Moderators: richierich, ua900, hOMSaR

 
RussianJet
Topic Author
Posts: 5983
Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2007 4:15 am

Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:19 am

Horrible piece of news. Two children staying at a friend's apartment over a pet shop in New Brunswick, Canada, were killed by some kind of constricting snake. It appears that the reptile somehow escaped its confines, then made its way up to the apartment through a ventilation system, killing the poor boys as they slept.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-23583116

Nasty, freak accident, or somebody's fault? It's certainly a very unusual thing to happen. No charges as of yet.
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
 
AR385
Posts: 6935
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:25 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:50 am

Very strange and sad news. How big were the children? And it must have been a hungry snake too. Somebody ought to go to jail for this.
 
RussianJet
Topic Author
Posts: 5983
Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2007 4:15 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:07 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 1):
Somebody ought to go to jail for this.

I don't know man.... It's truly awful, but probably not particularly foreseeable, especially the escaping to another property. Sometimes I wonder if we really should always immediately play the blame game. The owner has to live with this forever, apart from anything else. I guess we'll have to see what the investigation reveals. The jury is out for me at this point.
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
 
AR385
Posts: 6935
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:25 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:16 am

The kids were 7 and 5 years old. The store name was "Reptile Ocean" and it had been the target of several protests for the mistreatment of its animals for months. I guess this explains the hunger of the snake.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 17944
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2000 1:59 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:18 am

Well I'm never sleeping again....
I don't take responsibility at all
 
RussianJet
Topic Author
Posts: 5983
Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2007 4:15 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:18 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 3):
had been the target of several protests for the mistreatment of its animals for months. I guess this explains the hunger of the snake.

Oh dear, that's not sounding too positive....
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
 
User avatar
WarRI1
Posts: 13733
Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2007 10:51 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:38 am

A sickening incident, obviously caused by carelessness. What makes someone want such a dangerous animal? The animal is innocent, the people responsible for its care are not.
It is better to die on your feet, than live on your knees.
 
WestJet747
Posts: 1950
Joined: Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:43 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:53 am

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 2):
I don't know man.... It's truly awful, but probably not particularly foreseeable, especially the escaping to another property. Sometimes I wonder if we really should always immediately play the blame game. The owner has to live with this forever, apart from anything else. I guess we'll have to see what the investigation reveals. The jury is out for me at this point.

If it is shown that the snake escaped due to negligence on behalf of the owner, then it's absolutely a crime and he will be charged with 'negligence causing death'.

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
Well I'm never sleeping again....

   My thoughts exactly.

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 6):
What makes someone want such a dangerous animal?

A nice dog or cat, or some manageable fish, just aren't good enough for some people. I don't get it either...
Flying refined.
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 3:55 am

This really pisses me off!
I HATE snakes and I have no respect for people that buy these as pets - same for vicious put bull and rottweiler dog owners.
This shop should be shut down and the store owner should be held responsible for this.
Bring back the Concorde
 
YYZatcboy
Posts: 1183
Joined: Fri Apr 22, 2005 2:15 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 4:50 am

Quoting superfly (Reply 8):
I HATE snakes and I have no respect for people that buy these as pets - same for vicious put bull and rottweiler dog owners.

So because you PERSONALLY hate snakes, everyone else in the world who disagrees with you is worthy of your contempt and their opinion and experience is invalidated by your bias, is that right? And your opinion is magically more important than other people's freedom of choice?

I am not a fan of snakes, but I totally understand why some people like them and want them as pets. If you are a responsible pet owner then you should be allowed to have whatever pet you reasonably want.
DH1/3/4 MD11/88 L1011 A319/20/21/30/50/80 717 727 735/6/7/8/9 744 762/3 77E/W 788/789 E40/75/90 CRJ/700/705 CC150
J/S DH8D 736/7/8 763
 
jetblueguy22
Posts: 3404
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:26 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:01 am

Quoting YYZatcboy (Reply 9):
So because you PERSONALLY hate snakes, everyone else in the world who disagrees with you is worthy of your contempt and their opinion and experience is invalidated by your bias, is that right? And your opinion is magically more important than other people's freedom of choice?

I think he meant more along the lines of venomous snakes.

