Moderators: richierich, ua900, hOMSaR

 
Grisee08
Topic Author
Posts: 464
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:20 am

"If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:09 am

Why would anybody even say such a STUPID sentence? My best friend said this tonight, and it really upset me. She is not a heavy drinker, but I always thought she was just being responsible. Now, from the way she said this, it seems like it's only because she can't afford it.

I was hoping I could get some advice on how to talk to her about this. I want to let her know how much it upset and disappointed me, without her getting pissed at Me.

Any tips?
Alright Alright Alright!
 
kiwiinoz
Posts: 2000
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:07 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:22 am

Usually when people make these sort of references, they maybe dont know what an alcoholic really is. There are planty of people that drink too much that are not alcoholics.

But if she drinks a lot, and wants to drink more because she craves the numbing, "shut out the rest of life" effect that alcohol brings, then she's definitely a candidate.

You say you're her best friend. Is there any romantic history, or wishful thinking on your part? (Sorry if this offends but it's a relavant question in terms of you helping her)

Anyway, she needs professional help if she is. Friends play an important supporting role. Convince her to seek some professional help. If she cant be convinced, then more than likely, she will have to hit "rock bottom" before she convinces herself. Make sure you're there in support, even if she does everything to piss you off beforehand.
 
L410Turbolet
Posts: 6218
Joined: Wed May 05, 2004 9:12 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:28 am

Quoting Grisee08 (Thread starter):
Why would anybody even say such a STUPID sentence?
hyperbole

hy·per·bo·le
[hahy-pur-buh-lee]
noun Rhetoric
1.
obvious and intentional exaggeration.
2.
an extravagant statement or figure of speech not intended to be taken literally, as “to wait an eternity.”

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/Hyperbole
 
oly720man
Posts: 5813
Joined: Fri May 21, 2004 7:13 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:38 am

You could ask her what she thinks it means to be an alcoholic...... my ex sister in law thought you had a drink problem if you had a couple of glasses of wine occasionally, so her perception of what it actually means may not be accurate.

You could also say that she's an adult and can have her way, so what's stopping her.

Maybe it was just a bad joke. People do say stupid things sometimes.
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
Grisee08
Topic Author
Posts: 464
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:20 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:49 am

Quoting kiwiinoz (Reply 1):
Is there any romantic history, or wishful thinking on your part?

No, she's always been kind of like a sister to me.

Quoting kiwiinoz (Reply 1):
they maybe dont know what an alcoholic really is.

Her uncle was an alcoholic for 40 years, so she is well aware of what it is, and what it can do.

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 2):

I hope you are right on that

Quoting oly720man (Reply 3):
Maybe it was just a bad joke.

I hope you are right as well, but it was more than just a bad joke to me, because I've already lost one friend due to his alcoholism, and she knows all about it, so I just can't understand why she would even bring up the reference.
Alright Alright Alright!
 
kiwiinoz
Posts: 2000
Joined: Mon Oct 10, 2005 3:07 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:57 am

Quoting Grisee08 (Reply 4):
No, she's always been kind of like a sister to me.

How long have you known her?
 
Grisee08
Topic Author
Posts: 464
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:20 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:23 am

Quoting kiwiinoz (Reply 5):
How long have you known her?

About 7 years, since she was 15.   
Alright Alright Alright!
 
NoUFO
Posts: 7397
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2001 7:40 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:38 am

L410Turbolet and myself agree on something - doesn't happen very often.

What she said was: "I wish I could drink as much as I would like to. But then I would be an alcoholic. I don't want to be an alcoholic so I don't have it my way and drink reasonably."

Relax, she's probably similar to somebody who once told me that she has had an alcohol-free Thursday yesterday: "Did you know you can turn pears into juice?" I thought that was hilarious. Of course I know that basically every Thursday is alcohol-free for her.
I support the right to arm bears
 
Grisee08
Topic Author
Posts: 464
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:20 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:02 am

Quoting NoUFO (Reply 7):
"I wish I could drink as much as I would like to. But then I would be an alcoholic. I don't want to be an alcoholic so I don't have it my way and drink reasonably."

