Despite being my go to liquor these days I know embarrassingly little about what makes whiskey whiskey, why scotch and bourbon are different. My go to brands (depending on mood and how much I want to spend) are Jameson, Maker's Mark or Seagram's Seven Crown. Though lately I have been working my way through this: http://www.deerhammer.com/products.php (the Whitewater -- just a few steps away from moonshine in many regards.

Today's lesson...

1) Whisky (without the 'e') is made in Scotland. If it's made anywhere else, it MUST have the 'e' and be spelled Whiskey.

2) Scotch is a drink. A person from Scotland is 'Scottish' or 'a Scot'. A person from Scotland is not 'Scotch'.


Lesson over, let's drink!

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 1): Whisky (without the 'e') is made in Scotland. If it's made anywhere else, it MUST have the 'e' and be spelled Whiskey.

I've always thought Canadian whisky was spelled without the 'e' too:

http://dinersjournal.blogs.nytimes.c.../2008/12/04/whiskey-versus-whisky/

Bourbon and Scotch Whisky are usually my go-to's. That being said, I'm relatively new to Bourbon so I know Scotch Whisky much better.

Right now, I'm finishing up a bottle of Highland Park 18 which is fantastic. I'll definitely be buying another bottle.

However, I do love my peat, and Islay whiskys are usually what I end up with. On the affordable side, I really like Ardbeg and Laphroaig.

Being Canadian from Scottish stock, I'm caught in the middle. Perhaps my dear uncle can shed light on the topic....Kenny, are you reading this?

Quoting rwy04lga (Reply 1): 2) Scotch is a drink. A person from Scotland is 'Scottish' or 'a Scot'. A person from Scotland is not 'Scotch'.

Which is why Cmdr. Scott goes by Scotty and not Scotchy.

Not a huge bourbon drinker myself, but there are days when beer just isn't enough to see me through to Point B. And on those days I go with two I highly recommend, Buffalo Trace and Basil&Haydens. As for peaty smoke I always reach for Lagavulin, drinking that stuff is like smoking a Gauloise.

Quoting desertjets (Thread starter): why scotch and bourbon are different.

Bourbon is only made in Kentucky by law (anything made elsewhere is called something different - Jack Daniel's is a bourbon in nearly every aspect, but since it's made in Tennessee, it's called Tennessee Whiskey), and the mash it's made from must be at least 50% corn. Also, bourbon is barreled at a much higher alcohol content than most other whiskeys - 150 proof is pretty common, compared to most other whiskeys and scotches being in the 130-140 proof range.

Another defining characteristic of bourbon is how it's aged. Bourbon is aged at relatively high temperatures, which means they mature very quickly - it's rare to see bourbon that's aged more than 9 years. Scotch, on the other hand, is aged at fairly low temperatures (due to the local climate) and tends to take much longer to mature - upwards of 20 years in many cases. The shorter aging, combined with the higher alcohol content of the distillate, means that bourbons tend to have relatively high alcohol contents when bottled; they tend to range from 86-110 proof, whereas scotches typically don't get much higher than 90 proof.

Quoting sw733 (Reply 3): However, I do love my peat, and Islay whiskys are usually what I end up with. On the affordable side, I really like Ardbeg and Laphroaig.

If you can afford the Laphroaig, you're doing well ! My favourite was always either Glenmorangie or Glenfiddich. With the Islay malts, you can almost smell the iodine in the seaweed.

Quoting MrChips (Reply 7): Bourbon is only made in Kentucky by law (anything made elsewhere is called something different - Jack Daniel's is a bourbon in nearly every aspect, but since it's made in Tennessee, it's called Tennessee Whiskey), and the mash it's made from must be at least 50% corn. Also, bourbon is barreled at a much higher alcohol content than most other whiskeys - 150 proof is pretty common, compared to most other whiskeys and scotches being in the 130-140 proof range.

Yes, from a still functioning memory cell, that's my understanding.

Quoting MrChips (Reply 7): Another defining characteristic of bourbon is how it's aged. Bourbon is aged at relatively high temperatures, which means they mature very quickly - it's rare to see bourbon that's aged more than 9 years. Scotch, on the other hand, is aged at fairly low temperatures (due to the local climate) and tends to take much longer to mature - upwards of 20 years in many cases. The shorter aging, combined with the higher alcohol content of the distillate, means that bourbons tend to have relatively high alcohol contents when bottled; they tend to range from 86-110 proof, whereas scotches typically don't get much higher than 90 proof.

Interesting to know. For the 'by-law' thingee regarding scotch, I believe it must be aged in used sherry casks.