What a horrible tragedy. I can't understand the desire to have dangerous animals around. I don't want to wake up in the middle of the night staring down a pet I take care of getting ready to kill me. Stick with a pet store snake if you are really into them. I'd rather a dog, but hey maybe I'm just a big chicken.
Pat
Look at sweatpants guy. This is a 90 million dollar aircraft, not a Tallahassee strip club
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:02 am

Quoting YYZatcboy (Reply 9):
So because you PERSONALLY hate snakes, everyone else in the world who disagrees with you is worthy of your contempt and their opinion and experience is invalidated by your bias, is that right? And your opinion is magically more important than other people's freedom of choice?

Nope.
Not what I said.
I have no respect for people that buy these as pets. This incident is a reason why.

Quoting YYZatcboy (Reply 9):
If you are a responsible pet owner then you should be allowed to have whatever pet you reasonably want.

A 'responsible' pet owner wouldn't have such an animal in a shared living space such as an apartment or flat.
If you're way out in the country in your own home, then fine.
Bring back the Concorde
 
AR385
Posts: 6935
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:25 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:10 am

Quoting YYZatcboy (Reply 9):
I am not a fan of snakes, but I totally understand why some people like them and want them as pets. If you are a responsible pet owner then you should be allowed to have whatever pet you reasonably want.

I believe that having a "pet" that is not a domesticated animal means extra-caution, responsibility and a willingness to be extra careful. Most people who have non-domesticated animals as pets are not like that. Thus, I believe, non-domesticated animals should be banned as pets. They belong in the wild or in the zoo.
 
User avatar
pvjin
Posts: 3586
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:52 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:25 am

Quoting superfly (Reply 11):
I have no respect for people that buy these as pets. This incident is a reason why.

I hope you don't respect most dog owners either, after all dogs cause way more deaths than most of different dangerous wild animals on planet earth, I don't really think that's limited to certain breeds either. Also unlike beautifully quiet snakes they often harass innocent people by barking all the time.

I think having a Vipera berus living on my backyard would be nice, it's annoying how some people kill those relatively harmless mildly poisonous snakes whenever seeing one.
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
WestJet747
Posts: 1950
Joined: Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:43 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:37 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 12):
Thus, I believe, non-domesticated animals should be banned as pets. They belong in the wild or in the zoo.

The problem is that these laws exist to an extent in Canada but are are broken regularly. I don't believe pythons are covered under any of those statutes unforunately, so it wouldn't have made a difference in this case (legally speaking).

http://www.animallaw.ca/index.php/wildlife

Quoting pvjin (Reply 13):
after all dogs cause way more deaths than most of different dangerous wild animals on planet earth

Nope. Far from it: http://www.mnn.com/earth-matters/ani...ore-likely-to-kill-you-than-sharks

Quoting pvjin (Reply 13):
mildly poisonous

Mildly poisonous is too poisonous in my opinion.
Flying refined.
 
User avatar
pvjin
Posts: 3586
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:52 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:49 am

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 14):
Mildly poisonous is too poisonous in my opinion.

Not in my opinion as it really isn't enough to kill or even bring healthy adult into hospital unless one has an allergy of some sort towards its poison. Though I can understand why people kill them when they see one near their house, however some idiots kill them if they happen to encounter one in our huge forest areas where they don't really cause any harm to anybody.

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 14):
Nope. Far from it: http://www.mnn.com/earth-matters/ani...harks

That just says how many are killed in the US by dogs, I could imagine in many less developed countries with a lot of stray dogs around number would be a lot higher. In any case,they kill way more than bears, wolves, lions etc, so yes, they kill way more than most wild animals. Mosquitoes and hippos are of course some of the very few exceptions.

[Edited 2013-08-05 22:51:48]
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:05 am

Quoting pvjin (Reply 13):
I hope you don't respect most dog owners either, after all dogs cause way more deaths than most of different dangerous wild animals on planet earth,

Well dogs as pets are far more common than snakes.

Quoting pvjin (Reply 13):
beautifully quiet snakes

Snake and beautiful shouldn't be in the same sentence.

Quoting pvjin (Reply 15):
I could imagine in many less developed countries with a lot of stray dogs around number would be a lot higher.

Not really. Lots of stray soi dogs here in Thailand. Most are harmless. They're deadly when they jump out in front of you while on a motorcycle causing the front wheel to loose control and the rider(s) are injured severely and sometimes death due to no helmet.