That makes sense, but the tone in which she said it just alarmed me is all. Thanks for all of your inputs. I appreciate it. I'm still debating on whether I should talk to her about it, or just leave it alone. As I said before, she is not *currently* a big drinker, but when she does drink, she won't stop until she either passes out, or throws up. In other words, once she starts, she doesn't stop at two or three. She keeps going until she's plastered. I know Alcoholism runs on her dad's side of the family (he himself is NOT an alcoholic, nor is her mother), so I guess I'm just watching for signs, and I may be taking it a little extreme, but I don't know.
Alright Alright Alright!
 
rfields5421
Posts: 6223
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 12:46 pm

Quoting Grisee08 (Thread starter):
it's only because she can't afford it.

An alcoholic doesn't let the cost of alcohol stop them from drinking. They will do anything to get alcohol when they want it. Anything necessary. I skipped buying food, for myself, for my kids. Sold things which belonged to others, etc. Drank the cheapest possible booze to make the alcohol last longer. When I had money, booze was always the first thing on my shopping list.

Quoting Grisee08 (Reply 4):
she is well aware of what it is, and what it can do.

She might have an outsider's view of what happens to an alcoholic - but she cannot understand the mental component of alcoholism. She cannot see the full range of pain, anger, despair, depression from the outside. The suicide attempts, the damage caused to loved ones.

I was lucky to get sober on Nov 21, 1984 - and stay sober since. But I've buried a lot of friends over the years who could not stay sober, seen many go to jail. Watched dozens lose families, and everything else.

I've watched friends who got sober live the final 10-20 years of their lives alone, because the damage they did while drinking made their families never want to see them again. Sober or not.

Quoting Grisee08 (Thread starter):
I want to let her know how much it upset and disappointed me, without her getting pissed at Me.

Tell her you hope that was a joke - because anyone who really believes that is very ill. Getting her pissed is better than going to her funeral.
Not all who wander are lost.
 
User avatar
casinterest
Posts: 10744
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 1:43 pm

Quoting Grisee08 (Thread starter):
Why would anybody even say such a STUPID sentence? My best friend said this tonight, and it really upset me. She is not a heavy drinker, but I always thought she was just being responsible. Now, from the way she said this, it seems like it's only because she can't afford it.

I'll be honest, having dealt with one my whole life. I think she was being sarcastic/ironic with a twist of hyperbole as L410Turbojet pointed out.

mostly for the below reason

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 9):
An alcoholic doesn't let the cost of alcohol stop them from drinking. They will do anything to get alcohol when they want it. Anything necessary. I skipped buying food, for myself, for my kids. Sold things which belonged to others, etc. Drank the cheapest possible booze to make the alcohol last longer. When I had money, booze was always the first thing on my shopping list.

Alcoholics destroy a lot of lives. She has seen the destruction and damage, and probably has been through multiple attempts to stop them from doing it, and they just don't seem to care and continue to drink with little care for the consequences.


There are consequences as rfields5421 has pointed out, but the alcoholics let the alcohol win in most battles.



Your friend is not an alcoholic. She also feels empathy and acknowledgement of the consequences.

The real question for you and your friend is the following.
What is bothering her so much, that she wishes she could hide away in a bottle with no consequences?
She is probably fighting some tough times. Find out more and support her.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
User avatar
Tugger
Posts: 10163
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:38 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 3:29 pm

Quoting Grisee08 (Thread starter):
Why would anybody even say such a STUPID sentence?

There is something bad that she wishes she could forget in the dullness and oblivion that being an alcoholic can be. Many alcoholics start on the path because they want to forget, sometimes it is just stress other times it is traumatic events in their life. And alcohol in excess can make one just not care and some want that comforting blanket of not caring and forgetting.

Perhaps your friend is this way. She really wishes she could just be drunk and be oblivious and forget whatever it is that she has in her. But she has a life and she leads it and she can't do that (which is a good thing).

I mean the song "Margaritaville" can sure sound like a great life: no worries, have friends and fun, and the biggest problem is stepping on something and ruining your flip flop. Why not like that if there are terrible things in your life that you want to forget (besides that fact that is is an empty and wasted life, if you are not hurting anyone else why not)?

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
trav110
Posts: 553
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:49 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 4:03 pm

Quoting Grisee08 (Reply 8):
As I said before, she is not *currently* a big drinker, but when she does drink, she won't stop until she either passes out, or throws up. In other words, once she starts, she doesn't stop at two or three. She keeps going until she's plastered. I know Alcoholism runs on her dad's side of the family (he himself is NOT an alcoholic, nor is her mother), so I guess I'm just watching for signs, and I may be taking it a little extreme, but I don't know.

