. And with modern media, foreigners who do have interest in the sport don't need Olympic coverage to see it.

Quoting LTBEWR (Reply 53):
I would like to see all gun related events dropped (summer and winter) due to the usually military connections as well as the large number of countries with strict gun control laws.

No kidding. Why do the Olympic thing when you can see people actually shooting each other? Target shooting has nothing on a good third world revolution, which one can usually see by tuning to CNN.

Silver1SWA · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:11 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 49):
When even the practice of a popular sport can draw more attention than the top competition of Olympic sports, it means that the Olympic sports are not popular.

Oh I see, you assume the lead up to football has been more popular. Do you have proof to back that up? Add up over the past 16 days NBC's ratings, internet traffic and all the other buzz surrounding these Olympics, I seriously doubt football has come anywhere close.

The football season has a greater impact on people in this country since you know, people bet, people play fantasy football, people invest in season tickets. The Olympics are simply something people watch once every few years. And they DO watch the Olympics.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 49):
But in days past the Olympics were the only chance to see obscure sports, but that's not the case anymore with dozens of channels. The few people that actually want to see those sports can without the multibillion dollar circus. And that's exactly what the Olympics are: a modern day circus.

The Olympics is the only time the majority of the people in this country (and the world) see most of the sports feaured in the Olympics. Yes, you can see these sports more often if you do the homework and find the obscure channel showing them, but MOST people don't follow them during non-Olympic times! And someone who wants to follow individual Olympic sports between Olympics aren't getting the entire collection of sports on one stage. Plus, I personally don't get as excited about most Olympic sports on any stage other than the Olympics. It's the grand stage that appeals to me most. Same with soccer. I can't get as excited over soccer as the World Cup. I might watch if it's on, but I follow the World Cup with greater enthusiasm. I imagine most people are the same way.

[Edited 2012-08-11 21:15:16]

BMI727 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:19 am

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 55):
Oh I see, you assume the lead up to football has been more popular. Do you have proof to back that up?

Here's Deadspin's Bristolmetrics piece that tracks what is talked about on Sportscenter each week. In the first week, the Olympics got 11.2% of the coverage. That number is about equal to what I've observed in my consumption of sports media recently. The only outlets paying much attention to the Olympics are the ones broadcasting it.

http://deadspin.com/bristolmetrics/

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 55):
Yes, you can see these sports more often if you do the homework and find the obscure channel showing them, but MOST people don't follow them during non-Olympic times!

No, they don't follow them. Because the sports aren't popular and don't generate much interest.

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 55):
It's the grand stage that appeals to me most.

Exactly. Like I said, it's just the circus rolling into town. A really expensive circus.

MD11Engineer · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:20 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 49):

When even the practice of a popular sport can draw more attention than the top competition of Olympic sports, it means that the Olympic sports are not popular.

What is popular sport today? Mostly games and competitions, which can be easily televised with nice stretches of tension for the spectators (goals and side by side races) to keep them glued to the TV inbetween and plenty of breaks, where the TV stations can run commercials.
Due to the prevalence of TV other sports tend to get forgotten. If it was just for the TV stations all we would ever see would be football (soccer), ice hockey, basketball, track and field athletics, baseball and American football (and maybe Rugby Union).

Jan

zippyjet · Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:01 am

Quoting Mir (Reply 3):
That's rhythmic gymnastics, which I saw for the first time yesterday, and I was quite impressed. Not that it'll ever be favorite of mine, but the things those people can do are pretty damn impressive

And there are some hottie rythmic gymnasts! Besides the ribbon they fondle a ball and do it with a bowling pin thing.

Golf is returning to the Olympics in 2016. You asked for a least favorite sport and Golf gets my nod. And I can do without men's synchronized swimming but the women's is hot! And maybe a little off topic but, I believe the Spice Girls are going to perform in the closing ceremonies. Do we really nead them back?

Aeroflot777 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 8:06 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 54):
Ooh, somebody's leotard is in a twist.

Huh?

Quoting zippyjet (Reply 58):
And I can do without men's synchronized swimming

It's late over here and maybe I misread your post, but where have you seen men's sync swimming?

PlymSpotter · Sun Aug 12, 2012 9:21 am

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 44):
Ok, so on that basis I guess we should have sheep dog trials as an olympic 'sport', shouldn't we? A line has to be drawn somewhere.. for me the olympics are supposed to be about what a human being can do with the power of their own body.

Again, that just shows you have no idea of how demanding equestrian events are - the rider isn't sat there doing nothing. In fact the lead-in commitment is quite probably the greatest of any Olympic sport. You don't have to teach a boat to float or pretty much any other piece of apparatus how to do it's job perfectly. But if a horse and rider are to pull off a gold medal performance they need to have spent months if not years training together so that each understands the other perfectly and both are physically prepared. The only comparable factor with a dog trial etc... is that there needs to be a good human-animal relationship.

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 44):
.. but when was the last time you saw the equine part of the team up on the medal podium ?

I'm pretty sure you can deduce the reason for that. When was the last time an Olympic rower sat on the podium with their craft?

Dan

Aleksandar · Sun Aug 12, 2012 9:28 am

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 59):
It's late over here and maybe I misread your post, but where have you seen men's sync swimming?

Speaking of football...I don't like the idea limiting teams to under 23. This destroys Olympic football tournament, just like it was the case with so many sports.

cmf · Sun Aug 12, 2012 10:06 am

Quoting sprout5199 (Reply 48):
The Olympics need to go back to the roots, no pros, just amateurs

Agree. I think allowing pro's is when it fell apart. Not that it wasn't abused by the factories before.

Quoting sprout5199 (Reply 48):
Looking back, that is what the Olympics is all about, If athletes can get along, and show their respect no matter the race, religion, or country, then why can we? Because we are taught that the other guys are bad, end of story.

The Olympic Truce was a key part of the original games. It was to be an important part of the modern games but of course it was abused. So much that IOC felt the need to remind everyone in 1992.

In that spirit maybe we should not consider any sport questionable based on what we think about watching them and recognise that they are important to the people competing in them.

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 50):
People follow and participate in various sports. Just because you don't know anything about them, doesn't mean they are inferior, questionable or any other word you want to use here. It's incredibly disrespectful to the athletes and the sports they all and devote their entire lives to.

Well said.

Apart from going back to armatures I also think they should go back to winter and summer Olympics in the same year. I think a big part of the Olympic value is in that they only happen every four years but because we are exposed to them every second year it feels less so even though individual sports are still every four years.

Silver1SWA · Sun Aug 12, 2012 10:26 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 56):
Here's Deadspin's Bristolmetrics piece that tracks what is talked about on Sportscenter each week. In the first week, the Olympics got 11.2% of the coverage. That number is about equal to what I've observed in my consumption of sports media recently. The only outlets paying much attention to the Olympics are the ones broadcasting it.

You're comparing SportsCenter to NBC? Really? Of course SportsCenter is going to focus on football and baseball right now. NBC and the other networks broadcasting the Olympics are reaching a far wider audience.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 56):
Exactly. Like I said, it's just the circus rolling into town. A really expensive circus.

I just don't get what your point is. The Olympics are the biggest stage in the athletic world. For the athletes competing, there is no greater achievement than not just winning gold, but getting the chance to compete in the Olympics. For the rest of us, it's a chance to see these people earn their spots in history. We get caught up in it, so what? That doesn't make them irrelevant. I'd argue that if the Olymipcs were annual, or if they lasted much longer than two weeks, then they will become irrelevant.

Aleksandar · Sun Aug 12, 2012 10:27 am

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 50):
People follow and participate in various sports. Just because you don't know anything about them, doesn't mean they are inferior, questionable or any other word you want to use here. It's incredibly disrespectful to the athletes and the sports they all and devote their entire lives to.

Exactly.

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 50):
WOW, I don't even know what to say here dude, nor even where to start. I think your comment is incredibly naive. My grandfather was the president of the International Gymnastics Federation (FIG) for twenty years after an incredible career as a 4-time world champion and nine time Olympic medalist in artistic gymnastics.

Speaking of artistic gymnastics, can you explain why Russia is not as good as it used to be?

scbriml · Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:32 am

Quoting KingairTA (Reply 40):
The cost to the host country has gotten out of hand. One way to cut the cost is to eliminate sports that already have an international commercial championship cut it back to the basics.

That would rule out just about every sport.

Quoting sprout5199 (Reply 48):
OK, didn't read all the posts, that being said, any sport where the top award is not the Olympics then they need to drop it

And who gets to decide? Despite all his grand slam wins, Roger Federer was desperate to win the Olympic gold.

Quoting sprout5199 (Reply 48):
The Olympics need to go back to the roots, no pros, just amateurs

Never going to happen, that horse bolted probably 50 years ago. You cannot expect to be a top athlete in any sport today without it being your full-time job. The whole concept of "top amateur sports" is an oxymoron.

Quoting cmf (Reply 62):
Agree. I think allowing pro's is when it fell apart.

Define "fell apart". If top-level sport reverted to amateur, it would be like going back to the '50s. You might as well watch it in flickery black and white. While you're at it, ask those nice tennis players to start using wooden rackets again and footballers should get used to trying to kick a 10lb leather ball in their heavy leather boots.

It's called progress. Enjoy what you have today - anyone wanting to see top athletics reverting (I would say regressing) to amateur status can forget ever seeing another World record set.

cmf · Sun Aug 12, 2012 12:00 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 65):
Define "fell apart". If top-level sport reverted to amateur, it would be like going back to the '50s. You might as well watch it in flickery black and white.

Don't know why you use 1950's. The rule change I refer to was in 1986. Sure there were many problems with how nations abused the amateur rule but a big part of the Olympics was that it wasn't the same people you saw all other times. It was an event with equal or more prestige with other than the usual suspects. A good athlete usually had one chance to get an Olympic medal before turning pro.

Quoting scbriml (Reply 65):
It's called progress. Enjoy what you have today - anyone wanting to see top athletics reverting (I would say regressing) to amateur status can forget ever seeing another World record set.

You call it progress, I don't. I don't think setting world records is what matters in the Olympics. I find setting Olympic records much more interesting. World records can be set at any time but Olympic records can only be set every four years.

But what is really interesting about the Olympics is the spirit it used to portray. The Jamaican bob sledge team and Eddy the Eagle are better reflections of the Olympic spirit than the usual professional players meeting at one more event. That is what I'm missing in the Olympics.

ltbewr · Sun Aug 12, 2012 1:02 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 66):
But what is really interesting about the Olympics is the spirit it used to portray. The Jamaican bob sledge team and Eddy the Eagle are better reflections of the Olympic spirit than the usual professional players meeting at one more event. That is what I'm missing in the Olympics.

You won't see participants like them much more in the Olympics due to safety, pressures from the top competitive countries in respective events to keep them out as distracting, are seen as 'stunts' and to hold down the overall number of competitors and thus support costs. Still, we have seen in these games women from Islamic dominate countries participate even if not really compteitive,due to political pressures and the personal desires to break barriers by such persons as well as Woman's Boxing, both examples of should be clearly part of the modern Olympics.

As to the 'obscure' sports, despite numerous media outlets for sports, you have many more distactions from the intenet to I-Pods that now get people's attention. As a kid back in the 1960's and before the internet, you used to watch programs like ABC's Wide World of Sports and then the early days of ESPN to fill time and you got to see the 'obscure' and Olympic sports.

Aleksandar · Sun Aug 12, 2012 1:34 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 65):
If top-level sport reverted to amateur, it would be like going back to the '50s

This is pure utopia. For example, once upon a time, top basketball and volleyball players from Belgrade used to be very successful students. Sport was, for them, a chance to recreate and relax and maybe make some good results...this is impossible today.

corocks · Sun Aug 12, 2012 2:09 pm

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 63):
You're comparing SportsCenter to NBC? Really? Of course SportsCenter is going to focus on football and baseball right now. NBC and the other networks broadcasting the Olympics are reaching a far wider audience.

Not even taking into account that ESPN is owned by ABC - a competitor of NBC. Of course they are going to talk about football (which they air games) more than they talk about the Olympics.

To say that training camp is generating more buzz than the Olympics is just silly.

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 46):
I love curling!!! Its very technical!

Technical, maybe. Demonstrating any athletic ability whatsoever - not so much. Shuffleboard is a game I play while drunk in a bar. Does not belong in the Olympics.

bjorn14 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 2:14 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 62):
I think a big part of the Olympic value is in that they only happen every four years but because we are exposed to them every second year it feels less so even though individual sports are still every four years.

I fundamentally agree but it would have never happened if the OL hadn't gotten so big that NOCs were having a hard time funding two big teams in the same year and more importantly sponsors were also being streteched for both games in the same year. I think Winter and Summer are different enough to warrant off-Olympiads. There are roughly 204 NOCs at the Summer Games and roughly 65 participate in Winter.

cmf · Sun Aug 12, 2012 2:20 pm

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 70):
I fundamentally agree but it would have never happened if the OL hadn't gotten so big

Success is often the biggest enemy

scbriml · Sun Aug 12, 2012 2:27 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 66):
You call it progress, I don't.

You're entitled to your opinion, but I suspect you are in a small minority.

Quoting cmf (Reply 66):
That is what I'm missing in the Olympics.

It's not, it's still there if you look closely enough. Maybe the American TV coverage has simply ignored the non-US athletes, but there have been "Eddie the Eagle" level performances at this Olympics.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/rowing/19112057

Quoting cmf (Reply 66):
I find setting Olympic records much more interesting. World records can be set at any time but Olympic records can only be set every four years.

Again, your view. By definition, any World record set at the Olympics is also an Olympic record. Was any US coverage given of the men's 800m final? How you can dismiss a performance like that because it set a new World record is difficult to understand.

cmf · Sun Aug 12, 2012 2:58 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 72):
You're entitled to your opinion

Thank you

Quoting scbriml (Reply 72):
It's not, it's still there if you look closely enough.

If you look close enough, i.e. it takes a lot of effort to find. The games have changed. Not all of it to the better.

Quoting scbriml (Reply 72):
How you can dismiss a performance like that because it set a new World record is difficult to understand.

Think about it. I'm saying it doesn't take a world record to be impressive.

BMI727 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:03 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 62):
I think allowing pro's is when it fell apart.

Because the Olympics need to be a lower quality product?

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 63):
For the rest of us, it's a chance to see these people earn their spots in history.

A history that practically nobody pays any attention to.

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 63):
I'd argue that if the Olymipcs were annual, or if they lasted much longer than two weeks, then they will become irrelevant.

Just like people would stop going to the circus if it never left town.

cmf · Sun Aug 12, 2012 3:58 pm

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 74):
Because the Olympics need to be a lower quality product?

Because the spirit of the Olympics took a big hit.

BMI727 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:05 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 75):
Because the spirit of the Olympics took a big hit.

People don't tune in for spirit. Why would anyone watch a sport they are otherwise largely uninterested in if it isn't the best out there?

CPH-R · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:26 pm

Whoever suggested equestrianism needs to go watch the showjumping portion of the Modern pentathlon competition. There the competitors only know which horse they will be riding 20 minutes before they're up, and those 20 minutes are then spent trying to make the horse follow the riders command.

One of the Danish equestrians, Nathalie zu Sayn-Wittgenstein-Berleburg, mentioned she had spent 4 years training her current program with her horse, Digby, before she was able to nail it.

As for racewalking, I don't have a problem with that. The rules state that any lifting must be visible to the naked eye before it can be acted upon, and the carnage at the finish line of yesterdays 50k showed what a massive physical and mental undertaking it is.

scbriml · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:34 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 73):
If you look close enough, i.e. it takes a lot of effort to find.

Given the number of event, yes, you're going to have to look hard to find them. The event I highlighted was shown live in the UK, so wasn't that hard to "find" as I already knew about it. Was it shown on US TV? If not, then it seems disingenuous to say performances like these are not seen at the Olympics, because clearly, even in 2012, they still are.

Quoting cmf (Reply 73):
Think about it. I'm saying it doesn't take a world record to be impressive.

Think about it - a World record is even more impressive than a non record score/time/distance. That it's achieved under the pressure of an Olympic final makes it even more impressive.

Quoting cmf (Reply 75):
Because the spirit of the Olympics took a big hit.

Seriously? The spirit was mainly only ever in the mind of Pierre de Coubertin. Politics and drugs were major challenges to the spirit of the games long before the admittance of professional athletes. Given the cost of sending athletes to the games, national federations are unlikely to include someone just so they can "take part".

StarAC17 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:34 pm

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 43):
Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 38):
Your "Olympics are irrelevant" argument is getting old.

...but it's still true.

When tickets for track and field to see athletes like Usain Bolt are going for 2,500 pounds its far from relevant.

Quoting Aesma (Reply 52):
It's interesting that you should say that when the sports you're mentioning (baseball, hockey) are popular in one part of the world only. The Olympics are a worldwide event.

Baseball and Hockey may be most popular in North America but they are far from just popular there. A Gold in hockey is not a shoe in for Canada and neither would it be for a gold if professional baseball players were in the olympics.

Quoting corocks (Reply 69):
Technical, maybe. Demonstrating any athletic ability whatsoever - not so much. Shuffleboard is a game I play while drunk in a bar. Does not belong in the Olympics.

As said it very technical and the sweeping requires a lot of fitness to be able to put that stone where you want it, if anything you need more fitness than you need for golf.

If you are going to sack Curling then sack ping-pong, that is a game a lot of us play drunk.

ScarletHarlot · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:37 pm

Quoting corocks (Reply 45):
From the winter Olympics - curling. How is shuffleboard on ice a 'sport'?

I knew someone was going to say this. Have you ever tried it? It's much more than "shuffleboard on ice".

Quoting PHX787 (Reply 46):
I love curling!!! Its very technical!

It is more physical than it looks too. Whenever people come to our club to try curling they almost always end up saying "that was a lot harder than it looks!".

cmf · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:41 pm

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 76):
People don't tune in for spirit.

Since when?

The spirit may defined as watching the best, as it seems to be for you. Spirit may also be because of the sport, or it may be because they represent your country, or many other things. A big part of the Olympics is that there is a large number of sports at the same event.

I'd say that without spirit people do not watch. Not the Olympics. Not anything else.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 76):
Why would anyone watch a sport they are otherwise largely uninterested in

I think people are interested. Remember Olympics being a big deal before the amateur rule changed. I think bigger deal.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 76):
if it isn't the best out there?

When hasn't the Olympics been the best among the people who are qualified to compete? Who has never cheered for an underdog?

Question for you. What makes certain events more special than others even though they have the same participants

BMI727 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:49 pm

Quoting StarAC17 (Reply 79):
When tickets for track and field to see athletes like Usain Bolt are going for 2,500 pounds its far from relevant.

There's relatively expensive tickets for a lot of other things too, but the real money is in TV. Part of the reason for the price is that it is only once every four years, rather than a more regular thing. I doubt tickets for races Bolt runs in go for that much at other events, which makes it a function of Olympic hype more than anything.

And, for what it's worth, Usain Bolt is basically Lance Armstrong without wheels.

RussianJet · Sun Aug 12, 2012 4:59 pm

Why is there no darts if there is archery?

BMI727 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:01 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 81):
The spirit may defined as watching the best, as it seems to be for you.

If spirit matters so much, why do fans pack MLB stadiums rather than Little League?

Quoting cmf (Reply 81):
I think people are interested.

Just not enough to watch these sports on any other stage. Soccer has been the next big thing in the US for several decades now, and the World Cup being held here in 1994 was supposed to be the big coming out party...until it wasn't. Soccer went back to being what it always was: a sport for suburban kids with a league in the US, but not nearly on the level where it is in other parts of the world.

Hockey had the same thing in 2010. The Olympics were entertaining and the US gave a surprisingly good performance so it was thought that maybe it would see a real rise in popularity. But that never happened. The NHL went back to being a distant fourth among major sports leagues in the US.

Quoting cmf (Reply 81):
What makes certain events more special than others even though they have the same participants

Higher level of play, teams I actually care about, a longer and more grueling test. Why does one need the Olympics when you already get dozens of games of the same athletes playing better? I watched the USA in the basketball tourney, but it's nowhere near as good as the NBA. Same deal with baseball when that was part of the Olympics too, and if I cared about soccer why would I watch the Olympics rather than the World Cup or Premier League?

StarAC17 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:07 pm

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 82):
There's relatively expensive tickets for a lot of other things too, but the real money is in TV. Part of the reason for the price is that it is only once every four years, rather than a more regular thing. I doubt tickets for races Bolt runs in go for that much at other events, which makes it a function of Olympic hype more than anything

The point I was getting at is that many people want to see track and field at the olympics over other events which have their followings as well. I think most people want to see the 100m final over basically all events.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 82):
And, for what it's worth, Usain Bolt is basically Lance Armstrong without wheels.

Yes the very best athletes in their respective sports.

par13del · Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:10 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 15):
I don't have a problem with it, it's a widely practiced sport and you can't deny the human skill involved. If you get rid of it, then sailing and possibly pole vault need to go too (on the basis they're not 'man powered').

We had a discussion about this last week, like the Winter Olympics there are some sports in the summer games that are just not practical for some nations and thiose sports become the exclusive domain of some nations not because of talent and skill but basically finances.
Imagine the cost of transporting the horses to compete in the Olympics or heaven forbid the regional qualifying required to get to the Olympics, I put rowing in the same boat, the equipment is the issue, not the skill or the competitive spirit.
Now if the host nation in addition to providing the facilities they also provided "all equipment" then more nations may be able to get involved in more sporting events.

Silver1SWA · Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:10 pm

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 82):

So what should the Olympics be then?

The Olympics first and foremost are for and about the athletes. Look at it from their perspective. The rest of us watch for entertainment, that's it. Just like every other sport. They have become such a money-crazy "circus" because the games generate enough interest!

Hey, I think the Super Bowl is a over-produced corporate sponsored piece of crap circus, but it's still the biggest stage for the biggest sport in this country and it generates all the money and is such an over the top production because the network and the sponsors know it will be watched by millions.

cmf · Sun Aug 12, 2012 5:33 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 78):
The event I highlighted was shown live in the UK, so wasn't that hard to "find" as I already knew about it. Was it shown on US TV? If not, then it seems disingenuous to say performances like these are not seen at the Olympics, because clearly, even in 2012, they still are.

I have no idea if it was shown on US TV. I have not watched anything on US TV. It is a great example but it is one that is becoming more and more rare.

Quoting scbriml (Reply 78):
Think about it - a World record is even more impressive than a non record score/time/distance. That it's achieved under the pressure of an Olympic final makes it even more impressive.

Again, you don't need a world record for it to be interesting.

Quoting scbriml (Reply 78):
Seriously? The spirit was mainly only ever in the mind of Pierre de Coubertin. Politics and drugs were major challenges to the spirit of the games long before the admittance of professional athletes.

If it is so horrible why do you even watch it?

Quoting scbriml (Reply 78):
Given the cost of sending athletes to the games, national federations are unlikely to include someone just so they can "take part".

How many of the 11k athletes have a real medal chance?

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 84):
If spirit matters so much, why do fans pack MLB stadiums rather than Little League?

Wrong question. Why do people watch little league when there is MLB? Why do people watch the home team even when they are not going to win the league?

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 84):
Just not enough to watch these sports on any other stage.

So why is it different in the Olympics.... Sp___

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 84):
Soccer went back to being what it always was: a sport for suburban kids with a league in the US, but not nearly on the level where it is in other parts of the world.

Soccer has a bigger audience than everything else. There is more to the world than US. But looking at the bars advertising football, not that egghand version, I'd say it is pretty big here too.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 84):
Hockey had the same thing in 2010.

Hockey isn't watched. You're on thin ice there.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 84):
Why does one need the Olympics when you already get dozens of games of the same athletes playing better?

For the same reason people watch college football and many other games played by other than the leading players/teams.

Silver1SWA · Sun Aug 12, 2012 6:17 pm

Quoting GEEZER (Thread starter):
Olympic "action" taking place; yes there was............syncronized "ribbon twirling"

By the way, you might take a look at the gymnastics events from the 1924 and 1928 Olympics. Much closer to rhythmic gymnastics (what you called sunchronized ribbon twirling) than the modern popular gymnastic events that came much later.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D6RK0...6-GUg&feature=youtube_gdata_player

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJHcn...PUGzA&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[Edited 2012-08-12 11:19:20]

rfields5421 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 6:49 pm

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 83):
Why is there no darts if there is archery?

Because you can't drink beer while competing in the Olympics - and what would darts be without beer!!!!

CPH-R · Sun Aug 12, 2012 7:40 pm

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 90):
and what would darts be without beer!!!!

Uhm, the same it has been for quite a lot of years now?

(by popular consensus due to this sketch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=clv0S--z4p0 )

Geezer · Sun Aug 12, 2012 9:22 pm

Quoting Aeroflot777 (Reply 50):
WOW, I don't even know what to say here dude, nor even where to start. I think your comment is incredibly naive. My grandfather was the president of the International Gymnastics Federation (FIG) for twenty years after an incredible career as a 4-time world champion and nine time Olympic medalist in artistic gymnastics.

Aeroflot; You didn't misread my post ! I still think "synchronized" anything is ridiculous, and when you start calling it "rhythmic" it sounds even MORE ridiculous ! However.......you have just added yet another "descriptive" word............."Artistic"; now THAT'S more like it ! I can relate to "artistic" ! Unlike many of my fellow countrymen, but LIKE many of your fellow countrymen, I happen to be quite fond of ballet. Now THAT'S "artistic" ! Perhaps we could agree to disagree about our personal preferences and work together to have ballet included in the Olympics ! Anything having more of Tchaikovsky's fabulous music in it is a great thing, IMHO ! ( Incidentally, I think I may be the only American male over 18 years of age who is able to spell "Tchaikovsky" without looking it up ! )

So.......to sum up.........maybe we can just get the IOC to change the name from "rhythmic" gymnastics, to "artistic" gymnastics, then perhaps I will develop a greater appreciation for the sport. ( BTW......please allow me to extend my belated congratulations to your grandfather for his phenomenal achievement ! )

I hereby nominate ballet to become a recognized competitive discipline in all future Olympics ! ( but ONLY ballets featuring the music of Tchaikovsky )

Charley

scbriml · Sun Aug 12, 2012 9:25 pm

Quoting cmf (Reply 88):
If it is so horrible why do you even watch it?

Where did I say it was horrible?

I've been on vacation the last two weeks and have watched countless hours of sport. I've loved every minute of it. I'm arguing in favour of what it is, not some idealised amateur utopia that it isn't now and probably never existed.

Kiwirob · Sun Aug 12, 2012 9:52 pm

Quoting slider (Reply 24):

Meanwhile, one of the most universal sports on the planet--golf--remains unrepresented.

If you add a non sporting passtime like golf other non sporting passtimes like pool, darts and ballroom dancing should also be included.

Quoting MadameConcorde (Reply 33):
One Olympic F1 race every 4 years being part of the Games.

What a daft idea.

Quoting bjorn14 (Reply 41):

Rugby Sevens have been added for 2016 at Rio.

Easy gold for New Zealand, not really worth anyone else turning up, except Fiji for the silver.

Quoting kiwiandrew (Reply 44):
Ok, so on that basis I guess we should have sheep dog trials as an olympic 'sport', shouldn't we?

I'd be up for that, pretty good chance that New Zealand would be in with a good shot, another very competitive sport (probably one of the toughest there is) is sheep shearing, if walking around a field smacking a white ball is added then sheep shearing should be included, it's a real hardman's sport.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 82):
And, for what it's worth, Usain Bolt is basically Lance Armstrong without the drugs.

Fixed it for you. Pretty sure Bolt also gets way more pussy.

BMI727 · Sun Aug 12, 2012 10:25 pm

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 87):
So what should the Olympics be then?

Nothing. If you want basketball, watch the NBA. If you want track and field, turn that on. If you want gymnastics, watch that. There's several hundred channels of stuff on.

Quoting cmf (Reply 88):
Why do people watch little league when there is MLB?

Because their kids are playing.

Quoting cmf (Reply 88):
So why is it different in the Olympics....

Hype.

Quoting cmf (Reply 88):
Hockey isn't watched.

Not by many, but that was supposed to change after 2010. But it didn't.

Quoting KiwiRob (Reply 94):
Fixed it for you. Pretty sure Bolt also gets way more pussy.

Just put your head a little further in the sand there. Bolt's coach was a chemist at BALCO.

cmf · Sun Aug 12, 2012 10:37 pm

Quoting scbriml (Reply 93):
Where did I say it was horrible?

I've been on vacation the last two weeks and have watched countless hours of sport. I've loved every minute of it. I'm arguing in favour of what it is, not some idealised amateur utopia that it isn't now and probably never existed.

How can politics and drugs be anything but horrible in sports?

I appreciate a big prestige event for upcoming athletes. For athletes who actually do spend time in school or at a work in addition to all their training. Just as one of my neighbors did for his 1984 medal. And no, I did not like the hidden pros.

What happened to all your other objections?

Silver1SWA · Sun Aug 12, 2012 11:53 pm

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 95):
Nothing. If you want basketball, watch the NBA. If you want track and field, turn that on. If you want gymnastics, watch that. There's several hundred channels of stuff on.

Again, I care to watch those sports because of the Olympic stage. I'm not interested in a random track meet. I'm interested in watching the highest of athletic honors, athletes who dedicated four years of their lives to reach their goal of being an olympian and compete to be the best in the world. The rarity of the Olympics and the incredible difficulty just to compete there sets that stage far higher than regular sporting events. Why can't you accept that people enjoy that?

BMI727 · Mon Aug 13, 2012 12:11 am

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 97):
Again, I care to watch those sports because of the Olympic stage.

So you're purely buying into the hype. That's fine, but then don't pretend that these are great events when the only thing that matters is the stage.

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 97):
athletes who dedicated four years of their lives to reach their goal of being an olympian and compete to be the best in the world.

What about the Olympics makes it more difficult than a world championship? When you think of Michael Jordan, do you think of the gold medals or the six NBA titles? How many people do you see wearing Team USA LeBron James jerseys vs. Miami Heat? (a lot of the Cavs ones were burned by cretins)

Silver1SWA · Mon Aug 13, 2012 12:32 am

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 98):
So you're purely buying into the hype. That's fine, but then don't pretend that these are great events when the only thing that matters is the stage.

I'm only saying that people care and the Olympics matter. In sports, athletes have goals. The ultimate goal for most athletes in most sports is to compete in the Olympics.

Quoting BMI727 (Reply 98):
What about the Olympics makes it more difficult than a world championship? When you think of Michael Jordan, do you think of the gold medals or the six NBA titles? How many people do you see wearing Team USA LeBron James jerseys vs. Miami Heat? (a lot of the Cavs ones were burned by cretins)

First of all, stop using the NBA as an example. That's the worst possible sport to use as an example because most people would agree it does not belong in the Olympics.

With that said, what makes it more difficult than any other championship is that athletes get one chance every four years.
For most, they get 2-3 chances in their entire athletic careers to compete. That makes the achievement more significant.

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