Quoting jetblueguy22 (Reply 10):
maybe I'm just a big chicken.

Those are better pets than snakes and they taste better too.
Bring back the Concorde
 
jetblueguy22
Posts: 3404
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:26 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:11 am

Quoting pvjin (Reply 13):
I hope you don't respect most dog owners either, after all dogs cause way more deaths than most of different dangerous wild animals on planet earth, I don't really think that's limited to certain breeds either. Also unlike beautifully quiet snakes they often harass innocent people by barking all the time.

I think the difference, at least in my opinion, is that mean dogs are usually trained to be that way. When a venomous snake bites it shouldn't really come as a surprise as that is their defense mechanism.

Quoting pvjin (Reply 15):
Not in my opinion as it really isn't enough to kill or even bring healthy adult into hospital unless one has an allergy of some sort towards its poison. Though I can understand why people kill them when they see one near their house, however some idiots kill them if they happen to encounter one in our huge forest areas where they don't really cause any harm to anybody.

I think the problem becomes though how do you know whether someone is allergic? It's not like snake bites are all that common. At least where I grew up. This is one time where I think airing on the side of caution is a good idea. But I agree just killing it because you see one is outrageous. If it becomes a threat okay, but because it is living and breathing is just wrong. And that is from someone who despises snakes. Though I'd probably be in the next state before it had a chance to stare me down. I'd give the concorde a run for it's money speed wise.

Quoting superfly (Reply 16):
Those are better pets than snakes and they taste better too.

Never had snake, though I love me some of the Colonel's extra crispy   .
Pat
Look at sweatpants guy. This is a 90 million dollar aircraft, not a Tallahassee strip club
 
Mir
Posts: 19491
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:55 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:35 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 4):
Well I'm never sleeping again....

No problem, just close your door.

Oh wait: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sItmJMFpmPs

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
jetblueguy22
Posts: 3404
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 12:26 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:44 am

Quoting Mir (Reply 18):
No problem, just close your door.

Well so much for sleep tonight. Thanks Mir!
Pat
Look at sweatpants guy. This is a 90 million dollar aircraft, not a Tallahassee strip club
 
L410Turbolet
Posts: 6218
Joined: Wed May 05, 2004 9:12 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:39 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 6):
What makes someone want such a dangerous animal?

Same question could be asked for those pitbulls, mastifs and the rest of

Quoting YYZatcboy (Reply 9):
And your opinion is magically more important than other people's freedom of choice?

He just expressed his opinion, nothing else. On the other hand, often than not, the logic of the so called "pet lovers" is that their freedom of choice should trump everything else, even other people's freedoms and most of all common sense.
 
romeobravo
Posts: 1440
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:37 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:33 am

Something doesn't add up here. I presume it was a Burmese Python.

These snakes are extremely docile. They're not like foxes that'll kill everything in their path, snakes avoid fights at all costs. If you piss them off and you're careless they can kill you yes.

It could have been that the snake saw the heat signature of a small mammal and attempted to eat one of them, i would have thought that would have woken up the other lad though....It doesn't sound likely.

There's more to this story...
 
User avatar
fr8mech
Posts: 7952
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 9:00 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:34 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 1):
Somebody ought to go to jail for this.


If some sort of negligence can be proved.

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 2):
The owner has to live with this forever, apart from anything else.


HOw the owner mentally deals with this is of no concern...if he was negligent, he should be held responsible.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 3):
I guess this explains the hunger of the snake.


It explains nothing. You're jumping to conclusions. Pet stores are routinely targeted by animal rights groups, just because they exist.

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 6):
obviously caused by carelessness


Not obvious at all. Do you have some information we don't?

Quoting superfly (Reply 8):
I HATE snakes


In my opinion, snakes are worthy of an intentional discharge from a firearm. In fact, should I tread out into the woods, I load my .38 with 'snake load'.

Quoting superfly (Reply 8):
same for vicious put bull and rottweiler dog owners.


I've been around these 'viscious' dogs all my life. Absent some mental defect, a dog is viscious because its owner makes him that way. Heck, the wife and I are considering a Rottweiler puppy for the kids.
When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
Unless it's expressly prohibited, it's allowed.
You are not entitled to a public safe space.
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:00 am

Quoting Fr8mech (Reply 22):
a dog is viscious because its owner makes him that way.