For all whisky/ey fans, you might look up Welsh whiskey. I believe now only one distillery, Penderyn, which puts out three brands. There was a Daniel's distillery at one time (same family)| which put out a label called B|lack Prince, but they're gone now AFAIK. From my own experience, surviving Welsh whiskey is the primary goal.

Sigh... I used to like Whiskey and Rum until a bad night. Then I was down to just Tequila and Vodka. Then just Vodka. After another bad night, Vodka no more  

If it is diluted enough, I can stomach it and enjoy it. Anybody got a good, smooth mix for someone like me? If it gets down to 20 proof or less it's ok. Reading everyone else's replies, I sound like a drinking noob, apologies if I'm not as classy as yall   

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 8): Interesting to know. For the 'by-law' thingee regarding scotch, I believe it must be aged in used sherry casks.

I don't think that's true; all I know is that scotch must be aged in oak barrels. Due to the slow nature of how scotch matures in the barrel, it is advantageous to use a barrel that's had something else age in it before hand...coincidentally, bourbon barrels are highly sought after. The reason for this is that the first aging in the barrel pulls most of the natural sugars in the wood out, along with most of the more hard-edged fusel oils as well.

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 9): Anybody got a good, smooth mix for someone like me? If it gets down to 20 proof or less it's ok.

A long time ago, when I was at an office party and underage drinking didn't carry the stigma it has today, I ordered a whiskey sour. What I got tasted good, but I could tell it wasn't a whiskey sour. When I asked the bartender for another I asked what it really was. He answered 'John Collins', Scotch with Collins mix (the John standing for Johnnie Walker). He went on to say that "we're out of sour mix and at your age I didn't think you'd be able to tell the difference."     

That's what I drank for a number of years afterwards, even though on its own, I'm not a real fan of scotch.

For whiskies, I generally tend towards Canadians for drinking mixed, and Irish in coffee. VO, Crown Royal or Canadian Club with 7 will never get turned away if handed to me. I also like Sazeracs occasionally, but you have to find somewhere which carries real Peychaud's Bitters to make it right.

I'll drink pretty much whatever you put in front of me. No pretentiousness here...

That said, I tend to gravitate toward Woodford Reserve, which is a bourbon.

As we speak, I just bought a bottle of Suntory Whisky (no E per the lable) on my Japanese trip. I suppose it will do the job!

I hear they have a really good blended whisky here called "Hibiki" which is also from Suntory that supposedly, according to Wiki, has won Worlds Best Blended Whisky

I'm getting thirsty just typing all this!

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 11): For whiskies, I generally tend towards Canadians for drinking mixed

Too much traveling. I drink with Americans.

  

The biggest difference is in the grist, this being the floury mixture that has its sugars extracted to produce the low alcoholic strength wash prior to distillation.
For malt whisky the grist has to consist of 100% malted barley, for grain whisky, the vast majority of the grist will be of an unmalted grain, usually either wheat or maize, with a small amoubt of malted barley to provide the necessary enzymes.
Irish Whiskey will usually be from a grist with a majority of unmalted cereals.
In the US they also on occasions use rye.

Scotch whisky has to be matured in oak barrels for a minimum of four years, traditionally sherry barrels were used, but these are now hard to obtain as sherry is not only consumed in far smaller volumes than it used to be in the UK, but is also now bottled in Spain, rather than shipped to the UK in barrels. Increasingly Bourbon barrels are used, widely available as Bourbon regulations demand a new barrel every time. Meanwhile the thrifty Scots use the barrels over and over again, some lasting for 80 years or so.

The two main categories of Scotch whisky are blended and single malt:
Single malt is exactly what is says, pure malt whisky from one distillery, it doesn't all have to be from the same batch, they routinely mix a variety of casks of variosu ages in order to bottle a consistent product, none of the whisky however can be younger than any age statement made on the bottle. Many single malts are bottled at 40% or 43% alcohol, acheived by dilution with water. Rarely smaller distilelrs will bottle at higher strengths.
Blended whisky is a mixture of predominately grain whisky, with a small proportion of malt whiskies to add to the flavour profile, once again everything in it has to be older than any age statement on the bottle. The blender might add as many as 40 different malts and grains to the blend in order to produce a consistent bottle of Bells, Johnnie Walker, or similar. Blended whiskies are always diluted with water to acheive a constant alcohol content, usually 40%

The malt officianado will try to seek out single cask bottlings, these are exceptional casks that are bottled at the cask strength, and the bottles usually numbered Typically just over 200 bottles to a cask.

+1 on the Lagavulin -- fabulous stuff. It tends to invite strong opinions, though, and I know a few single-malt aficionados who won't go near it.

There are nearly as many favorites as there are single malts. IMO you can hardly go wrong with Lagavulin, Glenfarclas 15 and up, or Glendronach. The Macallan is very nice but can be overpriced. For a blended whisky I like the Johnnie Walker double black, and I shared a surprisingly nice Cutty Sark with my dad once. (That bottle was ancient, I need to try the current product someday to see what it's like.) Most of the blends I've tried tend to seem a bit anonymous.

I can't manage to get into bourbons at all. A friend gave me a bottle of Maker's Mark 46 which I enjoyed in very very small doses, though.

The OP didn't actually name any scotch...

Ref: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scotch_whisky

Quoting desertjets (Thread starter): Jameson

Irish whiskey.

Quoting desertjets (Thread starter): Maker's Mark

Bourbon.

Quoting desertjets (Thread starter): Seagram's Seven Crown

Rye Whiskey.

So:

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 14): Irish Whiskey will usually be from a grist with a majority of unmalted cereals.

I.e. Jameson.

If you like that, treat yourself to a bit of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redbreast_%28whiskey%29 - straight up and drunk slowly enough so you can taste it. Served at a dear price at many Irish bars in the US, and the bottles have been getting so pricey that I don't buy them anymore. Here in NH booze is cheap (state owned liquor store) and it used to be under $40 a bottle now it's over $60.

See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_Whiskey

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 14): n the US they also on occasions use rye.

Canadians are quite frequently rye whiskey, esp. the Segrams line.

Seven Crown is often thought of as a lower end whiskey, good for making 7&7s and not much more.

Segrams does make some more upscale ryes that are good in drinks that bring out the flavor more than 7&7s, like a whiskey sour.

See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rye_whiskey and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scotch_whisky

if you feel inclined to sample a few Scotch whiskies:

Laphroaig, Some compare it to drinking iodine, others won't drink anything else.
Talisker, Pepperish and fiery
Port Charlotte, Very peaty
Bruichladdich An Islay oddity as it has very little peat.
Ardbeg Typical Islay style.

Malt whisky has a huge flavour range from lowland whiskies which are very light and floral up to the aformentioned Laphroaig. Geography has some impact, but adjacent distilleries can produce very different styles, easily shown by Laphroaig and Lagavulin, literally a mile or two apart but planets apart in taste and body.

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 17): Very peaty

I forget - how does the peat taste get added to the whisky?

Quoting Revelation (Reply 18): I forget - how does the peat taste get added to the whisky?

Not sure how accurate this is, but this is what I found previously when I had the same question:

"For what do you need peat in the whisky production? The old Scots used peat for heating the pot stills. However that didn’t lead to the smoky taste of the whisky. Only during the drying process of the damp malt over a peat heated fire, the smoke gets into the barley. The difference in the smokiness of the whisky depends on the time the barley is exposed to the biting peat smoke. The drying time of damp malt lies at approximately 30 hours. At Laphroaig about 18 hours of these 30 hours it is dried over peat fires; in contrast at Glengoyne it is dried over non-peat fire. Thus a huge pallet starting from extremely peaty up to whiskies with little smoke flavor develops. There is a special characteristics of malt. Even without peat, the seed develops a little peatiness.

Does the water, which flows through peat moors, have an influence on the smokiness of a whisky? The answer is a clear NO! Peat water contains only a few ppm (parts by million) of peat, which colors the water brown, however it contributes to the smokey taste in no way. Surely, the water is of crucial importance for the quality of whisky, but it does not have an influence on the smokiness. The peat smoke delivers a ten to hundredfold peatyness than the water does."

Source: http://www.whisky.de/archiv/experts/peat.htm

Quoting Revelation (Reply 18): Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 17): Very peaty I forget - how does the peat taste get added to the whisky?

Malt is produced by wetting barley, allowing it to sprout, then drying it in a kiln. Traditionally the kilns in Scotland were wire floors over a peat fire so all whisky was peated, now with other heat sources its only peaty if required.
Additionally the water used in the mash tun will be sourced straight from the hillside and will have a small peat content.

Heading off on a tangent, but I'm sure some of you will appreciate this tribute to the Majesty of Scotland's Glens.