You're right to be concerned. Someone doesn't have to drink often to be an alcoholic- and drinking to blackouts every time you drink is a HUGE warning sign. Alcoholism can and does skip generations, and to me it sounds like she may be in the beginning stages of it. All you can do is to voice your concern- you are otherwise powerless over the situation. Nothing you do or say will make her stop, and if she decides to continue down that road all you can do is stand on the sidelines- it has to be her decision to quit.
 
trav110
Posts: 553
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:49 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 4:08 pm

Quoting tugger (Reply 11):
Why not like that if there are terrible things in your life that you want to forget (besides that fact that is is an empty and wasted life, if you are not hurting anyone else why not)?

Because that is not alcoholism. Alcoholics drink regardless of the detriment to themselves, their families, and the public. Alcoholics black out often, injure themselves drunk, drive drunk, make complete asses of themselves, their alcoholism destroys their family, their career, and their health until there is nothing left. There is nothing boring or mundane about alcoholism, it is absolute hell day in and day out.
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12546
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:14 pm

My guess would be as L410Turbolet stated:

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 2):
Quoting Grisee08 (Thread starter):
Why would anybody even say such a STUPID sentence?
hyperbole
Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 9):
An alcoholic doesn't let the cost of alcohol stop them from drinking. They will do anything to get alcohol when they want it. Anything necessary. I skipped buying food, for myself, for my kids. Sold things which belonged to others, etc. Drank the cheapest possible booze to make the alcohol last longer. When I had money, booze was always the first thing on my shopping list.

   Didn't have kids or a wife, luckily, but alcohol was certainly the most important component of my life for awhile. Had to start over from $0.00 a couple times.

Quoting casinterest (Reply 10):
Your friend is not an alcoholic.

You really can't draw that conclusion from the info posted. Especially since:

Quoting trav110 (Reply 12):
Someone doesn't have to drink often to be an alcoholic- and drinking to blackouts every time you drink is a HUGE warning sign.

   But again, we don't know whether she is or not. But it's certainly not a good sign if someone can't - or doesn't want to - stop drinking when they start.

Quoting trav110 (Reply 13):
Alcoholics black out often, injure themselves drunk, drive drunk, make complete asses of themselves, their alcoholism destroys their family, their career, and their health until there is nothing left. There is nothing boring or mundane about alcoholism, it is absolute hell day in and day out.

Yes and no. It certainly destroyed my life, greatly affected my family and school/career. But I didn't black out often, almost never injured myself, didn't make an ass of myself all that often, and luckily I stopped before I had seriously affected my long-term health (well, hopefully...). Alcoholics/addicts come in all shapes and forms; the thing we have in common is the mentality and/or physical addiction.
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
User avatar
casinterest
Posts: 10744
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 5:18 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 14):
You really can't draw that conclusion from the info posted. Especially since:

You are right, I missed post 8 .

It is a warning sign, but her awareness of it leaves room for intervention. Cost is never an object for Alcoholics.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
User avatar
Tugger
Posts: 10163
Joined: Tue Apr 18, 2006 8:38 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 6:10 pm

Quoting trav110 (Reply 13):
Because that is not alcoholism. Alcoholics drink regardless of the detriment to themselves, their families, and the public. Alcoholics black out often, injure themselves drunk, drive drunk, make complete asses of themselves, their alcoholism destroys their family, their career, and their health until there is nothing left. There is nothing boring or mundane about alcoholism, it is absolute hell day in and day out.

Actually I (sadly) know quite a few functional alcoholics. And yes they are functional, they get up and go to work every day, earn a good paycheck, have friends, are nice people..... but they can't stop drinking and they keep drinking and they have one... a few..... or more when they get home, and often drink all weekend. And I don't know if they drink at work much but I am sure one of them does have a couple at least while they are at work (you know that distinct "I just rinsed my mouth with mouth wash for some random reason... " smell on their breath). But they don't black out, they just drink and end up drunk and happily they are happy drunks (those are the acceptable kind you know). My roommate at ERAU was like this too, but he wouldn't drink in the morning and kept sober for flying etc. But twelve packs were consumed daily. And today he is doing fine, job flying, kids, wife, house the whole nine yards. But when I visit him he still drinks... a lot.

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 14):
Yes and no. It certainly destroyed my life, greatly affected my family and school/career. But I didn't black out often, almost never injured myself, didn't make an ass of myself all that often, and luckily I stopped before I had seriously affected my long-term health (well, hopefully...). Alcoholics/addicts come in all shapes and forms; the thing we have in common is the mentality and/or physical addiction.

Congratulations on understanding yourself and taking control, not an easy thing to do.

Tugg
I don’t know that I am unafraid to be myself, but it is hard to be somebody else. - W. Shatner
There are many kinds of sentences that we think state facts about the world but that are really just expressions of our attitudes. - F. Ramsey
 
Grisee08
Topic Author
Posts: 464
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:20 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:22 pm

Quoting casinterest (Reply 10):
She is probably fighting some tough times. Find out more and support her.

Money problems is her biggest concern actually. She is married, and I know her husband quite well, a good guy, but not too bright when it comes to warning signs. I think I am going to talk to her.
Alright Alright Alright!
 
cptkrell
Posts: 3186
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2001 10:50 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:15 pm

Quoting tugger (Reply 16):

Tugger; pretty good post.

I might only add (after a little bit of experience at age 70) that I have noticed that there is a difference between a person that WANTS to drink (various circumstances: parties, old friends, debriefings, etc) and a person that NEEDS to drink (irrespective of current, impending or imagined circumstances). There is also, in my opinion, a third difference with a person that simply wants to "zone out" via alcohol (or other substances).

I am not a real big fan of professional counseling, unless as a last resort; but do believe that a real friendship one-on-one conversation would be a tremendous positive key.

I have not mentioned any heredetary aspect. This is only because I think the jury is out on this. A year or so ago I watched a documentary that purported the results of exhaustive studies showed that alcoholism yes, can be classified as a disease, but there is no imperical evidence that shows it is hereditary. I dunno. Best wishes and kind regards...jack
all best; jack
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12546
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 9:47 pm

Quoting tugger (Reply 16):
Congratulations on understanding yourself and taking control, not an easy thing to do.

Thanks, much appreciated.

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 18):
I am not a real big fan of professional counseling, unless as a last resort; but do believe that a real friendship one-on-one conversation would be a tremendous positive key.

It's another valid issue - what works for one addict may not work for another. I've never gotten much out of professional counseling, in part because I have no issue being completely honest. After a few appointments, I had pretty much laid it all on the table.

I did get quite a bit from AA meetings, however, and from the support of friends and family. I'll also tune into that A&E show "Intervention" or something along those lines every once in awhile. That helps me keep things in perspective.

Perhaps the most important thing is what kiwiinoz stated:

Quoting kiwiinoz (Reply 1):
If she cant be convinced, then more than likely, she will have to hit "rock bottom" before she convinces herself.

You have to want to change yourself. You really can't do it for other people primarily.
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
trav110
Posts: 553
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:49 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:10 pm

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 14):
Yes and no. It certainly destroyed my life

Fair enough- alcoholism affects everyone differently, I just threw out a few common occurrences.

Also, congratulations on being sober.

Quoting tugger (Reply 16):
Actually I (sadly) know quite a few functional alcoholics. And yes they are functional, they get up and go to work every day, earn a good paycheck, have friends, are nice people..... but they can't stop drinking and they keep drinking and they have one... a few..... or more when they get home, and often drink all weekend.

I don't think there is such thing as a functional alcoholic. Just making good money and having friends doesn't matter a bit when you are addicted. You either are or you aren't. Addicts like to portray an image of themselves as having it all together (which I used to do) while their alcoholism steadily progressing, but if those people are at the point where they can't make it through the day without drinking at work hey have a serious problem that will only get worse if they don't take it upon themselves to get clean. They haven't lost their job or their friends or their friendly attitudes - yet.
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12546
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:28 pm

Quoting trav110 (Reply 20):
I don't think there is such thing as a functional alcoholic. Just making good money and having friends doesn't matter a bit when you are addicted. You either are or you aren't. Addicts like to portray an image of themselves as having it all together (which I used to do) while their alcoholism steadily progressing, but if those people are at the point where they can't make it through the day without drinking at work hey have a serious problem that will only get worse if they don't take it upon themselves to get clean. They haven't lost their job or their friends or their friendly attitudes - yet.

You're absolutely right in one sense. I think "functional alcoholic" is simply a way to differentiate between those who still manage to have some semblance of a "normal" life - job, family, whatever - and those who don't.