We all know that already. Jerks that want a vicious dog buy pit bulls and rottweilers because they are much more powerful and vicious than training a Yorkshire terrier or Jack Russell terrier to be vicious.

Quoting Fr8mech (Reply 22):
Not obvious at all. Do you have some information we don't?

It's very obvious.
Having a large python in a shared living space with other tenants is irresponsible.
Those belong in their native habitat in the wild or in a zoo.
If someone has one in their home, they should live out in the country in their own home. A pet store with apartments above should not be allowed to sale snakes. Those should only be sold in stand alone pet stores that doesn't share a wall with other business or residential units.

[Edited 2013-08-06 03:22:15]
Bring back the Concorde
 
connies4ever
Posts: 3393
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:54 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:21 am

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 6):
A sickening incident, obviously caused by carelessness.

Not obvious. Snakes are well-known to be very capable of wiggling out of seemingly 'secure' enclosures.

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 7):
Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 6):
What makes someone want such a dangerous animal?

A nice dog or cat, or some manageable fish, just aren't good enough for some people. I don't get it either...

There is a subset of people who apparently get some sort of buzz from having a tiger or lion or bear as a pet. But i just don't understand this mentality. There is an A.net member (can't remember handle) who has 2 Serval cats. Beautiful creatures, but they are wild. Wouldn't want anything larger than that in m y house.

Quoting superfly (Reply 8):
I HATE snakes and I have no respect for people that buy these as pets - same for vicious put bull and rottweiler dog owners.

Garter snakes ? As for dogs, they're not naturally vicious. Lady that worked for me in Manitoba bred rotties. These guys were pussycats. My cousin Chris had a pitbull-cross rescue dog, you could take a bone right out of its' mouth. Neat dog, lived to be 21.

Quoting pvjin (Reply 13):
I hope you don't respect most dog owners either, after all dogs cause way more deaths than most of different dangerous wild animals on planet earth, I don't really think that's limited to certain breeds either.

Where I grew up, in Winnipeg, Manitoba, there are 2 large deer herds within city limits. It seemed late every winter packs of dogs would run white tails to death in the snow, as the deer were more or less out of gas by late March/early April. Then eat part of the deer, then go home, to play with the kids. You'll never look at Fido the same way.

Quoting jetblueguy22 (Reply 17):
I think the difference, at least in my opinion, is that mean dogs are usually trained to be that way.

Quite.

Quoting superfly (Reply 23):
We all know that already. Jerks that want a vicious dog buy pit bulls and rottweilers because they are much more powerful and vicious than training a Yorkshire terrier or Jack Russell terrier to be vicious.

More powerful yes, naturally vicious, no. And more kids are bitten per capita by Jack Russells than any other breed. They were bred to be ratters in the barn, so the on/off switch for attack mode is a fine line. One that children cross without knowing. I would say to JR owners, never leave your children alone with the beast.

Actually, after a large dog mauls somebody, I'd vote for having the owner get the needle than the dog.

I've got a springer spaniel, and, although Snert is only 35 pounds (not fully grown), when he gets walked he's in a harness. Safer for him, safer for others. I should put up some pics of him.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
kiwiinoz
Posts: 2000
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:07 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:41 am

I am going to go out on a limb he and confess a hunch. I think there is an element to this story that is yet to come out that is more sinister.

I could be wrong and as I said, just a hunch, but the facts as stated don't seem likely, in my opinion

They were having a sleepover at this guys house but there wasn't another child mentioned
These snakes strangle to eat. They rarely attempt something bigger than they can swallow, (which a 7 year old would be for a 4 meter python)
Why didn't it attempt to eat the first child before strangling the second?
They can squeeze the air out of you pretty quickly, but it still seems more likely than not that one of them would have been able to raise an alarm

Now, each of the above doubts can probably be explained. But collectively, sounds fishy

[Edited 2013-08-06 04:50:04]
 
smittyone
Posts: 1336
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:55 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:49 am

Quoting superfly (Reply 16):
Those are better pets than snakes and they taste better too.

Fiercely loyal...until they see the menu.

Quoting RomeoBravo (Reply 21):
Something doesn't add up here. I presume it was a Burmese Python.

These snakes are extremely docile. They're not like foxes that'll kill everything in their path, snakes avoid fights at all costs. If you piss them off and you're careless they can kill you yes.

It could have been that the snake saw the heat signature of a small mammal and attempted to eat one of them, i would have thought that would have woken up the other lad though....It doesn't sound likely.

There's more to this story...

Agreed. Maybe I'm mistaken but these large snakes strangle things so that they can eat them. I don't see why it would have killed both kids...unless it killed the older (larger) child, realized it could not eat him, then went after the other one.

I obviously don't have the facts but it wouldn't shock me to find out this was murder of the two-legged variety being blamed on the snake.
 
connies4ever
Posts: 3393
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:54 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:14 pm

Quoting Smittyone (Reply 26):
Quoting RomeoBravo (Reply 21):
Something doesn't add up here. I presume it was a Burmese Python.

African rock python, actually.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:19 pm

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 24):
More powerful yes, naturally vicious, no

...and therefore pit bulls and rottweilers are the dog of choice among thugs and other low-lifes. The combination of it's power and trained viciousness is what makes those breeds the dog of choice among those kinds of people.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 24):
And more kids are bitten per capita by Jack Russells than any other breed.

Actually the breeds that bite the most are Poodles, Pomeranians, and Chihuahuas. Those bites aren't serious. I was once bit on my big toe by a Yorkshire Terrier. It didn't even puncture my skin.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 24):
Actually, after a large dog mauls somebody, I'd vote for having the owner get the needle than the dog.

I would agree but good luck finding the owner. Often times in rough inner-cities, some of them are stray. They were offspring of an owner's dog or just simply abandoned. I don't think there is a electronic paw print database to keep track of dogs and traced back to owners.

Quoting Smittyone (Reply 26):
Agreed. Maybe I'm mistaken but these large snakes strangle things so that they can eat them. I don't see why it would have killed both kids...unless it killed the older (larger) child, realized it could not eat him, then went after the other one.

7 years old seems to be a bit too big for a large snake to go after. I thought snakes only attack humans when they feel threatened. Tow sleeping kids can't be of any threat.
Bring back the Concorde
 
smittyone
Posts: 1336
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:55 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:21 pm

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 27):
African rock python, actually.

LOL I just had a Monty Python "African vs. European Swallow" moment.

That's a pretty damned substantial snake then.
 
romeobravo
Posts: 1440
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:37 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:43 pm

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 27):
African rock python, actually.

Yeah so i hear.

They don't make good pets, hard to tame and can have relapses out of nowhere.

They can also swallow very large prey, as this video demonstrates.

This story still doesn't add up though. "Strangling" (of course snakes don't strangle they constrict) a boy and then moving on to the next is something a snake is very unlikely to do.
 
User avatar
zkojq
Posts: 4251
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2011 12:42 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 2:14 pm

Don't most ventilation systems have grates at both ends? Or are these snakes strong enough to break through them.

Quoting WarRI1 (Reply 6):
What makes someone want such a dangerous animal?

I wonder this myself. What possible practical function can owning a snake have? Even if one finds them 'cute', the majority of people (particularly females) find them repulsive. At least large, angry dogs (which I usually have a healthy dislike for) can be trained to herd livestock, or at the very least alert their owner as to when an intruder (welcome or not) enters the home. Snakes on the other hand are useless, unless one considers scaring the living daylights out of many visitors to somehow be beneficial.

Quoting Mir (Reply 18):
No problem, just close your door.

Oh wait: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sItmJ...FpmPs

      Thanks for the nightmares.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 24):
Snakes are well-known to be very capable of wiggling out of seemingly 'secure' enclosures.


Which seems like a great reason not to have one.

Quoting YYZatcboy (Reply 9):
And your opinion is magically more important than other people's freedom of choice?

So my neighbours should have the freedom to own a hippo/crocodile/rhino/bear if they so desire?

Quoting Smittyone (Reply 26):
I obviously don't have the facts but it wouldn't shock me to find out this was murder of the two-legged variety being blamed on the snake.

A human would struggle to produce 'snake like' strangulation marks on the person they were trying to kill, wouldn't they?
First to fly the 787-9
 
WestJet747
Posts: 1950
Joined: Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:43 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 3:06 pm

Quoting pvjin (Reply 15):
Not in my opinion as it really isn't enough to kill or even bring healthy adult into hospital unless one has an allergy of some sort towards its poison.

The snake you mentioned sends 12% of bite victims to the hospital, according to Wikipedia. That's a high enough number that I would want nothing to do with anybody who keeps one.

Quoting pvjin (Reply 15):
That just says how many are killed in the US by dogs, I could imagine in many less developed countries with a lot of stray dogs around number would be a lot higher. In any case,they kill way more than bears, wolves, lions etc, so yes, they kill way more than most wild animals. Mosquitoes and hippos are of course some of the very few exceptions.

Even if you extrapolate the data, dogs still don't kill more than all other wild animals put together.

Quoting superfly (Reply 16):
Lots of stray soi dogs here in Thailand. Most are harmless.

I did some backpacking through Thailand and all the stray dogs I came across couldn't be bothered with me unless I had food.

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 20):
Same question could be asked for those pitbulls, mastifs and the rest of

Those breeds aren't naturally dangerous.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 24):
more kids are bitten per capita by Jack Russells than any other breed.

I believe the breed responsible for the most reported bites in North America is the Golden Retriever.

Quoting kiwiinoz (Reply 25):
They rarely attempt something bigger than they can swallow, (which a 7 year old would be for a 4 meter python)

If you Google it, it appears that an African Rock Python is very much capable of swallowing an average 7-year old.
Flying refined.
 
User avatar
fr8mech
Posts: 7952
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 9:00 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 3:36 pm

Quoting superfly (Reply 23):
Jerks that want a vicious dog buy pit bulls and rottweilers because they are much more powerful and vicious than training a Yorkshire terrier or Jack Russell terrier to be vicious.

Power, size or strength does not equate to viciousness and viciousness is not related to size.

Quoting superfly (Reply 23):
It's very obvious.
Having a large python in a shared living space with other tenants is irresponsible.

Not if the snake is properly contained.

Quoting superfly (Reply 23):
A pet store with apartments above should not be allowed to sale snakes.

What else shouldn't they be allowed to sell? If proper precautions are taken, there should not be an issue.
When seconds count...the police are minutes away.
Unless it's expressly prohibited, it's allowed.
You are not entitled to a public safe space.
Ego Bibere Capulus, Ut Aliis Sit Vivere
 
smittyone
Posts: 1336
Joined: Thu Feb 09, 2012 12:55 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 3:55 pm

Quoting zkojq (Reply 31):

A human would struggle to produce 'snake like' strangulation marks on the person they were trying to kill, wouldn't they?

Indeed. I admitted I didn't have the facts  
 
L410Turbolet
Posts: 6218
Joined: Wed May 05, 2004 9:12 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 4:14 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 32):
Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 20):
Same question could be asked for those pitbulls, mastifs and the rest of

Those breeds aren't naturally dangerous.

I am sure that's really comforting information for those parents whose kids have been victim of a (fatal) attack from these "naturally not dangerous" breeds. For the sake of not taking the discussion off-topic, let's pretend that using the term breeding with adjective "natural" is not an oxymoron to begin with  
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 4:42 pm

Quoting Fr8mech (Reply 33):
Power, size or strength does not equate to viciousness and viciousness is not related to size.

Ok now you're just being silly.
Yes there are some large dogs that are calm in docile. In fact, a St. Bernard can get bigger than a pit bull but obviously the thugs go for the pit bull because the combination of their strength and rough training makes them very intimidating.
Duh!

Quoting Fr8mech (Reply 33):
Not if the snake is properly contained.
What else shouldn't they be allowed to sell? If proper precautions are taken, there should not be an issue.

The risk is too great to place that level of responsibility with a small pet store owner. They can sale as many puppies, kittens, gold fish & gerbils as they want.
Pythons? No frikkin way!
Bring back the Concorde
 
connies4ever
Posts: 3393
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:54 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 4:50 pm

Quoting superfly (Reply 28):
Actually the breeds that bite the most are Poodles, Pomeranians, and Chihuahuas. Those bites aren't serious. I was once bit on my big toe by a Yorkshire Terrier. It didn't even puncture my skin.

Having had a poodle growing, I can attest to being nipped several times. But serious bites, no. JRs like to latch on and shake their victim as violently as possible. I should have been more precise: serious bites.

Quoting superfly (Reply 28):
7 years old seems to be a bit too big for a large snake to go after. I thought snakes only attack humans when they feel threatened. Tow sleeping kids can't be of any threat.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Python_sebae#Attacks

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 32):
Even if you extrapolate the data, dogs still don't kill more than all other wild animals put together.

Good old felix domesticus is thought to kill between 3 and 4 billion songbirds every year. Pretty good toll.

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 32):
Quoting connies4ever (Reply 24):
more kids are bitten per capita by Jack Russells than any other breed.

I believe the breed responsible for the most reported bites in North America is the Golden Retriever.

Frankly, I have a hard time believing that from the GRs I've encountered. Otherwise why would they be frequently used as service dogs ? [Side note: couple of months ago at YOW I saw a first: service poodle] I don't see any JRs as service dogs.

http://www.dogsbite.org/pdf/dog-atta...-maimings-merritt-clifton-2012.pdf might support your statement, but I see no adjustment for dog populations to normalize the numbers.

But maybe that's may own bias. What I do know is that the only creatures that fear my guy (springer spaniel) are grouse and partridge, plus the hated red squirrel.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
User avatar
pvjin
Posts: 3586
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:52 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:15 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 32):
Even if you extrapolate the data, dogs still don't kill more than all other wild animals put together.

Yeah sure if you put all the kills made by different wild animals together. What I meant is that dogs kill way more than most individual wild animal types do, like snakes and bears for example.

Quoting superfly (Reply 36):
The risk is too great to place that level of responsibility with a small pet store owner.

Well what about smaller snakes, there are plenty of small snake species that really couldn't ever kill anyone, I think selling those would be perfectly fine, it would be dumb to ban all species like you suggested.

Though to be honest events like this are so very rare that I wouldn't bother banning even pythons from animal stores like this. Maybe there should be stricter regulations with how these snakes are being kept so they simply couldn't get away from their terrarium.

I think the money it would take to prepare a law about banning certain snakes in pet shops and then enforcing it would be used way better if it was used to fight against domestic violence, something that truly is relevant matter.
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:25 pm

Quoting pvjin (Reply 38):
it would be dumb to ban all species like you suggested.

It's dumb to put words in my mouth I never said.
I never called for any bans. I said;

Quoting superfly (Reply 23):
Those should only be sold in stand alone pet stores that doesn't share a wall with other business or residential units.

Now does that sounds like I was asking for a "ban"?
Bring back the Concorde
 
User avatar
pvjin
Posts: 3586
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:52 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:31 pm

Quoting superfly (Reply 39):
Now does that sounds like I was asking for a "ban"?

This does: "A pet store with apartments above should not be allowed to sale snakes."

There's no reason to forbid selling all snake species in any kind of pet shop, even if on the other side of its wall or above there's an orphanage or a medical clinic, it could make sense only for those species that could actually cause some real danger to humans, big amount of them really can't.
"Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that." - Martin Luther King Jr
 
connies4ever
Posts: 3393
Joined: Sat Feb 25, 2006 10:54 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:38 pm

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 35):
I am sure that's really comforting information for those parents whose kids have been victim of a (fatal) attack from these "naturally not dangerous" breeds.
Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 32):
Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 20):
Same question could be asked for those pitbulls, mastifs and the rest of

Those breeds aren't naturally dangerous.

No breed is "naturally dangerous". Individual dogs can be made dangerous through conditioning.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:39 pm

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 37):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Python_sebae#Attacks

I wish I never opened that link. Now I can't sleep tonight.   

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 37):
Frankly, I have a hard time believing that from the GRs I've encountered.

Same here. Golden retrievers are pretty mellow dogs. Hence why thugs and other low-life scum pass these dogs up in favor of pit bulls and rottweilers to train for obvious reasons.

Quoting pvjin (Reply 40):
This does: "A pet store with apartments above should not be allowed to sale snakes."

That is why you need to completely read what people write before you fly off the handle. It's just setting up some restrictions, not an all out 'ban'. There are already certain restrictions for sale of all sorts of things; cigarettes, booze, fireworks, guns & ammo, etc.
Bring back the Concorde
 
WestJet747
Posts: 1950
Joined: Sat Aug 06, 2011 7:43 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:46 pm

So it turns out the snake shouldn't have been in that pet store to begin with. That species of snake is illegal to possess in the province of New Brunswick:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-br...-snake-boys-campbellton-mayor.html

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 35):
I am sure that's really comforting information for those parents whose kids have been victim of a (fatal) attack from these "naturally not dangerous" breeds. For the sake of not taking the discussion off-topic, let's pretend that using the term breeding with adjective "natural" is not an oxymoron to begin with

Nice red herring with that victims' parents comment   Dogs are not born dangerous, they are trained that way. Pit Bulls and Staffordshires have a poor reputation among the uninformed populace because they have for the past 100 years or so been used in pit fighting by criminals due to their muscular physique...yet what I'm sure you don't know is that those "dangerous" breeds also have quite an extensive history of being therapy dogs.

Quoting connies4ever (Reply 37):
Frankly, I have a hard time believing that from the GRs I've encountered. Otherwise why would they be frequently used as service dogs ?

Generally Golden Retrievers and Labs are as friendly as can be (one of my best friends has a GR and a Chocolate Lab that are really just giant babies), but I heard that the reasoning for that statistic is that those breeds are among the most common, so of course there's going to be a higher number of incidents since there are more of the type than any other dog.

Quoting superfly (Reply 42):
I wish I never opened that link. Now I can't sleep tonight.

Really? And you were able to sleep after Mir posted that video of the snake opening the door?!   
Flying refined.
 
hawaii12
Posts: 83
Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2003 8:11 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:57 pm

if you're going to take snakes out of their environment, it is the owners responsibility to feed the snakes. a snake fed as it is supposed to be would not have killed the children.
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:06 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 43):
So it turns out the snake shouldn't have been in that pet store to begin with. That species of snake is illegal to possess in the province of New Brunswick:

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-br....html

Jvjin is going to be pissed after reading that.
Bring back the Concorde
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:13 pm

Quoting WestJet747 (Reply 43):

So it turns out the snake shouldn't have been in that pet store to begin with. That species of snake is illegal to possess in the province of New Brunswick

Wow! Just yesterday I read in another thread here that banning the importation of certain species of frogs and turtles into the United States was racist. What about people whose native culture is to keep those snakes as pets? Does that make Canadians racist?
International Homo of Mystery
 
Superfly
Posts: 37705
Joined: Thu May 11, 2000 8:01 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:18 pm

Quoting AeroWesty (Reply 46):
What about people whose native culture is to keep those snakes as pets?

What culture would that be?
Which ever culture that is, they'd better stay out of New Brunswick!  

Now if someone can't tell the difference between a frog and a python, they're a special kind of stupid.
Bring back the Concorde
 
romeobravo
Posts: 1440
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 8:37 pm

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:19 pm

Quoting hawaii12 (Reply 44):

if you're going to take snakes out of their environment, it is the owners responsibility to feed the snakes. a snake fed as it is supposed to be would not have killed the children.

Bullshit, snakes don't experience hunger in the same way as humans do. The specie in question will happily go a year without food, in fact the chances are it was far better fed in captivity than it would have been in the wild. Snakes are ambush predators and rely on the odds of an animal passing by as supposed to some message from their stomach that they are getting hungry and need to go out and hunt. They will regularly go off food if stressed or during the mating period. They will starve themselves to death if stressed or ill or overeat if offered too much food. They also grow relative to their food consumption. 5 year old snakes can be juvenile size if underfed, adults never stop growing.

You're talking about a completely different metabolism and there is still more to this story.

[Edited 2013-08-06 11:20:21]
 
AeroWesty
Posts: 19551
Joined: Sat Oct 30, 2004 7:37 am

RE: Pet Snake Kills Two Children In Canada

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:23 pm

Quoting superfly (Reply 47):
What culture would that be?

Where ever those snakes are natives from, of course!

Quoting superfly (Reply 47):
Which ever culture that is, they'd better stay out of New Brunswick!

Wow! I'm sure all of the consumers of non-native frogs and turtles in California thank you for your inclusiveness.
International Homo of Mystery

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: DaProf, fsnuffer and 71 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos