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Virginblue4
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Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 16, 2012 8:56 pm

The invitations have been sent out for the event on Tuesday 23rd October.

From rumours, it is expected that Apple will announce the iPad mini, 13" MacBook Pro with retina display, updated Mac Mini and possibly updated iMacs!

Looks to be an exciting event!

http://appleinsider.com/articles/12/...tle-more-at-oct-23-ipad-mini-event

Anyone here in the market for a smaller iPad?

Jordan  
 
traveler_7
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:05 pm

Quoting virginblue4 (Thread starter):
Anyone here in the market for a smaller iPad?

Price would be the key factor for me  . To be more precise precise price difference between iPad and rumored iPad mini.


regards,

Sven
 
QFA380
Posts: 2012
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:11 pm

Quoting virginblue4 (Thread starter):
Anyone here in the market for a smaller iPad?

Considering they only exist in the applusrumourus lobe of the fanboy's brain, how can one be in a market that doesn't exist in reality? You could say 'in the market for a smaller tablet' but then that would imply you'd consider anything not made by Apple, which we know is nonsense.
 
Rara
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 16, 2012 10:24 pm

To my mind, you aren't really "in the market" unless you have at least a slight influence on the price. Otherwise you're just "buying stuff".
 
baldwin471
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:01 pm

No thanks. Nexus 7 at £199. Much better.
 
Virginblue4
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:30 pm

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 2):

Woah! It was just a question. And to be fair, it's pretty much guaranteed, so you can be in the market.

I will reword my question. If this does turn out to be the iPad mini (which it will), would you be interested in buying based on the leaks (which as usual, will be correct)?

And some people love iOS, but not on a large iPad, so this will be a great option for those people.

And you're right, I won't consider a device not made by Apple. I find (once again my opinion before anyone quotes me) that iOS is the best mobile OS out there, combined with the best hardware, that meets my needs/wants the best.

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 4):

So I am ridiculed for asking a question if people would buy one, yet you state it is much better than a device that is yet unannounced? People on these forums really confuse me.

Anyone want to give a genuine reason as to why they DO or DON'T want to buy one? Not because the Nexus 7 is 'better' or posts saying it doesn't exist etc.

[Edited 2012-10-16 16:31:57]
 
QFA380
Posts: 2012
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 4:38 pm

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:48 pm

Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 5):
the leaks (which as usual, will be correct)
Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 5):
Anyone want to give a genuine reason as to why they DO or DON'T want to buy one?

Well he wrote the price, so one could reasonably assume the price is a heavy factor in his consideration. The leaks which are always correct apparently point to an iPad mini with a £249 starting price a not insubstantial difference considering the specs aren't even out.

Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 5):
iOS is the best mobile OS out there
Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 5):
I won't consider a device not made by Apple

Do you not see the inconsistency?
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 16, 2012 11:50 pm

I will definitely be one of those purchasing an iPad mini. I've long maintained that the iPad is slightly too large for my tastes (my wife loves hers, but I find it a bit too unwieldy) and would love the smaller form factor.

While I really liked some of the smaller Android tablets, they weren't iPads - so I passed on them.

Now I'm getting the best of both worlds.  
 
Virginblue4
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:00 am

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 6):

Sorry, I don't understand?

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 7):

Sounds good to me! Hope you enjoy it! 
 
baldwin471
Posts: 350
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:54 am

Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 5):

So I am ridiculed for asking a question if people would buy one, yet you state it is much better than a device that is yet unannounced? People on these forums really confuse me.

Bloody hell calm down! All i said was i think the Nexus 7 is better. I DON'T want to buy an iPad mini because i don't want to buy into Apple's horribly uptight and massively overpriced ecosystem. Happy?
 
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fr8mech
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 3:03 am

I am in the market for a tablet.

My wife uses an iPad and I like it.

I will wait for the iPad mini to compare the full-size to the mini.

I also want to get more info on the Kindle Fire HD.

It is killing me to wait, but it's good therapy to work on my 'instant gratification' instinct.
 
Klaus
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 5:23 am

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 2):
Considering they only exist in the applusrumourus lobe of the fanboy's brain,
Quoting QFA380 (Reply 6):
The leaks which are always correct

No to both.

There have been numerous leaks of various components thus far, so considering the relatively high consistency of such leaks when they come in groups in the run-up to a product presentation, an "iPad mini" appears plausible and even likely (whatever the actual name will be).

In addition, a 13" Retina MacBook Pro appears to be in the pipeline, as do new iMacs and a new Mac mini.

If any of those will share the stage with a new iPad model remains to be seen, of course. The new iMacs in a new case will likely receive some explicit presentation either way, while both a 13" Retina MacBook Pro and a new Mac mini would probably just be versions of already existing products consistent with what's already there, so those might me introduced without any presentation, particularly a new Mac mini.
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 6:30 am

Quoting Klaus (Reply 11):
There have been numerous leaks of various components thus far, so considering the relatively high consistency of such leaks when they come in groups in the run-up to a product presentation, an "iPad mini" appears plausible and even likely (whatever the actual name will be).

Klaus, based on the recent leaks of the purported battery size for this smaller iteration of the iPad, do you expect battery life to be greater than, less than, or equal to the current iPad?
 
Klaus
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:37 am

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 12):
Klaus, based on the recent leaks of the purported battery size for this smaller iteration of the iPad, do you expect battery life to be greater than, less than, or equal to the current iPad?

I haven't done the math on that one, but given the smaller, lower-resolution display on par with the iPad 2 and with the newer 32nm A5 processor (which needs less power than the older 45nm A5 version in the first iPad 2 models) likely powering it, together with a plausible orientation towards book-reading purposes I would expect pretty good battery life.

The iPad 3 is an outlier through its Retina Display with its massive resolution – both the display itself and the graphics processor pushing that insane amount of pixels are power hogs and require a comparatively large battery with associated long charging times.

I'm pretty sure the iPad 4 will primarily be about driving the battery consumption down again to at least the vicinity of the iPad 2.

But an iPad mini doesn't have the same baggage – it can just be a smaller version of the iPad 2 if that's what they want, with very good battery life.

The prevailing consensus appears to be that it will be 7.85" with the iPad 2's number of pixels but the non-Retina iPhone's resolution.
 
QFA380
Posts: 2012
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 4:38 pm

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 2:51 pm

Quoting Klaus (Reply 11):
numerous leaks of various components thus far, so considering the relatively high consistency

Dude, that was a tongue in cheek comment aimed at your fellow fanboy who essentially proclaimed that all leaks are true. Seeing as though he had already determined that leaks are true to counter my post outlining the ridiculousness of creating a market out of leaks; I merely ran with the notion that leaks vis-a-vis Apple must be true and showed a legitimate reason why a price conscious consumer would choose a competing product over the thus far inexistent iPad mini.

Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 5):
iPad mini (which it will), would you be interested in buying based on the leaks (which as usual, will be correct)?
 
Virginblue4
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 3:00 pm

Quoting QFA380 (Reply 14):

So you have basically come on this thread to name call? If you have nothing productive to say, please don't join in.

But generally yes, all leaks over the last year have turned out to be the real thing, so I imagine these leaks will be too.
 
NBGSkyGod
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 3:37 pm

Isn't the iPad Mini an iPhone?
 
Klaus
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 17, 2012 4:08 pm

Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 15):
So you have basically come on this thread to name call? If you have nothing productive to say, please don't join in.

  

I was exclusively responding to what topical content could be wrung from his post, ignoring his usual personal digs.

If he feels the urge to belittle and dismiss other people personally for what they're interested in, he is almost ridiculously out of place on an aviation hobby site, of all things. The irony is palpable.   

Quoting NBGSkyGod (Reply 16):
Isn't the iPad Mini an iPhone?

No, the iPad has a different user interface from the iPhone. It is not just an upscaled iPhone, although you can actually run iPhone-only apps just in magnified view if they don't have an actual iPad UI. But particularly in that case you notice right away why there are actual iPad versions of many apps (or "universal" apps which contain both UIs).

Real iPad apps often use the larger screen for more complex user interfaces and for fewer menu levels being needed. The difference is not trivial in both development effort and user satisfaction.

In an iPad mini the iPad UI would appear smaller, about on par with the iPhone's icon density; Which is not as comfortable as in actual iPad size, but that's a compromise you'd have to make for a more compact device if the rumours should pan out.

There is a similarity to the iPhone, though, in the "chin" and "forehead" of the device if the leaks should be factual – there don't appear to be left and right borders, just top and bottom ones, which may take its size to not much above smaller 7" tablets with equal borders all around.
 
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casinterest
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 5:53 pm

http://www.engadget.com/2012/10/23/apple-ipad-mini-liveblog/

The mini is official.
they even revamped the IPAD with version 4 just 6 months after version 3.

IMACS and Imac mini all got big updates as well.
blog is still rolling.

Pretty cool,.
 
baldwin471
Posts: 350
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 6:19 pm

So, let me get this right. .9" larger screen than the Nexus 7, but only 1024x600 opposed to 1280x800. Okay so ppi is around 162 compared to 219 on the Nexus 7. Right. Price is $329 for Wifi, 16GB, as opposed to $249 for 16GB(Soon to be the same price for 32GB). I can't believe Apple are still getting away with flogging this s**t as revolutionary. It's an incremental bump, that doesn't even compete with the Nexus 7, and costs much more.
 
KFLLCFII
Posts: 3621
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 6:27 pm

http://www.foxnews.com/tech/2012/10/23/apple-event-ipad-mini

$329. That's too much.

I would put a psychological barrier in this market at the $300 mark, and they instead went greedy by $30. They're taking a huge gamble by not pricing it at $299, which I don't doubt would still have yielded a decent margin.
 
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casinterest
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 6:29 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 19):
So, let me get this right. .9" larger screen than the Nexus 7,

But that is 35% more screen area. The PPI though is still less than the Nexus 7. It is still a push come to shove choice for quite a few folks. However for the extra cash, I think the ipad 4 is a much better purchase.
 
Acheron
Posts: 1852
Joined: Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:14 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 6:29 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 19):
It's an incremental bump, that doesn't even compete with the Nexus 7, and costs much more.

Its aimed at people who buy anything made by Apple without much thought and those who have invested so much into the Apple ecosystem that they couldn't drop them even if they wanted to, without losing hundred of dollars in iStuff.
 
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Kiwirob
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:08 pm

The new iMacs also look rather stunning.
 
baldwin471
Posts: 350
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:22 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:09 pm

Quoting Acheron (Reply 22):

Exactly.

iDiots.
 
D L X
Posts: 12725
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:19 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 19):
It's an incremental bump, that doesn't even compete with the Nexus 7, and costs much more.

Hm.

Looks like the iPad mini is lighter and thinner, yet has a larger screen than the Nexus 7.

But it doesn't compete with the Nexus 7?

If you don't want the iPad, no one is twisting your arm. It never ceases to amaze me how many people love to go on the internet where Apple products are being discussed, and assert their geeky manhood by bashing Apple.
 
racko
Posts: 4548
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2001 12:06 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:35 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 19):
16GB, as opposed to $249 for 16GB(Soon to be the same price for 32GB).

The Nexus 7 16GB is $199.
 
Silver1SWA
Posts: 4770
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 6:11 pm

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:41 pm

Quoting KFLLCFII (Reply 20):

There's an awful lot of people who just discovered this huge gap between their iPhone and iPad that absolutely must be filled! They will do alright at that price.  

What bothers me, as someone who has been interested in getting an iPad, is I assume Apple will no longer sell two iPad generations, the older at a lower price, and instead your cheaper option is for a smaller device?
 
D L X
Posts: 12725
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 7:52 pm

Quoting racko (Reply 26):
The Nexus 7 16GB is $199.

The Nexus 7 16 GB is $249.

https://play.google.com/store/devices/details?id=nexus_7_16gb
 
racko
Posts: 4548
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2001 12:06 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:22 pm

Quoting D L X (Reply 28):
The Nexus 7 16 GB is $249.

https://play.google.com/store/devices/details?id=nexus_7_16gb

All models are getting their storage space doubled, if you order a "8 GB" now you're already getting a 16 GB model...
 
Virginblue4
Topic Author
Posts: 614
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:35 pm

Quoting Silver1SWA (Reply 27):

Apple now sell the iPad Mini, iPad 2 and the 4th generation iPad.

Quoting Acheron (Reply 22):

Yes, clearly. I've just shown this to my step dad, doesn't know much about technology at all. The first thing he saw was the price. He then had a look at the mini and decided he is very likely to get one.

This is aimed at general consumers, and it will be very successful.
 
D L X
Posts: 12725
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:42 pm

Quoting racko (Reply 29):
All models are getting their storage space doubled, if you order a "8 GB" now you're already getting a 16 GB model...

Why are they lowering the price?
 
baldwin471
Posts: 350
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:22 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:43 pm

Quoting D L X (Reply 25):

.9" larger screen. But much lower resolution. I'd rather have slightly smaller and clear text as opposed to larger grainy text. 7.2mm is too thin for a tablet. It just is. I guarantee it will be uncomfortable to hold.
 
D L X
Posts: 12725
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 8:50 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 32):
.9" larger screen. But much lower resolution. I'd rather have slightly smaller and clear text as opposed to larger grainy text. 7.2mm is too thin for a tablet. It just is. I guarantee it will be uncomfortable to hold.

Then I quite sincerely wish you happiness on your choice!

I just don't understand the bashing of people who choose otherwise.
 
Virginblue4
Topic Author
Posts: 614
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:37 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 32):

But the thing is, it's not grainy. It has a better screen than the iPad 2 which is very clear (unless of course you compare it to the 3rd/4th gen iPad).
 
racko
Posts: 4548
Joined: Tue Nov 06, 2001 12:06 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 9:54 pm

Quoting D L X (Reply 31):
Quoting racko (Reply 29):
All models are getting their storage space doubled, if you order a "8 GB" now you're already getting a 16 GB model...

Why are they lowering the price?

Technically they aren't lowering the price, they are increasing the storage size. Cost are minimal (SSDs have become cheap, the huge price gaps between the different storage sizes are artificial), and 8 GB was small to begin with.
 
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Tugger
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 10:30 pm

Quoting Acheron (Reply 22):
Its aimed at

filling the gap between the various products they have and to give every price point consumer a solid option for an "Apple Universe" product. It is good, smart business and puts an end to the few here that insisted a smaller iPad was not a good idea or not needed.

With the iPhone starting at "zero" (wireless provider subsidized so not exactly free but....) they have every price point covered.

Tugg
 
Braniff747SP
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Tue Oct 23, 2012 11:58 pm

New iPad (the normal one) seems nice, but I like the fact that now a 3d-gen refurb will be much cheaper. iPad Mini looks interesting, but I can't judge it until I use it. MacBook Pro with Retina 13" looks fantastic; I'm a fan of the 15" as it is. The new iMac looks great; certainly impressive. Mac Mini got a nice upgrade, but it is still the oddball of the Mac lineup. All in all, it was a nice set of additions and updates to the line.
 
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LAXintl
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 24, 2012 12:24 am

To me the 7 inch is the sweet spot.

Being light weight, small and easy to hold, can fit in a jacket pocket, are big things for me. And the $200-250'ish price helps greatly also.

Got a Samsung Tab 2 7.0 from work and its a fantastic too to surf the web with, and do emails on. I take it with me to meetings, or anywhere I know I won't need the full capability of a laptop.

Also with the huge android app selection there undoubtedly will be things of interest for everyone, especially those that utilize android phone also.
 
baldwin471
Posts: 350
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:22 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 24, 2012 12:44 am

Quoting virginblue4 (Reply 34):

In what universe? I had an iPad 2, and it is definitely not clear.

Quoting D L X (Reply 33):
Then I quite sincerely wish you happiness on your choice!

I just don't understand the bashing of people who choose otherwise.

Not bashing, just giving information. It annoys when i see millions of people buying Apple products just because they're made by Apple. They're even worse than the "If it ain't Boeing i ain't going" knobheads.
 
D L X
Posts: 12725
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 24, 2012 1:15 am

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 39):
It annoys when i see millions of people buying Apple products just because they're made by Apple.

Why? Why does anything other people buy bother you?

Not you personally, because I think that mentality is shared by many many people.
 
Klaus
Posts: 21642
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 7:41 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 24, 2012 1:06 pm

Quoting Klaus (Reply 13):
I'm pretty sure the iPad 4 will primarily be about driving the battery consumption down again to at least the vicinity of the iPad 2.

They've instead chosen to up the ante again by doubling its already massive processing power (both CPU and GPU) and keeping everything else the same (apart from the connector).

Quoting Klaus (Reply 13):
But an iPad mini doesn't have the same baggage – it can just be a smaller version of the iPad 2 if that's what they want, with very good battery life.

The prevailing consensus appears to be that it will be 7.85" with the iPad 2's number of pixels but the non-Retina iPhone's resolution.

The leaks had nailed it pretty much exactly, it appears.
 
baldwin471
Posts: 350
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 5:22 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 24, 2012 4:55 pm

Quoting D L X (Reply 40):

Because it hurts other companies that ACTUALLY innovate. Like Nokia. They are doing some extraordinary things with their cameras and screens, yet no-one takes any notice. But Apple come along and release the same crap year after year with a slightly different moniker, and everyone falls for it.
 
Silver1SWA
Posts: 4770
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RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 24, 2012 6:34 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 42):
Because it hurts other companies that ACTUALLY innovate. Like Nokia. They are doing some extraordinary things with their cameras and screens, yet no-one takes any notice. But Apple come along and release the same crap year after year with a slightly different moniker, and everyone falls for it.

I see it as there are two types of people. There are those who are all about features. Features features features. They don't like Apple because Apple isn't the most innovative with the newest features. Then you have people who just want a beautiful, fluid, seamless design and an overall great user experience. This is what Apple delivers like no other company, in my opinion, and that is what their "fans" want...and like it or not, are willing to pay extra for.

[Edited 2012-10-24 11:37:16]
 
D L X
Posts: 12725
Joined: Thu May 27, 1999 3:30 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 24, 2012 7:21 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 42):
Because it hurts other companies that ACTUALLY innovate.

No offense intended, but that's a really poor reason.

Build a better product, and people will buy it. In any other context, you would laugh at the businessman that complained that people don't buy his superior product because they liked another product more.

(Especially when Android fans are quick to note that Apple has less than a 50% market share.)
 
Klaus
Posts: 21642
Joined: Wed Jul 11, 2001 7:41 am

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Wed Oct 24, 2012 9:14 pm

Quoting baldwin471 (Reply 42):
Because it hurts other companies that ACTUALLY innovate. Like Nokia. They are doing some extraordinary things with their cameras and screens, yet no-one takes any notice. But Apple come along and release the same crap year after year with a slightly different moniker, and everyone falls for it.

Or maybe you're actually missing a few things others can in fact see.

When your only alternative theory is that "everybody else is just stupid, except myself!", maybe you should really think again before passing judgment.
 
TLG
Posts: 381
Joined: Sun Jul 17, 2005 3:41 pm

RE: Invitations For Rumoured IPad Mini Sent Out

Thu Oct 25, 2012 1:39 am

I believe the iPad Mini will do very well. For one thing, it has the Apple name on it. Although Apple is maybe not the innovator & features leader they once were, the company still puts together a solid product that works well and does what most consumers ask of it. I say this as an Android user & supporter. I don't see myself owning an Apple product anytime soon, but I will be the 1st to say that Android, while being a leader in features, definitely has some bugs.

Besides competing with the Nexus 7, I wouldn't be surprised if the iPad Mini takes some sales from regular-sized tablets. Look at the iPhone 5 for an example. One could argue that it is a mini smartphone compared to the top end Android & Windows devices it directly competes with, yet it sells very well and fans don't seem to notice the size difference.

My 2¢.

-TLG

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