I love Scotland's glens, and whatever else we lose
Please leave us our glens, our glorious glens
Our mountains as grand, Ben Nevis, Ben Lomond too
You can have all those Bens, but leave us our glens

(Chorus)
Glenfiddich, Glendronach, Glenlivet, Glen Grant
Can you do without them? If you must know, I can't
Put a drop in the glass of Glen Spey or Glen Drotter
It's a perfectly bearable way to drink water

I'd willingly lose our culture, or most of it
Including that mess they call 'full Highland dress'
With the whole ethnic bit of haggis and Hogmanay
I'd gladly dispense, but leave us our glens

Glenfiddich, Glendronach, Glenlivet, Glen Fall
I once knew a man who had sampled them all
Glenisla, Glenugie, Glenkinchie, that's plenty
He looked sixty-five, but in fact he was twenty

Take our Highlands scottische, take our marches, strathspeys and reels
Take our old Scottish waltz, but leave us our malts
You can take, if you wish, our ladies' conveniences
And our gentlemen's - but leave us our glens

Glenfiddich, Glendronach, Glenlivet, Glenfyne
Was great at communion when we ran out of wine
Glenisla, Glenugie, Glenkinchie, Glenmorangie
I prefer them to Cointreau which I find too orangey

Oh breathe there a Scot whose aims and priorities
When laid on the line, are different from mine
Take our homes, take our jobs, take anything else you will
Wife, family and friends, but leave us our glens



Original by the Aberdonian Music/Comedy trio "Scotland The What".

Quoting Revelation (Reply 16): Seven Crown is often thought of as a lower end whiskey, good for making 7&7s and not much more.

The Seven Crown gets bought when I am being cheap -- usually runs around $15, whereas the Jameson or Maker's are about $28 or $30 if they aren't on sale.



So basically the general process of making all these varieties of whisk(e)y is about the same, but it is all the little details like which specific grain, the barrels and the fire (in case of peat fired scotch) makes all the difference.

Since I haven't actually tried a scotch, is there a universally good "starter scotch" that can be easily found at no more than $30?



And drinking it straight. This is something I can't do -- I almost always it over ice with ginger ale in a low ball. So how do you do it -- cut it with water a bit, or just on the rocks and let the ice melt?

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 9): Sigh... I used to like Whiskey and Rum until a bad night. Then I was down to just Tequila and Vodka. Then just Vodka. After another bad night, Vodka no more If it is diluted enough, I can stomach it and enjoy it. Anybody got a good, smooth mix for someone like me? If it gets down to 20 proof or less it's ok. Reading everyone else's replies, I sound like a drinking noob, apologies if I'm not as classy as yall

You have to drink in moderation and not act like you are at a college house party. A Jameson and ginger is a nice sipping drink over dinner (or while making dinner or after dinner). Vodka tonics used to be my drink of choice for a long time -- but such a bland drink even with the fruity flavored vodkas. Now if you can stomach it try some Gin. Bombay Sapphire is more personal favorite (had some bad results with Tanqueray). If you want a classic, gin and tonic over ice with a twist of lime.

Quoting desertjets (Reply 22): And drinking it straight. This is something I can't do -- I almost always it over ice with ginger ale in a low ball. So how do you do it -- cut it with water a bit, or just on the rocks and let the ice melt?

It completely depends on my mood. If I am at a nice restaurant, and splurging for a really nice glass, I'll get it neat to fully enjoy it. At home, I'm a bit more liberal. If I feel like having it neat, I will. Other times, I'll throw 1 ice cube in. Other times, I'll throw my Whisky Stones in, which take a bit of the edge off but don't dilute it (or even cool it down, really). It's entirely based on my mood.

http://www.amazon.com/Teroforma-1220-Whisky-Stones/dp/B002GZX2DE

I can say that I'm not snobby enough to always need it neat, but I am snobby enough to have Single Malt Scotch Whisky glasses  http://www.wineenthusiast.com/riedel...-scotch-glasses-%28set-of-2%29.asp

Quoting desertjets (Reply 22): You have to drink in moderation and not act like you are at a college house party.

To be fair, a lot of it was at college house parties  

But yes, mixed is better. Though I tend to see a lot of salty older guys drinking whiskey or scotch straight (though they don't go all out chugging it down either lol)

Quoting DeltaMD90 (Reply 24): Though I tend to see a lot of salty older guys drinking whiskey or scotch straight (though they don't go all out chugging it down either lol)

I live near a slightly dive-y bar, and that's better than seeing all of the older regulars (none of whom appear to have been able to keep a marriage, let along friends outside of the bar) drinking cans of Bud Light. Why one would go to a bar to drink cans of beer, I haven't a clue.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 8): If you can afford the Laphroaig, you're doing well

I guess I never considered Laphroaig to be that expensive. I can usually get a bottle of 10 year for US$40.00, which I consider quite fair. I don't often get very fancy whisky for home, and prefer to save that for a nice night out. That being said, the Laphroaig 18 is fantastic, but I've only ever had a few glasses of it.

Quoting sw733 (Reply 19): The old Scots used peat for heating the pot stills. However that didn%u2019t lead to the smoky taste of the whisky. Only during the drying process of the damp malt over a peat heated fire, the smoke gets into the barley.

Quoting Bongodog1964 (Reply 20): Malt is produced by wetting barley, allowing it to sprout, then drying it in a kiln. Traditionally the kilns in Scotland were wire floors over a peat fire so all whisky was peated, now with other heat sources its only peaty if required.

Yep, that's it, thanks!

Quoting desertjets (Reply 22): And drinking it straight. This is something I can't do -- I almost always it over ice with ginger ale in a low ball. So how do you do it -- cut it with water a bit, or just on the rocks and let the ice melt?

The only thing I drink straight is Irish whiskey or some of the tastier bourbons.

It helps if you drink it out of a nice glass.

See this note in a previous similar thread: Advice Wanted: Scotch Whisky (by Revelation Dec 20 2011 in Non Aviation)

Reply 22 that would be..

No ice, room temp, sipped.

Often with a good beer to chase it.

Quoting sw733 (Reply 26): I guess I never considered Laphroaig to be that expensive. I can usually get a bottle of 10 year for US$40.00, which I consider quite fair. I don't often get very fancy whisky for home, and prefer to save that for a nice night out. That being said, the Laphroaig 18 is fantastic, but I've only ever had a few glasses of it.

With the excise taxes here, closer to $60.

Quoting desertjets (Thread starter): Maker's Mark

Swill! Actually, no but my tastes have moved on from here. I still have 2 or 3 bottles in the house. I prefer Woodford Reserve for my "everyday" bourbon. Woodford also has a "Double Oaked" variety that is very nice.

I'm also a strong believer in Four Roses and a relative new-comer, Angel's Envy.

And, to round out my bourbon collection, I have, in the house:
-Buffalo Trace
-Jefferson Reserve
-Blanton's
-15 year Pappy
-Basil Hayden's
-Knob Creek
-Old Forester
-Elijah Craig

I've also got some American Honey (Wild Turkey) that I'll mix with unsweet tea.

Quoting sw733 (Reply 26): I can usually get a bottle of 10 year for US$40.00

It's times like these when I hate the Australian Government     

With excise and tax, AU$40 would get you Johnny Walker Red. For Laphroaig your often looking in the $70-80 range.

For that reason I stick to the Red, and IMHO it's pretty decent for a generic "glugging" blend Scotch. Hopefully one day, though, I'll be able to set my sights a little higher!

Quoting MrChips (Reply 7): Jack Daniel's is a bourbon in nearly every aspect,

Except for the filtering through charred maple chips which changes the flavor noticeably (to my palate, anyway).

That said, I'm a big fan of their higher-end Gentleman Jack product.

My go-to will always be either Basil Hayden's (bourbon), Pappy Van Winkle (bourbon) or Johnny Walker Gold (scotch, and to my palate, even better than Johnny Walker Blue).

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 28): With the excise taxes here, closer to $60.

Quoting RyanairGuru (Reply 30): For Laphroaig your often looking in the $70-80 range.

'Merica!

Yeah, I go to Australia quite often (several times a year) and people always ask me to bring back some wines. I then tell them it's cheaper to buy it in the US than it is in Australia, even if the wine is from Australia.

Well, Laphroaig is pretty affordable here considering the quality. It's about the same price to buy a Laphroaig 10 as it is to buy a Glenlivet 12, and the Laphroaig wins every time in my book.

I have Compass Box Orangerie (not really scotch per se) and Black Bush on the shelf right now. I don't normally spend that much on liquor but I was celebrating an income increase.   The regular "white label" Bushmills is my standby. For bourbon, Knob Creek is a favorite.

Here in WA we have massive liquor taxes but I can buy a 6-pack of beer at any store. In PA (my other home), beer is only sold in full cases but the state liquor stores have decent prices. Hence, I drink beer in WA and liquor in PA. 

I tried Trader Joe's 10yr at a friend's place the other day - not too bad for a "generic" scotch.

Quoting threeifbyair (Reply 33): I tried Trader Joe's 10yr at a friend's place the other day - not too bad for a "generic" scotch.

Didn't realize TJs had liquor, let alone a house brand scotch. Next time I am there I need to look a little closer. Their self-branded beers are reasonably good and down right cheap.