But yeah, if I had to describe myself, I'd say I was a functional alcoholic....until I wasn't a functional alcoholic anymore. And I didn't admit to it until I absolutely had to.
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
AR385
Posts: 6935
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2003 8:25 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:34 pm

Quoting Grisee08 (Thread starter):
I was hoping I could get some advice on how to talk to her about this. I want to let her know how much it upset and disappointed me, without her getting pissed at Me.

Why did it disappoint you so much?

Quoting kiwiinoz (Reply 1):
Anyway, she needs professional help if she is. Friends play an important supporting role. Convince her to seek some professional help.

AA is the best resource out there. If you believe she has a problem, offer to accompany her to a few meetings.

Quoting L410Turbolet (Reply 2):
hy·per·bo·le
[hahy-pur-buh-lee]
noun Rhetoric
1.
obvious and intentional exaggeration.
2.
an extravagant statement or figure of speech not intended to be taken literally, as “to wait an eternity.”

Hopefully L410Turbolet

Quoting Grisee08 (Reply 8):
As I said before, she is not *currently* a big drinker, but when she does drink, she won't stop until she either passes out, or throws up. In other words, once she starts, she doesn't stop at two or three. She keeps going until she's plastered. I know Alcoholism runs on her dad's side of the family (he himself is NOT an alcoholic, nor is her mother), so I guess I'm just watching for signs, and I may be taking it a little extreme, but I don't know.

While those behaviors are not restricted to alcoholics you´ve just described a person that has trouble with alcohol. The key being that she does not stop. The question is: Does she not stop or she CAN´T stop?

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 9):
An alcoholic doesn't let the cost of alcohol stop them from drinking. They will do anything to get alcohol when they want it. Anything necessary. I skipped buying food, for myself, for my kids. Sold things which belonged to others, etc. Drank the cheapest possible booze to make the alcohol last longer. When I had money, booze was always the first thing on my shopping list.

As a an alcoholic myself, sober since 2007, You just described my life from 2001 to 2006. I did all of those things and some others that I sometimes still cry at night when I think about them. Making amends helped, and most people were understanding but others had been hurt too much. I lost so many things and wasted so much time. Thankfully that´s in the past, but it was not easy.

I can understand how it would be upsetting to hear someone say what the OP heard.
 
trav110
Posts: 553
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 2:49 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 10:45 pm

Quoting Grisee08 (Thread starter):
I want to let her know how much it upset and disappointed me, without her getting pissed at Me.

Hate to say it but this is not about you, if you're disappointed then that's your problem and you deal with it. Your friend seems to be crying for help in subtle ways and may need support from friends or family to help her make the right decision. Saying that you're disappointed will probably push her further into her alcoholism- she needs help, not to be lectured.
 
Grisee08
Topic Author
Posts: 464
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:20 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:07 pm

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 18):

Well, I chickened out on talking to her.. she seems to be in kind of a crappy mood. However, I do have a bit of good news. I DO have alcoholic beverages in my fridge, and each time she wants something to drink at my house, she always asks for milk, or soda. NEVER for booze.

I want to think, and she's even mentioned about her uncle, that she knows what the repercussions are of alcoholism, and I think that it might be trying to tug at her, and she's trying her hardest to resist. I just hope that her husband, and I can help her be successful in resisting.

I already lost one friend (he didn't die, I just let him go because he REFUSED over a period of 5 years to NOT get help, and I gave him a final ultimatum. Get help, or lose a friend. He chose the booze, but the last words I said to him were "If you choose to get help, I'll stand behind you. Until then, leave me alone."

This girl, however, is a better friend than the dude ever was. So, I don't want to lose her to alcoholism. I really do not know if she is at high or low risk, and I just would like to hope that I could catch it early enough to help her before it got out of hand unlike my other friend. With the other friend, I did not have any idea of the warning signs, and by the time I figured it out, his drinking had already got out of control.
Alright Alright Alright!
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12546
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Tue Aug 06, 2013 11:23 pm

Quoting Grisee08 (Reply 24):

Well, I chickened out on talking to her.. she seems to be in kind of a crappy mood. However, I do have a bit of good news. I DO have alcoholic beverages in my fridge, and each time she wants something to drink at my house, she always asks for milk, or soda. NEVER for booze.

This alone doesn't necessarily mean anything. There were plenty of people around whom I wouldn't drink.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):
sober since 2007

Congrats. And like you, I too have moments where I'm driven to tears over what I have done. But thankfully, they happen less and less as time goes on. I used to also have dreams that I was drinking again, and trying to hide it from my parents or whomever; those were about the closest to nightmares I'll ever have. But those have dissipated over time as well. Can't remember the last time I had one.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):
The question is: Does she not stop or she CAN´T stop?

True. Unfortunately, us alcoholics are great at saying "oh, I can stop anytime I want to, but I just don't want to". I'm not sure I knew the difference for a long time.  
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
rfields5421
Posts: 6223
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:15 am

Quoting trav110 (Reply 13):
Alcoholics black out often,

Over the past near 30 years, I've seen well over a thousand people come in the doors of AA. In today's world, the number who have blackouts is declining.

Now, I was a blackout drinker. From my first drunk at age 17 in 1970. But I know people who have drank for 30 years, destroyed their body, their lives, their families - and never had a blackout. I see a lot of younger people - ages 14-16 - who have only had one or two blackouts coming to AA over the last 10 years.

The one thing I've learned over the years is that there is not any exact behavior which identifies an alcoholic. Most of us do have similar patterns, behaviors and issues. But there are enough folks who 'skip' one part of the puzzle.

I personally drank very little over the 14 years of my drinking career. I went long periods of time without taking a drink - six months or more on several occasions. But when I had access to alcohol - and could 'get away' with drinking - I always drank myself into sickness over several weeks, a few months. I poisoned myself with alcohol until I had to stop to survive. I could never drink in moderation for more than a couple days at the start of a bing. And while I was dry, I continued alcoholic behavior. I continued to destroy the lives of those close to me.

Quoting tugger (Reply 16):
know quite a few functional alcoholics

Many to most alcoholics go through a functional stage. I was able to do that by not drinking for weeks/ months at a time. I was a fantastic worker, I always did everything I could to make my boss happy. Because I knew without a doubt at some point I would get drunk again - and need his help to keep my job/ stay in the US Navy.

The key to getting sober, and staying sober - is to not pick out the differences between oneself and other drunks - but to identify the similar elements. To see what we have in common.

At some point, most alcoholics hear every part of their story out of the mouths of another drunk describing his/ her story.

Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):
sober since 2007
Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 14):
luckily I stopped

Congratulations.

ODAAT
Not all who wander are lost.
 
Grisee08
Topic Author
Posts: 464
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:20 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:18 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):
Why did it disappoint you so much?

She is my best friend, like a sister to me. Why WOULDN'T it disappoint me?

Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):
Does she not stop or she CAN´T stop?

I can't answer this one...yet, but I think that it is more like she doesn't WANT to stop once she's started.

As I've said plenty of times, she does not drink often, but given her family history, it worried me when she said that.
Alright Alright Alright!
 
cptkrell
Posts: 3186
Joined: Sun Sep 23, 2001 10:50 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 12:35 am

Well, all good posts muchly. Like I said in my Rep#18, I believe there are folks that WANT to drink and folks that NEED to drink. The former type usually has a better success rate at controlling or eliminating alcohol intake mentally and the latter will usually have a more difficult time physically (this is my opinion only; I am not a medical guy).

Just a piece of observation from an old guy...maybe food for thought? Wish ya'll the best. If not modified, the situation can lead to devasting results as I believe we all know. ball best...jack
all best; jack
 
vikkyvik
Posts: 12546
Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2003 1:58 pm

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 3:42 am

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 26):

The key to getting sober, and staying sober - is to not pick out the differences between oneself and other drunks - but to identify the similar elements. To see what we have in common.

And THAT is absolutely the key to AA and such. We all come from different walks of life, we're all different ages, nationalities, ethnicities, gender, sexual orientation, class, education, etc., etc., etc. But we're all fighting the same war, even if the individual battles are different.

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 26):
Congratulations.

To you as well.

Quoting cptkrell (Reply 28):
Just a piece of observation from an old guy...maybe food for thought?

There certainly can be the physical addiction component. The first few days of my sobriety (and the last year or so of drinking) were not entirely pleasant, though the mental anguish was just as bad as the physical. Honestly, if it were just a physical addiction, I think it would be a lot easier to kick. But the mental games are just horrendous. I've said it before, but desperation is the worst emotion I've ever felt, and the only time I really felt it was toward the end of my drinking career. It's that whole vicious cycle thing - I feel desperation, so I drink to numb myself, which then amplifies the desperation.

But as noted, not everyone will necessarily show the physical addiction symptoms. But you can still be an alcoholic depending on your attitude towards and behavior when drinking. Of course, it's really up to the drinker to determine whether they are or not.
I'm watching Jeopardy. The category is worst Madonna songs. "This one from 1987 is terrible".
 
RussianJet
Posts: 5983
Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2007 4:15 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 3:59 am

People say some very stupid things sometimes. It's when those things develop a particular pattern or become a habit that you need to worry, in combination with harmful behaviours.
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈
 
comorin
Posts: 3858
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 5:52 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 5:53 am

Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):
Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 25):
Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 26):

A big salute to all of you   .

It must take tremendous courage to pull out of alcoholism, and just as much willpower to stay sober. Drinking is so ingrained as a social bonding ritual (especially among men).
 
Grisee08
Topic Author
Posts: 464
Joined: Thu Mar 07, 2013 4:20 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 7:43 am

Quoting comorin (Reply 31):
A big salute to all of you

I second that

Quoting RussianJet (Reply 30):
People say some very stupid things sometimes.

I certainly hope this was one of them. I don't want to have to help her fight this battle, because I don't want there to be a battle to fight. Certainly she has seen what it can do. She is only 22, so the "night" is young. But every day, I see that she is stressed beyond what any 22 year old should be stressed to. It is the main reason she started smoking at 20 years old.

For a short while after she had surgery, she was addicted to pain killers, but she kicked that before it got out of control, so I think she has the mind to know when something is getting out of control, and when to stop...I hope
Alright Alright Alright!
 
rfields5421
Posts: 6223
Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 12:45 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:08 pm

Quoting comorin (Reply 31):
It must take tremendous courage to pull out of alcoholism, and just as much willpower to stay sober.

Seeking help for alcoholism is often not an act of courage so much as an act of desperation. For me, and many others, AA was the very last place I wanted to go. But there was NOT ANY other place to go. I had burned all my bridges.

I was somewhat lucky to be in the US Navy on a base with an alcoholism treatment center. I had two choices. Go, or get discharged after 12 years of service, with a reduction in rank. No possibility of serving in the reserve or ever coming back on active duty.

Willpower can keep someone sober for a day, or a few days. But in AA we learn to understand what happened to our lives, what we need to do to clean up that wreckage, and what we need to do to stay sober.

We learn what true friends are, and how they can help us. Staying sober alone is usually a pretty terrible experience. Staying sober with other sober people is an awesome, rewarding experience.

Quoting comorin (Reply 31):
Drinking is so ingrained as a social bonding ritual

It really isn't as much ingrained in US society as one might think. Once a person gets sober, they can find just as much fun sober as they previously did while drinking. There are of course certain events - such as work Christmas parties - where it might be uncomfortable.

I've met alcoholics in Japan and France. In Japan, social bing drinking was a significant part of the business community. But people learned how to deal with that. In France, learning how to eat without wine took time, but was possible.

We have to learn how to recognize those events, and seek alternatives.

Most of the people in my life today have never seen me take a drink. They don't know what a vicious, mean a-hole I can become when drunk.

In the corporate world, in the small track auto racing community, in boating on lakes, in camping, at sports events, at community events, in family situations - me not drinking has never been an issue. In many cases I've been invited to events by other guys in part because I will not drink and be able to drive them home.

It is a bigger issue for young people - especially the guys and girls who become drunks and get sober before they are 21. The younger generation tends to be less tolerant.

A concern of young women getting sober seems to be 'I won't be able to drink champagne at my wedding." But those who get sober and stay sober learn it is not really an issue.

Most of us never understood that life can be very, very, very good while not drinking. We learn it can actually be more fun.
Not all who wander are lost.
 
User avatar
casinterest
Posts: 10744
Joined: Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:30 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 2:24 pm

Quoting comorin (Reply 31):
Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):

Quoting vikkyvik (Reply 25):

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 26):

A big congratulations to all of you. Kinda jealous to be honest.

I have a person that is out of my life now, that in 30 + years only managed 2 straight years of sobriety. The worst part of the sobriety is that all the personality of the Alcoholic was still present. The Deceit, the lies, the secrecy, the fakeness. People in AA have even given up on this person.

Quoting Grisee08 (Reply 32):
I certainly hope this was one of them. I don't want to have to help her fight this battle, because I don't want there to be a battle to fight. Certainly she has seen what it can do. She is only 22, so the "night" is young. But every day, I see that she is stressed beyond what any 22 year old should be stressed to. It is the main reason she started smoking at 20 years old.

Do what you can to keep her out of it. The further down the road she gets, the tougher it is to pull out.
Where ever you go, there you are.
 
oly720man
Posts: 5813
Joined: Fri May 21, 2004 7:13 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Wed Aug 07, 2013 3:48 pm

Wow, reading all these stories I feel fortunate not to have fallen so low.

I've never been part of a drinking crowd and haven't really been in to drinking for the sake of, which is what a lot of people in the UK seem to do. Perhaps I never got the habit. I have been drunk the odd time, long ago, usually on holiday, on wine in France. I now (and for other reasons) prefer a clear head and I've never really understood why people drink so so much; either I'm not feeling what they feel or hope to achieve and don't suffer the peer pressure to join in and just have one, and another, and another, having to join in because you're "spoiling the mood" by not getting completely blasted with the rest. Now I sometimes feel I'm keeping orange trees in business if I am out.

Part of it is having kids that wake up early. They can be a handful sober, so the thought of facing them with the results of the previous night's endeavours still in the system doesn't really bear thinking about.

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 33):
There are of course certain events - such as work Christmas parties - where it might be uncomfortable.

Still on the orange there, even though there may be wine on the table. Maybe half a glass, if that, but I can happily not have any. Other people I work with wouldn't go to the party if there wasn't free wine.

One person I work with now looks back in some horror at how much he used to drink and what could have happened to him, nearly getting in to fights, nearly staggering into traffic and getting knocked down. He also managed, in a drunken haze, to get the wrong train home and ended up miles from home in the early hours of the morning, but managed to get into a hotel and carry on drinking until dawn.

Quoting rfields5421 (Reply 33):
Most of us never understood that life can be very, very, very good while not drinking. We learn it can actually be more fun.

I think some people have lives that are boring when sober so that's why they do drink, or they have little imagination in terms of keeping themselves entertained so drink (and/or drugs) are the only "fun" they get.
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
bennett123
Posts: 9438
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Thu Aug 22, 2013 8:32 am

I knew someone many years ago.

He nearly died after his ulcer, (probably due to drink) burst.

He was in hospital, and was found in a pool of blood when the nurse went round.

He lost 8 pints in 24 hours, but survived.

2 weeks later he was back down the pub.

That was 37 years ago, so he is clearly now gone.

Hope that your friend gets help.
 
User avatar
Pellegrine
Posts: 2430
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:19 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Thu Aug 22, 2013 12:16 pm

I read this topic, and I find it very sad. I've felt sort of used in a way by a long-term friend whom I've known since primary school recently.

Her problem isn't chiefly alcohol but marijuana too. The straw broke the camel's back is a really long story. Last time in May, she showed up at my door high as hell...and I feel guilty know for being an enabler...but we had a bottle of wine between us after that, and she stayed over in an extra bedroom. In the morning we both went to work, and she called me around noon screaming at me and berating me because her 4 grams of weed in a baggie was missing. I actually went home and looked for her stuff (In the middle of my workday, home is 25 mins away); I tore the bedroom apart, and it wasn't there.

I'm not against weed, but I don't really use the stuff myself. Honestly, maybe 5 times a year I will take a puff, but I cannot do much of it....at all..

Anyway, shortly after that she started blaming me for stealing her stash out of her purse. As if I would do that to anyone, let alone an old friend whom I trust in my house and let sleep over.

What's funny to me is how many times I've covered her at restaurants and bars when she was with me and what that added up to...I'd think nothing of it; I don't count money with friends...

Yet, then she accused me of stealing 4g of weed from her when I don't even smoke it...

Didn't talk to her since May; texted her a few days ago... She was really nasty to me and blaming me for her losing her drugs, when they were never over my house anyway.
We fly JETS, we don't fly donkeys.
 
RussianJet
Posts: 5983
Joined: Sat Jul 21, 2007 4:15 am

RE: "If I Had My Way, I'd Be An Alcoholic."

Thu Aug 22, 2013 4:18 pm

Quoting AR385 (Reply 22):
As a an alcoholic myself, sober since 2007, You just described my life from 2001 to 2006. I did all of those things and some others that I sometimes still cry at night when I think about them. Making amends helped, and most people were understanding but others had been hurt too much. I lost so many things and wasted so much time. Thankfully that´s in the past, but it was not easy.

Thanks for sharing, and congratulations on your excellent progress.
✈ Every strike of the hammer is a blow against the enemy. ✈

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Aaron747, afcjets, Number6, scbriml and 61 guests

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos